Getting a 'sinking' feeling about SH5

[Nimmo55]

Ok..call me a worry wart...fine. I'll wear that. But I gotta tell you I'm getting a little worried about SH5. I saw the interview with the lead developer...he's saying thngs like don't want people to have to study a book to enjoy SH5 (alarm bells right there going off...)...and I saw the pereiscope screen a couple of posts up...Yikes!! I really hope that isn't what they intend to put in SH5. It looks cartoony and frnakly, crappy. Little things like this make me wonder if they are going to ruin SH5 (from my perspective of course...who loves realism and simulation.) If it is like that, I certainly won't be buying it first up..I'll wait and see what the word is on these forums and wait and see if the talented modders can do something with it. But I hope I'm worrying for nothing...

Nimmo55 :-?

[HundertzehnGustav]

+1.....

[Snestorm]

I like SH3.
Didn't bother with SH4.
And now it looks like I won't bother with SH5.

[codmander]

I think your wrong ,, details,, like the souls on crews boots some nice detailing IT wont be perfect ((what is)) but I do believe we will be puttung sh3 on the selve

[java`s revenge]

It`s all awaiting.

But sh3 on the shelves??

[Méo]

Think about how SH3 vanilla was...

Could SH5 be worse than that!?!

No games will ever be perfectly of your likings.

Of course it will not be a hardcore simulation (like SH3 was, BTW have you ever see a hardcore simulation that sells well?) but it will still be a simulation:

when i sat down with dan dimitrescu, lead designer of silent hunter v, he made sure to point out that the submarine series wasn't abandoning its roots.Of course it will need modding.

SO JUST WAIT AND STOP WORRYING!!! :damn:

[Jimbuna]

All will be revealed in March http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

[Weather-guesser]

Well, well. After disappearing a year ago I find myself back at the rumor of Silent Hunter 5! Outstanding. However, I must say I found myself longing for SH3 after becoming bored with SH4 much too soon. I moved on to Empire Total war.

I am very excited to see the great ideas for SH5 but the question I ask myself is will it be as unfinished as SH4 was (like something as basic as torpedo aiming and ship distances being totally off)?

I also found myself being turned off at the time of what felt like a war between some modders sometimes (sorry if these comments brings up old feelings). I just hope this release is as successful as SH3 was and is built upon with the great talent of the community...pip-pip! :ping:

[JU_88]

Doesnt matter what we've seen and heard so far. previews tell you very little.
Most of the people who worry are jumping to conclusions.
Better to wait utill the game is released before bothering to 'worry'.
Worrying will change nothing now anyway.

As for those people who keep posting that they have already decided they will not buy the game,
Why are they even still posting/reading the SH5 forum?
Im guessing they must be:

a) Very bored indeed.
b) A drama queen
C) A Liar.

Im all for freedom of speech and all that,
but when humans genuinely dont care about something, they tend not to go around reading and writing about it - thats all.

[Reece]

As I have said in other threads, what really worries me big time is the fact that SH5 is built on SH4, I'm very much afraid of the bugs being transferred from one to the other, SH3 had a few bugs and most were fixed, was an excellent sim overall, the same can't be said of SH4, even now after all the mods is still shot full of bugs!!:-? I only hope that the initial statement by the Devs "all new code" is correct!:oops:

[Paajtor]

people who keep posting that they are "not going to buy the game"

They think by posting that, Ubi will read it.
And will worry, because player x won't buy their game.

Well, Ubi won't give a damn.
What Ubi does care about, is the expectations potential customers have of the game/sim.
And the higher these expectations are, the more likely Ubi will support the game better.

So naturally, a negative attitude works counter-productive.

[JScones]

As for those people who keep posting that they have already decided they will not buy the game,
Why are they even still posting/reading the SH5 forum?
Im guessing they must be:

a) Very bored indeed.
b) A drama queen
C) A Liar.
As opposed to others that take every opportunity to call people retards, short sighted, drama queens, liars etc for not having the same view as them? :down: :roll: :nope:

At least those with negative impressions are criticising the game, unlike you who seems to enjoy criticising the person. :nope:

[JU_88]

As opposed to others that take every opportunity to call people retards, short sighted, drama queen, liar etc for not having the same view as them? :down: :roll: :nope:

At least those with negative impressions are criticising the game, unlike you who seems to enjoy criticising the person. :nope:

Jscones. I dont enjoy it, im just bored of 'needless negitivity' based on a ton of assumptions.
How does one logically criticise a game that no ones played yet?
Sure-if the game sucks when released - THEN tear it apart by all means.
But point taken, my above post was a bit harsh.

[JU_88]

They think by posting that, Ubi will read it.
And will worry, because player x won't buy their game.

Well, Ubi won't give a damn.
What Ubi does care about, is the expectations potential customers have of the game/sim.
And the higher these expectations are, the more likely Ubi will support the game better.

So naturally, a negative attitude works counter-productive.

Make that d)
Well, too late to make any major changes now I expect.

As I have said in other threads, what really worries me big time is the fact that SH5 is built on SH4, I'm very much afraid of the bugs being transferred from one to the other, SH3 had a few bugs and most were fixed, was an excellent sim overall, the same can't be said of SH4, even now after all the mods is still shot full of bugs!!:-? I only hope that the initial statement by the Devs "all new code" is correct!:oops:

Oh it will have bugs alright and I really dont think you'll EVER hear those words uttered by a games dev :D
but Id be very suprised to see the same bugs appear as SH4. So long as they fix anything major, Im sure we'll live :P

[JScones]

Well, Ubi won't give a damn.
EXACTLY! So why all the agro from some when someone says that they don't like what they have seen? Ubisoft doesn't care, so what's the problem with people saying what they think? Why are some people so defensive of something that they haven't seen, yet so quick to attack others (usually personally) with statements like "you're a <insert emotive name here>, wait to you see it first"? :doh:

Indeed, who knows, if enough people complain about the same things, perhaps the devs--who frequent this forum--may be influenced to do something about it and improve it not just for "the whingers", but you too. And if people are being too quick to judge based on limited teasers, then at least the devs can sit back and have a laugh at our expense....or alternatively remove some of the mystery by providing preview copies to people like Neal or the like (ala SH2 and SH3).

Jscones. I dont enjoy it, im just bored of 'needless negitivity' based on a ton of assumptions.
Im merely Critizing people for Critizing a game that no ones played yet..
(if the game sucks when released - tear it apart by all means.)
But you haven't played it either, so what makes you the moral compass to criticise people?

Anyway, we're all bored mate.

What adds to the frustration are things like finding out that Settlers 7--another Ubisoft published title that is also set for release in March--has opened public registrations for beta testing; with "playing" expected to begin on 19 January.

Should we hold our breath for a similar opportunity with SH5?

[mookiemookie]

Jscones. I dont enjoy it, im just bored of 'needless negitivity' based on a ton of assumptions.
How does one logically criticise a game that no ones played yet?
Sure-if the game sucks when released - THEN tear it apart by all means.
But point taken, my above post was a bit harsh.

I agree 100%. It's just silly to watch people wring their hands and wail about how they're not going to buy the game based on two short videos of a half finished game and a few screenshots. And I too see nothing wrong with pointing that fact out.

[JU_88]

I agree 100%. It's just silly to watch people wring their hands and wail about how they're not going to buy the game based on two short videos of a half finished game and a few screenshots. And I too see nothing wrong with pointing that fact out.

To be fair to the guy - I think that Jscones sat me in the naughty chair over the way in which I expressed my self, (rather than what i was expressing)

As for the above, I suppose you could hypothetically argue that it is equally silly to Pre-Order a game based on the same above mentioned preview material.
Except for the one undeniable fact that most of us here have played & modded the last two (good!) Ubi Romania SH games to death, so its pretty fair to 'assume' that the third one will be enjoyed equally as much (at least)

[JScones]

It's just silly to watch people wring their hands and wail about how they're not going to buy the game based on two short videos of a half finished game and a few screenshots.
Would make for an interesting poll a month or so after release: "Of those of you who said before release that you wouldn't buy the game, have you since bought the game? [Yes/No]".

I would suspect "Yes" would win. :hmmm:

To be fair to the guy - I think that Jscones sat me in the naughty chair over the way in which I expressed my self, (rather than what i was expressing)

As for the above, I suppose you could hypothetically argue that it is equally silly to Pre-Order a game based on the same above mentioned preview material.
Except for the one undeniable fact that most of us here have played & modded the last two (good!) SH titles to death, so its pretty fair to 'assume' that the next one will be enjoyed equally as much (at least)
:yeah: to all quoted.

Whilst I have some reservations on how finished SH5 will be upon release (not just based on what we've seen so far, but also on what we haven't seen, such as a beta preview, which one could expect at this late stage), I have no doubt that it will at least provide a foundation that allows modders to take it well beyond anything imagined...

[Shiplord]

Doesnt matter what we've seen and heard so far. previews tell you very little.
Better to wait utill the game is released before bothering to 'worry'.
Worrying will change nothing now anyway.
Did you forget SH3?
If the players had not criticized the automatic trip to the mission area showed at the E3 before the release, then we would probably still not have a dynamic campaign until today.

[Lord Justice]

And the higher these expectations are, the more likely Ubi will support the game better.

So naturally, a negative attitude works counter-productive. Sirs, negative misplaced conduct so founded leaves me sir paajtor of becoming involved. If i may, these high grand nit picks are of no use hence, therefor matter not at this late development. Sirs are you sure this is the course you want to pursue? Should one not be intent of what is in the offering? controversy is inevitable, but ones tolerance should be more credible when having not even played the sim. I find all said presuptuous nit picks to be fool hardy, unwanted, disrespectful to the devs, and bad for morale within the sh5 forum. :nope: I personaly do not think it advisable to weaken the silent hunter series until iam certain (played the game) that i can establish a more than worthie necessary comment, and only then where it be my lot to post, i shall do with upmost dilligence and precision. Lets try to enjoy and look foward to it with the greatest respect it should deserve. :yeah: thank you.

[JScones]

Did you forget SH3?
If the players had not criticized the automatic trip to the mission area showed at the E3 before the release, then we would probably still not have a dynamic campaign until today.
VERY good point, and IMHO a great example to anyone who thinks that criticism is "counter-productive" and whatever 4Para has written.

Not surprisingly, the (albeit back then minority) "SH3 will be great, stop bagging it" crowd still crowed afterwards that those who criticised it were wrong all along, yet arguably it was the criticism beforehand that made SH3 what it was upon release, and not just an updated version of the mission-based SH2 that it undoubtedly would have been had everyone kept quiet, pre-ordered it and just "assumed" it would turn out OK.

I don't think I have ever thanked those who were vocal in ensuring that SH3 had a dynamic campaign. If not, then a belated thanks now for not giving in and for ensuring five years of SH3 enjoyment for me. :up:

[Méo]

then we would probably still not have a dynamic campaign until today.

VERY good point, and IMHO a great example

Ok, back then the criticism was about dynamic campaign missing, which is a BIG FEATURE.

But what is the BIG FEATURE that is currently missing in SH5 to call it a disaster?

Only a periscope screenshot?

[Lord Justice]

VERY good point, and IMHO a great example to anyone who thinks that criticism is "counter-productive" and whatever 4Para has written.

Not surprisingly, the (albeit back then minority) "SH3 will be great, stop bagging it" crowd still crowed afterwards that those who criticised it were wrong all along, yet arguably it was the criticism beforehand that made SH3 what it was upon release, Sir Jscones, do you have sight beyond sight? clearly you have a sharp mind in the understanding of opinions, therefor one should know speculation is nothing. Criticise by all means, :nope: infact i ask of you Sir Jscones will be so kind as to lay all your humble requests before neal that he will be graciously pleased to permit them foward to UBI . I would like to see the response, and then your presence sir would afford me another source of satisfaction. :up: Good Day

[JScones]

Ok, back then the criticism was about dynamic campaign missing, which is a BIG FEATURE.

But what is the BIG FEATURE that is currently missing in SH5 to call it a disaster?

Only a periscope screenshot?
I'm not calling SH5 a disaster. Never have. The point though is that things are much easier to change before release than after.

If you stay quiet and merely "assume the best" - you get what you're given. If you make a noise - you have a chance to influence...regardless on how big or small others see the feature...that's all subjective. Obviously a number of people have found the periscope screenshot an issue. You haven't? That's great Meo, more power to you. :up:

Besides, dynamic campaigns weren't, unless I'm mistaken, the only thing people complained about beforehand. ;)

[Méo]

I'm not calling SH5 a disaster. Never have.

I was not necessarily talking about you, in the first post of this thread he says he's worrying a lot after seeing the periscope screenshot. Some said that they would not buy it, well they can do whatever they want but it seems to me:

Hey! it's just a screenshot (probably depending on several options) of an unfinished game, ok it's not great, but it's no disaster!

Obviously a number of people have found the periscope screenshot an issue. You haven't?

I did: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=1224005#post1224005

BTW, I did not pre-order it, I will surely buy it but they will have to show more before I decide to pre-order.

[JScones]

I did: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=1224005#post1224005
Ah, I see. You do realise that puts you one step closer to the "dark side", BWAHAHAHAHA. :O::D

FWIW I agree 100% with your statement in that post. :up:

[Méo]

Ah, I see. You do realise that puts you one step closer to the "dark side", BWAHAHAHAHA. :O::D

FWIW I agree 100% with your statement in that post. :up:

Cool to see you're smiling. :up:

About the periscope view, I think Tomi's proposal would be amazing!

I wonder if it will be moddable. :hmmm:

[JScones]

I don't think I'm familiar with Tomi's proposal. I must have missed that one? :hmmm: I'm sure it would be brilliant though.

Even out of the box, if the objects (including the periscope view itself) are moveable - and evidence seems to suggest this may be the case - then even something like what Adriatico mocked up here (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1232939&postcount=47) (beside the default screen for comparison) would be (IMHO) a vast improvement. It's just a rearrangement of the existing objects, perhaps in much the same way that we will be able to do ourselves "live", but one is left with no uncertainty as to what the focus of the screen is.

[Méo]

I don't think I'm familiar with Tomi's proposal. I must have missed that one? :hmmm:

I was talking about this: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=1232798#post1232798

[Nimmo55]

Ok...I seem to have created something of a flap over my 'sinking feeling about SH5' post. :-?

Let me explain myself. I guess I could have just not said anything...and it's a fair point that I should stop worrying and just wait and see...actually I am sure the thing has a better than even chance of turning out ok.

So why the post? Well, I believe in standing up and stating my concerns...and in this respect, I am talking directly to the developers here (or hoping that I am :)) ...even though I sure respect my fellow posters and sub simmers, I believe I was really trying to get a message directly to the developers. Let's face it, this forum is the most influential on the planet when it comes to sub simulations; there is no way the developers are NOT going to be keeping tabs on it...seeing which way the feeling is running..getting ideas even and using it as a lithmus test for what they are contemplating. There is every chance they will see this post (and sure, ignore it perhaps...but the point stands; at least there is a chance they'll take it in..). So that is why I decided not to let it go by and post...and take thr risk of being called a worry wart by my fellow posters. :o

So my message is to Dan and his UBI publishers: I'm a little worried about what I have seen so far re interviews and some game screens; seems like you guys might be in the first stages of socialising the idea that SH5 won't actually be as hardcore as some of us hope and expect. I hope I'm wrong, but in case I'm not, and you really are thinking about 'walking the middle road'......PLEASE don't forget about the hardcore side of this sim..for people like me (who are guaranteed sales...and then some!). Implement all the assists and helps you want, Dan, but please make sure whan we can turn them all off, and when we do, the sim stands as a proud and bottom line hardcore submarine simulation, as the lineage of this series demands. I will buy your game quicker than a flash if you do this. That's my message. :yeah:

To my fellow posters and simmers...yes, I DO have a little worry that in their attempt to maximise the profit and appeal to the biggest gaming audience they can (nothing wrong with that per se BTW...it's a fact of economic life), they will tread a middle path, and not implement the hard core simulation angle that I have just loved about this series. And that would be a tradegy for a simmer like me :wah:; I treat my simulations seriously and LOVE playing them as realistically as possible. So I have a view on this.

Of course, as some have pointed out, maybe I'm tilting at windmills - I sure hope that is right; Dan and his team will implement all the hardcore bits of the sim and also have it compoetely scaleable, so a newby can turn on all the helps etc. Fine. No probs. To be expected even.

I just have a nagging feeling, that's all, that maybe, just maybe, they're considering not going all out on the hardcore side in the name of compromise...more than this series would expect. I think that it fair...

Ok, I've yacked on long enough. I'll shut up now and wait eagerly with the rest for March...

thanks,

Nimmo55 :DL

[Méo]

@Nimmo55

No problem mate!

To everyone who say they're not gonna buy SH5, my message was:

Relax, wait until the release, see what people here say about it, go on gamespot.com, ign.com or whatever and see what they say and how they rate it, THEN make a decision about whether or not it's worth to buy it.

This is not an order, only my opinion.

[IanC]

Worrying about the lack of dynamic campaign in SH3, made sense. Worrying about... nothing in particular in SH5... is not very productive, for anybody.

Meh don't worry, SH5 will have the same scalability for realism as the others in the series. They won't do away with manual targeting, and no map contact updates etc... In fact I bet we'll see a few new 'realism' features.

See... glass half full, the best/only way to live life. :D

[Task Force]

hmm... Saying HOLY CRAP over a pericsope view is alittle overboard...:rotfl2:
Remember, were a small groupe... UBI wants sales, and if they showed a Uber complex periscope view with all kinds of stuff up there, lots of people would say Holy crud... that looks hard, better stay away... Im sure the game is made to go accrost the spectrum... from those of us who are realism people, and for little billy, who wants to see things go boom...

[Reece]

hmm... Saying HOLY CRAP over a pericsope view is alittle overboard...:rotfl2:
Remember, were a small groupe... UBI wants sales, and if they showed a Uber complex periscope view with all kinds of stuff up there, lots of people would say Holy crud... that looks hard, better stay away... Im sure the game is made to go accrost the spectrum... from those of us who are realism people, and for little billy, who wants to see things go boom...Stuff little Billy!!:O:

[THE_MASK]

It will be the modders who will give the ultimate approval or not of SH5 . Then you will know if its good or bad .

[Snestorm]

It will be the modders who will give the ultimate approval or not of SH5 . Then you will know if its good or bad .

No. It will be the consumers who will ultimately decide SH5's fate.

[THE_MASK]

No. It will be the consumers who will ultimately decide SH5's fate. It will be the consumers who will decide the fate of SH6 . The modders will ultimately decide weather i like SH5 or not .

[WitoldGritz]

what to see?
its NOT gonna be Simulator, just Simulator of simulation for 12y/old kids

You saw game control Hood and controls of ship in Video? how close it is to realistic experience realistic stations and realistic control of the SS and how "captain" did it?

[urfisch]

ok, the interface can easily be modded. but if i see this interface, its a must! i was really shocked, when i saw it first. crappy action-mode...interface.

but i think, as mentioned before, there will be a great need of modding. so lets hope for a good core: a good gameplay and good basics. a good base is essential for modding the game. to get the game we want it to be.

anyway. i stopped judging sh5...theres nothin we can do, than hoping. the game should be released in 2,5 month? ok. this is a tight plan...graphics can be edited afterwards. so please, devs: integrate our long term wishes, regarding gameplay.

- wolfpacks
- nice interior interaction
- smart ai
- good simulation
===
in short: good gameplay, and:

- easy to mod


so, lets take our hands and hope...or should we pray instead?

as metioned...

[JU_88]

what to see?
its NOT gonna be Simulator, just Simulator of simulation for 12y/old kids

You saw game control Hood and controls of ship in Video? how close it is to realistic experience realistic stations and realistic control of the SS and how "captain" did it?

You are jumping the gun abit dont you think?
Maybe your right and maybe your wrong, we havent played it yet so we don't know.

Im not sure what level of realsim you are expecting from the HUD & controls, but these things are not realistic no matter how they are designed. (Since real captains didnt have there U-boat represented in 3d geometry on a 2d dislpay, controlled by a mouse & keyboard. :doh:)
So technically there is no right or wrong for the HUD & controls as they are just 'gamey' requirments we have to live with. :haha:

I would take a pinch of salt with the whole 'captain did and didnt' thing in general.
For instance; the captain probabaly didn't man the Flak Guns or operate TDC himself, yet Im sure we all want to be able to control those things right?

[Jimbuna]

Look at all this traffic whilst I was throwing out the zzzzz's :o

Some interesting posts to read whilst eating the good old 'full English' :up:

Neal should soon be contacting the dev team with a detailed list of last minute wants/wishes (call it what you will) taken from the myriad of threads on SS.

I should imagine anything that is doable (assuming it's not already included) within a permissable timeframe and that does not require too much effort (within acceptable parameters) will be considered for inclusion.

As already pointed out by Jaesen, it was as a direct result of the outcry for a dynamic campaign in SH3 that eventually led to its inclusion.

Perhaps it is still possible there is sufficient time for some of the requests that are outstanding to be included prior to release.

As stated in #7 All will be revealed in March

SINK EM ALL!! http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

[Uber Gruber]

SH5 is CURRENTLY in development...which means now is the window of opportunity to apply pressure on UBI to ensure the sub sim features the community long for are implemented prior to release.

Where time forbids full implementation, then our desire is that the devs 'code' in a mod friendly way such that lacking features can modded into the game after release by our very own capable modding members

If we do not voice our desires now then we should not expect them to be accomodated.

Therefore, if you have a requirement for SH5 you should shout loudly from the roof tops...and shout now!

Of course, if UBI listened more and liased more with this community then there would be no need to shout as we would feel safe in the knowledge that UBI is doing its best to produce a game with our requirements in mind.

Unfortunately, previous releases by UBI have proved that if we dont shout very loud then we dont get. So, if UBI want us to champion their products then they should create a better working relationship with their customers.
i.e. US

Cheers,
UG

PS: SH5 dev team, don't take this personaly - we know that you are all trying to accomodate us but have your hands tied by woefull management.

[Paajtor]

VERY good point, and IMHO a great example to anyone who thinks that criticism is "counter-productive" and whatever 4Para has written.



4Para's English is beyond my knowledge of that language....so I must take JScones' interpretation of his words for granted.
And I would like people very much not to take my words ("counter-productive") out of context.
I wasn't talking about SH3, but about criticism like "I ain't gonna buy this game, because blablabla".

[Adriatico]

Neal should soon be contacting the dev team with a detailed list of last minute wants/wishes (call it what you will) taken from the myriad of threads on SS.


Don't be too optimistic Jim...

SH5 (and Ubi in general) are drifting towards commercial waters of arcade gameplay (closer to Ubi forums) and far away from Subsim.

If there was genuine intention to incorporate wishes and feelings of "simulation fans" - the whole project would be much, much earlier opened for interaction and community feedback.
Don't you understand that this "sim" (or game) is not in development any more... if this should be released in March there is only time left to polish the bugs.

Simulation fans are "minor proportion" of market - and real bosses of this project don't give a **** what Neal and community behind him cry for...

Otherwise - they would present main features of game three months ago... not waiting mid-January to present their health bars, famous periscope screen, satelite picture of escort's scanning ...etc.

* * *
Anyway, I am grateful for a SH3 and nice memories... and wish them everything best with SH5 on market, consoles, i-phones, flipers, or whatever it's made for... :up:

[WitoldGritz]

"SH5 (and Ubi in general) are drifting towards commercial waters of arcade gameply (closer to Ubi forums) and far away from Subsim."

Thats EXACTLY what i wanted to say with my BAD english!!!

Have you seen "gampley" video? I dont mention "dificulty" tat can be ajusted ofcourse, but all GAMEPLAY and Simulation factor

UBI is comercial company and ofcourse they aim for bigger teenager market and not some bunch of 30y/olds Simulation maniacs!

I hope SH1.4 and SH 1.5 will be kept and developed more far y community!!


Its like compareing Air combat Sims like "LOMAC" "IL2" or helicopter sim "Black Shark" with all its realism factors and gameplay to some arcadish shiat like "Wings on fire: defend England" or smth!!! shoot shott!!!" ****

[JU_88]

Thats EXACTLY what i wanted to say with my BAD english!!!

Have you seen "gampley" video? I dont mention "dificulty" tat can be ajusted ofcourse, but all GAMEPLAY and Simulation factor

UBI is comercial company and ofcourse they aim for bigger teenager market and not some bunch of 30y/olds Simulation maniacs!

I hope SH1.4 and SH 1.5 will be kept and developed more far y community!!

Don't be too optimistic Jim...

SH5 (and Ubi in general) are drifting towards commercial waters of arcade gameplay (closer to Ubi forums) and far away from Subsim.

If there was genuine intention to incorporate wishes and feelings of "simulation fans" - the whole project would be much, much earlier opened for interaction and community feedback.
Don't you understand that this "sim" (or game) is not in development any more... if this should be released in March there is only time left to polish the bugs.

Simulation fans are "minor proportion" of market - and real bosses of this project don't give a **** what Neal and community behind him cry for...

Otherwise - they would present main features of game three months ago... not waiting mid-January to present their health bars, famous periscope screen, satelite picture of escort's scanning ...etc.

* * *
Anyway, I am grateful for a SH3 and nice memories... and wish them everything best with SH5 on market, consoles, i-phones, flipers, or whatever it's made for... :up:

Sorry guys but all this is based on what? 2 mins of ingame video and..?

IMHO, You guys are making assumptions.
Why not just wait until some of us have played it before deciding who SHV has been created & market for?

Oh and if the Devs didn't give a toss about our opinons and ideas (or had no control over the games content), why would they bother reading and posting on this forum and attending subsim meets etc?
Marketing?? LOL very funny.

Dan has already explained that there are no 'corperate suit types' directing or influencing the project, that is possibly something that we dreamt up oursleves. (Yet more assumptions)

Give the devs some credit - please.

Thats all.

[WitoldGritz]

and first of all the whole concept of game is wrong if they wanted to represent "life of Uboat Captain"


Its not just about sinking ships and chasing some marchant with "compressed time" its all about inner Sub life! dialogues? i bet UBI gonna put mth like in Footbal Manager!
"You gonna be promoed"
"Well done Sailor on last attack!"
"You not gonna be replaced in next Patrol" and etc...

If it gonna be real life we have not just to attack ships and plot courses we have to manage ALL SHIP with food suplies that should be even more important then Fuell reserve, doing minor maintanances over ship even play card game if you want with some crew

[Jimbuna]

Don't be too optimistic Jim...


Never am, but I do store my hope and faith in those I believe in.....those who have this community at the forefront of their minds (and there are those at Ubi dev team in addition to Neal still about).


SH5 (and Ubi in general) are drifting towards commercial waters of arcade gameplay (closer to Ubi forums) and far away from Subsim.


That may well be the case....but after the release of SH5 I hope.


If there was genuine intention to incorporate wishes and feelings of "simulation fans" - the whole project would be much, much earlier opened for interaction and community feedback.


My understanding is that this has been dictated by an earlier negative/contentious experience involving an area of the community and SHIV....and not something I know a great deal about.


Don't you understand that this "sim" (or game) is not in development any more... if this should be released in March there is only time left to polish the bugs.


That may or may not be the case, but a 'polishing of bugs' as you put it could lead to less disenchantment and a better game experience straight out of the box.


Simulation fans are "minor proportion" of market - and real bosses of this project don't give a **** what Neal and community behind him cry for...


Assuming you are correct....I doubt the same can be said of the dev team...I am of the firm belief they will do everything in their power to ensure as good a simulation as is possible, given the constraints place upon them by Ubi regarding time and finances.

Either way, we'll all know come March http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

[Snestorm]

I once attended a restaurant with a friend of mine. When the waiter came around to inquire if everything was alright min friend responded that everything was not alright. He then gave the waiter a short list of what was wrong followed by insisting he neither wanted a free meal, nor a replacement meal.

When the waiter finished picking up his jaw my friend went on to explain that his deceased father had been a succesful restaurenteur. An approximate quote follows:
If people refuse to report a problem with their meal, and don't come back, you're out of business.

By the way, not only did my friend pay his bill in full, he also left a VERY healthy tip for the waiter.

It's better to save some-one's business than their feelings, even if you're viewed in a negative light for doing so.

Although they may get annoyed with us at times, the fact that they are reading and responding to our posts tells me that Ubisoft is in fact, interested in our input. Negative input, although less popular, is generaly more constructive than posative input, provided there still remains time for changes.

[Apos]

Don't be too optimistic Jim...

SH5 (and Ubi in general) are drifting towards commercial waters of arcade gameplay (closer to Ubi forums) and far away from Subsim.

If there was genuine intention to incorporate wishes and feelings of "simulation fans" - the whole project would be much, much earlier opened for interaction and community feedback.
Don't you understand that this "sim" (or game) is not in development any more... if this should be released in March there is only time left to polish the bugs.

Simulation fans are "minor proportion" of market - and real bosses of this project don't give a **** what Neal and community behind him cry for...

Otherwise - they would present main features of game three months ago... not waiting mid-January to present their health bars, famous periscope screen, satelite picture of escort's scanning ...etc.

* * *
Anyway, I am grateful for a SH3 and nice memories... and wish them everything best with SH5 on market, consoles, i-phones, flipers, or whatever it's made for... :up:

+1 Its not first time when sim/strategy games changed into arcade-mainstream game cr**. Such games like Rainbow Six changed from strategic sims into arcade shooters.

Im wondering why Ubisoft doesnt listen real fans of SH game series and hire modders of TMO, GWX etc to make game better. It'd make game perfect w/o annoying bugs of 1.0 version.

Somebody could ask @ Ubi forum in FAQ section about realism and HUD thing? Will it be adjustable? I dont really want to buy game which was designed only for little kids. I also dont like Win7 Aero skin on attack periscope, i want real one -> http://www.subsim.com/ssr/sh2/prev6.jpg (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/../ssr/sh2/prev6.jpg).

BTW: Im not against it, to make game easier for newcomers but c'mon! I think the SH game series vets deserved for something too.

[Lord Justice]

And still ye come!! :doh:

[Adriatico]

Jimbuna... I genuinly wish you were right. From your mouth to god's ears...

But... I bet that you'll be clicking with your right hand to far-left side torp buttons... while staring trough far-right "whole", instead of "holding" periscope between your hands.

No matter what "community" said in nearby thread...

If I'm wrong - I'll reply to every your future post with "Your Majesty"...:rotfl2:

***
Just feel terribly sorry that GWX4 was cancelled... Feeling deep in my guts - that we missed out a great simulation experience... till moding comunity try to fix SH5.
:shifty:

[JU_88]

I once attended a restaurant with a friend of mine. When the waiter came around to inquire if everything was alright min friend responded that everything was not alright. He then gave the waiter a short list of what was wrong followed by insisting he neither wanted a free meal, nor a replacement meal.

When the waiter finished picking up his jaw my friend went on to explain that his deceased father had been a succesful restaurenteur. An approximate quote follows:
If people refuse to report a problem with their meal, and don't come back, you're out of business.

By the way, not only did my friend pay his bill in full, he also left a VERY healthy tip for the waiter.

It's better to save some-one's business than their feelings, even if you're viewed in a negative light for doing so.

Although they may get annoyed with us at times, the fact that they are reading and responding to our posts tells me that Ubisoft is in fact, interested in our input. Negative input, although less popular, is generaly more constructive than posative input, provided there still remains time for changes.


Good story, but while you friend had eaten some of his food, we have not played SHV yet.
Maybe even something as simple as a HUD should not be judged until it has actually been used/experienced in game?
Complaining about SHV now, is about as logical as 'your freind' complaining about the resturant food, after only reading the menu.

P.S This is not SH3 and as far as we know there are no major issues (e.g lack of a dynamic campaign etc)

[Méo]

If we do not voice our desires now then we should not expect them to be accomodated.

Therefore, if you have a requirement for SH5 you should shout loudly from the roof tops...and shout now!

I agree and that's not the problem IMHO.

The thing is that everytime something new comes, lot of people here seem to be acting like groupies and become hysterical.

You can express some doubts, shout it, but there's a difference between this and saying that it's gonna be an inevitable failure everytime there's a little sample of an unfinished product that comes out.

Try to think if you were Dan, would you like to come here after a hard day at work and spend time reading those threads where most of the comments are continuously bashing your work? Would this motivate you to interact more with this community?

[Jimbuna]

Jimbuna... I genuinly wish you were right. From your mouth to god's ears...

But... I bet that you'll be clicking with your right hand to far-left side torp buttons... while staring trough far-right "whole", instead of "holding" periscope between your hands.

No matter what "community" said in nearby thread...

If I'm wrong - I'll reply to every your future post with "Your Majesty"...:rotfl2:

***
Just feel terribly sorry that GWX4 was cancelled... Feeling deep in my guts - that we missed out a great simulation experience... till moding comunity try to fix SH5.
:shifty:

Let us both hope together http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

Your Majesty eh http://img98.imageshack.us/img98/1817/thinkbigsw1yo4.gif http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/werewolfking.gif

Has a nice ring to it http://img113.imageshack.us/img113/7975/gigglebigtb9fg3.gif

Right now I'm simply trying to counter the number of bear traps my friend keeps putting his feet in http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/whistle.gif

http://www.clker.com/cliparts/3/b/b/6/11971190921093978233ivak_Bear_Trap.svg.med.png

There be sharks in those waters as well http://www.blognow.com.au/uploads/l/LIZZYFOREAL/57049.gif

[THE_MASK]

Susan Boyle said " i knew once i started singing they would like me " .

[Lord Justice]

Let us both hope together http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

Your Majesty eh



http://www.clker.com/cliparts/3/b/b/6/11971190921093978233ivak_Bear_Trap.svg.med.png
l http://www.blognow.com.au/uploads/l/LIZZYFOREAL/57049.gif LMHO one would be more suited to your grace, lordship, your excellency. :03:

[urfisch]

is anybody here really thinking, that something from subsim reaches the dev-HQ? maybe...but do they care about, thats the point. i think we can say and cry as much we want, we wont change much. maybe in 2005 when the revival of the series started, it was possible to listen and built in a dynamic campaign, as the community wanted.

but

some of the posters here are right. the market itself is changing, and with it ubi goes. the masses are now the only target group, due to selling problems. concepts are drifting to be more and more for console games. arcade-play with sports, shooters and adventures is the new hope of the publishers. simulation games never had a major role, but will go apart. thats no curiosity. worldwide seen, only europe was a kind of bastion with players, who liked to play highly detailed sims for hours just to evade a destroyer or go and cutting hundrets of trees for building houses in games like anno, etc.

most players do not want to "dive" into a game, just to feel it. they want: "switch it on" and ACTION. thats what the market says. poor, but true.

in my opinion the studios grow to big and therefore need to take care of the masses. in times of SSI or similar studios (sierra with aces series), there was time and effort to take care of the smaller, more grateful groups, like us. theres not much we can do about this. a solution for the future would be, that big and functional modding groups, like the GWX team, etc. collect some money and found new, small studios. maybe, the great games market will correct itself and give these groups the chance of getting the niches back to real life. the big publishers do have the money, but not the passion. but i hope, there will come times, when quality of gameplay is needed again.

so, lets hope for the game sh5 and the winds of change.

:smug:

[stabiz]

Amen!

[Turbografx]

is anybody here really thinking, that something from subsim reaches the dev-HQ? maybe...but do they care about, thats the point. i think we can say and cry as much we want, we wont change much. maybe in 2005 when the revival of the series started, it was possible to listen and built in a dynamic campaign, as the community wanted.

but

some of the posters here are right. the market itself is changing, and with it ubi goes. the masses are now the only target group, due to selling problems. concepts are drifting to be more and more for console games. arcade-play with sports, shooters and adventures is the new hope of the publishers. simulation games never had a major role, but will go apart. thats no curiosity. worldwide seen, only europe was a kind of bastion with players, who liked to play highly detailed sims for hours just to evade a destroyer or go and cutting hundrets of trees for building houses in games like anno, etc.

most players do not want to "dive" into a game, just to feel it. they want: "switch it on" and ACTION. thats what the market says. poor, but true.

in my opinion the studios grow to big and therefore need to take care of the masses. in times of SSI or similar studios (sierra with aces series), there was time and effort to take care of the smaller, more grateful groups, like us. theres not much we can do about this. a solution for the future would be, that big and functional modding groups, like the GWX team, etc. collect some money and found new, small studios. maybe, the great games market will correct itself and give these groups the chance of getting the niches back to real life. the big publishers do have the money, but not the passion. but i hope, there will come times, when quality of gameplay is needed again.

so, lets hope for the game sh5 and the winds of change.

:smug:


Double plus good.

[dkunath]

I first started playing Silent Hunter 1 way back when. Then I waited years for SH2 to come out and when it did I played it for a short time and then off it went. SH3 came out and it was promising, but it was'nt until the moders did there thing. Lastly SH4 and again the modders made it worth while.

SH5, I don't know what it will hold, but I do hope that it offers enough that the modders work their magic on it, and I won't buy it until its been out for awhile and gets decent reviews.

Dwayne

[JScones]

The thing is that everytime something new comes, lot of people here seem to be acting like groupies and become hysterical.

You can express some doubts, shout it, but there's a difference between this and saying that it's gonna be an inevitable failure everytime there's a little sample of an unfinished product that comes out.
Meo, it's called hyperbole. It reflects much more on the person writing it than it impacts on the devs reading it.

Try to think if you were Dan, would you like to come here after a hard day at work and spend time reading those threads where most of the comments are continuously bashing your work? Would this motivate you to interact more with this community?
It would motivate me to interact more!

All this speculation would make me realise that I hadn't been providing useful information, or what I had been providing was missing the mark.

So, to mitigate much of the whining and complaining--which will not go away--I'd consider some approaches that other currently in-development games are using. I'd at least start with providing real answers to meaningful questions, (like "the game will model the following u-boat types" rather than the current "we'll possibly think about the possibility of possibly considering adding bum fluff"). Hopefully Neal can make some progress on this front.

If there's nothing to hide, why hide it?

So you've got to go back a step: why all the scepticism in the first place? And the answer is because of the lack of informative information provided by Ubisoft. What has been provided raises more questions than it answers. Fix that aspect and much of the problem goes away. You can't change how people react, but you can certainly change what they react to.

So my point: communication is a two way street and you reap what you sew.

Failing that, well, I'm sure Dan has broad shoulders. ;):up:

[Méo]

I'd at least start with providing real answers to meaningful questions

I agree, this is a problem.

It would motivate me to interact more!

So you've got to go back a step:

Why should I go back a step, what's true for you is not necessarily true for him or for everyone.

Personally, I would feel like: whatever we do, they're always gonna panic and say it's a failure, so **** **.

Sometimes I would feel like: bah, they're only a bit too passionate...;)

[IanC]

You see, some people here think we (subsim.com members) are the be-all, end-all of submarine simulations and therefore are owed answers to questions. When the ugly truth is that subsim members make for only a tiny percentage of Silent Hunter copies sold. So who are we, really, to demand answers... it would be a nice personal gesture for sure, but I don't get my panties in a bunch if Ubi keeps hush hush while in development.
Did Lucas provide answers to Star Wars fans before a big release?

[Adriatico]

You can express some doubts, shout it, but there's a difference between this and saying that it's gonna be an inevitable failure everytime there's a little sample of an unfinished product that comes out.

Try to think if you were Dan, would you like to come here after a hard day at work and spend time reading those threads where most of the comments are continuously bashing your work? Would this motivate you to interact more with this community?

Little sample ?
You call main combat "periscope screen" presented in video - little sample?
No mate, it is one of main features in simulator... if not the main one.
It determins, more or less, playability of sub-simulator.

Unfinished product ? ...looked quite finished to me.

I guess that Dan is having hard days after work, but this was last minute desparate attempt to influence something...before it goes on stamping and packing.

Hundreds of us are haveing a hard day after work (less attracive than Dan's, I guess...) so don't we have a right to rise our voice - if we want to have fun with simulator that we are supposed to buy and have some fun in the evening... or not to have a fun.

When would be the right time to rise our voices? In March2010... when Dan is less tired?

[Siegfried von Funk]

hmm... Saying HOLY CRAP over a pericsope view is alittle overboard...:rotfl2:
Remember, were a small groupe... UBI wants sales, and if they showed a Uber complex periscope view with all kinds of stuff up there, lots of people would say Holy crud... that looks hard, better stay away... Im sure the game is made to go accrost the spectrum... from those of us who are realism people, and for little billy, who wants to see things go boom...

Hey! Boom is GOOD!

[JScones]

You see, some people here think we (subsim.com members) are the be-all, end-all of submarine simulations and therefore are owed answers to questions. When the ugly truth is that subsim members make for only a tiny percentage of Silent Hunter copies sold. So who are we, really, to demand answers... it would be a nice personal gesture for sure, but I don't get my panties in a bunch if Ubi keeps hush hush while in development
If we're so inconsequential as you state (btw, I'd like to know your source on this because I think you are just guessing the percentage, which removes all credibility from your argument), then why are the devs more active here than at the "official" Ubi forums? Heck, why do they even bother with us at all if we are "nothing" as you want to imply.

Considering the devs are quite happy to cultivate our ideas, I don't see a problem in asking questions in return.

[TDK1044]

If we're so inconsequential as you state (btw, I'd like to know your source on this because I think you are just guessing the percentage, which removes all credibility from your argument), then why are the devs more active here than at the "official" Ubi forums? Heck, why do they even bother with us at all if we are "nothing" as you want to imply.

Considering the devs are quite happy to cultivate our ideas, I don't see a problem in asking questions in return.


I think the Devs choose to come here on their private time for two reasons. Firstly, they respect the fact that Neal set subsim up with his own money, and that the site continues to be successful because of his input and the contributions of the members here.

Contrast that with the offical Ubisoft forum, which was set up and paid for by Ubisoft as a dumping ground for their end users in the hope that having such a site would cut down the call volume to the Ubisoft call center.

The second reason that the Devs come here is because they are genuinely interested in how the subsim community is wanting to mod the game. In addition, they choose to interact with the forum on some of the questions posed.

Whatever my opinion has been of Ubisoft as a publisher over the years, my respect for Dan, Mihai and the others is huge. These guys have gone above and beyond for the Silent Hunter Series.

Dan and Mihai should both be honorary recipients of the Best Of Subsim avatar. :yeah:

[elanaiba]

I'm not really Dan, I'm just a "virtual actor" paid to behave like a smarter version of him.

[elanaiba]

Likewise, GreyOctober is another virtual actor. His role is a "silly version of Dan".

[Adriatico]

Absolutely true TDK1044:up:

But there is small problem here...

We are not going to buy and play "Dan and Mihai" DVD... but SHV, which has very specific and real issues...as title of this thread said, as well as initial post has described.


So heavy grey clouds remain above SHV simulator ...as starter of this thread emphasized.
:ping:

[Uber Gruber]

I'm going to be very honest here. IF I buy a sim my money goes to the company that is selling it. In the case of SH5 that company is UBI. I have every right in the world to request information regarding SH5, they don't have to answer of course, but the right exists.

Now as much as I respect developers in general, and pity them, I do not give a hoot about how my request for more info might be affecting them. I dont care if my negative impressions risk lowering their morale. My beef is with UBI, not the devs.

Devs do work, devs get paid.
I consider buying a sim, I want info first.
If sim good, UBI gets money.
If sim not ready ? I'll try and influence it.

Simple as that.

UG
PS: Just say NO to fanboys.

[TDK1044]

Absolutely true TDK1044:up:

But there is small problem here...

We are not going to buy and play "Dan and Mihai" DVD... but SHV, which has very specific and real issues...as title of this thread said, as well as initial post has described.


So heavy grey clouds remain above SHV simulator ...as starter of this thread emphasized.
:ping:


Silent Hunter V will be Silent Hunter IV patched to 1.5 with some bells and whistles. First person perspective, crew interraction and better graphics. If you're looking for more than that with the stock game then don't buy it.

[Adriatico]

Right UberGruber,
But in my case it is not even issue of buying and money...

I would pay straight 5 x price of DVD - just to enjoy feeling of good WW2 simulator... it simply means a lot to me... it's my passion.


( don't tell my wife... )

[Undefined]

About the periscope view im 100% sure they wont change that. And its not that bad. Hey, we got bunch of modders dont we ? :salute:

[TDK1044]

I'm not really Dan, I'm just a "virtual actor" paid to behave like a smarter version of him.

I think of you, Mihai and GreyOctober as Athos, Porthos and Aramis, Dan. Three lunatics riding around on horses shouting "All for one. One for all. Show me the money! We've worked our asses off. Where's our money?!

Neal of course is d'Artagnan....chasing after you on a pre-owned donkey shouting "where's our game?" :)

[GreyOctober]

Sorry, im playing Richelieu, i dont know about the others :shucks:

[Navarre]

Some German gaming sites report today, Ubisoft openly considering a version of SH5 for consoles, because the industry had changed and consoles could be the future of gaming.

[GreyOctober]

Some German gaming sites report today, Ubisoft openly considering a version of SH5 for consoles, because the industry had changed and consoles could be the future of gaming.

Link please?

[Sailor Steve]

Whatever my opinion has been of Ubisoft as a publisher over the years, my respect for Dan, Mihai and the others is huge. These guys have gone above and beyond for the Silent Hunter Series.

Dan and Mihai should both be honorary recipients of the Best Of Subsim avatar. :yeah:
:yep: I agree wholeheartedly. :rock:

I'm not really Dan, I'm just a "virtual actor" paid to behave like a smarter version of him.
Likewise, GreyOctober is another virtual actor. His role is a "silly version of Dan".
I'm glad to see you're keeping your great sense of humor through all this.

I think of you, Mihai and GreyOctober as Athos, Porthos and Aramis, Dan. Three lunatics riding around on horses shouting "All for one. One for all. Show me the money! We've worked our asses off. Where's our money?!

Neal of course is d'Artagnan....chasing after you on a pre-owned donkey shouting "where's our game?" :)
So Dan is a bitter but wise man with a tragic past, whose main goal in life is to drink himself into oblivion.

Mihai is a friendly but not-to-bright giant who follows a rough crowd because he doesn't know any better, and will die because of his friend's treason.

Grey October is ambitious beyond his capabilities, dreams of becoming a simple priest but will ultimately try to take over the world, all the while wishing he could go back to his old life, and whose best friend will die cursing him.

And poor Neal, the ingenue who may well be the best ever at what he does, but is doomed to a life of mediocrity, can only rise to his full measure by throwing in with his enemies, and will die on the very day he achieves his fondest goal.

Sorry, I know you weren't being that literal, but the simile was so much fun I couldn't help myself.:dead:
:rotfl2:

[TDK1044]

Neal's pre-owned donkey makes up for any short comings, Steve. :DL

[Sailor Steve]

:yep:

But did he buy it at AliBabaJimbuna's camel shop?

[TDK1044]

:yep:

But did he buy it at AliBabaJimbuna's camel shop?


He stole it while AliBabaJimbuna was out back measuring the distance his farts could travel after a bad curry. :)

[Méo]

so don't we have a right to rise our voice

When would be the right time to rise our voices? In March2010... when Dan is less tired?

I've said it before I'll say it again...

It's not about the right to rise your voice or not, it's about every time something is release, lot of people here are jumping to conclusions, panicing, saying it's a failure, and blablabla...

[Adriatico]

Today is 11.01.2010 ( if you haven't noticed )
... so I would strongly suggest to open a new thread named "personality and biography of Dan and Mihai" with a full respect to their credits - as creators of all this "subsim environment" :yep:

...and show some min. respect towards thread owner Nimmo55 and his topic ...and rest of "simualtion lunitics" - that are more interested in final shape of upcoming SHV ...than in your personal feelings and memories

[TDK1044]

Ok..call me a worry wart...fine. I'll wear that. But I gotta tell you I'm getting a little worried about SH5. I saw the interview with the lead developer...he's saying thngs like don't want people to have to study a book to enjoy SH5 (alarm bells right there going off...)...and I saw the pereiscope screen a couple of posts up...Yikes!! I really hope that isn't what they intend to put in SH5. It looks cartoony and frnakly, crappy. Little things like this make me wonder if they are going to ruin SH5 (from my perspective of course...who loves realism and simulation.) If it is like that, I certainly won't be buying it first up..I'll wait and see what the word is on these forums and wait and see if the talented modders can do something with it. But I hope I'm worrying for nothing...

Nimmo55 :-?

I think the game will be a graphically enhanced version of SHIV (1.5) with a first person perspective and a few bells and whistles. I think the in game options will allow it to be dumbed down to a greater degree than previous Silent Hunter games, and I believe that most of those options can be turned off or modded out.

So instead of worrying and or speculating, why not just wait for it to be released and assess it then. :)

[Jimbuna]

:yep:

But did he buy it at AliBabaJimbuna's camel shop?

Hey...dogs, llamas, camels are all available .....for an appropriate consideration.

http://img64.imageshack.us/img64/7943/doggyandnaner1.gif (http://img64.imageshack.us/i/doggyandnaner1.gif/) http://imgcash4.imageshack.us/img220/5318/bananariderhz3.gif http://img269.imageshack.us/img269/5558/camelnanerxt1.gif (http://img269.imageshack.us/i/camelnanerxt1.gif/)

http://img517.imageshack.us/img517/2430/thgenie9hyoj8gx1.gif

[paul_kingtiger]

The message I get about the difficulty / realism is that they want to make it accessible to non-simmers.

That could either mean it's going to be arcadey.
Or it will have a comprehensive set of difficulty / realism options.

Personally I think it will be the second, we will have a game that is very accessible for the new player but can be configured to be very simmy for the more hard core. That will be a brilliant thing, it'll get more people into the game, more people handing over money to Ubi and more chance of future games. I think a lot of people will start off on easy and become hardcore simmers.


Also as far as screenshots go, never assume a pre-release screenie is in the final game.

[Randomizer]

I think the game will be a graphically enhanced version of SHIV (1.5) with a first person perspective and a few bells and whistles. I think the in game options will allow it to be dumbed down to a greater degree than previous Silent Hunter games, and I believe that most of those options can be turned off or modded out.

So instead of worrying and or speculating, why not just wait for it to be released and assess it then. :)
This seems odd, to fill a post admonishing speculators with phrases like "I think" and "I believe" while referring to speculative features. Or perhaps only you can speculate? Perhaps only "positive" speculation is acceptable? I think not and that is opinion not speculation.

People look at the available information, which is pretty slim all things considered and see things they like or do not see evidence of features that are desirable. Yet just because something is not seen does not mean it's not there so speculation on SH5 content is certainly valid.

From my perspective (and only my perspective) I have seen no evidence to indicate that SH5 will be superior to SH3+GWX in any respect other than the eye candy to which I am entirely indifferent. If you see other things, good for you but advocating muzzling people whilst barking up a storm lends your points of view little credibility in my book.

Within all the hyperbole nobody seems to notice that if the developers produce the simulation that some are attributing to them than the hugely talented pool of Modders around here might have little to do. Strange that some speculate what a great game SH5 will become but only after the Modders have their way with the stock version. Perhaps there is more fanboyism and wishful thinking than objective analysis based on available hard information going on here.

Just an opinion.

[IanC]

If we're so inconsequential as you state (btw, I'd like to know your source on this because I think you are just guessing the percentage, which removes all credibility from your argument), then why are the devs more active here than at the "official" Ubi forums? Heck, why do they even bother with us at all if we are "nothing" as you want to imply.

Considering the devs are quite happy to cultivate our ideas, I don't see a problem in asking questions in return.

Well...How many hundred thousands of copies do they sell of, say, just SH3? A web search will show you that the SH series sold over 1.5 milllion copies world wide. You do the math about forum posters vs copies sold... it's not that hard to come to a conclusion.

And nothing wrong with asking questions, but there is a problem if people start complaining about lack of answers. Because that's not how it works.
You see, Ubi is a hot babe and her equally hot girlfriends (the devs) are way out of our league. You can go ahead and call them all you want, but don't expect them to call back.

[Adriatico]

And nothing wrong with asking questions, but there is a problem if people start complaining about lack of answers. Because that's not how it works.
You see, Ubi is a hot babe and her equally hot girlfriends (the devs) are way out of our league. You can go ahead and call them all you want, but don't expect them to call back.

Well... we had an avalange of genuine questions and concerns, in variety of threads, and finally we had an answer:
" I'm not really Dan, I'm just a "virtual actor" paid to behave like a smarter version of him."

Many thanks for answer WIP member of this forum, many thanks for your effort in development... but every member with some "grey compound within skull" should find this current situation at forum- pointless (if not humiliating)

So... I am "bailing out" from this forum (sorry Neal) till some less senseless times... somewere in April/May2010.

I deeply apologise to "untouchables" for shaking their sky and I apologise to simulation fans for my apparently "useless effort" - to help our comunnity and our future hobby and passion.

Best regards to all members... and see you in a near (more constructive) future...
:ping:

[TDK1044]

This seems odd, to fill a post admonishing speculators with phrases like "I think" and "I believe" while referring to speculative features. Or perhaps only you can speculate? Perhaps only "positive" speculation is acceptable? I think not and that is opinion not speculation.

People look at the available information, which is pretty slim all things considered and see things they like or do not see evidence of features that are desirable. Yet just because something is not seen does not mean it's not there so speculation on SH5 content is certainly valid.

From my perspective (and only my perspective) I have seen no evidence to indicate that SH5 will be superior to SH3+GWX in any respect other than the eye candy to which I am entirely indifferent. If you see other things, good for you but advocating muzzling people whilst barking up a storm lends your points of view little credibility in my book.

Within all the hyperbole nobody seems to notice that if the developers produce the simulation that some are attributing to them than the hugely talented pool of Modders around here might have little to do. Strange that some speculate what a great game SH5 will become but only after the Modders have their way with the stock version. Perhaps there is more fanboyism and wishful thinking than objective analysis based on available hard information going on here.

Just an opinion.


Because of your obvious arrogance, you totally miss the point. You've only been gracing us with your presence since January 2008, so you have little knowledge of the speculative nonsense that goes on here during the lead up to the release of a new Silent Hunter game.

I'd stick to your pacific island if I were you. The inhabitants there might actually be impressed with you.

Just an opinion.

[Uber Gruber]

It sickens me to see FanBoyism to be honest. Not only is it an embaressment to read but it also undermines 'genuine' compliments when someone achieves something good. So please keep the gushy FanBoyism till the game has been released OR the community is provided with some REAL information instead of the dribble we have received so far.

And for those who hate speculation.....well if the community had a better idea of what the main features of SH5 actually are then they wouldn't have to speculate. Alas only UBI can provide that info...perhaps they are not FanBoys of SubSIm.

[Reece]

Silent Hunter V will be Silent Hunter IV patched to 1.5 with some bells and whistles. First person perspective, crew interraction and better graphics. If you're looking for more than that with the stock game then don't buy it.There you go threatening me again!!:nope:

[Randomizer]

Because of your obvious arrogance, you totally miss the point. You've only been gracing us with your presence since January 2008, so you have little knowledge of the speculative nonsense that goes on here during the lead up to the release of a new Silent Hunter game.

I'd stick to your pacific island if I were you. The inhabitants there might actually be impressed with you.

Just an opinion.
Classic! Mere Post count or time as forum member = credibility.

I lurked these forums for years before joining and since then have read much but posted reletively little. I have the point just fine but you obviously do not since you were unwilling or incapable of addressing any of my observations. Far, far better to invoke the small-minded tyranny of the post count.

UBISoft probably has valid commercial reasons for keeping information tight but a problem stemming from that is when people can't see it, they tend to make it up. Some will see sweetness and light and dancing bears others will see an unmitigated disaster. Like most things, SH5 will likely fall somewhere in the middle. I'm still inclined to watch and shoot.

[conus00]

How about UBI releasing two SH5 games:
Hardcore simulation version: "Silent Hunter V: Battle of the Atlantic" and 13-year-old oriented FPS console-like shooter called "Silent Hunter V: Shoot'em All Up In the Middle of the Atlantic (Lite)"?

There you have it. Problem solved!

[Paajtor]

I'd probably buy both:O:

[Méo]

It sickens me to see FanBoyism to be honest. Not only is it an embaressment to read but it also undermines 'genuine' compliments when someone achieves something good. So please keep the gushy FanBoyism till the game has been released OR the community is provided with some REAL information instead of the dribble we have received so far.

Nothing prevent you from not reading them...

If still not satisfied, create your own forum exclusively for your clique.

[The General]

Classic! Mere Post count or time as forum member = credibility.

I lurked these forums for years before joining and since then have read much but posted reletively little. I have the point just fine but you obviously do not since you were unwilling or incapable of addressing any of my observations. Far, far better to invoke the small-minded tyranny of the post count.

UBISoft probably has valid commercial reasons for keeping information tight but a problem stemming from that is when people can't see it, they tend to make it up. Some will see sweetness and light and dancing bears others will see an unmitigated disaster. Like most things, SH5 will likely fall somewhere in the middle. I'm still inclined to watch and shoot.I personally like the cut of this man's jib :salute:


How could anybody who's watched the actual gameplay footage, seen on that German TV/Web show recently, not be impressed with the way SH5 is shaping up? It looks fantastic!

[karamazovnew]

It sickens me to see FanBoyism to be honest. Not only is it an embaressment to read but it also undermines 'genuine' compliments when someone achieves something good.

Usually Fanboys are the first to cheer the game before it comes, and then they're the first to bash the game for any bugs. Fanboys have the biggest expectations and hope for the game and thus they'll be the easiest to disappoint. So don't worry, genuine compliments will not be falsified if the released game deserves them.

[Snestorm]

Well...How many hundred thousands of copies do they sell of, say, just SH3? A web search will show you that the SH series sold over 1.5 milllion copies world wide. You do the math about forum posters vs copies sold... it's not that hard to come to a conclusion.

And nothing wrong with asking questions, but there is a problem if people start complaining about lack of answers. Because that's not how it works.
You see, Ubi is a hot babe and her equally hot girlfriends (the devs) are way out of our league. You can go ahead and call them all you want, but don't expect them to call back.

Who appointed you judge?

[IanC]

Who appointed you judge?

huh?

[Lord Justice]

Sirs, it gives me great concern, to undertake another post of which is not from a fanboy, just a bitter renewal of my objection to the seemingly excessive amount of complaints. (Providers) we should all make allowances for the devs to extract the content from the offerings and advice of the modders, bugfixes, threads, posts, etc.. Q When does the door close, and if sealed already, when will continuous complaints falter ? :hmmm: SH5 is not to long off now so... To (2nd Guessers) Does it really deserve or warrant ridicule? Does it serve to allow some followers to presumptuously attest, and discourse, unfinished development ? In my humble opinion one should await final release, and then perhaps they may not rue their words. I Must beg leave to express how glad i am, made by the return of SH series. I find it difficult to hold fourth my gratitude, in its making. In justice to the sim i must here say that no utterance by members could induce me to abandon my stance. Had i attempted to to mark early faults, then my doubts would have been exposed to unfortunate humiliation linked to quite possibly a lenghty self explanation. My single and only complaint thus far is however not aimed at the game, but of the conduct, and mannerism of some higher ranked vetran sub simmers, :nope: to which carry a distinguished mark of subsim favour. Some of their accounts vexed me, although did not suprise me. Is it scarcely credible to think that (some) of these (MatureBoys) even fall to the folly and imprudence of their friends, of which i deem unpardonable. To this end one believes that SH5 is not sinking, but rather some kind of order amongst ourselves. :yep: With the greatest respect and regard. p.s @ Meo, I read your post and am sensible of the small obliging response in this debate of which iam concerned. :up: Usually Fanboys are the first to cheer the game before it comes, and then they're the first to bash the game for any bugs. Fanboys have the biggest expectations and hope for the game and thus they'll be the easiest to disappoint. Indeed, Such wit must be awarded. Excuse this hasty scrowl.

[Uber Gruber]

Quote:
Originally Posted by Uber Gruber http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/smartdark/viewpost.gif (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=1234593#post1234593)
It sickens me to see FanBoyism to be honest. Not only is it an embaressment to read but it also undermines 'genuine' compliments when someone achieves something good. So please keep the gushy FanBoyism till the game has been released OR the community is provided with some REAL information instead of the dribble we have received so far.

Nothing prevent you from not reading them...

If still not satisfied, create your own forum exclusively for your clique.

Thanyou Meo for your input. I am somewhat ashamed to highlight that I have no clique, alas I haven't even been invited to join one - I guess I just didn't make the grade huh?

I for one am very interested in what people have to say about all topics and so it was with great pleasure that I read your reply. I would therefore like to take this opportunity to thankyou for reading my post and for taking the time to reply in order to express your oppinion.

I look forward to the day that all members of this community can express their oppinion without the risk of ridicule. However, as much as I accept that in some quarters of the world FanBoyism is, in itself, an expression of opinion, I am forced to contradict myself because, frankly, FanBoyism makes me want to dig my innards out with a rusty spoon and feed it to Amazonian Lesser-spotted Bull Frogs.

So I do hope you will accept this obvious flaw in my otherwise reputable character. To err is human as they say.

Thanks awfully for your understanding in this matter.

UG

[Steeltrap]

Seems a few people might benefit from a cool shower and a break.

This plaqce is normally about the most reasonable forum I know. It would be a shame for people to start sqabbling.

Not pointing fingers or saying anyone is "right" or "wrong", simply suggesting everyone remember to show some respect, refrain from name-calling and, if not able to do those, then abstain for a while.

Be a shame if we have to get the moderators to motivate a little peace through the brig....

Cheers all.

[karamazovnew]

:D Shake hands, make peace and go back to the bow torpedo room, the captain's there trying to Use Meo's special ability. Plus, UG you have a torpedo to load. :haha:

As a side note... god damn this SH5. I can't play SH3 and SH4 anymore :wah: I want the new one :damn:

[Méo]

Seems a few people might benefit from a cool shower and a break.

This plaqce is normally about the most reasonable forum I know. It would be a shame for people to start sqabbling.

Not pointing fingers or saying anyone is "right" or "wrong", simply suggesting everyone remember to show some respect, refrain from name-calling and, if not able to do those, then abstain for a while.

Be a shame if we have to get the moderators to motivate a little peace through the brig....

Cheers all.

Alright, alright, I should have retain myself and simply let it go.

[TDK1044]

I can't see how you can get a sinking feeling about a game based on a handful of screenshots and a couple of short promotional videos that show limited game detail and none of the options menu screens.

That statement is in no way intended to muzzle anyone who disagrees. I just believe that we should judge the game when it's actually released, and not judge it based on glimpses of the game probably released by Marketing and not by the Devs.

[Lord Justice]

Gentlemen thank you, if one possesses a double edged sword, then let it cut if need be, as long as it has the visable markings of mannerism, and respect, etched on to it. By your leave. :yeah: P.S The torp, had no decent guidance, way of the mark dear fellow, now i know who my silent hunters are! My move

[Randomizer]

I can't see how you can get a sinking feeling about a game based on a handful of screenshots and a couple of short promotional videos that show limited game detail and none of the options menu screens.

That statement is in no way intended to muzzle anyone who disagrees. I just believe that we should judge the game when it's actually released, and not judge it based on glimpses of the game probably released by Marketing and not by the Devs.
People can get a sinking feeling for exactly the same reasons they might be elated or anything in between. At this stage both points of view have exactly the same validity.

What information released to date allows us to make opinions based on whatever personal lens we view these sorts of things. Some are "glass half full" types and some are "glass half empty" types. I tend to take the pragmatic view that if either is true, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

All reasonably presented viewpoints are good, assault on those with whom you might disagree is not so good. Once the game has been released all this will be moot as discussion turns to the final results and some will crow in triumph while others wail in despair at a wasted purchase.

In the end though, it's just a computer game.

Good Hunting

[Adriatico]

I promised to keep away from SHV forum for two months... but you forced me to open my mouth just one more time:
I can't see how you can get a sinking feeling about a game based on a handful of screenshots and a couple of short promotional videos that show limited game detail and none of the options menu screens.

That statement is in no way intended to muzzle anyone who disagrees. I just believe that we should judge the game when it's actually released, and not judge it based on glimpses of the game probably released by Marketing and not by the Devs.

What is it... that you can't see?
He get a feeling based on screenshots and promotional videos. So what is he supposed to get?
He never mentioned a final judgment.
These screenshots and videos are made to rise impressions and feelings - and have no other purpose... so it is the most logical thing in this world: if you release promotional video on web - to bare impressions and feelings

"...and none of the options menu screens."
Do you think that "menu screens" would propose to you:
- to move periscope from far right to central position ?
- to remove cartoonish white outline from pointed parts of interior ?
- ...etc

"just believe that we should judge the game when it's actually released"
Of course, we should... but when you get it on your hard disc - you can change zero (0)
This is a "last minute" desperate attempt to point out some features that we (final users) feel as wrong... provided that Devs care about it ?

"...probably released by Marketing and not by the Devs"
What difference does it make who has released them ?
Marketing is just presenting what Devs made...

If we should rise our impressions when the game is released... what is purpose of this SHV forum... opened months before release ?
:ping:

[Lord Justice]

I promised to keep away from SHV forum for two months... but you forced me to open my mouth just one more time:


What is it... that you can't see?
He get a feeling based on screenshots and promotional videos. So what is he supposed to get?
He never mentioned a final judgment.
These screenshots and videos are made to rise impressions and feelings - and have no other purpose... so it is the most logical thing in this world: if you release promotional video on web - to bare impressions and feelings

"...and none of the options menu screens."
Do you think that "menu screens" would propose to you:
- to move periscope from far right to central position ?
- to remove cartoonish white outline from pointed parts of interior ?
- ...etc

"just believe that we should judge the game when it's actually released"
Of course, we should... but when you get it on your hard disc - you can change zero (0)
This is a "last minute" desperate attempt to point out some features that we (final users) feel as wrong... provided that Devs care about it ?

"...probably released by Marketing and not by the Devs"
What difference does it make who has released them ?
Marketing is just presenting what Devs made...

If we should rise our impressions when the game is released... what is purpose of this SHV forum... opened months before release ?
:ping: Oh come sir, its not for the want of complaints thus far it is quite simply a question of, IS IT JUSTIFIED AT THIS STAGE to complain, can they be immplemented as now!! now now and after, so close to release?? thank you

[Jimbuna]

http://img396.imageshack.us/img396/6942/popcorncowtx0.gif

[SteamWake]

http://img396.imageshack.us/img396/6942/popcorncowtx0.gif

No kiddin.

Whew thats a lot of drama for an opinion thread.

[Méo]

People can get a sinking feeling for exactly the same reasons they might be elated or anything in between. At this stage both points of view have exactly the same validity.

What information released to date allows us to make opinions based on whatever personal lens we view these sorts of things. Some are "glass half full" types and some are "glass half empty" types. I tend to take the pragmatic view that if either is true, the glass is twice as big as it needs to be.

Ok what is the reason why we could be ''elated''?

Well, this is simple because there is actually another u-boat sim in development! ;)

If I go back in 2008 I was really not expecting a new u-boat sim for Q1 2010, were you?

Having u-boat sim in development is better than having nothing at all!!

So you see the fact that they are doing this sim (or game) and that they showed a certain link with this community is something we should be grateful in some way. (SH5 was firstly announced here almost one year before its official announcement, the lead designer assisted & conversed with members of this community during both subsim meetings 2008 & 2009)

SO AT LEAST IT'S ALIVE!!!

[Bilge_Rat]

not to sound like an old man, but there have been discussions like this going back to SH2. A few things are a given:

- Each release is an improvement over its predecessor;

- Each release has needed multiple patches and help from modders to turn it from a game into a decent simulation;

and it is also true that:

-immediately after it comes out, each game has been savaged as "a travesty", "a parody", "an insult to the community", "not even fit to be called arcade like", etc., etc....

so sit back, have a beer, take a deep breath and wait until the game comes out before making up your mind.

one final note, keep in mind that in both sh3 and sh4, Ubi gave the developpers a very short leash in terms of development time and features they could add and both those games have matured into fine simulations. I have no reason to expect otherwise from sh5.

:ahoy:

[TDK1044]

I promised to keep away from SHV forum for two months... but you forced me to open my mouth just one more time:


What is it... that you can't see?
He get a feeling based on screenshots and promotional videos. So what is he supposed to get?
He never mentioned a final judgment.
These screenshots and videos are made to rise impressions and feelings - and have no other purpose... so it is the most logical thing in this world: if you release promotional video on web - to bare impressions and feelings

"...and none of the options menu screens."
Do you think that "menu screens" would propose to you:
- to move periscope from far right to central position ?
- to remove cartoonish white outline from pointed parts of interior ?
- ...etc

"just believe that we should judge the game when it's actually released"
Of course, we should... but when you get it on your hard disc - you can change zero (0)
This is a "last minute" desperate attempt to point out some features that we (final users) feel as wrong... provided that Devs care about it ?

"...probably released by Marketing and not by the Devs"
What difference does it make who has released them ?
Marketing is just presenting what Devs made...

If we should rise our impressions when the game is released... what is purpose of this SHV forum... opened months before release ?
:ping:


OK. Several points. Firstly, your statement "we (final users)". Understand that Ubisoft as a Publisher is not at all interested in pleasing this forum or others like it. We represent hard core simmers, and in terms of sales, if you put all of the SHV forums together you will get a figure of under ten percent of total sales of the product. Not only that, but the sales are guaranteed. Although there may be one or two 'ranting hold outs', the vast majority of people here will buy the game as soon as it is available and then hope that it can be modded to their liking during the year that follows. Ubisoft is well aware of this fact. They are not going to waste any time preaching to the choir.

Second point: It's important to understand that once a game is within two months of release, Marketing is running the show. The reason I made that distinction in my post relating to the released videos is because of the way that marketing guys think. What we would look for from a promotional video is one that depicts the game at a very high level of realism. To Marketing, that's the last thing they want. They want to pitch to people who may never have purchased a sub sim before. They want all the pretty, colorful pictures they can get in the video, and in SHV that means enabling all of the visual help screens and lowering the realism levels way down. That's why it's nonsense to assess promotional videos of the game as a hard core simmer when the videos are targeted at the casual gamer.

One contributor to this thread has Beta tested the game, and I will watch any further contribution from him with interest. :)

[Lord Justice]

No kiddin.

Whew thats a lot of drama for an opinion thread.lol i can confirm sir that i will hold firm on my opinions, as for real drama you seek, one should push on and aquaint friends in immersion immersion immersion thread there sir i believe you may gain some kind of favour, and indulge in trivial chit chat, oh and might i remind you sir, you perhaps will find it in this here forum, and not General Topics, all to which is scarcley saved by the title. :timeout: good day.

[longam]

http://www.businessweek.com/careers/managementiq/archives/info%20overload%20pic.jpg

ALL THESE SUGGESTIONS AND NOT ENOUGH TIME ! ! !

[Nisgeis]

one final note, keep in mind that in both sh3 and sh4, Ubi gave the developpers a very short leash in terms of development time

I'm not sure that's correct for SH3 - it was close to release date until the lack of dynamic campaign caused so much drama that they delayed the launch date by quite some time. Several months if I remember rightly. SH4 on the other hand was restricted in time and well, it did suffer from reviews saying that the game clearly was not finished, which never does sales figures any good. To be fair, those early reviews weren't wrong in their initial assesments.

[Uber Gruber]

Welease Bwian!

[Seeadler]

I'm not sure that's correct for SH3 - it was close to release date until the lack of dynamic campaign caused so much drama that they delayed the launch date by quite some time. Several months if I remember rightly.
SH3 was intended to publish in fall 2004 and was shown at the E3 in a nearly finished state, but without the dynamic campaign we know today. Then there were protests about the lack of dynamic campaign and Ubisoft prolonged the development time by 6 months.

[karamazovnew]

Welease Bwian!

Swentuwion, do we hwave a Bwian in ouwe pwizen? :haha:

BTW, does anyone feel that March is just too soon? :hmmm:
From current dev Q&A one would expect a game in this state to be out in late summer, not early spring.

[Méo]

BTW, does anyone feel that March is just too soon? :hmmm:

Agreed.

On amazon.com they say march 2, only 7 weeks from now... and we didn't see very much of it.

[Reece]

Also agree, hope they iron out all the bugs, don't care if there's less content!!:oops:

[JScones]

I think <snip>. I think <snip> and I believe <snip>.

So instead of <snip> speculating, why not just wait for it to be released and assess it then.
:har: Classic!

Just want to make sure though - your post was meant to be self-contradictory--a humourous way to highlight the speculation that occurs from "both sides"--wasn't it? :shifty:

Nothing prevent you from not reading them...

If still not satisfied, create your own forum exclusively for your clique.
Awesome! Finally we agree! Assuming of course that this also means no more threadcraps like this (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=1233947&postcount=8) from you whenever someone posts an opinion that isn't from within your exclusive clique?:yeah:

We may finally have made progress here Meo. :up:

[TDK1044]

:har: Classic!

Just want to make sure though - your post was meant to be self-contradictory--a humourous way to highlight the speculation that occurs from "both sides"--wasn't it?

Gold star to the JSGME Guy! :DL

[TDK1044]

By the way, my apologies to Randomizer for my rant at him in an earlier post. Unnecessary and stupid on my part. This is a $49 video game we're talking about. :)

[SteamWake]

lol i can confirm sir that i will hold firm on my opinions, as for real drama you seek, one should push on and aquaint friends in immersion immersion immersion thread there sir i believe you may gain some kind of favour, and indulge in trivial chit chat, oh and might i remind you sir, you perhaps will find it in this here forum, and not General Topics, all to which is scarcley saved by the title. :timeout: good day.

Ummm what?

Yea I need to post in GT someday ;)

[Randomizer]

By the way, my apologies to Randomizer for my rant at him in an earlier post. Unnecessary and stupid on my part. This is a $49 video game we're talking about. :)
Appreciate that, thanks. I sometimes come off like a pompus a$$ and that can be irritating. As they say don't sweat the petty stuff and don't pet the sweaty stuff.

Cheers.

[JScones]

This is a $49 video game we're talking about. :)
:o US$49?! Try more like AU$90 here, which on current exchange is just over US$83! We don't get cheap games here. :nope:

Perhaps this explains why some people are more nonchalant about it than others? I mean, while $90 isn't much to me, it's not small change either. I'd accept much less for AU$50 than I would for AU$100.

[Jimbuna]

:o US$49?! Try more like AU$90 here, which on current exchange is just over US$83! We don't get cheap games here. :nope:

Perhaps this explains why some people are more nonchalant about it than others? I mean, while $90 isn't much to me, it's not small change either. I'd accept much less for AU$50 than I would for AU$100.

I'll have TJ send you a few Pesos from out of the wishing well in his back garden :DL

[JScones]

I'd rather some Euros. :D

[JU_88]

Usually Fanboys are the first to cheer the game before it comes, and then they're the first to bash the game for any bugs. Fanboys have the biggest expectations and hope for the game and thus they'll be the easiest to disappoint. So don't worry, genuine compliments will not be falsified if the released game deserves them.

---
If the following Urban dictionary definition of Fanboy is correct....

'A passionate fan of various elements of geek culture (e.g. sci-fi, comics, Star Wars, video games, anime, hobbits, Magic: the Gathering (http://www.subsim.com/define.php?term=Magic%3A%20the%20Gathering), etc.), but who lets his passion override social graces.'

..Then I think its probably fair to say that there isnt a single 'non-fanboy' on this entire forum. :haha:

[Uber Gruber]

:rotfl2::rotfl2::rotfl2::arrgh!:

[karamazovnew]

---
If the following Urban dictionary definition of Fanboy is correct....

'A passionate fan of various elements of geek culture (e.g. sci-fi, comics, Star Wars, video games, anime, hobbits, Magic: the Gathering (http://www.subsim.com/define.php?term=Magic%3A%20the%20Gathering), etc.), but who lets his passion override social graces.'

..Then I think its probably fair to say that there isnt a single 'non-fanboy' on this entire forum. :haha:

How dare you include Star Wars and leave out Star Trek?! :stare:

Forgive me Spock, for this outburst of emotion. I'll now go and meditate.

[Adriatico]

Have to open my mouth again...
http://img197.imageshack.us/img197/3135/41588865.jpg

At new set of screens at russian site there is visible improvement on famous "periscope screen" compared to previous one (top):
- periscope view is bit larger that previous one
- shifted more to central part of screen, instead of far right
- edges of per. seems softer with crew boy out of main sight

It already looks better, especially at large screens (feeling is better...)
***
Does it mean that heavens heard our cry ?
Or we owe this one to Neal ?
(or is it simply different product ?)
http://www.buka.ru/cgi-bin/show.pl?i...pe=screenshots

[Apos]

Have to open my mouth again...


At new set of screens at russian site there is visible improvement on famous "periscope screen" compared to previous one (top):
- periscope view is bit larger that previous one
- shifted more to central part of screen, instead of far right
- edges of per. seems softer with crew boy out of main sight

It already looks better, especially at large screens (feeling is better...)
***
Does it mean that heavens heard our cry ?
Or we owe this one to Neal ?
(or is it simply different product ?)
http://www.buka.ru/cgi-bin/show.pl?i...pe=screenshots

2nd pic seems to have diffrent screen resolution or smaller HUD. Anyway, those health bars remids me one thing: where are first aid kits? Ships can collect them from the air drops and restore HP? :haha:

Anyway what i have found

http://www.buka.ru/sadm_images//game_screenshots/Silent_Hunter_5/10.jpg

minimap, 3 teamkills? Or those are friendly ships sunk by Allied forces? So there will be small naval battles? 2nd thing what is interesting. Chat windows is similar to these from RPG's where u can choose answer.

http://www.buka.ru/sadm_images//game_screenshots/Silent_Hunter_5/3.jpg

Water really looks nice! Also check left top corner. Numbers tells us what type of torpedo is loaded.

http://www.buka.ru/sadm_images//game_screenshots/Silent_Hunter_5/4.jpg

Minimap scared me. I dont know what are those numbers on torpedo and ship path. Also big orange transgle has returned ;)

http://www.buka.ru/sadm_images//game_screenshots/Silent_Hunter_5/6.jpg

Same screen as above but larger scale. I noticed there are two health bars, one is blue, second is yellow. Hmmm sinking and ship structure health points?

http://www.buka.ru/sadm_images//game_screenshots/Silent_Hunter_5/21.jpg

HMS Illustrious I think.

http://www.buka.ru/sadm_images//game_screenshots/Silent_Hunter_5/11.jpg

ps. Adriatico your link doesn't work. Here is fixed link http://buka.ru/cgi-bin/show.pl?id=487&type=screenshots

[Uber Gruber]

I'm only guessing here but I think those white circled numbers are related to torpedoes....could be torpedo range or even torpedo position number, i.e fire 3 fish and you get 3 numbers.....

If the latter is the case then destroyers appear to fire torpedoes as well!

Perhaps we should have a SubSim "guess the meaning of icons" competition.

[Apos]

I'm only guessing here but I think those white circled numbers are related to torpedoes....could be torpedo range or even torpedo position number, i.e fire 3 fish and you get 3 numbers.....

If the latter is the case then destroyers appear to fire torpedoes as well!

Perhaps we should have a SubSim "guess the meaning of icons" competition.

Torpedo position markers are the same as in SHIII/IV but orange. Probably these markers shows where will be torpedo or ship after 10/20/30 seconds but i might be wrong.

Also white marker on minimap shows area of periscope view...

Anyway where is "da sim" spirit? It looks more like Battlestation Pacific for me than Silent Hunter game.

[Gezoes]

There's something about that last large screenshot that feels right, it has a SH3 feeling :hmmm: We should not jump to conclusions, we should encourage the devs at this point and feed them thoughts and ideas, especially the wonderful modders. We do need to see some dials etc... yep. But I don't think they will pull a 180 and drop the dynamic campaign or difficulty options, or something gamebreaking like that.

SH5 features a completely reworked graphical engine and exciting campaign. Experience the life of a U-boat captain, interact with your crew, evade destroyers, sink cargo in over 35 historical missions spanning the first three years of the war.

Now that's a proper nightmare :timeout:, but for now based on nothing more than maybe plankton. So lighten up y'all. :arrgh!: Let her leave the harbour first shall we? :D

[Uber Gruber]

I just thought...yeah I do that sometimes...but maybe they're waypoints.

You see normally an image speaks a 1000 words....but this GUI speaks an entirely different language!

:O:

[karamazovnew]

WOW, that last image looks simply amazing. Focus on the planking on the right of the image... superb.

Now back to the minimap.
- the white cone is your field of view through the periscope
- the track of the torpedo is clearly shown, as is the track of the enemy ship.
- those numbers are not torpedo numbers, you can see the torpedoes as small orange lines. They've hinted on a new targeting system where numbered lines extend from both the ship and the torpedoes. To hit a target, you must overlap matching numbers. This implies a vector triangle, but in that case the numbers for the ship should be equally spaced. 0,1 and 2 are equally spaced but 3 is much further away. No idea what this means. It might mean that you're visually estimating the AOB and speed of the target. Thus the numbers might also indicate a level of accuracy, the smaller the better, or the more linear the better.
- the numbers on the torpedo tubes don't show the torpedo type, they show in Roman Numerals the number of the loaded tubes, while the arabic numerals show the percentage of loading on unloaded tubes.
- in all screenshots where the engines are stopped, we can't see yellow circels on the minimap. Thus, this must be the Hydrophone range of the enemy.
- the orange arcs represent ASDIC. one can clearly see that ships with bigger arcs of ASDIC have smaller circles of hydrophone.
- the course of the sub is shown as a thick dark line. While the compass controls haven't yet been shown, observe that there is a "closed" panel next to the engine controls. I bet that's where the rudder controls are. The reason it's closed is that the Compass might be quite big and would obstruct the minimap.

Observe that locking onto a ship opens the Weapon's officer panel. To unlock you say "never mind". Since the target hasn't been identified, he can't do any calculations... Automatic solutions are thus unavailable and the player has manual control ("shoot on my bearing"). But even so, he clearly has a way to shoot (the numbered lines).

Since this is clearly done on low difficulty levels (the ASDIC range is laughably short), I'm amazed at how complex the game can be at this level. It seems I was right in my "Dumbing down versus transparency" post. :up:

[Uber Gruber]

Oh that all sounds very complicated karamazovnew....can't we just do 100% manual targeting instead ?

[karamazovnew]

Oh that all sounds very complicated karamazovnew....can't we just do 100% manual targeting instead ?

:haha: C'mon you have to admire what they did for the newb crowd. It actually looks fun and "complicated". Plus it's based on the real procedure.
Now that you mentioned 100% manual targeting, we haven't yet seen a 100% difficulty periscope layout. I'm expecting something like this:
- the contacts on the minimap will be shown as hydrophone lines until you bring them inside the periscope FoV. Then you get a good estimate of range for tactical purposes.
- no more sensor circles.
- the Weapons Officer dialog box will have extra features. But in effect you'll be controlling the TDC through him.

I like this new minimap. Even though I'm against automatic plotting of bearing+range and a gods eye view, I'll be able to just hide it. The problem in SH3+4 was that the Nav Map also showed all the contacts allowing you to cheat and plot with the contact icons.

[Uber Gruber]

You have a good point, it has value as manual targeting "trainer" for a newb. I think GUI mods will be first on the agenda and i'm sure they'll be a few competing and popular ones made in the years to come.....before we too drift towards the evil lure of that console harlet.