How much would you pay for the ultimate subsim?

[GraylingSTS(SS)]

Hypothetically, how much would you pay for a U-boat sim that addressed all the recurring issues (lack of wolfpacks, dynamic campaign, historical accuracy, etc...) ?

Personally, I think an independent dev team could be successful by planning a true WW2 submarine simulation that was designed for the hardcore sub fan ONLY.

I believe that trying to develop a true subSIM and stay within a budget that allows it to be sold to the masses at Walmart for $49.99 is unrealistic.

Imagine if this dev team could narrow their target market to the "hardcore" sim crowd and perhaps even take input directly from the forums on this site? (Not that UBisoft hasn't, to some extent).

Why not charge a premium price for a premium product, market it directly to the target audience, release a finished project but charge a monthly fee for membership that would allow multiplayer wolfpacks and access to add ons?

Just food for thought!

[Buddahaid]

Pipe dream, I'm afraid. The closet thing I know to that would be Orbiter, which is free. How much? In general, I'm willing to double the price for say, a product that is 100% domestic over imported. Call it isolationism if you want, but I believe in supporting local business.

[JScones]

How much does Steel Beasts Pro PE go for now? I haven't played it, but believe it to be quite the simulation, even at the PE level.

So, I'd pay for an equivalent U-boat simulation whatever people pay for SBP PE. No more...no less...

[Reece]

If it were possible $150, maybe more, I play Silent Hunter more that I would "play with windows", and you know how much that cost!!:yep:

[Lanzfeld]

i have said for over 7 years now that i would $200 for a real fix to my personal list of problems with these games.

[THE_MASK]

Silent hunter series is the only sub game and ubi is the only producer . If SH5 sales are a success and they decide to do an addon then i would pay the going rate for a pc game .

[GoldenRivet]

i have said for over 7 years now that i would $200 for a real fix to my personal list of problems with these games.

$200 would be my limit.

$100 would be the median.

If it were the end all be all of subsims of course.

there are a lot of wish list items there... and yes it would be a 'pipe dream'

[Ducimus]

The utlimate subsim would probably be a true replacment for SH3. Problem is (im guessing) the devs haven't been given the time, money or resources to accomplish that. Sh4 and Sh5 are ultimately derived from SH3. Or rather, SH4 was based off of SH3 to save time and money, and SH5 borrowed from that!

What is really wanted IMO is an entirely new game, designed from scratch from the ground up, with 4 years development time behind it. Sh5 reminds me alot like earlier versions of windows. Win98 was duct taped over Win95 , which was stapled over Win 3.1, which was glued over DOS, - if you follow my train of thought there.

[Buddahaid]

The utlimate subsim would probably be a true replacment for SH3. Problem is (im guessing) the devs haven't been given the time, money or resources to accomplish that. Sh4 and Sh5 are ultimately derived from SH3. Or rather, SH4 was based off of SH3 to save time and money, and SH5 borrowed from that!

What is really wanted IMO is an entirely new game, designed from scratch from the ground up, with 4 years development time behind it. Sh5 reminds me alot like earlier versions of windows. Win98 was duct taped over Win95 , which was stapled over Win 3.1, which was glued over DOS, - if you follow my train of thought there.

That would be convoy of thought, but you are correct, and it would only happen if the franchise proved golden. Otherwise, it would be castrated like That PT boat abomination. I'm beginning to like the u-boat/wolfenstein direction more and more now.

[mookiemookie]

Amazing how often this comes up, and yet no one seems to know anything about the open source subsim Danger From the Deep (http://dangerdeep.sourceforge.net/gallery/)

[Tarnsman]

In one go Id say $99.99 but over time what ever. But for that it better be good. Between IL2 Stormovik, Forgotten Battles, the Aces Expansion Pack, Pacific fighters and IL21946 I've spent over $250 on my WWII airpower fix with Oleg Maddox . And eventhough I complained about pulling out my wallet so damn often, each time I loaded the sim up I have been in warbird heaven. I can fly more beautifully modeled warbirds than I ever knew existed over nearly every theater of the War. After I spent only $50 on SH4 and I was very disappointed and I still play SH3 far more than SH4, despite how graphically gorgous SH4 is.

I've bought all the Silent Hunter Series incl. DC since SH2 but I have not felt that same feeling I got with SH3 since SH3. If Ubi wants to follow Oleg's path and get me to pay for more SH addons down the line I will be happy to do so but they ve got to deliver. Make a commitment to accuracy (not perfection per se) fix howlers for free with regular patches (Oleg usually includes new content along with his patches) and constantly improve the product. Do that and I'll happily spend the bucks.

I really think the War at Sea deserves the same treatment as the War in the Air. PC Simming is my favorite hobby next to photography so for a quality program I'd be happy to pay up.

[GoldenRivet]

In one go Id say $99.99 but over time what ever. But for that it better be good. Between IL2 Stormovik, Forgotten Battles, the Aces Expansion Pack, Pacific fighters and IL21946 I've spent over $250 on my WWII airpower fix with Oleg Maddox . And eventhough I complained about pulling out my wallet so damn often, each time I loaded the sim up I have been in warbird heaven. I can fly more beautifully modeled warbirds than I ever knew existed over nearly every theater of the War. After I spent only $50 on SH4 and I was very disappointed and I still play SH3 far more than SH4, despite how graphically gorgous SH4 is.

I've bought all the Silent Hunter Series incl. DC since SH2 but I have not felt that same feeling I got with SH3 since SH3. If Ubi wants to follow Oleg's path and get me to pay for more SH addons down the line I will be happy to do so but they ve got to deliver. Make a commitment to accuracy (not perfection per se) fix howlers for free with regular patches (Oleg usually includes new content along with his patches) and constantly improve the product. Do that and I'll happily spend the bucks.

I really think the War at Sea deserves the same treatment as the War in the Air. PC Simming is my favorite hobby next to photography so for a quality program I'd be happy to pay up.

This right here...

this is a man who hit the nail right on the head. :yeah:

perfect marks my friend... perfect.

[Letum]

No more than £70, but it would have to be damm perfect.

[Sailor Steve]

For what I considered the perfect subsim I'd go as high as $200.

But I'm trying to come up with five times that just to get a computer that will run SH4 properly and SH5 at all, so I guess I'm used to thinking that way.

[BulSoldier]

I am wiling to pay quite a lot (within reason ofcourse).Since if you think about it if it has everything it wants it will probably save you more money than cost you.Though it is quite a blury dream - the perfect subsim.

[FIREWALL]

Since I have Flight and Racing controls that cost over $2000.00.

Pc software price is of little concern to me.

I am a Sim collector and avid player.

It is my major hobby. I don't care what it costs.

[jimmie]

I think it's kinda meaningless to talk about the price of single copy. You gotta think the other way: to complete the project, how many programmers/artists/etc you need to feed for how long, and you know how much you need for the project. Then divide the figure by people who want.

When the project is like our truly super geeky hardcore simulation, we could probably cut entirely for promotion since the target audience is very specific from the beginning (those people are likely to know the project without massive promo). Half the budget could go for promo so eliminating it is a big plus.

The thing is, creating this complex software like SH5 isn't so simple.. Most people (unfamiliar with programming) even wouldn't have an idea about what "from scratch" would really mean.

[GertFroebe_neu]

For a really really good sim I would pay 78 Euros. I like to support simulations and would not mind to pay a bit more for a really good one of this rare genre.

But there is no game like this in sight.

[Sonarman]

It's not really a fair comparison with SB Pro PE as it is mostly funded by the military with the PE version being a public offshoot of the full product. I'm not sure today's navies would be interested in training their officers using a German U-Boat simulator!

[Nimmo55]

I for one would pay quite a lot...maybe even up to and including $250...but it would want to be the last word in U Boat simulations...not just eye candy...

nimmo55:)

[Uber Gruber]

Tough Question....I would happily give my house, my car, my wife and our little dashund called Colin to UBI just to have a chance to lick their shoes. So for a decent subsim, well i'd have to rob a small state just to pay for it.

[Hitman]

So the highest bid is 200$?

Interesting, when you consider how many people will at the same time be buying a 2000$ computer to be able to play it :haha:

[Ducimus]

Honestly.. and i mean seriously...

If i walk into the PC game section at any local store, and i see a game priced more then 60 bucks (and i mean like 55 to 58 dollars rounded up), i don't even pick up the box, and if you wait long enough, the price will drop to to about half that or less.

So im having a hard time believing that if some of ya were to walk into your local PC games section, you'd pick out the 200 dollar game nestled amongst the 58 dollars or less tittles.

[Tarnsman]

Highest bid is $250 over intallemts/addons. :)

I know only one other person in my real life who is into subsiming -- and I consider that lucky since its really fun to talk tactics and proceedures and etc face to face. So I assume its a very small market. But Ubi keeps producing and distributing the Silent Hunter series so it must be a market out there. They certainly are not losing money or they would not keep it up.

With that in mind I hope SH5 builds on the previous game code, that way we hopefullly wont lose the good stuff under the hood. So Im happy if they fix the bugs improve the interface/interaction between me and my crew (which seems to be where they put most of their time ) and kick up the graphics, Im OK with that.

But if they started "from scratch" and are still using the same pricing structure, Im scared that they might have cut a bunch of corners to bring SH5 in under budget.

[Webster]

if its the ultimate subsim then i would pay whatever i had to but if i didnt have money issues i would pay whatever they wanted for it IF and only IF it was a completely finished game that was debugged first. if it came with issues then those issues would decide what im willing to pay for it.

[FIREWALL]

Face the facts. If UBI doesn't touch the Silent Hunter series again.

In 5yrs with newer OS and hardware and software someone else will probably build the Ultimate Sub Sim.

That will make all others before it a POS.

[Tarnsman]

Honestly.. and i mean seriously...

If i walk into the PC game section at any local store, and i see a game priced more then 60 bucks (and i mean like 55 to 58 dollars rounded up), i don't even pick up the box, and if you wait long enough, the price will drop to to about half that or less.

So im having a hard time believing that if some of ya were to walk into your local PC games section, you'd pick out the 200 dollar game nestled amongst the 58 dollars or less tittles.

For a way cool subsim heck yeah. I am only interrested in a couple of genres of sims: racing, flight and military and only realistically oriented titles. So for me its not about price its about availability. Half Life 2 is not a "better value" because its $50 since Im just not interrested. Stuff like that I do wait for the bargain bin. I also do that with aracde military sims like COD and BF2. I sincerly hope SH5 is not in that category.

But for the good stuff, Silent Hunter3, GTR2, IL2 series, I get it as soon as funds and responsibility allows. Im not going to sacrifice something important to buy a "toy" for myself. But once everybody else is taklen care of, Im treating myself, only one or two good sims come out a year these days, so there is no need to justify it.

[SteamWake]

Here ask these guys :up:

http://www.defencetalk.com/new-combat-system-tactical-simulator-for-norways-submarines-15059/

[Lanzfeld]

I sm not sure what the price of Steel Beasts Pro is right now but if they made a WW2 tank sim they could have my $200 right away. If there was a U-boat sim on the same level then they could have my $200.

[Tarnsman]

That is what Sonalysts used to do ( or still does IDK) . They produced 688I and Subcommand -- both classics. I think they did Dangerous Waters but I never bought that. I got sucked into the eye candy of SH3 and could not go back to the 1990s era graphics of DW. I admit it -- I can be a bit shallow.

[Platapus]

Well, if someone could program a submarine simulator that is exactly what *I* want with only what *I* want. I would be willing to pay a lot of money.

The problem is that I am the only one who knows what *I* want and I can't code. :nope:

[capthelm]

well for $50 i am getting the ultimate sim called sh5...:salute:

[cappy70]

Over the years PC games have gone up very little compared with what the cost to make a game is within the gaming industry itself and the value over 10 years.
So $50 for a game today and that same price that I paid 6 years ago is well worth it.

Good article about this in PC gamer: PC gaming vs. cost vs. value over the years.

[Lanzfeld]

I would pay a million billion dollars.

[Sonarman]

Even if all of the say 20,000 ? hardcore subsimmers here were prepared/ (allowed by their wives) to pay $200 each for a game, which I doubt, that's only $4,000000 SH3 cost $3,000000 to make and that was about 5 years ago Ubi would barely break even. Typically a the series has sold around 350,000 copies multipy that by an rrp around $40 and you get about 14,000000, taking off the retailers cut + distribution etc (about 60%) would leave about $5-6 million, conclusion- unfortunately we need the mass market. SB Pro is a bit of an anomoly which would I'm sure not exist without the military funding. Look what happened to DW and I think that did have some military backup.

[urfisch]

the ultimate sim would be to get yourself connected into a virtual world, where you can experience the game for real.

a normal "client game sim", a perfect one, where you need to sit in front of some screen and play, will never be released from an established studio. the target group is too small for a profit orientated company. so only if there will be some smaller studio, this might be possible. maybe the market opens up the possibilities for such a development - bigger studios produce mainstream stuff, smaller ones create passioned stuff.

i would pay about 99 euros for a really, really nice subsim.

[JScones]

I would pay a million billion dollars.
Cheapskate. :nope:


:D

[Sgtmonkeynads]

How much is this? With a cash for clunkers trade in?

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/picture.php?albumid=128&pictureid=1080

[Trondheim77]

49,95 and 9,95 for the addons and 5 dollar for the subforum.

[theluckyone17]

Well, if someone could program a submarine simulator that is exactly what *I* want with only what *I* want. I would be willing to pay a lot of money.

The problem is that I am the only one who knows what *I* want and I can't code. :nope:

I've harped on it before, and it's been mentioned previously in this thread,but I can't resist another pitch: Danger From The Deep: http://dangerdeep.sourceforge.net (http://dangerdeep.sourceforge.net/)

It's an "open source World War II german submarine simulator". Its source code is GPL'd and most of the artwork is licensed via Creative Commons. In non-Geek-speak, you can make all the alterations you want, you can even turn around and sell it, but you've got to credit the previous developers and provide the source code (including the changes you've made).

So feel free to hire a developer (or a team of developers), and get them cracking on working on what you want. Fork off the project, and call it whatever you want.

Realistically, that ain't gonna happen... obviously, it hasn't happened yet. If I ever win the lottery, though :cool:

[urfisch]

I've harped on it before, and it's been mentioned previously in this thread,but I can't resist another pitch: Danger From The Deep: http://dangerdeep.sourceforge.net (http://dangerdeep.sourceforge.net/)

It's an "open source World War II german submarine simulator". Its source code is GPL'd and most of the artwork is licensed via Creative Commons. In non-Geek-speak, you can make all the alterations you want, you can even turn around and sell it, but you've got to credit the previous developers and provide the source code (including the changes you've made).

So feel free to hire a developer (or a team of developers), and get them cracking on working on what you want. Fork off the project, and call it whatever you want.

Realistically, that ain't gonna happen... obviously, it hasn't happened yet. If I ever win the lottery, though :cool:

i think its a nice project...but there seems to be a lack of men power. i follow the development since 2 years now. and there is very little progress.

:-?

[Rilder]

10 Dollars.

(Or wait for a steam sale and get it + Addons for 5 dollars)

:rotfl2:

[fromhell]

agrand and ide throw in the wife and dog.

[TarJak]

Bugger I don't have a dog! Will a child do?:D