Interactive subsim? What exactly does that mean? [Archive]

Méo

01-16-10, 04:54 PM

Snestorm

01-16-10, 05:56 PM

No idé.
Can't even make a good guess.

JU_88

01-16-10, 07:03 PM

Sorry for starting another thread but I really wonder what's going on!

Looks like we're only gonna get the type VII this time, which will greatly reduce many possibilities, but:

Type VII U-boat interactive subsim http://www.subsim.com/nucleus/index.php?blogid=4

Interactive? What exactly does that mean...:hmmm:

- Interaction with AI operated boats (and/or with BdU)?
- Interaction with AI crew members?
- Interaction in Multiplayer?

Or is it just some kind of euphemism...

Me thinks you might be taking one persons choice of wording abit too literally. :hmmm:

All computer games are 'interactive', so that can be interpreted anyway you want.
It is confirmed to have playable VIIC Uboats, but who said there are no other types? Just because we haven't seen a screen shot of something - it doesn't mean its not in the game.

So it sounds like its nothing more than an assumption based on what has been seen in the previews, thats all.
Until I read official word on these things, I would assume nothing.

Méo

01-16-10, 07:48 PM

@JU

I hope you're right. :hmmm:

It's just that it seems to me that the SUBSIM NEWS & UPDATES had been pretty accurate so far. I remember in november (or maybe december) 2008 this was showing ''u-boats in the atlantic'' but was withdrawn few days later.

In the official announcement of august 2009, we finally see that it was true, SH5 was really about the u-boat war.

Now there must have a reason why this was changed from ''u-boats in the atlantic'' to ''type VII u-boat interactive subsim'', but maybe the word interactive doesn't specifically mean anything.

The thing is that if it just type VII without AI wolfpacks (and interaction with BdU), it seems to me that it will be an important step backwards from SH3, I mean in SH3 there were no wolfpacks but at least there was several types of u-boat, thus increasing A LOT the possibilities in how you could play a campaign. (by changing boat, changing theatre, etc.)

But if wolfpacks are in this time, it will be easy to ''forgive'' them the absence of other types of boats.

oscar19681

01-16-10, 08:03 PM

I,m guessing payed add on u-boats

Méo

01-16-10, 08:26 PM

From community Q&A:
Will we be able to meet another u-boat, while on the patrol? Say hello, exchange fuel and food supplies, perhaps?

Resupplying from milk-cows will definitely be possible. Meeting other u-boats will be possible but the degree of interaction with them is to be decided.I was thinking maybe that's what they (or he) mean by ''interactive subsim''

JU_88

01-16-10, 08:51 PM

Well the term is a very stupid one indeed.

'Interactive subsim' what? as opposed to a 'non-interactive' one? ..why I believe that would be catagorized as a 'CGI movie'. :haha:

I dont think it relates to any specific aspect of the game, just a poor choice of words.
Dont read too much into it mate :up:

Méo

01-16-10, 09:08 PM

Better communication.I have 1 torpedo left,%70 hull damage and in the middle of atlantic and request permision for returning to base.Answer is "Be more agressive"...Ok darling

Well, SH3 wasn't really interactive, isn't it?

But you might be right, I must be reading too far into it.

JU_88

01-16-10, 09:16 PM

Well, SH3 wasn't really interactive, isn't it?

:o

interactive (Dictionary definition)
adj 1. (Electronics & Computer Science / Computer Science) allowing or relating to continuous two-way transfer of information between a user and the central point of a communication system, such as a computer or television
2. (of two or more persons, forces, etc.) acting upon or in close relation with each other; interacting interactivity n

Basically if you can point-an-click on stuff with your mouse - thats interactivity.
All video games are considered as interative entertainment.
So by saying, 'this game is interactive' is abit like saying 'wow! this car comes with four wheels!'
It goes without saying.

Méo

01-16-10, 09:23 PM

Oh C'mon, you don't need a dictionary to understand what I mean. :03:

I was showing with AAtaman's quote (which is really cool BTW :DL) that the ''close relation'' you mentioned wasn't really ''close''.

Just my opinion, you don't need to agree. ;)

JU_88

01-16-10, 09:32 PM

Trouble is, that is how exactly how it reads in literal sense, (Interactive subsim) as you say it doesnt mention an specific interactive feature - which might be something new or even revolutionary.
Just that the sim itself is interactive just like all those before it... uh.. well thats re-assuring I guess. :haha:

Méo

01-16-10, 09:48 PM

which might be something new or even revolutionary.

Let's hope this will be the ''Big Announcement Coming''

Personally, if I was writing the ''interactive subsim'' in the description, it would mean that it's particularly interactive compared to other subsim.

But this is just interpretation.

JU_88

01-16-10, 10:00 PM

Do we actually know who wrote that? :hmmm:

Méo

01-16-10, 10:08 PM

I thought it was Neal. :hmmm:

As I said earlier: it seems to me that the SUBSIM NEWS & UPDATES had been pretty accurate so far.

But you must know better, you have a lot more experience in here than I.

IanC

01-17-10, 12:21 AM

Meo don't think so much! You're way over analyzing this "Interactive" thing. Type VII U-boat interactive subsim was probably just typed up because of the fully modeled interior. :DL

Méo

01-17-10, 12:33 AM

You're surely right, but I guess some are gonna RAGE when they'll see that wolfpacks, u-boat type II, IX, and XXI have been sacrificed just to get the pretty fully modeled interior with some ''interaction''.

IanC

01-17-10, 12:40 AM

Well, we're used to having no wolfpacks by now. But Playing with only one type U-boat will take some getting used to...

Reece

01-17-10, 01:28 AM

IanC

01-17-10, 01:37 AM

I really don't think there would only be the VIIC, it would be a step backwards from previous releases and would be a huge outcry!!:-? I would bet 99% that there will be Type II, VII, and XI at a minimum, I'm not even slightly concerned that this isn't the case!!:yep:

I like your positive attitude! But did you read the other threads, everything is slowly but surely pointing to only type VII.
It would help explain how they managed to push this puppy out so quickly. :hmmm:

Reece

01-17-10, 04:12 AM

I like your positive attitude! But did you read the other threads, everything is slowly but surely pointing to only type VII.
It would help explain how they managed to push this puppy out so quickly. :hmmm:If that were so, the start date would have to change to a later one compared to SH3, Flotilla & upgrades would be stuffed!!:nope: I seriously doubt that the VII is the only option, if it were I would be p!ssed off big time, I would then be waiting/hoping for add-ons!!:damn: Would make operation Drumbeat a little hard to play!!:doh:
Now look what you've done Ian, I have doubts!!:dead:

Kimmers

01-17-10, 12:31 PM

If that were so, the start date would have to change to a later one compared to SH3, Flotilla & upgrades would be stuffed!!:nope: I seriously doubt that the VII is the only option, if it were I would be p!ssed off big time, I would then be waiting/hoping for add-ons!!:damn: Would make operation Drumbeat a little hard to play!!:doh:
Now look what you've done Ian, I have doubts!!:dead:

thou shalt not spread mutinous thoughts around the boat known as subsim, it makes me :(

Jimbuna

01-17-10, 02:04 PM

All will be revealed in March http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

Reece

01-17-10, 08:35 PM

All will be revealed in March http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gifNow stop saying that Jim!!:x Talk about your stuck record!!:haha:

JU_88

01-17-10, 08:39 PM

Now stop saying that Jim!!:x Talk about your stuck record!!:haha:

Yes it would seem that Bernard has been fiddling with his Gramaphone again :woot:

IanC

01-17-10, 09:33 PM

Now look what you've done Ian, I have doubts!!:dead:

:haha:
Unfortunately (or fortunately) with type VII's, they can give us 1939 to 1945 operational dates. But good point about no Operation Drumbeat. :cry:
Anyways, as a wise man once said, "All will be revealed in March"

Subnuts

01-17-10, 09:38 PM

Das Boot is a "non-interactive subsim." :O:

Onkel Neal

01-17-10, 10:14 PM

:haha:
Unfortunately (or fortunately) with type VII's, they can give us 1939 to 1945 operational dates. But good point about no Operation Drumbeat. :cry:

Why no Operation Drumbeat? :o Have you forgotten about U-564? U-701? U-85, U-352, U-576, U-432, U-578, and U-653 ?

Do you know the name Topp? :hmmm: In U-552?

Does this look familiar?
http://www.uboat.net/special/emblems/images/u201.gif

He was part of O.D. and he commanded a Type VIIC. Right?

U-458 and U-754 were the last boats to fight off the Cape Hatteras before BdU shifted the U-boats back to the North Atlantic.

Nothing is too difficult for a U-boat commander. :03: I think you may have to ration the water, and nurse your diesel, but I think you can get in on the rich pickings off the American coast.

oscar19681

01-17-10, 10:17 PM

Who said no drum beat? It would foolish to leave it out again like in sh-3.

Snestorm

01-17-10, 10:19 PM

Why no Operation Drumbeat? :o Have you forgotten about U-564? U-701? U-85, U-352, U-576, U-432, U-578, and U-653 ?

Do you know the name Topp? :hmmm: In U-552?

Does this look familiar?
http://www.uboat.net/special/emblems/images/u201.gif

He was part of O.D. and he commanded a Type VIIC. Right?

U-458 and U-754 were the last boats to fight off the Cape Hatteras before BdU shifted the U-boats back to the North Atlantic.

Nothing is too difficult for a U-boat commander. :03: I think you may have to ration the water, and nurse your diesel, but I think you can get in on the rich pickings off the American coast.

What about U30, U65, U66, U123 (The good stuff)?

Méo

01-17-10, 10:22 PM

Why no Operation Drumbeat? :o

Yeah, but In real Life (it was already difficult for a type VII) distance between Europe & America is much shorter than in the Map in Silent Huter. (they said that there would be no sphere map).

So No Type IX and No sphere map seems like it will be a bit difficult for Operation Drumbeat.

So I dunno...:shifty:

IanC

01-17-10, 10:29 PM

Nothing is too difficult for a U-boat commander. :03: I think you may have to ration the water, and nurse your diesel, but I think you can get in on the rich pickings off the American coast.

Yes indeed type VII's went to America. I guess I was thinking of the first few waves of boats that were sent, I think they were all type IX's. I also remember reading that going over there in a type VII was a major pain in the arse.
But nothing is too difficult for a U-boat commander, I agree! That's why I paint "bring it on!" on my conning tower. :DL

Onkel Neal

01-17-10, 10:31 PM

What about U30, U65, U66, U123 (The good stuff)?

Well, we were discussing Type VIIs that were part of O.D. U-65, 66, and 123 are Type IX.

Snestorm

01-17-10, 10:34 PM

Well, we were discussing Type VIIs that were part of O.D. U-65, 66, and 123 are Type IX.

Yes. That was the intended point. Where are the IXs?

Onkel Neal

01-17-10, 10:35 PM

Yes. That was the intended point. Where are the IXs?

:06: In the ocean?

Snestorm

01-17-10, 10:37 PM

:06: In the ocean?

Do you promise?

Onkel Neal

01-17-10, 10:44 PM

Lol, you have completely lost me.

IanC

01-17-10, 10:47 PM

Lol, you have completely lost me.

He meant where are the IX's in SH5. Hopefully they'll be there. :yep:

Onkel Neal

01-17-10, 10:49 PM

Ah, ok. I thought he meant, where are the IXs in the list I mentioned.

Sorry, now I understand.

Anyway, I only posted to point out there were many Type VIIs in O.D. I was not commenting on SH5.:shucks:

Méo

01-17-10, 10:55 PM

@Neal

I'm curious to know if you think Operation Drumbeat would be possible with the Type VII without a sphere map? :hmmm:

IanC

01-17-10, 11:02 PM

@Neal

I'm curious to know if you think Operation Drumbeat would be possible with the Type VII without a sphere map? :hmmm:

Yeah, that's a good point about the flat map distance. I guess all that would be needed would be an 'extra fuel' mod?

edit: thinking about SH3 here

Reece

01-17-10, 11:05 PM

What I quoted was "Would make operation Drumbeat a little hard to play!!", not impossible with milch cows but certainly haven't the range or capability without refueling!:yep: The 2 boats I love are the types 7 and 9, would be disappointed if the IX is not included!:x I haven't placed an order yet and waiting for the "Big Announcement" before committing!:oops::yep:

GoldenRivet

01-17-10, 11:14 PM

@Neal

I'm curious to know if you think Operation Drumbeat would be possible with the Type VII without a sphere map? :hmmm:

Fuel and Fuel consumption values have to be modified to account for the increased Mercator distances.

IIRC GWX does this already.

no reason SHV cannot do it.

although im starting to realize there will be no other boats in SHV other than the VII type.

though this doesnt bother me so much, i know there will be a lot of people out there who are upset about such a move.

Méo

01-17-10, 11:15 PM

Yeah, that's a good point about the flat map distance. I guess all that would be needed would be an 'extra fuel' mod?

edit: thinking about SH3 here

I see but there's not only fuel, there's time...:hmmm:

In SH5, crew morale is the deciding factor; the longer you stay on patrol, the more affected the crew is, and the less you are able to demand that “extra mile” from them.

P.S. I'm perfectly aware that those are only conjectures, but that shouldn't stop us from expressing some reasoning, as long as you know on what it is based on. :know:

Onkel Neal

01-17-10, 11:27 PM

@Neal

I'm curious to know if you think Operation Drumbeat would be possible with the Type VII without a sphere map? :hmmm:

Surely with a Milchkühe in the right place.

IanC

01-17-10, 11:40 PM

Surely with a Milchkühe in the right place.

Yup, that's the key. SH5 would have to include milkcows, maybe that's the Big Announcement :lol:

Méo

01-17-10, 11:59 PM

SH5 would have to include milkcows, maybe that's the Big Announcement :lol:

Already announced!

Will we be able to meet another u-boat, while on the patrol? Say hello, exchange fuel and food supplies, perhaps?

Resupplying from milk-cows will definitely be possible. Meeting other u-boats will be possible but the degree of interaction with them is to be decided.
But even then, it seems to me that long range operations with Type VII might be a bit tricky. :-?

IanC

01-18-10, 12:10 AM

Sweet! Although the cynic in me is a little worried about the word "possible". :-? :DL

danurve

01-18-10, 04:40 PM

SSDD Sighted Sir!
.Nevermind

Ducimus

01-18-10, 04:44 PM

Why no Operation Drumbeat? :o Have you forgotten about U-564? U-701? U-85, U-352, U-576, U-432, U-578, and U-653 ?
.......

Neal, technically speaking, Operation Drumbeat only refer's to the first wave of boats sent over. "The drum beater's" were, U-66, U-109, U-123, U-125, and U-130.

Everyone after that was just additional waves of boats. Type7's could only make the trip when logistical support via milkcows were available, which in turn, If i remember correctly, weren't available until after the initial attacks off the US coast. (operation drumbeat). So no milk cow's, no type7's on the US eastern seaboard and carribean. So technically speaking, no type 9's, no drum beat.

edit:
Speaking of milkcows, of course they'll be in SH5, they already exist in SH4 and work without ending the patrol like the modded version of milk cows in SH3.

oscar19681

01-18-10, 04:49 PM

Is it comfirmed that there will be no Operation Drumbeat then? Can anyone comfirm?

Jimbuna

01-18-10, 04:51 PM

For those who prefer realism......the milch cows should only be scripted to be available as they were in RL.

Here's hoping.

Ducimus

01-18-10, 04:56 PM

Is it comfirmed that there will be no Operation Drumbeat then? Can anyone comfirm?

If there really isn't any type 9's, you can always fudge the campaign to change milk cow availalbity date to be earlier then what it was, and change assigned patrol areas so you can do it in a type 7, but it won't be historically correct. Considering the outlook of SH5 being more of a hybrid game then a true simulation..... meh. *Shrugs*

JU_88

01-18-10, 05:08 PM

If there really isn't any type 9's, you can always fudge the campaign to change milk cow availalbity date to be earlier then what it was, and change assigned patrol areas so you can do it in a type 7, but it won't be historically correct. Considering the outlook of SH5 being more of a hybrid game then a true simulation..... meh. *Shrugs*

Or take the type 7 one-way and swim home :haha:
Mmmm, Im a bit scared of what the milkcow will look like, would they take the time to model the Type 14 (milkcow) and not a type 9?
Hell the type 9d2 model in Sh4 is just fine looking they could re-use it!
I hope really this type 7 only thing is just a false rumour.

Ducimus

01-18-10, 05:23 PM

Hell the type 9d2 model in Sh4 is just fine looking they could re-use it!

This is why im not totally sold on the Type 7 only theory. Even if it is type 7 only, it wouldn't take long to rip that type 9D2 right out of UBM and get it working like the type 7.

JU_88

01-18-10, 05:51 PM

This is why im not totally sold on the Type 7 only theory. Even if it is type 7 only, it wouldn't take long to rip that type 9D2 right out of UBM and get it working like the type 7.

Yep me too - and with a bit more work Ill bet the type7 Interior is kit bashable to a type 9 also, they werent exactly worlds apart...

THE_MASK

01-18-10, 06:45 PM

I guess it means you interact with the crew , nothing more nothing less .

Platapus

01-18-10, 07:10 PM

I guess it means you interact with the crew , nothing more nothing less .

I believe you are correct.

Reece

01-18-10, 08:05 PM

This is why im not totally sold on the Type 7 only theory. Even if it is type 7 only, it wouldn't take long to rip that type 9D2 right out of UBM and get it working like the type 7.You would think Dan would have responded to this by now!:oops::-?

THE_MASK

01-18-10, 08:13 PM

You would think Dan would have responded to this by now!:oops::-? Why ? Anyway there is an update coming this week . Maybe some answers will be forthcomong because they sure as hell arnt in the official Q and A thread on the ubi site .

JScones

01-19-10, 01:41 AM

Even if it is type 7 only, it wouldn't take long to rip that type 9D2 right out of UBM and get it working like the type 7.
That might be true, but if the devs have "future plans" to add playable u-boat types via patches, addons or DLC, then I doubt they will make it easy to add (or replace existing u-boats with) your own, for free. Just thinkin'... :hmmm:

In any event I will be mighty disappointed if SH5 doesn't allow extra (modded) u-boats to be added, regardless of how many there are to start with. I'd even subscribe to the RoF approach of paying $5 or so every few months if it meant new detailed u-boats (playable and AI). Yeah, that raises the valid argument that we should get them right off the bat, but whatchagonnado? The buyers have spoken, and they want FPS; screw the consequences...