Supertramp help!

[Philipp_Thomsen]

Hi you all.

Im planning a supertramp to canada for 2010, making a lot of preparations, both physically and mentally, reading a lot either.

Im moving to canada to start a new life, but I intend to spend a whole year (maybe more, maybe less) in the wild life of United States, living off the land.

I need some information regarding some things, sure theres better places to ask but Im getting all the info I can get.

First of all, Im planning on getting a ride on a merchant ship from my country to the east coast of USA, I can arrange that no problem, I would work on the ship to pay my travell, sort of a friendly deal. But what I need to know is what do I need when I reach the USA port. I would prefer not having trouble with imigration, but Im not sure if I can just get out of the ship and start walking my way into america. Im not sure how those things work.

Besides, I want to know if any of you live in USA, and if so, if I can pay a visit, chat a little bit about life, drink a cup of tea and get some advices on places to visit.

The spots I'd like to visit so far are the yosemite park (and some other national parks), kaiak down the colorado river to the gulf of california and walk my way up the west coast up to Canada, where a friend of mine will be waiting for me.

So any help, info, advices, encouragement and kind words are welcome! :up:

Thanks in advance!

[Sailor Steve]

I'm not sure how those things work either. My best advice would be to start checking government offices about passports and visas early, and right before you're ready to go find the nearest American embassy or consulate and tell them what you're trying to do.

I live in Utah, which is in the mountains about 1/3 of the country in from the west coast. It's out of the way from almost anywhere, so you're not likely to pass through just by chance.
http://www.subsim.com/2008_subsim_meet.htm
Focus in on the United States and you'll find my pin, so you can see where I am (and a few more, the ones planning to attend the meeting).

The merchant ship part sounds like fun. I'd do it myself, if I were 30 years younger.

[kiwi_2005]

And heres me thinking you were wanting help on the 70's pop group 'Supertramp'

[DeepIron]

Im moving to canada to start a new life, but I intend to spend a whole year (maybe more, maybe less) in the wild life of United States, living off the land.
Good luck bro... I don't want to burst your bubble but it's not very likely to happen the way you envision.

Working your way to the US on a merchant is romantic and all, but there's no guarantee immigration will even let you into the country when you get here. The US is dealing with terrorism now, and "falling off the banana boat" (a phrase describing illegal entry) is more than likely to land you in jail and then extradited back to Brazil.

If you come to the US, you'd better have lots of $$$ with you. "Living off the land" in the US hasn't been feasible since the 60's... Sure, if you want to eat out of dumpsters and garbage cans, but then again, you'll have to compete with the rest of the homeless people already doing it...

It isn't like you can just "pitch a tent" somewhere anymore either. Local sheriffs will arrest you for vagrancy or trespass... Walking around the country isn't romantic anymore, it's friggin' dangerous...

I would prefer not having trouble with imigration, but Im not sure if I can just get out of the ship and start walking my way into america.Ain't gonna happen bro... Better have all your required vacinations and shot record, visa or passport and again, $$$. You walk off a merchant boat on the East Coast, and you'll liable to get mugged. I deliver and pickup goods in some of the port areas along both coasts and they can be rough neighborhoods.

BTW, if you're thinking about living in Canada, I hope you have a useful and needed skill and your friend can sponsor you, along with more $$$ to pay the fees, etc. Your not going to "just walk across the border" into Canada either. Canadian border crossing is more stringent than US... Again, I know this from experience taking goods into Canada.

My advice to you: save your money, get all your paperwork in order, FLY to Canada and meet your friend, get your new life started THEN come down to the US and look around...

Don't get me wrong, there are a lot of good people here in the US, it's just not as easy and safe as it used to be to "tramp around" anymore.

Good luck...

[stabiz]

Into the Wild?

[Trex]

My advice to you: save your money, get all your paperwork in order, FLY to Canada and meet your friend, get your new life started THEN come down to the US and look around...
That's the best advice going!



If you are really keen on sailing there as opposed to flying, many merchant ships do offer transport for travellers. You have to pay for it, of course, and the atmposhere is not as 'Las Vegas' as the liners, but they are said to be comfortable (you get the vacant owner's cabin, eg) and have good food. Just make sure your visa is in order when you land in Canada.

[JSLTIGER]

Hi you all.

Im planning a supertramp to canada for 2010, making a lot of preparations, both physically and mentally, reading a lot either.

Im moving to canada to start a new life, but I intend to spend a whole year (maybe more, maybe less) in the wild life of United States, living off the land.

I need some information regarding some things, sure theres better places to ask but Im getting all the info I can get.

First of all, Im planning on getting a ride on a merchant ship from my country to the east coast of USA, I can arrange that no problem, I would work on the ship to pay my travell, sort of a friendly deal. But what I need to know is what do I need when I reach the USA port. I would prefer not having trouble with imigration, but Im not sure if I can just get out of the ship and start walking my way into america. Im not sure how those things work.

Besides, I want to know if any of you live in USA, and if so, if I can pay a visit, chat a little bit about life, drink a cup of tea and get some advices on places to visit.

The spots I'd like to visit so far are the yosemite park (and some other national parks), kaiak down the colorado river to the gulf of california and walk my way up the west coast up to Canada, where a friend of mine will be waiting for me.

So any help, info, advices, encouragement and kind words are welcome! :up:

Thanks in advance!
I'm with DeepIron on this one. There is no way to pull off what you're talking about. In order to come into the US (even if you only stay on the ship), you have to go through immigration and customs, and to stay for anything longer than a short-duration visit (i.e. a week-long vacation), you'll need a visa. In order to get a visa, you have to show that you have a job in the US, or will only be here temporarily as a student. Beyond that, you'd have to wait in line to get a full immigration visa. The government will not let you in without either proof that you have enough money to support yourself indefinitely or proof of one of these two things to ensure that you are not using government services illegally.

Immigration Services:
http://travel.state.gov/visa/visa_1750.html

By living off the land, I assume you mean hunting. In order to hunt, you'll need a weapon, and the correct permits for that weapon. They will not admit you to the US with a weapon if you are not a citizen, and most likely you won't be able to buy one if you're only here temporarily. Moreover, you'd need to ensure that the land you're living off of is not owned by anyone else (a fairly tall order, certainly at least in the East).

I don't know how far you're planning on kayaking down the Colorado River, but you're liable to be arrested at certain sensitive points (not to mention it's dammed up at a bunch of places, i.e. Hoover Dam). Moreover, it is very unlikely that you'll be able to just walk up the 1100+ miles of coastline.

Your vision for what you want to do is indeed a romantic notion. However, the world we live in is not a romantic one, and these plans are not feasible in real life.

[Philipp_Thomsen]

@Sailor Steve

Saw your pin, its not too far away, Im planning on walking all over the place! Maybe I can drop by if you dont mind! :up:

@ Kiwi_2005

:rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

@ DeepIron

I love danger, man! Its in every man's heart. The new experiences are the core of happiness. I know theres much more rules for me to follow than to someone born in USA, but I'll find a way. I'm willing to walk around depending on other peoples hitchhiks, food, company, etc. But I'm also willing to work here and there in exchange for some food or money. The main objective is not to survive and start a life, but simply to pass by and see the nature, to see what is out there to be seen. If you say its better for me to get a visa, then I'll get one. But going in and out of the borders are not that difficult if you dont stay on the roads. Besides Im getting the imigration papers to live in Canada, and for the USA, I'll try to get something more like, ahn, turist! Just for some months... I'll follow your advice and stay away from the east coast. The wild west seems to be more pleasant. Thanks for all the tips. :up:

@ Stabiz

Pretty much! :up:

@ Trex

I'll think about it. There's a lot of things for me to study and reconsider. The trip starts in 600 days.

@ JSLTIGER

I have to take my chances here. What is happiness for you? I just can't accept to be like everyone else. People work to earn money to pay bills, and have children to perpetuate the mankind. In my head this is freaking redundant!

The most important thing is, when you reach the end of the road, you will look back and remember what you have been thru, what you have acomplished, what you have seen, the people you've met, will you be proud of yourself? I don't want to be a stubborn old man sitting on my butt, who have worked behind a desk his whole life and have done nothing but payed his bills and watched television. I rather die 30 years old of starvation in some remote place in the world after seen it all, then to die very old, warm in my bed, after passing by the whole life in blank.

Life is a whisper, you come, tell a story, and disappear. And I want to have a good story to tell.

[DeepIron]

I'm willing to walk around depending on other peoples hitchhiks, food, company, etc. But I'm also willing to work here and there in exchange for some food or money. Well Philipp, you're going to starve here. There are thousands of homeless people in this country and you'll get to compete with them... They stand on street corners with their little signs "Will work for food" and no one pays them any heed...
People don't pick up hitchhikers too much anymore either, including foreigners. I see people every trip I make dumped off and stranded in truck stops... their cash and belongings gone down the road with the people that picked them up...

But going in and out of the borders are not that difficult if you dont stay on the roads. Spoken like an illegal immigrant. First time you get stopped by a local law enforcement officer (and they'll do it just because they can) and they check your papers and find you entered the country illegally it'll be all over. You'll be classified as "undesirable" and confiscate your papers. You may be incarcerated for an indeterminant length of time while the government decides whether your a terrorist or not. If your lucky, you'll be extradited back to Brazil but you won't get a visa or traveling papers to the US ever again...

But hey, you love danger... so yeah, good luck... I hope we don't read about you dead and ass raped somewhere around LA in the Wild West...

[Philipp_Thomsen]

I guess you're too scared! I know at least 6 people who have done this already and they have a lot of good stories to tell. :up:

You keep thinking I'm going to be near big cities. For your information I wont be even near SMALL cities. This is a road trip. Im 100% sure that its possible to go from where I live to Canada ON FOOT. But I wont do that, there would be a lot of places in the way that Im not interested on seeing.

Do you mind me asking how old are you?

[Sailor Steve]

@Sailor Steve

Saw your pin, its not too far away, Im planning on walking all over the place! Maybe I can drop by if you dont mind! :up:
You're welcome anytime!

The most important thing is, when you reach the end of the road, you will look back and remember what you have been thru, what you have acomplished, what you have seen, the people you've met, will you be proud of yourself? I don't want to be a stubborn old man sitting on my butt, who have worked behind a desk his whole life and have done nothing but payed his bills and watched television. I rather die 30 years old of starvation in some remote place in the world after seen it all, then to die very old, warm in my bed, after passing by the whole life in blank.
HEY! Quit talking about me that way!:dead:

Life is a whisper, you come, tell a story, and disappear. And I want to have a good story to tell.
Good for you! There are obstacles, and you do need to find out all about the legalities, but don't let youreslf be stopped by other peoples' negatives. Live your life. Nobody else can.

[DeepIron]

I guess you're too scared! I know at least 6 people who have done this already and they have a lot of good stories to tell. :up:

You keep thinking I'm going to be near big cities. For your information I wont be even near SMALL cities. This is a road trip. Im 100% sure that its possible to go from where I live to Canada ON FOOT. But I wont do that, there would be a lot of places in the way that Im not interested on seeing.

Do you mind me asking how old are you? Being "scared" has nothing to do with it Phillip. I've already hitchhiked the US twice from coast to coast so being on the road is no strange thing to me. BTW, I'm 51. I drive a semi about 15,000 miles a month over most of the country so I see a lot of what is going on.

You say you won't even be near small cities. Then how do you expect to traverse California? Entering into a port on the West Coast will limit the number of cities you can enter, San Diego, LA and San Francisco are the most likely. That will put you on the "wrong side" of a major metropolitian area from which you will go... where?

A "road trip" is what to you exactly? Hitchhiking?

I'm glad your friends had good stories to tell. I'm assuming they entered the country legally with all the necessary papers, etc?

[Philipp_Thomsen]

I guess you're too scared! I know at least 6 people who have done this already and they have a lot of good stories to tell. :up:

You keep thinking I'm going to be near big cities. For your information I wont be even near SMALL cities. This is a road trip. Im 100% sure that its possible to go from where I live to Canada ON FOOT. But I wont do that, there would be a lot of places in the way that Im not interested on seeing.

Do you mind me asking how old are you? Being "scared" has nothing to do with it Phillip. I've already hitchhiked the US twice from coast to coast so being on the road is no strange thing to me. BTW, I'm 51. I drive a semi about 15,000 miles a month over most of the country so I see a lot of what is going on.

You say you won't even be near small cities. Then how do you expect to traverse California? Entering into a port on the West Coast will limit the number of cities you can enter, San Diego, LA and San Francisco are the most likely. That will put you on the "wrong side" of a major metropolitian area from which you will go... where?

A "road trip" is what to you exactly? Hitchhiking?

I'm glad your friends had good stories to tell. I'm assuming they entered the country legally with all the necessary papers, etc?

I wouldn't be able to answer that for you, coz I don't know. And honestly, I don't care, thats not important. I'll have my papers in order, but I'll do my best to don't need using them. And I'll have my money to survive when things get really ugly, but I'll do my best to survive without it. You said you drove a semi from coast to coast twice, that should have been pretty nice. Did you gave hitchhike to anybody? There were a good number of people asking for hitchhike? Were you afraid of doing it?

A man that I do admire a lot, once told me, not long before he died, "Do, everyday, something that scares you."

I'll do a LOT of planning around this, including a very very hard physical preparation, and possibly I'll go with a friend. I'll plan my way 10 times before doing it and I'll get the maximum information I can. I don't want to be surprised except for the landscape. And don't worry, I'll find a way to stay away from cities. Where there's land for me to step, I'll step. There's no need to follow the routes everybody follows, coz, afterall, if I'd like to follow norms and protocols, I wouldn't be doing this in the first place.

I'm very thankful for any thing you say to me here, its all good information. This trip would not be possible if everybody told me "go for it, its very easy". I want to hear the most of "dont do it" that I can, so I can be mentally prepared for what I'll face. Any other information you find valid, I'd be glad to read.

I'm 24, by the way. :up:

[JSLTIGER]

@ JSLTIGER

I have to take my chances here. What is happiness for you? I just can't accept to be like everyone else. People work to earn money to pay bills, and have children to perpetuate the mankind. In my head this is freaking redundant!

The most important thing is, when you reach the end of the road, you will look back and remember what you have been thru, what you have acomplished, what you have seen, the people you've met, will you be proud of yourself? I don't want to be a stubborn old man sitting on my butt, who have worked behind a desk his whole life and have done nothing but payed his bills and watched television. I rather die 30 years old of starvation in some remote place in the world after seen it all, then to die very old, warm in my bed, after passing by the whole life in blank.

Life is a whisper, you come, tell a story, and disappear. And I want to have a good story to tell.

I can't define what my idea of happiness is for you. I know it when I feel it, as it were. What I will say is that when I look back on my, admittedly short life, I'm already proud of myself.

I've not only met the majority of the goals which I've set for myself, but I've exceeded most of them. I am lucky enough to be learning as a student at one of the most elite universities in the world.

I am only 21 years old, but I've set foot on four of the seven continents (which would have been five had the Strait of Gibraltar not been to rough for the ferry to Morocco) and have seen approximately 17% of the world. I've been to the Temple Mount in Jerusalem, had lunch in a Parisian cafe, and heard the chimes of Big Ben echo over the Thames. I've ridden a cable car in San Francisco, seen the Hollywood Walk of Fame, stood at the top of the World Trade Center, and lived only miles away from the Liberty Bell and Independence Hall. I've seen the homes (or, more accurately shacks) which multiple families share stacked on top of one another in the hills around Caracas, watched water cascade over Niagra Falls and been to the only (remaining) walled city in North America (Quebec, by the way).

Sitting at a desk and working to pay bills may be a part of one's life, but I agree that it doesn't have to be your whole life. However, having a good story to tell does not require taking massive risks and/or breaking the law.

[DeepIron]

...and possibly I'll go with a friend.That, would be a very good idea...
I'll have my papers in order, but I'll do my best to don't need using them.It will be unavoidable if you intend to enter the country legally. If you have all your papers in order, there shouldn't be any problems. But, you should know that Immigration and Customs can prevent you from entering the US regardless...
You said you drove a semi from coast to coast twice, that should have been pretty nice. Did you gave hitchhike to anybody? There were a good number of people asking for hitchhike? Were you afraid of doing it?I've hitchhiked solo across the US twice, I drive a semi about 15,000 miles a month all over the US. We don't pickup hitchhikers for two reasons: the first is because the company I drive for doesn't allow it, the second is due to hijackers. I drive in a team with another guy and there isn't any extra room in the tractor sleeper anyway. We don't see as many hitchhikers because most people won't pick them up anyway...

If you want to avoid cities and towns as much as possible, and you want to see some fantastic country, then I suggest you hike the Pacific Crest Trail. Here's a link to a map: http://www.trailquest.net/PCTmap.html You can Google the other details. The PCT runs from Southern California all the way to the Canadian Border. It's rough, rugged, isolated and beautiful. You hike the PCT Phillip and you'll have stories to tell your friends for years and years. It'll test your endurance and I'm sure will more than fill your need for adventure...:up:

I want to hear the most of "dont do it" that I can, so I can be mentally prepared for what I'll face.Well, there you go. My best advice is travel with a friend, have plenty of $$$ if you need it and just be sure to have a travel visa.

Good luck!

[Philipp_Thomsen]

If you want to avoid cities and towns as much as possible, and you want to see some fantastic country, then I suggest you hike the Pacific Crest Trail. Here's a link to a map: http://www.trailquest.net/PCTmap.html You can Google the other details. The PCT runs from Southern California all the way to the Canadian Border. It's rough, rugged, isolated and beautiful. You hike the PCT Phillip and you'll have stories to tell your friends for years and years. It'll test your endurance and I'm sure will more than fill your need for adventure...:up:



THERE YOU GO!!! THATS EXACTLY WHAT I WANTED, DIRECTIONS!!! :rock:

Any more ideas, just bring it on! I'm dying to see yosemite park, did you went there already?

Looks like you have plenty of story to tell yourself! :up:

[Philipp_Thomsen]

@ JSLTIGER

I have to take my chances here. What is happiness for you? I just can't accept to be like everyone else. People work to earn money to pay bills, and have children to perpetuate the mankind. In my head this is freaking redundant!

The most important thing is, when you reach the end of the road, you will look back and remember what you have been thru, what you have acomplished, what you have seen, the people you've met, will you be proud of yourself? I don't want to be a stubborn old man sitting on my butt, who have worked behind a desk his whole life and have done nothing but payed his bills and watched television. I rather die 30 years old of starvation in some remote place in the world after seen it all, then to die very old, warm in my bed, after passing by the whole life in blank.

Life is a whisper, you come, tell a story, and disappear. And I want to have a good story to tell.

I can't define what my idea of happiness is for you. I know it when I feel it, as it were. What I will say is that when I look back on my, admittedly short life, I'm already proud of myself.

Once you're able to answer that question, you solved 99% of your life! :up:

I've not only met the majority of the goals which I've set for myself, but I've exceeded most of them. I am lucky enough to be learning as a student at one of the most elite universities in the world.

To each his own, my idea of happiness might be the opposite of yours. But doesn't matter, there is more then one way of reaching the goal. The vision of life changes a lot while you grow. When I was 21, my dream was to be very sucesseful, have a lot of cash, a nice car, a nice apartment and have wife and kids. Now, 3 years later, I don't want any cash (proved myself a thousand times that happiness is 100% unrelated to money), I don't want any material whelth, don't want to be stuck living in the same place and absolutely don't want to get married and have children. All the problems in the world that we are facing everyday have the same common cause: excess of people. The next generations will suffer like hell, this planet is collapsing. Our generation is one of the last generations that will live in the planet without too much struggle. The way I see it, theres no point in putting my decendents to live in this planet and suffer a lot in the future. (but Im running away from the subject here)

I am only 21 years old, but I've set foot on four of the seven continents (which would have been five had the Strait of Gibraltar not been to rough for the ferry to Morocco) and have seen approximately 17% of the world. I've been to the Temple Mount in Jerusalem, had lunch in a Parisian cafe, and heard the chimes of Big Ben echo over the Thames. I've ridden a cable car in San Francisco, seen the Hollywood Walk of Fame, stood at the top of the World Trade Center, and lived only miles away from the Liberty Bell and Independence Hall. I've seen the homes (or, more accurately shacks) which multiple families share stacked on top of one another in the hills around Caracas, watched water cascade over Niagra Falls and been to the only (remaining) walled city in North America (Quebec, by the way).

There's all very impressive. You must have a lot of money or you must be a crazy guy like me. Either way, I think that evey single people should take a trip somewhere at anytime, helps to putting your head together, thinking straight, reorganizing ideas.

Sitting at a desk and working to pay bills may be a part of one's life, but I agree that it doesn't have to be your whole life. However, having a good story to tell does not require taking massive risks and/or breaking the law.

The law is there to protect people from doing wrong things to other people and the state. I'm going out there to make the good, to live and let live, to spread the joy, to teach people to love more. I've got a mind full of questions but a teacher in my soul. Sure I'll try to keep myself on the line, playing by the book, just so I don't give trouble to anyone that protects the law, but if I do break the law, will be doing something harmless.

Above in yellow.

[Etienne]

For the record, the visa you will need to enter the US onboard a merchant ship as a crew member (A B1, if I'm not mistaken) is only valid as long as you're attached to a ship. If you sign off, you're allowed to head to the airport and jump on a plane, that's it - You're not allowed to decide to spend a couple day in a hotel before you fly home. If you don't have the visa, you'll simply be deported as soon as the ship ties up.

So make sure you get the right visa, and that the captain will sign you onboad as a passenger. Actually, mind what you sign; a lot of people have ended up with long term contracts when all they wanted was a ride. If that happens, just make a dash for the nearest consulate, they'll help you even if you don't have your passport.

As for the rest, I'll say it's extremely, extremely unlikely. It'd probably be simpler to get your canadian citizenship and then travel to the US, but it's a lenghty process in any case...

ETA: American immigration and customs are, by far, the worst you will encounter in any civilized country. You'd think these guys get paid by the catch... And they're twice as bad when you're getting off a ship. Fingerprinting is sometime involved. And now that I think of it, I wouldn't sail on a boat where they allow passengers to work... Although if it's because you know someone onboard and they're making an exception, yeah, that could fly.

[Trex]

PT - Don't get us wrong. I think everybody wishes you luck. It's just that it might not be quite as simple as it may appear from down there. Do your research, get your paperwork in order, bring lots of cash and have a Plan B.

Good luck.

[seafarer]

I'd also point out that stays of more then 6 months in either Canada or the USA without a non-visitors VISA are more involved to arrange (in Canada, a temporary resident visa is good for 6 months). More then 6 months usually means you'll need to apply for some form of non-resident VISA - an employment visa, student visa, or somethig along those lines. You must apply for your VISA's BEFORE you arrive - in Canada, without one in hand, they won't even let you out of the arrivals area at the port or airport.

For those, you must provide a fixed residential address/contact within the country. Also, the fees for such visa's can get pretty steep.

Check out the respective countries web pages. For Canada,

http://www.canadainternational.gc.ca/brazil/visit/apply_TRV.aspx

For the USA - http://www.uscis.gov/portal/site/uscis (click on the Education and Resources link at the top, then on the VISA Resources link on the left).

P.S. DO NOT tell the customs guys (or gals) at either country that you plan on just "living off the land"!! As you'll note on the pages I linked to, you must show documentation that you have sufficient funds for the duration of your stay (for room, board, and travel - I don't know exactly how they decide how much is enough). So whatever you do, do not blatantly tell them that you are just winging it as you wander around the country - that for sure will get you denied entry. Also, do not tell them you don't know where you are staying - you must provide them with that information to gain entry, so even if camping, know some place names and address to provide them (or use a friend's place, a relatives, a hotel you know, but don't just say you are going to be staying somewhere in the great outdoors).