View Full Version : WTH....
AVGWarhawk
10-12-09, 03:21 PM
Six-year-old Zachary Christie was so excited to become a Cub Scout that he brought his camping utensil to school. The tool serves as a spoon, a fork and a knife, and Zachary wanted to use it at lunch.
What Zachary didn't know was that the gizmo violated his school's zero-tolerance policy on weapons. And now the Christina School District in Newark, Del., has suspended the first grader and ordered him to attend the district's reform school for 45 days.
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,564605,00.html
Has the school gone to far? What does the cafeteria use for utensils?
SteamWake
10-12-09, 03:26 PM
I dont get it..
Why not just take the gizmoe away from him and hold it till the end of the school day and tell him not to bring it back.
45 days in a reform school is almost assuredly going to do more harm than good in this case.
I remember the biggest fight (of many) I got involved in back in my high school I split some kids head open with a history book. So yea lets ban books too.
AVGWarhawk
10-12-09, 03:32 PM
I think this was a bit far also. But who am I to question the do gooders school officials? It is a case of CYA only.
I remember the biggest fight (of many) I got involved in back in my high school I split some kids head open with a history book. So yea lets ban books too.No no! Let's burn them instead. That's far more effective.
Frickin' nanny state. 45 days reform for a 6 yo will probably turn out a mean spirited little bastid with little respect for authority.
AVGWarhawk
10-12-09, 03:44 PM
But again, what utensils do they use in the cafeteria? Is is just spoons like the local prison? I mean really, I remember forks, knives and spoons in my cafeteria. Even so, first grade and is loving he is a Boy Scout wanting to use his utensils. Actually, I think he would be a cub scout. :hmmm:
Jimbuna
10-12-09, 03:47 PM
I agree with TJ.
@Chris.....probably plastic utensils judging by the reaction.
Skybird
10-12-09, 03:49 PM
An extreme reaction.
The other extreme: in England, three or four years ago, there was reported a rule forbidding knifes and other weapons at that school(s). Only kids and juveniles from Sikh families were given special rules. They were allowed to carry knifes at schools. Religion, you know.
WTH?
CastleBravo
10-12-09, 03:55 PM
Too much! Nanny state without the pretty nanny.
God forbid we punish the disobedient foul mouthed violent children who abuse teachers and students alike. Take the sporks from cub scouts. That'll teach 'em. How about another Peace Prize for the nanny staters.
Jimbuna
10-12-09, 03:58 PM
An extreme reaction.
The other extreme: in England, three or four years ago, there was reported a rule forbidding knifes and other weapons at that school(s). Only kids and juveniles from Sikh families were given special rules. They were allowed to carry knifes at schools. Religion, you know.
WTH?
The same was tried regarding turbans and crash helmets for motorbikes.
AVGWarhawk
10-12-09, 03:58 PM
I agree with TJ.
@Chris.....probably plastic utensils judging by the reaction.
Back in my day it was cheap metal forks, knives and spoon. I guess they use plastic sporks now.
http://images.quizilla.com/D/drunkenpirategirl/1101758079_hailsporks.jpg
Eat your lunch without fear of a fork being lodged in your jugular. :doh:
OneToughHerring
10-12-09, 04:01 PM
I dont get it..
Why not just take the gizmoe away from him and hold it till the end of the school day and tell him not to bring it back.
45 days in a reform school is almost assuredly going to do more harm than good in this case.
I remember the biggest fight (of many) I got involved in back in my high school I split some kids head open with a history book. So yea lets ban books too.
You can always count on the astro turfers to come up with the appropriate use for everyday objects like books. :har:
Jimbuna
10-12-09, 04:02 PM
Back in my day it was cheap metal forks, knives and spoon. I guess they use plastic sporks now.
http://images.quizilla.com/D/drunkenpirategirl/1101758079_hailsporks.jpg
Eat your lunch without fear of a fork being lodged in your jugular. :doh:
I guess some in society are that wee bit less tolerant and with violent tendancies now. :hmmm:
Fincuan
10-12-09, 04:03 PM
Pfft... The boy being a cub scout should have been a dead giveaway on why he brought that stuff to school. It's damn annoying when some people ALWAYS start thinking of the worst case scenarios first, no matter how unlikely they are, instead of considering the most probable option.
When I was about six years old I once took a real knife, the blade being about 10-15 cm long, to an airplane because I was into hunting at the time and didn't really understand it was something you'd better not do. The guys at the security check just smiled and waved us through. I hate to think what would happen if any kid tried that now...
CastleBravo
10-12-09, 04:08 PM
Another thought..forgive me. Six year olds are now public enenmies?
Insane.
SteamWake
10-12-09, 04:11 PM
You can always count on the astro turfers to come up with the appropriate use for everyday objects like books. :har:
When I went to school integration was a brand new thing. There was alot of racial tension and fights were quite common.
In this particular case the boy had sucker punched me as I walked down the hall... for no particular reason other than I was a 'honkie'. I managed to catch up wtih him later and return the favor.
Skybird
10-12-09, 04:17 PM
Another thought..forgive me. Six year olds are now public enenmies?
Insane.
Yes, they can blow up quite young these days.
OneToughHerring
10-12-09, 04:28 PM
When I went to school integration was a brand new thing. There was alot of racial tension and fights were quite common.
In this particular case the boy had sucker punched me as I walked down the hall... for no particular reason other than I was a 'honkie'. I managed to catch up wtih him later and return the favor.
I hope that US-style violent culture never finds it's way to Finland.
CastleBravo
10-12-09, 04:32 PM
I hope that US-style violent culture never finds it's way to Finland.
Where do you think the US-style violent behavior came from..........Europe. None of us are native to this land. We are but caretakers and are willing to do what is neccessary to keep it. Much like the Finns, when it comes to Russia.
OneToughHerring
10-12-09, 04:35 PM
Where do you think the US-style violent behavior came from..........Europe. None of us are native to this land. We are but caretakers and are willing to do what is neccessary to keep it. Much like the Finns, when it comes to Russia.
US culture is not the same thing as European culture. It wasn't even in the very beginning when the US was founded. Caretakers? Meaning one day you'll scamper out and give the land back to it's rightful owners, the natives? And where will you go?
CastleBravo
10-12-09, 04:41 PM
US culture is not the same thing as European culture. It wasn't even in the very beginning when the US was founded. Caretakers? Meaning one day you'll scamper out and give the land back to it's rightful owners, the natives? And where will you go?
You neglected to address this.
Where do you think the US-style violent behavior came from..........Europe.
or this.......
Much like the Finns, when it comes to Russia.
Time to get over your sense of moral superiority and get a grasp on reality mate.
OneToughHerring
10-12-09, 04:45 PM
I already addressed it, US culture is very different from European culture. Originally we all came from Africa, can I use this as a cop out next time I do something wrong?
Russia? What does Russia have to do with this?
CastleBravo
10-12-09, 04:51 PM
Blame it on the Europeans. 85% of the US population comes from you. And yes we brought our backgrounds with us. I'm sorry if that is hard for you to grasp OneToughHerring. You are part of a very violent culture.
Sniffle, cry, all you wish. It is the truth, Americans didn't invent violence.
SteamWake
10-12-09, 04:53 PM
Much like the Finns, when it comes to Russia.
Time to get over your sense of moral superiority and get a grasp on reality .
He was just trying to point out a releationship thats all Russia has to do with it.
CastleBravo
10-12-09, 04:59 PM
He was just trying to point out a releationship thats all Russia has to do with it.
Thanks for the support SteamWake, but if OneToughHerring knows so little of his own country's history the entire argument is and will always be lost on him.
Platapus
10-12-09, 05:07 PM
Too bad the parents did not take the time to explain to him about knives and rules. Could have avoided all this mess.
here is another version
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/10/12/MNM21A4B2T.DTL
(10-12) 04:00 PDT Newark, Del. -- Zachary Christie, 6, was so excited about joining the Cub Scouts that he brought a camping utensil that can serve as a knife, fork and spoon to school to use at lunch.
School officials concluded he had violated their zero-tolerance policy on weapons, and Zachary faces 45 days in the district's reform school.
Spurred in part by the Columbine and Virginia Tech shootings, many school districts around the country adopted zero-tolerance policies on possession of weapons on school grounds. More recently, there has been growing debate over whether the policies have gone too far.
But, based on the code of conduct for the Christina School District, where Zachary is a first-grader, school officials had no choice. They had to suspend him because, "regardless of possessor's intent," knives are banned.
Critics contend that zero-tolerance policies like those in the district have led to sharp increases in suspensions and expulsions, often putting children on the streets or in other places where their behavior only worsens, and that the policies undermine the use of common sense by school officials in handling minor infractions.
For Delaware, Zachary's case is especially frustrating because last year state lawmakers tried to make disciplinary rules more flexible by giving local boards authority to, "on a case-by-case basis, modify the terms of the expulsion."
The law was introduced after a third-grade girl was expelled for a year because her grandmother sent a birthday cake to school, and a knife to cut it. The teacher called the principal - but not before using the knife to cut and serve the cake.
Education experts say that zero-tolerance policies initially allowed authorities more leeway in punishing students, but were applied in a discriminatory fashion. Many studies indicate that African-Americans were several times more likely to be suspended or expelled than other students for the same offenses.
Other school districts are also trying to address problems they say have stemmed in part from overly strict zero-tolerance policies.
In Baltimore, around 10,000 students, roughly 12 percent of enrollment, were suspended during the 2006-07 school year, mostly for disruption and insubordination, according to a report by the Open Society Institute-Baltimore. School officials there are re-writing the disciplinary code, to route students to counseling rather than suspension.
In Milwaukee, where school officials reported that 40 percent of ninth-graders had been suspended in the 2006-07 school year, the superintendent has encouraged teachers not to overreact to student misconduct.
This is what happens when parents scream about what are the schools doing to protect kids? Everyone likes no-tolerance rules when they apply to the other kid, but when it is your kid all of a sudden there should be some tolerance.
Perhaps if the schools could be trusted to implement policy with out discrimination, they can be trusted to evaluate these instances on a case-to-case basis. Until then the policies need to be worded such that the school officials have no leeway. This means that the rules need to be worded very carefully so that bad kids don't fall through the cracks and good kids don't get caught up in the net.
I am a little concerned that these parents would allow their 6 year old to go to school with a knife. The knife should have been kept under the parents control while the kid is not doing scouting stuff.
Has the school gone to far? What does the cafeteria use for utensils? Defiantly a case of going to far. Anyone who possessed a Swiss Army Knife when I went to school was proud to show it off.
Counseling in the USA has become a income source for a large batch of companies and they are taking advantage of anything they can. Drug testing would be a good example at work. If you pop on a test you can keep your job but you have to attend a course for so many weeks, doesn't matter if you sober up or not. :nope:
Sniffle, cry, all you wish. It is the truth, Americans didn't invent violence.
Maybe so, but you do a pretty good job on keeping the violence level high on that side of the pond. ;)
CastleBravo
10-12-09, 05:12 PM
I am a little concerned that these parents would allow their 6 year old to go to school with a knife. The knife should have been kept under the parents control while the kid is not doing scouting stuff.
It wasn't a knife. Please read the article. Even if it was. I went to school with a knife on a few occaisions. Nothing happened. Little boys show and tell. Nothing more.
CastleBravo
10-12-09, 05:15 PM
Maybe so, but you do a pretty good job on keeping the violence level high on that side of the pond. ;)
And Finland is free of violence? Please. You will notice that much of the violence is black on black. What does it say about black culture.
And Finland is free of violence? Please. You will notice that much of the violence is black on black. What does it say about black culture.
No no no, now you're doing the old trick again of putting words into my mouth. ;) I didnt say Finland is violence free, hell, I didnt even mention Finland! Yes, I know there is alot of black on black violence, but what it has to do with this? There's also white on black, black on white, white on white (etc.) violence. I just got the impression from your posts that you are somehow trying to make us believe that US isnt particulary violent country from the western bunch?
CastleBravo
10-12-09, 05:31 PM
I just got the impression from your posts that you are somehow trying to make us believe that US isnt particulary violent country from the western bunch?
And you would be correct. The US is as violent as any country. I was trying to disuade OneToughfish from thinking the US is more violent than any Euro country. Because that is incorrect.
OneToughHerring
10-12-09, 05:39 PM
Blame it on the Europeans. 85% of the US population comes from you. And yes we brought our backgrounds with us. I'm sorry if that is hard for you to grasp OneToughHerring. You are part of a very violent culture.
Sniffle, cry, all you wish. It is the truth, Americans didn't invent violence.
The violent crime figures of Finland are well below of those of the US. Same goes for Europe as a whole.
Oh you're also a racist. And SteamWake with his racist spin on the 'cracking a head with a history book' - story might also be one. Groovy.
CastleBravo
10-12-09, 06:11 PM
The violent crime figures of Finland are well below of those of the US. Same goes for Europe as a whole.
Oh you're also a racist. And SteamWake with his racist spin on the 'cracking a head with a history book' - story might also be one. Groovy.
The last refuge of the tyrannt......you're a racist. And if you check the crime numbers for the US it is in majority black on black. Facts don't lie bud. I will allow you your interpretation, because you have no other argument, but it doesn't alieve you of your responsibility to acknowledge Europe's and by extension Finlands tendancy toward violence.
OneToughHerring
10-12-09, 06:22 PM
The last refuge of the tyrannt......you're a racist. And if you check the crime numbers for the US it is in majority black on black. Facts don't lie bud. I will allow you your interpretation, because you have no other argument, but it doesn't alieve you of your responsibility to acknowledge Europe's and by extension Finlands tendancy toward violence.
Yea facts don't lie and the facts say that the US is more violent then Europe. Not even the US right-wing think tanks try to deny this.
Continue on with your racism, it's just kind of funny how you attack against people who you brought to the US as slaves and then put into ghettos. I guess you don't mind the blacks not considered as a part of the US.
CastleBravo
10-12-09, 07:00 PM
Yea facts don't lie and the facts say that the US is more violent then Europe. Not even the US right-wing think tanks try to deny this.
Continue on with your racism, it's just kind of funny how you attack against people who you brought to the US as slaves and then put into ghettos. I guess you don't mind the blacks not considered as a part of the US.
I guess you don't mind the blacks not considered as a part of the US.
Never heard that before. But that shows how misinformed you are. I consider blacks a part of the US, citizens in fact. Like the rest of the folks in the US everyone needs to take responsibility for their actions.
Asd of now more blacks are taking the lives of other blacks at a greater rate than any other demographic. I guess you will call that racist.
But then Fns are racist by calling the US violent.
Now you see how useless the term is when used in the vaccum in which you used it.
MothBalls
10-12-09, 07:26 PM
Now you see how useless the term is when used in the vaccum in which you used it.Good point. He should have never tried to use anything between your ears.
(btw, it's spelled vacuum)
AngusJS
10-12-09, 07:44 PM
There was another instance of a 10 year old girl bringing a steak knife into school to eat her lunch of steak leftovers.
Some teachers saw this, so they confiscated the knife, and then naturally called the cops, who arrived and naturally arrested her for possession of a weapon on school grounds, and naturally charged her with a felony.
Fortunately, sanity eventually prevailed, and the charges were dropped.
http://www.wftv.com/news/14858405/detail.html
All because of @$#% stupid zero tolerance policies enacted by @$#% stupid people. They're a bit like the brilliant three strikes laws, which can sentence someone to life in prison for shoplifting.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leandro_Andrade
And naturally, the Supreme Court refused to overturn the sentence. Way to go, guys.
CastleBravo
10-12-09, 09:45 PM
Good point. He should have never tried to use anything between your ears.
(btw, it's spelled vacuum)
Thank you for the spelling correction. As ususal it shows the lack of argument. Just surrender. Its what your good at. :har::rotfl2::har::rotfl2:
Award yourself a piece prize.
Sledgehammer427
10-12-09, 10:20 PM
if some kid insulted me and my race and sucker punched me, I'd crack him too. It's not racist, it's standing up for myself.
as for the violent crime thing. Freedom does weird things to people. To many it's some kinda drug and they take it too far. Freedom of almost everything does that to people
CastleBravo
10-12-09, 11:48 PM
if some kid insulted me and my race and sucker punched me, I'd crack him too. It's not racist, it's standing up for myself.
as for the violent crime thing. Freedom does weird things to people. To many it's some kinda drug and they take it too far. Freedom of almost everything does that to people
With freedom comes responsibility. Not the kind of freedom we see at the G-#?. That is something else. Freedom is allowing other opinions, beliefs, and ways of life, while standing for certain universal principles, which don't overtly harm others.
Sledgehammer427
10-13-09, 12:24 AM
you got me, I had a brain fart mid-sentence. :O:
Tribesman
10-13-09, 05:21 AM
It wasn't a knife.
When the school says it was a knife , the parents say it was a knife and even Foxnews says it was a knife how can you say that?
I went to school with a knife on a few occaisions. Nothing happened.
Did your school have a zero tolerance policy where suspension was automatic no matter what the circumstances were?
So this story is just an example of the sillyness of zero-tolerance policies which some people seem to favour due to their shewed perception of how much of a threat current crime levels are.
CastleBravo
10-13-09, 05:48 AM
Did your school have a zero tolerance policy where suspension was automatic no matter what the circumstances were?
I don't think so, but I graduated HS in 1979. It was a time when if you got out of line the smack down was comming.
XabbaRus
10-13-09, 06:18 AM
OK keep this on the level, I am watching a couple of people here.
CastleBravo
10-13-09, 06:28 AM
OK keep this on the level, I am watching a couple of people here.
??? This isn't 1979.
Tribesman
10-13-09, 07:02 AM
I don't think so, but I graduated HS in 1979.
Exactly, there was no major difference in real levels of knife crime back then , but the perception would have been different.
There certainly wasn't an idea of zero tolerance policies which are just a popular lazy reaction to knee jerk hysteria.
If you had graduated another 20 years earlier there also wouldn't have been a major difference in real levels of knife crime and it would be considered perfectly normal or even expected for a young boy to carry a knife.
XabbaRus
10-13-09, 07:33 AM
??? This isn't 1979.
I'm not sure what you are meaning but this thread did start to get a little heated....
Glad to see it is staying reasonable.
AVGWarhawk
10-13-09, 08:52 AM
Maybe so, but you do a pretty good job on keeping the violence level high on that side of the pond. ;)
Strictly for your entertainment only. :03:
Strictly for your entertainment only. :03:
I am extremely happy to see that US is taking our future world domination plans seriously and are trying to please us whenever possible. :yeah:
They're a bit like the brilliant three strikes laws, which can sentence someone to life in prison for shoplifting.
No they aren't at all alike. In the first instance we're talking about a child who, like the Scout in the op, may not have had any violent intentions at all compared to a criminal who made three conscious decisions to commit a crime.
IMO, the former ought to be given some latitude, the latter none at all.
AVGWarhawk
10-13-09, 11:39 AM
I am extremely happy to see that US is taking our future world domination plans seriously and are trying to please us whenever possible. :yeah:
We AIM to please...that is our motto. :D
OneToughHerring
10-13-09, 03:24 PM
I guess you don't mind the blacks not considered as a part of the US.
Never heard that before. But that shows how misinformed you are. I consider blacks a part of the US, citizens in fact. Like the rest of the folks in the US everyone needs to take responsibility for their actions.
Asd of now more blacks are taking the lives of other blacks at a greater rate than any other demographic. I guess you will call that racist.
But then Fns are racist by calling the US violent.
Now you see how useless the term is when used in the vaccum in which you used it.
How should the blacks be responsible for being brought over as slaves and then having been placed in ghettos and segregated from the society etc.? Don't the whites have any responsibility over any of this?
I call poor living standards in the ghetto poor living standards in the ghetto.
Criticising nations is not the same thing as criticising ethnic groups.
Finns have never had any slaves and we haven't pursued a segregationist policy regarding our minorities.
SteamWake
10-13-09, 03:40 PM
We AIM to please...that is our motto. :D
LOL theres a local bar that has a sign in the mens room over the urinals.
"We aim to please, You aim too please" :haha:
Tribesman
10-13-09, 04:39 PM
Finns have never had any slaves
:har::har::har::har::har::har:
Its sort of true if you stretch it, Finns have never had any slaves since the time the Swedes abolished slavery...unless of course they had slaves elsewhere.
SteamWake
10-13-09, 05:09 PM
How in the heck did this become a discussion on race and slavery :doh:
OneToughHerring
10-13-09, 05:16 PM
:har::har::har::har::har::har:
Its sort of true if you stretch it, Finns have never had any slaves since the time the Swedes abolished slavery...unless of course they had slaves elsewhere.
Sorry but you're not making any sense.
How should the blacks be responsible for being brought over as slaves and then having been placed in ghettos and segregated from the society etc.? Don't the whites have any responsibility over any of this?
You're white. How much responsibility do you bear for this?
As for slavery in Finland, OTH is quite right in that there have not been any widespread/general slavery here (I'm pretty sure that was the case when we were under Swedish/Russian rule aswell). Which is propably why Finland doesnt have any laws specifially dealing with slavery. :hmmm:
You're white. How much responsibility do you bear for this?
I'm pretty sure he was referring to the white population in the US (surely you knew that before posting? :O:).
Tribesman
10-13-09, 07:50 PM
I'm pretty sure he was referring to the white population in the US
What about if it was a white American who had emigrated from Finland?
How about a native American whose ancestors kept slaves?
Maybe a fella from Mauritania living in the US but still having slaves back home.
It does imply that Herrings white American guilt idea is bollox.
As for slavery in Finland, OTH is quite right in that there have not been any widespread/general slavery here (I'm pretty sure that was the case when we were under Swedish/Russian rule aswell).
Finland had slavery abolished by the Swedes in the 14th C.
Then later when Russia took over they didn't extend the policy of serfdom into the dutchy
SS107.9MHz
10-13-09, 07:59 PM
Whatta ... Is this a boyscouttbringssporktoclass/Americansareracist&violent Thread?!!! ...Oh wait, it's the typical Subsim thread warp in action!:ping:
1. None of this would've happened if common sense would prevail.
2. The US has some spectacular FAIL!!! zero tolerance policies (remember that guy who was arrested in the plane because his shirt had a pic of Optimus prime holding a fusion canon?! LOL), that some people take quite literally and cause these kind of dumbass situations...
3. Start treating Kids As Kids and maybe you don't have to deal with wackedout gun totting Charles Manson Wannabees when they grow up in their teens...
AVGWarhawk
10-14-09, 08:27 AM
Just put'em all on Prozac! Medication is the only way. :doh:
Looks like the Kid is off the hook
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/10/14/MN951A58KE.DTL&type=education
SteamWake
10-14-09, 09:56 AM
Good now that that has been resolved.
Looks like old school discipline can land you in jail !
Mom Arrested for Washing Kid's Mouth With Soap
A Florida couple is behind bars for some old school discipline
http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local-beat/Mom-Arrested-for-Washing-Kids-Mouth-With-Soap--64112132.html
AVGWarhawk
10-14-09, 10:00 AM
Good now that that has been resolved.
Looks like old school discipline can land you in jail !
http://www.nbcmiami.com/news/local-beat/Mom-Arrested-for-Washing-Kids-Mouth-With-Soap--64112132.html
Some people do have allergic reactions to soap in the mouth. I got the old soup in the mouth once. I called my sister a b1tch will my mom was standing there. Dial soap does not taste good. :oops:
AVGWarhawk
10-14-09, 10:04 AM
Looks like the Kid is off the hook
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?f=/c/a/2009/10/14/MN951A58KE.DTL&type=education
I think he realizes at this point what he did. No need for 45 days of probably getting his butt kicked.
SteamWake
10-14-09, 12:35 PM
Loosly releated
Assault with a deadly Burrito... yup you read that right !
OCTOBER 14--A South Carolina teenager is facing a felony charge for throwing a "deadly missile" at a moving vehicle. The armament in question was a burrito.
http://www.thesmokinggun.com/archive/years/2009/1014092burrito1.html
If it was Taco Bell the charges just might be justified :rotfl2:
Some people do have allergic reactions to soap in the mouth. I got the old soup in the mouth once. I called my sister a b1tch will my mom was standing there. Dial soap does not taste good. :oops:
That particular report doesn't mention it but I was reading another that said the parents made the kid eat half the bar and wouldn't take her to the hospital until she had cleaned up her own vomit.
AVGWarhawk
10-14-09, 02:10 PM
That particular report doesn't mention it but I was reading another that said the parents made the kid eat half the bar and wouldn't take her to the hospital until she had cleaned up her own vomit.
If that is the case the yes, what they did was over the edge and abusive.
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