Looking to build a decent PC in a budget

[XabbaRus]

OK looking to build a new PC budget is £500 to £600

Now I'm looking for advice and links to good places to buy would be great but I don't want to be bombarded with multiple different options.

Here is what I need.

New Case
New MOBO
New CPU
New HDD
New DVD/RW
New RAM of course
New Tx

I'll be reusing my nVIDIA GFX card which is PCI-e Maybe not the fastest card on the block now but it is the one thing I can forgo getting straight away since the only game I will be playing on it is IL-2 1946.

Although it is a family computer the aim is that I will be able to Play Battle of Britain : Storm of War at high options settings when it is released.

I have built a PC before so I can do that.

One other thing is Intel only...not keen on AMD and undecided whether to go Core 2 Duo or Quad core.

Cheers for your help. Purchasing will be done in stages, getting the bits as I can afford it. Though certain things I'll be buying together.

I'm sure I can build a decent PC good enough to go 6 or so years and still be able to play future flight sims coming out in that time.

My current PC is 5 to 6 years old and can still hack it like I said with IL-2 on fullish settings, but for BOB:SOW and Black Shark it will struggle.....

[Task Force]

I myself use a e8400, its a good processor, or you could go to the 8500, but thats cause I use duel core, always have.

umm... ive had good experience with my antec 900... keeps my 8800 cool.

I use a asus MoBo have had no issues.

[Kaleun]

hi,

I know it's not building your own - but i saw this whilst browsing overclockers, and it's in your budget and is a stonking gaming rig for the money (but it is AMD)

http://www.overclockers.co.uk/showproduct.php?prodid=FS-180-OK

Kaleun

[porphy]

My current PC is 5 to 6 years old and can still hack it like I said with IL-2 on fullish settings, but for BOB:SOW and Black Shark it will struggle.....

If you are ok with running IL2 as it is now, I would hold of and wait for the actual release of BOB:SOW. The closer to the release of the sim, the better hardware you will get for the money. And you will know a bit more of what it will take to run it in a good way.

If you want to run BS right now, and turn on full settings in IL2 I can see why you want to build a new PC pronto. But if BOB is the main event, I would hold my breath a bit longer. (although no one really knows for how long... :) )

cheers Porphy

[Task Force]

yea, the 200 series cards prices should be dropping once the 3xx series cards come out.:yep: if they do.

[XabbaRus]

OK looking at a Core 2 Duo E8400 or E8500

Quad core is out of the question.

Now what Mobo should I get. I'm going to get an Intel chipset mobo for maximum compatibility.

[SUBMAN1]

Why is a quad core out of the question? You can buy one for $150 easy.

-S

[Task Force]

im currently useing a p5k deluxe... it has been good to me.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131182

The CPU I use.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115037

[SUBMAN1]

im currently useing a p5k deluxe... it has been good to me.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16813131182

The CPU I use.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819115037

Bah! Old technology that is overpriced for being as under performing as it is. Not picking on your CPU since you probably bought it when it was hot, but why invest in 1 to 2 year old technology? It is so sacrilegious to me that I'd almost offer up the difference for an i7 920 just to feel good that he didn't buy into something that won't last! :nope: If I knew him personally, I probably would!

The games coming that are making use of heavy physics will dedicate a core on a quad to physics alone. People with dual cores will get reduced fun. :damn:

-S

[FIREWALL]

TigerDirect has good deals cpu\mobo bundles.

Also case\psu deals.

[XabbaRus]

Why is a quad core out of the question? You can buy one for $150 easy.

-S

Well I was on DABS.com and overclockers.co.uk and Core Quads are £250

[XabbaRus]

OK I said I wanted to keep this simple. I am on a budget looking £500-600

I'm looking for clear realistic recommendations, not turning into a poo-pooing the other guys choice of CPU/mobo what ever.

I can't afford a quad core unless someone can get a good one to me for about £150

[FIREWALL]

If TigerDirect isn't available to you I still say look for a cpu\mobo bundle deal.

Also a case\psu bundle deal.

[Arclight]

I'd say get a P45 board (preferably PCI-e 2.0), throw in 2x2GB DDR2 (4-4-4-12 if possible) and a decent dual-core. If DDR3 is a must, you'd best go with i7, but that would likely ramp up the price, meaning you need to cut corners on other stuff, if it's doable on that budget at all.

GigaByte is always a good choice for boards, but they're expensive. Kingston offers good modules for a good price with maximum compatibility and a lifetime waranty, no strings attached.

Over here, a E8400 costs about the same as an Q8400 (!) (just under 150,- euros). For 10 to 15 more, you have a Q9400 (just under 165,- euros).

Get a case to your liking, make sure it has a decent (preferably good) PSU.

There, simple.



But...

You mentioned Black Shark. At the moment, single core speed is very important for it, since it doesn't support multi-cores. You can enable it through the OS (set affinity for the process to all cores), but it's less than ideal. With upcoming modules, there should be native support for multi-core and multi-threading. Since your primary focus is flight-sims, I'd say a quad is mandatory, especially with future releases. Since not all sims can use multi-cores effectively, especially older ones, you'll want a fast one at that for high speed per core.

(flight) sims are heavy on the CPU. You want a good one. :yep:

[Task Force]

I'd say get a P45 board (preferably PCI-e 2.0), throw in 2x2GB DDR2 (4-4-4-12 if possible) and a decent dual-core. If DDR3 is a must, you'd best go with i7, but that would likely ramp up the price, meaning you need to cut corners on other stuff, if it's doable on that budget at all.

GigaByte is always a good choice for boards, but they're expensive. Kingston offers good modules for a good price with maximum compatibility and a lifetime waranty, no strings attached.

Over here, a E8400 costs about the same as an Q8400 (!) (just under 150,- euros). For 10 to 15 more, you have a Q9400 (just under 165,- euros).

Get a case to your liking, make sure it has a decent (preferably good) PSU.

There, simple.



But...

You mentioned Black Shark. At the moment, single core speed is very important for it, since it doesn't support multi-cores. You can enable it through the OS (set affinity for the process to all cores), but it's less than ideal. With upcoming modules, there should be native support for multi-core and multi-threading. Since your primary focus is flight-sims, I'd say a quad is mandatory, especially with future releases. Since not all sims can use multi-cores effectively, especially older ones, you'll want a fast one at that for high speed per core.

(flight) sims are heavy on the CPU. You want a good one. :yep:

someone has made a program that allows you to run 2 cpus in dcs blackshark.

[Arclight]

Like I said, less than ideal. It sets the affinity to all cores, just like you can do manually. ;)



DVD: http://www.sony-optiarc.com/products/hhid_dvdrw/ad7240.html
Sony Optiarc AD7240s
Latest and greatest multi-DVD writer, no lightscribe or other labeling tech: 20,- euros

HD: http://www.wdc.com/en/products/products.asp?driveid=394
Blue series, general desktop model. 640GB: 56,- euros

http://www.wdc.com/en/products/products.asp?driveid=551
Black series, high performance. 640 GB: 63,- euros

[goldorak]

Building a new computer right now is a bad move, especially if you're going the Intel route. By September Intel will present the new Lynnfields that will literally smoke any core 2 or quad core in single or multithreaded performance. Lynnfields are not top of line processors, they are mainstream (so the price will be low), but they will be a definite improvemente over core 2 duo and core 2 quad.

[porphy]

someone has made a program that allows you to run 2 cpus in dcs blackshark.


yepp, but remember you only will see benefits in Vista or Windows 7. XP will not give any better performance with more cores in Black Shark.

[XabbaRus]

Building a new computer right now is a bad move, especially if you're going the Intel route. By September Intel will present the new Lynnfields that will literally smoke any core 2 or quad core in single or multithreaded performance. Lynnfields are not top of line processors, they are mainstream (so the price will be low), but they will be a definite improvemente over core 2 duo and core 2 quad.

Still look more expensive than current CPUs

The thing is I can always wait for the newest shiny CPU to come out...result, will never have a new PC.

[goldorak]

Still look more expensive than current CPUs

The thing is I can always wait for the newest shiny CPU to come out...result, will never have a new PC.


No, the secret is to buy at the right time to maximize performance and minimize the aumount of money you spend. And that time is september. For the same amount of money you'll spend on a core 2 duo or core 2 quad right now, you'll get a Lynnfield that not only will be better than the old c2d or c2d in multithread, but most importantly they will be better in single thread. Some classic games are not multithreaded, so they gain performance by using high clocked cpu's. The Lynnfields will have an automatic overclock that will enable in certain circumstances to increase its frequency by 40-50%. Thats nothing to sneer at, especially if you're a gamer.
Lynnfields are going to replace c2d and c2q at the same pricepoints if not less.

[FIREWALL]

Mobo is the key. Buy a good one with a good warrenty.

Make sure it's CPU socket will be upgradeable in the future.

Mobo's with a 775 socket in the past could use a single core 3.0 , duo core and quadcore for Intel.

Antec 900 or 1200 case should answer all your future needs with good cooling. 500 watt psu with 30 to 40 amps at rail.

Then buy the best CPU that will fit that socket. You can upgrade in the future.

Ram is so cheap you figure it out.

Good Luck :salute:

[SUBMAN1]

Double tap

[SUBMAN1]

Well I was on DABS.com and overclockers.co.uk and Core Quads are £250

Go for an AMD. You can buy one for pretty cheap comparatively.

I saw Core i7 for $260 (way less than your price) a little while back. They may be less now.

4850 Vid cards are down to $100!!! Rediculous!

Some good info for helping you on a budget:
Best Graphics Cards For The Money: July '09:

http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/best-graphics-card,2362.html

Far Cry is probably what you should base your CPU opinion on if you primarily use it for gaming:
http://www.tomshardware.com/charts/2009-desktop-cpu-charts/Far-Cry-2-1.0.1,1401.html

Here is $180 for a 940. This price could probably be beat too pretty easily. Use the 945 score from the chart above (same CPU, just different socket - AM2+ vs AM3):
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16819103471

-S

[Arclight]

I must admit I'm with Goldorak. :hmmm:

Lynnfield will run on yet another new socket, LGA 1156. It's a direct replacement for the current Penryns. By the time supply is steady, costs should be the same for Lynnfield CPU + P55 board as you would pay now for Penryn + board. It's worth holding out for, but probably means waiting till Q4 before you buy.

The biggest problem moving to i7 right know is that the boards cost 2x as much. 150,- for a basic board, 200,- for a good one. Add 230,- for the 920, and most of the budget is gone already.

[Castout]

Hmm for that amount of money truth is you can build yourself a very decent rig! :)

all I can say is pick teh mobo right go for all solid capacitors!!! I'm using Gigabyte's mobo with all solid capacitors. It's supposed to extend its lifetime. I can always go back and kill the vendor if it doesn't :rotfl:

[goldorak]

Hmm for that amount of money truth is you can build yourself a very decent rig! :)

all I can say is pick teh mobo right go for all solid capacitors!!! I'm using Gigabyte's mobo with all solid capacitors. It's supposed to extend its lifetime. I can always go back and kill the vendor if it doesn't :rotfl:

Having solid caps is not a guarantee for reliability.
Many workstation and server boards use electrolytic caps and they are as reliable or even more as the all 100% solid caps motherboards.
Don't buy into the marketing snake oil, whats important is quality caps, either electrolytic or solid.

[SUBMAN1]

Having solid caps is not a guarantee for reliability.
Many workstation and server boards use electrolytic caps and they are as reliable or even more as the all 100% solid caps motherboards.
Don't buy into the marketing snake oil, whats important is quality caps, either electrolytic or solid.

Except when they leak and destroy your computer:

http://www.pcstats.com/articleimages/200302/capblown_6.jpg

They are cheap though. So if you like cheap and adequate, there ya go.

Solid caps have better stability too. BTW, Gigabyte doesn't buy Chinese garbage for caps either - they are Japanese caps. It is always going to be 100 x better quality control for Japanese made parts over Chinese. Japan usually has honor in what they produce (unless you buy Sony). The Chinese however, really don't care. They can accept some failures in the name of mass production. All is good until these cheap caps leak all over your motherboard and your motherboard is rendered useless because of it.

Just my 2 cents.

-S

[Skybird]

Xabba,

take note of Ssnakes answers in the 5th or 6nd reply.

http://www.steelbeasts.com/sbforums/showthread.php?t=13586

I have asked at subsim some time ago, now there at SBP boards, and several people in real life as well. I still cannot beolieve how many very different, even contradicting answers I have gotten. But if it is how ssnake says, it should be taken into account: there is little reason then to buy a quad if you do not plan to get software optimised for that. Probably better to got for a duo - but that with as many GHz as your budget allows.

[stabiz]

I went with the E8500 Core 2 Duo because I wanted a strong CPU when playing single core games, and I am happy with it. Much better than my old E6600.

[goldorak]

Except when they leak and destroy your computer:

http://www.pcstats.com/articleimages/200302/capblown_6.jpg

They are cheap though. So if you like cheap and adequate, there ya go.

Solid caps have better stability too. BTW, Gigabyte doesn't buy Chinese garbage for caps either - they are Japanese caps. It is always going to be 100 x better quality control for Japanese made parts over Chinese. Japan usually has honor in what they produce (unless you buy Sony). The Chinese however, really don't care. They can accept some failures in the name of mass production. All is good until these cheap caps leak all over your motherboard and your motherboard is rendered useless because of it.

Just my 2 cents.

-S

What about japanese quality electrolytic caps ? Really the question is not whether to use solid or electrolytic, as if solid caps were somehow instrinsically more secure because they are not (on the [H]ard|Forum there are images of Nvidia video cards with failing SOLID CAPS how about that ?) . They fail just as easily.
Its just a myth the motherboard manufacturers have been "pushing" to justify higher prices and terrorize the consumers with the "experience of bad mobos dieing in the early 2000 because of bad quality control con electrolytic caps".
My stereo rig has high quality electrolytic caps, and it has been going strong for almost 20 years.
Motherboards wether using electrolytic or solid caps won't last that long because of technological obsolescense.
My last 2 intel motherboards (top of the line) use eletrolytic caps and have absolutely no problem whatsoever (one is almost 6 years old, and the other is going on 3 years).
;)

[FIREWALL]

Seems like you have 2 choices.


Cheap and Adaquate or Longer lasting and Upgradeable.


A little more money spent now equates to less headaches later.

[goldorak]

Seems like you have 2 choices.


Cheap and Adaquate or Longer lasting and Upgradeable.


A little more money spent now equates to less headaches later.

It has always been like this. You have to pay for quality.
Nowadays, people are more concerned with overclocking and so motherboards typically don't last long, 3 years at most if you're lucky.
And this in turn makes most consumer oriented motherboard makers churn up "cheap" motherboards that are flashy, hyped to death, support overlocking but whose quality is very very questionable in relation to the price asked.
Look at Asus for instance.

[FIREWALL]

I won't go cheap when it comes to a mobo.

It is the main part of a computer. Longevity and upgradeabilty and compadibility is of the utmost concern when makeing a buying decision IMHO.

All other hardware is upgradeable with the right purchase of the mobo.

For that reason I chose this mobo.

http://www.tigerdirect.com/applications/SearchTools/item-details.asp?EdpNo=4323387&CatId=4068

[goldorak]

That sure is a kick ass motherboard. :D

[Arclight]

Can't go wrong with a Gigabyte board, really. Weapon of choice for me as well. :yep:

Though I'm 1 or 2 generations behind (http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/Products/Motherboard/Products_Overview.aspx?ProductID=2744). :hmmm:

[FIREWALL]

Can't go wrong with a Gigabyte board, really. Weapon of choice for me as well. :yep:

Though I'm 1 or 2 generations behind (http://www.gigabyte.com.tw/Products/Motherboard/Products_Overview.aspx?ProductID=2744). :hmmm:


I went overboard on this mobo I know but, I knew I wanted Ci7 975 Extreme cpu and I now also run a pair of BFG 295 GTX H20's

24gb of ddr3 Dominators

All liquid cooled

Powered by a 1600 psu

I don't plan on another pure gameing rig for a long time.

My last rig had a Gigabyte mobo that took 4 hard yrs of abuse and still works.

I guess I got a little carried away with this build. After the mobo I just couldn't stop. :haha: But I count on years of trouble free gameing enjoyment. I HOPE. :rotfl:

edit: Sorry XabbaRus for OT of your thread.