Some convoy tips?

[Khourieat]

Need some tips on attacking convoys, folks! (I know, I was shocked too).

I've done 2 ships with no escorts with no problem, sneak up on the first, let torpedoes do their thing and then chase the second down with the deck gun. Once "startled" I haven't been able to guess their course directions, they just seem to scatter in a random direction, so I keep missing with torpedoes. I usually do this from 900-1000 yards to avoid detection.

But that's only for small groups that do not have an escort. For large groups I've only been able to attack 1 ship with any level of accuracy. Even took out a battleship in a task force like this once (fired off 3 torpedoes, crash dived and tucked my tail to run away).

For large, escorted convoys (lets say 4 rows, 2 columns of merchants with some number of escorts) I usually try to settle off to one side, again at about 1k yards from the espected path of the nearest column, and set my numbers for the first ship. Once those torpedoes are off I quickly try to set up for the one behind it, hoping to get 2 in the same pass but never manage, they turn in random directions and will sometimes not even cross in front of me (sometimes they try through me, but that never seems to work).

Am I too far from the column? Should I be aiming for different ships, instead? Or is the hit 1 and run the general tactic? I could probably sneak away and stalk another ship, specially since they all scatter in different directions, but even then I usually end up missing due to their changing directions for the next day.

Better aiming on my part? I'm running stock SH, and on automatic targeting, so it's pretty embarrasing to be on automatic and watch two torpedoes swim off into the distance, completely missing a target 1000 yards away :nope:

Although that's not as bad as the time I missed a stationary target at a port :damn:

Any suggestions? Or just hit 1 and follow someone else for a few days till they straighten out their course?

[Graafenstein]

Maybe I could give a few pointers here for a change, instead of reading the other Kaleuns strategies (which, by the way, I wouldn't have played SH3+4 without ;)).

My strategy is to get to and stay in the center of the convoy.

I usually try to plot a course to get at least 10 nm ahead of the convoy's course, turn radar on and with the ruler estimate and draw each column's course (usually 5 in a large convoy). Then I position myself between the center column and the outer left/right one with my bow towards the convoy, thus give away as little beam as possible for the lead DD. All stop, silent running on and dive to 300 feet on first visual contact (just to confirm your column plottings). Stay down there until the leading DD passes you and then I rise to about 95 feet to open my torp doors. Slowly turn your boat 90 dgs so you get good bow and aft shots to the outer columns. Fire away on the furthest targets, and when they hit (or you get detected), secure from silent running (to reload fish) and go flank speed towards the center of the convoy (where you most likely are already at that time). Then just fire away as much as possible. The key thing is to stay close to a merchant and torp the others. That way the DDs often have to abort their attack runs. When your out of torps, dive at flank speed to 300 feet, drop a decoy on your way down at about 100-150 feet, go silent right after that at maximum 1 knot, and change your course. They seem to have trouble pinpointing you around remaining merchants, so I can escape almost every time.

Back in SH3 i even got one DD firing his guns past me and hit a DD on my other side, making that one fire at the first DD. Civil naval war!:D
Happy hunting!

[Slang]

Typically I shoot at only 2 targets in a convoy. I pick a target in a far column, and shoot at it, then setup a shot on a target in a closer column. The idea being to get both shots to detonate at or approximately at the same time. Thus, minimizing or negating any time they have to react to torpedo hits.

The thing to remember when targetting is that all merchants in a convoy are going to be on the same heading, at the same speed. The only variable is range, which is easily and quickly deduced via the standimeter, or active sonar.

One thing you may not be familiar with yet, with regard to manual targetting, is how the TDC handles the AOB. On the right side of the screen you have the tool for inputting the AOB. But if you notice on the upper left dial of the TDC is a picture of a little ship. You'll notice that the front of that little ship will point to a number on the outer ring of that dial. That number is the targets true course, assuming you've input the correct AOB. So in a convoy situation you know that any merchant, no matter what bearing its on, will always have the same course. That course should have already been solved via visual, or radar tracking. So its just a matter of turning the input tool, until the correct course is reached on the upper left dial for any target in the convoy.

Appologies if you already knew this, but its important, so worth mentioning.

[Khourieat]

So you are perpendicular to the columns, and firing at the outer ones on the first row?

That's really interesting, I need to try that, I can see where it'd work, specially if you have a convoy with an even number of columns, they'll just sail right around you. The escorts? Not so much, but that's what running away is for.

How close do you need to be to a merchant for destroyers to leave you alone? I'm not sure I can navigate all that well while trying to line up a firing solution :hmm:

Even still though, if I could grab 2 in one firing solution, that'd be great.

What is the minimum arming distance for the torpedoes? Maybe the ship in the nearest column can be fired at, as well?

[Buffalo9]

I miss all the time on auto targeting, usually because they either detected my torps or are on a zigzag plan which I didn't see.

Are you using steam's or electric's?
Steam being faster(on fast) but detectable, electric's slower(1 speed) but more stealthy.

A good rule is to allow 400yds for runout arming, though i don't know the specification's for either arming run, I probably should look that up!!

[Graafenstein]

I'm in december '43 and still using steam, and I think I recall minimum arming range in SH3 being 300 yards, but I don't know the range in SH4.
Your torp range could very well be 300+, while range to ship is only 200 depending on your AOB:
http://thumbnails6.imagebam.com/474/73635e4734567.gif

Yes, perpendicular as much as possible, and as Slang says: time your torpedoes so all impacts are simultaneous.
After my first torps have hit I try to maintain the same course+speed as and within the convoy, and about 100 yards away from a merchant while targeting all others.

[Rockin Robbins]

So I attack at sundown. I take out one ship at a time and any sure opportunities, but don't expect a second ship. I pull out, do an end around and approach the other side of the convoy. Repeat as necessary. Make every shot count.

I like to get forced down by two or three escorts and maneuver for the "Cutie on a Leash" trick. You ascend to 99' when your attackers are bunched up behind you and loose the Cutie in their general direction. Not much will happen. Go deep again and when the cutie is 700-1000 yards out hit full throttle for about 20 seconds. The cutie will have his leash yanked and do a 180 to come right over top of you.

You're too deep for the cutie to hit and you're back to silent running anyway. Where do the escorts have to go to kill you. Hehehehehehehehe. You guessed it, Right by your leashed guard dog. When he gets away again, yank the leash and get him back. You can keep your cutie heeling really well for about fifteen minutes during which time your odds of bagging an escort are really good.

[SurfnSea]

Do NOT under any circumstances sink the merchants carrying the alchoholic beverages...I understand it's against the Geneva convention. :yep:

[Khourieat]

I just wanted to thank everyone for the ideas! I tried this last night, lined up outside the escort, aimed at the first 3 columns of ships (starting with the farthest away), and unloaded all forward tubes, 2 shots a ship, sank all 3 before I had to sink down to 300 for some prowling.

I couldn't get the hang of staying in range of the merchants, but I eventually managed to get within 500 or so yards of one, come up, fire 2 off and sink back down, I repeated this tactic until all 5 remaining ships were down (having to swap for rear tubes at one point).

Now I have to make my way to my mission objective, with only the rear torpedoes left :up:

I think my prowling near merchants needs some work, every time I tried aiming at a different ship while stalking one nearby, my shots were very off. I reloaded and saved a few times to get some practice in, but I think I'm just rushing this tactic, the ships were still in zigzag mode and were too difficult to hit at the distances I was working with. I found that at 400-500 yards, even on a wild zigzag I had excellent chances of a double hit (near simultaneous fire, no time for a proper spread).

Anyways, very exciting stuff, thanks all for the help, it was really a thrill to end the siege on the convoy, because I ran out of convoy :rotfl:

Funny enough the convoy seemed to try to retreat towards a second convoy, which I only picked up on sonar...they were long gone by the time I was done, and with only aft torpedoes left I decided not to mount a chase.

[gimpy117]

i use the lay and wait tactic. get in front of the convoy, let them come to you, saves battery and gets you really close if your stopped at silent... some ships are withhin 500 yards

actually, the only problem is making sure that your not too close so your torps can arm...

this is in stock.

[Able72]

Before I went to manual aiming, I liked to take on the escorts first (don't know what I'll do now that I've changed to manual targeting). My tactic was to get the attention of one of the escorts, target him, wait till he was comming head on and within about 500 yards. I'd loose one bow torp at him and wait, when it hit, most of the time, it was all over for that escort. His radio calls would have gotten the next escort lined up for you, so that you could take out the escorts one at a time. They aren't nearly as dangerous one at a time.

Once I had downed all the escorts I had my pick of the merhcie's. I'd start with the heavies, wound them so they'd have to stop. Once I had a nice long trail of immobile merchies, I'd go back and use the Deck Gun to finish them off. Biggest patrol I had was running one convoy using this method, dropped over 65k tons to the bottom on that patrol.

[9th_cow]

Well it took some doing, and a lot of time, wich is obvious if there are going to be 8 aircraft over your position at all times from dawn till dusk every day, i wondered why there were so many planes, i guessed carrier, but was still surprised by the sheer volume of traffic. took well over 48 hours, flat out after dark on the surface and decks awash when i was feeling brave during daytime.


but i ifnally found out why, 6 carriers, at least 2 tankers and 2 heeavy cruisers, god alone knows how many other ships.
without doubt the most exciting challenge ive ever faced, obviously seen task forces with 2-4 carriers, but 2 were always escort class, all of these are big ships.

kinda risky running in there decks awash at low light, and as it turned out the annoying sods started a course change as i calculated my attack.
the other thing that makes me cry is that my little tub has 4 tubes. 4 fishies and there is a submariners wet dream sailing past.


no doubt ill meet up with them later, will require another day of yo-yo travel and a night of burning gas but as theyre turning south down the straight i should get set up nicely for an attack or two.

btw i forgot how tought this games learning curve is, didnt ever play manual aim all the way through shiii or for months in shiv. then i mastered it, but that was a long time ago, just got back into playing and damn...it sounds simple on paper, but it really isnt :)

http://img382.imageshack.us/img382/3431/sh4imgby3.jpg

oh and i would just like to thank the Takoa captain.
if you hadnt sailed into my torpedoes, that damnable CV would be doing more than burning :damn:

[Able72]

damn, I'd like to meet a task force like that. Only ever seen one carrier in this game. Would love to sink my teeth into a task force like the one your describing.

only 4 tubes? you running an S-class?

[9th_cow]

its 1941 and im running from the base wich is the first to fall to the IJN ( may have already for that matter) so although i dont recall right now im running an early type, ill look it up next time i play

yeah ive encountered a few task forces but since i started playing again this is my first sighting of one, and what a sighting ( realism aside its just fun )

actually its my 4th career attempt since restarting the game. and i guess im back on track, my first victim a lonely merchant racked up 7K+

my 3 previous attempts wich all ended in disaster i managed 1K combined hehe.

taking my time, being patient, and worst of all, allowing a 50/50 chance to escape, so i can save my torps for a 100% certanty at a later date.

once im up ahead of this Task force, im going to do my utmost to sink a CV, failing that ill run deep and go back though the whole process again to get back up ahead of them, the thing i dread at the moment is getting in too close when theyre aproaching me.
nothing worse than seeing 4 carriers sail past you because you got in too close to theyre course and dare not move incase you attract the escorts, been there done that :)

[kylesplanet]

So I attack at sundown. I take out one ship at a time and any sure opportunities, but don't expect a second ship. I pull out, do an end around and approach the other side of the convoy. Repeat as necessary. Make every shot count.

I like to get forced down by two or three escorts and maneuver for the "Cutie on a Leash" trick. You ascend to 99' when your attackers are bunched up behind you and loose the Cutie in their general direction. Not much will happen. Go deep again and when the cutie is 700-1000 yards out hit full throttle for about 20 seconds. The cutie will have his leash yanked and do a 180 to come right over top of you.

You're too deep for the cutie to hit and you're back to silent running anyway. Where do the escorts have to go to kill you. Hehehehehehehehe. You guessed it, Right by your leashed guard dog. When he gets away again, yank the leash and get him back. You can keep your cutie heeling really well for about fifteen minutes during which time your odds of bagging an escort are really good.

The ole "Cutie on a Leash" is just a great little trick!:yep: I've popped more than a few DD's with that little piece of info.:arrgh!:
Thanks for sharing that RR, I read it sometime back and started with it and I always load up some cuties when available. It's more fun than a barrel of fish hooks!:lol:

Plus RR gave me credit for naming it.:know:

[Khourieat]

I've only seen one task force so far, but I got to take down a kongo BB, I think. Also am really looking forward to seeing a carrier, but with the rate of my recent patrols, I'm pretty confident I'll stumble into one sooner or later. Don't know how much of a beating those things can take, but I have 6 forward tubes with it's name on it :up:

[9th_cow]

well over 3 nights i managed to put 2 fish into a Takoa, 2 into a Tanker, and into a CV the tanker especially sailed on so deep in the water a stones backwash would have sank her.
but i did claim 2 carriers, a fully fledged one and a escort.

don't know what happened between my first kill, and the second, but when i lazily started to make my way round to the south of the force so i could surface and make another run during the night time to over take them the somewhat embarrassingly bad IJN escorts learned they're trade.
first night i made a decks awash surface attack to claim the escort type, sailed of laughing, second night i went in submerged, and didnt get back up till around noon the next day.
the whole time i was hounded by destroyers, thats also when i noticed the damaged tanker, however as the thought to put the deck gun to use formed i was detected once more, and spent another 4 hours on the run.

im almost certain i couldnt evade them the second time due to a little ambush i suffered between the first and second night, during the day i came up for a look around, surfaced to 30 ( decks awash because hitting dive in this condition sinks you like a brick) and finally surfaced ( decks awash limits me to 12 knots, i can do 20 fully surfaced)
20 minutes later the first warning i got of a destroyer on the horizon was a barrage dropping right on my tail. 30% hull damage and flooding.
thankfully the flooding was under control so i could dive, but that took about 1 and a half to 2 minutes, these are not U boats :) and thats why i like to run with only the conning tower showing whenever i may face attack because i can get under in seconds as opposed to minutes.

im sure the damage i took then is what was giving away my position after my second attack, even running silent at 1 knot, at 240 feet wich was as low as i dared go with my hull damage, i couldnt shake the sods.
the whole thing left me sweating hehe.
after my first attack i was detected but dropping below erm...thermal layer, and powering off at 5 knots i got away with ease

however im heading home, not risking my neck for a few more tons, besides i only have 3 torps left and at the moment still cant surface. ( due to the whole jap airforce being up there)

to make matters worse that task force is heading south along the "straight" towards my new base, so i have to head north and box around them east then south.
if the IJN airforce stays up there thick as flies i wont make it home for 2 weeks.

still 40K or so of shipping isnt bad. unless you consider all those misses, a couple of duds, and a lot of seemingly bad luck with torps thumping home with no real effect :)

[edjcox]

Ok here's some of my Tactics and methods


Site the convoy and go to periscope depth

Check the water depth around you and be aware if there are shallows.

Run a course center line on the convoy to determine there position and projected position

Dive to max dept and run standard speed to within convoys projected path.

Slow to silent running and stay at max depth while Escort destroyers run over you and keep on moving by.

Raise your scope and crawl at silen running to periscope depth. Open up your tubes and have used all the previous time to set appropriate depths and speed impact / magnetic fuses on your fish

Open all your tubes using the "Q" and "W" commands and then


Line up on the farthest target first

Fire and move your scope forward. This will let your fish all be fired before an impact alerts the gang to your presence. After 1st shot go to slow and remove silent running so your crew will reload.

Remember shot rear most target first and move forward to closest. Drop your scope between shots and lower totally when empty.

When your empty and reloading release a decoy and change your heading paralle to convoy track and go to flank once your lined parallel relase another decoy and slows to standard untill you have enough fish for anotehr salvoe. Remember to open te muzzles ahead of time so that the firing sequence is faster.

Good luck

[Dmsdmullins]

I ran into a task force with 4 carriers but only had two torps left. I went deep and popped up perpendicular to the last one about 500yds out. Hit it twice and blew off its rudders and props but didnt sink it. With no torps left I waited to see if it would sink but it didnt. Funniest part was the task force left it and when they got about 15 miles out I emptied my deck gun into it until i was out of ammo.. Didnt even scratch it! Its hard to turn tail and walk away from a disabled carrier.