Targets everywhere, but who do I sink?

[bookworm_020]

I'm having a problem that all would love to suffer,

I have made contact with a Task force (4 BB's, 4 CA's and a bunch of CL's, DD's and a couple of large Tankers for good measure!:arrgh!:) The problem is I have 8 torpedos:cry: (3 Forward, 5 Aft)

Who do I target?

[Torplexed]

I'd aim for the BBs. They're far rarer prey than tankers, the tonnage is good. Taking on the Yamatos will probably consume your whole salvo tho. The DDs are probably out. Too hard to hit and once the alert is on the rest will be after you.

Congrats on having such a marvelous choice to make.:know:

[Sailor Steve]

Go for the biggest targets. We usually say that we're here to stop commercial shipping, but battleships can't be replaced. Don't miss your chance to save the fathe...er, the USA!:sunny:

[mrbeast]

If you want your name in the papers then go for the BBs.

If you want to be a footnote in the history books go for the CA/CLs

If you want a good working over with DCs and a Purple Heart go for the DDs

If you really want to help the war effort; send Davy Jones a big oil filled present and take down those tankers! :arrgh!:

[bookworm_020]

Is there any weak points on the Yamato that I can aim for? Fuso's go down with two or three torps, but I want to see if I can go for a Yamato double! I'm already thinking what they will say back at Pearl!:arrgh!:

[simonb1612]

IMHO, best to take the targets most likely to result in success. Your efforts will be appreciated even if you do not sink a high profile target like the Yamato.

Then the:arrgh!: in me takes over and says fortune favors the brave so get in there and take out so major targets that would really demoralize the rest of the TF.

(It is a pity that such things are not accounted for in the AI, Flagship sunk = 15% drop in morale & poor performance from all units within visual range)

[Torplexed]

(It is a pity that such things are not accounted for in the AI, Flagship sunk = 15% drop in morale & poor performance from all units within visual range)
That would be cool, but I don't know how you account for something as complicated as morale when it comes to the very aggressive Japanese especially. Some might feel dispirited. Others would burn for revenge. At Midway the Japanese would have been wise to withdraw after the shocking loss of three carriers. Instead they continued with the one and eventually lost the Hiryu, but not before disabling the Yorktown. That's the problem with AIs. Unpredictable human nature is hard to duplicate. :cool:

[simonb1612]

Maybe the AI could role the dice to see whether the sinking demoralized or strengthend resovle. This in itself would be dependant upon which ship was sunk, how many in a TF/ Convoy had beeen hit/sunk, when in the war it was (early war= better for IJN), how many DDs left to defend the rest of the TF/Convoy.

I think all of these things could be accounted for in a way to create more realistic behavviour from ships.

[Torplexed]

Maybe the AI could role the dice to see whether the sinking demoralized or strengthend resovle. This in itself would be dependant upon which ship was sunk, how many in a TF/ Convoy had beeen hit/sunk, when in the war it was (early war= better for IJN), how many DDs left to defend the rest of the TF/Convoy.

I think all of these things could be accounted for in a way to create more realistic behavviour from ships.
I could see that. Kind of a 'beserker' rule in which disaster causes some go wild while others break and run.

[Reaves]

I'd normally say go for the BB's but you don't have the torps plus you need to do a U-turn to shoot your aft fish.


Use 3 bow torps on a Yamato, If she don't sink, save some aft torpedos. As long as you don't get all duds you should at least slow down a BB with 3 side hits. then either go for a heavy cruiser or the tankers. Remember though, tankers can also take a few fish to sink so do fire all your ammo on the first spread.

[simonb1612]

I am sure that such things must have happened in real life, inexperienced crew panic and lose efficiency where as those who have faced battle are more resiliant and less likely to be demoralized

[MorganThePirate]

Go for the tankers. BBs CCs, DDs, ACs.... need oil to move. Sinking two tankers may not help to much but you deprived the enemy of precious resources.:arrgh!:

[Captain Vlad]

While the whole 'war effort helped more by sunk tankers' argument has some merits, the loss of a battleship represents the loss of a huge investment in material, capital, trained crewmen, etc, and I certainly wouldn't pass up the chance to torpedo one.

Given the torpedo loadout, I don't know if I'd go for the Yamato or not. I might, though...since even if I just damaged her, she'd be out of action for a loooong time.

[Torplexed]

Japan had only 12 battleships total in the Pacific War. She had about 80 dedicated tankers and plenty of provisional ones. I'd go for the BBs.:arrgh!: However if it was a choice between CVs and BBs the CVs win hands down.

[mrbeast]

Strategically the tankers are a more important target. As BBs were superceded by CVs they no longer represent a worthwhile investment in time/resources trying to sink them, they can easily be bye-passed. Certainly they are a potent weapon in a surface action, but the CV battles were the ones that had real effect on the war. For example, if USN had sunk 4 BBs at midway it would have been a major loss for the IJN but it would not have won the battle for the US.

Tankers were in short supply and as Japan had no natural oil supplies, the loss of the tanker fleet would fataly cripple the Japanese war effort.

If there was a CV though that would automatically be the priority, damage it at all costs! :arrgh!:

[quitefrankly]

Who do I target?
What difference does it make?

[Takeda Shingen]

Who do I target?
What difference does it make?

It makes a lot of difference. A captain would have to decide what was more valuable: The fuel and materiel that makes the warship go or the warship itself. Standing USN orders were that capital ships, which we have here, take priority over other vessels, but the navy did not stricly enforce this policy, and left execution up to the individual commander at sea. This would seem very simple: That the BB should be the target, but bookworm only has 8 torpedoes left. The Yamato displaces 63k tons. Assuming the high rate of torpedo malfunctions it may or may not be enough to sink her.

Does he gamble and attack the battleship? Does he target a series of tankers? It is a conundrum.


EDIT: I forgot to give my opinon: I voted to take out the big Y. Given the malfunctions, the number of escorts described and the fact that your torpedoes are unevenly split between fore and aft tubes, you will probably not get more that one salvo off before you have to duck and run. Point your stern at her, empty the tubes and get under the thermal.

[quitefrankly]

But in the game, what difference is it? Isn't it only about score, and that is just based on the number of tonnes?

[Takeda Shingen]

But in the game, what difference is it? Isn't it only about score, and that is just based on the number of tonnes?

It all depends on how you want to play the game. If you want to simulate USN submarine operations in the Pacific (simming), then operational authenticity means something to you. If you are concerned about posting a high score, a la Pac Man with subs (gaming), then it does not mean anything to you.

He asked about operations. He may have a different philosophy than you. It's his game, his style of play, and thusly, his question is legitimate.

Now I suggest that we stop hijacking his thread.

[Captain Vlad]

Forgot to mention: I voted for the Yamato as well.

Realistically, I wouldn't like going back to Pearl and having to endure 'You had a chance to torpedo the biggest ship in the world and you didn't take it?' followed by my removal from command.:D

[Powerthighs]

Yamato. The morale-boosting articles in Allied papers and the morale-crushing equivalent in Japan as a result of sinking it would more than make up for any differences in actual strategic impact.

Not to mention the morale on your own boat, a guaranteed Navy Cross or MOH, and going down in history as a legendary skipper.

[quitefrankly]

Ok so its "simulate USN submarine operations" or "high score, a la Pac Man with subs". I just wanted to hear that from someone else.

Now I suggest that we stop hijacking his thread.No worries. I don't intend on flying this thread off to another country. =P

[Snuffy]

I took out a heavy cruiser the other day with a single torp. It was a pure luck shot that I put under the upper front turret ... and I hit the magazine! The whole ship was aflame and sinking rapidly.

[rrmelend]

Without reading your original post I voted for the tankers. Tankers were a huge priority target but as others mentioned, sink the Yamato and you could name the job you wanted.

[Powerthighs]

Ok so its "simulate USN submarine operations" or "high score, a la Pac Man with subs". I just wanted to hear that from someone else.

I feel putting 8 torps into a single Yamato is the correct choice in either case.

[Biggles]

I took down Yamato with 6 contact torpedoes. If I can, then you can mate.

[clayp]

I don't know how you guys do it...I have tried campaigning in 1941 and 1942 and I never find any ships or convoys..All the contact reports I get are long range..I'm doing something wrong..It sure is boring and frustrateing...:cry:

[bookworm_020]

I did a test run (I have the game saved, just as a gain contact with my new SJ radar:D) before I posted this thread. Both times I sank a Fuso and onced damaged a Yamato. I tend to approach from the front and run dwon the coloums so I can do a 90 degree deflection shot fore and aft at close range. IT also buys me time when they do realise that I'm there, as I have time to go deep.

I targeted the Fuso first because it was the closest and I got trigger happy (just couldn't resist taking the shot and waithing for the next target. I will hold on next time and go for the biggest fish.

[STEED]

Target the one's with better odds. :yep:

But as we all know bigger the tonnage better the renown. :roll:

[V.C. Sniper]

Yar, me be huntin destroyers on these ruff seas. :arrgh!:

[Sailor Steve]

While the whole 'war effort helped more by sunk tankers' argument has some merits, the loss of a battleship represents the loss of a huge investment in material, capital, trained crewmen, etc, and I certainly wouldn't pass up the chance to torpedo one.

Given the torpedo loadout, I don't know if I'd go for the Yamato or not. I might, though...since even if I just damaged her, she'd be out of action for a loooong time.
My thought exactly: damaged battleships take months, even years to rebuild. HMS Malaya was hit by one torpedo from U-106, and was laid up in New York for four months, then transferred home for a complete refit.
http://www.uboat.net/allies/warships/ship/4059.html

[Torplexed]

Go for the Yamato. You don't see those every day. Yeah, sinking tankers hurt Japan economically in the real war, but in the game, Japan still surrenders in September 1945 and no sooner no matter how many you sink.

[quitefrankly]

I don't know how you guys do it...I have tried campaigning in 1941 and 1942 and I never find any ships or convoys..All the contact reports I get are long range..I'm doing something wrong..It sure is boring and frustrateing...:cry:I used to have that problem until I saw someones video guide to tracking targets, which made things easier. It also might help to have good people on the observation deck, so when you do finally get into range, someone actually spots them.

[bookworm_020]

I'm going to have a crack at the Yamoto tonight and see if I can make it a double with a Fuso

[bookworm_020]

Guess I better give the follow up. Had a crack at the Yamoto, she was well down by the bow and was slower than normal, but didn't sink!:cry: Hit the Fuso with two torps (third was set for a mag shot on the Yamoto, went too deep to detonate!:damn:) She sank like a stone!:rock:

With one torp left and some angry destroyers after me I crept away and attempted to intercept them again, but failed!:cry:

I pushed on to finish my mission objective, photo recon of a port in the inland sea of Japan. With the help of the radar and foul weather, I was able to stay on the surfeace and make good time. I submerged when I was getting close to the area I needed to photograph. Out of the fog came the shape of a destroyer at anchor! Got into his blind spot and continued on. Another mass loomed out of the fog, A carrier!!!!:o

Moved into a good firing position and let loose the last torp I had, set for a mag kheel shot, just fore of the island structure. BOOM! She hit's! No fire, but she starts to list, and keeps going!:D

Add one Hyiro carrier to the list, not as good as a Yamoto, but better than nothing! I get home safe and sound with 150000 tons to my name, but all I get is a thanks for your effots!:x

Where are the dancing girls, beer, and untold wealth that I was promised!:stare:

Well at least I survive to fight another day!:yep:

[howler93]

I voted for the Yamoto also. I've yet to see one in I don't know how many career patrols :roll: so I'm a bit jealous. From a stategic/historical perspective, I don't think any commander in the navy would bypass the opportunity to attack the Yamoto, ESPECIALLY if you're actually able to get into a favorable attack position. Whatever you decidce, good luck & give 'em hell!

Good Hunting,
Howler :arrgh!:

[DevilThorn]

Nice work bookworm:up:. I wish I would could the pleasure of placing my eyes on such a juicy convoy not to mention the carrier! How much tonnage and/or beer did you get?

[Torplexed]

I voted for the Yamoto also. I've yet to see one in I don't know how many career patrols :roll: so I'm a bit jealous. From a stategic/historical perspective, I don't think any commander in the navy would bypass the opportunity to attack the Yamoto, ESPECIALLY if you're actually able to get into a favorable attack position. Whatever you decidce, good luck & give 'em hell!
What's interesting is that the famous Yamatos having built in great secrecy behind sisal barriers were something of a mystery and engima to USN intelligence through most of the war. Although there were rumours of their existence, their massive dimensions weren't fully appreciated until the first US photographs of them were taken in 1944...

On 4 February 1944, two B-24 reconnaissance aircraft overflew Truk, taking photographs. These were processed by 25 February 1944 and one of them showed a Yamato class ship visible in one corner. ONI photo interpreters at the Photographic Reconnaissance Interpretation Section Intelligence Center (PRISIC) at Pearl Harbor correctly estimated that this ship was armed with 18-inch guns. Ship-design experts called in to consult estimated the ship at a minimum of 60,000 tons and noted that this huge size was necessary in order to mount nine 18-inch guns. However, these experts then proceeded to thoroughly play Devil’s Advocate against their own position, claiming such a design was “impractical.”

The intelligence assessment for these ships as of the time of Yamato’s “Final Sortie” may be judged by the following paragraph taken from Morison’s “History of U.S. Naval Operations in World War II,” Volume XIV:“An eagerly anxious evening followed for TF 54. Staff officers familiar with range tables took care to remind others that Yamato’s 18.1-inch guns should have a maximum range of 45,000 yards, as against 42,000 for the 16-inch gunned battleships in Deyo’s force and 37,000 for [the 14-inch gunned] Tennessee; and that her speed should enable her to make an ‘end run’ and thrust at the transports.”This statement effectively shows that at some point between the October 1944 battles around Leyte Gulf and Yamato’s final sortie in April 1945, the USN had come to a more complete and accurate appreciation of the Yamato’s true size and armament and was actively using that assessment for battle planning.

Of course since the war with all the data available (and a certain notable Japanese anime series) the ships of this class are now quite famous. ;)

[bookworm_020]

UPDATE: I'm haveing a flashback! A couple of patrols later and I've come accross another Task Force:D:D:D

This time I've got all tubes loaded and have a couple of spares to polish any left overs off! Time to go forth and sink some serious tonnage!!!!!:arrgh!::arrgh!::arrgh!:

What a Christmas Present! This and GWX 2.0:D:D:D:D I just now need to win the lottery and I'm set!:ping::ping:

[Mr. Redbird]

Torp the tankers....

[bookworm_020]

YAHOOO!! Got all four battleships!:rock: :rock: Plus a light cruiser as a bonus!:D

5 out six torps brought the Yamoto to a halt. 3 out of 4 torps knocked off an Ise BB, the one that missed took out the light cruiser. Three torps knocked off a Fuso BB, tow more torps and the Yamorto went down. Then the final three torpedos took down the remaining Fuso!:rock: :rock:

To top it off, the escorts didn't even get a wiff of me, let alone a depth charge!

But I didn't even get a medal for it!:/\\!! :/\\!! :/\\!!

[Lognoreng]

Yamato for sure. For the glory and honor!

I had a chance on one of those some time back (first i ever seen). Unfortunately my torps went just a few feet away from an escort, which alerted the TF. Yamato dropped speed and changed course. The closest torp was almost close enough to bounce off her bow. That still haunts me. :damn:.

Now i hunt TF's just for another chance at it!

[simonb1612]

I am amazed that you did not get a medal for all of that tonnage, let alone the psychological impact such an event would have on the war effort for our enemies and allies.

You have the respect of this skipper if nothing else:rock:

[bookworm_020]

Proof if you need it!:yep::arrgh!::arrgh!:

http://img183.imageshack.us/img183/7799/sh4img200712192119sy4.jpg

The light cruiser was an extra, it collected a torp that missed a battleship!:D