Harbour Raiding

[fisherstoys1]

How many people here have taken to harbour raids to make things more interesting??

In the Medd. I got tons of warships this way, many were cruisers. In one campaign I got 12 cruisers alone.

Grant

[Redbear]

Can't say I'm a fan of that tactic - too easy to get caught in shallow water. I've done it in single missions, but never in the campaign.

[BulSoldier]

Ive done it once or twice but im not really in to it.It seems too easy and unreal.

[Pohl]

Lots of stuff to take care of...but yeah sometimes it's worthy, Gibraltar likes to have Heavy Battleships on it in mid 40, but you need to check for mines and submarine nets, even when you hit them at 2 knts the will make you flood, also don't forget the shore batteries and any destroyer that is at dock will go after you if they notice you + you need a easy way out before the entire fleet is on you, also depend on your realism settings, im playing at 7X% and having to wait 7 minutes for a torpedo to load & If I fail to sink the destroyer that is DC me....its just to risky

[Sgtmonkeynads]

He He He.......

Funny you mention this now. I found my self in a port in Norway the day before the invasion. I just dove to periscope depth and waited for a few hours before all the good guys became bad guys and sank about six mechants that were stationary.

I know...cheating...but... I know the future..so...why not use it a little?

Well, see you guys latter "I've gotta get Back in Time"

[fisherstoys1]

I think it's Algiers. But you are always get a Fiji and a Dido there.

As for the patrols I usually take a day sitting off and watching while plotting them, then when they are right I go in.

But that is only with the easy harbours some like Malta I will not touch, I think I have been sunk to many times trying.

Grant

[andym]

Dodgy old buisness Harbour Raiding,sometimes theres lots to be had and then others theres nothing at all.Recently in St Helena i got 2 Cruisers and several Destroyers and sundry vessels,but took quite a bit of damage in the process.Plenty of pickings in the area of the Straits of Gib.

[Kptlt. Siegmann]

I used to harbor raid in my earlier careers, back in the days when I didnt have 100% realism so I could "cheat" with the external cam and find the subnets and mines. Now that I'm playing 100%, I dont dare go anywhere near a harbor that isn't friendly. I dont want to be caught up in a subnet with a pack of destroyers at angle zero going flank speed:damn:

[Highbury]

Also alot of times you can, for example sink a BB in a given harbour then go and end your patrol. If you return to the harbor before a set date in the campaign files then the ship you just sank will be there again. They are set to spawn at that harbor between two set dates. Ending your patrol resets the spawns I believe. In the Pacific on SH4 I had 5 Yamato Class BBs in one career... not too realistic....

For that reason the tactic felt kinda cheap and easy so I avoid it now... unless I am almost out of fuel and haven't found anything good to shoot at! (Doesn't take long in a Type II ;))

[Bronzewing]

Back when I was last sailing a type 2 in 1939 almost every patrol ended up with a trip into hartlepool to blow up the T2 oil tanker that was almost invariably there. It seems insane that no one noticed my boat was showing up roughly once every 3 weeks and blowing up an oil tanker in the same spot every time! I carried on doing this until our flotilla switched bases and I moved up to a type VIIC.

[Torplexed]

It seems insane that no one noticed my boat was showing up roughly once every 3 weeks and blowing up an oil tanker in the same spot every time!

That's because most simulations have no strategic sense, just a tactical one. The AI doesn't care that it's losing a tanker every three weeks, because all it's prior cargo and warship losses are constantly being regenerated every time you start a new patrol. If the AI had only a finite pool of warships and cargo vessels and was programmed to worry about long-term losses, the game sure would play more realistic.

[JHuschke]

I used to do harbor raids alot, cause I love sinking ships to get alot of renown..but now I am being realistic and I'd rather patrol the grid I am suppose to like they did in WWII...have to be realistic about everything nowadays!

[Bent Periscope]

I showed us once in Loch Ewe expecting a couple aof battleships but they weren't there. I blame it on Goering's flyboys and no long believe their intel.

BP

[andym]

Raid Freetown,go on i dare you!:haha::har:

[Ancient Mariner]

Mmm heard Freetown's a tough raid,havent continued my last patrol for a few days(issues)but am currently raiding scapa flow in a Type IX in '39 I have a saved my game and if memory serves correctly am busy lining up a battleship,had a few near misses getting into the harbour too,nearly got discovered by a patrolling DD and had to run decks awash through high seas at some points where my boat would have torn her guts out on the sea bed. Hopefully this will be my 1st succesful Scapa Flow raid

[Sailor Steve]

I don't do it for the simple reason that the game makes it too easy and it wasn't done in real life. Well, once, of course, but that was the only one.

That's because most simulations have no strategic sense, just a tactical one. The AI doesn't care that it's losing a tanker every three weeks, because all it's prior cargo and warship losses are constantly being regenerated every time you start a new patrol. If the AI had only a finite pool of warships and cargo vessels and was programmed to worry about long-term losses, the game sure would play more realistic.
That was one of the things we discussed in Houston with Dan. While talking about a truly dynamic campaign we were arguing how much influence one submarine could have on the outcome of the war, when someone suggested that it would be nice if once you caused enough havock for the enemy they started rerouting convoys away from your area and started actively looking for you. Dan said he would look into the feasibility of doing that in "some future unnamed subsim".

Proper AI response to individual attacks and to ongoing warmaking is one of the main things still lacking in the game.

[danurve]

FAIL SUB
Does a harbour Raid
http://www.ananova.com/images/web/1476909.jpg

[mookiemookie]

I don't do it for the simple reason that the game makes it too easy and it wasn't done in real life. Well, once, of course, but that was the only one.

:timeout: Could it be!? Sailor "Walking Naval Encylopedia" Steve is wrong!? :03:

Prien wasn't the only harbor raider. Albrect Achilles in U-161 raided Port of Spain in 1942:

http://books.google.com/books?id=YOONXQ4tTdEC&pg=PA136&dq=achilles+port+of+spain+raid

[Brag]

On a Dare, Balz went into Southampton. Didn't see any worthy targets, took pictures and left undetected. (GWX 2.1).

[Sailor Steve]

:timeout: Could it be!? Sailor "Walking Naval Encylopedia" Steve is wrong!? :03:
More often than you may think.

Prien wasn't the only harbor raider. Albrect Achilles in U-161 raided Port of Spain in 1942:

http://books.google.com/books?id=YOONXQ4tTdEC&pg=PA136&dq=achilles+port+of+spain+raid
Good find. But the principle still stands. Going into an unprotected Caribbean port is not what people are talking about in these threads. Loch Ewe gets mentioned a lot.

[BasilY]

With 100% realism, the only harbor I dare to attack are islands with lots of deep water around. St Helena, comes to mind, You can usually find a light cruiser and a large tanker there. The other ones I can think of right now will be the two little islands off Sicily. After the capture by the allies, there are some troop ships there (that ware GWX2.1, don't know if GWX3.0 keep it).

I find attacking a major fleet port, such as lock Ewe or Gibraltar quite unrealistic. Especially Lock Ewe, If suppose a uboat did sneak into the harbor and sink a ship, round the clock air-patrol and aggressive surface search it will be impossible for it to get out the Hebrides. But then this is a game, a lot of things are pretty unrealistic.

[BasilY]

How many people here have taken to harbour raids to make things more interesting??

In the Medd. I got tons of warships this way, many were cruisers. In one campaign I got 12 cruisers alone.

Grant

See my poll earlier on this very subject.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=145990

I agree with you that there are plenty of actions away from harbor raids. On this patrol I got 7 carriers. That is much more fun than any harbor raid.

CAPTAIN'S LOG
Date and Time
Grid
Occurrences
05 Sep 1943 0235 Patrol 39
U-161, 2nd Flotilla
Left at: September 5, 1943, 02:35
From: Lorient
Mission Orders: Patrol grid ED39

28 Sep 1943

1216 ED 12 Ship sunk! M/V Eutaw Springs (Modern Tanker), 9018 tons
1216 ED 12 Ship sunk! M/V Royal Oak (Modern Tanker), 9016 tons
1220 ED 12 Ship sunk! S.S. Trego (Medium Tanker), 8701 tons
1253 ED 12 Ship sunk! S.S. Fenris (Medium Tanker), 8327 tons

04 Oct 1943

0018 DM 52 Ship sunk! S.S. Jean Jadot (Great Lakes Freighter), 1788 tons
1746 DM 52 Ship sunk! S.S. Merkur (Intermediate Tanker), 3490 tons

11 Oct 1943

1044 DB 95 Ship sunk! USS Franklin (Essex class), 27100 tons

12 Oct 1943

0219 DB 95 Ship sunk! S.S. Suderoy (Whale Factory Ship), 12016 tons
1759 DB 92 Ship sunk! S.S. Atlantic City (Intermediate Tanker), 3491 tons

14 Oct 1943

0935 DB 98 Ship sunk! USS Lexington (Essex class), 27100 tons

26 Oct 1943

0512 CC 11 Ship sunk! HMS Attacker (Bogue class), 15390 tons

27 Oct 1943

1450 BB 94 Ship sunk! HMS Tracker (Bogue class), 15390 tons
2017 BB 91 Ship sunk! USS Kalinin Bay (Casablanca class), 10400 tons

29 Oct 1943

1132 BB 91 Ship sunk! USS Breton (Bogue class), 15390 tons

01 Nov 1943

0058 BB 95 Ship sunk! USS Copahee (Bogue class), 15390 tons

13 Nov 1943 1449 Patrol results
Crew losses: 0
Ships sunk: 15
Aircraft destroyed: 0
Patrol tonnage: 182007 tons

BACK (file:///C:/Users/Derekoffice/Documents/Personnel%20Files/SH3/Georg%20Von%20Liebe/Personnel%20File%20-%20Georg%20Von%20Liebe.html)

[Zilch]

(snip)The AI doesn't care that it's losing a tanker every three weeks, because all it's prior cargo and warship losses are constantly being regenerated every time you start a new patrol. (snip)

And that, ladies and gentlemen, is why humanity will always lose a war of attrition against a mechanical foe. Just ask the Connors.