View Full Version : 10 Best Games with Real Educational Value?
I was browsing Amazon earlier today and happened upon a custom created list or two for various PC game enthusiasts... most were along the lines of:
Best War Games
Best Games of All Time
Best Platformers
...yawn...
And so the lists went; mostly mindless collections of various Doom-ish FPS drivel.
And then the idea struck me...:hmm:
What might be interesting would be to compile a list of games and simulations that teachers or parents could recommend to their high school students that involved practical examples of teaching subjects and perhaps they could even base some assignments on?
Of course, Silent Hunter 3 & 4 immediately comes to mind for students of math and trig... I was trying to come up with the top 10 games that are fun to play and also have great educational value.
Math & WWII History: SH3 & 4
Business Mgmt: Railroad Tycoon 3 (but not SM Railroads!)
Urban Planning: SimCity 4
Aerodynamics: MS Flight Sim
Can you think of any others (any school subject) to help expand the list to a Top 10? :hmm:
TheBrauerHour
07-16-07, 01:59 PM
First off, WOOT 100th post!!!
Ok, now that I got that out of the way...
I remember a year or two ago a game was released about the 2004 election. You could make a candidate and send him or her through the whole election process I think. I never played it so can't tell you how realistic it was but it may be a worthy mention for a Govt class.
geetrue
07-16-07, 02:06 PM
I think Generals Zero hour is educational ... You have to control your building and your money income at the same time.
Teaches you values in money management.
You have to replace your lost men and equipment or perish. You have to be agressive
or lose the battle if your just hung up on defense.
You have to make decisions in a hurry so it helps in other everyday activities.
Car racing games teach you to control your speed or die.
Football or all sports games are good at developing think ahead skills too.
PC/console games are not just for the sake of exercising your fingers.
They can make or break you in a real life situation. :yep:
Camaero
07-16-07, 02:41 PM
Janes WWII Fighters tought me a hell of a lot and was first thing to open my now large interest in history. I wached videos with interviews from actual aces, I also watched real combat footage and read up on the specs of each plane. So much great info was in that game. It just immersed me so much. Then best of all, I was actually able to fly the planes. It was just so great during my very early teens. Listening to crappy music while I flew was awesome.
I wouldn't even give a damn about sub sims and be here now if it wasn't for that game. :up:
kiwi_2005
07-16-07, 02:56 PM
Biowares Neverwinter nights 1, is used for students to team up and solve quests as a group. I read an article where some schools in the UK tried this game out. Over here primary schools have Age of Empires 2 on school PCs for pupils to play as groups in city building.
Depending on what you do EVE online can teach a fare bit about economics, infact I guess it was in the new-york times or something. :p
Well Myst comes to mind for working the old cerebral juices. I never finished it despite houirs of plodding away. Similar to that is a game called Grim Fandango from 1998 that was a puzzle game but involved some nice story. Damn those puzzels were harsh.
I noticed that geetrue mentioned Generals as a source for education. Generally that holds true for most RTS's but the really interesting ones are the ones that break the mould. Back in the day Total Annihilation was the antithesis of Starcraft. It wasn't just about economy. Instead it had rudimentary economics, like build a metal extractor and leave it and it makes metal, solar collectors, and once you have enough to build you build a diverse balanced attacking force that can deal with the enemy. The economy functioned more like a real one in that you didn't need to babysit the extraction of every crystal or whatever it is but instead you built the extractor and it generated a consistent stream of resources. It demanded scouting to see the enemy's movements, see his army makeup so that you could counter it, it involved land air and sea, it also included rudimentary weapon physics so that mortar like weapons actually fired over hills but had no accuracy and vehicles couldn't see over hills. Missiles fired at aircraft spun and winded, and bombers drops bombs with questionable accuracy and caused lots of splash damage. Really it was a tactically stimulating game. Supreme Commander is the next generation of that though I've not played it myself. I hear its even better though.
In the same vein Homeworld and Homeworld 2 are space RTS's that involve 3 dimensions of space to work in.
Thats all I got for now.
Leisure Suit Larry
As a kid it taught me all about life.
*Gigady gigady
Iron Budokan
07-16-07, 08:56 PM
Oregan Trail was a good game and it had good educational value, too. Orbiter is another good game with EXCELLENT educational value.
Some good suggestions here...
I think the commentary on strategic RTS's in general is probably true for all. However, I'm not sure that resource mgmnt and troop mobilization are enough for an educational recommendation. For instance, the detailed economic model in Pacific Storm might have some value... but just harvesting crystals and sending waves of drones into a blender is perhaps a tad too gamey.
I was thinking possibly one of the Total War titles, but I haven't played any of those myself. ...or maybe some of the strategy games of the civil war era.
I'm also looking for stuff that is currently and readily available... a couple of the suggestions are good (Grim Fandango, Oregon Trail, and Myst) although it would probably be difficult to locate those gems at the local Best Buy.
Jimbuna
07-17-07, 09:20 AM
GWX....teaches you patience and how to create a structured plan :lol:
GWX....teaches you patience and how to create a structured plan :lol:
Yeah, I was half-tempted to suggest that if students could figure out how to successfully mod SH3 to GWX that it might qualify as a decent homework assignment for a computer lab class. :lol:
On the other hand, if they could figure out how to get SH4 to run bug free they would earn an automatic A for the semester... (and then they'd have to show the rest of us how to do it!) :rotfl:
Jimbuna
07-17-07, 10:05 AM
GWX....teaches you patience and how to create a structured plan :lol:
Yeah, I was half-tempted to suggest that if students could figure out how to successfully mod SH3 to GWX that it might qualify as a decent homework assignment for a computer lab class. :lol:
On the other hand, if they could figure out how to get SH4 to run bug free they would earn an automatic A for the semester... (and then they'd have to show the rest of us how to do it!) :rotfl:
A+ me thinks Kaleun ;)
RE: SH3/4... these games might be good for inspiring students to do historical research on their own, but the games themselves, unmodded at least, don't teach too much except that submarines roamed the ocean, blew stuff up, and were blown up. As far as the trig and such, you're assuming that you can captivate the attention of a group of typical 15-18 year olds to play on 100% difficulty long enough to figure out what kind of math to apply and where.
My choice is any non-graphical Zork game. Easy to set up and play, no graphical simulation of violence, and teaches language skills which, IMHO, is what graduating students in my region are lacking the most today.
I became a speed-reader from playing MUDs in high school. Since I stopped, I've lost that ability - it's a shame there are no good ones left :cry:
RE: SH3/4... these games might be good for inspiring students to do historical research on their own, but the games themselves, unmodded at least, don't teach too much except that submarines roamed the ocean, blew stuff up, and were blown up. As far as the trig and such, you're assuming that you can captivate the attention of a group of typical 15-18 year olds to play on 100% difficulty long enough to figure out what kind of math to apply and where.
My choice is any non-graphical Zork game. Easy to set up and play, no graphical simulation of violence, and teaches language skills which, IMHO, is what graduating students in my region are lacking the most today.
I became a speed-reader from playing MUDs in high school. Since I stopped, I've lost that ability - it's a shame there are no good ones left :cry:
So lemme get this straight...
You think it's highly unlikely to get the average (assumed attention deficit) 15-18yr old interested in playing SH on 100% realism and yet somehow you expect they'll be willing to put down Halo for an hour to play Zork?
I'm afraid the era of text-based adventure games has long passed...
However, you do bring up a good point. There may be some adventure games out there that do involve a deep story line and plot that does require some reading comprehension and problem solving skills. Perhaps something like Neverwinter Nights, KoTOR, or Final Fantasy then?
geetrue
07-17-07, 11:36 AM
The best thing about education and games would have to apply to Silent Hunter II, III and IV.
I have found out more about my computer and how it works due those three games.
I have found out how to add more ram memory, up grade my video card, clean my computer, how to defrag constantly, what video settings work and what settings don't work. I have found what page file means. I have added mods and deleated mods to get the game to work.
I have a better working relationship to my computer thanks to submarine sims and to be fair flight sim games like FSX, than any other reason.
So lemme get this straight...
You think it's highly unlikely to get the average (assumed attention deficit) 15-18yr old interested in playing SH on 100% realism and yet somehow you expect they'll be willing to put down Halo for an hour to play Zork?
I'm afraid the era of text-based adventure games has long passed...
However, you do bring up a good point. There may be some adventure games out there that do involve a deep story line and plot that does require some reading comprehension and problem solving skills. Perhaps something like Neverwinter Nights, KoTOR, or Final Fantasy then?
I submitted that thought on the basis of accessability; the students who are most in need of education beyond the base curriculum in the classroom are frequently underprivileged and likely not going to be able to afford a PC that can crunch the latest renditions of Silent Hunter. Text-based games are cheap and quick to develop and could be custom-tailored to seem more 'cool' e.g. change the setting to an urban atmosphere rather than fantasy. Further, they can be run on the decrepit PCs that I have encountered in public school classrooms and libraries.
Silent Hunter is fun, but I don't feel it has taught me any practical skills, as I don't see myself serving in the diesel boats in the near future. Learning to communicate with people beyond your typical urban youth vernacular is a good place to start opening opportunities.
@ Fatty
Well, OK...
I guess I was thinking more along the lines of:
If you have a gamer on your gift shopping list, you can purchase these popular games for them and also feel good about the fact that they are getting something educational benefit out of it.
...or maybe a teacher could put together some lesson plans that coincide with some of these games. If the students should happen to have the games, great! If not, they can still do the lesson.
Your taking a slightly different direction on the subject which is certainly valid but not really the direction that I was headed. Your approach is sorta like "Here's what the kids really need", but not necessarily what they'd actually play. But your opinion is valid, thanks for the input.
I'm looking for mainstream, popular PC and console games that gamers enjoy playing and also may have the added side benefit of educational value. Almost like your covertly inserting some learning into their free game time.
There are definitely math lessons embedded in the stock SH series... in particular, time-speed-distance problems, various trig and graphic plotting examples, intercepts, angles, degrees, relative vs. true, there's really quite a bit in there and much of it would seep through at even the lower realism settings.
An RTS for instance that involves historically accurate maps of Europe might indirectly benefit the geography student?
tycho102
07-17-07, 12:39 PM
What might be interesting would be to compile a list of games and simulations that teachers or parents could recommend to their high school students that involved practical examples of teaching subjects and perhaps they could even base some assignments on?
Heck, there's all kinds of stuff.
Sid Meyer's Pirates. You learn a lot of geography that is still applicable to the modern countries involved.
Panzer General 2. It's fairly simple but contains all the fundamental political issues of that war, coupled with standard logistics and terrain planning for combat.
Railroad Tycoon 2 and 3. There's quite a bit involved with those.
Ages of Empires 2 (skip 3). There's a tremendous amount of history and basic logistics involved with that game.
I learned quite a bit about English geography from all the "Defender of the Crown" games. Many of the counties have been broken down further, but there's quite a few that are still applicable.
Any flight simulator is good. Standard VOR fixes, point to point navigation, emergency drills, basic avionics and aeronautics. People are going to be gliding on air for at least another century.
There certainly more but that's all I can come up with right now.
Obviously if we are ever invaded by aliens, then good skills with a trackball and experience with Missile Command will clearly be a vital contribution to the defence of the planet.
On a more serious note, wargames and simulations can spark interest in people to learn about the real events, so they are always a good choice and generally serve to widen people's knowledge.
As already noted, many MMORPG's and such like, can teach you stuff about economics and supply and demand as well as marketing. Ironically enough, EVE Online, which I played a lot for a while until I found out about the scandal and quit in disgust (their loss, as I had two accounts) showed that sometimes economies do not have a level playing field either! Many people also quit EVE in disgust because of that scandal too, so I guess that was educational, if not intentionally so, and more of a lesson for CCP than the players of the game:rotfl:
Knowledge gained from playing flight sims actually saved my life once while flying a real aircraft too, which was cool.
:D Chock
Camaero
07-17-07, 01:48 PM
Hey, don't think all 15-18 year olds have a low attention span. Even in my early teens I was playing simulations on full realism!! :)
Of course I did like Halo too... :lol:
Tchocky
07-17-07, 01:59 PM
Half-Life taught me not to mess with zombies unless I had my trusty crowbar/shotgun/savegame
Hey, don't think all 15-18 year olds have a low attention span. Even in my early teens I was playing simulations on full realism!! :)
Of course I did like Halo too... :lol:
...and I think that's true of a LOT of high school gamers. We just tend to think they're all absorbed in GTA and Madden tournaments.
In high school I recall all my favorites were MicroProse titles, I also really liked the first edition of Pirates.
Ya know I was thinking of suggesting Gran Turismo for driver ed... but in reality, it's just not that hard to drive a car!
Thniper
07-17-07, 02:27 PM
I'll put in my two cents, too.
Railroad Tycoon 2 & 3:
- business management, logistics
- geography (good for a european to learn all those locations of famous american cities, especially from western movies ;) )
Age of Empires 2:
- a huge amount of history you can learn if you browse through the in-game database
- basic strategy training exercise
Der Patrizier 2:
- again business management, logistics
- small amount of history (Zeit der Hanse)
- european geography, old trade routes and their consequences
Thniper
I'll put in my two cents, too.
Railroad Tycoon 2 & 3:
- business management, logistics
- geography (good for a european to learn all those locations of famous american cities, especially from western movies ;) )
Age of Empires 2:
- a huge amount of history you can learn if you browse through the in-game database
- basic strategy training exercise
Der Patrizier 2:
- again business management, logistics
- small amount of history (Zeit der Hanse)
- european geography, old trade routes and their consequences
Thniper
The RR Tycoon series is the only game I've come across that includes financing, stock/bond issuance, margin calls, hostile buyouts, supply & demand ,debt management... It's really a pretty cool intro to business and economics.
Too bad Sid Meier had to go and redo it in a dumbed down fashion and trash that aspect of the game. I had such high hopes...
Personally, I've never touched any of the "Sims" series...
Would anyone recommend any of the Sims titles for Social Studies or Personal Economics? ...or is there really nothing much of educational quality there?
TteFAboB
07-17-07, 07:33 PM
The only educational value of The Sims is time management. That's what the game is about. You have 24 hours in a day that pass way fast and need to do alot of stuff in these hours: study, work, eat, make/keep friends, keep your character and the objects working (satisfy your "fun" and "social" needs and clean the house and repair broken stuff), sleep, and in the second game have babies baby to keep your family going.
Maybe you could use it to teach what happens when you spend more than you earn, as you receive bills every few days according to the objects you own. So with a cheap job you could still save money and buy the best TV and the best computer but then you wouldn't be able to pay their bills, or once being billed you wouldn't have enough money left over to buy anything else before passing away...:rotfl:
Oh I just remembered another great one. Close Combat! Something about top down low graphics games from the late 90s just kicks ass. That game teaches you so much about tactics and strategy. And the community mods are brilliant. Juno Sword Gold ftw! I just wish I could get a copy of CC:Marines. That one sounds brilliant.
In a slightly related note I suddenly found out a week ago that Infantry Zone is free again! Its a top down online soldier game from like 2000 that I played way back until they made it pay to play in 2002. But its back to free! Whats brilliant is that the game's dynamic forces team work. Even noobs report enemy position.
Check it out. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infantry_(computer_game) (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Infantry_%28computer_game%29)
Most of what I have learnt through games I have learnt because the game inspired me to learn, not because the game taught me.
However, most historical games teach you a lot of academic information. (I can name every radar set used on VIIC uboats in 1939-1945), but this kind of stuff isn't normally going to come in handy.
They also teach specific information/skills. (I know how to make a good convoy attack in a 1940s German submarine) but this kind of stuff isn't normally going to come in handy either.
What they don't often teach is the important stuff:
Key Skills (Math, English)
Culture (It's not like reading shakespeare)
Broad history (you might learn that Hitler used U-boats against America, but you wont learn about how the war started, what impact it had etc, etc.)
Work Related skills/trades (unless you are going to become a submarine captain)
test
Most of what I have learnt through games I have learnt because the game inspired me to learn, not because the game taught me.
Very true.
Most of what I have learnt through games I have learnt because the game inspired me to learn, not because the game taught me.
However, most historical games teach you a lot of academic information. (I can name every radar set used on VIIC uboats in 1939-1945), but this kind of stuff isn't normally going to come in handy.
They also teach specific information/skills. (I know how to make a good convoy attack in a 1940s German submarine) but this kind of stuff isn't normally going to come in handy either.
What they don't often teach is the important stuff:
Key Skills (Math, English)
Culture (It's not like reading shakespeare)
Broad history (you might learn that Hitler used U-boats against America, but you wont learn about how the war started, what impact it had etc, etc.)
Work Related skills/trades (unless you are going to become a submarine captain)
test
Agreed, I definitely see these games as vehicles to spark interest. How many of us would have read Iron Coffins if it weren't for SH3?
In fact, I like that title better... Top 10 Games that Inspire Learning
Thniper
07-18-07, 10:05 AM
The RR Tycoon series is the only game I've come across that includes financing, stock/bond issuance, margin calls, hostile buyouts, supply & demand ,debt management... It's really a pretty cool intro to business and economics.
Too bad Sid Meier had to go and redo it in a dumbed down fashion and trash that aspect of the game. I had such high hopes...
Is there a chance that a Railroad Tycoon 4 will be released?
I do mean a REAL Railroad Tycoon game, not that SM Railroads kind of stuff.
Is there a chance that a Railroad Tycoon 4 will be released?
I do mean a REAL Railroad Tycoon game, not that SM Railroads kind of stuff.
If they don't, somebody else will...
My wishlist for RR Tycoon 4 is:
Take everything you had in RR Tycoon 3 and just add:
1) the track building system from SM Railroads (the only thing they got close to right in that game)
2) the ability for the player to manually control the track switching
3) and if they want, go ahead and let the user crash trains into each other!
...aside from the above, RR Tycoon 3 was nearly the perfect all-round train game!
SM Railroads didn't even have cabooses? What were they thinkin? :nope:
Thniper
07-19-07, 10:10 AM
Is there a chance that a Railroad Tycoon 4 will be released?
I do mean a REAL Railroad Tycoon game, not that SM Railroads kind of stuff.
If they don't, somebody else will...
My wishlist for RR Tycoon 4 is:
Take everything you had in RR Tycoon 3 and just add:
1) the track building system from SM Railroads (the only thing they got close to right in that game)
2) the ability for the player to manually control the track switching
3) and if they want, go ahead and let the user crash trains into each other!
...aside from the above, RR Tycoon 3 was nearly the perfect all-round train game!
SM Railroads didn't even have cabooses? What were they thinkin? :nope:
Yep! You're completely right.
The only thing I don't like about RT 3 is, that the tunneling and bridge-building function doesn't work well.
And, if you successfully placed your tracks sloping up a hill, suddenly a new building popped up near your new track confusing the slope again. :damn:
You don't know jack. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/You_Don't_Know_Jack)
Most of the Sim series (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Sim_games)of games
tycho102
07-23-07, 12:52 PM
Sid Meier's railroad game wasn't bad, it just was a completely different game than Tycoon. SMR was made to be fun -- even the introductory video made this pretty clear.
The one thing I really didn't like about SMR was the interface. It was really clunky to work with because you couldn't zoom out much, you were stuck with a severe isometric view, you couldn't lay double tracks automatically, I had a lot of difficultly being able to judge how much it was going to cost.
It's been awhile since I played it and I didn't play a lot of it because of the interface. It was a pretty game and it ran well, the I was having entirely too much trouble just trying to manage the build interface. Once I got the lines up and working properly, actually managing the train cargo was pretty easy. The cargo interface was smooth and pretty intuitive, and there were a few things I liked about it over the Tycoon series. It's not exactly a "baby simulator" in comparison to the Tycoon series, but I could believe people having an easier time learning to play SMR than Tycoon 3.
Oh, let's see.
Seven Cities of Gold is a pretty decent game for geography and supply managment in the 1500's. There's a lot of balance between exploration and income, and as far as I can remember, the rivers and mountain ranges were pretty darn close to actual conditions.
I mean, technically, Where in the World is Carmen Sandiego stuff. For the very-young crowd these days.
Any game with zombies in it. It's important for children to know what to do in the event of a zombie outbreak.
I kind of feel the Infocom text series have a lot of utility. Learning to map and mark your route, some of the puzzles are *very* logical in nature, and others take some kind of deduction skill to solve. Plus they take quite a bit of expermentation and require abstract thinking due to the text interface. They really do have a lot of merit to them.
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