A noob's thread...

[www2]

OK first off all I want to mention that I am completely new to this type of simulation and have very little or now knowlege about sub's.

I will use this thread in the next couple of days to ask a lot of questions. I know most of you are going to tell me to look here or read this book, but my questions are going to be simple and straight forward, so please bare with me.....oh and dont laugh if some questions are, well just plain stupid.

1. Why is the torpedo trajectory so weird? I mean I always thought that it goes in straight line, only to see now that it goes straight just for a couple of meters and than takes a sharp turn.

I have figured out that I can set my torpedo to deviate a couple of degrees to the right or left, but why would I want to do that?


...thats it for now.

[Bosje]

because your target is not directly in front of you

welcome aboard :arrgh!:

yeah you will be told to read up on the many many helpful guides you can find here. of course the best way to learn is to play the game for a couple hours, if you're completely new to subsimming you prolly won't understand what's being talked about in some guides... i dunno

[www2]

Ok but about when my target is lets say sitting in a spot and I am directly at 90 degres to him......will the torpedo trajectory (in the attack map) still be in the curve or will it be straight.....

....oh and I did get my first two kills in the first carrer mission.

[ETR3(SS)]

Hitting a ship with torpedoes is a lot like shooting at a moving target. If the target ship is stopped and directly in front of you, your torpedoes will run straight to it. If the target ship is moving then the Torpedo Data Computer will calculate an impact point for the torpedo based on the range to target, target speed, target course, and torpedo speed.

[www2]

OK...getting the hang of it now. So it's something like 1940's homing missile, but doesnt follow heat, but rather relies on pure math.

2. How come I cant turn on my freeking radar. I click the ON/OFF switch but nothing happens?

[gimpy117]

exactly...pure math!! :up:

I got a C- in pre-calc

this is why i keep auto target on.

besides in real life i'd make my XO do it...I hate math!

[Roatest]

I'm recently back to the game and just got the u-boat addon, I'll ask here instead of starting another thread: Is there any mod that activates the new strategic commands thingy in the american campaign? I've been googling with no luck.

[mookiemookie]

OK...getting the hang of it now. So it's something like 1940's homing missile, but doesnt follow heat, but rather relies on pure math. Exactly

2. How come I cant turn on my freeking radar. I click the ON/OFF switch but nothing happens?

What year is it? Do you have radar installed? When you go to the bridge and look up at the radar equipment, is it turning?

[www2]

OK....so only to find that darn auto target thingy......I dont see it in the game play options where the realism set up is.......

...and what does the auto target do? I mean does it mean that I will never miss my target?

What about the radar problem I am having?

[Bosje]

OK...getting the hang of it now. So it's something like 1940's homing missile, but doesnt follow heat, but rather relies on pure math.


basically, yes :)
the torpedo shoots out of the boat straight ahead at first and then after a little while it turns according to the programmed course (so that it meets the ship at the same spot at the same time) if the ship is stationary and right in front of you, the torpedo won't need to turn at all.
the trick is to shoot at moving targets so that the torpedo goes as straight as possible, so you shoot before the target crosses your bow (I hope that was clear)

[www2]

Exactly



What year is it? Do you have radar installed? When you go to the bridge and look up at the radar equipment, is it turning?



Well its 1941, and I can go in the radar room, but no the radar is not turning, its off, but there is ON/OFF switch near the radar.


oh, and again:

Where can I find that auto target option......I dont see it in the game play options where the realism set up is.......

[Bosje]

auto target is active as long as you have the 'manual targeting' turned off

if you see yellow triangles underneath ships as you watch them through the periscope, you know it works. what it does is calculate the torpedo track for you (the turn which the torpedo makes after being fired)
it's not a guarantee for hits though. there are plenty reasons for torpedoes to miss or malfunction (or even do a full circle to hit you in the behind)
war is hell

SD radar (air) is always active, you have no control
SJ radar (surface) can be controlled by you but it has to be available and installed on your boat. check the systems/weaponry screen to see if it's there.

and play around for a while, you'll come to grips easier

[ETR3(SS)]

You probably don't have radar installed yet. The consoles are always there even though you might not have it onboard.

[kylesplanet]

If it is 1941 you don't have surface radar. It doesn't become available until June of 42 I believe. I you recieve a radar contact, it is an aircraft. Your SD radar is always on and you always have it.

[Sailor Steve]

WELCOME ABOARD!:sunny:

...and what does the auto target do? I mean does it mean that I will never miss my target?
No. In real life they had to make the torpedo not go straight at the target, but at where the target would be when the torpedo got there. This meant doing a lot of advanced math and then setting the gyro angles on the torpedo so it would turn to the correct path.

Auto Targeting means that the game does the math for you. You can still miss sometimes, just like they really did.

[www2]

Rgr....thank you guys....well this has to be one of the most noob friendly forums I have ever been to.

[Bosje]

it is, yes :)

[Armistead]

Check out the sticky's at the top..Skippers bag of tricks. You may not be ready for manual targeting yet, but Robins video's are great explaining things. Obvious as you learn to track, setup, determine speed and range, ect....you'll want to move onto manual targeting.

What version are you playing..1.4 or 1.5. You can play stock awhile, but the mods make the game so much better. Plane traffic is maddening in stock and some mods take care of that. GFO may be a good mod to start with.

This game can be as simple or complex as you want to make it....that's what's good about it....

Welcome aboard.

[Akula4745]

Rgr....thank you guys....well this has to be one of the most noob friendly forums I have ever been to.

Exactly the same reason I fell in love with it... lots of good hearted folks with some great advice to make your simming more enjoyable!

Welcome to Sub-Sim, www2!

[I'm goin' down]

For starters, either use auto targeting, or the Dick O'Kane attack method if you are trying manual targeting. Sinking a ship or two will keep your morale up. But there is a LOT to learn.

The Dick O'Kane attack method has a lot of steps, but the theory is not difficult to learn. It is basic manual attack (i.e. a 90 degree attack angle) theory. I refer you to Rockin Robbins' sticky for a tutorial, etc. Also, typical issues such as how to read the naigation map, how to ditch destroyers, how to stay undetected, how deep to set torpedoes, etc, are always on the table. It is quite complicated at first, but you tackle the issues one at a time. Then there are mods, which is an entirely new ball game (i.e. you may want a better guns, fewer planes, a custom sub with a custom emblem, updated uniforms, or war time radio stations on the radio).

If you want to get a feel for manual targeting and understanding aspect ratio, download, print and study Manual Targeting at 100 Percent Realism by Hitman. In short, Hitman teaches you to calibrate speed, AoB, and distance for an attack when playing with auto targeting turned off/manual targeting enabled. It will give you a good foundation for manual targeting and you will understand later how such mods as SCAF and the recent Easy AoB mod will make a captain' life easier. You can keep the manual at your desk as you work through an attack, and will learn how to view the attack map to see the torpedo's projected run angle and whether it will intercept the target. At some point you will gain confidence to attack multiple targets in a single attack run (I have gotten three but never four targets, but that was after months of playing).

Hint when you play a career, you have to reset all of the game settings when you are in the captains room before your first mission. If you do not reset it, then you cannot reset it later. Once reset, the settings endure throughout the career and until it is over or your boat is sunk. Also, the boat are different, so you might want to check here to see what boat is recommended for a new skipper.

There are a lot of experienced people on this site, many great modders, and a few who are in the genius category, as they understand all or a portion of submarine warfare concepts, tactics, submarine history during WW2, computer programming, graphics and animation, and have the abilty to incorporate it into the game. With their help SH4 is far superior to the stock game.

On behalf of the Barbarinna and its two mascots, Welcome aboard skipper.:salute: Anchors away.....

[Armistead]

I can change my settings anytime I'm back at port...Usually I'll cut cams and contacts on every other patrol...

[Rockin Robbins]

I always recommend that you stick with auto-targeting until you get to the point that boat handling is an unconscious act. You should be able to select torpedoes, set depth and pistol, dive your sub to a predetermined depth, raise the scope, look around, rendezvous with an enemy convoy to exchange pleasantries, work the ice cream machine, spit from the bridge to the water without striking the side of the conning tower or the deck, etc.

The game is plenty challenging with auto targeting. When you're comfortable or bored, then it's time to open the game up to its true splendor!:D

So don't rush it. Enjoy the process of proficiency: gaining the vast array of skills required to become an excellent submarine commander.

[www2]

Well than...thanks once again.

Now for my first "profesional" kill.

My second carrer mision. I am send to recon an area north of my base (cant remember the island now), so I sailed (is the the right term with the sub) east of Borneo, and my sonar guy tells me there is a merchant close by.

I get to periscope depht and try to use the things I saw on the sticky threads. Lined my self at 90 ° (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v55/lwwwl/?action=view&current=sh42009-08-3120-42-10-88.jpg) (is this good setup) to the ship and fired two torps.

Now for the questions:

1. This ship was qlasified as an Large Old Split Freeighter. Now I get to the ship list to see how this baby really looks like, and to determine how deep should I set my torpedo. The ship with that name is nowhere to be found in the Japan's ship list.

Now I couldnt get a good look at it seeing it was pitch black, so I just set the depht to 4 meters. I got both torps to hit the ship but it didnt go down.

My question: Are the names in the ship list different to the ones I get on the map? If so is there a list somewhere here of the ships in game, but that uses the names you get on the map?

2. Is it normal for that kind of ship to survive two torpedos? I had to chase him with my sonar (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v55/lwwwl/?action=view&current=sh42009-08-3121-00-04-64.jpg) for 10-15 minutes to set up again in 90° position, and fired two more, till he finnaly went down. Now I am not sure, but I think that he would go down with only one more (the third one), but I wanted to make sure so I fired the fourth aswell. :)

3. Now this is one that really bugs me. When I get my attack periscope (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v55/lwwwl/?action=view&current=sh42009-08-3120-42-03-61.jpg) up and spot a ship. Does that periscope acts like a croshair in FPS games? I mean do I have to follow the ship with it and click on the section of the ship I want to hit? If so, how do I do that? I mean, while I click on a boat the very next second he is already 10 meters out of my periscope view.

I ask this coz I saw in some of those tutorial videos, that a guy was saying something like "I allways hit the ship in the engine room, not like most guys who go for the propeler....." Now, for now I am more than happy to get any kind of hit, but am just wandering.

....oh and I almost forgot..... CLICK (http://smg.photobucket.com/albums/v55/lwwwl/?action=view&current=sh42009-08-3121-14-04-56.jpg) :rock:

[www2]

Check out the sticky's at the top..Skippers bag of tricks. You may not be ready for manual targeting yet, but Robins video's are great explaining things. Obvious as you learn to track, setup, determine speed and range, ect....you'll want to move onto manual targeting.

What version are you playing..1.4 or 1.5. You can play stock awhile, but the mods make the game so much better. Plane traffic is maddening in stock and some mods take care of that. GFO may be a good mod to start with.

This game can be as simple or complex as you want to make it....that's what's good about it....

Welcome aboard.


I am playing 1.4

[magic452]

The ships you had is listed in the book, you may have been looking in the wrong book.

When you bring up the recognition manual it says Japan, this is for warships only. Click the arrow to the right and it should say Merchants. Open that and you will find your ship. A large old split is a big ship and often will take three hits to sink unless you hit the right parts.

With auto targeting you can lock on the target with the L key and the periscope will fallow the target. You will lock on the center and you can use the gyro angle offset to hit different parts of the target. That is why you can deviate the trop. track a couple of degrees. If you don't lock than fallow the target with the scope and you should hit what you are looking at when you fire the trop. Like a cross hair.

All this is assuming the target stays at the same speed and course.
Auto targeting works good for a constant speed and course but if the target is maneuvering it's not so hot. That is when you will need to lead the target with the gyro angle offset wheel.

By the way nice shooting, stay with it you will get good at it very soon.

Hope this helps
Magic

[www2]

The ships you had is listed in the book, you may have been looking in the wrong book.

When you bring up the recognition manual it says Japan, this is for warships only. Click the arrow to the right and it should say Merchants. Open that and you will find your ship. A large old split is a big ship and often will take three hits to sink unless you hit the right parts.

With auto targeting you can lock on the target with the L key and the periscope will fallow the target. You will lock on the center and you can use the gyro angle offset to hit different parts of the target. That is why you can deviate the trop. track a couple of degrees. If you don't lock than fallow the target with the scope and you should hit what you are looking at when you fire the trop. Like a cross hair.

All this is assuming the target stays at the same speed and course.
Auto targeting works good for a constant speed and course but if the target is maneuvering it's not so hot. That is when you will need to lead the target with the gyro angle offset wheel.

By the way nice shooting, stay with it you will get good at it very soon.

Hope this helps
Magic


Well than...this was not only helpful but kind of crucial information about the game.

Just one more thing.


So lets say I find the boat in the recognition manual and it says his draft is 10 m. I saw somewhere here that I should set the torpedo depth to half that value, in this case 5 meters.

Is this correct?

[ETR3(SS)]

This is were it gets both technical and personal. The object obviously is to sink ships. Ships sink by taking on more water than buoyancy can support. To accomplish this you can try for a few different methods.

1. The keel shot
Set your torpedoes to run just under the targets keel. With luck you can "break her back" and she sinks like a rock.

2. I giant hole in the side of the ship.
This method would have you setting your run depth to about half of keel depth so as to impact the hull and cause compartment flooding. The target will begin flooding and if it floods enough capsize and/or sink.

You will probably be better off with the second method mentioned until you become experienced enough to know how your torpedoes behave (i.e. gyro problems, depth keeping issues, duds, etc).

[I'm goin' down]

Frst of all, update to SH4 version 1.5 (the Uboat missions). It costs about $10. You can download it. Mods have been revised for 1.5 and you will have a big selection.

At the beginning of WW2 torpedoes ran deep and many were duds. Set them to run several meters above the target's designated depth. For destroyers that have a shallow depth, you may not be able to hit them because you will not be able to set the run depth shallow enough if a torpedo runs deeper than it was set to run.

I agree with RR. Master auto targeting. It is good first step. When you can whack enemy ships regularly, it is time to move to manual targeting. Get to the point where you can hit 5/6 or 6/6 shots when you auto target are trying to sink more than one ship. If you can, watch the distance data on the TDC (torpedo data computer) when you fire torpedoes to get an idea of distance in an attack scenario.


Manual targeting is a new ball game, but you should be ready for it after learning how to intercept, set up for an attack, etc. Remember, convoys are another problem as they are accompanied by destroyers. If you do not use stealth to plan a convoy attack their is a good chance that your boat will be attacked. Even if you sink one, the destroyers may find you.

Learn to serch the threads for answers to many questions, as the information is here.

Right now settle for hitting the target. Hitting specific parts required adjusting the torpedo angle or setting a torpedo spread. I do not bother with it most of the time.

[Scurvy]

With auto targeting you can lock on the target with the L key and the periscope will fallow the target. You will lock on the center and you can use the gyro angle offset to hit different parts of the target. That is why you can deviate the trop. track a couple of degrees. If you don't lock than fallow the target with the scope and you should hit what you are looking at when you fire the trop. Like a cross hair.Magic

Just to clarify with this technique, do you need to keep the periscope on the target until the torpedo hits it? Like with a TOW missile?

Or, is it a "fire and forget" scenario, where the torpedo will swim at the section of the target it's aiming at, after it's launched, and you can then move the periscope to another ship?

Learning something new, every day. Thanks!

[donut]

Just to clarify with this technique, do you need to keep the periscope on the target until the torpedo hits it? Like with a TOW missile?>No

Or, is it a "fire and forget" scenario,Open tube door "Q",before you fire, when you hear "torp in water", unlock, & go to next closest target. Helps if target is helming broadside under 1,000Yds., when you fire. where the torpedo will swim at the section of the target it's aiming at, after it's launched, and you can then move the periscope to another ship?

Learning something new, every day. Thanks!If you are firing a 2 speed fish, set to fast at under 4,000 Yds range.

[I'm goin' down]

ww2, how about a status report? Macarthur is looking for more captains and might need you to join the fleet in Brisbane. Lot's of cute shiela's down there and they love Yanks.:smug:

[Scurvy]

Thank you for clarifying that for me, donut.

:salute: