Patty Murray does something right for once- Gov should pay for troops injured in Iraq

[SUBMAN1]

Obama wants to make Vets pay for their own medical care when injured in combat? WTF? Seems that plan is dead on arrival though:

http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/03/...nce/index.html (http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/03/10/veterans.health.insurance/index.html)

-S

[Frame57]

Sure! free unlimited health care for illegals, but a citizen and wounded combat veteran must pay. Sounds like a perfect MO for the liberal agenda.

[baggygreen]

Lefty-righty arguments aside for a minute, please gentlemen.

I want to know, seriously and concisely, what logic is used behind an idea like this. How do the proponents of such an idea justify it?

I'd genuinely like an answer, to try and understand the reasoning and logic behind it. And please, I don't want 'because they're leftists yada yada, I want a proper response.

Please.

Thankyou.

[Frame57]

I cannot speak on the behalf of the insane because it takes one to know one. But I am sure if you read the link it, you will see the sane side of the story. NOTHING in the realm of sanity could justify this. Short enough for ya?

[baggygreen]

Ta frame :D

I was hoping more that (again, without getting into a dumb lefty vs stubborn righty debate) some of the more liberal leaning members might be able to shed light on possible reasons or explanations. Does, for example, Enigma agree with the plan, and for what reasons? Or our Irish mate Tribesman? Do they have any insight as to what can be seen in the idea, what merits might it have that i as a more right-leaning individual can't see.

By looking to understand how one another from "rival sides" arrive at their decisions, we can look for mutually acceptable solutions to all sorts of problems, right round the world.

[Frame57]

All I do know is that the bill has not been presented yet, but apparantly must have been drafted because all the veteran affiliated organization are up in arms about it. What could be their motivation? Dunno...Save money I guess, but then why continue to allow non citizens access to medical care that has already shut down hospitals in LA? :salute:

[Enigma]

You rang? :03:

As stated above, no bill has been introduced as yet, and I'm skeptical. I can't ignore the possibility of political maneuvering here. The GOP is much better than the Dems when it comes to that game. Also, I couldn't comment now because I wouldn't be making any kind of educated statements about it. But, my interest is engaged, and I'll do some reading. On the bare surface, I cant tell you I wouldn't agree with this plan at all as presented here....

[Enigma]

By the way Baggy, I appreciate your post. The tone, choice of words etc. Sincerely. We need more of that around here.

[Aramike]

Actually, I would consider this plan IF in included full payment of veteren's premiums and deductibles by the Fed. Wouldn't that then allow veterans to have full control over their healthcare choices at no cost to them?

[AVGWarhawk]

Actually, I would consider this plan IF in included full payment of veteren's premiums and deductibles by the Fed. Wouldn't that then allow veterans to have full control over their healthcare choices at no cost to them?

Good point! This is not a lefty/righty debate as Baggy said. It is a do the right thing debate and it should be a short debate at that.

[Enigma]

Actually, I would consider this plan IF in included full payment of veteren's premiums and deductibles by the Fed. Wouldn't that then allow veterans to have full control over their healthcare choices at no cost to them?

Interesting point...

We're gonna have to wait and see how this thing plays out.

[baggygreen]

Enigma, it boils down to the fact that trying to learn from - for want of a better word - your enemy, is far better than trying to do this :damn:

Besides, I feel myself we're all facing something far worse than the divided western politics, but thats another matter :yeah:

Actually, I would consider this plan IF in included full payment of veteren's premiums and deductibles by the Fed. Wouldn't that then allow veterans to have full control over their healthcare choices at no cost to them?My question to this one, is if it were implemented, could/should there be some form of restriction on the range of care? What I'm trying to get at is that if the Feds covered premiums etc, the vet may choose the absolute top care in the country. Whether or not it is their right is a slightly different matter, but it would surely be a potential situation. Which would cose the feds large sums of money. In which case, could not that cash be better spent making sure that the existing scheme provides the absolute best care that your nation can provide?

[Aramike]

My question to this one, is if it were implemented, could/should there be some form of restriction on the range of care? What I'm trying to get at is that if the Feds covered premiums etc, the vet may choose the absolute top care in the country. Whether or not it is their right is a slightly different matter, but it would surely be a potential situation. Which would cose the feds large sums of money. In which case, could not that cash be better spent making sure that the existing scheme provides the absolute best care that your nation can provide?First off, I think our vets should receive the top care. That being said, why not make it like any other employer coverage? I mean, maybe not cover boob-jobs and other cosmetics, but why not the rest?

[Digital_Trucker]

You rang? :03:

As stated above, no bill has been introduced as yet, and I'm skeptical. I can't ignore the possibility of political maneuvering here. The GOP is much better than the Dems when it comes to that game. Also, I couldn't comment now because I wouldn't be making any kind of educated statements about it. But, my interest is engaged, and I'll do some reading. On the bare surface, I cant tell you I wouldn't agree with this plan at all as presented here....
To quote the linked article

Veterans Affairs Secretary Eric Shinseki confirmed Tuesday that the Obama administration is considering a controversial plan to make veterans pay for treatment of service-related injuries with private insurance.
So, how would the Republicans be involved if the Veterans Affairs Secretary confirmed it? Is he not appointed by the President?

[baggygreen]

First off, I think our vets should receive the top care. That being said, why not make it like any other employer coverage? I mean, maybe not cover boob-jobs and other cosmetics, but why not the rest?Is that not already the case at the moment? I just assumed that it was, but that it was all funded by either your military or your vets affairs branch..

[geetrue]

All I do know is that the bill has not been presented yet, but apparantly must have been drafted because all the veteran affiliated organization are up in arms about it. What could be their motivation? Dunno...Save money I guess, but then why continue to allow non citizens access to medical care that has already shut down hospitals in LA? :salute:

I saw a special news show on LA hospital care ... they release patients that can't pay the bill with cash or insurance. They drive them downtown to skid row and drop them off still in their hospital gown.

As for veterans the last time I checked for help was several years ago, but they want to know how much money you have at a VA hospital when you check in and if you have over a certain amount you are billed according to some strange rules on how much of the charges belong to you.

No money and you still have to wait, but at least they don't charge you. I even worked at a VA hospital in La Jolla, California as records nurse, all I did is flag the records as the doctor made changes for the regular nurse.

An injured veteran in conflicts like the last seven years should get special care without charge, even more alarming are the series of sucides in the armed forces on duty.

Somebody besides Obama has to step up to the plate for the veterans sake.

[Enigma]

So, how would the Republicans be involved if the Veterans Affairs Secretary confirmed it? Is he not appointed by the President?

Are you asking me if he's appointed by the President??

A little projection there. I'm aware of Shinseki's involvement. I'm just saying the politics of the issue are not non-existent.

[Digital_Trucker]

So, how would the Republicans be involved if the Veterans Affairs Secretary confirmed it? Is he not appointed by the President?
Are you asking me if he's appointed by the President??

A little projection there. I'm aware of Shinseki's involvement. I'm just saying the politics of the issue are not non-existent.
No projection, just being a smart-ass (it's what I do:salute:), and, no, I wasn't asking any questions except for what political maneuvering is being done since the only mention of a Republican was one who agreed with the Democrat that the proposal wouldn't get anywhere. Perhaps I misinterpreted what you said.

[Frame57]

All I do know is that the bill has not been presented yet, but apparantly must have been drafted because all the veteran affiliated organization are up in arms about it. What could be their motivation? Dunno...Save money I guess, but then why continue to allow non citizens access to medical care that has already shut down hospitals in LA? :salute:

I saw a special news show on LA hospital care ... they release patients that can't pay the bill with cash or insurance. They drive them downtown to skid row and drop them off still in their hospital gown.

As for veterans the last time I checked for help was several years ago, but they want to know how much money you have at a VA hospital when you check in and if you have over a certain amount you are billed according to some strange rules on how much of the charges belong to you.

No money and you still have to wait, but at least they don't charge you. I even worked at a VA hospital in La Jolla, California as records nurse, all I did is flag the records as the doctor made changes for the regular nurse.

An injured veteran in conflicts like the last seven years should get special care without charge, even more alarming are the series of sucides in the armed forces on duty.

Somebody besides Obama has to step up to the plate for the veterans sake.I am rated at 30% disabled by the VA and I have never been asked how much money I make. I have had a few invasive proceedures at VA Frisco and martinez CA. I never paid a dime for any of it. The only thing I pay for is a 5 dollar per prescription co pay. I bet the people they released on skid row were homeless people. But not for one second would it be an illegal because the ACLU would sue the crap out of that hospital.