This time I'll wait......

[TDK1044]

I'm happy to see that SH5 has finally been officially announced. Now the game begins once again. Demands, frustration, anger, joy etc.

For me, having gone through the fiasco of SH3 and SH4 being released as unfinished games and then having to be heavily patched during the first year after release, has changed my mind about purchasing the game.

This time I've decided to wait at least 9 months, probably a year after release, before purchasing SH5.

Buying a game and immediately patching it...then waiting for and adding mods....then uninstalling those mods and adding patch 2....then waiting for and adding the newly compatible mods....then uninstalling those mods and installing patch 3...then adding newly compatible mods.....it all gets so old.

So I'll follow the journey of SH5 as an interested onlooker. Once patch 1.4 is released, I'll buy the game at some bargain basement bin and patch and mod it.

I'm too old now for Ubisoft's nonsense. :)

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Wise words from the miserable old fart ;):haha:

But yeah, I know what you mean, but I'll likely be getting it sooner. As soon as I can afford more hamsters to run my computer.

[u-168]

i will go on ebay looking for cheap ones ppl who cannot run it then get one and just wait to save my money read the box then get a g-card i think.

U-168

[TDK1044]

Wise words from the miserable old fart ;):haha:

But yeah, I know what you mean, but I'll likely be getting it sooner. As soon as I can afford more hamsters to run my computer.


I just can't go through all that nonsense again, Kapitan. I know that Dan and his team will have worked their asses off on the new game, and I also know that they will have had a totally under funded production schedule to get the game built.

It will be the same old story. Either reward Ubisoft's poor customer service ethic and support the Silent Hunter franchise by paying $49 for the unfinished game at release, or pay $10 for a completed game patched to 1.4 nine months later.

With SH3 and SH4 I went for choice 1 and supported the franchise, but this time I'm going with choice 2. I have better things to do with my time than constantly patching an unfinished game that I paid $49 for.

If that makes me a miserable old fart then I guess I'm guilty as charged. :)

[Nexus7]

I'm happy to see that SH5 has finally been officially announced. Now the game begins once again. Demands, frustration, anger, joy etc.

For me, having gone through the fiasco of SH3 and SH4 being released as unfinished games and then having to be heavily patched during the first year after release, has changed my mind about purchasing the game.

This time I've decided to wait at least 9 months, probably a year after release, before purchasing SH5.

Buying a game and immediately patching it...then waiting for and adding mods....then uninstalling those mods and adding patch 2....then waiting for and adding the newly compatible mods....then uninstalling those mods and installing patch 3...then adding newly compatible mods.....it all gets so old.

So I'll follow the journey of SH5 as an interested onlooker. Once patch 1.4 is released, I'll buy the game at some bargain basement bin and patch and mod it.

I'm too old now for Ubisoft's nonsense. :)

Good posting :up:

I experienced the same farce with Dangerous Waters.
Very high expectations but
- first release very bugged
-> everyone angry waiting for the first patch that seems to never arrive
-> play a little
-> MOD's frenzy starts
-> new bugs
-> new patch (new wait)
-> new bugs
-> producer withdraws from project leaving the game unfinisched and me with 70$ less in my pocket AAAAAARGHHHHHHHH!!!! :shifty:

[ccruner13]

ditto. went through it too many times and too recently in E:TW to go through the frustration again. maybe im just finally learning? heh i do want it tho....

[BellJack95]

I too have felt the same frustration and while the trailer caught my attention I will be patient and see what else is revealed in the coming months on the game. As for purchase, I will buy the game but I do not think I will rush out and get it until after the first couple of patches - as Ubisoft has a past track record of releasing the game too soon and then the devs have to patch it quickly.

I also have to look at my PC. It is 3 years old and I have been upgrading parts of it to keep it somewhat current but it would depend on the specs for this game as to when I buy. If I need to upgrade again to run the game then I would need to do that first and then save up to buy the game (which might buy me time to get a more stable game :))

[ETR3(SS)]

Well someones got to bite the bullet somewhere. If we the sub simmers dont buy the game (anticipating the same ol' same ol'), then Ubi will think the game is either:

A. fine as it is and will reassign dev's (due to lack of feedback) or
B. the sub sim genre has died out and the SH franchise is no longer a cash cow.

Now if we all buy the game Ubi will think that:

A. the game must be good because it's selling well and will reassign dev's or
B. they might actually learn and keep the dev team together for a couple of months while the bugs come in.

Now personally I have no choice but to wait to get it as I have to upgrade my system. A P4 and 6800GT don't cut it anymore.

[Rockin Robbins]

Hooray for TDK! I'll take door #2 as well. We have all sorts of questions to answer before game purchase is in order for me:


What is the copy protection scheme? Is it a "service" which runs 24 hours a day sucking resources from my computer? Is it something that will use me as a pawn to carry on a personal grudge against another programmer who just happened to catch them in a previous criminal act? Will it interfere with the operation of unrelated aspects of my computer? I won't accept unreasonable copy protection.



What are the equipment requirements? I don't mean "what does the box say." I mean what does it really need. Others can be the pioneers and collect the arrows this time.



Wolfpacks? No wolfpacks, no sale. SH5 without wolfpacks will be as realistic as SH4 without water.



I'm looking for meaningful improvements in gameplay. Sub walkthroughs with natural looking crewmember movements and "interactive" speech don't count. They're eyecandy and earcandy. As such they're nice, but are meaningless to gameplay. I want gameplay first, candy second.



The trailer's emphasis on surprise attack by forces that should have been easily detected before, with a captain who is touring his boat when he should have been attending to his responsibilities on the surface, plus the absurd artwork depicting the sub surfaced within a hundred meters of exploding merchies and attacking escorts make me wonder about the overall design philosophy of the game. Do we have an arcade game here? Does Ubi understand the buyer of a simulation? Or are they selling to FPS fans only now?



And of course I want to know how it plays. It's not like I'm not having fun with SH4 and have SH3 as well. Many think SH3 is even more fun than SH4. I'm perfectly happy with the status quo and would consider buying a proven, realistic, smooth-running Silent Hunter 5 in several months.

[Sonarman]

What is the copy protection scheme? Is it a "service" which runs 24 hours a day sucking resources from my computer? Is it something that will use me as a pawn to carry on a personal grudge against another programmer who just happened to catch them in a previous criminal act? Will it interfere with the operation of unrelated aspects of my computer? I won't accept unreasonable copy protection.


That one seems to be giving Ubisoft some sleepless nights at the moment. Looks like they are working on a new tool (http://www.incgamers.com/News/17655/ubisoft-outlines-thoughts-on-piracy) lets hope it's not too intrusive.
Though I think Eidos may have hit upon the best piracy prevention of all here (http://www.championshipmanager.co.uk/server/show/ConWebDoc.1088) let's hope it works for them as it may signal a new dawn for software retail.

[Rockin Robbins]

I believe the ideal copy protection scheme should encourage people to copy the game with reckless abandon, minimizing distribution costs, while requiring them to pay for registration in order to play the game. Keeping the installation disks from being copied only adds to game company expenses.

A little imagination needs to be applied to the copy protection arena. If Jutland came up with something new, Ubi can.

[AVGWarhawk]

Bugs or not.....I'm buying:D The game is afoot as they say! UBI will deliver a 99.9% completed game! :yeah: Keeping the faith men!

[SteamWake]

LOL ironic thread is ironic.

I'm pretty sure were all going to have to wait...

[Sonarman]

@RockinRobbins
Yes, I like your idea, alternatively make games so cheap no one would bother to pirate them. They diid this in Russia and piracy rates dropped by 78%.

[TDK1044]

Bugs or not.....I'm buying:D The game is afoot as they say! UBI will deliver a 99.9% completed game! :yeah: Keeping the faith men!

I genuinely admire your loyalty and your optimism, AVG, but what makes you think they'll deliver SH5 in a 99.9% state when neither SH3 or SH4 were anywhere near that?

The game is certainly afoot though. May cool heads prevail. :)

[tater]

@RockinRobbins
Yes, I like your idea, alternatively make games so cheap no one would bother to pirate them. They diid this in Russia and piracy rates dropped by 78%.

Lower price, then have add-ons (already in the can, or nearly so, ideally) that similarly cost a little.

I'll likely wait, too, as I have no use for u-boats. I'd be interested in escort duty, though... or maybe RN subs.

[Rockin Robbins]

Regardless of what we get, this is going to be very interesting and entertaining. Hope they blow my socks off and kill all my doubts.

[mookiemookie]

plus the absurd artwork depicting the sub surfaced within a hundred meters of exploding merchies and attacking escorts make me wonder about the overall design philosophy of the game.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/thumb/3/3a/SilentHunter4_Wolves_of_The_Pacific.jpg/256px-SilentHunter4_Wolves_of_The_Pacific.jpg

[Nexus7]

@RockinRobbins
Yes, I like your idea, alternatively make games so cheap no one would bother to pirate them. They diid this in Russia and piracy rates dropped by 78%.

My personal attitude is to:

- download the game from some torrents
- install & play it hopeing it works

if it works:
1. if i consider the product worthy:
- the producer gains my respect
- i buy the game no matter the price (below 200$ is ok)

2. if i consider the pruduct BS:
- i uninstall the pirated game.
- no buy.

Even at work I see to much squanded money on crappy software. That's fraud to me.

Best protection to make me buy the game:
- the protection that allows you to go multiplayer over some server (applyed for BF1942, Call of Duty, Medal of Honor and others)

I am no longer going to spend (a lot) of money when with the same money i can buy four books witch will enrichen me and maybe my children.

[FIREWALL]

I'm happy to see that SH5 has finally been officially announced. Now the game begins once again. Demands, frustration, anger, joy etc.

For me, having gone through the fiasco of SH3 and SH4 being released as unfinished games and then having to be heavily patched during the first year after release, has changed my mind about purchasing the game.

This time I've decided to wait at least 9 months, probably a year after release, before purchasing SH5.

Buying a game and immediately patching it...then waiting for and adding mods....then uninstalling those mods and adding patch 2....then waiting for and adding the newly compatible mods....then uninstalling those mods and installing patch 3...then adding newly compatible mods.....it all gets so old.

So I'll follow the journey of SH5 as an interested onlooker. Once patch 1.4 is released, I'll buy the game at some bargain basement bin and patch and mod it.

I'm too old now for Ubisoft's nonsense. :)

That's what they all say. :haha:

[Rockin Robbins]

My personal attitude is to:

- download the game from some torrents
- install & play it hopeing it works

BRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!! Warning buzzer goes off. I don't think it's proper to suggest that here. Either pay and play or don't pay and don't play. Those are your only two choices unless there's a demo coming out.

Not sure if this warrants ringing up the mods or not. They'll see it I'm sure. I feel merciful tonight.

@mookie That IS pretty disgusting isn't it? At least they got it better for the UBM badge. SH3 box was pretty ok too.

[longam]

MSRP $49.99 USD - why not....

http://pc.ign.com/objects/026/026623.html

[FIREWALL]

My personal attitude is to:

- download the game from some torrents
- install & play it hopeing it works

if it works:
1. if i consider the product worthy:
- the producer gains my respect
- i buy the game no matter the price (below 200$ is ok)

2. if i consider the pruduct BS:
- i uninstall the pirated game.
- no buy.

Even at work I see to much squanded money on crappy software. That's fraud to me.

Best protection to make me buy the game:
- the protection that allows you to go multiplayer over some server (applyed for BF1942, Call of Duty, Medal of Honor and others)

I am no longer going to spend (a lot) of money when with the same money i can buy four books witch will enrichen me and maybe my children.

If you read anything. I would recomend the SubSim rules about this subject. Big No No :yep:

[Rockin Robbins]

Changed my mind. Unfortunately, that's too reportable to ignore. I hate to report somebody with 481 posts.

[ETR3(SS)]

If ye be a pirate, this not be the site fer yer kind to flaunt it arrrghh! :arrgh!:

[FIREWALL]

If he deletes his post, I'll delete mine.

Only because he fairly new. And I'm not a Moderator.

[Nexus7]

BRRRRRRRRRRRR!!!!! Warning buzzer goes off. I don't think it's proper to suggest that here. Either pay and play or don't pay and don't play.
Those are your only two choices unless there's a demo coming out.

What is wrong in testing a product before you buy it ?
At work, I just bought a 50$ software (the company pays), it promises to allow you to split and merge multipage TIFF images.
Problem: The demo allows you to work with multitiff images up to 5 pages, while i work with multitiff images up to 50 pages.

I bought the software (my company paid).
Result: with more than 10 pages, the conversion becomes
1. slow
2. crappy (images get distorted and unusable)

Should I trust the demo again ?? I donnnnnnnnnnn't like to get robbed

Second example -> Dangerous Waters:
The general expectations and excitement got me totally about the improvement of Sub Command into a new level.
At game release i spent my 75$ (current exchange) and bought the sim right away. It's not really about the money you know...

The sim (and this will ring up the DW MOD community for the 100'th time) was very playable with official patch 1.00 witch then evolved to patch 1.04.

Problem: the community was not happy and wanted faster corrections (while the same community was pushing to release the sim as soon as possible). MODders activity started. In a complex simulator like Dangerous Waters, to touch little parameters results in a totally new gaming experience. To keep in touch, I would have had to keep in touch to the fast releasing MOD's updates (lots of changements), maybe 10 changes in onme week.

While I was relatively good with Sub Command and Dangerous Waters patched Officially, I totally lost the feeling to the simulator after it started getting Modified (the majority played with the MOD installed).

Result: I pushed to stay with the official patches -> the developer shut the doors and the sim went dead, YES DEAD.


Not sure if this warrants ringing up the mods or not. They'll see it I'm sure. I feel merciful tonight.

That one about DW is a little an extreme situation i recognize it, as Sonalyst's primary concern is not the gaming industry.
On the other hand, before I buy something, I want to be sure it is not just worth the trashcan.

[Onkel Neal]

Let's all hold off on buying SH5, at least for a year, when it is in the bargain bins. That way we can end the Silent Hunter series for once and all. That'll teach 'em. It sure worked for Sonalysts games.

[Sonarman]

Some very brave companies throw their brand new game (http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1529467/pay-championship-manager-2010) straight into the bargain bin in an effort to combat piracy/ revitalise the market maybe Ubi should try that?

[Biggs[CV]]

Some very brave companies throw their brand new game (http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/news/1529467/pay-championship-manager-2010) straight into the bargain bin in an effort to combat piracy maybe Ubi should try that?

Yea and there are some very crappy games in the bargain bin too. You want this series of games to continue, you pay full price. Ubisoft has done a pretty damn good job with the SH franchise. If you don't think so just look at what happened to Rainbow 6.

[FIREWALL]

That ought to straighten out this No-No piracy discussion.

And straighten out a possibley uninformed member.

[Sonarman]

@BiggsCV
Yes do't get me wrong, I fully agree with supporting the industry, I was just showing how Eidos is tackling the piracy problem in a new and innovative way similar to that which the music industry employs. Plus putting the game out at that price-point might attract a huge volume of new customers who had never played a Subsim before? But I admit it would be a big risk for Ubisoft.

Personally I actually think that software is much cheaper now than it has been and we should not whinge about it too much when our console brethern are paying almost twice as much as we are for an often inferior product.

When I purchased the first SH game it cost £50 SH4 had a retail of £30 twelve? years later. At the end of the day SH5 costs the same as two crappy Hollywood movies you watch once and then assign to your dusty movie shelf. I know what I'll be spending my £30 on!

[Biggs[CV]]

Only problem with that is we are a very small niche. UBI makes money on the SH series, but nothing like what they did for Rainbow 6 or Ghost Recon.

[Webster]

there are very few games out there that are worthy of the price we pay for them.

personally i think all games are overpriced but so is everything else in this world, plus im a tightwad lol.

in relative terms ubisofts games are a bargin to buy because they end up being good games for a long long time which many compaies cant do.

if you want to wait then thats your choice but not supporting the game when it comes out tells the game company there is no intrest in the game so once they see this data they do not support it with any more resources. its that simple, a game is judged by its initial as well as continuing sales and when they slow down or stop then all work on improvements to the game will also stop.


yes a few lucky people will be able to buy sh5 at the garage sale for $5-$10 from someones kid who doesnt update it or learn how to play it but its not a wide spread thing and you shouldnt plan on being able to do so.

[Sonarman]

;1153825']Only problem with that is we are a very small niche. UBI makes money on the SH series, but nothing like what they did for Rainbow 6 or Ghost Recon.

Not too small a niche I think, Ubi now publically state that they have sold over 1.5 million copies in the series. And the very fact that we are geting a 5 indicates financial viability.

[Biggs[CV]]

Sorry to tell ya, we are a very small niche. Rainbox 6 sold 6.7 million copies from '99-02. Add the sales of Rogue Spear, Raven Shield , Vegas, Vegas 2 and Lockdown........and the sales dwarf those of the SH series.
And that in no way a knock on our small niche.

I'm just glad that UBI has taken much better care of this series than they did R6.

[Sonarman]

Yes, but how much did those games cost to develop & licence from TC? Plus they were also on the consoles which SH was never has been.

[Biggs[CV]]

R6 started on the PC. Those sales figures from '99-02 represent PC. Yes later R6 games went to console and have done really well.
But regardless, I'd rather pay $50-$60 and keep the franchise alive. Heck if the game looks and plays well I'll pay $20-$30 for an expansion. :salute:

[mookiemookie]

I'll be a day one-er. :yeah:

[Sonarman]

;1153844']. Heck if the game looks and plays well I'll pay $20-$30 for an expansion. :salute:

Yup, I'm with you on that one, bring on the expansions (especially the long awaited playable destroyer addon !!!)

[Nexus7]

Let's all hold off on buying SH5, at least for a year, when it is in the bargain bins. That way we can end the Silent Hunter series for once and all. That'll teach 'em. It sure worked for Sonalysts games.

For me, what Killed DW it was the MOD frenzy (tell me I am wrong please).
OK i can be an ahole, the modders put a lot of work on the code.

I can barely evaluate the result of the modding as i quitted after the very first versions of Mods appeared.



As a programmer (little experience ok), I can state that DW is a HIGH QUALITY product.

[Sonarman]

I think the over-complexity is what really killed DW off it just was way too in-depth for the mass market in the same way as Shuttle was many years ago on the Amiga. The general populace does not have the patience to set out patterns of sonobuoys tune in to them and and patiently wait for results. Red Storm Rising had much the same theme as DW but was massively successful in its day, it wasn't a high fidelity sim but it was a good game and I think that made the difference. DW was a good sim but not a particularly good game.

Also Sonalysts DW manual was good at explaining how to do things but not why you would do them. I think the original 688 Hunter Killer manual from EA did a much better job of hand holding the new player into the game.

I dont think people waited for DW to hit the bargain bin there simply were not enough people willing to invest the time it required to learn such a complex sim. It certainlly wasn't a marketing issue either I think Sonalysts bent over backwards to push the game in the marketplace.

[ccruner13]

That one seems to be giving Ubisoft some sleepless nights at the moment. Looks like they are working on a new tool (http://www.incgamers.com/News/17655/ubisoft-outlines-thoughts-on-piracy) lets hope it's not too intrusive.
Though I think Eidos may have hit upon the best piracy prevention of all here (http://www.championshipmanager.co.uk/server/show/ConWebDoc.1088) let's hope it works for them as it may signal a new dawn for software retail.

i dont have exact figures but i know steam does bargain things on a weekly basis and the discounts vary but they reduce prices and that induces buying by people who might overlook it at full price and doing this actually increased profits. enough extra people bought it at the discounted price to offset the loss from the discount. itll be interesting to see what happens with the 'pay what you want' experiment.

for example...

18th August 2009 11:51PM, posted by JWhittaker (http://forums.championshipmanager.co.uk/forums/member.php?u=192228)
I just purchased this with no problems, so it would seem that if they were having trouble with the website, they have it sorted out now. Maybe it just got overloaded with everyone trying to buy it at once. Anyway, £2.51, a great price for any game. I wouldn't normally buy a game like this, but at that price, who wouldn't???

[Thomsen2002]

After having watching the trailer in German, the answer is "maybe". My PC is 6 years old, and runs fine for the games I play. In this case, Ubisoft is shooting for the moon, so if I wanna get this one, a new PC will be required.

[bruschi sauro]

I'm happy to see that SH5 has finally been officially announced. Now the game begins once again. Demands, frustration, anger, joy etc.

For me, having gone through the fiasco of SH3 and SH4 being released as unfinished games and then having to be heavily patched during the first year after release, has changed my mind about purchasing the game.

This time I've decided to wait at least 9 months, probably a year after release, before purchasing SH5.

Buying a game and immediately patching it...then waiting for and adding mods....then uninstalling those mods and adding patch 2....then waiting for and adding the newly compatible mods....then uninstalling those mods and installing patch 3...then adding newly compatible mods.....it all gets so old.

So I'll follow the journey of SH5 as an interested onlooker. Once patch 1.4 is released, I'll buy the game at some bargain basement bin and patch and mod it.

I'm too old now for Ubisoft's nonsense. :)
You are right, :)

[TDK1044]

Let's all hold off on buying SH5, at least for a year, when it is in the bargain bins. That way we can end the Silent Hunter series for once and all. That'll teach 'em. It sure worked for Sonalysts games.

I think you believe this forum to be more important in the scheme of things than it actually is, Neal. I believe that when it comes to total sales, the percentage represented here is not that great at all. When it comes to valuable input for the Devs....that's a different story.

If a few like me wait 9 months to buy the game...big deal. If Ubisoft was to actually produce a finished game for once then we'd all be happy. Who knows, they might surprise us.

[Nexus7]

After all aren't "bug's" a sort of increase of the realism ?? (lol)

I mean, in what machinery do you never have unexpected failures ?

i.e. fire torpedo tube 1 - torpedo tube doesn't open Sir !

:O:

[TDK1044]

Yeah, but there's a difference between a few bugs and fixes which you'd expect with any complex game release and the 'shove it out there and patch it later' attitude of this Publisher. I draw a distinct line between the Publisher and their Devs.

[Nexus7]

On the other hand, I guess that a category of bugs can be really hard to explore, the hardware-driven bugs (too many poss configurations).

For the rest, don't they listen at the beta-testers ?

[TDK1044]

For the rest, don't they listen at the beta-testers ?

I must choose my words very carefully. In my experience the answer to your question is 'No'. Again, I would differentiate between the publisher and the Devs here. The Devs welcome external Beta Teasters. The Publisher does not.

You know, understandably, some folks take a 'walking on egg shells' attitude with Ubisoft because they are the only publisher out there making sub sims. I understand that, but there's nothing wrong with legitimate criticizm of a publisher that has a terrible reputation accross the board for the quality control of its games.

Here's a recent quote from console game users:

'Members on the official Ubisoft forum harshly criticized the company for the lack of quality control and accusing Ubisoft of breaking its own promise of "significantly better" Wii projects.' Ubisoft has acknowledged that it's console game quality control standards were too low and needed addressing.

So to the egg shell walkers, here's the point.... Ubisoft continues the Silent Hunter franchise as a Business decision. Nothing more and nothing less. The Silent Hunter franchise doesn't make a huge amount of money, but it is profitable for Ubisoft. The U Boat sims have proved more profitable than the Fleet Boat sims and that is the sole reason that Silent Hunter 5 is set back in the Atlantic during WWII.

I guarantee you that Silent Hunter 5 will be as unfinished as Silent Hunter 4 was at release. If that's Ok with you and you're happy to patch and install and uninstall mods for 6 to 9 months then I respect that. I will wait for the game to be patched to 1.4, at which time it will be in the state that it should have been at when it was released.

[Nexus7]

If things are really that serious, I can imagine as a result a thinning of the subsimmers community over time... :shifty:

[ETR3(SS)]

The whole thing is a Catch 22, as I tried to explain before. We the consumers have seen Ubisoft release the previous two installments in the series before they were market ready. I myself bought SH3 and 4 when they were released. But after installing SH4, I shelved it for at least a year!

So here's the Catch 22. Past experience leads us to believe that this installment will be just as unfinished as the previous, so therefore some will not jump to buy it. However, because some choose not to buy it based on past experience with the company, the sales numbers will reflect that. And whatever the numbers reflect is what will Ubisoft perceive as the "market" for such a product. It will never cross their mind that consumers might be a little upset about past dealings, it simply doesn't fit into their business model. Plain and simple. :know:

[Blood_splat]

I don't even know why they are making a SH 5. It must be a way to make a quick buck every two to three years. I'll take it though hehe.

[TDK1044]

So here's the Catch 22. Past experience leads us to believe that this installment will be just as unfinished as the previous, so therefore some will not jump to buy it. However, because some choose not to buy it based on past experience with the company, the sales numbers will reflect that. And whatever the numbers reflect is what will Ubisoft perceive as the "market" for such a product. It will never cross their mind that consumers might be a little upset about past dealings, it simply doesn't fit into their business model. Plain and simple. :know:

I don't actually agree with your assesment. The total number of members of forums such as this represent less than ten percent of total sales of the product. The very small number of that percentage who will either delay their purchase or not purchase at all is an insignificant number in respect to total sales.

The vast majority here will purchase the game, and the Devs will get excellent feedback from some of us here. The real issue is the ninety plus percent of sales who are not members of forums like this and who are purchasing the game as a 'go to sea and sink stuff' game. Those are the guys that Ubisoft is interested in.

[ETR3(SS)]

I don't actually agree with your assesment. The total number of members of forums such as this represent less than ten percent of total sales of the product. The very small number of that percentage who will either delay their purchase or not purchase at all is an insignificant number in respect to total sales. Ok im with ya on this so far. If 1% of the target audience doesn't buy the game, no big loss for Ubi. I'll agree there.

The vast majority here will purchase the game, and the Devs will get excellent feedback from some of us here. The real issue is the ninety plus percent of sales who are not members of forums like this and who are purchasing the game as a 'go to sea and sink stuff' game. Those are the guys that Ubisoft is interested in. This one is a little harder to chew on. It would be hard to get Ubi to come out and say who they are targeting for this game. But at the same time can we really assume that this is being marketed more as an arcade than a sub sim? If you (and by you I mean anyone) judge this game based solely off of the cinematic trailer than you're nuts. For those who are familiar or may have seen it, take for example World of Warcraft. Blizzard came out with some phenomenal cinematic trailers, but that's all they were, cinematics. Don't get me wrong I'm excited over a SH5, even if it is U-boats. But I think some people are falling victim to rubber neck syndrome and aren't watching out for the crash that's about to happen in front of them.

[Apachezulu]

I'm still getting sweaty palms playing with SH3 GWX + mods...even after all these years...

I bought SH4 for it's Pacific War theater...not playing it yet but eagerly waiting for the GWX team to do their miracles...

Will I buy SH5?

Yes...but only AFTER the GWX gods says they're gonna work on it.

Ubisoft should be paying GWX and all the Modders product makeover fees.

:yep:

[Arclight]

Day 1 purchase... or pre-order. :hmmm:

We complained/suggested, they listened;




Walk through highly detailed submarines in the new first-person view and access every part of your U-boat


Interact with your crew, watch them perform their daily jobs and experience the tension and fear inside the U-boat through the new advanced order system


Choose your own strategy and select your targets with a new objective-driven, dynamic campaign


Open new locations, upgrades and resupply possibilities, while the Allied ships adjust dynamically to your approach. Your actions will directly impact the evolution of the campaign


Prowl the waters with user interface. Every beginner can successfully command a sub while remaining free of confusion. In expert mode, experienced players will be provided all the necessary information and controls to command the sub completely on their own


Operate authentic, highly detailed U-boats and fight against surface ships.
I've seen all these points requested on the 2 or 3 threads that sprung up on SH5 after the first rumors. They have earned my support, waiting to buy untill it hits the bargain bin would be condemning SH to death. At least it would certainly feel like that to me. :(

Unless you want the blood of Silent Hunter on your hands, you will buy this, and you will pay good money for it! :arrgh!: ;)

[TarJak]

Wolfpacks? Anyone?

[Blood_splat]

"Do not spoil what you have by desiring which you have not; but remember that what you have now was once among the things you only hoped for." --Epicurus
:salute:

[Fish40]

I've preordered both SH3 and 4, and I have a feeling it'll be no different with this one. Call me gullible!

[TDK1044]

Not gullible at all. Personal choice. I just don't have the patience for all that patching...installing mods....uninstalling mods....adding more patches etc.

I will purchase the game about nine months after its release and patch it and mod it once. It will cost me about $10 and the other $40 I will donate to subsim. :)

[Wulfmann]

I bought SH3 after 1.2 and quickly realized I should have waited for 1.3.

After 1.3 it was as it could be considered releasable but by that I mean most all games have a retrospect required update and 1.4 should have been the only patch. 1.3 should have been the released version

So, I waited until 1.3 for SH4 and while that was OK as 1.3 1.4 may have improved deficiencies nothing could cure the simple fact the Pacific War being easier as it goes makes not a challenging game so one career and back to GWX3.

I will wait for 1.3 unless you pay to be beta testers report the game stable and CTD free earlier (I doubt UBI will wait for stability but one can dream)

Don't worry, most are too impatient to wait and I want to thank you all in advance for testing the game so the needed improvements will be there for me when I start running it.

Also, as hardware drops in price by the day i will be able to have better PC upgrades for that blessed SH5 first patrol.

The nice thing about getting old (60) is you finally start to have some patience.

Wulfmann

[tomoose]

...that says "never buy the first version of anything". Not sure if it applies here given that SH5 is...well....the fifth in the series but I'll definitely wait based on the experiences with the last two games. SH3 + GWX fills the bill so SH5 would have to have some remarkable improvements or details for me to dust of my wallet.:D

Here's hoping (I'm still waiting for the definitive heavy bomber sim ala the Mighty Eighth too but that's another dream, LOL).:salute:

[sharkbit]

I have mixed feelings about this.

First though, I have to say that I have only played SH3 since April 2008. I have not been involved in the series since the start and have not experienced many of the problems that people like TDK have experienced. I can imagine their frustration though.
The reason I bought SH3 instead of SH4 in the first place was the reviews of SH4 were full of the bugginess of the game and the number of patches needed to fix it. I thought SH3 was a better choice and I have not regretted that choice.
After joining these forums, I have learned about the mods that have made SH4 much more playable and a game worth buying. In fact, I have just recently purchased it. :DL

On the one hand, I want to support the genre and dish out the money on release day, even if the game may sit on the shelf for a bit. SH3 has brought many, many hours of enjoyment to myself and my son and many, many hours of frustration to my wife. :D

On the other hand(and I lean a lot more toward this view), I find it hard to run out on release day and plop down $30 for a product from a company that in the past has released a very buggy game(SH4) and had to release numerous patches within the first year or so. I don't like to spend money on a bad product, whatever it may be, and have to wait for patches/fixes/mods to make it a good product. Now I don't expect perfection the first time, but based on some of the stories I've heard about the early days of both SH3 and especially SH4.

As with any product(cars, stereos, cameras, etc.), if I buy something and it is a piece of crap, I won't buy something made by that company again in all likelihood or at least do so very cautiously. If it is a good product, lasts a long time, and works like it should, I will very likely go right back to that company for something else. Brand loyalty is earned.

Like I said at the beginning of the post, I personally don't have a lot of history with the game so my opinion might not hold a lot of weight but I probably will not be running out on day one and buying SH5.

I honestly do hope that Ubisoft releases an outstanding game that is relatively bug free and meets many of our expectations. I am eagerly awaiting the release and will be reading everyone's comments, reviews, and/or bitchin' on these forums. If there is a lot of :yeah:, I'll be more willing to go out and plunk down the $30, albeit a few months later.

:)

[AVGWarhawk]

What is forgiven is usually well remembered.


SH4 stands on its own merits, good or bad. SH5 is a clean slate and I do not judge previous releases on this new release in hopes that things were learned and addressed.

[Jimbuna]

I'm still getting sweaty palms playing with SH3 GWX + mods...even after all these years...

I bought SH4 for it's Pacific War theater...not playing it yet but eagerly waiting for the GWX team to do their miracles...

Will I buy SH5?

Yes...but only AFTER the GWX gods says they're gonna work on it.

Ubisoft should be paying GWX and all the Modders product makeover fees.

:yep:

I'll be purchasing the game on the first day of release to support the genre.....I'm also an inquisitive nosey bastid.

If our community don't feel able to support Ubi and the devs, there's a simple end game......the potential cessation of sub sim games releases.

As for the above reference to GWX.....too early to say and the game isn't even released yet. http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

[JScones]

No waiting here - like always I'll pre-order the most expensive edition available (just for the free pen).

Then I'll install it and spend the next few weeks picking the files apart and learning how it hangs together.

Then I'll watch as a myriad of individual modders start releasing little setting tweaks.

Then I'll watch as an alpha male starts combining those tweaks into one d/l.

Then I'll watch the obligatory deck gun rate of fire argument.

Then I'll watch at least two opposing groups of modders go to their corners to work on their take of realism.

Then I'll watch the fireworks, egos, tears, tantrums, threats. Modders will leave, return, leave, return until it becomes disturbing.

Then I'll watch the "This game sux! I won't play it until GWX5 as no-one else could possibly know how to mod it so I'm sticking with SH3" threads, thus deflating the motivation of many, many new great modders that will no doubt emerge.

Then I'll start work on SH5Cmdr because someone will find something "missing" that can't be fixed through normal modding or setting tweaks.

Then I'll get bombarded with "how do you download a file?" questions and "SH5Cmdr ate all the food in my fridge, got my wife pregnant and vomitted in my car" accusations.

Then I'll stop work on SH5Cmdr out of frustration at the never end of ungreats.

Then after a hiatus I'll come back for one last release just to tie things off and recognise the many loyal supporters.

Then they'll announce SH6.

Then I'll pre-order the most expensive edition available (just for the free pen).

...

:up:

[Wolfehunter]

TDK I agreed. I'm tired of game companies putting out beta's. :up:

[Uber Gruber]

Then I'll watch the obligatory deck gun rate of fire argument.

Then I'll watch at least two opposing groups of modders go to their corners to work on their take of realism.

Then I'll watch the fireworks, egos, tears, tantrums, threats. Modders will leave, return, leave, return until it becomes disturbing.

:rotfl::rotfl::haha::rotfl::har:

[AVGWarhawk]

No waiting here - like always I'll pre-order the most expensive edition available (just for the free pen).

Then I'll install it and spend the next few weeks picking the files apart and learning how it hangs together.

Then I'll watch as a myriad of individual modders start releasing little setting tweaks.

Then I'll watch as an alpha male starts combining those tweaks into one d/l.

Then I'll watch the obligatory deck gun rate of fire argument.

Then I'll watch at least two opposing groups of modders go to their corners to work on their take of realism.

Then I'll watch the fireworks, egos, tears, tantrums, threats. Modders will leave, return, leave, return until it becomes disturbing.

Then I'll watch the "This game sux! I won't play it until GWX5 as no-one else could possibly know how to mod it so I'm sticking with SH3" threads, thus deflating the motivation of many, many new great modders that will no doubt emerge.

Then I'll start work on SH5Cmdr because someone will find something "missing" that can't be fixed through normal modding or setting tweaks.

Then I'll get bombarded with "how do you download a file?" questions and "SH5Cmdr ate all the food in my fridge, got my wife pregnant and vomitted in my car" accusations.

Then I'll stop work on SH5Cmdr out of frustration at the never end of ungreats.

Then after a hiatus I'll come back for one last release just to tie things off and recognise the many loyal supporters.

Then they'll announce SH6.

Then I'll pre-order the most expensive edition available (just for the free pen).

...

:up:


JS,

That is just a priceless post if I have ever seen one! I have seen some funny posts over the years but yours takes the cake! :har::har::har::har:

[Contact]

Jscones very funny and very true :up:
I wish it was the magic post who could sort things out in peace and harmony..

[TDK1044]

No waiting here - like always I'll pre-order the most expensive edition available (just for the free pen).

Then I'll install it and spend the next few weeks picking the files apart and learning how it hangs together.

Then I'll watch as a myriad of individual modders start releasing little setting tweaks.

Then I'll watch as an alpha male starts combining those tweaks into one d/l.

Then I'll watch the obligatory deck gun rate of fire argument.

Then I'll watch at least two opposing groups of modders go to their corners to work on their take of realism.

Then I'll watch the fireworks, egos, tears, tantrums, threats. Modders will leave, return, leave, return until it becomes disturbing.

Then I'll watch the "This game sux! I won't play it until GWX5 as no-one else could possibly know how to mod it so I'm sticking with SH3" threads, thus deflating the motivation of many, many new great modders that will no doubt emerge.

Then I'll start work on SH5Cmdr because someone will find something "missing" that can't be fixed through normal modding or setting tweaks.

Then I'll get bombarded with "how do you download a file?" questions and "SH5Cmdr ate all the food in my fridge, got my wife pregnant and vomitted in my car" accusations.

Then I'll stop work on SH5Cmdr out of frustration at the never end of ungreats.

Then after a hiatus I'll come back for one last release just to tie things off and recognise the many loyal supporters.

Then they'll announce SH6.

Then I'll pre-order the most expensive edition available (just for the free pen).

...

:up:


If you wait nine months, JS, they glue the sub shaped pen to the cellophane DVD cover to sell the game in the bargain bin. If you point the pen towards the floor, the little propellers start to spin in the wrong direction.

[Oberst Oswald]

Provided my PC can run it, I'll buy it right away, unplug internet to not be tempted to read the inevitable whining over this and that, and enjoy it like I enjoyed stock SH3 before reading about it :)
Sometimes reading forums about a game you're about to play is like reading spoilers for the movie you're about to watch. You'll know about things that you'd never have noticed by yourself and it ruins it.

I agree with this...

[longam]

Then I'll watch the "This game sux! I won't play it until GWX5 as no-one else could possibly know how to mod it so I'm sticking with SH3" threads, thus deflating the motivation of many, many new great modders that will no doubt emerge.

I never did DL GWX3... but that was a spot on post there JC :haha:

[Akula4745]

No waiting here - like always I'll pre-order the most expensive edition available (just for the free pen).

Then I'll install it and spend the next few weeks picking the files apart and learning how it hangs together.

Then I'll watch as a myriad of individual modders start releasing little setting tweaks.

Then I'll watch as an alpha male starts combining those tweaks into one d/l.

Then I'll watch the obligatory deck gun rate of fire argument.

Then I'll watch at least two opposing groups of modders go to their corners to work on their take of realism.

Then I'll watch the fireworks, egos, tears, tantrums, threats. Modders will leave, return, leave, return until it becomes disturbing.

Then I'll watch the "This game sux! I won't play it until GWX5 as no-one else could possibly know how to mod it so I'm sticking with SH3" threads, thus deflating the motivation of many, many new great modders that will no doubt emerge.

Then I'll start work on SH5Cmdr because someone will find something "missing" that can't be fixed through normal modding or setting tweaks.

Then I'll get bombarded with "how do you download a file?" questions and "SH5Cmdr ate all the food in my fridge, got my wife pregnant and vomitted in my car" accusations.

Then I'll stop work on SH5Cmdr out of frustration at the never end of ungreats.

Then after a hiatus I'll come back for one last release just to tie things off and recognise the many loyal supporters.

Then they'll announce SH6.

Then I'll pre-order the most expensive edition available (just for the free pen).

...

:up:

LOL - I love it! Well said sir...

[mookiemookie]

and "SH5Cmdr ate all the food in my fridge, got my wife pregnant and vomitted in my car" accusations.

SH5 Commander sounds a lot like my college roommate :haha:

[Jimbuna]

So what do you plan doing after lunch Jaesen? :hmmm:

:DL

[Rockin Robbins]

No waiting here - like always I'll pre-order the most expensive edition available (just for the free pen).

Then I'll install it and spend the next few weeks picking the files apart and learning how it hangs together.

Then I'll watch as a myriad of individual modders start releasing little setting tweaks.

Then I'll watch as an alpha male starts combining those tweaks into one d/l.

Then I'll watch the obligatory deck gun rate of fire argument.....:har::haha::har:

:up:

This is perhaps the greatest post in the history of Subsim!:up::up::up:

[Raven08]

Having played most of the previous versions I will (for better or worse) buy SHV when it ships; my curiosity level will just be too high.

Do I expect bugs? Of course, it will have its problems, I don't think anyone is expecting otherwise given the history of Silent Hunter games.

The question is how bad will it be? Will it be virtually unplayable out of the box? :hmmm:


As far as another 'Atlantic' sim, I'm just not that worked up about it. We've had several of those, I'm on board with the folks looking for something different...modern boats, or else take it back further to WWI.

Anything new. :sunny:

[IanC]

If our community don't feel able to support Ubi and the devs, there's a simple end game......the potential cessation of sub sim games releases.


Although it's easy to forget, the subsim community here forms a very tiny percentage of the sold SH games. In other words Ubi don't need us.
I jumped on SHIII the day it came out and I literaly had to wait another year to make the game playable.
So of course this time I'm waiting.

[skwasjer]

...

:up:
Funny post Jaeson :rotfl:

What's so sad is, you are too right... :dead:

I'm interested (not actually) to see how many demands I'll be getting when SH5 hits retail... :shifty:

Oh, and of course I will buy it on day 1. Personally, I feel that anyone that already knows it is going to delay their purchase for 9 months, without even knowing what the game is going to be like, should think back on how much they played SH3 or SH4 (or both, and/or other versions) and then think again: those hundreds (or thousands) of hours you have been playing, how much did you pay for it in total, to date?

I mean come on, many of us drive one tank of gas empty in one week or less, at the full retail price of the game...

Give support, buy on day 1... Keep the game alive...

[Jimbuna]

Although it's easy to forget, the subsim community here forms a very tiny percentage of the sold SH games. In other words Ubi don't need us.
I jumped on SHIII the day it came out and I literaly had to wait another year to make the game playable.
So of course this time I'm waiting.

Then I'd say all the more reason to support the release from day one.....as skwasjer rightly points out, we spend a lot more on other things without giving it a second thought.