Qualifications: what do you do?

[Steeltrap]

There's another thread about promotions/decorations, and it occurred to me the other aspect of crew management is qualifications.

I'm interested in hearing what you choose to do in terms of qualifications: what do you have in your boat, and in what order do you acquire them?

FYI, here's the other thread: promotions (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=148247)

[A Very Super Market]

I always make a shakedown patrol, and then use that to make a second machinist. Why would there only be one? After that, I go to the radioroom, followed by torpedoes, watch, repair and control room. I will give one man "medic" status with SH3 commander, but never deck gun or flak. I'm just a VIIC guy I guess.

[GoldenRivet]

in terms of qualifications... well here is what i do.

For starters... the crew managment in SH3 is 100% grade A garbage.

In real life aboard a ship you have a schedule, some men rest or get some recreation while others work.

this RR/Work schedule is something to the order of 3, 8 hour rotations.

unless you play almost strictly in the crew screen this is almost impossible to do efficiently.

so here is a solution.

1. use SH3 Commander and turn off fatigue.

2. In each engine room i have to machinists, and the rest regular sailors

3. aft quarters... one regular sailor, 1 officer with torpedo/watch and repair qualifications... the rest torpedo petty officers.

4. Forward quarters, 1 deck gunner, the rest regular sailors

5. on the bridge, 3 sailors, one watch qualified petty officer, and one officer with the torpedo/repair/watch quals

this seems to work best IMHO

[Annatar]

I usually get a second machinist, then a radio/sonar guy, then a Torp qualification, as above. After that I like to get an officer qualified in Watch, Flak and Gunnery. He's no use when submerged but it's nice to have everything together on the surface just in case.

Medics are something I rarely seem to have. Most injuries my crew have suffered have been instantly fatal so I've never seen the use. Repair is another one that I'm pretty lax with. It's usually one of the last qualifications I pick up. I don't think I've ever picked up a helm/navigation qualification past the one at game start. That must be the most useless of the lot.

[Weiss Pinguin]

Usually the first guy I qualify is another machinist for my 2nd Engine watch. Then I roll a dice to decide between radio/watch/torpedo. I don't usually grab repair qualification for anyone, and the only medics I have aboard will be medic-qualified officers.

Of course, with SH3 Commander, I can just qualify people as I see fit without going through SH3's award-rationing business.

[kdv]

Using commander, how do you get a crewman qualified? Nothing seems to work?

[Weiss Pinguin]

Just go into the Manage Your Crew screen and drag qualifications into the 'Qualifications' section of your crewmember's descriptions.

Note that the quals and awards you give your crew via SH3C won't show up ingame, but they do get all the benefits.

[Pioneer]

I take a different approach, I look for what I don't have.

The first patrol is the shakedown, work out who I have and where I want to put them as I go. Upon return I always examine what's available on transfer. If I can get an officer with the same qualification plus another, budget to take him.

I try to match the qualifications to where I want them, example: my watchman is also my torpedo man. Between the helm and engines I try to balance two with the same qualifications. My third, usually the highest experience as the Weapons Officer, is helm/gunner/ and either watch or machinist. This is because I use fatigue in SH3Commander.

With the crew I have two machinists who relieve each other, two torpedo men who spend their times playing cards in their bunks, ready to go when it's time. Sonar and radio are serviced by three who consistently alternate, one of them is either the gunner or the flax gunner.

When staff transfer out, the priority is to replace. I had an officer with 900 experience on my 8th patrol with qualifications helm/gunner/machinist transfer and in return I got a fresh officer with repair. He never even made it to the dock, I had him replaced that same day...at great expense.

16th patrol, no deaths, no injuries. Oh happy times.

[Robert Fulton]

Qualification is an aspect of SH3 that has much unrealized promise. Having or lacking a skilled watch officer, chief engineer, doc, mechanic, navigator, radioman, and etc. made an enormous difference in RL. Not everyone in the service could keep a boat in trim in tough circumstances, remove a bullet, spot a DDE in bad weather, or identify a target from the sound of its screws. And like anything only a few were truly outstanding. It is one of my wishes that future sims will realize more of the potential for simulating crew skills & crew management.

Meanwhile, my thoughts on qualification for officers are that Watch is the most important; two qualified watch officers is a must. After that the Machinist has a large positive affect on the green bar, but I cannot say that I know what practical value this has. Torpedoman and Gunner give faster reload times which is useful. Repair and Medic fall into a separate class; they are not often needed, but when they are they can be vitally important, especially Repair. Putting that altogether, I like to have my one Helmsman combined with Repair and the other (are we always dealt two helmsmen?) combined with Medic. Gunner combines well with Torpedoman because if you surface for an artillery attack, torpedo reload, even if required will not be time critical. One noteworthy factor is that the officers on a VII are constantly affected by fatigue. In order to keep from being overwhelmed by this, two must almost constantly be resting in quarters. This leaves only three officers fit for duty most of the time. With one on watch and one at the helm, this leaves only one to cover all the other duty stations, including Navigator, Torpedoes, and Engines, not to mention Repair if needed. Keep this in mind when allocating qualifications. If and when you can award a German Cross in Gold, this situation will be mitigated, as it negates fatigue for the recipient.

For the NCOs, I believe Radioman is the top priority. Even if as I do you man the hydrophone personally to find targets and threats, a good Radioman is valuable in tracking contacts. And if you have map updates enabled he will identify targets for you. Next in value is a Watch PO. It is not possible to fill the green bar without one, even if you have a qualified Watch Officer. Assuming the Medic PO speeds fatigue recovery it is very useful to have one permanently in the forward quarters. Since the engine compartment is always operating and alway tiring the crew, I dedicate the stern quarters (Type VII) to rotating with the engine compartments. Thus it is useful early in career to have two Machinists and later four. Meanwhile Torpedomen speed up reloads, but I have not seen the need for more than the two or three that one gets dealt initially. The Repair mechanic is not needed often, but can mean the difference between the pumps keeping up or not, so get one when you can afford it.

I have left Flak Gunners for last because it depends on personal preference. Most Captains prefer to dive when aircraft are spotted, and this is a sound practice. But in the first year of the war, a qualified Flak PO can shoot down his share of Hurricanes. And even later on, you will be happy to have one if you get caught on the surface.

[TheDudTorpedo]

My preference is firstly to qualify my Watch Officer as 'Watchman' (obviously), Torpedoman (for use in reloading during submerged attacks), and as 'Flak Gunner' during aircraft attacks - this makes him useful almost all the time.

[mookiemookie]

I go for funkers (radiomen) first as being able to hear targets while making hydrophone checks is very important to me.

I usually can put together a watch crew that fills the efficiency bar up all the way, even without a watchman qualification. I use the "realistic crews" feature in SH3 Commander and that usually includes a watch qualified officer or bootsman anyways.

Same goes for helmsmen, as I can usually fill the bar up all the way even without a helms qualified crewman.

I fill up with machinists and torpedomen as needed.

I generally skip the deck gunners, as I like to man the gun myself. Same for flak gunners as I just crash dive when I see a plane anyways. Later on in my career I may take one for emergency insurance, but I definitely don't make it a priority. I skip medics as I can't remember the last time I ever had an injured crewman. They're usually dead if anything, and if I'm getting dead crewmen that means I'm usually dead myself.

[Steeltrap]

Under NYGM, you need a medic as you often get injured crew from strafing attacks from aircraft should they get to you before you dive.....quite annoying, really: I don't see how they can hurt you/damage your hull with cannon/.303 mgs, but that's how it is...

[Jazer]

Just go into the Manage Your Crew screen and drag qualifications into the 'Qualifications' section of your crewmember's descriptions.

Note that the quals and awards you give your crew via SH3C won't show up ingame, but they do get all the benefits.

My additions thru SH3 Commander show up in game, even the quals I give to regular sailors. That's weird!

[A Very Super Market]

The seamen won't get any benefits from qualifications, but it's useful for logging what men are in what station.

And its very possible to penetrate your pressure hull with aircraft mounted guns.

[JScones]

Note that the quals and awards you give your crew via SH3C won't show up ingame, but they do get all the benefits. Hmmm, that's not quite what it says on page 17 of the SH3 Commander User Guide. :hmmm:

[irish1958]

Medics are something I rarely seem to have. Most injuries my crew have suffered have been instantly fatal so I've never seen the use.

Currently working on a mod to give the Medic (sorry Pen) some balls

[tomfon]

Note that the quals and awards you give your crew via SH3C won't show up ingame, but they do get all the benefits. Hmmm, that's not quite what it says on page 17 of the SH3 Commander User Guide. :hmmm:

:haha:

Quals for the officers will always show up.
Extra Quals (i.e. more than one) for the petty officers won't show up.
Quals (no matter how many) for the sailors won't show up...

As far as i can remember.

:salute:

[irish1958]

Note that the quals and awards you give your crew via SH3C won't show up ingame, but they do get all the benefits. Hmmm, that's not quite what it says on page 17 of the SH3 Commander User Guide. :hmmm:
:haha:

Quals for the officers will always show up.
Extra Quals (i.e. more than one) for the petty officers won't show up.
Quals (no matter how many) for the sailors won't show up...

As far as i can remember.

:salute:
Yes they do; they just have no effect. RTFM

[Jimbuna]

Yep, using SH3Commander and giving the PO's and Crew 3 qualifications each (the max allowed) means only the first assigned to a PO is taken into account and none of the Crew make any difference at all.

What does work every time is the additional stamina and experience they obtain at the end of each patrol.

[tomfon]

Note that the quals and awards you give your crew via SH3C won't show up ingame, but they do get all the benefits. Hmmm, that's not quite what it says on page 17 of the SH3 Commander User Guide. :hmmm:
:haha:

Quals for the officers will always show up.
Extra Quals (i.e. more than one) for the petty officers won't show up.
Quals (no matter how many) for the sailors won't show up...

As far as i can remember.

:salute: Yes they do; they just have no effect. RTFM


Yes you're right. I just messed things up. Memory failure and i have RTFM.:timeout:

[Redbear]

I normally go for the radio/sonar qual first. Maybe a machine qual next. I've tried the gunnery qual, but haven't seen much improvement in skill, so I've pretty much given up on it. Always get a repair qual or two before I get too late in the war - I know I'll need it eventually! Then I just fill in back-ups for them all as best I can.

[Chisum]

I'm interested in hearing what you choose to do in terms of qualifications: what do you have in your boat, and in what order do you acquire them?
At first, radio & detection crew.
It's essential.

At second Security, it's essential to.

About the officer I build quickly an officer who is specific specialist for watching(the gold star) Guns and FLAK.

This is my 3 priority.

[KeptinCranky]

About the Medic...

It's true that crewmen (and officers) are more likely to end up dead than injured, but I've seen it happen ocassinally, the medic helps a lot with getting the injured crewman ready for duty again, this is especially important if it's your watch officer who got injured

Injured (and panicked) crew (the ones with red exclamation points) are ready for duty all the quicker for having a qualified medic on your boat...

There is a downside though, because even if the medic miraculously patched up your crewman's injury, he will not receive a "verwundetenabzeichen" when you get back to base. The only way to get that medal in SH3 is to return to port while the crewman is still injured....which seems needlessly harsh to me...:88)

If crewmen get injured, and that happens a lot because I don't crashdive for every plane, especially when I have a big Flakvierling taking up space on the back of the boat, I normally give them a verwundetenabzeichen using SH3 commander

[irish1958]

Actually, in my testing, the medic has little or no effect in getting rid of the red exclamation point next to the icon of the affected crew member due to fatigue or low morale (at least in vanilla SH3, NYGM mod and Grey Wolf mods). His only real effect is on the injured crew, and it is a major effect. This was not implemented in SH3 or SH4 and the medic has as much effect on the game as a bull without his equipment does in a cow pasture. (Sorry Pen).
In real life, patrols had an average of three incidents involving the health and well being of the crew per patrol. Many patrol were aborted due to accidents, injury and/or illness (at least in the USN). I don't read German well, but a few patrol reports I have read show about the same level of problems in the U-Boats.
Unfortunately, I have access only to the USN Pacific medical reports of the patrols.
I really hope our mod is successful as it will add a bit of realism to the game.
The working title of our mod is "the medic really has balls." (Sorry Pen)

[Chisum]

The working title of our mod is "the medic really has balls." (Sorry Pen)

A mod ?
Compatible GWX 3.0 ?
Where can I found it ?

[Jimbuna]

The working title of our mod is "the medic really has balls." (Sorry Pen)

A mod ?
Compatible GWX 3.0 ?
Where can I found it ?

Here....allow me to pick you one :DL :03:

http://www.mothersover40.com/files/animated_bloke_scratching_balls.gif

[difool2]

Jimbuna I'd say that's brig material-I'd edit it quick if I were you... :doh:

[Chisum]

Lol Jim, you are in manual mod !
:D

[Hanomag]

1st patrol return, I max out the sonar man give him every medal and promote him.

That way I can give the radio operator the day off.... for the remainder of the war! (oh.. the immersion):salute: