What do yall think the best type of gov would we.

[Seth8530]

Well here is a conterversial topic. What do yall think the best type of goverment would be ie. Republic. Democracy. Facism. Communism. ANARCHY! Post your thoughts no flaming..

[fatty]

Benevolent dictatorship.

[Seth8530]

An intriging choice...:ping:

[fatty]

An intriging choice...:ping:

You're damn straight. What's yours?

[P_Funk]

You beat me fatty. I was going to say that monarchy or some other form of absolutist government is ideal... when it works. One perfect leader is all you need so long as he does everything right. Problem is when he goes crazy or his son turns out to be Nero the 2nd.

[Camaero]

Benevolent dictatorship.

Amen. No other form of government could be as swift to just action as this. No bickering and arguing so much that nothing gets done, as you have in a democracy. It just is the best possible way to run a country!

Of course the risks are bad, when somebody like Hitler or Stalin comes into power.

[Happy Times]

I will choose Liberal democracy, best results so far in history.


Post your thoughts no flaming..

Good luck with your thread. :lol:

[Camaero]

I will choose Liberal democracy, best results so far in history.


Post your thoughts no flaming..

Good luck with your thread. :lol:

It's so very hard after what you just posted. :rotfl: Just kidding. :D

[Officerpuppy]

Can anarchy even be considered as a goverment type? Sounds like a contradiction. Even with anarchy, isn't it inevitble that people will gather and form some kind of leadership and eventually have small local goverments or eventually lead to some kind of dictatorship?

[Letum]

Democracy is not ideal as it is a form of Ochlocracy. (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ochlocracy)
It is also, like almost all form of government, a form of dictatorship by a system and this can lead to dehumanization.

However I am unaware of a more stable structure for society, so it gets my vote!


Benevolent dictatorship.
Amen. No other form of government could be as swift to just action as this. No bickering and arguing so much that nothing gets done, as you have in a democracy. It just is the best possible way to run a country!

Of course the risks are bad, when somebody like Hitler or Stalin comes into power.

Well, that and the fact that what one person thinks is benevolent may differ from what another person thinks is benevolent. Althow it worked somewhat well in Butan in the past.

[Happy Times]

Can anarchy even be considered as a goverment type? Sounds like a contradiction. Even with anarchy, isn't it inevitble that people will gather and form some kind of leadership and eventually have small local goverments or eventually lead to some kind of dictatorship?

Of course its totally philosofical, in reality it would lead to mass murders.

[P_Funk]

Can anarchy even be considered as a goverment type? Sounds like a contradiction. Even with anarchy, isn't it inevitble that people will gather and form some kind of leadership and eventually have small local goverments or eventually lead to some kind of dictatorship?
Its a common misconception that all forms of anarchy are sononymous with what is called individualist anarchy. Those crazy guys in ski masks blowing up banks and stuff aren't the main of what you'd call a real anarchist. For example Noam Chomsky calls himself an anarchist at heart and he obviously doens't want the downfall of all organized government.

The heart of anarchy is alot like socialism in general. The idea is government from the ground up where you govern yourself locally. Its a total contradiction of world scale economics but it certainly isn't the idea of everyone running around without any laws whatsoever.

To sononymize all Anarchy with Individualist Anarchists is like saying all feminists are the same as Lesbian Feminists (those crazy women that want both sexes to live on seperate islands).

So in theory Anarchy is as viable as any other form of socialism.

[Tchocky]

Anarchy...voluntary order as opposed to the imposed order of a democracy

[Reaves]

Quotes on Democracy.

My favorite:

"The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter."
- Winston Churchill



More:

"Did you, too, O friend, suppose democracy was only for elections, for politics, and for a party name? I say democracy is only of use there that it may pass on and come to its flower and fruit in manners, in the highest forms of interaction between [people], and their beliefs -- in religion, literature, colleges and schools -- democracy in all public and private life."
- Walt Whitman

“Democracy forever teases us with the contrast between its ideals and its realities, between its heroic possibilities and its sorry achievements.”
- Agnes Repplier

"Creative ability and personal responsibility are strongest when the mind is free from supernatural belief and operates in an atmosphere of freedom and democracy."
- Unknown

“Democracy: A government of the masses. Authority derived through mass meeting or any form of ‘direct' expression. Results in mobocracy. Attitude towards laws is that the will of the majority shall regulate, whether it is based upon deliberation or governed by passion, prejudice or impulse, without restraint or regard to consequences. Results in demagogism, license, agitation, discontent, anarchy.”
- 1928 Army training manual

"A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where fifty-one percent of the people may take away the rights of the other forty-nine."
- Thomas Jefferson

"At no time, at no place, in solemn convention assembled, through no chosen agents, had the American people officially proclaimed the United States to be a democracy. The Constitution did not contain the word or any word lending countenance to it, except possibly the mention of ‘We the people,' in the preamble ... When the Constitution was framed, no respectable person called himself a democrat."
- Charles & Mary Beard

"The death of democracy is not likely to be an assassination from ambush. It will be a slow extinction from apathy, indifference, and undernourishment."
- Robert M. Huchins

"Real liberty is neither found in despotism or the extremes of democracy, but in moderate government."
- Alexander Hamilton

"The common people feel themselves oppressed by the grasping of some, and their vanity is flattered by others. Fired with evil passions, they are no longer willing to submit to control, but demand that everything be subject to their authority. The invariable result is that government assumes the noble names of free and popular, but becomes in fact the most execrable thing, mob rule."
- Polybius, 126 B.C.

"The surface of American society is covered with a layer of democratic paint, but from time to time one can see the old aristocratic colours breaking through."
- Alexis de Tocqueville

"Of all tyrannies, a tyranny exercised for the good of its victims may be the most oppressive. It may be better to live under robber barons than under omnipotent moral busybodies. The robber baron's cruelty may sometimes sleep, his cupidity may at some point be satiated; but those who torment us for our own good will torment us without end, for they do so with the approval of their own conscience."
- C.S. Lewis

"The evils we experience flow from the excess of democracy. The people do not want virtue, but are the dupes of pretended patriots."
- Elbridge Gerry

"The two greatest obstacles to democracy in the United States are, first, the widespread delusion among the poor that we have a democracy, and second, the chronic terror among the rich, lest we get it."
- Edward Dowling

"...democracies have ever been spectacles of turbulence and contention; have ever been found incompatible with personal security, or the rights of property; and have in general been as short in their lives as they have been violent in their deaths."
- James Madison

"Democracy is a device that ensures we shall be governed no better than we deserve."
- George Bernard Shaw

"As democracy is perfected, the office represents, more and more closely, the inner soul of the people. We move toward a lofty ideal. On some great and glorious day the plain folks of the land will reach their hearts desire at last, and the White House will be adorned by a downright moron."
- H.L. Mencken

"It has been observed that a pure democracy, if it were practicable, would be the most perfect government. Experience has proved that no position is more false than this. The ancient democracies, in which the people themselves deliberated, never possessed one feature of good government. Their very character was tyranny: their figure deformity."
- Alexander Hamilton

"We are not afraid to entrust the American people with unpleasant facts, foreign ideas, alien philosophies, and competitive values. For a nation that is afraid to let its people judge the truth and falsehood in an open market is a nation that is afraid of its people."
- John F. Kennedy

"A good politician under democracy is quite as unthinkable as an honest burglar."
- H.L. Mencken

"Remember, democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts and murders itself. There never was a democracy yet that did not commit suicide."
- John Adams

"Democracy means simply the bludgeoning of the people by the people for the people."
- Oscar Wilde

"Democracy is the only system that persists in asking the powers that be whether they are the powers that ought to be."
- Sydney J. Harris

"The Bill of Rights—The original contract with America. Accept no substitutes. Beware of imitations. Insist on the genuine Articles."
- Unknown

"In a democracy, the individual enjoys not only the ultimate power but carries the ultimate responsibility."
- Norman Cousins

"Democracy is always a beckoning goal, not a safe harbor. For freedom is an unremitting endeavor, never a final achievement."
- Felix Frankfurter

"The efforts of the government alone will never be enough. In the end the people must choose and the people must help themselves."
- John F. Kennedy

"A generation that acquires knowledge without ever understanding how that knowledge can benefit the community is a generation that is not learning what it means to be citizens in a democracy."
- Elizabeth Hollander

"Democracy is the most demanding of all forms of government in terms of the energy, imagination, and public spirit required of the individual."
- George Marshall

"We are now forming a Republican form of government. Real Liberty is not found in the extremes of democracy, but in moderate governments. If we incline too much to democracy, we shall soon shoot into a monarchy, or some other form of dictatorship."
- Alexander Hamilton

"Between a balanced republic and a democracy, the difference is like that between order and chaos."
- John Marshall, Chief Justice of the Supreme Court

"The adoption of Democracy as a form of Government by all European nations is fatal to good Government, to liberty, to law and order, to respect for authority, and to religion, and must eventually produce a state of chaos from which a new world tyranny will arise."
- Duke of Northumberland, 1931

"Democracy is a form of worship. It is the worship of jackals by jackasses."
- H.L. Mencken

[Camaero]

^^^ Nice post. There are some very good quotes in there.

"The best argument against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter."
- Winston Churchill

That would have to be my favorite too, followed by:

“Democracy forever teases us with the contrast between its ideals and its realities, between its heroic possibilities and its sorry achievements.”
- Agnes Repplier

[Reaves]

“Democracy forever teases us with the contrast between its ideals and its realities, between its heroic possibilities and its sorry achievements.”
- Agnes Repplier


It's good because it is true.

I was orginally looking for a quote that I think Thomas Jefferson said. It was something like

"Democracy is a failed form of government, but it is better than the alternatives."


:know:

[Camaero]

Are you thinking of ol Winston who said something close to: "Democracy is the worst form of government, but it is better than all the others." I know that isn't quoted exactly...

[Reaves]

That's the one. So it was old Winnie then.

[Iceman]

One that rules with wisdom...

Proverbs 8
[1] Doth not wisdom cry? and understanding put forth her voice?
[2] She standeth in the top of high places, by the way in the places of the paths.
[3] She crieth at the gates, at the entry of the city, at the coming in at the doors.
[4] Unto you, O men, I call; and my voice is to the sons of man.
[5] O ye simple, understand wisdom: and, ye fools, be ye of an understanding heart.
[6] Hear; for I will speak of excellent things; and the opening of my lips shall be right things.
[7] For my mouth shall speak truth; and wickedness is an abomination to my lips.
[8] All the words of my mouth are in righteousness; there is nothing froward or perverse in them.
[9] They are all plain to him that understandeth, and right to them that find knowledge.
[10] Receive my instruction, and not silver; and knowledge rather than choice gold.
[11] For wisdom is better than rubies; and all the things that may be desired are not to be compared to it.
[12] I wisdom dwell with prudence, and find out knowledge of witty inventions.
[13] The fear of the LORD is to hate evil: pride, and arrogancy, and the evil way, and the froward mouth, do I hate.
[14] Counsel is mine, and sound wisdom: I am understanding; I have strength.
[15] By me kings reign, and princes decree justice.
[16] By me princes rule, and nobles, even all the judges of the earth.
[17] I love them that love me; and those that seek me early shall find me.
[18] Riches and honour are with me; yea, durable riches and righteousness.
[19] My fruit is better than gold, yea, than fine gold; and my revenue than choice silver.
[20] I lead in the way of righteousness, in the midst of the paths of judgment:
[21] That I may cause those that love me to inherit substance; and I will fill their treasures.
[22] The LORD possessed me in the beginning of his way, before his works of old.
[23] I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was.
[24] When there were no depths, I was brought forth; when there were no fountains abounding with water.
[25] Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth:
[26] While as yet he had not made the earth, nor the fields, nor the highest part of the dust of the world.
[27] When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth:
[28] When he established the clouds above: when he strengthened the fountains of the deep:
[29] When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth:
[30] Then I was by him, as one brought up with him: and I was daily his delight, rejoicing always before him;
[31] Rejoicing in the habitable part of his earth; and my delights were with the sons of men.
[32] Now therefore hearken unto me, O ye children: for blessed are they that keep my ways.
[33] Hear instruction, and be wise, and refuse it not.
[34] Blessed is the man that heareth me, watching daily at my gates, waiting at the posts of my doors.
[35] For whoso findeth me findeth life, and shall obtain favour of the LORD.
[36] But he that sinneth against me wrongeth his own soul: all they that hate me love death.

[Lagger123987]

none

[CCIP]

Well, I guess as a self-confessed socialist this one is kinda obvious for me.

I will take either a pragmatic socialist path (leaning slightly towards libertarian socialism). I would have said liberal democracy not too long ago, but I've been increasingly disappointed with where it's going. I would take it as a temporary solution for now, but I think it'll eat itself eventually thanks to the economic model that sits on top of it. I would also name both enlightened despotism and communism, but those are reliant on an ideal-world scenario which by default can't be relied on, so they're right out.

[TteFAboB]

Genocidal totalitarian. :88)

none

Ditto.

Republic with suffrage limited to the citizens aged 55, not one year more or less.

[The Avon Lady]

Well, I guess as a self-confessed socialist this one is kinda obvious for me.

I will take either a pragmatic socialist path (leaning slightly towards libertarian socialism). I would have said liberal democracy not too long ago, but I've been increasingly disappointed with where it's going. I would take it as a temporary solution for now, but I think it'll eat itself eventually thanks to the economic model that sits on top of it. I would also name both enlightened despotism and communism, but those are reliant on an ideal-world scenario which by default can't be relied on, so they're right out.
"The vice of capitalism is that it stands for the unequal sharing of blessings; whereas the virtue of socialism is that it stands for the equal sharing of misery."
- Winston Churchill

:|\\

[geetrue]

Tribal authority should only come from the chief ... if he needs any extra helping hands he should be able to chose from the strong able bodied men counted as trust worthy among their own kindred.

Everyone's rice bowl must have a little piece of chicken or pork to satisfy the pallet'. All women are to remain topless till after their third child. Please dig a hole and cover up all waste material, so as not to offend the chief when walking among the camp fires.

When the chief dies, two men will be chosen to arrange for the entire tribe to join the chief in his cermonial burial grounds horse drawn cart. Burial to include all wives, children, followers, animals, gold and precious gem stones.

That really happened by the way .... I think it was 500 BC in the land that now resembles Germany or was it Romania?

[CCIP]

"The vice of capitalism is that it stands for the unequal sharing of blessings; whereas the virtue of socialism is that it stands for the equal sharing of misery."
- Winston Churchill

:|\\

Somehow that actually appeals to me? :hmm:

[P_Funk]

"The vice of capitalism is that it stands for the unequal sharing of blessings; whereas the virtue of socialism is that it stands for the equal sharing of misery."
- Winston Churchill

:|\\
Somehow that actually appeals to me? :hmm: I know exaclty what you mean.:o

I'll take the Russian point of view. Life is sh1t and then we die. Every day is an opportunity to experience misery in a differnet way. So why jerk off for the rest of your life hiding from inevitability? :rotfl:

And AL, I don't think that its very fair to supplya quote in place of an actual argument. Which one is that? The appeal to authority? I have to be careful how often I use these fallacy terms. waste gate might actually accuse me of making a similar observation about a recurring theme amongst the same people too frequently.

[cobalt]

capitalism - cap·i·tal·ism

n. Buy the most expensive **** that you can, and then die.

[Konovalov]

Secular democracy based on the Westminster System as is the case at home in Australia. :up:

[Skybird]

Reason. - Without it, none of the above can produce any good that lasts beyond the moment.

[Happy Times]

The Soviet Collapse
Grain and Oil

http://www.aei.org/publications/pubID.25991,filter.all/pub_detail.asp

Big bubble..

[The Avon Lady]

capitalism - cap·i·tal·ism

n. Buy the most expensive **** that you can, and then die.
Did you copy and paste that from Mao's little red book? Available from Amazon.com (http://www.amazon.com/Quotations-Chairman-Mao-Tse-Tung/dp/083512388X/ref=pd_bbs_2/105-2219151-5625247?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1182168571&sr=1-2) and at fine capitalist pig/imperialist dog booksellers everywhere.

[Sailor Steve]

I'll take the Republicanism that America started with:
"The legitimate purpose of government is to prevent that which is injurious."
-Thomas Jefferson

[The Avon Lady]

I'll take the Republicanism that America started with:
"The legitimate purpose of government is to prevent that which is injurious."
-Thomas Jefferson
Which is why my children never ever ever ever run with scissors in their hands. :yep:

So that's what makes us Republicans! :hmm:

[Hitman]

Democracies are perfect as long as 1) They are not too big, 2) All voters are intelligent, responsable, educated and cultivated.

Dictatorships are perfect as long as 1) The dictator is intelligent, responsable, educated and cultivated, 2) He uses his powers in the best benefit of society and avoids corruption of him and his administration.

No democracy or dictatorship I have seen did met the requisites :shifty:

But if one ever meets them, I would like to live there.:yep:

It should be noted anyway that it is easier to get one intelligent, responsable, educated and cultivated person for dictator rather than several thousands or millions for a good democracy :roll:

[Happy Times]

Democracies are perfect as long as 1) They are not too big, 2) All voters are intelligent, responsable, educated and cultivated.

Dictatorships are perfect as long as 1) The dictator is intelligent, responsable, educated and cultivated, 2) He uses his powers in the best benefit of society and avoids corruption of him and his administration.

No democracy or dictatorship I have seen did met the requisites :shifty:

But if one ever meets them, I would like to live there.:yep:

It should be noted anyway that it is easier to get one intelligent, responsable, educated and cultivated person for dictator rather than several thousands or millions for a good democracy :roll:

http://www.worldaudit.org/countries/finland.htm :smug:

[Hitman]

Hey, and it's full of beatiful blondes :D

Now why didn't I think about this before I met my wife and we created our family here? :hmm:

[Happy Times]

Hey, and it's full of beatiful blondes :D

Now why didn't I think about this before I met my wife and we created our family here? :hmm:

Move your family here, the winters are warm these days. :D
But you are right, that its much more easy to organize things when the state is small. Like in the US, small states do better in different surveys than the large ones.