Star Shells

[longam]

Brining my boat into port and trying to find my dock was the first experience I had with star shells. I realize it wasn't what they were intened to be used for, but there was no dock area image on the map at that time in SH3, so I would launch a few shells to light up the area.

I can only hope they have this in SH5.

[Letum]

It would not add to realism at all.
No u-boat carried Star-shells, or AP shells for that matter.

[longam]

I edited my original post so the word 'realism' no longer exist.

Now back o how cool they were.

[Webster]

It would not add to realism at all.
No u-boat carried Star-shells, or AP shells for that matter.

are you sure? i thought AP shells were SOP for finishing off merchants?

[Syxx_Killer]

It would not add to realism at all.
No u-boat carried Star-shells, or AP shells for that matter.

I'm currently reading The U-Boat Wars by Edwin P. Hoyt and according to his book they did. If anyone else has the book they can see, too. It is near the beginning of chapter 12 (titled The Convoy Trade). I just read this today. This is a paragraph from the book (referring to an attack on convoy HX72):

At about 10:30 P.M. one of the submarines from Doenitz's wolf pack fired off a star shell over the starboard side of the convoy. At the same time Knapp saw a ship hoist the red light ["have been torpedoed"]. Again no explosions were seen and nothing was heard. The Lowestoft was on the port side of the convoy, and Commander Knapp tried to find out what was going on. He signaled the commodore but got no reply. He swung out and around and finally saw the torpedoed ship near the center of the convoy.

[iambecomelife]

I'd appreciate having at least some signal flares b/c the star shells are quite useful - even if they aren't historically accurate.

[Letum]

I'm currently reading The U-Boat Wars...


Yes, starrshells where made, a few where deployed and a few where even used.
I should not have said "No u-boat carried Star-shells".
The GWX 3 crew looked into the matter in detail and chose to disable star shells based on their extreme rarity.

[Sailor Steve]

are you sure? i thought AP shells were SOP for finishing off merchants?
AP is Armor Piercing. No merchant carried armor, and no destroyer for that matter. Light cruisers were the smallest armored warships, and if you want to duke it out with six 6" guns guided by a dedicated fire-control system, by my guest.

That said, I was one of the chief proponents for no AP or SS aboard, and in turned out that I was wrong. Some did, apparently at the captain's discretion. But also it seems not many.

[SteamWake]

Star Shells are fun ! Admit it ! :D Like fireworks.

I remember popping them off to watch ships sink ;)

Wether or not 'historically correct' I would like to see them.

Make it a toggelable option to have them or not, along with AP rounds for the blow em up crowd. Maybe a couple of 'bonus reality points' for not carrying them. Part of a realisim setting.

I would have no problems with that.

[JU_88]

I never uderstood the star shells thing, but i never researched it either,

To me - it makes sense that star shells would be bad juju for Uboats that primarily need to remain undetected...
Then again, In WW2 the British equipped there own Submarines with ASDIC :06:, (unsuprisingly, their crews never really used it)

So anything's possible I guess.

[Webster]

in sh3 i even sunk a few destroyers with them which surprised me, i guess they worked like AP shells

the star shells can be helpfull if you need to see to finish off a merchant but they have no realistic use for them on a sub and the shell space is needed for real shells

[Sailor Steve]

...along with AP rounds for the blow em up crowd.
AP should cause less damage than HE, as they carried less powder in favor of the very heavy armor piercing cap. Also, AP should have a fair chance of going right through a merchant without going off at all.

On the other hand what we're calling AP was actually a semi-armor piercing shell with an in-between amount of powder and a lighter steel cap. Real AP wasn't even made for guns smaller than 6".

[SteamWake]

Im just sayin star shells are 'cool' and would like to see an option to put a few on board :yeah:

[Subnuts]

Then again, In WW2 the British equipped there own Submarines with ASDIC :06:, (unsuprisingly, their crews never really used it)



"ASDIC" was just a catch-all term used by the British for what we now call SONAR.

[Sailor Steve]

Im just sayin star shells are 'cool' and would like to see an option to put a few on board :yeah:
You just said the magic word!

OPTIONS! OPTIONS! OPTIONS!

There should be options for everything the captain might do.

[Jimbuna]

Yes, starrshells where made, a few where deployed and a few where even used.
I should not have said "No u-boat carried Star-shells".
The GWX 3 crew looked into the matter in detail and chose to disable star shells based on their extreme rarity.

Yeah....they were extremely rare. It was never in a U-boats best interest to risk giving away its approximate location whilst surfaced.

[Takeda Shingen]

Yeah....they were extremely rare. It was never in a U-boats best interest to risk giving away its approximate location whilst surfaced.

Agreed. Stealth is a thing specific to submarine operations. Using star shells in the SH series is akin to using the RADAR mast in 688(i)/SC/DW. It advertises 'here I am' to the local vicinity.

[JScones]

You just said the magic word!

OPTIONS! OPTIONS! OPTIONS!

There should be options for everything the captain might do.
There's a lot of truth in that. It's easy to make blanket statements such as "Kaleuns never carried star shells", but the fact is, they could, if the Kaleun wanted to.

Let the player choose his complete loadout, ala many Flight Sims, then such arguments can disappear.

Same with the deck gun. It should be Kaleun's discretion whether he keeps it or removes it, whenever he wants.

[FIREWALL]

Easy spam :haha:

[Letum]

There's a lot of truth in that. It's easy to make blanket statements such as "Kaleuns never carried star shells", but the fact is, they could, if the Kaleun wanted to.

Let the player choose his complete loadout, ala many Flight Sims, then such arguments can disappear.

Same with the deck gun. It should be Kaleun's discretion whether he keeps it or removes it, whenever he wants.


It should be the Kaleun's decision if it was the Klauen's decision.

Certinaly in the case of deck guns, I doubt any Kaleun's would have the
leverage to order a deckgun if his boat didn't come with one because BdU
had decided not to give him one.

[JScones]

That's why I specifically said keep or remove it--as many Kaleuns did when it became obvious it was no longer practical--not obtain it. ;)

[Letum]

I have no idea if it is, but it could be the case that Kaleuns where ordered
to remove deckguns or didn't have the authority to remove them by choice.

[Jimbuna]

Simply surface near an escort and I'm sure they'd be happy to remove it for you :DL

[Captain Vlad]

I'm big on allowing what could possibly be done, rather than what could 'realistically' be done...cuz 'realistically' is based on what people actually did rather than what they very easily could've. I want loads of options available to me, and it be my job to determine how to utilize them.

Hence...star shells, AP, removing the deck gun, etc, should be allowable.

[ridgewayranger]

Hi Everyone,
Asdic was the name used for all Sonar equipment. In s/ms this consisted of passive hydrophones above and below the hull and the ability to transmit using a manual key. It could be used to 'talk' to other s/ms and surface ships by ultrasonic telegraphy using morse code. I have personally used it to find the entrance to Portland harbour in heavy fog. Pinging along the wall until the gap was found. It was quite useful for detecting mines, using a very short ping. It was certainly not used to advertise ones presence when attacking ships.
RR

[Sailor Steve]

I have no idea if it is, but it could be the case that Kaleuns where ordered
to remove deckguns or didn't have the authority to remove them by choice.
Sounds like we're back to Renown again. It's time for the deck gun to go - you want to keep it, it's going to cost you some pull.:sunny:

[longam]

I dont want to go grocery shopping or make sure there is enough TP on board before I sail, but complete weapons loadout selection would be perfect in my book.

[Webster]

Sounds like we're back to Renown again. It's time for the deck gun to go - you want to keep it, it's going to cost you some pull.:sunny:

i think the deck gun could be made an upgrade item and default is no gun but i do not want to not have the option to have it.

as long as its up to me, my sub will always have a deck gun.


i feel it can have real value when used properly since torpedos are much more costly than gun shells so whenever curcumstances allowed the deck gun can save you a few torpedos and i heard a rumor we might be able to destroy land objects in sh5 so there might be gun related missions

[Arclight]

How much drag would a DG generate when submerged? Maybe removing it could have the benefit of a little more underwater speed, or perhaps little longer batterie life because less power is needed to maintain a specific speed. :hmmm: