Nation States 2

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Does anyone play NationStates 2? You run your own country and deal with issues and your people, form alliances, join them, go to war, be diplomatic; all sorts. I thought it might be interesting to have a Subsim alliance.

To give you a taster, here is my country; Vulcansu. (http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/vulcansu/summary)

Its worth a go, its pretty fun! :DL

[Thomen]

Does anyone play NationStates 2? You run your own country and deal with issues and your people, form alliances, join them, go to war, be diplomatic; all sorts. I thought it might be interesting to have a Subsim alliance.

To give you a taster, here is my country; Vulcansu. (http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/vulcansu/summary)

Its worth a go, its pretty fun! :DL

mhm..
NULL

looks good... yea.. :D

[Kapitan_Phillips]

http://www.nationstates2.com/

:oops:

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/vulcansu

[UnderseaLcpl]

We have to play in the same world to play in the same instance, yes?
Does 34 even have any open spots?
Please explain a bit more.

[Kapitan_Phillips]

We have to play in the same world to play in the same instance, yes?
Does 34 even have any open spots?
Please explain a bit more.

34 is the default area for new players and has unlimited spots. I think all the worlds and continents do, its just your choice which you want to be in.

Its not a realtime game, you just set up your country and become friends/enemies with who you wish, whilst keeping your people happy and your economy running. It sounds crap but it isnt :P

[UnderseaLcpl]

I'd like to play but I don't want to mess up the registration part. Can I just pick any world to start with and move later? 34 doesn't even show up on the menu it gives me.

[Kapitan_Phillips]

I'd like to play but I don't want to mess up the registration part. Can I just pick any world to start with and move later? 34 doesn't even show up on the menu it gives me.

You can indeed pick any

[August]

I played the original Nation states getting my population up to 4 billion but I eventually let it lapse.

[JALU3]

Still have my Nation states, and am on nationstates 2.
http://nationstates2.com/g/nation/capuchino

[Raptor1]

Ah, I played the first NS a while ago, think I'll start a new nation in NS2

[UnderseaLcpl]

bump because this game is fun

[Spike88]

I think I'll have a go at it.

[UnderseaLcpl]

Cool:up: Both myself and Kapitan_Phillips are on world 34, if you're interested in his subsim alliance idea.

[Raptor1]

The Disputed Territories of Northwestern Bigfootia (http://nationstates2.com/g/nation/northwesternbigfootia) would be interested in such an alliance

[UnderseaLcpl]

Excellent. I'll set you to priority trade partner and ally status once your nation shows up on the roster. I'm on a different continent so it probably won't update until morning.

Neuropa Ltd. welcomes you http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/neuropa

[Kapitan_Phillips]

You have both been invited to the alliance :DL

[Morts]

i cant find world 34:doh:

*edit*
never mind

[Spike88]

Its a large world, with war enabled.

[Morts]

http://nationstates2.com/g/nation/morts
Yarr :D the kingdom of morts:DL

[Dowly]

Sooo... how can I declare war in this game? :D Soon you'll all be under the reign of Kingdom of Titties. *Evil laughter*

[Raptor1]

WHAT?!?!™ I'm the only environment-killing dictatorship here? How rude

[Kapitan_Phillips]

WHAT?!?!™ I'm the only environment-killing dictatorship here? How rude

Vulcansu is hot enough without all your gaseous emissions :O:

[Oberon]

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/wotsitstan

Wotsitstan!! :yeah:

[Raptor1]

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/wotsitstan

Wotsitstan!! :yeah:

Wrong world

[Oberon]

:damn:

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/wotsitstania

Take two :har:

[Raptor1]

That's better, just keep your environmentalists away from my borders

Moved myself to the Arctic, which is what I wanted from the start

[Oberon]

That's better, just keep your environmentalists away from my borders

Moved myself to the Arctic, which is what I wanted from the start

Arctic? Excellant, we can deport our political prisoners there...aka anyone who dares to question the government :yeah:

[Dowly]

Take 2 too, now in W34. :yeah:
http://nationstates2.com/g/nation/tittieso

[baggygreen]

how does one change world?

I started in world 12 (whoops), any way to move? or is it a case of begin-again?

[UnderseaLcpl]

how does one change world?

I started in world 12 (whoops), any way to move? or is it a case of begin-again?

Happened to me, too. Go to "rankings", then click browse other worlds. Select 34 and then hit join this world. You get 3 free world moves and one continent move once you arrive.

[baggygreen]

the inoffensive, centrist democracy of baggystan has now joined world 34 :)

[Kapitan_Phillips]

the inoffensive, centrist democracy of baggystan has now joined world 34 :)

"Sheep roam the roads dodging cars and amorous farmers."

:har:

[Raptor1]

So how long does it take for issues to get through the legislation thing? I have ones I answered over a day ago

[Kapitan_Phillips]

I'm not entirely sure myself actually :hmmm: A couple of things I decided on at the start went through quite fast, but these latest ones are taking a bit more time.

[Freiwillige]

Im in! Im trying out an idea of an Artic National socialists country minus all the Hitler and oppression. I call it Nazi lite :DL

[Raptor1]

Im in! Im trying out an idea of an Artic National socialists country minus all the Hitler and oppression. I call it Nazi lite :DL

So, eh, like, Nazism minus Hitler and Oppression is like...your average democracy, really

[Kapitan_Phillips]

So, eh, like, Nazism minus Hitler and Oppression is like...your average democracy, really

You havent seen Britain lately have you :O:

[UnderseaLcpl]

So how long does it take for issues to get through the legislation thing? I have ones I answered over a day ago

Usually a day to a day and a half.

[Oberon]

You bought 2.17 million units of edible underwear from http://static.nationstates2.com//flags/inline-thumb/Flag_of_Finland.png Titties (http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/tittieso) at a price of 3.04 million Florins to satisfy entertainment.


:har::har::har::har::har:

[Dowly]

Haha, was laughing at that too. :haha:

[Raptor1]

Hey, you're stealing my business!

Ah, well, oil is my real industrial strength, none of you here can match my oil production, MWAHAHAHAHA...*cough* *cough*...

[UnderseaLcpl]

You bought 1.20 million units of oil from http://static.nationstates2.com//flags/inline-thumb/Flag_of_Austria.png Northwestern Bigfootia (http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/northwesternbigfootia) at a price of 1.76 million marks to satisfy materials.


I want my money back for this shipment, it had bigfoot hair in it.

[Dowly]

I tell you... something's not right in my country... :hmmm:
You consumed 0.56 million units of your own edible underwear to satisfy food.

[Raptor1]

Wha? You think your population is wrong?

You consumed 0.41 million units of your own horses to satisfy food.

My footmen eat horses...

[Oberon]

Wha? You think your population is wrong?

My footmen eat horses...

But that means....


*dramatic chord*

You're French! :o:o:o:o:o

[Raptor1]

But that means....


*dramatic chord*

You're French! :o:o:o:o:o

*cough*

Such accusations will lead to a breakdown of diplomacy, I demand that you desist immediately!

[Oberon]

Of course, Mr De Gaulle :arrgh!:

[Raptor1]

Of course, Mr De Gaulle :arrgh!:

*reaches for the embargo button*

Are you sure you want to risk your oil supply? :O:

[Oberon]

*reaches for the embargo button*

Are you sure you want to risk your oil supply? :O:

You want to risk continuing your downward spiral into French cuisine by cutting your supply of fish? :O::haha:

[Raptor1]

You want to risk continuing your downward spiral into French cuisine by cutting your supply of fish? :O::haha:

If you will notice the charts, I imported 0.12 million units of fish from Wotsitstania, while YOU, on the other hand, seems to have bought 1.84 million units of oil from this Grand Duchy

Do the math yourself

[Oberon]

If you will notice the charts, I imported 0.12 million units of fish from Wotsitstania, while YOU, on the other hand, seems to have bought 1.84 million units of oil from this Grand Duchy

Do the math yourself

Touché :salute:

[Raptor1]

And yet another crisis has been averted with the power of intimida...err...diplomacy...

[Oberon]

And yet another crisis has been averted with the power of intimida...err...diplomacy...

:haha:
Just remember, my nation is the only thing standing between you, and this:

http://www.english.upenn.edu/Projects/knarf/Gifs/napoleon.gif

[Geno_Mariner]

Just joined today after Oberon showed me this thread :yep:

Here's my world, I couldn't think of any funny world names so I used my story universe's main planet's name for it: http://nationstates2.com/g/nation/kygoria

[XabbaRus]

OK I have joined.


Never mind

http://nationstates2.com/g/nation/xabbaramiax/summary

[UnderseaLcpl]

Never mind


Why?

[baggygreen]

My fiancee would be pleased, I'm making a motza off the italian olive oil i'm producing :D

[Rilder]

http://nationstates2.com/g/nation/attackdwarves

My nation, world 60.

[UnderseaLcpl]

Nice, but I suppose you're not willing to move such a well-established nation to 34, right?

edit- oh, I just saw your invitation to alliance caveat.

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Who is Kygoria? :hmmm:

[UnderseaLcpl]

Geno-Mariner

[JALU3]

Is there a common subsim world we can all move to, and if so will that effect your current trading you have been doing with other nations?

[Dowly]

Is there a common subsim world we can all move to, and if so will that effect your current trading you have been doing with other nations?

We have SubSim alliance in world 34.

[Dowly]

Yaayy, I sold sheep for over 10 million. :yeah:

[Raptor1]

You are also my main oil export for the day, I hope you aren't doing anything disgusting with it...

I wonder what our Alliance leader is doing that his economy is so weak though

[Dowly]

You are also my main oil export for the day

Dont count on that. I found me a big nation that sells anything from lumber to firearms to ballistic missiles to enriched uranium. In fact, he was the one that bought all them sheep.

I wonder what our Alliance leader is doing that his economy is so weak thoughWas thinking the same thing. :hmmm:

[UnderseaLcpl]

Is there a common subsim world we can all move to, and if so will that effect your current trading you have been doing with other nations?
As Dowly said, we are on 34 for the time being, although we could always got to another world if everyone wanted to. And yes, moving to 34 will sever your trade with nations on your current world.


I wonder what our Alliance leader is doing that his economy is so weak though


Too much government spending too early on.

[Geno_Mariner]

Who is Kygoria? :hmmm:

My nation :D I completely failed to think of a funny name for my nation XD So I resorted to the name of my story universe's main planet, Kygoria :doh:


EDIT: Lol, I sold a lot of Scooters to Oberon.

[Rilder]

Nice, but I suppose you're not willing to move such a well-established nation to 34, right?

edit- oh, I just saw your invitation to alliance caveat.

Umm doesn't really matter but can you even move worlds?

[Rockstar]

I sent off a request to subsimlandia. No subs yet but I do have land you can place missles on and deep water harbors.

[JALU3]

I have moved, and sent an alliance request

[UnderseaLcpl]

Umm doesn't really matter but can you even move worlds?

Yes. Just go to browse nations, select "browse nations in other worlds", select world 34, and then select "move to this world"

You get 3 free world moves if you are a non-ambassador nation. Ambassadors get unlimited moves. Once you arrive on 34, you can change continent once.

[UnderseaLcpl]

I'm posting this here as well as the alliance forum to get our member nations to sit up and take notice of what just happened.

Essentially, two nations just decided that everyone else is bound by law to sell their goods at garage-sale prices.
I think that in proposing this law, JALU3 probably had good intentions, but he's going to hurt smaller nations, especially those that produce very common goods, or that already have weak economies.

I'm proposing some discussion and possible modification to the bill here:
http://www.nationstates2.com/g/forums/thread/24078455

[Raptor1]

I tend to agree, limiting us to priority with the entire alliance means we can't make our own trade agreements outside it properly

KP should also get those Alliance offices established

Oh, life in Northwestern Bigfootia is great now if someone wants to immigrate


Following new legislation passed in Northwestern Bigfootia, religious people are quickly renouncing their faith as the government hunts down and kills "those crazy heretics".

State execution is one of the most common causes of death in Northwestern Bigfootia.

The nation's leader has recently been awarded the title Supreme Dictator for Life.

Environmental protestors are being rounded up and taken away in sinister black vans as a massive land development campaign gets underway.

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Oh, life in Northwestern Bigfootia is great now if someone wants to immigrate

Are you Subman's brother? :o:haha:

[JALU3]

I'm posting this here as well as the alliance forum to get our member nations to sit up and take notice of what just happened.

Essentially, two nations just decided that everyone else is bound by law to sell their goods at garage-sale prices.
I think that in proposing this law, JALU3 probably had good intentions, but he's going to hurt smaller nations, especially those that produce very common goods, or that already have weak economies.

I'm proposing some discussion and possible modification to the bill here:
http://www.nationstates2.com/g/forums/thread/24078455

I have already replyed in game. My intention was that everyone within the alliance be able to trade, and have diplomatic levels, that were as equally favorable to all within it. That is, we all provide to the others within the alliance the goods which they need, at the lowest price. That means, they are able to have more funds to spend on items that one cannot get within the alliance, with those nations who are outside it. What's the term, the economy of shared quantity?
However, I do agree it should have been passed within more than 2 of 10 total member nations. Thus as I responded, that maybe in the future all legislation must be cosponsored by 1/2 of total member nations +1 member nations in order for legislation even to be proposed, thus it would pass, if all cosponsers vote yes, automatically upon being put up to a vote.

[JALU3]

Since we allowed to nominate our own nations to offices in the alliance, I have nominated myself to be the Alliance Chief. :haha:

[Raptor1]

Since we allowed to nominate our own nations to offices in the alliance, I have nominated myself to be the Alliance Chief. :haha:

No, you haven't, you only made a post in the forum about that...

Or maybe I just don't see it until it updates...

[JALU3]

I did make a post about it, but I also didn't saw where the nation Northwestern Bigfootia was elected to be elevated to the Head of Foreign Affaris, or that it was agreed that such an office be created, other than that there be elected officials, at it did not say what those offices were, what their responsibilities be, and for what terms, in any legislation.

And nominated...

I have proposed the following law under the name 'The Subsim Alliance' passage of legislation into law act

Whereas, the Intermember Relations Act was passed with only two votes

Whereas, the Intermember Relations Act was only up for a vote for less than 48 hours

Whereas, the Intermember Relations Act did not have any vetting prior to being put up to a vote

Be it enacted by the governments of the member nations of ‘The Subsim Alliance’ that,

Section I. Legislation Rules
A. Legislation Proposal
1. All legislation proposed must have been posted in ‘The Subsim Alliance’ for at least 7 days in order for it to be brought to a vote.
a. The title of the legislation proposed shall be formatted as follows: “Legislation Proposal – (Name of Proposed Legislation)”
2. All legislation proposed must have at least one cosponsoring member nation in order for it to be brought to a vote.
a. If the legislation proposed does not receive a cosponsor within 7 days, it cannot be opened to a vote.
b. The legislation proposed text must be amended in order for it to be repurposed.
B. Voting
1. The time limit by which legislation proposed are open to a vote shall be no less than the time it takes for at least one half of member nations of to have placed a vote in regards to the legislation proposed, but no more than 14 days from the day which the vote began.
2. No legislation proposed may be enacted into law for ‘The Subsim Alliance’ without a simple majority (1/2 total member nations +1) having voted yea

Section II. Ratification of Legislation Rules
A. Effective date.
1. This legislation shall take effect immediately upon being passed.
B. Retroactive enacting.
1. All legislation enacted into law prior to this legislation shall be abolished as a law.
2. All legislation enacted into law prior to this legislation shall immediately and without amending of text be proposed according to these rules.

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Since we allowed to nominate our own nations to offices in the alliance, I have nominated myself to be the Alliance Chief. :haha:



TRAITOR!

[JALU3]

TRAITOR!

Who died and made you king? No one. That's right, uhuh, you heard me, I did it. Democracy Represent! :|\\

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Who died and made you king? No one. That's right, uhuh, you heard me, I did it. Democracy Represent! :|\\


I made you! :stare:

[Lagger123987]

Well, I don't play this, but my little brother have a whole set of nations.

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/****

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/peep

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/janitiors

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/poiuytrewqlkjhgfdsamnb

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/zxcvbnmlkjhgfdsaqwerty

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/glerjgkljerwklgjweklgj

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/5469469846468464864684

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/egnq

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/9812u4ioeqwurklasjfdxz

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/klasdjflasjdfiojweaifo

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/agregeageargaegreragae

Talk about managing business!

[Raptor1]

Well, I don't play this, but my little brother have a whole set of nations.

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/****

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/peep

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/janitiors

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/poiuytrewqlkjhgfdsamnb

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/zxcvbnmlkjhgfdsaqwerty

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/glerjgkljerwklgjweklgj

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/5469469846468464864684

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/egnq

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/9812u4ioeqwurklasjfdxz

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/klasdjflasjdfiojweaifo

http://www.nationstates2.com/g/nation/agregeageargaegreragae

Talk about managing business!

Looks like he completely missed the roleplaying point of the game...

[JALU3]

I made you! :stare:

Haha, not, have had this nation for quiet a long time before the alliance was ever established. You forget that.

[UnderseaLcpl]

I voice my support for Kapitan_Phillips and Vulcansu to continue their tenure as Head of the Alliance for the time being.

I don't have any real argument as to why what is basically a third-world nation should lead the alliance other than that it was KP's idea, and he's a smart guy, even if his country is....still developing. :DL

I would also like to voice my support for the Subsim Alliance Act. I would have preferred that a 2/3 majority be required to pass legislation, but I don't think NS2 includes that feature.
I think that this act will make the legislative process more balanced, and it does not contain flagrant spelling errors:O:

[Oberon]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/telegraph/multimedia/archive/00675/mahmoud-ahmadinejad_675904c.jpg

I, the leader of the Holy Empire of Wotsitstania also pledge my support for Kapitan Phillips and Vulcansu to be the leader of the Subsim Alliance.

[Raptor1]

JALU! Now you screwed up the whole alliance

Fix it, now

[JALU3]

JALU! Now you screwed up the whole alliance

Fix it, now

How did I screw it up?
I abolished positions that were not agreed upon, I asked for legislation to codify alliance positions. I added a description to the alliance, and allowed all members to invite new members, edit the alliance description, and alliance history .. and have increased the voting time for to 7 days so all players, daily and casual have a fair amount of time to cast a vote on proposed legislation.

[Raptor1]

The positions were agreed upon, they just haven't been put to the vote to keep them flexible, and I didn't see anyone complaining

Besides, the alliance description doesn't fit the game at all

Oh, and everyone could invite people before too...

[JALU3]

The positions weren't agreed upon just because you proposed them. I placed a counter proposal, and no action was taken.

All members may edit the desciption, so if you don't like how it is presently, by all means please make the edits you see fit.

This is the reason why I have proposed the legislation that is presently up for a vote, so that way there was a process by which all member nations can have a say in legislation proposed, have a chance to vote on legislation brought up to a vote, and what not.

Why must you be so angry, simmer down, slow your roll, and enjoy the game.

[Oberon]

Stop arguing and fix my economy :O:

[Geno_Mariner]

My economy isn't that good either XD

[UnderseaLcpl]

Stop arguing and fix my economy :O:

Here's your problem right here:

Economic Freedoms: Below Average

[Oberon]

Here's your problem right here:

But...if I give them freedom they might take out bank loans! :doh:

Thanks for the heads up though, I'll have to push through some legislation to free up the market abit. Also performing an experiment with trade statuses, see what that nets me. :shucks:

[Kapitan_Phillips]

It seems I need to bolster energy imports/production :hmmm:

[Rockstar]

Seems NS2 is going to be O.O.C. for the month of July. And here I was just now figuring out what buttons to push. Btw how does one 'bolster' particular areas of the economy?

.

[Raptor1]

Seems NS2 is going to be O.O.C. for the month of July. And here I was just now figuring out what buttons to push. Btw how does one 'bolster' particular areas of the economy?

.

Only through Issues at this point, though they said they will make it so you can choose which industries to invest in later on

[UnderseaLcpl]

Speaking of issues and industry, has anyone positively identified any particular issues that lead to the creation of new industries?

I'm still stuck with my first 3, all the other non-poor nations have 4, Dowly has 5 somehow......


In other news:

Poiuytrewqlkjhgfdsamnb has requested to join the alliance. Apparently it's Lagger's brother. Admit?

[Raptor1]

Speaking of issues and industry, has anyone positively identified any particular issues that lead to the creation of new industries?

I'm still stuck with my first 3, all the other non-poor nations have 4, Dowly has 5 somehow......


In other news:

Poiuytrewqlkjhgfdsamnb has requested to join the alliance. Apparently it's Lagger's brother. Admit?

I've had one that doubled my oil output on the start (Something about bulldozing the Bigfoot's homes to make way for new drills), and then I had one that gave me a choice of entertainment industry (Went with dancing monkeys, maybe not the best choice)

[UnderseaLcpl]

I guess I'm just unlucky then. I keep getting dumb issues like whether or not sirens are too loud. I end up just dismissing quite a few of them because they ask me to make decisions that the government has no place in making, or do not provide an acceptable choice.

[Dowly]

I have no idea how the technology advances work. Most of my issues have been totally irrelevant and shouldnt give any technology advances. :hmmm:

[UnderseaLcpl]

I have no idea how the technology advances work. Most of my issues have been totally irrelevant and shouldnt give any technology advances. :hmmm:

Yours is a special case. Everything, including industry, is attracted to Titties. Everyone knows that:O:

[Lagger123987]

Speaking of issues and industry, has anyone positively identified any particular issues that lead to the creation of new industries?

I'm still stuck with my first 3, all the other non-poor nations have 4, Dowly has 5 somehow......


In other news:

Poiuytrewqlkjhgfdsamnb has requested to join the alliance. Apparently it's Lagger's brother. Admit?

Yeah, it's my litte brother, I don't play this since I'm sucking up on Sh3/4 and Wings over series.

[Task Force]

This looks intresting.

[Oberon]

http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/2728/ehwhat.jpg

:hmmm: :dead:

[Raptor1]

I think you need to buy some guns from my newfounded weapon industry, how dare those miners complain?

[Dowly]

Wait, you still dont have anything else to produce than those 3?? I just got my 6th thingie; cars. :D

[Oberon]

Yeah, just the three at the mo, it's pretty much at random on how the questions will appear, although they might have come through and I've not picked up on them. :haha:

[UnderseaLcpl]

Wait, you still dont have anything else to produce than those 3?? I just got my 6th thingie; cars. :D


I finally got a fourth industry: lumber
Just my luck I get something with such a low commodity price. :shifty:

The more I play this game, the more I think that it was designed by people with no understanding of free-market economics. They don't even have a finance industry, and the value of currency is universal per denoted unit.

Most of the issues I get are things that no self-respecting "Capitalist Paradise" would even consider. Funding for the arts, for instance. No I would not provide it, nor would I lower it, nor raise it, because there is no reason why that should be a state function at all. Unfortunately, there is no option to let the free market regulate art, or healthcare, or religion, or business, or the military, or welfare, or any of the other sectors. The best I can do is dismiss the issue, and I have a feeling that consistent support or denial of issues of a certain type affects which industry choices you get (i.e. I got lumber because I refused to allow the public sector to interfere with private lands, repeatedly)

I hope that they fix these issues when they do the overhaul in July.

[Raptor1]

I finally got a fourth industry: lumber
Just my luck I get something with such a low commodity price. :shifty:

The more I play this game, the more I think that it was designed by people with no understanding of free-market economics. They don't even have a finance industry, and the value of currency is universal per denoted unit.

Most of the issues I get are things that no self-respecting "Capitalist Paradise" would even consider. Funding for the arts, for instance. No I would not provide it, nor would I lower it, nor raise it, because there is no reason why that should be a state function at all. Unfortunately, there is no option to let the free market regulate art, or healthcare, or religion, or business, or the military, or welfare, or any of the other sectors. The best I can do is dismiss the issue, and I have a feeling that consistent support or denial of issues of a certain type affects which industry choices you get (i.e. I got lumber because I refused to allow the public sector to interfere with private lands, repeatedly)

I hope that they fix these issues when they do the overhaul in July.

They did say they were going to be fixing much of this until the beta ends...somewhere...

[UnderseaLcpl]

They did say they were going to be fixing much of this until the beta ends...somewhere...

Well, I applaud them for their beta testing methods. There is no better way to discover bugs than to test the product on a large group of people over a significant period of time, but I think that the issues they are wanting to fix have little to do with the economic model. As long as economy system is broken, this is going to be a broken game, given the premise.

[Raptor1]

Well, I applaud them for their beta testing methods. There is no better way to discover bugs than to test the product on a large group of people over a significant period of time, but I think that the issues they are wanting to fix have little to do with the economic model. As long as economy system is broken, this is going to be a broken game, given the premise.

This is what they're working on now from their FAQ




1) War - directly battle other player nations
2) Occupation - occupy nations that you have conquered, and mould their citizens for awhile
3) Enhanced espionage - spy on your friends and enemies and make sure their not cooking up any nastiness for you.
4) Better issues - we're working on expanding the issues mechanism to allow for issues that are more relevant to your immediate problems. These issues could do things like check if your people are starving, address the trade deficits with your partners, or even ask you to deal with the arms build-up of neighboring nations.
5) Finer-grained industry control - Decide directly if you need to pump money into an industry, or abandon industries that are a drain on the economy - all without having to wait for the relevant issues to come up.
6) Industry efficiency - Currently all your industries are operating at 100% efficiency. Don't get used to it, they won't be for long. MWA HA HA!

Make what you will of it

The game isn't supposed to be some crazy economic simulator too...

[HunterICX]

http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/2728/ehwhat.jpg

:hmmm: :dead:

Mmm...there is something extremly fishy about that...

HunterICX

[Kapitan_Phillips]

http://img188.imageshack.us/img188/2728/ehwhat.jpg

:hmmm: :dead:

lol at Margaret Thatcher

[UnderseaLcpl]

lol at Margaret Thatcher

Says the third-world country :DL

[baggygreen]

yeh, 3rd worlder.

back away from my massive GDP, i'd hate to have to go all economic on yours arses!!:x

:shucks::O:

[Kapitan_Phillips]

3rd world my arse, people are still flocking to Vulcansu because they hate y'all's nonsense :haha:

[Dowly]

yeh, 3rd worlder.

back away from my massive GDP, i'd hate to have to go all economic on yours arses!!:x

:shucks::O:

:haha::haha:

[Raptor1]

3rd world my arse, people are still flocking to Vulcansu because they hate y'all's nonsense :haha:

Flocking with what? It says here people can't even reach the stores...

...I heard about the things GDP withdrawal can do to a mind...

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Yeah alright mate. People are happy, you run your own country :03:

:haha:

[baggygreen]

...I heard about the things GDP withdrawal can do to a mind...Have ya heard about the types of pain that such a massive GDP as mine can do to a behind?!:woot:

In all seriousness though, I have no idea how its so high, but hey I aint complaining!!

[UnderseaLcpl]

*bump* for an important alliance issue.

We need to elect a new leader. My nominations are for JALU3, due to his actual, competent, effort to develop some sort of framework for this alliance, and Baggygreen, because of his nation's obscene GDP. (If there is one thing Neuropans respect, it is money:DL Go Capitalist Paradise!)

[Raptor1]

*bump* for an important alliance issue.

We need to elect a new leader. My nominations are for JALU3, due to his actual, competent, effort to develop some sort of framework for this alliance, and Baggygreen, because of his nation's obscene GDP. (If there is one thing Neuropans respect, it is money:DL Go Capitalist Paradise!)

Nah, JALU is just trying to impose useless legislative barriers on the alliance, I'll vote for Baggy though

[UnderseaLcpl]

Nah, JALU is just trying to impose useless legislative barriers on the alliance, I'll vote for Baggy though

I don't think he is. I think he's just trying to do things properly. He has been more than willing to compromise in the past.

Besides, you're one to talk about legislative abuse, Mr. Compulsive-Consumerist State:O::DL

[JALU3]

As I see it, the alliance right now is a vehicle for which we as Subsim members can come together as a unified force when making policy with other players. RIght now each individual member nation is acting on its own within and outside of the alliance, as each nation-state should be allowed to do, unless they voluntarily enter into a pact which to do so with.
I would rather have our alliance be slow to build (as far as the joint actions are concerned), rather than having anything come up that hasn't been read, at least supported by another member state, and agreed by at least a majority of total members. Otherwise, any member state that wishes to pull a quick one on the legislative floor could do so, and declare us all sub-states of their own (for example), thus why I proposed the legislation that provides a system which to pass legislation in a fair manor, and cleared all previous legislation, including my own that passed.

[Raptor1]

*facepalm and mumbles something about the inefficient democracies and environmentalists*

[baggygreen]

Tremble before my GDP, ladies!

200.44 MILLION!

That little capitalist paradise only wishes they could be so successful :O:

[Raptor1]

My main exports, guns and oil, capped, so my economic growth ain't what it used to be... :cry:

[baggygreen]

Fish is mine.

and them big nations have gotta eat:salute:

[Stealth Hunter]

Tried to get into NS2 about a month ago...

Annoyed the hell out of me. It's not the kind of simulation I was looking for.

[Oberon]

It's not the kind of simulation I was looking for.

http://2.bp.blogspot.com/_4C_tSMqS810/SZmZ_nkErQI/AAAAAAAADQM/Rc8OVX5iBPY/s400/Daniel+Dennett+and+atheism.JPG

[Oberon]

Guess who is enriching uranium?

http://img108.imageshack.us/img108/5990/9906ku3.jpg

"Theyvium Hadicus Weetibixia!"

[Task Force]

QUICK someone press the nuke oberon button.:rotfl:

[Raptor1]

My economic freedoms flipped up to 'World Benchmark', first time I see that level...

[UnderseaLcpl]

My economic freedoms flipped up to 'World Benchmark', first time I see that level...

I had that for a little bit, too, but then after dismissing two issues, it went back down to superb. I think it's based on other nations, rather than a fixed scale. Now, if I could just get my government type to stop changing to corporate bordello every once in while....


In other news, we should probably embargo Oberon. Not so much because of the Uranium thing, but because he's dangerously close to surpassing my GDP. :DL

[Raptor1]

Hell, Oberon might enrich uranium...but he needs Northwestern Bigfootian Ballistic Missiles to use it! MWAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

https://jspivey.wikispaces.com/file/view/2007.08.17icbm.JPG

[baggygreen]

In other news, we should probably embargo Oberon. Not so much because of the Uranium thing, but because he's dangerously close to surpassing my GDP. :DL
ahem...

:O:

[Oberon]

:D

Interestingly my cap on fish appears to be 40.0, and yet yesterday I produced 42.33 :hmmm:

Never mind, the glow sticks are growing :yeah:

Come to think of it, I think I'm the only one here with such a high GDP who isn't a Democracy :haha:

http://img72.exs.cx/img72/3682/politicalmap5tf.jpg

[Raptor1]

Hey, I'm only 30 million behind!~

[JALU3]

I voice my opposition to the following legislation that has been put up to the vote, the legislation being “Missile Shield Spending”.

The Legislation was not properly vetted, nor did it follow the course of action outlined by the "'The Subsim Alliance’ passage of legislation into law act" which states clearly how legislation is to be proposed, seconded and debated prior to it even being brought up to the vote.

Although I believe such an alliance law is noble, and worthy endeavor, such blattent disregard of the rules agreed by us as an alliance in attempting to carry out such joint action is neither noble or right.

May the nation of Vulcansu propose the legislation in the manor previously agreed to, may we work on it together, and upon finding legislative language we can agree upon, put that future legislation up to a vote.

[Raptor1]

The rules were not agreed on by the alliance, they were voted in by a minority, and thus nullified by themselves

[JALU3]

Do you disagree that the "'The Subsim Alliance’ passage of legislation into law act" was passed by the majority of those voting member nations of 'The Subsim Alliance' and created a system and rules by which future legislation was to be proposed, debated, voted on, and by what amount of vote said future legislation had to be passed by?
Furthermore, do you disagree that prior to the passage of the "'The Subsim Alliance’ passage of legislation into law act" that no rules of order were established for how legislation was to pass?

[Raptor1]

Do you disagree that the "'The Subsim Alliance’ passage of legislation into law act" was passed by the majority of those voting member nations of 'The Subsim Alliance' and created a system and rules by which future legislation was to be proposed, debated, voted on, and by what amount of vote said future legislation had to be passed by?


Yes


Furthermore, do you disagree that prior to the passage of the "'The Subsim Alliance’ passage of legislation into law act" that no rules of order were established for how legislation was to pass?

No

[JALU3]

So you agree that no rules were in place prior to "'The Subsim Alliance’ passage of legislation into law act". Well that's a start.

Since no rules were in place, there was no established rules saying how legislation was passed or proposed.

Do you agree to the fact that the majority of voting nations voted in favor the aforementioned legislation?
Do you agree that the aforementioned legislation had text which establisehd rules for passing future legislation after it?

[Raptor1]

So you agree that no rules were in place prior to "'The Subsim Alliance’ passage of legislation into law act". Well that's a start.

Since no rules were in place, there was no established rules saying how legislation was passed or proposed.

Do you agree to the fact that the majority of voting nations voted in favor the aforementioned legislation?
Do you agree that the aforementioned legislation had text which establisehd rules for passing future legislation after it?

Don't be ridiculous, if you pass a law, it needs to be established by it's own criteria. If I didn't know better I would say you are trying to sabotage the alliance's function...

[JALU3]

What I am trying to do is establish, through the legislative process, the rules by which our alliance is to pass new legislation. That was the attempt of the aforementioned legislation, so that no alliance law maybe passed without majority of the total membership voting yea, and a bill requiring a period of review before being put up to a vote.

I am not trying to as you say, sabatoge the alliance's function, if anything I am attempting to give the alliance's legislative functions rules by which it is to run by; something that in real life, legislative bodies need to establish, prior to even passing the first laws which it effects the political entities they are to legislate for.

To quote UnderseaLcpl
I don't think he is. I think he's just trying to do things properly. He has been more than willing to compromise in the past.

Yet, you still don't answer my most recent questions to you.

Do you agree to the fact that the majority of voting nations voted in favor the aforementioned legislation?
Do you agree that the aforementioned legislation had text which establisehd rules for passing future legislation after it?

[baggygreen]

My GDP says:

too much big words:know:. show me the money!

[JALU3]

What money? 'The Subsim alliance', does not have any funds of its own, nor does it collect taxes or dues from its member nations.

Let me give you examples of rules used by real life legislative bodies.
United States House of Representatives (http://www.rules.house.gov/bills_details.aspx?NewsID=4116)
United States Senate (http://rules.senate.gov/public/index.cfm?FuseAction=HowCongressWorks.RulesOfSenat e)
Canada House of Commons (http://www.parl.gc.ca/compendium/web-content/c_a_index-e.htm)

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Taking this WAY too seriously :haha:

[Raptor1]

The purpose of this alliance is not to entrench itself in huge legislative barriers, you need to let it function efficiently

Bah, useless democracies...

[JALU3]

If this alliance does not take it self seriously, what is its point?

Raptor, you had stated before that you do not want legislation being passed without a majority of member nations, thus the legislation that was passed, and written by myself, created such a rule, and abolished all previous alliance laws that didn't go through the new rules, thus providing the alliance a clean slate.

[Raptor1]

If this alliance does not take it self seriously, what is its point?

Raptor, you had stated before that you do not want legislation being passed without a majority of member nations, thus the legislation that was passed, and written by myself, created such a rule, and abolished all previous alliance laws that didn't go through the new rules, thus providing the alliance a clean slate.

Yes, I agree with that part, but not with practically all of the rest of that law, there's no need to nullify other laws which were passed by a majority, there's no need to remove the alliance offices, and there's certainly no need to deliberate a law before it's put to a vote...

[UnderseaLcpl]

Raptor, you seem to be under the impression that the Subsim Alliance act is null and void because it did not meet its' own half+1 voting criterion. That is simply not true. It passed under what was an acceptable system at the time, so it grandfather clauses itself.

That said, I also think there is also a need to deliberate laws before they are put to a vote. Allowing members time to discuss and amend a law before voting on it is both more effective and efficient than simply having everyone vote against everything because there is some small part of it they do not like. If JALU's last bill had been devised under such a system, you might have had the opportunity to change it.

If you are really worried about legislative barriers, you should be supporting JALU's attempts at drafting proper laws. Open-ended legislation like this missile defense thing is wide open to exploitation of all types, including the appropriation of a certain nation's ballistic missiles to be repurposed for missile defense. :DL

[Raptor1]

Bah, you democracies lack understanding...

Oh, and you're welcome to use my ICBMs any way you wish as long as you pay for them, there's plenty enough for missile defense and complete nuclear annihilation

[Raptor1]

Reports from Northwestern Bigfootia indicates everything necessary to produce and launch nuclear weapons has been perfected, enriched uranium will now be exported to the highest bidder...

[Stealth Hunter]

reports from northwestern bigfootia indicates everything necessary to produce and launch nuclear weapons has been perfected, enriched uranium will now be exported to the highest bidder...

I'LL GIVE YOU SIX MILLION PESOS!:D

p

[Oberon]

Reports from Northwestern Bigfootia indicates everything necessary to produce and launch nuclear weapons has been perfected, enriched uranium will now be exported to the highest bidder...


ICBMs are expensive, in the Holy Empire of Wotsitstania, we fall back on tried and tested methods:

http://www.cncgames.com/arsenalpics/l_demo.jpg

"My truck is loaded!"

[Raptor1]

Economic Freedoms now at "Excessive"

You are not allowed to sneeze in Northwestern Bigfootia, but go ahead and open a sneeze factory!

Top that, democracies (Especially you, Mr. Capitalist Paradise)

[UnderseaLcpl]

I'd say I'm topping it quite nicely. My gdp is 10 million higher than yours and I only have half as many indutries as you do. It's just a matter of time before I get some more industry issues and then I'll be leaving you in the dust:O:

[Task Force]

And he has nukes... he could make you country go BOOM!

[Raptor1]

I'd say I'm topping it quite nicely. My gdp is 10 million higher than yours and I only have half as many indutries as you do. It's just a matter of time before I get some more industry issues and then I'll be leaving you in the dust:O:

Not the GDP, the economic freedom! You silly democracies pride yourself in all that sort of "freedom" nonsense after all...

Either way, much of my industries are counter-productive, preventing the progress of others and bringing the GDP overall. IMO it's better to have a small amount of large industries. (Also military and police spending is huge, you can guess why)

But then, to get economic freedoms, I have to consent to every whim of the neighbourhood capitalists, so I get this many industries...

[UnderseaLcpl]

The difference between your economy and mine is that while we both choose pro-industry legislation, I never endorse any legislation that subsidizes industries. My country actually has more economic freedom than yours because the state doesn't pick winners, allowing everyone to compete fairly. :smug:
What good is prosperity if no one gets to enjoy it?

[Raptor1]

The difference between your economy and mine is that while we both choose pro-industry legislation, I never endorse any legislation that subsidizes industries. My country actually has more economic freedom than yours because the state doesn't pick winners, allowing everyone to compete fairly. :smug:
What good is prosperity if no one gets to enjoy it?

I never subsidize industries, I just force the population to be good capitalists, and the rest of the population to buy their products...

[UnderseaLcpl]

I don't force anyone to do anything so Neuropa is still more free.:O:
And you did subsidize the media once, but I have to admit that I didn't see much else. Nice work!

[baggygreen]

I'm a bit worried now lance, your GDP is growing!!:salute:

Perhaps together we wealthy nations can come to some arrangement for the betterment of our populations at the expense of others...:up:

[UnderseaLcpl]

I'm a bit worried now lance, your GDP is growing!!:salute:

Perhaps together we wealthy nations can come to some arrangement for the betterment of our populations at the expense of others...:up:

Unfortunately, it's about to stop growing if I don't get another industry soon. The last non-capped product I have is olive oil, and that will cap tommorrow. You might have to continue your march to dizzying heights of prosperity without me for a time. :wah:

Once I catch up, however, I think that between the two of us we can probably work something out. Using mostly change I found in the sofa, and with a small investment from your government, I think we can buy the entire population of Vulcansu and sell them to Raptor.:DL

[Raptor1]

Buy the population of a third-world country...Alright, I think we can do business

[Raptor1]

Unfortunately, it seems that NationStates 2 is dead (http://nationstates2.com/)

[UnderseaLcpl]

Unfortunately, it seems that NationStates 2 is dead (http://nationstates2.com/)

Yes, I noticed that some time ago and assumed everyone else had as well.

IIRC, you're deserving of some congratulations for being the #1 GDP in the subsim alliance at the end. Baggy gets the runner-up for being number two and an official commendation for holding on to the #1 spot for so long and by such a large margin. My beloved Neuropa falls in at a solid #3:cry:(damn the random issue generator!:damn:)
Between the three of us, we could have bought most of the alliance in cash.:rock:Also, IIRC Northwestern Bigfootia was on the top ten leaderboard for economic freedoms. Very nice:up:

Honorable mentions include Jalu3's state of Capucino for his administrative skills, even when they were unappreciated, and Dowly's Kingdom of Titties just for being awesome;)

It was a fun game and a nice alliance, but we'll have to find some other venue for our megalomanical ambitions:woot:

[Raptor1]

I moved back to NS1 and created a new nation (My old one got deleted years ago), though it doesn't have all the fancy GDP and trade stuff

Of course I also took advantage of the turmoil to annex the Northeastern part of Bigfootia from the oppressors too

http://www.nationstates.net/nation=northern_bigfootia

[UnderseaLcpl]

I won't be playing NS1. The game lacks too much depth for my taste, but I wish your nation well. :salute:

[Raptor1]

Actually NS1 has much of the same depth as NS2 or more, most of it is just used behind the scenes to calculate what issues you're getting (NS2 was completely random), but there are offsite calculators that can get all that data

Here's mine for example, a few stats are missing, probably because I just made my nation

http://nsdossier.texasregion.net/main.aspx?nation=northern+bigfootia

[UnderseaLcpl]

Wow, that is a lot more in-depth than I had thought. Perhaps I will make an NS1 country after all :hmmm:

[Oberon]

http://images.smh.com.au/ftsmh/ffximage/2009/01/29/Ahmadinejad_narrowweb__300x402,0.jpg

The Holy Empire of Wotsitstania denies allegations that it was our nuclear weapons program that killed NS2, we were nowhere near it, it was like that when we got there.

[Geno_Mariner]

http://images.smh.com.au/ftsmh/ffximage/2009/01/29/Ahmadinejad_narrowweb__300x402,0.jpg

The Holy Empire of Wotsitstania denies allegations that it was our nuclear weapons program that killed NS2, we were nowhere near it, it was like that when we got there.

:rotfl: