VIIB vs. VIIC What is the difference?

[Shrike37]

I was just reading the SH3 manual and noticed that the VIIC was the primary Uboot of the war, an upgrade of the VIIB. However, all the stats seem to be about the same or worse than the VIIB. So what is going on? The only possible thing I can imagine is that the VIIC was used cost saving features and that is why it was built and used more than the VIIB...

Is there any real difference in game between the two boat others than the slightly slower speed and slightly faster dive time?

[BulSoldier]

VIIC has more fuel ;) i think.

EDIT: yes I the upgrades for VIIB are rather limited.

[papa_smurf]

You can install better equipment/conning towers on the VII/C.

[Shrike37]

VIIC has more fuel ;)

Is it a misprint in the manual then? It lists them both as having a 6500 nm endurance (with the VIIC having a 10nm less submerged endurance).

[mookiemookie]

If I remember right, the main upgrades of the VIIC were in the mechanical and electrical systems of the boat, making it a bit heavier than the VIIB. I don't think this is something that can really be reflected in the game and the performance of your boat, aside from the availability of upgrades. The VIIC gets more than the VIIB.

[Bent Periscope]

VIIC could travel a little further but was larger and heavier so it was slightly slower. Also, I think that they can get more of the new technology in the later years.

[RoaldLarsen]

The pressure hull of the VIIC was 1.5m longer, so they could fit in more equipment and more people to run that equipment. It had the same power plant, so the VIIC was a bit slower than the VIIB.

That extra equpment could include new or improved communication and detection equipment, better medical supplies, or more anti-aircraft ammunition.

[Jimbuna]

In gaming terms the VIIC is more upgradeable.

[Platapus]

Other than the flak upgrades/superstructure upgrades can the VIIB get all the other upgrades (engines, radar detectors and such)?

[Akmatov]

Checking a few references, other than the facts that the VIIC was a bit longer, a bit slower and drew a bit more water (all previously mentioned); the two types appear identical. One reference stated that the VIIC had 50m more diving depth, but diving depth is not commonly referenced so I don't know if that is correct. In-game both seem to have a max safe depth of 150m. One reference seemed to suggest that political or ease-of-construction factors may have been the reason for the focus on the VIIC.

I suspect that in the design work that added the extra 1.5m, some simplification for construction work was also done.

[onelifecrisis]

In-game, the VIIC can dive deeper than the VIIB (although it might not say so in the on-screen stats).

[meduza]

VIIC dives a bit faster than VIIB.

[Pohl]

I might....trade my IXB for a VIIC, but I still don't know I sure will miss the extra torpedo capacity and since I have a high renown so far I want to wait for a IXD2 or maybe the mighty XXI

[Jimbuna]

I might....trade my IXB for a VIIC, but I still don't know I sure will miss the extra torpedo capacity and since I have a high renown so far I want to wait for a IXD2 or maybe the mighty XXI

I may be biaised but I'd hang on for the IXD2 http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

[Pohl]

I may be biaised but I'd hang on for the IXD2 http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/pirate.gif

Still 1 year and 6 months for it to become avilable :arrgh!: hopefully I'll gather the renown needed for it....something near 12k and I have like 4k :stare:

[BulSoldier]

Oh how i dream of type 9 but ever since i sunk german merchant raider type 9 is just out of my reach, atleast until 42 (in witch i hope to have the fuel to go visit america :))

[Jimbuna]

Still 1 year and 6 months for it to become avilable :arrgh!: hopefully I'll gather the renown needed for it....something near 12k and I have like 4k :stare:

Oodles of time http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

[Akmatov]

i sunk German merchant raider

That is something I had never thought of. How would you know that it was a German merchant raider? They certainly would not be flying a German ensign. And if you did sink it, seems unfair that you would get spanked.

[BulSoldier]

In dark nights, with darkened ships in hostile waters.That was in norwegian waters during norwagian invasion so i guess i should have been more careful.Few days later in the same patrol i almost did it again close to scapa flow (i know weird place for german raiders) but it was day and i said to myself, lets check the flag for extra reasurence...

[Graf Paper]

If you're playing with the GWX mod, I'd say you're better off saving your renown points and skipping over the VIIC completely to the VIIC/41 (with the optional 'GWX VIIC/41 playable sub' mod enabled to get all the proper stats). The VIIB is adequate for the job until 1942, anyways, but improvements in enemy ASW technology and tactics make survival a tough proposition if you don't upgrade and the VIIB is very limited in what can be retro-fitted.

The VIIC/41 has a thicker pressure hull and can dive much deeper than either the VIIB or VIIC. I think the crush depth is around 280 meters, versus the 240 of the VIIB and 260 of the VIIC, which means you can easily dive to between 240-260 meters before you risk damaging your boat. The VIIC/42 can go even deeper still.

Going as deep as possible can save your skin when those escorts are hammering away with depth charges and locked on to your exact position with ASDIC. (If only thermoclines were modeled into the game!)

Despite the GWX subs having the historically listed deeper dive stats versus the much shallower depths in stock SH3, it's somewhat annoying to have your CE babbling away about the depth long before you actually do reach critical but that's apparently hard-coded in the game.

I guess you could look at it as your CE and Hydro/Sonar man are just being nervous old ladies. :roll:

I've never been a fan of the "Seekuh" type IX series boats, preferring the more versatile size and maneuverability of the VII series. They were nicknamed "seacows" for a reason. They do tend to steer and wallow around in the water like their namesake but those big boats do have their charms such as long-range endurance and enough eels to satisfy all but the most bloodthirsty kaleuns.

I've read that a few were even spacious enough to include freezers for keeping fresh meat and other perishables on hand for those extra-long patrols of which only the IX was capable.

[BulSoldier]

Ive always liked the late war siluete (spL?) of tyoe 9 that looks like surface ships with all of its AA guns and the allmighty 105mm :)

[Graf Paper]

Yeah, a late-war XI is an impressive sight, bristling with guns as she is.

As big as the IX/D2 was, you have to wonder why they didn't try outfitting her with a twin 88mm turret instead of the single 105mm. Then again, maybe they did try it? :hmmm:

It would have been a sight to see if the "U-Cruiser" had been produced, with those four big guns, paired fore and aft. There were even plans to copy Japanese designs for those impractical, but ingenious, submersible aircraft carriers.

For all we know about World War II, we've already lost so much knowledge about that world-shaping conflict which affects our lives over a half-century later and, likely, far into the future. Historians are constantly rediscovering new facts that requires rewriting some of the books.