jap destroyers sub hunters are pussys

[Seademon]

Jap destroyer sub hunters are pussys compared to the sh3 versions,
They are just to easy to evade , where as the sh3 destroyers would always pick you back up the sh4 versions do not.
who else thinks the same

[Packerton]

The GWX DD AI is better then anything Ubisoft can scrape together.

[Ducimus]

Probably because Japan wasnt as advanced in ASW as the allies. That said, its quite easy to design a jap tin can which can depth charge the snot out of anyone. Slighly beefing up the AI was one of the very first things i did in SH4, and If i really wanted to, i could conjur AI settings that are twice as hard as GWX, that you have absolutley no chance to evade.

[Fat Bhoy Tim]

I'm finding the current Trigger Maru AI more than challenging enough, given how they can detect you in the active cone.

[STEED]

Attack the convoy dive deep and slip away on silent running, piece of cake. :D

[Rockin Robbins]

Changing the subject to real life Japanese destroyers, most of the time they were a bit like the Germans on "Hogan's Heroes." They tended to be perfunctory in their attacks, gave up too quickly, assumed that the sub was destroyed when it was alive and well.

However, there were single groups of destroyers that seem to have been up close to the level of your beloved Limeys. (can you believe we've had some complaints that Trigger Maru destroyers are too viscious?) They've never played SH3/GWX to see what a REAL destroyer is all about.

I have spent time on the US Submarine Vets of World War II website for some years, as my wife's grandfather served aboard the Kraken, SS 370. I have been laboring under the generalization that Japanese destroyers were not even close to the killers British destroyers were. Maybe in some instances I was wrong. Check this out from the sub vets' web site http://www.ussubvetsofworldwarii.org/:

REMEMBER THIS USS TRIGGER?
After attacking a convoy of 20 ships, with 25 escorts, on 23 March 1944, Trigger (Harlfinger) was attacked by six of the escorts for over 17 hours. When she surfaced, Trigger's forward torpedo room was flooded up to the deck plates, her hull air induction was flooded, bow planes, trim pump, and sonar gear and both radars were dead and her radio antennas grounded. After making repairs for the next four days, she rendezvoused with Tang, borrowed air compressor parts, and continued her patrol.

They are asking the crew if they remember this? How could they forget? Now that's equal to any survived pasting of a U-Boat in the Atlantic. I guess we are forced to say that not ALL Japanese destroyers were like those in SH4.

Tell you what though, load up Trigger Maru 1.5, go find Bungo Pete and let us know if his behavior fits your characterization. Hehehehehehehehe! Ducimus has already backed up his words for those who wish greater challenges. I think you qualify!:up: Let us know how you do. Mind you, I'm not attacking your skills. No GWXer is anything but excellent, or he quits GWX.:damn:

I'll grant that you're right about the non-elite destroyer crews in SH4, and that is a reflection of reality in the Pacific. They are still enough of a challenge in less than 200' of water though, where evasion tactics are marginal at best.

[Seademon]

what im talking about is that you can approach a destroyers screen and drop a couple of decoys and dive under the thermal in sh4 then go and attack the convoy or whatever and the jap destroyers will still huddle arround the decoys and not attack you on convoy for a lonnnnnng time, without notice

[DavyJonesFootlocker]

I don't agree. Once there were 2 DDS that stayed and gave me hell. Even under thermal layer and everything that could make a sound turned off they seemed to know where I am.

[TheSatyr]

Try doing it WITHOUT the decoys. US Subs didn't start getting those until the war was almost over,and even then they were very rarely used. Why the devs even put them in the game is something I'll never know

[UnderseaLcpl]

What"s all this "evading" crap? Much easier to just torpedo them. (yes,manual TDC)
You may run out of torps faster but you can just deck gun the merchants to death at long range.

[AVGWarhawk]

Seademon,

Are you using TM or RFB? Stock game the AI are whimpy. As stated above, drop the decoy usage. These were not available until late war.

[AVGWarhawk]

What"s all this "evading" crap? Much easier to just torpedo them. (yes,manual TDC)
You may run out of torps faster but you can just deck gun the merchants to death at long range.

Not sure if you are running a mod but try RFB with the statistically accurate torpedo failure and under runners. You will not sink many DD as they go swooshing under the keel......I certainly have not nailed one using RFB and the modded torpedo realism mod. You get lucky every now and then. But more often then not, you just poke the bee hive.

[Soundman]

BTW, how will one know for sure if you have run into "Bungo Pete" ? Other than him killing you of course:lol: .

[AVGWarhawk]

BTW, how will one know for sure if you have run into "Bungo Pete" ? Other than him killing you of course:lol: .

Bungo is relentless. Once he has you in his sonar it is like a string is tied between your stern and his bow. He just does not go away. Constantly trailing you and making runs until you are dead. Sounds like the Terminator...44 Long slide with laser signting, UZI 9mm, plasma rifle in the 40 watt range....you get the idea....

[Ducimus]

In TM, he is the ONLY Akikaze destroyer, and only exists in ithe bungo suido near Area 7. He looks like a minekaze. So if you see something that looks like a minekaze, and your in the bungo suido area, you'll want to give him a WIDE berth.

[DavyJonesFootlocker]

It seems that Darth Vader left the decoys available in TMO. I had liked the idea of the unavailabilty of them in RFB until late in the war.

[Ducimus]

Your obviously not using TMO 1.5b. :rotfl:

And me as Darth vader? Nah, i dont control an evil Empire. Im more like a Han solo type. :88)

[UnderseaLcpl]

What"s all this "evading" crap? Much easier to just torpedo them. (yes,manual TDC)
You may run out of torps faster but you can just deck gun the merchants to death at long range.

Not sure if you are running a mod but try RFB with the statistically accurate torpedo failure and under runners. You will not sink many DD as they go swooshing under the keel......I certainly have not nailed one using RFB and the modded torpedo realism mod. You get lucky every now and then. But more often then not, you just poke the bee hive.

Sadly I have not installed RFB, although I plan to do so after I finish my first campaign in a day or so here. Are the differences reallly that vast? I mean, my torpedoes sucked in the first year or so of the war, but historically did they not get better?
Well, nonetheless I find evading or destroying 3 DD's or less at periscope depth to be fairly easy until 44 or so when they start throwing DC's off their sides. The first time that happened I had about 10 seconds to wonder what that cylindrical object falling towards me was before a flood of joy overtook me.
Perhaps RFB will make a noob of me again.

[AVGWarhawk]

What"s all this "evading" crap? Much easier to just torpedo them. (yes,manual TDC)
You may run out of torps faster but you can just deck gun the merchants to death at long range.

Not sure if you are running a mod but try RFB with the statistically accurate torpedo failure and under runners. You will not sink many DD as they go swooshing under the keel......I certainly have not nailed one using RFB and the modded torpedo realism mod. You get lucky every now and then. But more often then not, you just poke the bee hive.
Sadly I have not installed RFB, although I plan to do so after I finish my first campaign in a day or so here. Are the differences reallly that vast? I mean, my torpedoes sucked in the first year or so of the war, but historically did they not get better?
Well, nonetheless I find evading or destroying 3 DD's or less at periscope depth to be fairly easy until 44 or so when they start throwing DC's off their sides. The first time that happened I had about 10 seconds to wonder what that cylindrical object falling towards me was before a flood of joy overtook me.
Perhaps RFB will make a noob of me again.

Yes, historically the torps get better and they do in RFB. RFB may not make you a noob again but the torpedo issue in the first two years will frustrate the heck out of you. Perfect solution+imperfect torpedoes=:damn:

[DavyJonesFootlocker]

1.5b? Geez I don't even have the u-boat add-on yet! I think I'm missing out on a lot. So, whaddya guys think? Set up a collection for the old DJFL to get one?

[Char]

Yeah I think they are easy to spoof,even with RFB.

But I've only ecountered a measly 2 Escorts of a convoy and got away easy,thats my experience and I've been playing RFB for a week.

[CaptHawkeye]

Changing the subject to real life Japanese destroyers, most of the time they were a bit like the Germans on "Hogan's Heroes." They tended to be perfunctory in their attacks, gave up too quickly, assumed that the sub was destroyed when it was alive and well.

This was a pretty common problem all over the Japanese military. Pilots often reported American ships sunk when they weren't. Captains reported convoys eradicated when they had escaped. A lot of them seem to suffered from some pervasive belief that the Americans were completely inferior opponents who dropped one after the other against the mighty spirit (Hence, illusion) of Bushido. That's what racial propaganda and programming will do to you.

[Hylander_1314]

I slammed 4 torpedoes into a Jap Fleet Carrier in a huge task force and had 7 destroyers chase me for 14 hours in a big game of cat and mouse.

I guess they really took offence to my sinking the carrier.

[MonTana_Prussian]

I popped 2 Furutaka Cruisers in a TF,and had 4 DDs hound me for 10+ hours. Very uncomfortable,I have to say.

[Captain Vlad]

Torpedoed a large passenger carrier off the coast of Borneo in stormy, shallow seas. I spent the next two real-time hours trying to evade a truly PO'ed destroyer who just would not give up trying to kill me.

I finally got to a deep enough area that I could submerge below a thermal and he still kept hunting for me. After a while, he seemed to go away, but, wary after all this, I moved up to periscope depth and could see him way off on the horizon, motionless, waiting for my butt to surface or make too much noise.

And that was stock 1.3.

[Brag]

Judging by this thread, SH4 has made a lot of progress. Maybe by the time I'm done with the Atlantic (loooong way to go yet) SH4 will be as good as GWX2.1 :cool:

[Soundman]

In TM, he is the ONLY Akikaze destroyer, and only exists in ithe bungo suido near Area 7. He looks like a minekaze. So if you see something that looks like a minekaze, and your in the bungo suido area, you'll want to give him a WIDE berth.

Thanks Duci...That's what I needed to know, as I am running TMO. :) .