The Rise of the Putin Doctrine

[SUBMAN1]

This is a very interesting article.

-S

http://www.newsweek.com/id/154937

Excerpt:

True, Georgia (http://www.newsweek.com/related.aspx?subject=Republic+of+Georgia)'s Mikheil Saakashvili (http://www.newsweek.com/related.aspx?subject=Mikhail+Saakashvili) is not a very smart president. A pro would not have walked into the trap the Russians and their local thug-in-chief (a.k.a. "president"), Eduard Kokoity, had set up in South Ossetia. A wise leader would have done some elementary intelligence work and then recoiled in horror. Across the border in (Russian) North Ossetia lay waiting Russia (http://www.newsweek.com/related.aspx?subject=Russia)'s 58th Army, steeled by annihilationist warfare in Chechnya and considered their best trained. It has 600 tanks, 2,000 armored troop carriers and 120 combat planes. Even if only half smart, the president could have saved his country from disaster by simply closing the Roki Tunnel, those two miles under the Caucasus Mountains that were the only way in for the 58th. In poured 15,000 men and 150 tanks, and that shut up the mouse that roared....

[Happy Times]

Those who have chastised Saakashvili for tweaking the bear are also pleading clemency for Putin. They invoke Russia's humiliation in the cold war, the loss of its empire (14 out of 15 republics chose independence) and the forward march of NATO and the European Union across the former Iron Curtain. So what? Does this mean Russia has a right to an empire? That its ex-vassals from the Baltic to Bulgaria have no right to autonomy and safety?

Forty years ago, the Brezhnev doctrine proclaimed "once socialist, always socialist" as pretext for crushing the Prague Spring. Shall we now have a Putin doctrine: "Once Russian, always Russian?" Even the propitiators would not savor this kind of retro imperialism. Nor is the West as powerless as the hand-wringers pretend. The first order of business must be massive reconstruction aid to Georgia. Saakashvili may be a fool, but he is a democratic one, and he is a lot better than a Putin puppet. The German chancellor, Angela Merkel, was right when she pronounced in Tbilisi: "Georgia will be a member of NATO; it wants to be one."



Thats what this is about.

[Frame57]

This is a tough one. on one hand i can see Russia not wanting NATO in their backyard. On the other hand when an Independant Country wants protection, what do they do? Russia has always operated that way. The reason they tried to put missiles in Cuba was because we first put them in Turkey. Would I have done any different? Dunno. After the Cuban missile crisis we did take out our missiles in Turkey which was not publicized much. Tit for tat!

[XabbaRus]

This is a tough one. on one hand i can see Russia not wanting NATO in their backyard. On the other hand when an Independant Country wants protection, what do they do? Russia has always operated that way. The reason they tried to put missiles in Cuba was because we first put them in Turkey. Would I have done any different? Dunno. After the Cuban missile crisis we did take out our missiles in Turkey which was not publicized much. Tit for tat!

Just going OT for a second. The Thor missiles pulled out of Turkey were bordering on obscelete anyway so America really lost nothing in that deal. Thye were deactivated September 1963. That in itself isn't often reported.

[SUBMAN1]

This is a tough one. on one hand i can see Russia not wanting NATO in their backyard. On the other hand when an Independant Country wants protection, what do they do? Russia has always operated that way. The reason they tried to put missiles in Cuba was because we first put them in Turkey. Would I have done any different? Dunno. After the Cuban missile crisis we did take out our missiles in Turkey which was not publicized much. Tit for tat!
Just going OT for a second. The Thor missiles pulled out of Turkey were bordering on obscelete anyway so America really lost nothing in that deal. Thye were deactivated September 1963. That in itself isn't often reported.Thats true. Russia still didn't like them there though. I wouldn't if I were Russia either.

-S

[Happy Times]

-cut-



Thats what this is about.
That's actually full of BS :

Those who have chastised Saakashvili for tweaking the bear are also pleading...
Typical demagogy, say one truth and add three lies just behind, it will pass. I don't think anybody said it was ok for Russia to claim it's former republic or whatever this article pretends.

Saakashvili may be a fool, but he is a democratic one, and he is a lot better than a Putin puppet.
Translation to reality : Sakashvili is like Putin in smaller but he's our puppet so let's say he's democratic, westerners are typically too brain-lazy to dig into things and won't figure it out. Better a west puppet than a Russian puppet.

I also think your perception of the world is total BS.:D

[Skybird]

http://img178.imageshack.us/img178/4467/picardnotagainanonibld8lp6.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[Happy Times]

I didnt meen it in a bad way, its just that our world wiews differ so much that its impossible for us to agree ever in anything.:D

[SUBMAN1]

I didnt meen it in a bad way, its just that our world wiews differ so much that its impossible for us to agree ever in anything.:DHe is holding his head because that statement is better meant for him! :p :D

-S

[asanovic7]

Putin is holding the whole europe by the balls.. :rotfl: :rotfl: it is really pleasant to see Merkel sweating when he will show up, when when :rotfl: :rotfl:
Together with China, neither u.s. is far away..

The reds are comming :()1:

The best thing about Putin for me was that gone fishing with a cowboy hat picture. That showed the man has a good sense of humour and likes to play.

Cheers!

[Frame57]

This is a tough one. on one hand i can see Russia not wanting NATO in their backyard. On the other hand when an Independant Country wants protection, what do they do? Russia has always operated that way. The reason they tried to put missiles in Cuba was because we first put them in Turkey. Would I have done any different? Dunno. After the Cuban missile crisis we did take out our missiles in Turkey which was not publicized much. Tit for tat!

Just going OT for a second. The Thor missiles pulled out of Turkey were bordering on obscelete anyway so America really lost nothing in that deal. Thye were deactivated September 1963. That in itself isn't often reported.Obsolete or not, it was Kruschev's motivator for attempting to put missiles in Cuba.

[Skybird]

Obsolute Thor-missiles, I always wondered what that meant in times when there was no missile defense. Wouldn't they have exploded, if being fired? Would they have strayed off by a couple of hundred meters before going off? would they have gone off without leaving their silos? Or was it that there was a new missile that needed to be sold and thus the existing ones needed to be declared "obsolete"?

[Tchocky]

Obsolute Thor-missiles, I always wondered what that meant in times when there was no missile defense. Wouldn't they have exploded, if being fired? Would they have strayed off by a couple of hundred meters before going off? would they have gone off without leaving their silos? Or was it that there was a new missile that needed to be sold and thus the existing ones needed to be declared "obsolete"?

:D

It means we can put bigger bombs in the new missiles, Sky :p

[sergbuto]

I didnt meen it in a bad way, its just that our world wiews differ so much that its impossible for us to agree ever in anything.:D
How about muslims? :)

[Happy Times]

I didnt meen it in a bad way, its just that our world wiews differ so much that its impossible for us to agree ever in anything.:D
How about muslims? :)

What about them?
Recent Jihad news from Finland, the Al Qaida boys thretening to kill Blair and Brown were arrested in Manchester boarding a plane to Finland. Finnish SUPO and NBI are investigating. They said its possible they were just on their way to see their infidel Finnish girlfriends, they do everything a prudent Muslin girl wont.

[sergbuto]

I didnt meen it in a bad way, its just that our world wiews differ so much that its impossible for us to agree ever in anything.:D
How about muslims? :)

What about them?
Recent Jihad news from Finland, the Al Qaida boys thretening to kill Blair and Brown were arrested in Manchester boarding a plane to Finland. Finnish SUPO and NBI are investigating. They said its possible they were just on their way to see their infidel Finnish girlfriends, they do everything a prudent Muslin girl wont.
Funny.
But I meant a possibilty of agreement in views while discussing the events/issues concerning muslims. :)

[Happy Times]

I didnt meen it in a bad way, its just that our world wiews differ so much that its impossible for us to agree ever in anything.:D
How about muslims? :)

What about them?
Recent Jihad news from Finland, the Al Qaida boys thretening to kill Blair and Brown were arrested in Manchester boarding a plane to Finland. Finnish SUPO and NBI are investigating. They said its possible they were just on their way to see their infidel Finnish girlfriends, they do everything a prudent Muslin girl wont.
I meant a possibilty of agreement in views while discussing the events/issues concerning muslims. :)

Look, i dont even have anything serious against Mikhayl, its hard to interact with letters and smilies. I dont remember his wiews on Islamisation of Europe.

[sergbuto]

I didnt meen it in a bad way, its just that our world wiews differ so much that its impossible for us to agree ever in anything.:D
How about muslims? :)

What about them?
Recent Jihad news from Finland, the Al Qaida boys thretening to kill Blair and Brown were arrested in Manchester boarding a plane to Finland. Finnish SUPO and NBI are investigating. They said its possible they were just on their way to see their infidel Finnish girlfriends, they do everything a prudent Muslin girl wont.
I meant a possibilty of agreement in views while discussing the events/issues concerning muslims. :)

Look, i dont even have anything serious against Mikhayl, its hard to interact with letters and smilies. I dont remember his wiews on Islamisation of Europe.
No problem. It was my unsuccessfull attempt to make a joke.

[Happy Times]

I think it was good :D
HT, I don't want to start on the subject, so simply put, to me "islamisation of europe" sounds exactly like "global warming" to Subman :lol:

Then it was a good joke.:)
And with me you have to remember that im willing to fight for anyones right to disagree, that would do the same for me.