Boliva close to civil war ... please pray

[geetrue]

Please pray for my missionary friend in Boliva ... the unknown war.

Rocky just sent me this email yesterday:

Men of faith,

We could well be entering civil war. 20,000 Cuban regulars backed by Venezuelan advisers are on the ground. Russian support is in the waters of Venezuela. According to the Swiss Embassy there were 40 trucks of Bolivian Army personnel cut off when Bolivian opposition blew a bridge. Bolivian opposition is boasting a 60,000 man militia. The death toll continues to rise as fighting is reported to be going on in the northern department of Pando, Boliva.

God bless,
Rocky

[Oberon]

Yowch...that looks to get real nasty real quick. I'll keep your friend in my thoughts Gee.

[August]

Yeah let's all pray, I'm sure it's gonna solve the crisis in no time :up:

What an incredibly insensitive thing to say.

[Digital_Trucker]

Yeah let's all pray, I'm sure it's gonna solve the crisis in no time :up:

:nope:

My thoughts and prayers are with your friend, too, geetrue.

[SUBMAN1]

Yeah let's all pray, I'm sure it's gonna solve the crisis in no time :up:
What an incredibly insensitive thing to say.But typical out of him.

Hey Geetrue, Hope he pulls through man.

-S

[Mush Martin]

:|\\ Capzap where are you ?

[JoeCorrado]

Yeah let's all pray, I'm sure it's gonna solve the crisis in no time :up:
What an incredibly insensitive thing to say.

All we "can" do is pray. It's not like the United States Military is in any position to intervene even in our own back yard. We can't assist our brave soldiers in Afghanistan in their hour of need- how are we going to do anything for Bolivia?

Pray for a change in Washington- pray for Obama to be elected president.

[Skybird]

"Missionary friend" ?

Is he trying to help by treating ill and wounded people in a hospital or building infrastructure, informing on agriculture or teaching children in schools how to write and read an doing math - or is he trying to spread his religion, founding a church and preaching?

In case of the first I hope he makes it in one piece, no matter his beliefs. In case of the latter: I simply don't care .

I will not be liked for being blunt and writing that. On the other hand - maybe I also do not like everything I need to read.

[Sailor Steve]

Pray for a change in Washington- pray for Obama to be elected president.
Equally insensitive. Do we have to bring our personal politics into this?

[JoeCorrado]

Pray for a change in Washington- pray for Obama to be elected president. Equally insensitive. Do we have to bring our personal politics into this?
The leader of the free world... is a politician.

Hate to break it to you but the next president will decide the direction of our country and perhaps that of Bolivia as well-

What we have today in Washington is the reason that these things like Bolivia are happening in our own back yard so to speak while "our attention" is focused half way around the world and on countries like Georgia instead of countries like Bolivia.

It is a matter of policy and the policy has been wrong headed and our countries focus and attention has been misplaced.

We could well be entering civil war. 20,000 Cuban regulars backed by Venezuelan advisers are on the ground. Russian support is in the waters of Venezuela. According to the Swiss Embassy there were 40 trucks of Bolivian Army personnel cut off when Bolivian opposition blew a bridge. Bolivian opposition is boasting a 60,000 man militia. The death toll continues to rise as fighting is reported to be going on in the northern department of Pando, Boliva.

The "civil war" that you speak of is of a "political nature" so please- do not accuse me of bringing my politics into the debate when the thread is clearly one of politics, and of praying. I urge both... pray for a change and MY preferred change starts in Washington with our own commander in chief.

[Sailor Steve]

Joe, everything you say may be true, but the guy asked us to pray for his friend. And that's all his asked for.

I ceased to be a praying man years ago, but I do sincerely hope it turns out alright for him. And that's all I'll say on this thread.

[Frame57]

Any opportunity to attack someones religion huh guys? Why bother to post such snide remarks when the man simply asked for prayer for his friends. You should be ashamed of yourselves!:nope:

[JoeCorrado]

Any opportunity to attack someones religion huh guys? Why bother to post such snide remarks when the man simply asked for prayer for his friends. You should be ashamed of yourselves!:nope:

And who's religion was being attacked? You create McCain's campaign ads or is it simply coincidental that you make things up, throw the "stuff" against the wall and "pray" something sticks??

I suggest that you see the original post of the thread. He spent 6 words asking for prayers for his friend and then included a full paragraph from HIS FRIEND who went on at comparative length discussing the reason such prayer is necessarry. That description of events on the ground in Bolivia is a legitimate part of this thread.s initial post.

If he did not want comments about the description regarding the events in Bolivia that were the motivation in his request for prayers... to somehow "change" the facts on the ground there... then he should have left those comments out of the original post.

I responded to that portion of the original post and stand by my comments. I also stand by the fact that my comments were relative and proper tp the original post. You may disagree but please spare me your dubious indignation that I have been somehow improper.

All he asked for was a little prayer, eh? I suppose you missed this part then.


Rocky just sent me this email yesterday:

Men of faith,

We could well be entering civil war. 20,000 Cuban regulars backed by Venezuelan advisers are on the ground. Russian support is in the waters of Venezuela. According to the Swiss Embassy there were 40 trucks of Bolivian Army personnel cut off when Bolivian opposition blew a bridge. Bolivian opposition is boasting a 60,000 man militia. The death toll continues to rise as fighting is reported to be going on in the northern department of Pando, Boliva.
You ask that I NOT respond to the comments posted DIRECTLY from the man we are supposed to pray for as he describes the reasons that such prayers are needed? That is a little selective, don't you think?


I ceased to be a praying man years ago, but I do sincerely hope it turns out alright for him. And that's all I'll say on this thread.
I'll pray. I'll keep Rocky in mind and hope that he stays safe. But I will also work for change to prevent these situations from spreading and engulfing more than just Rocky or just Bolivia. I'm kind of a pragmatic sort of guy.
__

To the original thread starter- thanks for bringing this issue to the forefront. It deserves more attention on the nightly news because it has been very quiet concerning events in Bolivia these days.

[Skybird]

Any opportunity to attack someones religion huh guys? Why bother to post such snide remarks when the man simply asked for prayer for his friends. You should be ashamed of yourselves!:nope: Keep thy religion for thyself. Don't expect respect if you make your holy idea a fairground attraction with which you go peddling.

My question was honest and straight. If the guy is down there to help in real deed and action like I described, fine, no complaint. If he is about arrogantly thinikng it is up to him to missionize foreign people into his beliefs (and i met such kind of people in North Africa for sure), then it would be better for all if he never went down there.

So what kind of guy is he? My original question stands.

[Frame57]

I think you both just like to hear yourself speak. Banter somewhere else!:nope:

[SUBMAN1]

I think you both just like to hear yourself speak. Banter somewhere else!:nope:I second that.

-S

[Skybird]

I think you both just like to hear yourself speak. Banter somewhere else!:nope:
That's a deal on reciprocity.

[Thomen]

I think you both just like to hear yourself speak. Banter somewhere else!:nope:I second that.

-S

third'ed (if that even exists)

Good luck to Rocky.

[UnderseaLcpl]

My prayers go with your friend geetrue, that no harm may come to him, and that he may be a refuge for those around him.

[AntEater]

20.000 Cubans???
Where the hell should they come from?
Cuba, obviously, but I'm not sure they have that many regulars left in their army.
Also, I didn't read anything about a "night flight to Angola" style air lift recently, not to mention that Cuba maybe has the capability to airlift some tourists around the island, but certainly not to do such an operation.

Sorry, but that whole thing smells like american right wishful thinking.

[Skybird]

20.000 Cubans???
Where the hell should they come from?
Cuba, obviously, but I'm not sure they have that many regulars left in their army.
Also, I didn't read anything about a "night flight to Angola" style air lift recently, not to mention that Cuba maybe has the capability to airlift some tourists around the island, but certainly not to do such an operation.

Sorry, but that whole thing smells like american right wishful thinking.
:up:

Same thought here, I just have bitten my lips. One controversy at a time seemed to be enough. :)

[Frame57]

There are medical missionaries. One I support and am proud to is called Operation smile, they do great work world wide. I also support James Robison who is a christian and brings fresh water and food to countries, even though he preaches the gospel that communist and most liberals hate, he brings life saving things to those countries. I applaud both because both do great work. I believe that 90% of food and medical supplies that go to third world countries come from this predominantly Christian land. I think Jesus said, "If you give even a cup of water to these little ones, you will not lose your reward..." The reward itself is in being able to give...:yep:

[DeepIron]

It's not like the United States Military is in any position to intervene even in our own back yard.
Well, isn't that what Chavez, Morales and the Russians would like to see?:shifty:

Thoughts and prayer go out to your friend and the all innocent people involved in this...

[SUBMAN1]

There are medical missionaries. One I support and am proud to is called Operation smile, they do great work world wide. I also support James Robison who is a christian and brings fresh water and food to countries, even though he preaches the gospel that communist and most liberals hate, he brings life saving things to those countries. I applaud both because both do great work. I believe that 90% of food and medical supplies that go to third world countries come from this predominantly Christian land. I think Jesus said, "If you give even a cup of water to these little ones, you will not lose your reward..." The reward itself is in being able to give...:yep:Some people here would have no missionaries at all and let these people starve or die of curable diseases. Heartless, but typical of the Darwin crowd. They can't explain helping fellow men like this and to them the world is overpopulated anyway.

-S

[mrbeast]

There are medical missionaries. One I support and am proud to is called Operation smile, they do great work world wide. I also support James Robison who is a christian and brings fresh water and food to countries, even though he preaches the gospel that communist and most liberals hate, he brings life saving things to those countries. I applaud both because both do great work. I believe that 90% of food and medical supplies that go to third world countries come from this predominantly Christian land. I think Jesus said, "If you give even a cup of water to these little ones, you will not lose your reward..." The reward itself is in being able to give...:yep:Some people here would have no missionaries at all and let these people starve or die of curable diseases. Heartless, but typical of the Darwin crowd. They can't explain helping fellow men like this and to them the world is overpopulated anyway.

-S

Oh those Darwinists! They are so nasty aren't they! :stare: :nope:

What are you talking about Subman, where the heck did Darwin come from and what does it have to do at all with any of this? :huh:

BTW where are the stats that say 90% of aid comes from Christians?

[Skybird]

There are medical missionaries. One I support and am proud to is called Operation smile, they do great work world wide. I also support James Robison who is a christian and brings fresh water and food to countries, even though he preaches the gospel that communist and most liberals hate, he brings life saving things to those countries. I applaud both because both do great work. I believe that 90% of food and medical supplies that go to third world countries come from this predominantly Christian land. I think Jesus said, "If you give even a cup of water to these little ones, you will not lose your reward..." The reward itself is in being able to give...:yep:Some people here would have no missionaries at all and let these people starve or die of curable diseases. Heartless, but typical of the Darwin crowd. They can't explain helping fellow men like this and to them the world is overpopulated anyway.

-S

Oh those Darwinists! They are so nasty aren't they! :stare: :nope:

What are you talking about Subman, where the heck did Darwin come from and what does it have to do at all with any of this? :huh:

BTW where are the stats that say 90% of aid comes from Christians?
Social darwinism is a theoretical concept traditionally propagated more in anglosaxon lineage of social and economical sciences. So much for that. I know it from the field of social sciences, and it also is part of the reason why the society in the US his considerably less build on the principle of obligatory social solidarity and sociual insurancing. to accuse europe of social darwinsim and at the same time calling it the socialist nanny-state, is a bit confused, I fear.

I also remember quite clearly that one of these evil wicked social darwinists from Europe asked two times what kind of "missionary" Rocky is: a guy assisting it practical and pragmatic help and not caring for theological missionising of foreigners, or one of these ideologists who are more about spreading their ideology instead of giving help for the sake of the help itself . This reminder serves as the third time now.

[August]

BTW where are the stats that say 90% of aid comes from Christians?

That's not what he said. Reading comprehension FTL.

[Digital_Trucker]

Skybird, perhaps he didn't answer your question because he's busy puking at the garbage being spewn in this thread. I certainly wouldn't blame him one bit.

[baggygreen]

I saw my first news article about this today. According to it, the problem lies with provincial governors taking exception to el presidente declaring marshall law. Apparently there are several provinces who are refusing to honour the presidents declaration and so they've begun fighting.

As for 20,000 cubans, etc, well at the risk of playing devil's advocate, we've got groups like the african union who have sent troops into countries to help stabilise and maintain peace etc, then theres the UN, is it possible people are reacting badly because anti-western nations are doing the exact same thing??

finally, geetrue, fingers crossed for your mate there, and for everyone else up there too, we all know how nasty these south american disputes can get

[JoeCorrado]

I'll pray that ALL non-combatants be safe from any possible violence-

Hey, didn't the Russians just rush to the aid of all those poor folks in Georgia who somehow ended up in the middle of a shooting war when first the Georgians and then the Russiians began falling over themselves in an effort to save everybody from ebverybody and everybody got upset with everybody because everybody was on the wrong side? Everybodies right, everybodies wrong...

Hmmm.... maybe we should just stick to praying and let the rest sort itself out. After all, we are not so far from our own revoloution, are we?

:rotfl:


(Reuters) - Bolivia's simmering political crisis has entered a crucial phase, with martial law imposed in one region and at least 30 people killed in clashes between supporters of leftist President Evo Morales and rightist opposition groups that oppose his plans for socialist reforms.

A summit of South American leaders on Monday in Chile could encourage Morales and his rivals to resolve the conflict peacefully as neighbouring countries express strong support for the president and the rule of law.

[geetrue]

Thanks for the back up ... prayer is just one of those little faith things people do especially when the plane is going down. You either do or your don't ... so lets not argue about it.

My friend Rocky Malloy was a drug runner back in the early 80's. Not just any drug runner either. He was the captain of a ship that got caught doing a regular dope run out of Mexico to Texas.

He got nabbed in the Gulf of Mexico on his way out still in Mexican waters with 500 pounds of pot. They put him in jail and said he could be there for life. Rocky was single then and he had praying parents, but they didn't even know he was a drug runner or in jail. Three days is all he spent in jail. They came to his cell opened it up and said he was free to go. He said he made it to the border real fast with no money in his pocket and walked across the international border down Brownsville way and then hitched hiked home to Rockport, Texas.

They kept his ship of course lol

Rocky went on to become a missionary in Nicaragua back in 1991 meets a beauitful nurse from Denmark they get married have like four girls and finally a boy move to La Paz in Bolivia and now he's got an offer from the Domican Republic to put his form of teaching school into the system (which comes to about 500,000 books)

Rocky's not a drug runner anymore just a nice man that cares.

http://afp.google.com/article/ALeqM5hcXcuza1g7xtBo4KY8V_pk2lK63w
Fresh violence in Bolivia stokes civil war fears


3 days ago
LA PAZ (AFP) — Deadly clashes in Bolivia Thursday stoked fears of further widespread unrest and possibly even civil war, amid a furor over the expulsion of the US ambassador to the country.



The conflict has racial overtones as relatively prosperous regions of the eastern lowlands, where more people are of European descent and mixed-race, are keen to hold on to local resources they see as being pulled away by the impoverished indigenous highlands.


In southeast Bolivia, a gas pipeline was blown up Wednesday in what the head of the state energy company YPSL, Santos Ramirez, called a "terrorist attack" by anti-government protesters.
Authorities at the private Franco-Brazilian Transierra company said supply to Brazil had been seriously affected.



The US spokesman would not say how the United States might retaliate, adding: "We're at the point of considering all our options regarding our relationship."
The row was playing out against a wider challenge to US influence in Latin America that is, in part, linked to Russia's ties to leftwing nations in the region.

[Tchocky]

20.000 Cubans???
Where the hell should they come from?
Cuba, obviously

:lol:

[Skybird]

Thanks for the back up ... prayer is just one of those little faith things people do especially when the plane is going down. You either do or your don't ... so lets not argue about it.

My friend Rocky Malloy was a drug runner back in the early 80's. Not just any drug runner either. He was the captain of a ship that got caught doing a regular dope run out of Mexico to Texas.

He got nabbed in the Gulf of Mexico on his way out still in Mexican waters with 500 pounds of pot. They put him in jail and said he could be there for life. Rocky was single then and he had praying parents, but they didn't even know he was a drug runner or in jail. Three days is all he spent in jail. They came to his cell opened it up and said he was free to go. He said he made it to the border real fast with no money in his pocket and walked across the international border down Brownsville way and then hitched hiked home to Rockport, Texas.

They kept his ship of course lol

Rocky went on to become a missionary in Nicaragua back in 1991 meets a beauitful nurse from Denmark they get married have like four girls and finally a boy move to La Paz in Bolivia and now he's got an offer from the Domican Republic to put his form of teaching school into the system (which comes to about 500,000 books)

Rocky's not a drug runner anymore just a nice man that cares.


Sounds as if he managed to get the corner while his life still had time. I wish him well.

http://www.nytimes.com/2008/09/15/world/americas/15bolivia.html?_r=1&scp=2&sq=bolivia&st=cse&oref=slogin

[geetrue]

Thank you Skybird ... saw your name and thought it would wind up being a war of words. You can actually be civil too, uh?

as for the 20,000 cuban troops ... I'm sure thats the word on the ground in La Paz, you know like in street talk. But the troops are probably still on the ground in Venezuela.

There is an emergency meeting scheduled for all leaders of South American countries, today I think: http://www.democracyctr.org/blog/2008/09/bolivia-at-abyss-special-report.html

Here's Rocky and his wife's bio in case your wondering what kind of missionary he is: http://www.sofministries.com/sof/meettheteam.htm


ROCKY J. MALLOY - Co-Founder and President/1990
Personal and Professional data: Born Elisabeth City, NC. October 16, 1954, US Merchant Marine Officer/Captain (1980). School of Evangelism - Horizon Christian Fellowship, San Diego, California (1988) School of Ministry, Abundant Life Christian Center, La Marque, TX (1993) Lic. & Ordained by ALCC (1992/1994) Lic. & Ordained by Victory Fellowship (1998/2000) Lic. & Ordained by Living Word (1999/2001)

JOSKE K. MALLOY - Co-Founder and Vice-President/1990
Personal and Professional data: Born Tanahmerah, Indonesia (Dutch citizen) October 10, 1961, HBOV University (B.S. 1985) Bible School - Abundant Life Christian Center La Marque, TX (1993) Lic. & Ordained by ALCC (1992/1994) Lic. & Ordained by Victory Fellowship (1998/2000)

Ministry History - Before meeting in 1989 in Honduras Rocky served on staff at Horizon Christian Fellowship San Diego, California in the hospitality department, a church of 5000. As the daughter of a missionary couple ministering in Irian Jaya (West Indonesia), Joske was born into the ministry, living the first fourteen years of her life with Stone Age cannibals. She has been active in the ministry ever since.

Rocky and Joske worked on the Honduras/Nicaragua border for one year during the Sandinistas war in the war zone, founded Shield of Faith Ministries Inc. in April 1990 and retuned to the Mosquito Coast of Honduras where they established government clinics for the Indian population, administered medical care, trained midwifes and other health care professionals, vaccinated children, directed a sanitation project, directed a marketing program and coordinated regional childcare while helping to repatriate the Nicaraguan refugees.

[Biggles]

I really had no idea that it was so bad down there. Maybe I'm just ignorant, but I haven't noticed much on the (swedish) news about it. It's been all about China, Georgia and Black Holes the last weeks.

[geetrue]

I just found this article by accident while searching google to find out if the Democtrcy Center in san francisco was a front for (who knows what).

I didn't find any dirt on them, but take a look at the article and then look at the date ... this sounds like today and it was (8) eight years ago.

source: http://www.commondreams.org/views/100200-104.htm

Published on Monday, October 2, 2000
US Drug War At Center Stage In Renewed Bolivian Violence
by Jim Shultz
Dear Readers:
I am sorry to report that, once again, I am writing from a Bolivia in the midst of conflict. A series of national strikes and highway blockades which began two weeks ago has been met with 20,000 government troops using tear gas and live rounds in abundance. At least ten are dead, more than a hundred injured and many jailed. The U.S. State Department has publicly declared its support for the government's actions. Below is my dispatch from Bolivia, which will be circulated to news outlets in the U.S. Monday morning by Pacific News Service. I hope you will share it with others to keep Bolivia in the U.S. public eye. The only help I am asking for at this time is the following. Many of the injured are children, many maimed beyond Bolivian medicine's ability to help them. This includes a six year old girl whose nose and face was decimated Saturday morning by a government tear gas canister.
Jim Shultz
The Democracy Center

[SS107.9MHz]

20.000 Cubans???
Where the hell should they come from?
Cuba, obviously, but I'm not sure they have that many regulars left in their army.
Also, I didn't read anything about a "night flight to Angola" style air lift recently, not to mention that Cuba maybe has the capability to airlift some tourists around the island, but certainly not to do such an operation.

Sorry, but that whole thing smells like american right wishful thinking. :up:

Same thought here, I just have bitten my lips. One controversy at a time seemed to be enough. :)

It's an awfulll wrong turn from miami to Bolivia :doh:

Hope you're friend keeps safe Geetrue!