Insomnia

[Letum]

I have damm awful insomnia.
Given a holiday from work my sleep patterns become wildly erratic through day and
night.

It's not the sort of insomnia produced by stress, gloom or anxiety either.

I just cant turn off my mind.
For example, it is 5:26am in the UK now, I went to bed at roughly 2:40am and have
not slept.
In the time between I have thought about the following:


Posting this forum topic
The project I am working on
The book I am reading and the book I read before that one
My replies to a forum topic
My recent connection problems
Insomnia (oh the irony!)
Skin care (cracked lips this winter)
Chemistry (trying to remember why nitroglycerin is explosive and what the difference between sugars/starches and oil-hydrocarbons is)
The lass I might be entertaining tomorrow *edit* Gah! today!
Sentence structure (I suspect I use commas and clauses incorrectly)That's just tonight, another night it could be any other set of conundrums.

So, now i have a full day tomorrow and a bus to catch early, my mind does not
even remotely feel like turning off, but no doubt it will as soon as I get into town
and I need to stay awake.

I get plenty of exercise, am in good physical health and don't general drink caffeine
in the afternoon or night.
It's not that I'm not relaxed, it's just that when I am relaxed, I think.

Occasionally I meditate (not half as often as I would like, must make more time for
it). And I can empty my thoughts then, but it requires concentration that prohibits
sleep.

Any help guys? Whats the trick?
I envy people who can sleep anywhere, anytime. You chaps are very lucky!


Oh, by the way, don't let me fool you into thinking I am a great thinker. Great thinkers have great
thoughts. I just have lots of thoughts; no great ones. ;)

[mcf1]

You really have a problem.
I just checked http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Insomnia#Treatment_for_Insomnia
it has details about what insomnia is, some treatment ways.

[Torplexed]

Hmmm. I have the opposite problem. I can fall asleep in front of a blaring television with a show on I wanna watch with all the lights on.

Damn annoying to snap awake at 2:00 am just to have to go back to bed.

Don't have an answer. You need to clear your busy mind somehow. My mind is fulla fuzzy cobwebs. That helps. :p

[Letum]

I somewhat get the feeling that most of the treatments are for insomnia caused by
stress, gloom or anxiety. Perhaps I am wrong.
Apart from sleeping pills, but I dont really want to have to rely on them.

Im not sure it's really the sort of thing to see a shrink about, but I assume my GP
would either give me sleeping pills, or if I didn't want that, send me to a shrink anyway.

[Foxtrot]

1. A boring lecture can help you to sleep.
2. A senseless female nagging can definately help you to sleep

[Letum]

1. A boring lecture can help you to sleep.

:rotfl:
A lecture usualy keeps me up for hours thinking about it.

At least my insomnia isn't fatal (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatal_familial_insomnia).

[Torplexed]

Get one of those inflight magazines. Duller than dishwater. They'll put you out like a light. (I saw it work in Red Dwarf). ;)

Or we could hire Al Gore to come over to your place and do a Powerpoint presentation...zzzzzzz.

[Letum]

:rotfl::rotfl:

I think perhaps you under estimate how dull I am. ;)
Or at least how easy I am to engage and entertain.

For me counting sheep is entertainment and food for thought. :D

From the wiki link I have come across this article. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delayed_sleep_phase_disorder)
I think it fits me rather well. Left to my own devices and without duties to perform
I settle into a regular sleep pattern, sleeping between 7am and about 4pm.

I suppose that the closest thing to being naturally "nocturnal".

[Skybird]

Only when lack of sleep causes deficits in your daytime activity and gives you mental handicaps, it is considered to be insomnia, Letum, and maybe is worth to have a look at. I usually shut down the lights at 0230 or 0330, and raise a 0830. It is not insomnia, but a shifted sleep cycle. That can have psychological causes, too, but it must not be like that.

If you can arrange your life accordingly, I see no reason why you should think of it as a problem, practically or physically. The real disease is living to artificial rathms dictated by your clock. Eating when you are not hungry, but it is that and that time. Not being able to have a nap in the early afternoon, which normally most people's organism and physiology would demand, from a ceertain age on at the latest, and espcially if having had a noontime lunch.

Cats and dogs are much brighter than humans, concerning their living styles. :D

around 15% of the wetsern population is known to be so-called "owls", and another 15% are "larks". scientists doing research on sleep say that these people have "normally chnaged" day-and-night rythms, which cannot be chnaged and are not a question of habits, but predisposition.

P.S. Maybe you simply do not have enough work and exercise to become tired in the evening! ;)

[Letum]

I would very much love to live to the dictates of my clock.
My employer less so. ;)

[Skybird]

I would very much love to live to the dictates of my clock.
My employer less so. ;)
As I indicated, mothern life rythms are often unhealthy.

[FIREWALL]

Letum I'm going to read a gazillion posts after I post this but....

Take 1 tylenon pm an you will get rest you need with out the ???

It's safe and mellow.

I never recomend drugs over the counter or otherwise but' when your body's beat but your mind is wide awake. Take 1 not 2 as it says on the bottle will let you snooze safely if you don't have reactions to it,

I feel weird recomending this but I know how it feels when your tired and need the rest and can't sleep.

Wish you the best. :up:

[Letum]

Doesn't look like thats avaliable over the counter in the UK.

I might try diphenhydramine hydrochloride (Benadryl/Dimedrol/Nytol/Unisom) instead,
that is over the counter and I have had a similar drug before so I know what it is like.

S' a shame to need something like that, but perhaps I will be able to figure out a
solution before too long.

[Chock]

Read the Adobe Photoshop manual chapter on color rendering engine selection. That's enough to put anyone to sleep.

More seriously, here's a good one to try: get some background music CDs, i.e new age/ambient type stuff, whale calls whatever, that will probably get you relaxed enough to go, failing that, get hold of a recording of a single tone, that usually works like the drone of an engine at a steady RPM does when it puts you to sleep, like it does on long aeroplane/train journeys and (somewhat dangerously) a car engine note when cruising on a motorway. You could also try altering the temperature in your house, I always find warmer temperature make people drowsy, which is why I knock the heating down a bit in training rooms when I am teaching people!

You are getting sleepy....

:D Chock

[Kapitan_Phillips]

Thats interesting, Letum. Reminds me a little of Sherlock Holmes, actually.

Anyway, I have been experiencing a major shift in my sleep patterns, and I dont think my body knows what to do with all the extra time its gotten. I used to have to get up somedays at 6:30 to be in to work on time, and the days were very busy.

Now my contract is up, I'm unemployed again and obviously have more time for sleep (pain in the ass trying to get work here if you dont drive) and over these couple of days I've been dozing off at 10pm and waking at 4am and I'm unable to get back to sleep. I did it again this morning, I woke at half 3 even after I had a great many beers the previous night :88)

Give it some time, your bio-clock needs to adjust to what you're giving it. I wouldnt think serious medication is the answer just yet, maybe just dunk a sleeping pill When you REALLY cant stop your mind working. Things should fix themselves in time.

[HunterICX]

I had a unhealthy situation of getting into sleep,

worrying about stuff, thinking to much and cant stop with it, getting out of bed to check things like books ''are they in the right place?''

it tired me very much , is was hard to stay awake during the day.
eventually it turned me sick.
then like what chock mention I got myself soft New age and instrumental music
always a piano, dont know why, but it always touched me deeply.
changed my thinking and worrying for dreamy thoughts...
and eventually I fall asleep and wake up the next morning.

dont really need the music or dreamy thoughts anymore but it defintly helped me back in those days

HunterICX

[Skybird]

It's not the sort of insomnia produced by stress, gloom or anxiety either.
---->
I just cant turn off my mind.
---->
It's not that I'm not relaxed, it's just that when I am relaxed, I think.
That's almost classic!

Maybe your ordinary life is such that it does not leave you too much room for yourself, your thoughts, wishes, etc. Work keeps you running, family keeps you busy, you rotate from 8 am to 10 pm. Something like that. It could become an exhausting nevertheless adapted routine. And then the worst case happens: holidays! no more work, nothingthat leeps you spinning! the engine stutters, slowly comes to standstill. Horror! for the firts time since weeks and months you become aware again of yourself, not just beeing aware of your functioning in the job's context. what to do now, all these thoughts! Maybe you know this püerception phenomenon: you are rding by train, and the train enters a staion and comes to a standstill - for some seconds you nevertheless may have the feeling that it is still moving on.

You see where I am pointing. the state or relaxation is what allows you to become aware of your thoughs and wishes, maybe for a first time after a linger period. The unusual sensation of this is what keeps your mind spinning, then. This ohenomenon also is known with older people who leave job activity due to their age. Sometimes they can even become depressive.

I would not recommend to use drugs of any kind as long as your daily routines and actions do not suffer from your "insomnia". You sound as what you experience is pretty much a natural thing. If you do not need sleep, well, then don't try to sleep with determination. that simple! ;)

but if you are tired but still cannot sleep, try paradox internvention: don't try to sleep, but TRY TO STAY AWAKE. One cannot try to sleep, it's almost a guarantee that you will not sleep.

Occasionally I meditate (not half as often as I would like, must make more time for it). And I can empty my thoughts then, but it requires concentration that prohibits sleep.

first: regularity is what counts, choose a timeframe and length wehre you have no exycuse anymore not do practce meditation.
second: talking by own experience, I would say your decreased need for sleep is pretty much normal if you meditate regularly. It is not different for me. Remember, physically, your body does in no way need the mind'S state of being asleep to regenerate: physical rest, not using your muscles, is absolutely enough. It is your brain and mind that depends on sleep to regenerate. But when meditating, your mind also regenerates, just in a different manner than when sleeping (if you find yourself falling off your seat cushion then that difference is no more :D ), and some would even say in a more efficient manner. we know of Yogis who haven't slept for years.

If your brain is running lull, it is less stressed, and if being offered the state of meditating, it needs less regeneration by sleeping and dreaming. It starts pushing the gas pedal with your gears not switched away from neutral. That way you have lots of noise, without going anywhere. The implication is that the way you meditate makes it a meditation that does not carry over in effect to your regular life, but is limited to the timeframe when your meditation is practiced. That is not what it is about...! You mentioned concentration, without going into detail. that sounds like object-related meditation. That is okay, but it needs supplementation by what is called attentive meditation (Achtsamkeits-Meditation, Einsichts-Meditation). You need both. Do you know the theoretical difference between Shamata and Vipassana?

Rethink the drugs. As you describe it, I can't see a need for them.

[TarJak]

Look into my eyes...look into my eyes...you are getting sleepy...
Look into my eyes, not around the eyes, into the eyes. You're under.
http://www.littlerbritain.com/images/gallery/kenny_craig_02.jpg

[STEED]

@Letum

Advice from my mate is this..............

Have wall to wall sex with the wife, that should shag you out.

Worked for him. :roll:

[FIREWALL]

If all the above posts don't work and I would try STEEDS TWICE before giveing up.

Read something boreing like an insurance policy or simular.

And still if none of that works watch Late Nite with ROSIE O'DONNEL :eek:

If that doesn't scare you wide awake nuttin will. Then being awake 2 days will help you maybe sleep.

Hope you can get some rest. Been there and it's not fun. :yep:

[baggygreen]

Given my job in a past life was a dispensary tech and patient counsellor in a pharmacy, can i say *dont* go the route of benadryl et al??

Give something natural a crack first, ie valerian. extremely effective i've found.