Operation Flashpoint 2: Dragon Rising

[Tikigod]

Videos, Gallery, and Forum Available Online:

http://www.codemasters.com/flashpoint2/

[GlobalExplorer]

In order for people not have wrong expectations, Armed Assault 2 is the game delevoped by Bohemia Interactive. Operation Flashpoint 2 is only a license deal, and as can be seen from the screenshots, targets consoles. I would say it falls in the same league as Birds Of Prey (IL2 for consoles): great and realistic games for consoles, meh if you come from the originals.

Here is the link to Arma2:

http://www.arma2.com/news.html

[CaptHawkeye]

Operation Flashpoint 2 is only a license deal, and as can be seen from the screenshots, targets consoles.

You mean the pre-rendered CGI shots which tell us nothing about the game other than that is has guns? I can't believe people are saying "it doesn't look like OFP" because they aren't using Flashpoint's crappy textures and blocky animations anymore. What? People actually WANT IT to look like ArmA? I mean, Flashpoint has never been about its open ended gameplay right?

Here is the link to Arma2:

Because Bohemia has been doing a great job with the series so far? Right? Sorry, they had their chance and blew it. Now they've got to prove they can make a game that doesn't suck. Until then, ArmA2 isn't worth anyone's time.

I would say it falls in the same league as Birds Of Prey (IL2 for consoles): great and realistic games for consoles, meh if you come from the originals.

This is still speculation though.

[Dowly]

In order for people not have wrong expectations, Armed Assault 2 is the game delevoped by Bohemia Interactive. Operation Flashpoint 2 is only a license deal, and as can be seen from the screenshots, targets consoles. I would say it falls in the same league as Birds Of Prey (IL2 for consoles): great and realistic games for consoles, meh if you come from the originals.

Here is the link to Arma2:

http://www.arma2.com/news.html
And what was ArmA aimed for? Stupid kids who are too young to have played OFP to see it is 99% the same game? :roll: Bohemia lost my support after that fiasco.

Ow yeh, and add the fact that Bohemia cant do as realistic game as they'd want to as they also do the 2000$ "game" VBS2 for the armies around the world.

EDIT2: Dang, forgot this one. Look at the screenshots of ArmA2. Funny how the poses & wrecked vehicles look exactly like in Arma/OFP. Do they even know how to make a NEW game?

[GlobalExplorer]

Operation Flashpoint 2 is only a license deal, and as can be seen from the screenshots, targets consoles.
You mean the pre-rendered CGI shots which tell us nothing about the game other than that is has guns? I can't believe people are saying "it doesn't look like OFP" because they aren't using Flashpoint's crappy textures and blocky animations anymore. What? People actually WANT IT to look like ArmA? I mean, Flashpoint has never been about its open ended gameplay right?

Here is the link to Arma2:
Because Bohemia has been doing a great job with the series so far? Right? Sorry, they had their chance and blew it. Now they've got to prove they can make a game that doesn't suck. Until then, ArmA2 isn't worth anyone's time.
:fanboi butthurt detected

OFP2 screens look like it will suck that's all. I am sure a lot of folks will still dig it though.

[Dowly]

OFP2 screens look like it will suck that's all. I am sure a lot of folks will still dig it though.

Already said, those arent screenshots from the game. :roll:

[GlobalExplorer]

OFP2 screens look like it will suck that's all. I am sure a lot of folks will still dig it though.

Already said, those arent screenshots from the game. :roll:

Then what's the point in releasing them? At least Arma2 shows screenshots. Besides I like the graphics in all their titles very much, they're much more realistic and down to earth as in other games. They always cared for realistic colors, high resolutions and long view ranges and not for flashy stuff, maybe that's why some people hate them.

And how can anyone crave for OFP2 and the say BI didn't do a good job with OFP1 which was entirely their work ?? I don't get it.

I would like to see some real screens of OFP2 too, but the ones that have been linked do not look like OFP anymore.

[Dowly]

OFP2 screens look like it will suck that's all. I am sure a lot of folks will still dig it though.
Already said, those arent screenshots from the game. :roll:
Then what's the point in releasing them? At least Arma2 shows screenshots. Besides I like the graphics in all their titles very much, they're much more realistic and down to earth as in other games. They always cared for realistic colors, high resolutions and long view ranges and not for flashy stuff, maybe that's why some people hate them.

And how can anyone crave for OFP2 and the say BI didn't do a good job with OFP1 which was entirely their work ?? I don't get it.

I would like to see some real screens of OFP2 too, but the ones that have been linked do not look like OFP anymore.

OFP was a great game, ArmA a very bad copy of it. And in nowhere does it say on the OFP2 site that those are screenshots! It says "Gallery", alot of games post artshots on their site.

And I give you that ArmA 2 does look good, but it looks very much the same as ArmA and I can bet that those shots have gone thru quite a bit of "surgery" before being released, again, like most devs do to their screenshots.

[Janus]

In order for people not have wrong expectations, Armed Assault 2 is the game delevoped by Bohemia Interactive. Operation Flashpoint 2 is only a license deal, and as can be seen from the screenshots, targets consoles. I would say it falls in the same league as Birds Of Prey (IL2 for consoles): great and realistic games for consoles, meh if you come from the originals.

Here is the link to Arma2:

http://www.arma2.com/news.html
All "screenshots" and trailers of Ofp2 released so far show nothing but rendered stuff which has nothing to do with ingame graphics.

As far as there is no valuable information (and that is: ingame videos, real and unedited screenshots, information about mission editors and modability...) about Ofp2 I see no point in bashing Codemasters.
Sure: BIS fecked up with Arma, so people can be more sceptic about Arma2.
Codemasters on the other hand should be a white paper to the Ofp/Arma community. Maybe Ofp2 will take the things that are good in Ofp and bring it to a new level of tactical simulations or maybe they will come up with a BF2'ish game that totally sucks if you liked Ofp.

I try to be cautiously optimistic about Ofp2 until there will be useful facts available.

[Dowly]

I try to be cautiously optimistic about Ofp2 until there will be useful facts available.

Gotta agree. :hmm:

[SUBMAN1]

OFP2 is already supposed to be released! Where is it already?

Anyway, the one thing that was missing from ArmA is that it really had a pathetic story (not to mention super AI that could pinpoint you by sound!). You never really got into 'the war'. You just ran around and shot a few things. I think that is where they failed the most. The latest patch fixes the gameplay issues though the game is still not perfect.

I hope OFP2 plays as well as the original, but brings a new story to the table. i want to feel like i felt playing OFP. ArmA never captured that.

-S

[GlobalExplorer]

As far as there is no valuable information (and that is: ingame videos, real and unedited screenshots, information about mission editors and modability...) about Ofp2 I see no point in bashing Codemasters.
Sure: BIS fecked up with Arma, so people can be more sceptic about Arma2.

I am not bashing Codemasters.

And I understand your logic, but I think it is wrong:

BI has released 2 games - at least one of them a classic - as well as screenshots of their next game, which is based on technology contracted by the military. The screenshots are actually meaningful and nice.

CM has nothing but a trademark and some wonna be photorealistic graphics that reek of next gen consoles and everyone goes: HYPE!!

Now based on the fact that Arma - which was developed in a rush - was not meeting the astronomic expectations, people are bashing BI, though there is not even 1 alternative battlefield sim on the market that could be considered a competition.

I don't get that, though I would of course like to see OFP2 to be good.

Maybe Ofp2 will take the things that are good in Ofp and bring it to a new level of tactical simulations or maybe they will come up with a BF2'ish game that totally sucks if you liked Ofp.

Agreed. But the market wants dumbed down games, and BI is much more of an independent company than CM to ignore the market.

I try to be cautiously optimistic about Ofp2 until there will be useful facts available.

Nothing wrong with that. There are no useful facts available.

[Janus]

Maybe Ofp2 will take the things that are good in Ofp and bring it to a new level of tactical simulations or maybe they will come up with a BF2'ish game that totally sucks if you liked Ofp.
Agreed. But the market wants dumbed down games, and BI is much more of an independent company than CM to ignore the market.
Ofp was game of the year and was a commercial success. BIS failed with Arma and I have the impression that they are trying to go more mainstream with Arma2 to attract more people. BIS is more than likely to focus more on consoles than on PC development which can't result in better games from my point of view.
One more failure like Arma from BIS and they might be out of business...

[BadKarma1001]

[quote=GlobalExplorer][quote=Janus]
One more failure like Arma from BIS and they might be out of business...
I highly doubt that because VBS2 is a great success!

Okay, the original release of ArmA was buggy as hell, bad optimized and the single player campaigns are nonexistent comparing to OFP but one of the strengths of ArmA is it´s mod compatibility today there are tons of mods which improves this game with hundrets of missions and campaigns also the multiplayer is way better than OFP´s mp.


Now based on the fact that Arma - which was developed in a rush - was not meeting the astronomic expectations, people are bashing BI, though there is not even 1 alternative battlefield sim on the market that could be considered a competition.
..and thats exactly the point no developer besides BI had the guts to do somthing like ArmA or OFP.

[Janus]

Now based on the fact that Arma - which was developed in a rush - was not meeting the astronomic expectations, people are bashing BI, though there is not even 1 alternative battlefield sim on the market that could be considered a competition.
..and thats exactly the point no developer besides BI had the guts to do somthing like ArmA or OFP. And that is surprising, isn't it? I mean Ofp was a full success, so why did not anyone else try to get a foot in this genre?
Time will tell us if Codemasters is trying to do just that with Ofp2...

Regarding VBS: the question is whether BIS will or would take or get money from VBS and BIA if Arma2 would be a failure. By now it's well known that Arma was released early because BIS was running out of money; maybe the same thing will happen to Arma2 and we can buy "Arma2 betatester editon" by the end of this year, that would also explain the very optimistic release announcement ;)

[GlobalExplorer]

By now it's well known that Arma was released early because BIS was running out of money;

But now you really put your foot into what I wanted to say. BI are a bunch of guys who had a vision, and - as the rumour goes, in a house somewhere in a Czech forest - created one of the most bold, visionary computer sims ever. I will never forget how I used the Mission Editor and took rides with the Skoda Rapid in this huge, unlimited gameworld that felt like I remember real Czechoslovakia and thought *finally that's how a game should be* !

I never expected Arma to be a completely new game, as it was always stated that it would work on OFP's base and accept OFP missions, and should be merely some OFP version 1.5, to give the fans something to play and to get the company over some dire straights. Nothing wrong with that. I consider the money invested in Arma as a kind of loan for the development of Arma2, besides such a battlefield simulator as VBS2 should cost hundreds or thousands of dollars, and we're getting a light version for 50$.

maybe the same thing will happen to Arma2 and we can buy "Arma2 betatester editon" by the end of this year, that would also explain the very optimistic release announcement ;)

I honestly accept that Arma2 will come with it's own bunch of problems, even much bigger companies like Microsoft never manage to release such huge complex bug-free, and that's why they will not even take on such a project. If you have a problem with that, you are indeed better served with game developers like CM which I expect to release more of a streamlined - mass market - game, and not the realistic sim technology that BIS have made themselves a name with.

Besides the features for Arma2 sound just right again: real satellite terrain, improved AI, rpg features. And of course improved graphics, optimized for huge numbers of entities, large areas, viewing distances, but not so much for impressive screenshots.

I don't think CM will make a bad game with OFP2 I just don't expect them to have an interest in that kind of realism we are used to from BI. He who has such hopes has not studied the market in the recent years.

[GlobalExplorer]

And that is surprising, isn't it? I mean Ofp was a full success, so why did not anyone else try to get a foot in this genre?
There is a project called "Enemy in Sight" by Illusion Softworks - the other Czech developer - but there is complete gagging order over the project. My gut feeling however is that they are still developing, remember HD2 went also through such off the radar cycles. But they had serious publisher problems, just recently they were bought and renamed by Take2.

http://www.strategyinformer.com/pc/enemyinsight/screenshots.html#latest

http://www.enemyinsight.info/photogallery.php?album_id=2

[Janus]

maybe the same thing will happen to Arma2 and we can buy "Arma2 betatester editon" by the end of this year, that would also explain the very optimistic release announcement ;)
I honestly accept that Arma2 will come with it's own bunch of problems, even much bigger companies like Microsoft never manage to release such huge complex bug-free, and that's why they will not even take on such a project. If you have a problem with that, you are indeed better served with game developers like CM which I expect to release more of a streamlined - mass market - game, and not the realistic sim technology that BIS have made themselves a name with. I never said that Software can or will be bugfree after release and even after some patches there are still bugs and I never said I had a problem with that. Software is NEVER free of bugs.
I only wanted to say that: BIS admitted that Arma was released early because they ran out of money, it was a case of releasing Arma in so to speak beta stage or not release it at all. If they still have had sufficient funds they might have released Arma in a state similar to the 1.05 patched version.

But now you really put your foot into what I wanted to say. BI are a bunch of guys who had a vision, and - as the rumour goes, in a house somewhere in a Czech forest - created one of the most bold, visionary computer sims ever. I will never forget how I used the Mission Editor and took rides with the Skoda Rapid in this huge, unlimited gameworld that felt like I remember real Czechoslovakia and thought *finally that's how a game should be* ! I have Ofp installed since the day I got it in 2001, I am still an active mission designer and coop player. Ofp has been installed on my rig for 7 years now - non stop - and I always have been using it frequently.
So I think we agree in this point: Ofp is an awesome game and BIS did a good job in supporting it with editing and modding tools. This level of community support is unseen in most other games or genres.

[Deamon]

I have Ofp installed since the day I got it in 2001, I am still an active mission designer and coop player. Ofp has been installed on my rig for 7 years now - non stop - and I always have been using it frequently.
So I think we agree in this point: Ofp is an awesome game and BIS did a good job in supporting it with editing and modding tools. This level of community support is unseen in most other games or genres. Ahh, OFP. I am going to reinstall it now and live up some good old days, with the best game of all times. :ping:

Nothing comes even remotely close to OFP! This game feels so incredebly....

.....incredebly natural. I just lack the right words to express how much I love this natural feeling, this inert character animations and this very natural looking terrain. You can almost feel how all the heavy gear slow you down. The immersion is incredebly. I guess I sticked to this game probably for 1,5 years non stop. But Arma was a disapointment for me. I still hope they will get it right, I realy hope so. But lots of my fears came true.

[Robsoie]

Personnally, i strongly hope OFP2 will be a simulation masterpiece.
I would really hate to see it becoming something disapointing in front of the really great first OFP.

Additionnally, if OFP2 is a great simulation, it would force BIS to reconsider what they are doing with they re-usage of the same old things.

As this way instead of re-using things to death like they did in the very disapointing ArmA (it was just OFP with -less- content in the game, -less- interesting campaign and missions, -less- stability, -more- bugs, but better graphics) would then need to add more features into their games instead of holding all the cool ones back for their VBS2.

Another problem for BIS that re-use the same things is that with ArmA they made some important urban theaters on their island.
Unfortunately as they re-used the OFP AI that was great when navigating wilderness but dumb like hell at navigating on complex towns, the BIS AI shows more its limits in ArmA than in OFP due to the nature of the only island of ArmA that feature bigger towns.

BIS really needs to rework their AI so they actually are able to fight in towns and use tactics. Or at least use more than the brainless tactic of just dropping on the ground in the middle of the street as soon as danger is detected and stay there until death.

BIS stated they improved it, but the last ArmA2 videos display always the same lack of tactics and the AI running out of cover to end into the player sight and drop dead.

That's why i hope OFP2 will be as great as Codemasters says in their interview.

It can only be a great for us as customers to have a choice between products, instead of being forced, if you like inf sims, to only buy BIS products with them being lazy in term of new features and improvements because they are on a monopole and none else is making infantry sims (while you have a lot of infantry arcade games).

OFP2 being great would force BIS to work more on ArmA2 and add more cool things to their sims if they want to be able to compete.

So in the end , if OFP2 is good, it is good for people that like inf sims. Because they will be able to have a choice, and more interesting products due to the concurrence.

[Janus]

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/37090.html

This is kind of the first evidence, that Codemasters really intends to do the "deluxe" simulation we all are longing for.

[Dowly]

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/37090.html

This is kind of the first evidence, that Codemasters really intends to do the "deluxe" simulation we all are longing for.

That was pretty darn cool! This' how ArmA should've been like. :hmm: Really looking forward to this? :rock:

[stabiz]

This looks mighty impressive ! Only downside I can see is that I don't trust the marketing BS, we'll see when they show some real gameplay video :D
But it's looking great :yep:

Yes, I am cautiously optimistic after seeing this. I guess they are going after the Battlefield 2-market.

[GlobalExplorer]

I really like it so far! Now I really have 2 games to look forward to.

[stabiz]

I have three, but this is not one of them (yet).

1. Empire: Total War
2. T34 vs Tiger
3. GTR: Evolution

All coming out this year! :rock:

[SUBMAN1]

http://www.gametrailers.com/player/37090.html

This is kind of the first evidence, that Codemasters really intends to do the "deluxe" simulation we all are longing for.Drool!

[Robsoie]

I don't care about the graphics, as i play regularly some old DOS games like Ace of the Deep and Silent Hunter 1, graphics are absolutely not what i am looking for in a simulation.

But features, are a definitive part of what i am seeking.

And from the interviews, it seems Codemasters is paying attention to several sectors BIS have ignored in OFP and ArmA :
-Destruction model that even without being dynamic for performance reason will allow for progressively damaged buildings, while in ArmA2 will only offer some "holes" pre-placed in buildings though.

-Soldier animations : in OFP2 soldiers will catch each weapon differently and according to the weapons shapes, will reload them differently etc.. in OFP, ArmA, and from videos ArmA2, soldier use the same animation for catching every weapons , and the same animations to reload each weapons, basically that's why in OFP/ArmA you see most weapons having the hand going through and that soldiers reload heavy machinegun like if it was a light rifle.
Immersivity is important in an infantry simulation, as you must have the feel "you are there", more details in animations help to provide that.

-Vehicules Animations, in OFP2 the soldiers wil be moving inside vehicles instead of magically "teleport" inside of them like in OFP/ArmA and from videos ArmA2. Again another immersive point for OFP2.

-Realistic vehicules combat model and realistic ballistic, there if you played them you know that OFP / ArmA are completely arcade in term of combat model, all is based on "hit points" that lower with each things impacting it. This way you could destroy an heavy tanks with enough bullets.
Sadly in some BIS interview, it seems there will always be the same kind of hit point system in ArmA2, but BIS has always have time to change their combat model, but will they want to do it as their community has requested this since the early years of OFP ?

If OFP2 can live up to what was mentionned in the various interviews in term of features and what was showed in the presentation videos, i will sure get it over ArmA2 any days.

I just hope the AI that unlike the previous point has never been showed but only stated as great, unscripted and capable of using tactics unlike BIS AI, will be really that good.
As i don't care of online play, AI is usually what make or break a game for me, i hope OFP2 will deliver the great AI they mention in interview and that BIS will working on them more than the OFP/ArmA-like brain dead AI we noticed on video.
If on retail, both 2 games have brain dead AI, i will just keep my money to buy something better in the simulation world.

But anyways, i hope OFP2 will be as great simulation as it sounds to be in previews, the infantry simulation sector has way too few games, basically out of OFP and ArmA BIS has a monopole on this.

And that's never good to have someone having a monopole, because without any serious concurrence, they can only become lazy.

[Arclight]

Release date pushed back (http://kotaku.com/5244129/operation-flashpoint-dragon-rising-stealthily-slips-to-fall); best guess (http://www.joystiq.com/2009/05/07/operation-flashpoint-dragon-rising-later-than-expected/) September.

[Dowly]

In-game footage from the console version.

'Take the Beach' Part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wSd3HdM0drA

Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cr-pVhRAUT4

'Blinding the Dragon' Part 1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QBxPGRBOxJA

Part 2
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XRD1F5w-dB4

[Arclight]

Too arcady for my taste, but looks pretty good.

One thing I'm left wondering though: are ballistics and pullet-penetration modeled?

[stabiz]

That just looks silly.

[Fincuan]

At least the audio acting is on par with Arma2 :haha:

[SUBMAN1]

And what was ArmA aimed for? Stupid kids who are too young to have played OFP to see it is 99% the same game? :roll: Bohemia lost my support after that fiasco.

Ow yeh, and add the fact that Bohemia cant do as realistic game as they'd want to as they also do the 2000$ "game" VBS2 for the armies around the world.

EDIT2: Dang, forgot this one. Look at the screenshots of ArmA2. Funny how the poses & wrecked vehicles look exactly like in Arma/OFP. Do they even know how to make a NEW game?

Have to agree here. Operations Flashpoint 2 need only be mediocre to catch the ArmA series. There was no sense of being their with ArmA.

Anyway, OF2 with its recently released gameplay video looks to be the game we have been waiting for, for so so long. :yeah:

-S

[stabiz]

Who are we? Those that want what looks like Call of Duty 4 with larger maps?

[Dowly]

TBH, after watching those two missions and E3 2009 presentation, it looks to be way more arcady than what they made us believe.

But I wouldnt go as far as calling it CoD with bigger maps. Sure, it has a flashy UI and cheesy map icons, but those are just icons and if you look at them, you can find them all in ArmA series, just simplified.

Controlling the guy seems to be more like the traditional FPS, instead of what ArmA does. Is it good or bad? For me, that's good, because I've never liked the ArmA controls that much, feels like I'm carrying 500kg of extra weight. Pretty much the same goes for the AI, ArmA's AI feels like that of Close Combat with the enemy thinking for a few seconds, proning, then getting up again and then starting to shoot at you.

Oh well, time will tell.

[Arclight]

Actually, CoD is less arcady because it has weapon sway, while DR has perfect steady aim. :O:

[CaptHawkeye]

It looks AWESOME. Just the balance of cinema action and detailed realism i'm looking for in a game.

[Fincuan]

Looks like we have one of the first if not the first proper hands-on preview of DR: http://www.doupe.cz/Doupecz/Dojmy-Operation-Flashpoint-Dragon-Rising--nelitostny-souboj/Ve-stinu-draka/sc-108-sr-1-a-135333-ch-129181/default.aspx

It's in Czech, and the only translation I found was on BIS forums. Something to consider when checking it out, even if the poster seems pretty level-headed: http://forums.bistudio.com/showpost.php?p=1421489&postcount=2531

Everything is pretty much as expected, until you get towards the end...
The answer to reviewer's question whether you can add new units or islands was NO, however you will be able to buy DLC to "enhance your game".

Good night and good bye DR if this turns out to be true :damn:

[Arclight]

That would be pretty... yeah... :doh:

[Raptor1]

Idiocy, well, that pretty much does it for OFP2 (I doubt it deserves the name) then...

[Oberon]

Ah, the old 'shooting yourself in the foot' maneuver... :damn:

[stabiz]

Its Rainbow 6 all over again.

[Ilpalazzo]

The answer to reviewer's question whether you can add new units or islands was NO, however you will be able to buy DLC to "enhance your game". http://img42.imageshack.us/img42/2955/picardfacepalm.jpg


Okay, I just watched the videos. I am impressed actually. First of all, coop campaign. That means a lot to me.

Despite being a console game, the interface is actually not jarring to me.

Now, I dunno if the guy in the video just felt like getting shot up or what, but I couldn't help but notice he didn't bother leaning at all. Especially around corners. wtf, there better be leaning.

The weapon model was taking up so much freaking space on the screen, especially with the scope. It was ridiculous. The weapon bobbing was actually making me feel physically ill. I hope something can be done about it when the game comes out.

Overall, I just hope the AI allows me to be immersed in the game and that the scripts work without issue. I hated the scripts and ai in the old OFP and Arma games.

[onelifecrisis]

It's in Czech, and the only translation I found was on BIS forums. Something to consider when checking it out, even if the poster seems pretty level-headed: http://forums.bistudio.com/showpost.php?p=1421489&postcount=2531

Nooooooooooooooooooooo :wah:

[Dowly]

"The damage in Operation Flashpoint: Dragon Rising is pretty gruesome," says Mike Smith, Art Lead "It's pretty much realistic - if you get hit by a large round, you're very likely to have serious trauma to your body. We represent damage with several different visual stages. For example, you've got blood that seeps through clothes and then you've got catastrophic damage, which is actually losing your limbs or having your head blown off."

:rock:

EDIT: and new dev video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-S2x95gk1BY

EDIT: And a fan made sniper video: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hnPuVTTtwpc (**** me, I love those ragdolls)

EDIT: Just in! IGN Review 8.1/10: http://xbox360.ign.com/articles/103/1031302p1.html

[stabiz]

It might be fun. It will probably have some realism mods in a not to distant future as well.

[Fincuan]

That is IF you can mod it. It is yet to be confimed if it'll ever be possible, but it's already certain that it won't be possible at release.

[Dowly]

Goddammit! Now they've pushed the Steam release to Thursday from the original date of Wednesday. :damn:

[Fincuan]

Any word on the demo?

[Dowly]

Any word on the demo?

They are promising a pre-release demo, so if it still holds it should be released this week. :hmmm:

EDIT: OFP2Online says it will be a post-release demo afterall.

[Dowly]

As for the modding of OFP2, nobody really knows anything solid how OFP2 works but the EGO engine should be moddable with new models, sounds and editing/creating lua scripts.

Good sign is that a mod announce thread for Combat Simulation Project has been stickied at the official OFP2 forums. Or then they are just sadistic wankers and made it sticky so ppl would think the game is moddable when it really isnt. :O:

EDIT: Oooh, now I really want it to be moddable. CSP team has few guys from ACE team working with them. :yeah:

[Fincuan]

Or then they are just sadistic wankers and made it sticky so ppl would think the game is moddable when it really isnt. :O:

Precisely what I'm afraid of. The only thing hinting towards moddability is the DLC packs, but those will cost money and will be done by CM. There's no word on user-made content yet, nothing. Only silence. Someone did ask a CM representative at Gamescon about this and he said there won't be means to include user-made content. You know marketing though... Not always equal to truth

edit: I'm also slightly concerned on the quality of DR community at present. Judging by the official forums "mature and rational" isn't exactly the impression one gets, and the ability to mod might just be one major incentive in introducing the right kind of people to the community and keeping them there. If the kiddies get their say, as it stands now on the forums, be very very afraid...

[stabiz]

I google-translated the review from one of the biggest Norwegian newspapers. Oddly the reviewer knows his stuff, it seems.

THE FIRST "Operation Flashpoint" is a memorable game that truly deserves the title of war simulator.

Where you in other fist person shooters can take half a magazine in the skull before you finally hang up had this game a very different attitude to the realism. A well-placed shot, and hey presto there was the war over to your part.

OF RELATIVE realism that this will work, a war simulator effectively kill the whole concept we would otherwise take as a mere matter of course.

You are no longer the Event center; a completely immortal character who single-handedly saves the day with his inexhaustible arsenal. You are an anonymous part of the vast war machine. Vulnerable, limited and completely dependent on others' decisions.

This has a tremendous reward for some players, while others understandably will have trouble accepting that role completely disappears and the insane increase in the challenges it entails.

For those who liked the first game or simulators in general may have built up quite high expectations of "Operation Flashpoint: Dragon Rising".

Firstly, it has been eight years since the last time, and it is associated with much excitement to how the technical development has created new opportunities for the franchise.

Second, it has an effective PR machine whipping up the atmosphere with the promise of 220 square kilometers of open and detailed landscape and the tough realism finally be combined with high production values.

For a bitter simulation fan who regularly quinces irritated tributes to "Enemy Engaged" and "Ghost Recon" (the first) was a fairly predictable thing that I was going to bite the hook. I'm an easy victim for the promise of realism, physics and open landscape. I was really looking forward to this game.

Promise of high production value and great graphics are quickly confirmed. After a quick visit to the main menu, where China's response to the Ol 'Dirty Bastard on the show has inexplicably been allowed to develop their singing talents, I am thrown into a future conflict between China and the United States over the island of Skira.

Ten minutes later I lie with my nose in the grass and enjoy the view. The game uses the same engine as the "Dirt" and "Race Driver: Grid", so the island's rolling landscape of grasslands and sparse forests are attractive to look at.

With the always handy binoculars undercover I enemy base after patrol routes, guards and vehicles. I take my happy time with choosing among the tactical options I have. I can ask my three computer-controlled fellow soldiers attacking from the flank, I can summon a massive artillery attack, or I can try to whack all from my exalted and well-concealed position.

Before I have time to choose, there are some Indians in the camp with the Hubble Space Telescope as contact lens that sees me. It takes him a shot to learn about the game's sadistic storage system.

Because you can not save himself in this game, it is done programatically at selected sites. I realize that I have just spent an hour to play creeping blanket in the grass and it looked pretty realistic hours is due to a completely unrealistic event has been completely wasted.

To "lose" Running is not just irritating for critics with a deadline. Of all the ways to punish the player is a waste of time, the player's definitely the most nerve-racking. With growing frustration disappears also a lot of goodwill to comply with the game's encouragement of realism.

The subsequent storming of the enemy base was a hazardous gamble. When you still risk losing a good portion of the progress you choose tactic that costs the least time.

Thus, actually encourage this storage system to rambo stroke and seems totally counterproductive - that is to make the player more concerned about their own well-being.

DESPITE the frustration of waiting behind the unfortunate shot is fighting in the game engaging and adrenaline pumping. Green and red tracers act as visual markers for the enemy and friendly forces are located in the grass. The bullets throwing up dust and gravel when they hit the ground and slammed like a lash on the lands near or ricochet on.

The explosions in the game are particularly impressive, especially from various artillery and bombs you can call in via the radio. A couple times I have experienced that splinters from the explosions have flown dangerously close, but I can not confirm that they actually do harm.

One can see the smoke from the burning vehicle several miles away, making a pretty big impact. Not just for atmosphere's sake, but you feel pretty vulnerable when behind enemy lines suddenly lit a bonfire of tires.

When you run your character breathing heavily, and eventually you will hear his heart beat. If you get shot and are lucky enough to survive, you must stop the bleeding with a bandage or brought order to the medical team to help.

But the fight reveals another of the game's weaknesses, namely the controls. I suspect that the PC version of this game has become a bit console castrated, for I find no reason why I should not be able to lean your head to the side to see around corners.

Once this is something one has been able to do in all tactical shooters the last few years I hope really that this is because the developer ran out of buttons on a console controller and was too lazy to fix it on PC.

The alternative is the fact that they have not followed with an hour - to wide around the corner and expose the entire body to the unknown is not particularly smart and feels very wrong.

Another big problem I have with this game also testify console-related limitations. As it should be has not all the world with ammo in this game - there are actually some of the smallest made. The point is that you often have to plunder the enemy's equipment and ammunition.

The problem is that these bodies will disappear after about 30 seconds. I ended up so constantly in situations where I had to get up in the middle of a firefight and running to catch a dead body. Talk to negate all previous efforts to make things realistic.

Of all unintentional minigame so is "let the carcass in the tall grass before it disappears into thin air" probably the most lame.

If you are lucky enough to find one of the game's vehicles, creating the rigid head big problems. You can switch to a third person camera, but not even when you are sitting in a car can look backwards for reversing. Even in "Grand Theft Auto" for a chance to look around when driving, and it is just as far from a simulator that you can come.

To land helicopters are in this way, a chapter for themselves. Now I experienced only to find a helicopter once in the course of the campaign missions, but then I managed to total abundance to land nicely and neatly right on top of an anti-aircraft guns. It's like driving with Blinders and his head screwed on the ceiling.

Finding one of the game's vehicles, which were disappointingly rare, feels pretty liberating because the game animates the gun in front of you on an exaggerated way when you are on foot. Running over longer distances is therefore a pain - it bounces as if you are equipped with a neck collar and running with high knee lifts.

BUT VEHICLE emphasizes a considerably more serious problem. Here they made a 220 square kilometers of countryside and boasts that it takes eight to nine hours to go from one side to the other. When I imagine immediately a seamless, open affair where I will be free to use the vehicle for exploring the surroundings and span out potential attack positions.

Therefore, it is completely incomprehensible that the developer here has divided the missions of 15-30 minutes of affairs involving perhaps a fraction of the map.

We're talking maybe 3x3 square kilometers on average. After completing the mission you will be kicked out in the main menu again and automatically transported to the next 15-30 minute mission, and mostly a whole new person to manage.

As if it were not so sad manage developers for everything excess to put tight limits on most missions, so we therefore are denied to explore especially outside the operation area. Completely silly when you have made a large and impressive world.

GAME loses immediately right to call himself a "sandbox" games. It is a shooter with slightly longer distances than usual, where the tight, action-driven directed to other geographically distinct shooters as "Modern Warfare" is missing.

The greatest sin of "Operation Flashpoint: Dragon Rising" commits is that it gives you the desire to play a game that does not exist. It starts an itch that will not go away until someone makes a game that really gets to the developer has advertised for.

They do not care out on so much and stumbles in so much potential that had double or triple the entertainment value of the game. How the game is up now, it falls between two uncomfortable chairs. It does not work well as a realistic war simulator and not as a regular first-person shooter.

THERE is simply a mediocre game that is over almost before it begins. After five hours I was taken completely by surprise by the credits and wondered where all the good stuff I had been promised disappeared unnoticed.

Not the multiplayer part, that's for sure. With the two different game modes and an upper limit of 16 people on each team tremble not just "Battlefield" in his pants.

For the PC version comes with a program to make the mission with. It did not work on my test machine, but regardless, it is far too much to demand of the users that they will save this game from its mediocrity.

In a hint of inappropriate self serving game the following sentence when you start the game: "This product is not endorsed by the U.S. Department of Defense. " As if there are any doubts.

PS: The developer of the first "Operation Flashpoint" game came in the summer out with a spiritual sequel "ArmA 2". An amazing realistic and impressive games that unfortunately are so plagued by technical failures and the excessive difficulty that that scared away many players. It is recommended however, that the best option.

Edit: He gave it a 3/6.

[Fincuan]

Well, at least we now know which area, SP or MP, is in focus. DR multiplayer summed up by someone over at CM forums:

No dedicated servers.
No cd-key needed
No anti cheat program


Looks like CM really botched a great opportunity.

[Ilpalazzo]

Well, there goes another game.:down:

[Dowly]

Live stream from someone's Xbox copy
http://www.justin.tv/toasty411

[Fincuan]

Yeah I've been watching that for a while... "There's a guy in the window, shoot him! ... Oh, I guess you're not gonna..." :D

[onelifecrisis]

Bah!

If console controllers are so fricken great then why can't they do something as simple as leaning around corners? This is the second sequel-to-a-pc-shooter which I was interested in until I found out it had lost it's lean function due to consolitis.

[Fincuan]

It looked like an ok action shooter juding by the feed, but there's something they've overhyped waaayy too much: The AI was absolutely bonehead stupid. The Arma2 grunts are geniouses compared to their DR counterparts.

Example: One guy jumped in front of an APC, looked like a BMP3, and started firing into the front armor with his assault rifle. What did the APC do? Nothing.

[Fincuan]

Another live feed here, this one from PC:
http://www.ustream.tv/channel/pol-s-first-broadcast

[Dowly]

I'll let you know my first impression at some point today. Looking at the streams it looks to be something between Ghost Recon and OFP/ArmA's. :hmmm:

[Fincuan]

Waiting :up:

That's what I gathered from them too, ie. pretty much what was to be expected. The streams did decide one thing for me though: I'm not gonna bother grabbing an "internet preview". The demo will do. Something that amazed me when watching the streams was recoil, or more precisely the lack of it: There was none. When the guy started firing on full auto, hands off controls apart from pressing the firing button, the gun rose just a tad bit after which it stayed put and all the rounds landed in the same spot. :stare:

A bit surprisingly the game also seems to be buggy. At least there's plenty of people bitching and moaning on the CM forums, and some of those moans even seem to have an inch of truth in them.

[Arclight]

It's more something that falls between COD and ArmA, from what I understand from the reviews. Thing is, it kinda falls short on both accounts; the run-and-gunners will face too stiff a challenge (with the waypoint-saves system being the biggest pain), and the hardcore crowd will laugh their ass off if someone compares it to ArmA (at least the console version). :-?

I haven't seen people state disappearing bodies are an issue on PC, so I guess it doesn't happen there. Apparently you really need to scrounge for ammo, so bodies fading away after 30secs on the consoles would, technically, make the whole thing unplayable. :nope:

Imho they really fudged a couple of things, but there may be some life in it. Curious to some first hand experiences. :up:

[Dowly]

Right, tried it for a few minutes in the mission editor.

Firstly the editor. It's great, very similar to OFP/ArmA editor but with few features more. Not so user friendly, but if you have any basic knowledge of ArmA editor you get right in. One big improvement compared to ArmA editor is that you can see the objects you place in 3D, making it very easy to align fences etc.

You can place soldiers one by one or in squads (which there is quite a few of). Appearance, voice, skill level and equipment can all be changed with ease.


Righto, now to the tests I made.

First I put me as a sniper and a PLA soldier in the game, the enemy was ~100m away, facing away from me. He saw me instantly when the game started. Boo! Same goes for the enemy being roughly 150m away. Dont know if it was because I was standing when the game started, but still that was pretty crappy.

Next I found myself a town and put squad of marines and a squad of PLA paratroopers to the main street, maybe a 100m apart. They didnt notice each other until I fired the first shot... which sucked balls. The AI seems to be adjusting depending of the enviroment as when they started to shoot eachother, the marines started to spread out around the town. Once the shooting ended I went closer and saw that the marines were covering stuff from corners of the buildings. One bigger building had marines on each of it's corners, which was pretty nice.

That was all I tested.

Now to the game itself.

It runs great, but comes with a price. While the view distance is huge, the graphics get pretty low at distance making it look as if I'm running it with low settings. This is particulary ****ty with the soldiers, from ~400m the marines and the PLA paratroopers looked exactly the same due to the LOD being lowered because of the distance. Big **** up if you ask me.

The grass is nice and you can actually see something if you are prone, there dont seem to be forests on the scale of OFP/ArmA.

Many have said the sounds are great, which they are for the most part, but some of the distant gun sounds arent that good IMHO. The radio chatter is much better compared to ArmA, the guys sound good enough to not be mistaken for martians, but the normal chatter I could've lived without (one guy cried "Jesus! That hurts!" when I shot him point blank with a pistol to his face :doh:).

The controls are IMO better than that of OFP/ArmA. Much smoother, yet you still can feel the 'weight'. The recoil isnt AS bad as I though, you cant land accurate shots by just tapping the button repeatedly. They will land at the area where you aim, but propably wont hit your target.

I had a very very very quick try at the MP. There's a carrot in it, you gain ranks by experience, dont know if you get anything by gaining ranks, tho. Lack of dedicated servers is a major **** up, but I did eventually find someone hosting a 20 player deathmatch with good ping. Died alot. Stupid game. :shifty: Need to try the coop mode if I can get a mate of mine to get the game.

@Arclight

Bodies do disappear in the PC version aswell. Maybe after 5 minutes or so. :-?

PS. You can pop guys head open with a rifle shot, that was nice.

[Arclight]

At least 5mins gives you a bit of time. One reviewer remarked he felt himself forced to get over to corpses quickly, putting him in danger of getting shot. Either get shot or run out of ammo, and then get shot. :-?

All reviewers seem to agree the campaign is best played in coop. The AI will sometimes fail to get to cover. 3 guys ducking behind a wall with the fourth one standing in the open, getting his head "popped". :roll:

Your medic standing idle besides you while you're bleeding out is another anoyance, which makes me wonder; how's the command interface? Most say it's a pain, but some comment it's quick and easy. Bit of division on that one. :06:

*I kind of expected the LOD issue, with the game being tailored to consoles. You won't see any real forests, just rolling hills with sparse trees. Even with the nerfed LOD, consoles just can't cope with lot's of shader-work (vegetation).

** I hereby apologize to any console-owners who I may have upset with that last edit. ;)

[Dowly]

At least 5mins gives you a bit of time. One reviewer remarked he felt himself forced to get over to corpses quickly, putting him in danger of getting shot. Either get shot or run out of ammo, and then get shot. :-?

I started the campaign and went the first mission solo. Cant say I needed to take ammo from enemies. Still had 3 mags left when the mission ended. But if you need the ammo, you can just shot the enemy to stomach and they usually go down, but wont die. Then you can mob the other enemies and go to the wounded one and put a round to his head and take the ammo.

All reviewers seem to agree the campaign is best played in coop. The AI will sometimes fail to get to cover. 3 guys ducking behind a wall with the fourth one standing in the open, getting his head "popped". :roll:

Your medic standing idle besides you while you're bleeding out is another anoyance, which makes me wonder; how's the command interface? Most say it's a pain, but some comment it's quick and easy. Bit of division on that one. :06:Yes, I have to agree that the campaign will be great played on coop. Cant say much about my AI as like I said, I went solo. Tho, I had other AI squad that worked independently nearby and they did seem to work well. They took out an road block while I was busy decimating enemy convoy abit further away. But they did eventually die, to the best of my knowledge, they had stolen a vehicle from the enemy and got missile up their butt from an enemy chopper. :hmmm:

The command menu can be used in two ways; One way is the command circle, pretty much same deal than in BF2, one needs to get used to it as it is a bit wonky. My main gripe about it is that it doesnt go away automatically if you stop pressing the key, but you must press the key again.

The other way to command is from the map, which is much easier if you're not in a hurry or under fire. Right-click somewhere on the map brings up a menu with commands.

*I kind of expected the LOD issue, with the game being tailored to consoles. You won't see any real forests, just rolling hills with sparse trees. Even with the nerfed LOD, consoles just can't cope with lot's of shader-work (vegetation).

** I hereby apologize to any console-owners who I may have upset with that last edit. ;)Aye, true that. The enviroment is abit richer on PC, the grass is very thick and covers most of the ground. I did come by a forest that was O.K. it wasnt as populated as ArmA's but it was ok.

EDIT: ow about the medic thing. You dont really need the medic (I think) as the medical system is so that when you get hit, you start to bleed. You carry an field dressing that you can use to stop the bleeding, but you gotta do it quickly as you dont get the 'blood' back, so if you wait and let the blood meter drop to near minimum before bandaging, the next hit will propably kill you. Not to say that there isnt headshots that kill you with one shot. :) Also, if you are shot to leg, you cant sprint, hit in arm and you cant aim as accurately. If played on a difficulty where there is checkpoints during the missions, you will be healed, both blood and hits once you reach a checkpoint, but this only works on lower difficulties.

[danlisa]

If you missed them:

OFDR Bonus Mission Codes (case sensitive):

RaidT18Z - Night Raid
StrongM577 - Coastal Stronghold
AmbushU454 - Ambush
CloseQ8M3 - Close Quarters
OFPWEB1 - Encampment
OFPWEB2 - Debris Field

:shifty:

[Dowly]

Few more things I came across while playing the campaign.
- Enemy AI will run away at times.
- Enemy AI will flank you.
- Weapons seem to be awfully inaccurate when standing.
- Weapons sound awesome inside buildings (like one would think they'd sound in an confined space).
- Some problems with AI not noticing me (stood on a hill 25m away from 2 guys while shooting at third, they didnt attack me).
- It's definitaly a tactical game, run & gun will get you killed very fast.
- Bullets penetrate stuff they should (had enemy guy run to a house for cover, peppered the walls and managed to wound him).
- Enemy cant see through smoke (almost tackled one guy running around in the smoke).

[Arclight]

I wasn't too impressed, most reviews out there being for the 360 version didn't help... but you're starting to bring me around. :)

Might be something worthwhile, especially considering most games I was looking forward to being pushed into 2010. Just not sure yet it's worth the full €40,-. :hmmm:

[Dowly]

Enemy AI can get confused and start firing each other. :haha:

I made a mission with the editor set during the night with me being an sniper ambushing an enemy patrol walking down the road. I shot one of them, set my claymores between me and the enemy and pulled back. I started to hear shooting behind me and as I turned around I saw two enemy soldiers duking it out with their rifles. :har: I hope this is something that was meant to happen, I think it could be possible as the other soldier was at the road and the one he exchanged shots with was off the road tracking me. :hmmm: They did stop shooting each other when the one who was after me stepped into my mine and was blown away. :up:

[Fincuan]

Ah, well looks like there's at least some light at the end of the tunnel, maybe even enough to warrant trying out the full game. It's just that the marketing and the streams made the game looks like a completely arcadey pos. Thanks Dowly!

In regards to the 3d-editor, there's one(well actually two, but more on that) for Arma2 too. The official ingame 3d-editor can be started by pressing alt+e in the main menu, but it's currently very unfinished and probably "hidden" for that very reason. A much more practical solution is RealTimeEditor (http://rte.jonasscholz.de/blog/2009/06/19/download). It actually works, and it has a good manual (http://rte.jonasscholz.de/manual) and a set of Youtube tutorials (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hQAOiO6Mj-4&)

[Dowly]

I'll post news about the coop either tomorrow or late tonight, depending how fast the steam download is for my mate. :hmmm:

Ow might aswell use this post to talk about the physics.

If one though ArmA had bad vehicle physics, then they havent seen OFP2's. Atleast for trucks the physics are so that if you hit a tree for example with high speed the truck will bounce several feet backwards. :O:

Tho, the physics do make some cool stuff occasionally. Like when I ambushed a convoy, I shot the driver and the drivers foot remained on the gas pedal which resulted the truck to keep on driving, going over some rocks and flipping to it's side down to the beach. That was awesome. :rock:

The ragdolls are pretty darn cool for most parts. When they dont work right, you see bodies slide down slopes unrealisticly, but when they work, they are awesome. Especially when scoring an headshot to someone who is standing still, the body goes instantly limb and he drops where he stands (if you've seen videos of them ragheads sniping western troops in Iraq etc. you know what I mean).

As for the gore of the game, it's ok. I havent seen much yet, I did blow up someone with some satchels which resulted to a chunks of flesh all around. Shot to the head with a highpower rifle usually cracks the head open (this is done with the model itself). I'm yet to see limbs go off, tho I did see my leg disappear when I accidentally jumped out of an chopper and fell to my death but I'm not sure if the leg was under the body or if it really was cut off.

[Dowly]

hmpf... mate went to bar, so no coop tonight.

Instead, few observations regarding the mission editor.
- Everything is done via the editor. (i.e. no need to make scripts with notepad etc.)
- Ambient sounds and FX are both easy to apply to the mission. Click where you want it and select the SFX/FX from the dropdown menu.
- Objectives etc. are applied via .lua scripts
- Briefing is very easy to add (think of ArmA's mission properties, except here it works).
- Waypoints are abit more complicated that ArmA's. You construct the path first and then select the unit you want to use the waypoints and select the first waypoint from a dropdown box.
- Custom campaigns are easy to make. You do your missions first, then fire up the campaign builder and start importing the missions.
- Quite a few sample missions are included which are useful especially when you need to script something.

And a quick test I made with the AI today:

Squad of PLA troops (A from now on) and squad of marines (B from now on) starting from two adjanced hills, both having waypoint making them move in-between the hills. B's hill had more cover (rocks), so they stayed there when the combat started. A's hill was more exposed and they split into two squads and started to find cover while simultaneously engaging the enemy. After some casualties, A pulled back from the hill and started to flank B. B's hill had forest on both sides, A moved to both the forests and used the trees as cover. B split in two to defend both sides of the hill. As A's casualties grew, B started to move more aggressively, making their way down the hill and in the end killed the enemy. Whole battle lasted for, give or take, 15 minutes.

[Dowly]

Was a chance to try coop today, but it seems Codemaster's multiplayer account servers are down. :doh:

Oh and the modding part seems to be undoable to any extent without tools from CM. All files are encrypted. :-?

[Fincuan]

Oh and the modding part seems to be undoable to any extent without tools from CM. All files are encrypted. :-?

****... Encrypting the files actually points to them trying to prevent modding :shifty:

[Dowly]

Aye, it's pretty stupid. Oh well, I'll keep my eyes open for any news regarding this. It wouldnt be the first time someone comes up with a tool to open files that werent meant to (IL2 for one).

EDIT: Hehe, seems that servers ranging from PC to PS3 to wankbox360 are all either down or very slow. CM wasnt really prepared to the worldwide release now were they? :haha:

[Fincuan]

My guess is they weren't prepared on how quickly people will torrent the game :) One torrent I checked a few days ago had tens of thousands seeders and leechers. No cd-key or any other prevention methods means these pirates are able to play online just like anyone else, which just sucks...

[Fincuan]

Modders have managed to open the "encrypted" files(which weren't encrypted at all afterall) :yeah:

[Ilpalazzo]

I wonder if there's any chance of a lean button mod.:hmmm:

[Amiral Crapaud]

I wonder if there's any chance of a lean button mod.:hmmm:

I don't envy Dowly... Must be a pain in the a*s to try to defend this game now - although it's an OK shooter, it falls so short of OFP on every aspect that I cannot not reproach CM for trying to sell it like OFP follow up on purpose. But considering the radical stance Dowly chose to adopt over a year ago, I guess he is stuck with OFP2 till the end of days :salute:

One thing is sure: fanboyism - or rather anti-fanboyism in the case of Bohemia - leads nowhere close to objectivism... Good luck Dowly, no offense, but well... Reading about your posts over one year ago about how CM would make it right and hand over BI's butt over a plate when it came to realism was just joyful, like the memories of a lost youth... :03:

[Ilpalazzo]

...CM would make it right and hand over BI's butt over a plate when it came to realism...

Who would have imagined that the sequel to OFP would be a dumbed down console game?

I'll be trying this game out soon enough. I waited a very long time for another Operation Flashpoint game. I'd hate to just let it go without trying it. So many good games keep fading into consoland.

[Amiral Crapaud]

Who would have imagined that the sequel to OFP would be a dumbed down console game?Well, sounded like predictable to me when coming from Codemasters, which had no experience whatsoever in infantry stuff and relied heavily upon OFP legacy to advertise the thing.
The moment it was announced for consoles you knew it would be cut down, come on!

I may understand the prudence of people out there and their goodwilled optimism. What I understood not that well was the fact that rancour and bitterness towards ArmA was enough to make certains here assume that BIS work over the years could be swept with the hand by some miraculous team built from scratch by an editor in need of cashing a licence. What I saw was simply bad faith, or ignorance: of course ArmA is OFP all over again when it comes to animations or the way things burn: it's a development of the same engine over more than a decade now. What some saw as the admittance of a failure, I saw as a promess of a long-standing standard. And while I remember people shouting about "BIS' treason with ArmA", I find it funny those same people don't feel betrayed by CM now...

[Ilpalazzo]

I meant before we knew it was going to be for consoles. If you'd have told me it was going to be like this, I would have smacked you and said "no way in hell."

Tis another blow to pc gaming. In fact, I'd say it's close to the final blow.

[Arclight]

:haha: What, PC gaming is going to die again?! :har:

Imho it's not even a bump on the road of PC gaming. People forget that Codemasters only owns the name, it's BIS that made the original OFP, and continued the series with Arma.

Imho anyone who expected something on par with the original OFP (realism wise) is just ignorant. I never had high hopes for DR, and if I'm to believe Dowly, it's actually better than expected. AI getting confused in the dark and engaging friendlies is unique, never seen before. How he described the way they set up to cover corners of a building sounds pretty good too.

Imho they deserve credit for what they accomplished with the AI. If not setting a new standard for realism, maybe they'll set a new one for what can be done with AI. I don't think this is a "significant" title, but I don't think it's a bad one either.

[Dowly]

@Alain-James

I believe I have already admitted that it is no competition to ArmA/OFP. As for my stance, I still stand behind it. OFP2 does things differently, yes it's dumbed down and is missing features that I would've liked to be there, but atleast it tried a new approach. As for CM riding the fame of OFP, well.. so does BIS. Or can anyone really say their main selling point has been all the new stuff they've added? :O:

Much of how OFP2 will do in the future is now up to the dev's decision to either support the modders or not. If the community is fortunate enough to get support and the necessary tools, the cap between OFP and OFP2 will shrink alot.

I'm enjoying the game at the moment, dont know how long it'll last, that we'll see later.

EDIT: Ow, it seems that over the weekend the community has been able to unpack the files, so if I read it right, OFP2 is moddable to some extent atm.

[Dowly]

Looking at the unpacked files, I came across the morale stuff. Here's how it works for anyone who is interested.

Soldier has it's base morale, let's call it morale points, of 100 to start with. How much said soldier loses morale depending of what happens is calculated by the soldier's skill level (green loses faster than an veteran etc.).

There is 6 morale states an soldier can be in:
Full - Full morale
Lowering - ~50% of morale lost
Failing - ~80% of morale lost
Breaking - ~90% of morale lost
Broken - 99% of morale lost
None - 100% of morale lost

Things that lower morale of an invidual soldier:
Pinned down................-0.5/sec
Suppressed.................-0.25/sec
Lightly wounded...........-10
Seriously wounded........-30
Low ammo...................-10
No ammo.....................-30

Other stuff that lower morale either for a group or an invidual soldier:
Friendly lightly wounded
Friendly seriously wounded
Friendly killed
Friendly fleeing

Things that raise morale of an invidual soldier:
In cover......................+0.5/sec
Enemy lightly wounded...+5
Ene. seriously wounded..+10
Enemy killed.................+10
Enemy fleeing...............+20


Lastly, everyone generates 0.5 MPs per second if they are not in an situation where their morale is dropping (i.e. the invidual has fled and is in relative safety or he is not otherwise in combat).

If an invidual has lost all of his MPs, there will be an 5 second penalty before his MPs start to regenerate.

EDIT: Always forget something. :)

The entity limit that is plaguing the mission makers is not hardcoded as it was first though. It can be modded to whatever one likes. :rock: Now... if someone just could come up with how to repack the files so one could actually test the changes made. :O:

[Ilpalazzo]

:haha: What, PC gaming is going to die again?! :har:

Imho it's not even a bump on the road of PC gaming.

Another good old pc title ruined is at least a bump to me. Off the top of my head, these once great games have been consoled; Call of Duty, Elder Scrolls, Thief, Deus Ex, Red Alert, Fallout, Ghost Recon, and Rainbow Six.

I finally tried OpFlash 2. I think the guy in the main title music summed up my feelings quite well with "bleeeaaaghhhhh" They show xbox controller buttons until you disable the controller in the options. It took me a good while to find out what 'press start button' meant (it's enter btw). The Fov is way too close and the lack of leaning sucks.

Well, I wouldn't say it's a terrible game. It's just not a good port. I need a higher FOV and lean buttons. Also, a better way to command my guys on the fly. I hate that I stop right in my tracks when I open that menu. Guess I just have to remember to get in cover before using it. If nothing else, it's a game with a coop campaign. And even bad games can be fun with coop.

[Raptor1]

No good old PC game is ruined, OFP2 simply uses the old OFP's name, it doesn't change the fact that the old one is great. It's true that the level of games developed today has been decreased dramatically due to the introduction of the idiot masses into gaming, but PC gaming is not going to die just because some developers pretend that their games are the continuation of great older games.

[Dowly]

Another good old pc title ruined is at least a bump to me. Off the top of my head, these once great games have been consoled; Call of Duty, Elder Scrolls, Red Alert, Fallout, Ghost Recon, and Rainbow Six.

May I ask you how you think those games have changed now that they are available on consoles aswell? Most of those have remained true to their original games no matter if they are for consoles aswell.

And yeh, I gotta laugh at this 'PC gaming is dying' bit, it has been said from around the time PS1 was released. There is still alot of titles that are and will remain as PC only titles.

[Ilpalazzo]

If only they would just introduce these sequels as entirely new games with new names. Then I wouldn't care at all:yeah:


May I ask you how you think those games have changed now that they are available on consoles aswell? Most of those have remained true to their original games no matter if they are for consoles aswell.I don't feel like getting into all that. For the most part I'd just like to say I don't like interfaces designed for large televisions, I don't like games that I can beat in a day, and I HATE regenerating health.

For now, for me, I just hope Diablo 3, Deus Ex 3, and Thief 4 turn out to be good PC games. Also, I'm still freaking waiting for Battle of Britain. Oh yes and the next Silent Hunter ><

[Fincuan]

Ok seriously... WTF is this AI taking and can I have some of the same? Please tell me they're not always like that...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=StWArGzWnBU&fmt=35
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B-7MAiYMbbk&fmt=35

[Dowly]

More like WTF the guy who recorded is taking. Either he put the AI skill to minimum or then that's an PS3 or Xbox360 (that is if the AI is dumbed down on those versions) as I tried the peek a boo and the 6 vs 1 and I got my ass whooped. And that was with regular AI. :hmmm:

[stabiz]

He says its on normal, no adjustments. An since he mentions fraps and video capture I guess its the pc version.

[Dowly]

Ah, missed that bit. Then I have no idea. Like I said, I got my ass whooped fast. :yep:

[Dowly]

Tried the 3 squads vs. me and again, I got very different results than what is shown on the video.

I made five or six runs with the same setup, all but one played like this:

As soon as they see me, the squad closest to me stays where they are and start shooting, while the other two squads move into my right and left flank = crossfire = dead.

The one that played out differently went as such; I got away into the nearby woods, middle squad came straight from front while the two other squads again flanked me from left and right = crossfire = dead.

Not once was I able to get ANYWHERE near to be able to knife anyone. This was also true with the other tests I made earlier.

:hmmm:

[Ilpalazzo]

I can use a little help.

Can somebody tell me how to use the compass? I don't see a button for it.:doh: My ai teammates are calling out directions like North and South, but I don't really know where that is (whatever happened to 12 o'clock etc?).

Is there a way to change the FOV at this time? I feel like the game is always zoomed in. Feels weird walking past objects or through doors.:o

ps. I never played arma 2 before tonight. I thought it was going to be just like arma 1. Boy was I wrong! I just played the demo and I think I'll be purchasing it very soon. I LOVE the quick command menu thingy. Somebody kick me for ignoring arma 2 all this time.:dead:

[ajrimmer42]

The compass is the bar at the top of the screen :up:

[Ilpalazzo]

There is nothing there. I think I saw it when I was in a vehicle though.:-?

[Dowly]

Press Q, it pops out the command circle and the compass in Hardcore mode.

[Ilpalazzo]

Thanks! Didn't notice it there. Was expecting a round compass when I tried pressing all the keys.

[Arclight]

Keep in mind this is about the console version:
While Operation Flashpoint: Dragon Rising touts itself as a tactical squad-based shooter, what really separates this franchise from all of the other gun games is its brutal difficulty and faithful adaptation to real battlefield conditions.
Operation Flashpoint: Dragon Rising Review: Boom Headshot! (http://kotaku.com/5374883/operation-flashpoint-dragon-rising-review-boom-headshot)

Seems like a level-headed review to me. :hmmm:

[Fincuan]

Yeah, on console. Not so much on PC :D

Then again I bet the reception wouldn't be as hostile if they didn't call it Operation Flashpoint and it would be even remotely close to the marketing that has been going on.

[Arclight]

Exactly, everyone was expecting a bigger and better Flashpoint, which it just isn't. Said it before, but noone seems to realize CM only owns the name Operation Flashpoint, BIS actually coded it. :-?

I'm curious to see where the modders are going to take this on PC. All the ingredients are there, there might be a real "hardcore" sim in there. :hmmm:

[Fincuan]

Bye bye dedi-servers for an unkown length of time, ie. probably forever. CM just keeps making the good design decisions:


Regarding Dedicated servers I can assure you we have not been ignoring you, we have been dealing with issues on a priority basis and obviously the connection issues amongst other things have been top priority over the last 120 hours.
I hear the calls but cannot promise anything at this stage, its not under development right now. More news if that changes

Sion
__________________
Sion Lenton
Exec Producer
Operation Flashpoint Dragon Rising

Source: http://community.codemasters.com/forum/showpost.php?p=5753424&postcount=46

[Dowly]

Oh well. Not a biggie atm coop missions are limited to 4 players, including custom missions. :doh: (atleast I think so)

[Fincuan]

Ok my first attempt on DR is now behind and ahemm.. Well I'm not sure if I dare to try again :D

After I fired up the game it was time to set settings and map controls. The main menu is ok and looks good, although it's pretty consolish with things like "Press return to enter main menu". When that was done I started a campaign on hardcore. No briefing or any intel at all before the first mission, but anyway the first task was to clear an LZ. I ordered the AI to fall in on me and proceeded towards a hill near the obj. Once we were almost on top of the hill a few enemis SPAWNED out of nowhere in defensive postions on top of it, but two of my AI quickly dispatched them. The two then charged the enemy positions on their own, without orders, while a third threw a grenade into... the position his mates just charged :haha:

The nade went off and killed both of the chargers, and at the same time my PC went into a hard lock forcing me to cut power in order to reboot. Now I'm wondering if I dare to start up the game again, because those hard locks sure aren't very healthy for the system. :down:

[Arclight]

Not very encouraging. Hope you give it another go though, would like some more feedback on it. :salute:

Hope it's not another "patch untill playable" ones. :-?

[Dowly]

I've been fortunate to not have any issues with my copy. :smug:

(ok ok, I CTD'd once, but that is propably because I havent dusted my PC in ages :hmmm:)

[Fincuan]

Yeah it was weird, probably something to do with audio since it occured almost instantly after the nade exploded. I don't have any stability problems with other games such as Arma2 and SH4, both of which are a lot more demanding than DR. One good thing about it was that it really runs well, all full settings was no problem on even my crappy PC, but at the cost of very dated graphics. I got severe flashbacks of Raven Shield.

[Fincuan]

Ok first two missions of the campaign completed, and I must say it's not as bad as I first thought.

It's definitely not a sim by a long shot and much closer to the run-and-guns than OFP/Arma. Like a complex run-and-gun, "run-stop-gun" :D The first two campaign missions were very easy even on hardcore, and thanks to that I already got slightly bored with the game. Bear in mind that I jumped straight into the campaign, which should give you some kind of clue on how hard it is. Anyone with an FPS/shooter background will feel right at home. The controls and the commanding are very easy to learn, even if the command menu could easily be a lot better. Weapons were a pleasant surprise in the sense that they actually do feel a bit like weapons, even if the recoil is very simplified. The sights will always land at exactly the same spot after firing. I recommend keeping it on semi-auto at all times, because that way you'll avoid noticing the lack of recoil on burst and full-auto. Mouse control is very sluggish with the control-lag easily noticeable, but it's not too bad most of the time given that the FPS is almost always hitting 60 except for the odd moments with lots of smoke and explosions(vertical-sync enabled, all settings maxed out).

To me the biggest let-downs are the almost complete lack of realism, the stupid AI, the awful animations, sluggish controls and the alredy mentioned dated graphics. It's still not a bad "tactical shooter", as this is lightyears ahead of CODs and such, but not a very good one either. On the positive side it's sort of fun for half-an-hour at a time, after which it gets repeative. Hopefully user-made mission will help with this problem.

[Dowly]

Hater! :stare: :O:

Tbh, I've grown bored to it already. I'll be propably saving the rest of the campaign for any future LAN's I might have with my mates. :hmmm:

[Fincuan]

A sequel for DR has been announced: http://blog.gameshadow.com/?p=1841

W.T.F ???

:rotfl2:

[Oberon]

A sequel for DR has been announced: http://blog.gameshadow.com/?p=1841

W.T.F ???

:rotfl2:

L4D syndrome :03:

Boycott OFP2 interweb campaign in five...four...three...

[Fincuan]

Judging by the official DR forums your counter should be headed the other way, and the numbers quite a lot bigger :D

Naturally it's full of bitching and outright trolls, but there's also serious talk on suing CM for false advertising and plenty of other kind of threads by people who are quite disappointed.

[Oberon]

Judging by the official DR forums your counter should be headed the other way, and the numbers quite a lot bigger :D

Naturally it's full of bitching and outright trolls, but there's also serious talk on suing CM for false advertising.


:dead: Still, it is a bit EA in practice to begin churning out a sequel before the first has even bedded in. Particularly on such a sensitive subject as OFP. :hmmm: Still a bit OTT, but there you go, it's the internet, it's Drama ;)

[Arclight]

I don't think CM has been misleading anyone. :-?

I saw the trailers and gameplay videos, and it was clear it wasn't going to be a sim. They announced release for consoles, and I knew it wasn't going to be "OFP"... :hmmm: On second thought, sue their asses, they should have never attached the name Operation Flashpoint to this game. :nope:

I still think anyone who didn't realize BIS made OFP instead of CM is just naïve, but I can see where they're coming from.

[Fincuan]

First mod is out, and it claims to fix something that was a huge problem: the AI accuracy: http://community.codemasters.com/forum/showthread.php?t=390475

As the game isn't designed for modding one actually needs to overwrite original files to change anything, so bring in JSGME :)

[Dowly]

Nnirvi has spoken (in finnish)
http://www.pelit.fi/index.php?id=70333

[Arclight]

So what did he say? :doh:

[Zachstar]

I will never buy the PC version. Lack of any kind of protection against Pirates and Cheaters is just insane. Its a free for all in PC multiplayer with lots of reports of cheating.

The console I will buy tho only once I can get a copy at under 40USD and only after a patch is let loose to help with the retarded AI.

The only reason I am buying it is because I want to be able to run missions with friends

[Ilpalazzo]

So has anybody tried that ai mod? That video reminded me of CoD on 'veteran' difficulty. That was rough (remember Pavlov's:dead:).

[Fincuan]

Thanks for the link Dowly :up:

So what did he say? :doh:

What we've been saying all along basically.

I think this part sums it up pretty well:
The Arma II engine is considerably more advanced than that of Dragon Rising, but DR is still a good mix between Arma and Call of Duty.


Given how DR turned out this one is right on the spot. DR is the "worst case scenario" he lists.

There aren't too many games in this genre, so let's hope this one sells. In the best case we'll be playing more of both Arma and OFP, while in the worst case there will just be a third tombstone next to Rainbow Six and Swat with the text "Global Operations Flashpoint: Vegas" next to a symbol consoliditis

[Arclight]

So we got stiffed again by devs focusing on developing for consoles? Hurray for platforms with limited resources... :nope:

Frickin Codemasters, let's hope they don't tarnish the name any further. I hope they just stick with their racing-games and Wii shovelware. :down:



Not that BIS is heading in the right direction (at least when it comes to SP campaigns). :damn:

[Dowly]

So we got stiffed again by devs focusing on developing for consoles? Hurray for platforms with limited resources... :nope:

Well, Nnirvi said that in his opinion there is surprisingly little consolisation and compromises in DR.

I translated ~half of the review last night, I'll try to get the other half translated today. :salute:

[Zachstar]

If they want to dev for consoles they need to stick with consoles and ignore PC ports.

[Gato76]

Is there a way to disable the head-bob in this game ?,is making me sick :stare:,cannot play more than 30 minutes without geting a headache

[Ilpalazzo]

tell me about it. I would love to disable it. I disabled it in arma2 and now I don't feel like a clumsy oaf.