Question about the deck Gun

[Schütze]

Guten tag, fellow Kaleuns!

My compliments to everyone involved in making Silent Hunter III closer and closer to a true Das Boot experience. :salute:

I have rather two questions but the deck gun is my most vital question for know. It seems like a lifetime since i (and we) could perhaps sank the whole Royal Navy with the deck gun alone. Remember in stock Silent Hunter III prepared with 200 plus shell shot plus the extra 200 panzer breaking plus the light shot with the ship sinking just after a 10 shot or so, dependless of were the shot hit.

Enjoying my time as a commander know (U-48, Wegener flottile) equipped with GWX 3.0 gold and SH3 Commander it seems like a whole new game and with the possibility of having NONE benefits with the deck gun, which is more closer to the historical accuracy. As i have understand it, the deck gun was mostly used during the early period in the war when the Sub commanders were bound to the prise regulation. And you have guessed it correct, i want to be as much close to the history as possible.

My question then: How were the deck gun used and how long were the reloading? I have read every book of Clay Blair and his "Hitlers Uboat-war" and despite some few comments in the first book there isn´t much infomation about the Deckgun. It is said that the deck gun is a "fastshooting-fastreloading 8.8 cm" and that could motivate the four second reloading time but somehow i can´t belive it. I have also read that the ammunition was stored under deck and this is what you have to take into account when guessing the actual reloading-time, unless the crew weren´t prepared with all of the ammunition and had removed it from under deck before the shooting. Via SH3 Commander i have set the reloading time to 20 sec taking into account the time of removing the ammunition under deck and the reloading-time but i don´t know if im historical correct with it, but sure wan´t to be close to it.

Using the deck gun seemed like a process not in a hurry. It took f.ex Kapitänleutnant Bleichrodt a whole lot of hours and the whole ammunition store to sank a ship (can´t remember which one) close to the American east-coast.

[Jimbuna]

The debate on reloading times for deck guns is a popular one.

The link below suggests an experienced crew could fire 15-19 rounds per minute.

I should imagine that is in perfect conditions....without taking into account weather conditions, boat stability etc:

http://www.uboataces.com/tactics-deckgun.shtml

[Schütze]

Thanks Jimbuna! I guess i am to lazy to find this out myself :up:

[Laufen zum Ziel]

Good question.

[Jimbuna]

Thanks Jimbuna! I guess i am to lazy to find this out myself :up:

If you look around the forum you'll come across many excellent links to naval warfare topics, not just U-boats. http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

[Sailor Steve]

The 8.8cm gun could indeed be loaded in 4-5 seconds. The problem is that any small vessel is subject to variations in the waves, and a submarine more than some others. The guns are hand-cranked, and once the proper elevation is set for the range required, the gun captain has to wait until the boat is perfectly flat, what they called "firing on the roll". This can be several more seconds even in a supposedly 'calm' sea, and as the wind picks up the problem only worsens.

I keep my 8.8cm set to 10 seconds and the 10.5cm set for 12. This has always felt about right to me for a calm sea. As the weather worsens I order 'Hold Fire' until I feel the proper time has passed, then I let them shoot one.

But that's just me.

[UnderseaLcpl]

As usual, Steve has the best answer. :O:

I prefer to fire the deck gun myself in GWX 3.0. The crew gets too proficient at it, especially if the watch officer has a gunnery qualification.
I figure the gun crew would only be as good as I could train them to be, so with the increased reload times and compensating for rough seas, using myself as the yardstick for deck gun performance is the most realistic. Plus I like shooting it.

The stock 4-second reload time is a bit short, imo, but don't underestimate how quickly a well-trained gun crew can work. I've seen 155mm M198 howitzers reload and adjust fire in about ten seconds, and they have to swab the breech first and use bigger shells, and put powder bags in the breech, and place the primer. Admittedly, though, that is on land.
20 seconds seems too long to me, because there was a relay system for passing shells up, and even 120mm shells can be manhandled more quickly than that using a human chain.

[evan82]

Little info about "Deck Guns":
http://www.uboat.net/technical/index.html

[Schütze]

Thanks guys!

20 seconds is a bit long i agree but then i hadn´t not a clue about how the deck gun was used (except for now). Given that i read that the ammunition was stored under deck i counted with the time taken from removing the shells to the crew plus that extra four seconds of reloading. Plus that even the shortest waves could delay the moment given that a submarine of type VIIB was very vurnerable to every wind or weather condition.

[owner20071963]

Try the Multiplay Website,
Members Virbally help :salute:

[McHibbins]

As usual, Steve has the best answer. :O:

I prefer to fire the deck gun myself in GWX 3.0. The crew gets too proficient at it, especially if the watch officer has a gunnery qualification.
I figure the gun crew would only be as good as I could train them to be, so with the increased reload times and compensating for rough seas, using myself as the yardstick for deck gun performance is the most realistic. Plus I like shooting it.

The stock 4-second reload time is a bit short, imo, but don't underestimate how quickly a well-trained gun crew can work. I've seen 155mm M198 howitzers reload and adjust fire in about ten seconds, and they have to swab the breech first and use bigger shells, and put powder bags in the breech, and place the primer. Admittedly, though, that is on land.
20 seconds seems too long to me, because there was a relay system for passing shells up, and even 120mm shells can be manhandled more quickly than that using a human chain.

But keep in mind : M198 crews have a stable platform.....:hmmm:

[Schütze]

My personal preferences is that the crew should do the shooting with my second officer leading the way, you wouldn´t imagine a Kaleun man the deck gun by himself? But i am just obsessed with the realism so this is strictly subjective.

I motivate it with follow:

1) It is damn cool standing on the turm and seeing it flashing up with the 8.8 cm plus the extra noise i imagine it to be. When firing during nights and pitch black, this is an extra dimension. Very realistic indeed.

2) Handing the shooting over to my team i could navigate the submarine easier and watching the horison after potential destroyers. I have the feeling that my watch officer discover and inform about the hunting destroyer very, very later than he SHOULD thus making us loosing important time for escape.

Just my two cent.

[sunvalleyslim]

My personal preferences is that the crew should do the shooting with my second officer leading the way, you wouldn´t imagine a Kaleun man the deck gun by himself? But i am just obsessed with the realism so this is strictly subjective.

I motivate it with follow:

1) It is damn cool standing on the turm and seeing it flashing up with the 8.8 cm plus the extra noise i imagine it to be. When firing during nights and pitch black, this is an extra dimension. Very realistic indeed.

2) Handing the shooting over to my team i could navigate the submarine easier and watching the horison after potential destroyers. I have the feeling that my watch officer discover and inform about the hunting destroyer very, very later than he SHOULD thus making us loosing important time for escape.

Just my two cent.

And a good two cents too......:yeah: It's just you can't trust the team to get the job done as well as yourself. Have hoped they could get the job done, only to find my career ended way too short.....:salute:

[Sailor Steve]

I used to man the deck gun back in the SH1 days, because the gun crew couldn't hit the Shinano at 50 yards. One day I finally realized that that was probably a lot more realistic than my ability to hit a sampan at 5000 yards, almost every time!

Today I always let the gun crew do their job.

[UnderseaLcpl]

But keep in mind : M198 crews have a stable platform.....:hmmm:

I said that:O:

Admittedly, though, that is on land.

[kaptkirkU4467]

Back in my younger days I could load a 105mm tank cannon in under 4 seconds,...but if the monster was going down the tank trail it becomes a game of hit the jumping hole.

10 seconds sounds right for a boat on water.

[BasilY]

Being a avid deck gunner (in SH3), I will frankly admit I have NO idea what my reloading time is. I play with default GWX3.0 settings, and I haven't seen any reason, (nor want to create any my myself) to change any of the settings.

The GWX3.0 team have done a very balanced job, within the limitations of the SH-3 engine.

[droid002]

When checking my ammo (key i) everything looks fine but when I order my men to fire the deck gun they say that there is no ammo.

The AA works...

How can I fix this?

[mookiemookie]

When checking my ammo (key i) everything looks fine but when I order my men to fire the deck gun they say that there is no ammo.

The AA works...

How can I fix this?

Assuming you're running GWX, you must manually click the HE shell icon to load the ammo into the gun before firing. Have you done this?

[Platapus]

As Steve et al have already posted, there is a big difference between the questions

1. How fast can the crew fire the deck gun

2. How fast can the crew fire the deck gun accurately.

To fire the gun accurately, I would imagine that 20 seconds is not totally unreasonable. The gun may be able to operate much faster. I imagine that if accuracy was not a concern a good crew could fire it every 5 seconds... but they would miss.

[TarJak]

There are a couple more parameters that need to be added into the equation.

How fast can the ammo be passed from the locker into the conning tower hatch and then onto the gun?

[Sailor Steve]

There are a couple more parameters that need to be added into the equation.

How fast can the ammo be passed from the locker into the conning tower hatch and then onto the gun?
Also a good point. My research on surface ships over the years has turned up the interesting phenomenon that, unless the loading system is fully automated, there is always a difference listed in rates of fire before and after ready-use ammo is exhausted, with the latter usually being about two-thirds of the former. If it has to come from a remote source, rate-of-fire decreases dramatically.

[BulSoldier]

Ive set mine to 7 seconds, i guess i should atleast double it.