Which fatigue model for GWX and SH3 commander

[Rangoon]

I'm a little confused on the fatigue models. The manual for GWX 3.0 recommends NOT using the GWX 24-hour in SH3 Commander, but I don't see that in the list. I see GWX 8-hour. So for the experience intended by GWX 3.0, should I choose:

Nothing (don't check the box)
Default SH3
GW/GWX 8 Hour

?

Thanks!

EDIT: The more I think about it, I believe for what I'm after I would leave it unchecked in SH3 Commander.

[sharkbit]

I use the no fatigue option. I hate micro-managing the crew and tucking them at night. I set up my crew for "battle stations" and leave them there until I need to move them if there are casualties or damage to the sub.
I got fed up very quickly in the stock game with crew fatigue, and GWX/SH3Commander was a godsend concerning crew fatigue.

The SH4 crew management was a breath of fresh air and I hope SH5 is modeled similarly.

:)

Welcome aboard!

[Dissaray]

The no fatigue modle is the best one as far as the SH3 Commander options go I think. The stock setings are just a little odd if you ask me in terms of the ammount of time the crew stays on station befor they have have to be rotated out. On top of that it is kind of a pain having to manulay move every one around like they don't know when they are too tierd to keep doing thier job.

Don't quote me on this but I think I remember seeing the the GWX 3 gold manual, the one that is created when the mod is installed, that they also recomend the no fatigue moddle.

[Magic1111]

Hello !

I also use the "no fatigue" option in SH3 Commander. Finally, I as a captain can not monitor the observance of pauses of my crew...:03:

Best regards,
Magic

[Jimbuna]

I also use the 'no fatigue' version for similar reasons to sharkbit.

In tc above x32 the fatigue model stops working irregardless of what you choose.

[Rangoon]

Thanks - that all makes sense. I haven't played enough yet to really see how it plays out through an entire patrol. From what you're all saying it sounds like it's not worth the trouble.

[Jimbuna]

Thanks - that all makes sense. I haven't played enough yet to really see how it plays out through an entire patrol. From what you're all saying it sounds like it's not worth the trouble.

It depends on what your gaming preferences are. Some like to micro manage they're crew and others see it as a form of hassle.

To each they're own.

[Rangoon]

Right. I realized that this is something I can change on a patrol-to-patrol basis, so I've been bouncing back and forth between No Fatigue and leaving it blank (using default GWX 3.0 fatigue). Jury is still out for me, but it's nice having the options. It does add another level of management depth for timing your actions, but also adds the micromanagement hassle. So far I've enjoyed both sides of that coin at different times.

[Sailor Steve]

I'm one of those who uses the '8-Hour' fatigue model, not because I want to but because some weird inner voice keeps making me feel guilty if I don't. I also set the animations level so they fatigue no matter how high I set the time compression.

Something about dropping to 1x TC every four hours makes me feel like I'm somehow doing my duty to my crew. Weird, huh?

I too think that SH4 is a vast improvement in that area.

[danurve]

S S; uh yeah it is nuts.
Frack fatigue, not the CO's job anyhow. A complete waist of time and Bullcrap feature in this game.

[Gaijin]

I use GWX 8 hour, for same reasons as above. Don't want to micro manage... but at same time, don't want a crew of robots either.

Always thought that morale V fatigue should play a bigger role in the game. As in, a big successful sinking gives the crew an extra boost while a sustained depth charging takes it toll.

That and stale air. And bad food after several weeks at sea.

And as for Bernard's farts...:dead:

[Kpt. Lehmann]

Just my two cents, but on the rare occasions that I get to patrol a bit, I use the GWX 8-hour fatigue model for the reasons you've both stated.

I just don't feel right with a crew that is impervious to the rigors of the sea.

As you say. It removes on of the few human elements from the experience.

[Rangoon]

Thanks for the input, guys.

What is the difference between the stock GWX settings (i.e. NOT checking the fatigue box in SH3 Commander) and the GWX 8 hour settings? I don't recall seeing that in either documentation. Am I correct that the stock GWX 3.0 fatigue is different from GWX 8 hour? Or are they one in the same?

The more I play, the more I do use the fatigue (been using stock GWX 3.0 fatigue). Last night I was dueling with a British ASW Trawler in shallow water near the English Channel in my Type IIa. The entire engagement lasted about 8-10 hours from the time I spotted him to the time he was sitting at the bottom of the Channel. Throughout the engagement, many of my crew became critically fatigued. Even with a fully crewed torpedo station, nobody was loading torpedos due to fatigue (yes, I had fired three already and couldn't afford to stay silent any longer).

It was actually fun to sort out how to manage the crew in that scenario because I needed everybody! I like that time compression above 32x has no effect on fatigue. During normal cruise operations, it's not hard for the crew to get their rest without me babysitting them. It only becomes a factor for the captain during drawn-out engagements where decisions need to be made about who can rest and who needs to be on station. For now I'm going to keep using fatigue of some sort.

p.s. Kpt. Lehmann I have to say it - thanks for all your work on GWX. I just picked up SH3 and SH4 through Steam and am glad I decided to play through SH3 with GWX before getting to SH4. I'm having a great time with it and GWX is a huge factor in that. Appreciate all the work by you and the GW team. :up:

[Sailor Steve]

What is the difference between the stock GWX settings (i.e. NOT checking the fatigue box in SH3 Commander) and the GWX 8 hour settings? I don't recall seeing that in either documentation. Am I correct that the stock GWX 3.0 fatigue is different from GWX 8 hour?Or are they one in the same?
I'm not sure myself. I've fallen into the habit of trusting Commander for everything.

Last night I was dueling with a British ASW Trawler in shallow water near the English Channel in my Type IIa. The entire engagement lasted about 8-10 hours from the time I spotted him to the time he was sitting at the bottom of the Channel.
That sounds like one hell of a fight.

It was actually fun to sort out how to manage the crew in that scenario because I needed everybody! I like that time compression above 32x has no effect on fatigue.
I actually used Commander to change it so my crew fatigues at any TC. In a Type II it becomes very hard to keep them going when the weather is bad and they need to be changed every two hours, and there aren't enough. I understand that as they gain experience they last longer and need less help, but I've never played that far into a career.

One of the realism rules I hold myself to is the fact that they never reloaded torpedoes while in combat. Steep dive and rise angle while being pursued can play havoc with a torpedo that weighs about a ton. I don't use Auto Reload, and don't even put the men in the torpedo room until I'm done fighting and in a position to load them safely.

am glad I decided to play through SH3 with GWX before getting to SH4
You made a good choice. My favorite part about GWX is all the extras. Some people label it "eye candy", but I love the harbors filled with ships. I always depart and return in real time, just to look at the stuff. Then there's the blimps...

On the other hand, one of the things that SH4 actually fixed is the way crew management works. The have three shifts, and they change themselves. I play both myself, back and forth, back and forth...

[Rangoon]

That sounds like one hell of a fight.

Well, given my lack of experience, I'm sure it could have gone smoother. I spotted him 14km out and figured I could sneak into position. I remained surfaced in order to plot his course and determine his speed. Just as I was about to head to periscope depth (since he was basically heading my way and I could sit and wait) at about 7km, I saw him turn toward me. Well I underestimated both his detection range and his ability to locate me below the surface. It wasn't long before he made his first depth charge run - directly over head, but detonating too shallow. It took some time to confuse him enough to maneuver out to 1km again, where I took my first torpedo shot. Missed because he saw me again and maneuvered. Again, it took some time to out-maneuver him for a second shot, which hit the engine and disabled him. A third torpedo shot either missed or was a dud (I thought I heard an explosion, but saw nothing and he continued to float). I waited a while to see if he was flooding, but must have had it under control so I launched a fourth which hit and sunk him. It was an ordeal. I must have heard three dozen depth charges go off, and a few of them did cause minor damage. The crew was exhausted.




I actually used Commander to change it so my crew fatigues at any TC.

Yeah, I had considered that, too. But haven't done so, just figuring while I'm in transit at high TC, they're taking care of themselves well enough. The flip side is that those in quarters during high TC are not recuperating. So it makes sense both ways. I'll probably give that a try.

One of the realism rules I hold myself to is the fact that they never reloaded torpedoes while in combat. Steep dive and rise angle while being pursued can play havoc with a torpedo that weighs about a ton. I don't use Auto Reload, and don't even put the men in the torpedo room until I'm done fighting and in a position to load them safely.

I see what you mean. I didn't reload any tubes until I had emptied all three and saw him still sitting there. So I sat still and reloaded - putting my most rested crew to the torpedo room.

However, if you don't put anyone into the torpedo room, doesn't that increase your chance for duds and such? Or do you mean you fire the torpedoes and then remove the crew right away? I don't know myself whether you can even fire torpedos without crew in the torpedo room, so maybe the answer to my question is obvious.

[Rangoon]

Oh yeah, and one more thing I'm still not sure on...

I use the GWX 8-hour fatigue model for the reasons you've both stated.

In the GWX 3.0 manual, it states:


• Do not use the Grey Wolves 24 hour fatigue modelObviously 24 and 8 are different, but can someone clarify that indeed the GWX 8 hour option in SH3 Commander is NOT the 24 hour model mentioned here and that it's good for use in SH3 GWX 3.0 with SH3 Commander?

Thanks! I don't mean to seem obtuse or anything (pun intended...been plotting too many target intercepts I guess), but since there is no "Grey Wolves 24 hour" option in the current SH3 Commander I don't know if it's just been removed, replaced, or if they're the same and it's a typo in the manual.

[Jimbuna]

Oh yeah, and one more thing I'm still not sure on...



In the GWX 3.0 manual, it states:

Obviously 24 and 8 are different, but can someone clarify that indeed the GWX 8 hour option in SH3 Commander is NOT the 24 hour model mentioned here and that it's good for use in SH3 GWX 3.0 with SH3 Commander?

Thanks! I don't mean to seem obtuse or anything (pun intended...been plotting too many target intercepts I guess), but since there is no "Grey Wolves 24 hour" option in the current SH3 Commander I don't know if it's just been removed, replaced, or if they're the same and it's a typo in the manual.

The 8 hour is exactly that....forget the 24 hour version http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

[Sailor Steve]

Just as I was about to head to periscope depth (since he was basically heading my way and I could sit and wait) at about 7km, I saw him turn toward me. Well I underestimated both his detection range and his ability to locate me below the surface. It wasn't long before he made his first depth charge run - directly over head, but detonating too shallow.
That's one of the things that took me by surprise. I love the 'Happy Times' single mission for convoy practice, but the starting range is 7 km and the first time I played using GWX, he started shooting at me before I realized what was happening.

Yeah, I had considered that, too. But haven't done so, just figuring while I'm in transit at high TC, they're taking care of themselves well enough. The flip side is that those in quarters during high TC are not recuperating. So it makes sense both ways. I'll probably give that a try.
I use it as an excuse to slow down and see if the weather's changed, maybe dive and do a sound check. For me it's a reason not to rush through the game too quickly. I'm not in any hurry to get into action, I just like the feel of the thing.

However, if you don't put anyone into the torpedo room, doesn't that increase your chance for duds and such? Or do you mean you fire the torpedoes and then remove the crew right away? I don't know myself whether you can even fire torpedos without crew in the torpedo room, so maybe the answer to my question is obvious.
I don't know about the duds part, but I'm pretty sure they will fire with no one there. (Will they? Now that you mention it I don't remember if I had crew there before firing or not.):06:

I are not getting senile! I are not drain-bamaged!

[PappyCain]

I myself like the fatigue setting at 8hrs. If Helga is aboard I reset it to 4 hrs. If I am playing past 10 PM at night, I have to set it for 2 hours. That is when my nurse rolls me to bed and shuts the lights.

S'
PC

[Kpt. Lehmann]

Ahhh, yes.



I meant to add. When I sail, I like to do a lot of it in 1x time compression, because I can look at the date and read all about what was going on on that date, while I watch the horizon and listen to the waves. I keep most of the crews in their quarters relaxing to stay on top of fatigue. Some get rotated up for a smoke on the bridge. I like to think that I'm getting to know my crew that way.


As far as building GWX was concerned, the pleasure was all ours. As far as stability is concerned, GWX by herself (and/or properly installed SH3 Commander) she is rock solid! Glad you are having a good time!


Sink'em ALL!

:arrgh!:

[Kapitän]

I also use the 8h model. Always travel at x64 time compression until an aircraft is sighted or a contact report is received. Naturally, I use real time in attack mode but also drop below x64 time compression, to recover the crew in the crew compartment faster. I also, use real time, when leaving and entering port (e.g., Kiel Ehrenmal) or at certain parts of the KWK in CCoM (e.g., bridges) or any other sites, that I come across at times.

[UKönig]

What I have found in the original silent hunter 3 regarding crew fatigue was that the more medals or decorations you are able to give your crew, the higher their overall morale, and the "German cross in gold" eliminated the fatigue for the crewman in question. Put him on duty on day one, and leave him there, he never gets tired.
This allows you to free up some space so you can take on new crew, like the petty officers, who can be qualified in a trade, to help improve the fighting condition of your boat.
That's the difference between having an experienced and highly trained ship, vs one that is crewed by newbies, and it can be a difficult shift for me to make when ending a late war career and starting up a new one. There are certain habits I got used to, and now have to rethink my position...

[Kapitän]

What I have found in the original silent hunter 3 regarding crew fatigue was that the more medals or decorations you are able to give your crew, the higher their overall morale, and the "German cross in gold" eliminated the fatigue for the crewman in question. Put him on duty on day one, and leave him there, he never gets tired.
This allows you to free up some space so you can take on new crew, like the petty officers, who can be qualified in a trade, to help improve the fighting condition of your boat.
That's the difference between having an experienced and highly trained ship, vs one that is crewed by newbies, and it can be a difficult shift for me to make when ending a late war career and starting up a new one. There are certain habits I got used to, and now have to rethink my position...

Yes, that is definately true for the Knights Cross. Need to check this for the German Cross in Gold ...