Have we all moved to Russia?

[STEED]

There are so many Russian threads I'm just wondering if I should crack out a bottle of Vodka my fellow comrades. :lol:

http://oldbeacon.com/beacon/airlines/images/flag-soviet_union.jpg http://reds.linefeed.org/bios/stalin.jpg http://oldbeacon.com/beacon/airlines/images/flag-soviet_union.jpg

[Digital_Trucker]

Don't know how much it would help, but it probably wouldn't hurt any

[SUBMAN1]

There are so many Russian threads I'm just wondering if I should crack out a bottle of Vodka my fellow comrades. :lol:

http://oldbeacon.com/beacon/airlines/images/flag-soviet_union.jpgI just opened a bottle of Hefeweizen in honor of them. Oh wait... That's German. Ah well, close enough!

-S

[STEED]

http://www.stalin.website.pl/galerie/zdjeciaII/s001.jpg

SUBMAN1 could be a Nazi Dog I shall make a note of that.
STEED is taking the p*** out of me he's going in the book as well.

[SUBMAN1]

SUBMAN1 could be a Nazi Dog I shall make a note of that....Only if I get to rule the world! Outside of that, I like the US. :p

-S

[nikimcbee]

There are so many Russian threads I'm just wondering if I should crack out a bottle of Vodka my fellow comrades. :lol:

http://oldbeacon.com/beacon/airlines/images/flag-soviet_union.jpg http://reds.linefeed.org/bios/stalin.jpg http://oldbeacon.com/beacon/airlines/images/flag-soviet_union.jpg

Your bad attitude towards the Motherland has been noted.

[STEED]

http://www.stalin.website.pl/galerie/zdjeciaII/s001.jpg
SUBMAN1 is joining STEED taking the P*** out of me I will teach him to mess with the great Stalin, nikimcbee is a good comrade and I shall pin the Order of Lenin on him.

[ubootcomrade]

Long live glorious comrade Stalin! *goes to make Ubootcomradeland a communist country*

:rotfl:

[STEED]

http://www.stalin.website.pl/galerie/zdjeciaII/s001.jpg

I will promote ubootcomrade to General of the fist Guards Army.

[Bruno Lotse]

Za Rodinu! Za Stalina!

http://www3.nameofrussia.ru/p/t_8828.jpg

Сталин Иосиф Виссарионович
1879–1953 гг.

Hey guys,
Check out this site http://www.nameofrussia.ru/rating.html

It's called The Name of Russia

It's Russians are voting the most important person in their history.
Georgian Iosif Stalin is on the second place
for the whole 1000 years of Russian statehood.
Yet I have a hunch he will end up on top as he would always do.

[ubootcomrade]

http://www.stalin.website.pl/galerie/zdjeciaII/s001.jpg

I will promote ubootcomrade to General of the fist Guards Army.

Fist guards? :o , I hope you mean First Guards :p :rotfl:

[nikimcbee]

http://www.stalin.website.pl/galerie/zdjeciaII/s001.jpg
SUBMAN1 is joining STEED taking the P*** out of me I will teach him to mess with the great Stalin, nikimcbee is a good comrade and I shall pin the Order of Lenin on him.

Yes, I knew all of my schmooozing would pay off. And I didn't need to get under the table.

[STEED]

http://www.stalin.website.pl/galerie/zdjeciaII/s001.jpg

I will promote ubootcomrade to General of the fist Guards Army.

Fist guards? :o , I hope you mean First Guards :p :rotfl:

@Stalin
Bloody Vodka gone to my head, that too is going in to my book.

[nikimcbee]

I will promote ubootcomrade to General of the fist Guards Army.

Fist guards? :o

Isn't that awfully personal for a forum thread?

[ubootcomrade]

Yes, but its funny to anyone who understands the innuendo :p

[Bruno Lotse]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cf/Teheran_conference-1943.jpg/797px-Teheran_conference-1943.jpg

[SUBMAN1]

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/cf/Teheran_conference-1943.jpg/797px-Teheran_conference-1943.jpgThat is a terrible picture. Two great men and one POS.

-S

[Bruno Lotse]

It's how two great men
(one crippled another alcogolic -
Navy, you really wanted this:hmm:)
sold Eastern Europe to Stalin.

[Skybird]

It's how two great men
(one crippled another alcogolic -
Navy, you really wanted this:hmm:)
sold Eastern Europe to Stalin.
Didn't helped them, nevertheless. They all died of high blood pressure soon after.

[SUBMAN1]

Here. let me help you make this a truely great pic! There! Fixed it!

-S

http://img396.imageshack.us/img396/98/picmu2.gif

[Skybird]

Have we all moved to Russia?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KZg8WR-uyag
:sunny:

[Bruno Lotse]

It's how two great men
(one crippled another alcogolic -
Navy, you really wanted this:hmm:)
sold Eastern Europe to Stalin. Didn't helped them, nevertheless. They all died of high blood pressure soon after.
I guess you know what Churchill would say about Stalin
in 1953 in Brit Parliament.

I'm sure those kids have no idea.
But I have a hunch you do.

[SUBMAN1]

I guess you know what Churchill would say about Stalin
in 1953 in Brit Parliament.

I'm sure those kids have no idea.
But I have a hunch you do.You missed my fixed up picture! I made it special for you! :D :p There! Much Bettar!

http://img396.imageshack.us/img396/98/picmu2.gif

[Bruno Lotse]

Caption:
Crippled: 'Hm.Where is Good Old Uncle Joe?'

[SUBMAN1]

Caption:
Crippled: 'Hm.Where is Good Old Uncle Joe?'You lack of feeling for people who are challenged one way or another is showing through quite clearly, as is your need to pick on the weak and disabled. Your other areas I highlight include Your own native country and how you honor chaos and destruction. I could go on with this list all day, but in the end, it shows you are the most evil of men and you honor that evil. Some day, your number will be up and you will get what is coming to you. That day will be a great day for the people of Earth.

-S

[Bruno Lotse]

You don't like when someone insults your prez?
I don't like when someone insults the Russian leader who takes the second place
in the roster of the greatest Russian men in the history of Russian 1000 year statehood.

You started it, didn't you?

[SUBMAN1]

You don't like when someone insults your prez?
I don't like when someone insults the Russian leader who takes the second place
in the roster of Russian 1000 year statehood.

You started it, didn't you?Never started it, but you sure as hell finished it. Done with the conversation. You are a sick man.

-S

[Mush Martin]

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e368/MartinPicfix/Thebig3cleaned.jpg


[edit] I figured it to be a sunny day in Terhan so its a little bright.

as for the discussion, none of these men were handicapped where
it mattered.

[SUBMAN1]

Mines better - I got rid of the murderer of millions of people.

Stalin is the ultimate when it comes to serial killers. No one can touch him. Not even Hitler.

http://img396.imageshack.us/img396/98/picmu2.gif

[Bruno Lotse]

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e368/MartinPicfix/Thebig3cleaned.jpg
To you Mush.
Thank you.
To you only, I don't mean what I wrote about FDR or W. Churchill.
Thank you again for a good picture of the Big Three.
Bruno

[Mush Martin]

Mines better - I got rid of the murderer of millions of people.

Stalin is the ultimate when it comes to serial killers. No one can touch him. Not even Hitler.

http://img396.imageshack.us/img396/98/picmu2.gif

Much as I am his biggest fan I dont think WSC could pass a
war crimes tribunal if we did a mock one.

M
[edit] strangely it looks like he knows that in this pic.

[Mush Martin]

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e368/MartinPicfix/Thebig3cleaned.jpg To you Mush.
Thank you.
To you only, I don't mean what I wrote about FDR or W. Churchill.
Thank you again for a good picture of the Big Three.
Bruno
Your welcome.

Bruno you need to look at the issues with less prejudice though
it may well be said for all of us I think.
however here is a tongue in cheek poke at you from me.

http://echosphere.net/star_trek_insp/insp_nationalpride_preview.jpg

and in the interest of equal time on both sides.

http://echosphere.net/star_trek_insp/insp_20thcentury_preview.jpg
(http://echosphere.net/star_trek_insp/insp_20thcentury_preview.jpg)

[SUBMAN1]

To you Mush.
Thank you.
To you only, I don't mean what I wrote about FDR or W. Churchill.
Thank you again for a good picture of the Big Three.
Bruno
Your welcome.

Bruno you need to look at the issues with less prejudice though
it may well be said for all of us I think.
however here is a tongue in cheek poke at you from me.



and in the interest of equal time on both sides.

http://echosphere.net/star_trek_insp/insp_20thcentury_preview.jpgMuch better picture:

http://img396.imageshack.us/img396/98/picmu2.gif

[Bruno Lotse]

<< Much as I am his biggest fan I dont think WSC could pass a
war crimes tribunal if we did a mock one.>>

Man, if wonna try a contest on knowledge of Russian history
I warn you, you will loose.:rock:

[SUBMAN1]

Man, if wonna try a contest on knowledge of Russian history
I warn you, you will loose.:rock:I think the better answer is - I don't want to know anything about such heartless people.

See this thread for whom you worship - http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=141080

-S

[Digital_Trucker]

Caption:
Crippled: 'Hm.Where is Good Old Uncle Joe?'You lack of feeling for people who are challenged one way or another is showing through quite clearly, as is your need to pick on the weak and disabled. Your other areas I highlight include Your own native country and how you honor chaos and destruction. I could go on with this list all day, but in the end, it shows you are the most evil of men and you honor that evil. Some day, your number will be up and you will get what is coming to you. That day will be a great day for the people of Earth.

-S
Bruno does not insult the handicapped, he only insults himself. (At least that's the way this wheelchair jockey views it).

[Bruno Lotse]

Caption:
Crippled: 'Hm.Where is Good Old Uncle Joe?'You lack of feeling for people who are challenged one way or another is showing through quite clearly, as is your need to pick on the weak and disabled. Your other areas I highlight include Your own native country and how you honor chaos and destruction. I could go on with this list all day, but in the end, it shows you are the most evil of men and you honor that evil. Some day, your number will be up and you will get what is coming to you. That day will be a great day for the people of Earth.

-S
Bruno does not insult the handicapped, he only insults himself. (At least that's the way this wheelchair jockey views it).

Oh, you're still reading my posts:rotfl:
Keep on, you might learn something new.:arrgh!:

[Mush Martin]

<< Much as I am his biggest fan I dont think WSC could pass a
war crimes tribunal if we did a mock one.>>

Man, if wonna try a contest on knowledge of Russian history
I warn you, you will loose.:rock:

Explain please WSC=Winston Spencer Churchill
if you would care to debate British and commonwealth
history I could understand but I am afraid that I dont
follow the meaning of your comment.

[Digital_Trucker]

Yep, Bruno, you're worth a good laugh occasionally. But I must admit that your total ignorance of reality is wearing a little thin. If you were, perhaps, to open your mind (if, indeed you are equipped with one) you might learn a little something yourself.:sunny:

Edit : Mush, an intellectual duel with Bruno would be like waving your Sabre at empty space. Don't waste the energy.

[Bruno Lotse]

<< Much as I am his biggest fan I dont think WSC could pass a
war crimes tribunal if we did a mock one.>>

Man, if wonna try a contest on knowledge of Russian history
I warn you, you will loose.:rock:
Explain please WSC=Winston Spencer Churchill
if you would care to debate British and commonwealth
history I could understand but I am afraid that I dont
follow the meaning of your comment.
Oops. My bad:oops:
I was thinking there was another attack on Stalin.
Sorry.

Well, strategic bombings? What else could he possibly do.
Germans were hellishly strong...

[Mush Martin]

I don't mean what I wrote about FDR or W. Churchill.
Thank you again for a good picture of the Big Three.
Bruno

Bruno what is the purpose of writing biting and hurtful comments
that you dont really mean?

is it to show your sensitivity
is it because you think these gentlemen arent
capable of reasoned debate?
is it to improve the situation by furthering dialogue
and understanding between opposing sides.

does it contribute to the solution
or the problem when people behave as you have
confessed to doing?
:|\\

[Bruno Lotse]

The guy insulted a member of the Big Tree.
Tit for tat.

Winston Churchill in my view is the greatest leader of British people and the British Commonwealth in the XXth century.
A fighting man, a real hero. A man who would never surrender (well, once he was captured, BUT he escaped!!!)
I do respect him very very much.
Truly.

[Mush Martin]

The guy insulted a member of the Big Tree.
Tit for tat.

Winston Churchill in my view is the greatest leader of British people and the British Commonwealth in the XXth century.
A fighting man, a real hero. A man who would never surrender (well, once he was captured, BUT he escaped!!!)
I do respect him very very much.
Truly.

On that much we are agreed I am his biggest advocate as such
I will also go further and say he is the greatest english language
orator of the twentieth century as well.

but as you saw earlier I am not above acknowledging
his faults I believe also that the strategic bombing campaign
against germany was not acceptable in the light of its
cause the "immoral" bombing of rotterdam that started that
phase of the war off was of course an attack made in error
that had a damage effect far out of scale with the attacks
original damage potential.

I cant be hypocritical about his shortcomings
He got america into two world wars.

can you be unbiased about uncle joe?

[Bruno Lotse]

He was a great statemen and the duty of every great statemen is to protect his people.

That was the war and his duty was to win that war with as little loss of British lives as possible. He did a great job. Less losses then in WWI.

Morality of killing German civil population or making others fight along with British (coup in Jugoslavia) - is possible to discuss nowadays.

But at the time his primary duty was to protect lives of British people - not Germans, Jugoslavians, Americans, or Russians.

[Mush Martin]

I feel that Stalin did much harm to the Professional military
and much harm to the soviet peoples out of megalomaniacal
paranoia, for all that he was a great statesman and IIRC correctly
a great Georgian.

M

[Bruno Lotse]

Nope. Repressions covered only 4% of officer cadre of the Red Army.

But you might argue because Stalin showed his generals who was the boss
Stalin did not have Colonel Stauffenberg.

[Mush Martin]

Nope. Repressions covered only 4% of officer cadre of the Red Army.

But you might argue because Stalin showed his generals who was the boss
Stalin did not had Colonel Stauffenberg.
Please Bruno I am not able actually to recall in reality
but was Stalin a Georgian by birth?
(sincere)

[Bruno Lotse]

Yep, a Georgian (Mengrel ethnic group of Georgian people).
His real last name is typically Georgian - Dzhugashvili

But later on he went on records
'I am a man of Russian culture'.

Stalin is his 'party name' which he was using while fighting the last Romanov's Empire.
Stalin means 'a man of steel'. And he was truly up to his party name.

There's a lot of talk nowadays about Georgian city of Gori.
Gori is the birthplace of Iosif Stalin.
There is still a huge monument to him on the central square of the city.

Here you go:
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/e/ef/Goristatue.JPG/200px-Goristatue.JPG

[Mush Martin]

Thanks I was trying to do it right in english lettering and was
having trouble well thats it I'm out. We have transitioned from
Punk assed provocation to exchanging cultural discussion.
Im finished now.
:|\\Mush.

[Bruno Lotse]

Nice talking to you Mush :D

Cheers,
Bruno

[Mush Martin]

http://www.stalin.website.pl/galerie/zdjeciaII/s001.jpg


http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e368/MartinPicfix/unclejoe.jpg

[edit] well ive done better.

[Bruno Lotse]

Thank you Mush for the picture.

Here's Stalin writing something.
But he was also a great reader. His personal library which he would collect for his whole life included 20 th!!! books.
Each day he would try to read 300 pages of literature on various subjects - science, economics, history, and military affairs.

He was a heavy smoker. He used Caucasian tobacco 'Gertsegovina Flor' exclusively.
A pack of this cigarettes is in the picture. He would take a cigarette, break it and use tobacco for his famous black pipe.

http://www.zigsam.at/B_HerzegovinaFlor.htm

[Happy Times]

Maybe you can clone him? You think he would let Putin live, he is so soft?:hmm:

[Stealth Hunter]

Maybe you can clone him? You think he would let Putin live, he is so soft?:hmm:

Tell that to these guys, lol:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8f/Jeńcy1.jpg/250px-Jeńcy1.jpg

To be EXECUTED for:

Being alleged "saboteurs, lawyers, priests, landowners, factory owners, and spies".

Well, what was the end result?

The infamous event we know as the Katyn Massacre.

[Bruno Lotse]

Maybe you can clone him? You think he would let Putin live, he is so soft?:hmm:
Tell that to these guys, lol:

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8f/Jeńcy1.jpg/250px-Jeńcy1.jpg (http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/8/8f/Je%C5%84cy1.jpg/250px-Je%C5%84cy1.jpg)

To be EXECUTED for:

Being alleged "saboteurs, lawyers, priests, landowners, factory owners, and spies".

Well, what was the end result?

The infamous event we know as the Katyn Massacre.
Just words.
I want to see a legal document where it would be spelled out that
someone is to be executed for being
alleged "saboteurs, lawyers, priests, landowners, factory owners, and spies".
not proved but alleged
If someone is proved to be a spy then what - America will give that person a credit card?
If someone is proved to be a saboteur - then what - that one may go home and continue?
Think what you are writing.

Katyn Massacre? Sure. Germans did it.

Burdenko commission came to this conclusion back in 1944
in presence of Americans amongst which was a daughter of US Ambassador to the USSR Mr. Garriman.

[Stealth Hunter]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Katyn_Massacre

:rotfl:

Seriously, are you drunk, crazy, or do you really believe what you're saying?

This will have to wait. I'm tired, and need to rest. I have a strong feeling I'll have plenty of laughs in this thread tomorrow.

[Happy Times]

They are starting to deny large parts of history officially in Russia, its not only Bruno the Ruskie.

[Bruno Lotse]

It's all you've got?
Only wicki? Do you have idea how it's being created.
Find me there a reference to Ms.Garriman.
It's not there? Why? She was an one of US reps working with Burdenko commission
and signed results in early spring of 1944.
So, now it is not politically expedient to write about Ms.Garriman in English version of Vicky?
Right?

[Skybird]

I must object. Stalin does not become "the second greatest leader of russia" just becasue the russian victory over Nazi Germany falls into the term of his reign. Tito said in a public speech that if Stalin deserves any honour, than that of being one of mankind's absolute top slaughterers of his own people, Chruchtchew in an internal speech distanced the later soviet regimes from Stalin, and there is a reason why throughout the Eastern bloc after stalin's detah a more or less obvious process of de-stalinisation set in.

I am aware that since several years there has a new Stalin cult emerging in russia, and that he gets transfigured into a national paternal holy figure, with serious distortions of history. That can be explained with the ignorrance of the young who did not live under his regime, and the forgiuveness of the old who suffered losses for the main after the fall of the USSR and the social internal decline. It is the hope for the savior, the call for the strong man, and sometimes it is straightout stupidity.

It is not hitler'S recommendable "merit" we must admire of having lauched a war and a regime that costed 6 million Germans their lives and caused the death of the better part of the 54+ million people dead after five years of Nazi-German glory (exclduing the scores in the Pacific theatre). for the same reason I am hesitent to see Stalin as his country's greatest leader. There were several fearsome slaughterers in russian history, but nobody acchieved such a high bodycount like comrade Stalin. And I do not mean the deaths caused by the Nazis - I am talking about the killing of Russians commited by Stalin himself, by order, by command, by state-terror, and by incompetence (in agriculture, for example). The estimations range between half a dozen of millions, and five dozen millions russian having come to death in and by Stalin'S regime.

Bruno, you may want to reconsider your statement of Stalin being the greatest leader of Russia. He ranks amongst the greatest criminals in human history, I'm sorry to clear that one up - but Stalin has to be seen not any different than Hitler, or Mao.

The following may be wikipedia, but it is a good summarizing overview. If you use Google, you can find much material about the deathscores achieved by Stalin.


Early researchers attempting to count the number of people killed under Stalin's regime were forced to rely largely upon anecdotal evidence. Their estimates ranged from 3 to 60 million.[49] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#cite_note-51) After the Soviet Union dissolved in 1991, evidence from the Soviet archives became available. The archives record that about 800,000 prisoners were executed under Stalin for either political or criminal offences, while around 1.7 million died in the GULAG (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/GULAG) and some 390,000 perished during kulak forced resettlement (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Forced_settlements_in_the_Soviet_Union) — a total of about 3 million victims.
Debate continues, however, since some historians believe the archival figures to be unreliable.[50] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#cite_note-52) For example, Gellately argues the many suspects tortured to death while in "investigative custody" were likely not to have been counted amongst the executed.[51] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#cite_note-53)[5] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#cite_note-RedTsar-6) Also, there are categories of victim which were not accuaretly recorded by the Soviets — such as the victims of ethnic deportations, or of German population transfer in the aftermath of WWII.
Thus, while some archival researchers have estimated the number of victims of Stalin's repressions to be 4 million in total or less, others believe the number to be considerably higher.[52] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#cite_note-54) Russian writer Vadim Erlikman, for example, makes the following estimates: executions, 1.5 million; gulags, 5 million; deportations, 1.7 million out of 7.5 million deported; and POWs (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/POWs) and German civilians, 1 million — a total of about 9 million victims of repression.[53] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#cite_note-55)
Wheatcroft and Davies have also included the 6 to 8 million victims of the 1932–1933 famine as victims of repression.[26] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#cite_note-davies-wheatcroft-2004-27)[54] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#cite_note-56)[55] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#cite_note-57) This categorization is controversial however, as historians differ as to whether the famine was a deliberate part of the campaign of repression against kulaks or simply an unintended consequence (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Unintended_consequence) of the struggle over forced collectivization.
Certainly, it appears a minimum of around 10 million surplus deaths - 4 million by repression and 6 million from famine - are attributable to the regime, with a number of recent books suggesting a likely total of around 20 million.[56] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#cite_note-58) Adding 6–8 million famine victims to Erlikman's estimates above, for example, would yield a total of between 15 and 17 million victims. Researcher Robert Conquest (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Conquest), meanwhile, has revised his original estimate of up to 30 million victims down to 20 million.[57] (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joseph_Stalin#cite_note-59) Others continue to maintain their earlier much higher estimates are correct.

Please Bruno, don't tell us that you were serious when saying Stalin was "the Russian leader who takes the second place in the roster of the greatest Russian men in the history of Russian 1000 year statehood." Tell me instead that you just were sarcastic and that I am just too dump to get it. Please. I stand ready to apologize, then.

Would somebody here understand it, would I be even tolerated in this forum anymore, if I would defend the holocaust and Hitler's crimes, and declare him Germany's second-greatest leader ever...? for the good reputation of this forum probably most of us would agree on that the answer would be: "hardly".

[Bruno Lotse]

Please Bruno, don't tell us that you were serious when saying Stalin was "the Russian leader who takes the second place in the roster of the greatest Russian men in the history of Russian 1000 year statehood." Tell me instead that you just were sarcastic and that I am just too dump to get it. Please. I stand ready to apologize, then.

Yeah, I was wrong
At the moment Stalin is number one.
You can check it out here.
http://www.nameofrussia.ru/rating.html

It's how People of Russia voting (yes, those who have access to internet)

[Happy Times]

Russian leader looks to Stalin's legacy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m9o6ZaZHteI

[Bruno Lotse]

<<Would somebody here understand it, would I be even tolerated in this forum anymore, if I would defend the holocaust and Hitler's crimes, and declare him Germany's second-greatest leader ever...? for the good reputation of this forum probably most of us would agree on that the answer would be: "hardly".>>

Do we remember about Nurnberg?

Was there any Nurnberg about leaders of the Sovet Union from 1923-53?

[Skybird]

Please Bruno, don't tell us that you were serious when saying Stalin was "the Russian leader who takes the second place in the roster of the greatest Russian men in the history of Russian 1000 year statehood." Tell me instead that you just were sarcastic and that I am just too dump to get it. Please. I stand ready to apologize, then.

Yeah, I was wrong
At the moment Stalin is number one.
You can check it out here.
http://www.nameofrussia.ru/rating.html

It's how People of Russia voting (yes, those who have access to internet)
I do not understand what you wish to say here, and I also do not read Kyrillic.

...?

[Happy Times]

Was there any Nurnberg about leaders of the Sovet Union from 1923-53?

Point often made by the evil nationalists in Finland, Baltics and Poland.

[Skybird]

Was there any Nurnberg about leaders of the Sovet Union from 1923-53?
Obviously not. And that is a cultural failure. that Stalin never was called to responsibility during his lifetime does not make this fact an argument to wash him clean. It is evidence of a huge historic failure.

[Sailor Steve]

I once saw World War Two described as a contest between Hitler and Stalin to see who could kill the most Russians.

Hitler won.

Barely.

[Happy Times]

Was there any Nurnberg about leaders of the Sovet Union from 1923-53?
Obviously not. And that is a cultural failure. that Stalin never was called to responsibility during his lifetime does not make this fact an argument to wash him clean. It is evidence of a huge historic failure.

This is the thing that has led to were we are now, not because provocations of Russias neighbours.

[Bruno Lotse]

It's online poll The Name of Russia.
Question - which political, scientific or cultural figure in Russian history made the greates contribution to the nation.

If you have PC, you connect and vote.

As of now on the first place Stalin
On the second Knjaz Alexander Nevskiy
On the third Marshal Zhukov.

[Bruno Lotse]

Was there any Nurnberg about leaders of the Sovet Union from 1923-53? Obviously not. And that is a cultural failure. that Stalin never was called to responsibility during his lifetime does not make this fact an argument to wash him clean. It is evidence of a huge historic failure.
It's you oppinion.
Yet the poll shows that majority of people of Russia would not share it.
Quite the opposite. They consider him the Name of Russia - a person who made the greatest contribution to their country.

[Happy Times]

I will bring out the Champagne when you lay in ruins like the Third Reich.

[Happy Times]

Edward Lucas' thought experiment

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RqqgHCqp6ys

[Skybird]

Was there any Nurnberg about leaders of the Sovet Union from 1923-53? Obviously not. And that is a cultural failure. that Stalin never was called to responsibility during his lifetime does not make this fact an argument to wash him clean. It is evidence of a huge historic failure.
It's you oppinion.
Yet the poll shows that majority of people of Russia would not share it.
Quite the opposite. They consider him the Name of Russia - a person who made the greatest contribution to their country.
A majority in an online poll does not qualify for the description of a qualified majority regarding the total population adressed by this poll. It is a non-representative, non-systematic sample that has at best the character of a hint. This is different to a systematic effort under controlled statistical conditions, which aim add adding representational value to the sample. A poll open to everybody, has no meaning whatever, since the representational quality of the sample is not controlled. I said I know that a new stalin-cult has emerged in Russia. Wether or not the majority of russians subscribe to it, is beyond my judgement.

Do I understand you correctly that you wish to defend your attitude regarding Stalin, as I have explained I perceived your statements?

[Bruno Lotse]

[quote=Bruno Lotse] I also do not read Kyrillic.

...?
Well, it would certainly help to read Kyrillic to read all new material recently published in Russia about those years. It is now based on archives not on political winds.
I definitely do not read about Russia in English.

[Happy Times]

[quote=Bruno Lotse] I also do not read Kyrillic.

...?
Well, it would certainly help to read Kyrillic to read all new material recently published in Russia about those years. It is now based on archives not on political winds.
I definitely do not read about Russia in English.

Good point Bruno.:up:

[Bruno Lotse]

<<A majority in an online poll does not qualify for the description of a qualified majpoirty regarding the total population adressed by this poll. It is a non-representative, non-systematic sample that has at bets the character of a hint. I said I know that a new stalin-cult has emerged in Russia. Wether or not the majority of russians subscribe to it, is beyond my judgement.>>
It's certainly true. I would also believe in statistics made by people whom I've hired;)
But it is a very strong trend now. It's not the first poll of such a kind. The most recent one was done by Ekho Moskvy and results
Stalin with a huge margin to the second place which took Pushkin, and then Lenin.

[Skybird]

[quote=Bruno Lotse] I also do not read Kyrillic.

...?
Well, it would certainly help to read Kyrillic to read all new material recently published in Russia about those years. It is now based on archives not on political winds.
I definitely do not read about Russia in English.
the opened archives have been mentioned in the snippet from the wikipedia entry I gave. The archives alone leaves you with severla million people killed by Stalin.

My question stands: Do I understand you correctly that you wish to defend your attitude regarding Stalin, like I have explained I perceived your statements?

[Bruno Lotse]

<<Do I understand you correctly that you wish to defend your attitude regarding Stalin, as I have explained I perceived your statements?>>
OK, what is in your oppinion my attitude?
I am listening.

[Happy Times]

<<A majority in an online poll does not qualify for the description of a qualified majpoirty regarding the total population adressed by this poll. It is a non-representative, non-systematic sample that has at bets the character of a hint. I said I know that a new stalin-cult has emerged in Russia. Wether or not the majority of russians subscribe to it, is beyond my judgement.>>
It's certainly true. I would also believe in statistics made by people whom I've hired;)
But it is a very strong trend now. It's not the first poll of such a kind. The most recent one was done by Ekho Moskvy and results
Stalin with a huge margin to the second place which took Pushkin, and then Lenin.

The ones that voted for Pushkin should be saved out of Russia, from the rest that idolize anything from Ivan the Terrible to Stalin and will destroy your country.:hmm:

[Thomen]

<<Do I understand you correctly that you wish to defend your attitude regarding Stalin, as I have explained I perceived your statements?>>
OK, what is in your oppinion my attitude?
I am listening.
No, Bruno.. you are supposed to talk... give him an answer to a valid question.

EDIT:
Я понимаю вас правильно что вы желаете защитить вашу ориентацию относительно Сталин, как я объяснял я воспринял ваши заявления?

Is this easier for you, comrade?

EDIT 2: damn.. that looks like greek.. hehe

[Bruno Lotse]

I am not a mind-reader.
I cannot tell what other person think what I might think.
Please, spell me out what you think is my position and I will try to answer weather it really fits my ideas or not.

[Skybird]

<<A majority in an online poll does not qualify for the description of a qualified majpoirty regarding the total population adressed by this poll. It is a non-representative, non-systematic sample that has at bets the character of a hint. I said I know that a new stalin-cult has emerged in Russia. Wether or not the majority of russians subscribe to it, is beyond my judgement.>>
It's certainly true. I would also believe in statistics made by people whom I've hired;)
But it is a very strong trend now. It's not the first poll of such a kind. The most recent one was done by Ekho Moskvy and results
Stalin with a huge margin to the second place which took Pushkin, and then Lenin.Save me from hear-say, I talk about that kind of statistic sample criterions by which for example pharmaceutical drug testing decides wether or not a new drug gets licensed for release to the market, or not. That is responsible use of statistics.

<<Do I understand you correctly that you wish to defend your attitude regarding Stalin, as I have explained I perceived your statements?>>
OK, what is in your oppinion my attitude?
I am listening.

I repeat once more:

Please Bruno, don't tell us that you were serious when saying Stalin was "the Russian leader who takes the second place in the roster of the greatest Russian men in the history of Russian 1000 year statehood." Tell me instead that you just were sarcastic and that I am just too dump to get it. Please. I stand ready to apologize, then.

Do you defend and support Stalin's reputation as described in this, and in your poll, and in your quoted statement, or not. That is no difficult question. But the answer will say a lot about you.

[Zero Niner]

Katyn Massacre? Sure. Germans did it.
Burdenko commission came to this conclusion back in 1943
in presense even Americans amongs which were a daughter of US Ambassador to the USSR Mr. Garriman.

That is just plain wrong.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/c/c1/Katyn_-_decision_of_massacre_p1.jpg

[Thomen]

Anyone else getting flashbacks from 2003 when Comical Ali said "There are no American tanks ins Baghdad"?

[Bruno Lotse]

I support what was said by Winston Churchill in British Parliament after Stalin's death.

Stalin inherited Russia equipped with a wooden plow,
Stalin bequested Russia equipped with a Hydrogen Bomb.

[Bruno Lotse]

Katyn Massacre? Sure. Germans did it.
Burdenko commission came to this conclusion back in 1943
in presense even Americans amongs which were a daughter of US Ambassador to the USSR Mr. Garriman.
That is just plain wrong.

This is a piece of forgery. This kinda 'document' was once presented to the Russian Constitutional Court and was rejected as a forgery.
Simple like that.
You should know this, ZeroNiner.

[Thomen]

Katyn Massacre? Sure. Germans did it.
Burdenko commission came to this conclusion back in 1943
in presense even Americans amongs which were a daughter of US Ambassador to the USSR Mr. Garriman.
That is just plain wrong.

This is a piece of forgery. This kinda document was once presented to the Russian Constitutional Court and was rejected as a forgery.
Simple like that.

Source?

[Zero Niner]

What about this then:

The Nazis discovered the bodies of several thousand Polish officers at Katyn in 1943, but Moscow did not admit responsibility for the killings until 1989.

Link: http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/4102967.stm

But going by your previous posts (not just in this thread) you'll probably claim that it was all a fabrication by Imperialist Western media out to tarnish the good image of the Soviet Union. :roll:

[Happy Times]

Katyn Massacre? Sure. Germans did it.
Burdenko commission came to this conclusion back in 1943
in presense even Americans amongs which were a daughter of US Ambassador to the USSR Mr. Garriman.
That is just plain wrong.

This is a piece of forgery. This kinda document was once presented to the Russian Constitutional Court and was rejected as a forgery.
Simple like that.

Source?

The date of the rejection would be interesting.

[Thomen]

I guess, I found one of Bruno's sources..

http://www.stalinsociety.org.uk/katyn.html

[Skybird]

I support what was said by Winston Churchill in British Parliament after Stalin's death.

Stalin inherited Russia equipped with a wooden plow, Stalin bequested Russia equipped with Hydrogen Bomb.

People starting an egg-dance when being asked a straight question, usually know that a straight answer would leave them open for attack or criticism, so they try to deceive it. But that way they have given the obvious answer nevertheless.

In my real life I do not tolerate Neonazis, Stalinists, Scientologists, fundamental Islamists and sympathisers and defenders of genocides, mass-killing and totalitarian ideologies, of which all the mentioned terms before are derivates and variations. As a matter of fact I have kicked out such people in my real life on more than one occasion. So why should I tolerate them in the virtual world.

Assuming that you are in no position to do real damage to the world I conclude that it is safe to ignore you. Farewell, and please, do not search for me - i do not wish to have anything more to do with you.

[Bruno Lotse]

<<In my real life I do not tolerate Neonazis, Stalinists, Scientologists, fundamental Islamists and sympathisers and defenders of genocides, mass-killing and totalitarian ideologies, of which all the mentioned terms before are derivates and variations. As a matter of fact I have kicked such people out on more than one opportunity. So why should I tolerate them in the virtual world. Assuming that you are in no position to do real damage to the world I conclude that it is safe to ignore you. Farewell, and please, do not search me - i do not wish to have anything more to do with you.>>

It's certainly your right.
But it doesn't prove that I am wrong.
And frankly speaking, I am not really afraid of tags.

I still support the choice of Russian people
Stalin, Alexander Nevskiy, Zhukov
http://www.nameofrussia.ru/rating.html

[Bruno Lotse]

I guess, I found one of Bruno's sources..

http://www.stalinsociety.org.uk/katyn.html Did you find a reference to that so called 'document' pellted by Zero Niner?
Forgery is forgery. If court says so - please do not show that crap paper to me.

[Zero Niner]

So I suppose this site is all about forged documents?

http://ru_katyn.livejournal.com/tag/link-sealed-envelope-aprf

[Bruno Lotse]

Katyn Massacre? Sure. Germans did it.
Burdenko commission came to this conclusion back in 1943
in presense even Americans amongs which were a daughter of US Ambassador to the USSR Mr. Garriman.
That is just plain wrong.

This is a piece of forgery. This kinda document was once presented to the Russian Constitutional Court and was rejected as a forgery.
Simple like that.
Source? You check out Russian Constitutional court findings on the case of
attemped declaration of Communist party a criminal organization.

One of item of accusations was Katyn and as an evidence the accusing party presented that document.
Court after investigation came to a conclusion that 'document' is just a forgery. Rejected.

It was also discussed in literature. You can check out
Mukhin Katynskiy Detektiv
The author discusses that 'document' in his book and mentions the Constitutional Court findings.

If you can read Russian you can get this book right here
http://lib.aldebaran.ru/author/muhin_yurii/muhin_yurii_katynskii_detektiv/

Юрий Игнатьевич Мухин
Катынский детектив
(1995 г.)

Or updated and expanded book on all Katyn package by the same author
http://lib.aldebaran.ru/author/muhin_yurii/muhin_yurii_antirossiiskaya_podlost/

Юрий Игнатьевич Мухин
Антироссийская подлость

[Zero Niner]

So I suppose Mikhail Gorbachev was in actuality a CIA spy, when in 1990 he admitted Soviet involvement in the Katyn massacre, and 2 years later the Russian government handed over official Soviet documents to Lech Walesa showing that your hero Stalin had ordered the execution of the Polish prisoners?

http://edition.cnn.com/SPECIALS/cold.war/episodes/01/spotlight/index.html

[Bruno Lotse]

So I suppose this site is all about forged documents?

http://ru_katyn.livejournal.com/tag/link-sealed-envelope-aprf

I don't take blogs as a proof of anything.
Certainly not in the case when there is a Constitutional Court decision.

[Bruno Lotse]

So I suppose Mikhail Gorbachev was in actuality a CIA spy, when in 1990 he admitted Soviet involvement in the Katyn massacre, and 2 years later the Russian government handed over official Soviet documents to Lech Walesa showing that your hero Stalin had ordered the execution of the Polish prisoners?

http://edition.cnn.com/SPECIALS/cold.war/episodes/01/spotlight/index.html
Who really knows.
But if you check the Name of Russia poll you won't find Gorby there.
He lost hist credit.
Sure, the West loves him - look what he and his crony Shevarnadze did to the Russian state!
But his problem is the Russian people do not.

Gorby did a lot of things.
There was an investigation committee on Katyn and they allegedly compiled evidences
BUT they didn't bring court action!!!

That means as of now all those evidences given to Gorby on bases of which he made
a political statement
DO NOT HOLD WATER for a court.

Most interestingly, I read an article some time ago (in June???) that Poles
lost ?!!!? all those documents handed over by the Soviets.
How come, LOST!!!

[Thomen]

So I suppose this site is all about forged documents?

http://ru_katyn.livejournal.com/tag/link-sealed-envelope-aprf
I don't take blogs as a proof of anything.
Certainly not in the case when there is a Constitutional Court decision.

Well, I take the word of Mikhail Gorbachev everyday over that of some random guy on an internet forum. :up:

[Zero Niner]

Who really knows.
But if you check the Name of Russia poll you won't find Gorby there.
He lost hist credit.

Gorby did a lot of things.
There was an investigation committee on Katyn and they allegedly compiled evidences
BUT they don't bring court action!!!
That means as of now all those evidences given to Gorby on bases of which he made
a political statement
DO NOT HOLD WATER for a court.

Most interestingly, I read an article some time ago (in June???) that Poles
lost ?!!!? all those documents handed over by the Soviets.
How come, LOST!!!

That's irrelevant. Gorbachev's standing amongst Russians is also irrelevant.

You claimed that the Germans were responsible for the Katyn massacre. The sources I've looked at say otherwise. News report also mention that the Soviets admitted that they, and not the Germans, did it. Whether or not the documents exist, or are lost as you claim, doesn't change the fact that the USSR *ADMITTED* that they did it. Whether there was legal action, or a trial or not also doesn't change the fact of admission. The prerogative to prosecute lies within the legal system and there may be reasons why the state decides not to prosecute a crime even after admission of guilt.

Are you now trying to say that the USSR *lied* in 1990. If so, why would they confess to a heinous act when they didn't, in fact, do it?

[Happy Times]

Who really knows.
But if you check the Name of Russia poll you won't find Gorby there.
He lost hist credit.

Gorby did a lot of things.
There was an investigation committee on Katyn and they allegedly compiled evidences
BUT they don't bring court action!!!
That means as of now all those evidences given to Gorby on bases of which he made
a political statement
DO NOT HOLD WATER for a court.

Most interestingly, I read an article some time ago (in June???) that Poles
lost ?!!!? all those documents handed over by the Soviets.
How come, LOST!!!

That's irrelevant. Gorbachev's standing amongst Russians is also irrelevant.

You claimed that the Germans were responsible for the Katyn massacre. The sources I've looked at say otherwise. News report also mention that the Soviets admitted that they, and not the Germans, did it. Whether or not the documents exist, or are lost as you claim, doesn't change the fact that the USSR *ADMITTED* that they did it. Whether there was legal action, or a trial or not also doesn't change the fact of admission. The prerogative to prosecute lies within the legal system and there may be reasons why the state decides not to prosecute a crime even after admission of guilt.

Are you now trying to say that the USSR *lied* in 1990. If so, why would they confess to a heinous act when they didn't, in fact, do it?

You cant surpass the official truth with your Western forgeries.

[OneToughHerring]

Za Rodinu! Za Stalina!

http://www3.nameofrussia.ru/p/t_8828.jpg

Сталин Иосиф Виссарионович
1879–1953 гг.

Hey guys,
Check out this site http://www.nameofrussia.ru/rating.html

It's called The Name of Russia

It's Russians are voting the most important person in their history.
Georgian Iosif Stalin is on the second place
for the whole 1000 years of Russian statehood.
Yet I have a hunch he will end up on top as he would always do.

I see Zhukov is third place now. Personally I might vote him if I could vote in this thing.

[Bruno Lotse]

Who really knows.
But if you check the Name of Russia poll you won't find Gorby there.
He lost hist credit.

Gorby did a lot of things.
There was an investigation committee on Katyn and they allegedly compiled evidences
BUT they don't bring court action!!!
That means as of now all those evidences given to Gorby on bases of which he made
a political statement
DO NOT HOLD WATER for a court.

Most interestingly, I read an article some time ago (in June???) that Poles
lost ?!!!? all those documents handed over by the Soviets.
How come, LOST!!!
That's irrelevant. Gorbachev's standing amongst Russians is also irrelevant.

You claimed that the Germans were responsible for the Katyn massacre. The sources I've looked at say otherwise. News report also mention that the Soviets admitted that they, and not the Germans, did it. Whether or not the documents exist, or are lost as you claim, doesn't change the fact that the USSR *ADMITTED* that they did it. Whether there was legal action, or a trial or not also doesn't change the fact of admission. The prerogative to prosecute lies within the legal system and there may be reasons why the state decides not to prosecute a crime even after admission of guilt.

Are you now trying to say that the USSR *lied* in 1990. If so, why would they confess to a heinous act when they didn't, in fact, do it?


If owners of those sources have a proof of Russian responsability in Katyn massacre
those owners should start a court case against political structures responsible for Katyn.

They might also provide their 'evidences' to the Government of Poland and the Government of Poland would be only happy to bring a court case against 'evil Russkies'
in one of International courts which are many. There are money involved here. If Russia looses, Russia most probably would have to pay compensations to relatives of Polish servicemen in Katyn forest. Hey, Russians have oil! They would afford payng compensations.

Why Poland does not bring a court case if 'evidences' are abound and Russian archives are open? Why Polish are so shy? Instead of legal action which would require fool-proof documents, Polish would print articles, make shows or movies, i.e. be engaged only in propaganda war.

As of now I do not know A SINGLE COURT CASE (except mentioned decision of a Russian Constitutional Court) where either of parties would use those 'evidences'. DO YOU?

If they do not have a case that means those 'documents' are nothing more then
tools in propaganda war. They are forgery. Period.

[Bruno Lotse]

Za Rodinu! Za Stalina!

http://www3.nameofrussia.ru/p/t_8828.jpg

Сталин Иосиф Виссарионович
1879–1953 гг.

Hey guys,
Check out this site http://www.nameofrussia.ru/rating.html

It's called The Name of Russia

It's Russians are voting the most important person in their history.
Georgian Iosif Stalin is on the second place
for the whole 1000 years of Russian statehood.
Yet I have a hunch he will end up on top as he would always do.
I see Zhukov is third place now. Personally I might vote him if I could vote in this thing.
Actually you can. But they would ask you a question on history of Russia
in Russian language to check whether you can read Russian sources.

Hey, Stalin right now is on the first one.
I told you he would turn up on the top.

[Bruno Lotse]

So I suppose this site is all about forged documents?

http://ru_katyn.livejournal.com/tag/link-sealed-envelope-aprf
I don't take blogs as a proof of anything.
Certainly not in the case when there is a Constitutional Court decision.
Well, I take the word of Mikhail Gorbachev everyday over that of some random guy on an internet forum. :up:
Take it. Be another casualty in propaganda wars. It's a war. There are many casualties.

In my case, until I see a court decision in which all those 'documents' are used as evidences
I am sticking to Burdenko commission findings
Burdenko commission was monitored by US representetives
amongst which was a daughter of US Ambassador to the USSR Ms. Garriman.

[Happy Times]

So I suppose this site is all about forged documents?

http://ru_katyn.livejournal.com/tag/link-sealed-envelope-aprf
I don't take blogs as a proof of anything.
Certainly not in the case when there is a Constitutional Court decision.
Well, I take the word of Mikhail Gorbachev everyday over that of some random guy on an internet forum. :up:
Take it. Be another casualty in propaganda wars. It's a war. There are many casualties.

In my case, until I see a court decision in which all those 'documents' are used as evidences
I am sticking to Burdenko commission findings
Burdenko commission was monitored by US representetives
amongst which was a daughter of US Ambassador to the USSR Ms. Garriman.

Do you think the majority of Russians share your wiew or are you in the minority?

[OneToughHerring]

Za Rodinu! Za Stalina!

http://www3.nameofrussia.ru/p/t_8828.jpg

Сталин Иосиф Виссарионович
1879–1953 гг.

Hey guys,
Check out this site http://www.nameofrussia.ru/rating.html

It's called The Name of Russia

It's Russians are voting the most important person in their history.
Georgian Iosif Stalin is on the second place
for the whole 1000 years of Russian statehood.
Yet I have a hunch he will end up on top as he would always do.
I see Zhukov is third place now. Personally I might vote him if I could vote in this thing.
Actually you can. But they would ask you a question on history of Russia
in Russian language to check whether you can read Russian sources.
I know the cyrillic alphabet but my Russian grammar is a little rusty. Oh well...

Also nice to see Korolev, the rocket guy, in sixth place. He was kinda forgotten for awhile although he was the brains behind the USSR space program.

[Happy Times]

I know the cyrillic alphabet but my Russian grammar is a little rusty. Oh well...

Also nice to see Korolev, the rocket guy, in sixth place. He was kinda forgotten for awhile although he was the brains behind the USSR space program.

You really are someone the security services should monitor.

[Mikhayl]

I know the cyrillic alphabet but my Russian grammar is a little rusty. Oh well...

Also nice to see Korolev, the rocket guy, in sixth place. He was kinda forgotten for awhile although he was the brains behind the USSR space program.
You really are someone the security services should monitor.

And you dare bitching on Stalin :rotfl:

[Bruno Lotse]

So I suppose this site is all about forged documents?

http://ru_katyn.livejournal.com/tag/link-sealed-envelope-aprf
I don't take blogs as a proof of anything.
Certainly not in the case when there is a Constitutional Court decision.
Well, I take the word of Mikhail Gorbachev everyday over that of some random guy on an internet forum. :up:
Take it. Be another casualty in propaganda wars. It's a war. There are many casualties.

In my case, until I see a court decision in which all those 'documents' are used as evidences
I am sticking to Burdenko commission findings
Burdenko commission was monitored by US representetives
amongst which was a daughter of US Ambassador to the USSR Ms. Garriman.
Do you think the majority of Russians share your wiew or are you in the minority?

Listen, didn't I told you before - I do not want either read or answer to your posts.
Keep posting if you will but I am ignoring you.

[Bruno Lotse]

Za Rodinu! Za Stalina!

http://www3.nameofrussia.ru/p/t_8828.jpg

Сталин Иосиф Виссарионович
1879–1953 гг.

Hey guys,
Check out this site http://www.nameofrussia.ru/rating.html

It's called The Name of Russia

It's Russians are voting the most important person in their history.
Georgian Iosif Stalin is on the second place
for the whole 1000 years of Russian statehood.
Yet I have a hunch he will end up on top as he would always do.
I see Zhukov is third place now. Personally I might vote him if I could vote in this thing.
Actually you can. But they would ask you a question on history of Russia
in Russian language to check whether you can read Russian sources.
I know the cyrillic alphabet but my Russian grammar is a little rusty. Oh well...

Also nice to see Korolev, the rocket guy, in sixth place. He was kinda forgotten for awhile although he was the brains behind the USSR space program.
You are absolutely right.

BTW I guess you understand why they insist on input in Russian language.

[Happy Times]

I know the cyrillic alphabet but my Russian grammar is a little rusty. Oh well...

Also nice to see Korolev, the rocket guy, in sixth place. He was kinda forgotten for awhile although he was the brains behind the USSR space program.
You really are someone the security services should monitor.

And you dare bitching on Stalin :rotfl:

Im not the one with symphaties for extreme ideologies, the security services have a role in protecting our society.

[Konovalov]

Bruno Lotse,

In most of your threads and posts on Subsim since the Georgia crisis I have detected a pattern in your posts. When challenged or questioned you always dance around it by diverting the topic. Many of your posts are aimed at baiting others. When you on the race occassion point to evidence and sources they are of highly dubious historical value coming from questionable and heavily biased sources.

Looking at your recent track record I can only conclude that it is a complete waste of time even attemting to discuss anything on this forum with you. In that I share fully Skybird's thoughts and views on this topic and indeed you.

My advise to all on Subsim is don't feed this troll.

Proshai Bruno!

[Mikhayl]

I know the cyrillic alphabet but my Russian grammar is a little rusty. Oh well...

Also nice to see Korolev, the rocket guy, in sixth place. He was kinda forgotten for awhile although he was the brains behind the USSR space program.
You really are someone the security services should monitor.
And you dare bitching on Stalin :rotfl:
Im not the one with symphaties for extreme ideologies, the security services have a role in protecting our society.

Yeah knowing a foreign alphabet and mentionning a rocket scientist is indeed a serious threat :D
"everyone if after me because I'm paranoid !"

[Happy Times]

I know the cyrillic alphabet but my Russian grammar is a little rusty. Oh well...

Also nice to see Korolev, the rocket guy, in sixth place. He was kinda forgotten for awhile although he was the brains behind the USSR space program.
You really are someone the security services should monitor.
And you dare bitching on Stalin :rotfl:
Im not the one with symphaties for extreme ideologies, the security services have a role in protecting our society.

Yeah knowing a foreign alphabet and mentionning a rocket scientist is indeed a serious threat :D
"everyone if after me because I'm paranoid !"

It was based on his previous posts, this is just a tip on where he is coming from.

[Bruno Lotse]

Bruno Lotse,

In most of your threads and posts on Subsim since the Georgia crisis I have detected a pattern in your posts. When challenged or questioned you always dance around it by diverting the topic. Many of your posts are aimed at baiting others. When you on the race occassion point to evidence and sources they are of highly dubious historical value coming from questionable and heavily biased sources.

Looking at your recent track record I can only conclude that it is a complete waste of time even attemting to discuss anything on this forum with you. In that I share fully Skybird's thoughts and views on this topic and indeed you.

My advise to all on Subsim is don't feed this troll.

Proshai Bruno!
Proshai Konovalov.

Do you know that one of the meanings of a word KONOVAL in Russian
is charlatan ?
So your nick in Russian sounds - 'a son of charlatan'

Your loving troll

[OneToughHerring]

I know the cyrillic alphabet but my Russian grammar is a little rusty. Oh well...

Also nice to see Korolev, the rocket guy, in sixth place. He was kinda forgotten for awhile although he was the brains behind the USSR space program.
You really are someone the security services should monitor.
And you dare bitching on Stalin :rotfl:
Im not the one with symphaties for extreme ideologies, the security services have a role in protecting our society.
Yeah knowing a foreign alphabet and mentionning a rocket scientist is indeed a serious threat :D
"everyone if after me because I'm paranoid !"
It was based on his previous posts, this is just a tip on where he is coming from.

Oh just chill out. I doubt you will get very far as a student of history if you constantly in every way try to belittle the achievements of Russian or Soviet scientists and other significant people. For example Korolev, he was a great scientist and the Americans benefited from the knowledge in the Russian space program when, for example, creating the international space station together with the Russians. So it's not all black and white.

[Bruno Lotse]

Exactly.
Some people are lying that under Stalin was a paradise on Earth,
some people are lying that under Stalin was a hell on Earth.

[Happy Times]

I know the cyrillic alphabet but my Russian grammar is a little rusty. Oh well...

Also nice to see Korolev, the rocket guy, in sixth place. He was kinda forgotten for awhile although he was the brains behind the USSR space program.
You really are someone the security services should monitor.
And you dare bitching on Stalin :rotfl:
Im not the one with symphaties for extreme ideologies, the security services have a role in protecting our society.
Yeah knowing a foreign alphabet and mentionning a rocket scientist is indeed a serious threat :D
"everyone if after me because I'm paranoid !"
It was based on his previous posts, this is just a tip on where he is coming from.

Oh just chill out. I doubt you will get very far as a student of history if you constantly in every way try to belittle the achievements of Russian or Soviet scientists and other significant people. For example Korolev, he was a great scientist and the Americans benefited from the knowledge in the Russian space program when, for example, creating the international space station together with the Russians. So it's not all black and white.

I dont belittle Russian scientists, i ment you are a person security services would be interested if you ever held a position involving national security. That is still my opinion, want to answer some test quoestions?

[OneToughHerring]

I know the cyrillic alphabet but my Russian grammar is a little rusty. Oh well...

Also nice to see Korolev, the rocket guy, in sixth place. He was kinda forgotten for awhile although he was the brains behind the USSR space program.
You really are someone the security services should monitor.
And you dare bitching on Stalin :rotfl:
Im not the one with symphaties for extreme ideologies, the security services have a role in protecting our society.
Yeah knowing a foreign alphabet and mentionning a rocket scientist is indeed a serious threat :D
"everyone if after me because I'm paranoid !"
It was based on his previous posts, this is just a tip on where he is coming from.
Oh just chill out. I doubt you will get very far as a student of history if you constantly in every way try to belittle the achievements of Russian or Soviet scientists and other significant people. For example Korolev, he was a great scientist and the Americans benefited from the knowledge in the Russian space program when, for example, creating the international space station together with the Russians. So it's not all black and white.
I dont belittle Russian scientists, i ment you are a person security services would be interested if you ever held a position involving national security. That is still my opinion, want to answer some test quoestions?

What questions? Are you hiring for the Supo or something? (Supo = Finnish 'secret service').

[Happy Times]

I know the cyrillic alphabet but my Russian grammar is a little rusty. Oh well...

Also nice to see Korolev, the rocket guy, in sixth place. He was kinda forgotten for awhile although he was the brains behind the USSR space program.
You really are someone the security services should monitor.
And you dare bitching on Stalin :rotfl:
Im not the one with symphaties for extreme ideologies, the security services have a role in protecting our society.
Yeah knowing a foreign alphabet and mentionning a rocket scientist is indeed a serious threat :D
"everyone if after me because I'm paranoid !"
It was based on his previous posts, this is just a tip on where he is coming from.
Oh just chill out. I doubt you will get very far as a student of history if you constantly in every way try to belittle the achievements of Russian or Soviet scientists and other significant people. For example Korolev, he was a great scientist and the Americans benefited from the knowledge in the Russian space program when, for example, creating the international space station together with the Russians. So it's not all black and white.
I dont belittle Russian scientists, i ment you are a person security services would be interested if you ever held a position involving national security. That is still my opinion, want to answer some test quoestions?

What questions? Are you hiring for the Supo or something? (Supo = Finnish 'secret service').

http://www.politicalcompass.org/

That would be a start, maybe you can take it with Bruno..

[Mikhayl]

Cool test, I would be close to Nelson Mandela and the Dalai Lama :cool:

[Happy Times]

Cool test, I would be close to Nelson Mandela and the Dalai Lama :cool:

How much? It gives you the result in points.

[Mikhayl]

Your political compass

Economic Left/Right: -4.12
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -5.44

http://img377.imageshack.us/img377/7571/pcgraphpngphpfj5.png

[OneToughHerring]

I have about same as Mikhayl. Although I don't think that test is very accurate, the same rules don't apply similarily in every country. For example I think the government should be strong in many ways, yet it puts me as a libertarian and George Bush as authoritarian. Go figure.

[Happy Times]

Economic Left/Right: 1.12
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 2.05

http://img151.imageshack.us/img151/8164/juhavf6.png (http://imageshack.us)

[Konovalov]

It seems the political compass test pops up here every year. Always interesting to see forum members results for a bit of fun. :)

[Bruno Lotse]

Oh, you popped up in this thread.
Hm. Didn't you call on everybody to ignore it:rotfl:

[Happy Times]

Exactly.
Some people are lying that under Stalin was a paradise on Earth,
some people are lying that under Stalin was a hell on Earth.

Depends who you ask, after the murdering maniacs you have had its possible it was just average.

[Bruno Lotse]

Slaves hate their masters.
Finland was a slave or one might say a puppy on a short leash.

Proud people appreciate their leaders and keep on voting for them.

[Happy Times]

Slaves hate their masters.
Finland was a slave or one might say a puppy on a short leash.

Proud people appreciate their leaders and keep on voting for them.

:rotfl:

Only slaves your going to find in Russia, long history in that, we have never had serfs like you.

You have never had a free election Bruno the Serf, just serving the master and obeying the official truth.

[Sailor Steve]

Didn't check the score - just got the graph.
http://www.politicalcompass.org/facebook/pcgraphpng.php?ec=0.38&soc=-4.15

[kurtz]

Cool test, I would be close to Nelson Mandela and the Dalai Lama :cool:
But from the websites explanation

Socialists like Mahatma Gandhi and Robert Mugabe would occupy a less extreme leftist position.

ghandi and mugabe were seperated at birth?

and I'm like the pope??

[Digital_Trucker]

Economic Left/Right: -5.75
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -1.85


http://img156.imageshack.us/img156/883/pcgraphpngphpid6.th.png (http://img156.imageshack.us/my.php?image=pcgraphpngphpid6.png)

Never would have guessed that result:hmm: Go figure:rotfl:

[Thomen]

This flawed poll that Bruno is showing off as a proof for something is pretty ridiculous. As he said it himself.. everybody can vote their (which rather negates the validity of the poll). Hell, you don't even need to know Russian or Cyrillic.

I voted for this dude here..
http://www.nameofrussia.ru/person.html?id=76

no clue who is was. but the picture looked cool. hehe

If i read the intructions correct, you can vote mulitple time, for multiple persons, and/or the same person.

Now thats a qualifying poll. :damn:

EDIT: As far as the question for history goes, either wing it, or babelfish it. =)

[STEED]

The Political Compass


Economic Left/Right: 6.12
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 4.00

http://img186.imageshack.us/img186/4769/pcgraphpngfo1.png

[Happy Times]

The Political Compass


Economic Left/Right: 6.12
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 4.00

http://www.politicalcompass.org/facebook/pcgraphpng.php?ec=6.12&soc=4.00

Your turning Nazi.:lol:

[Mikhayl]

Digital Trucker is a closet commie and Steed is actually ... Gordon Brown :o:rotfl:
http://www.politicalcompass.org/images/internationalchart.gif

[STEED]

The Political Compass


Economic Left/Right: 6.12
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: 4.00

http://www.politicalcompass.org/facebook/pcgraphpng.php?ec=6.12&soc=4.00

Your turning Nazi.:lol:

You watch it or I will invade your country. :D

[STEED]

Digital Trucker is a closet commie and Steed is actually ... Gordon Brown :o:rotfl:
http://www.politicalcompass.org/images/internationalchart.gif

Thats BS. :p

Gordon Brown is busy giving money away to the feckless and worthless washouts of this country.

[OneToughHerring]

This flawed poll that Bruno is showing off as a proof for something is pretty ridiculous. As he said it himself.. everybody can vote their (which rather negates the validity of the poll). Hell, you don't even need to know Russian or Cyrillic.

I voted for this dude here..
http://www.nameofrussia.ru/person.html?id=76

no clue who is was. but the picture looked cool. hehe

If i read the intructions correct, you can vote mulitple time, for multiple persons, and/or the same person.

Now thats a qualifying poll. :damn:

EDIT: As far as the question for history goes, either wing it, or babelfish it. =)
You voted for this guy. Not really a Russian, but a viking ruler who ruled in Russia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rurik

[Thomen]

This flawed poll that Bruno is showing off as a proof for something is pretty ridiculous. As he said it himself.. everybody can vote their (which rather negates the validity of the poll). Hell, you don't even need to know Russian or Cyrillic.

I voted for this dude here..
http://www.nameofrussia.ru/person.html?id=76

no clue who is was. but the picture looked cool. hehe

If i read the intructions correct, you can vote mulitple time, for multiple persons, and/or the same person.

Now thats a qualifying poll. :damn:

EDIT: As far as the question for history goes, either wing it, or babelfish it. =)
You voted for this guy. Not really a Russian, but a viking ruler who ruled in Russia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rurik

Awesome, thanks =)

[Digital_Trucker]

Digital Trucker is a closet commie and Steed is actually ... Gordon Brown :o:rotfl:
http://www.politicalcompass.org/images/internationalchart.gif

Actually, I came out of the closet, it was dark in there:rotfl:

[Oberon]

Wow, I'm straying into Libertarian territory now for the first time, I was Authoritarian Left not so long ago.

Your political compass

Economic Left/Right: -6.12
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -0.87



http://www.politicalcompass.org/facebook/pcgraphpng.php?ec=-6.12&soc=-0.87

[Bruno Lotse]

This flawed poll that Bruno is showing off as a proof for something is pretty ridiculous. As he said it himself.. everybody can vote their (which rather negates the validity of the poll). Hell, you don't even need to know Russian or Cyrillic.

I voted for this dude here..
http://www.nameofrussia.ru/person.html?id=76

no clue who is was. but the picture looked cool. hehe

If i read the intructions correct, you can vote mulitple time, for multiple persons, and/or the same person.

Now thats a qualifying poll. :damn:

EDIT: As far as the question for history goes, either wing it, or babelfish it. =)

Are you sure your vote was accepted?
What was the answer on the baloon when you clicked?

There are two possible answers IN RUSSIAN
1. Your vote is accepted - if you correctly answered multiple-choce.
2. Your vote is not accepted - if you failed to provide a correct answer on multiple-choice.

[Thomen]

This flawed poll that Bruno is showing off as a proof for something is pretty ridiculous. As he said it himself.. everybody can vote their (which rather negates the validity of the poll). Hell, you don't even need to know Russian or Cyrillic.

I voted for this dude here..
http://www.nameofrussia.ru/person.html?id=76

no clue who is was. but the picture looked cool. hehe

If i read the intructions correct, you can vote mulitple time, for multiple persons, and/or the same person.

Now thats a qualifying poll. :damn:


EDIT: As far as the question for history goes, either wing it, or babelfish it. =)
Are you sure your vote was accepted?
What was the answer on the baloon when you clicked?

There are two possible answers IN RUSSIAN
1. Your vote is accepted - if you correctly answered multiple-choce.
2. Your vote is not accepted - if you failed to provide a correct answer on multiple-choice.
Yep it did count.

EDIT:
You do NOT need to speak Russian to take that poll.. I certainly do not speak nor understand Russian.
This http://babelfish.yahoo.com/ negates the need for it.

[Bruno Lotse]

This flawed poll that Bruno is showing off as a proof for something is pretty ridiculous. As he said it himself.. everybody can vote their (which rather negates the validity of the poll). Hell, you don't even need to know Russian or Cyrillic.

I voted for this dude here..
http://www.nameofrussia.ru/person.html?id=76

no clue who is was. but the picture looked cool. hehe

If i read the intructions correct, you can vote mulitple time, for multiple persons, and/or the same person.

Now thats a qualifying poll. :damn:

EDIT: As far as the question for history goes, either wing it, or babelfish it. =)
You voted for this guy. Not really a Russian, but a viking ruler who ruled in Russia.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rurik

Cool, you're right.
He was the founder of dynasty which ruled Russia up until 17th century.
The last guy from the dynasty was Ivan Vasilievich IV.
They were called Rjurikovichy.

[OneToughHerring]

I've heard that in some circles in Russia there is still a respect of the Vikings who came there. There are even folks building viking ships and sailing on the Volga or some other river etc.

[Bruno Lotse]

This flawed poll that Bruno is showing off as a proof for something is pretty ridiculous. As he said it himself.. everybody can vote their (which rather negates the validity of the poll). Hell, you don't even need to know Russian or Cyrillic.

I voted for this dude here..
http://www.nameofrussia.ru/person.html?id=76

no clue who is was. but the picture looked cool. hehe

If i read the intructions correct, you can vote mulitple time, for multiple persons, and/or the same person.

Now thats a qualifying poll. :damn:


EDIT: As far as the question for history goes, either wing it, or babelfish it. =)
Are you sure your vote was accepted?
What was the answer on the baloon when you clicked?

There are two possible answers IN RUSSIAN
1. Your vote is accepted - if you correctly answered multiple-choce.
2. Your vote is not accepted - if you failed to provide a correct answer on multiple-choice.
Yep it did count.

Of cause, it's not fool-proof, and of cause you might guess a correct multiple-choice
BY CHANCE if you ether don't know language or nation's history.

Yet it shows the tendency in people preferences in terms of their leaders.

[Thomen]

I've heard that in some circles in Russia there is still a respect of the Vikings who came there. There are even folks building viking ships and sailing on the Volga or some other river etc.

The Russians are descended from a Viking tribe as far as I remember. The Rus Vikings had settlements there, hence the name, Russia.

[Digital_Trucker]

Yet it shows the tendency in people preferences in terms of their leaders.

It shows the tendencies of the people who have computers, take the time to vote and those who vote the most. The way it is set up, it has no statistical meaning.

[OneToughHerring]

This flawed poll that Bruno is showing off as a proof for something is pretty ridiculous. As he said it himself.. everybody can vote their (which rather negates the validity of the poll). Hell, you don't even need to know Russian or Cyrillic.

I voted for this dude here..
http://www.nameofrussia.ru/person.html?id=76

no clue who is was. but the picture looked cool. hehe

If i read the intructions correct, you can vote mulitple time, for multiple persons, and/or the same person.

Now thats a qualifying poll. :damn:


EDIT: As far as the question for history goes, either wing it, or babelfish it. =)
Are you sure your vote was accepted?
What was the answer on the baloon when you clicked?

There are two possible answers IN RUSSIAN
1. Your vote is accepted - if you correctly answered multiple-choce.
2. Your vote is not accepted - if you failed to provide a correct answer on multiple-choice.
Yep it did count.
Of cause, it's not fool-proof, and of cause you might guess a correct multiple-choice
BY CHANCE if you ether don't know language or nation's history.

Yet it shows the tendency in people preferences in terms of their leaders.
I had a question about Dostoyevsky, and although I didn't quite understand the question I noticed that one of the answers was "Roulette" and I remembered that that was Dostoyevskys favourite game so I guessed it. I think it was the correct answer.

So my vote counted. I've done my part! :D

[Bruno Lotse]

I've heard that in some circles in Russia there is still a respect of the Vikings who came there. There are even folks building viking ships and sailing on the Volga or some other river etc.
Northern Russians are a mixture of slavic, finn, and germanic people (vikings - they are called varjags there).
Varjags (vikings) were military nobility of the area - warriors, traiders, sailors.
Now Russians would reenact it as a touch to their own acient history.

[Thomen]

This flawed poll that Bruno is showing off as a proof for something is pretty ridiculous. As he said it himself.. everybody can vote their (which rather negates the validity of the poll). Hell, you don't even need to know Russian or Cyrillic.

I voted for this dude here..
http://www.nameofrussia.ru/person.html?id=76

no clue who is was. but the picture looked cool. hehe

If i read the intructions correct, you can vote mulitple time, for multiple persons, and/or the same person.

Now thats a qualifying poll. :damn:


EDIT: As far as the question for history goes, either wing it, or babelfish it. =)
Are you sure your vote was accepted?
What was the answer on the baloon when you clicked?

There are two possible answers IN RUSSIAN
1. Your vote is accepted - if you correctly answered multiple-choce.
2. Your vote is not accepted - if you failed to provide a correct answer on multiple-choice.
Yep it did count.
Of cause, it's not fool-proof, and of cause you might guess a correct multiple-choice
BY CHANCE if you ether don't know language or nation's history.

Yet it shows the tendency in people preferences in terms of their leaders.

While I do not really disagree with you, I do not think that this poll is about leaders, rather than the most revered or favored/famous persons in Russian history. Otherwise there wouldn't be Soccer stars, Cosmonauts, Scientists and Artists in the list. If it is about leaders the list misses some names.

[Bruno Lotse]

Yet it shows the tendency in people preferences in terms of their leaders.
It shows the tendencies of the people who have computers, take the time to vote and those who vote the most. The way it is set up, it has no statistical meaning. Ah, you're again.
Are we smoking a peace-pipe?;)
Or a samold, samold.

[Bruno Lotse]

This flawed poll that Bruno is showing off as a proof for something is pretty ridiculous. As he said it himself.. everybody can vote their (which rather negates the validity of the poll). Hell, you don't even need to know Russian or Cyrillic.

I voted for this dude here..
http://www.nameofrussia.ru/person.html?id=76

no clue who is was. but the picture looked cool. hehe

If i read the intructions correct, you can vote mulitple time, for multiple persons, and/or the same person.

Now thats a qualifying poll. :damn:


EDIT: As far as the question for history goes, either wing it, or babelfish it. =)
Are you sure your vote was accepted?
What was the answer on the baloon when you clicked?

There are two possible answers IN RUSSIAN
1. Your vote is accepted - if you correctly answered multiple-choce.
2. Your vote is not accepted - if you failed to provide a correct answer on multiple-choice.
Yep it did count.
Of cause, it's not fool-proof, and of cause you might guess a correct multiple-choice
BY CHANCE if you ether don't know language or nation's history.

Yet it shows the tendency in people preferences in terms of their leaders.
While I do not really disagree with you, I do not think that this poll is about leaders, rather than the most revered or favored/famous persons in Russian history. Otherwise there wouldn't be Soccer stars, Cosmonauts, Scientists and Artists in the list. If it is about leaders the list misses some names. And still as you see, the people have enough brains not to put
on top or somewhere close to top some kinky stripper or a rock-star.

It's really Name of Russia.
Which person would associate with importance and glory of that nation. Something like that. At least it's my reading.
Yep, revered and favoured people in their 1000 year long history.

[OneToughHerring]

Yes, we had a similar thing here called the Greates Finn. Although that was a telephone voting - thing and not through the Internet like this one. Also in Great Britain there was a Greatest Briton or something similar. I thought this might be that type of contest.

The Finnish contest was won by our Marshall Mannerheim, a WW 2 figurehead.

[Bruno Lotse]

Yes, we had a similar thing here called the Greates Finn. Although that was a telephone voting - thing and not through the Internet like this one. Also in Great Britain there was a Greatest Briton or something similar. I thought this might be that type of contest.

The Finnish contest was won by our Marshall Mannerheim, a WW 2 figurehead.
You know that when Marshall Mannerheim died
the Soviets declared 3 day national mourning.
So much he was regarded there.

[SUBMAN1]

<<Do I understand you correctly that you wish to defend your attitude regarding Stalin, as I have explained I perceived your statements?>>
OK, what is in your oppinion my attitude?
I am listening.
No, Bruno.. you are supposed to talk... give him an answer to a valid question.

EDIT:
Я понимаю вас правильно что вы желаете защитить вашу ориентацию относительно Сталин, как я объяснял я воспринял ваши заявления?

Is this easier for you, comrade?

EDIT 2: damn.. that looks like greek.. hehe
Translated:

I understand you correctly that you wish to protect your orientation rather Stalin how I explained I has apprehended your applications?

[Thomen]

<<Do I understand you correctly that you wish to defend your attitude regarding Stalin, as I have explained I perceived your statements?>>
OK, what is in your oppinion my attitude?
I am listening.
No, Bruno.. you are supposed to talk... give him an answer to a valid question.

EDIT:
Я понимаю вас правильно что вы желаете защитить вашу ориентацию относительно Сталин, как я объяснял я воспринял ваши заявления?

Is this easier for you, comrade?

EDIT 2: damn.. that looks like greek.. hehe
Translated:

I understand you correctly that you wish to protect your orientation rather Stalin how I explained I has apprehended your applications?

Interesting...

[Bruno Lotse]

Read all my posts in the thread.
You might learn something.
I've answered in my posts.

[Bruno Lotse]

I support what was said by Winston Churchill in British Parliament after Stalin's death.

Stalin inherited Russia equipped with a wooden plow,
Stalin bequested Russia equipped with a Hydrogen Bomb.


You need a GREAT MAN to do it.
From some kinda country into the Super Power.

W.Churchill was a great man. He knew Stalin personally, met with him frequently
during WW2 and came out highly regarding Stalin.
They used to be partners, they used to be enemies,
yet they both appreciated the stature of each other.
Mutual respect.

And I also mentioned that when Marshal Carl Gustaf Emil Mannerheim died in 1951
Stalin ordered 3 day mourning in the Soviet Union
in respect to the former enemy.
Marshal was fighting Soviets, his troops were killing Soviet solders
and while doing this he proved himself both
the great statesman and the great warrior.
Stalin ordered national mourning on the great Finnish Marshal (again former enemy).

[Thomen]

Read all my posts in the thread.
You might learn something.
I've answered in my posts.

I think, that is not the point of his post.. hehe
He just wanted to show what I actually had posted in Russian.

[Jimbuna]

Good grief!!.....another entertaining/Russian thread thread :o

http://img396.imageshack.us/img396/6942/popcorncowtx0.gif

[Digital_Trucker]

I think the entertainment value is starting to drop off (and that's saying a lot for someone as easily entertained as I:rotfl:)

[OneToughHerring]

Marshal was fighting Soviets, his troops were killing Soviet solders
and while doing this he proved himself both
the great stateman and the great warrior.
Stalin ordered national morning on the great Finnish Marshal (again former enemy).

This is really something I don't quite understand. Finns often think that the relationship between the Finns and Soviets was very tense back then and even today WW2 and the hostilities of that time are brought up. To think that Stalin ordered that type of mourning is just odd to me. But on the other hand I don't think Mannerheim hated the Russians, as a young officer he was trained there in the Czars military academy. He also traveled there and in China.

[Bruno Lotse]

Because he was THE MAN and his troops put up a good fight and were not quitters.
Russians would respect a brave, strong, determined enemy.

Georgians are former Soviets (they proved themselves very good in the WW2)
, yet I'm sure there won't be any honors from Russians to any of the current Georgian generals.

[Dowly]

Russians would respect a brave, strong, determined enemy.

Good to hear! As they surely didnt give rat's arse about their dead soldiers during the Finno-Russo war. :roll:

[Bruno Lotse]

So you say.

Because of Soviet-Finnish war Russians were able to stop Germans near Moscow.
War with Finns displayed them they were not properly equipped for fighting in winter conditions. After the war they introduce changes in their equipment and supplies which
prevented repeating near Moscow mistakes and defficiencies which they experienced in Finnlad.

So, in a sence Soviet should be greateful to Finns for showing Soviets what they would need
in order to fight in the utmost cold. In Moscow 1941 Soviets had it. Germans - not. Germans lost.

One of the noticable consequences of Finnish war lessons was an urgent introduction of
T-34 tank. That tank had wide tracks which allowed him to cross winter terrain.

[Dowly]

So you say.

And the many many many finns who had to bury the corpses of Soviet soldiers during the spring, so the stench & diseases wouldnt cause trouble.

[Jimbuna]

So you say.

Because of Soviet-Finnish war Russians were able to stop Germans near Moscow.
War with Finns displayed them they were not properly equipped for fighting in winter conditions. After the war they introduce changes in their equipment and supplies which
prevented repeating near Moscow mistakes and defficiencies which they experienced in Finnlad.

So, in a sence Soviet should be greateful to Finns for showing Soviets what they would need
in order to fight in the utmost cold. In Moscow 1941 Soviets had it. Germans - not. Germans lost.

One of the noticable consequences of Finnish war lessons was an urgent introduction of
T-34 tank. That tank had wide tracks which allowed him to cross winter terrain.

So how come they didn't heed the lesson in the early 19th century when Napolean reached Moscow :hmm:

[Bruno Lotse]

So you say.
And the many many many finns who had to bury the corpses of Soviet soldiers during the spring, so the stench & diseases wouldnt cause trouble.
There was no exchange of bodies?
What happened to Finnish bodies on the territory occupied by Russians?

[Bruno Lotse]

So you say.

Because of Soviet-Finnish war Russians were able to stop Germans near Moscow.
War with Finns displayed them they were not properly equipped for fighting in winter conditions. After the war they introduce changes in their equipment and supplies which
prevented repeating near Moscow mistakes and defficiencies which they experienced in Finnlad.

So, in a sence Soviet should be greateful to Finns for showing Soviets what they would need
in order to fight in the utmost cold. In Moscow 1941 Soviets had it. Germans - not. Germans lost.

One of the noticable consequences of Finnish war lessons was an urgent introduction of
T-34 tank. That tank had wide tracks which allowed him to cross winter terrain.
So how come they didn't heed the lesson in the early 19th century when Napolean reached Moscow :hmm:
Ask Guderian.
He was stopped dead near Tula.

[Happy Times]

The Suomussalmi-Raate battle has to be the best, 30,000 Soviets KIA/MIA against 900 KIA/MIA Finns, big piles of bodys, like firewood they say.:hmm:

[Happy Times]

So you say.
And the many many many finns who had to bury the corpses of Soviet soldiers during the spring, so the stench & diseases wouldnt cause trouble.
There was no exchange of bodies?
What happened to Finnish bodies on the territory occupied by Russians?

We are still bringing them home, every summer we search, most 90,000 are buried in their home towns church yards.

[Bruno Lotse]

But not forget something,
fighting in winter 1940 Russians were attacking and finally WON
fighting in winter 1941 Germans were attacking and finally LOST

Finnland has exceptionally good terrain for defence - forrests, rocks, in spring bogs.
And Finns were fighting for their Motherland in their Motherland, so they knew terrain
and knew how to use it. Still eventully Soviets overcame Finnish defenses.

[Bruno Lotse]

So you say.
And the many many many finns who had to bury the corpses of Soviet soldiers during the spring, so the stench & diseases wouldnt cause trouble. There was no exchange of bodies?
What happened to Finnish bodies on the territory occupied by Russians?
We are still bringing them home, every summer we search, most 90,000 are buried in their home towns church yards.
Thank you very much.
Truly, thank you.
I am sure you wouldn't skip Russian remains as well.

The same in Russia. There is a volunteer organization called 'POISK' (Search).
They are searching for remains of Soviet and German solders and provide them
decent burial. They say the war is not over till a single fallen solder is in the open.
There are lots of forests, lots of bogs, wetlands so some heros unfortunately are still
there. But guys from POISK every summer are doing this job.