Police refuse to apologise for "Commando Raid"

[Yahoshua]

http://www.hometownannapolis.com/cgi-bin/read/2007/06_08-49/CAN


http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/local/annearundel/bal-md.ar.raid09jun09,0,7257503.story?coll=bal-local-arundel

So what kind of new "government" can we expect if this continues? Fascism? Communism? Capitalist Dictatorship?

This is another stain on the badge that was wholly unnecessary due to one morons' inability to properly check an address before making the raid. And all this for a drug warrant?

*EDIT* Links fixed.

[Letum]

Broken links

[P_Funk]

Canadian tall ship, guests from sister city to arrive in Annapolis (http://www.hometownannapolis.com/cgi-bin/read/2007/06_12-54/CAN)
OMG! Canada's back for revenge for 1812, and we're bringing out tall ships!

[GakunGak]

http://www.hometownannapolis.com/cgi-bin/read/2007/06_08-49/CAN


http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/local/annearundel/bal-md.ar.raid09jun09,0,7257503.story?coll=bal-local-arundel

So what kind of new "government" can we expect if this continues? Fascism? Communism? Capitalist Dictatorship?

This is another stain on the badge that was wholly unnecessary due to one morons' inability to properly check an address before making the raid. And all this for a drug warrant?

*EDIT* Links fixed.
It's not the first time cops/army kicked the wrong door, it's that they are frustrated enough to declare anyone a terrorist who even winks at them...:damn:
As for the gov, it is similar with nazism...:ping:
Martial law, the abuse of the first amedment, dictatorial powers, the destruction of free speech, internet 2 and other BS is just leading to the point where American people are not looked upon as individuals, but as a part of the gov they have.

[The Avon Lady]

The lack of apology is much ado about nothing and the headline is very misleading.

To quote from the first article:
"In this day and age, people have to apologize, but as soon as you apologize, you put yourself in a defensive position legally," Officer Hal Dalton, city police spokesman, said after a media conference.
No one's trying to be intentionally sinister here, unless you count the attorneys who helped create such an atmosphere. :yep:

Lawyer jokes always welcomed! :p

[tenakha]

The lack of apology is much ado about nothing and the headline is very misleading.


To quote from the first article:"In this day and age, people have to apologize, but as soon as you apologize, you put yourself in a defensive position legally," Officer Hal Dalton, city police spokesman, said after a media conference.No one's trying to be intentionally sinister here, unless you count the attorneys who helped create such an atmosphere. :yep:

Lawyer jokes always welcomed! :p

well they broke the wrong door, they are already in a defensive position legally

[The Avon Lady]

The lack of apology is much ado about nothing and the headline is very misleading.

To quote from the first article:"In this day and age, people have to apologize, but as soon as you apologize, you put yourself in a defensive position legally," Officer Hal Dalton, city police spokesman, said after a media conference.No one's trying to be intentionally sinister here, unless you count the attorneys who helped create such an atmosphere. :yep:

Lawyer jokes always welcomed! :p

well they broke the wrong door, they are already in a defensive position legally
Yes but not necessarily to the maximum extent of legal liability.

Mistken identity arrests and actions happen all the time. This is a non-event. What bothers me is that one cannot give the courtesy of a civilized apology because it might affect you in a court of law. That's what's very wrong here. :shifty:

[P_Funk]

The thing that makes me think is that the officer answering the questions said that it might be a typo on the search warrent that led them there.

Well if its a typo then wouldn't that make any search and seizure at the correct address unconstitutional since the address on the warrent isn't for the apartment they were after? I'm just wondering.

As for the atmosphere of civil liability. Lawyers didn't do anything that the courts didn't allow. If the courts had been more prudent is weeding out these pointless suits then nobody would bother suing someone for emotional distress when they bumbped into someone else. I'm not saying I don't think lawyers are a$$holes, I do. Just the courts can clamp down on this stuff but instead they let a precednet be set and now its all gone to sh1t.

[darius359au]

speaking of pointless suits ,or just plain crazy

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,21897411-38198,00.html

news report I saw on this says that the courts are so back logged in Washington that a case filed today will maybe get heard in 2 Years time :o

[The Avon Lady]

speaking of pointless suits ,or just plain crazy

http://www.news.com.au/story/0,23599,21897411-38198,00.html

news report I saw on this says that the courts are so back logged in Washington that a case filed today will maybe get heard in 2 Years time :o
Old news (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=113873).

[Yahoshua]

The lack of apology is much ado about nothing and the headline is very misleading.




To quote from the first article:"In this day and age, people have to apologize, but as soon as you apologize, you put yourself in a defensive position legally," Officer Hal Dalton, city police spokesman, said after a media conference.No one's trying to be intentionally sinister here, unless you count the attorneys who helped create such an atmosphere. :yep:

Lawyer jokes always welcomed! :p

Lets count the ways this op. went wrong:

http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k84/yahoshua/Smilies/RantONRantOFF.gif

-Wrong address: The intended address was across the street (which they raided right after they realized their mistake, the obvious result being that it was empty), so they DID have the right address printed on the warrant but apparently somebody is incapable of reading the proper address.

-Method of arrest: I'm not surprised (sadly) at the ineptitude and incompetence displayed by the leadership in this situation, as it doesn't take alot of manpower to verify intelligence information before making a raid (stakeout anyone?), nor does it take much effort to arrest the individuals (as per the warrant) by arresting them once they arrive at their home or place of work. What was used here was a battering ram and stun grenades on the basis of a drug warrant with faulty or outdated intelligence.

The chief should be sacked and the commander in charge of this debacle should be sacked, mistakes like this get people killed and there are more than enough incidents of this kind of event floating around the internet. Such events like this lead to mistakes like the woman in Atlanta who killed 3 LEOS using a no-knock warrant (and lied to the judge get that warrant) in order to make a drug bust with planted evidence and faulty intelligence.

Our LEOs' are NOT paramiltary forces, and they should not be playing "Commando Cop" on the job. They can play weekend warrior on their own time, out of uniform, and not using any official capacity as a LEO whatsoever.

-Unwarranted abuse of the occupants: The occupants did not resist and were unarmed. The woman was 4 months pregnant and being roughly handled by the LEOs', and her husband got a boot in his nuts. (As for whether the occupants are legal residents or not remains an open question for now). Why the husband deserved a boot in the nuts if he didn't resist smacks of a bully in uniform, hence "Commando Cop".

-No knock warrants for drug charges are an especially dangerous abuse of the no-knock warrant. Surrounding a residence and knocking on the door is more than enough to arrest a person suspected of dealing in drugs and they'll shoot whether there is a no-knock warrant or a knock-warrant issued or not. If someone were to burst into my home and begin assaulting me, I'm already going to be responding with lethal force (it's not as if crooks won't yell "police" to throw you off guard) before I realize my mistake and realize that these men invading my home aren't a bunch of brawling thugs coming after me with the intent to kill me and my family.

-Refusal to apologise: Refusing to apologise for a mistake you've already made is more than damning to your reputation, it completely shatters it. For example, if I accidently bump someone elses vehicle and put a dent in it, I'm going to apologise and pay for the damages I caused (this is how one avoids lawsuits). If I were to cause that same damage and refuse to take responsibility or apologise for it, I'm going to be dragged into court and lose more than I needed to because I felt I was above the law.

Comments such as "What's the big problem we raided the wrong place, we didn't kill anyone...." don't go over well in court and should not be taken as an excuse to make the same mistake again. Thank you Mr. Spokesman, I don't expect to hear any complaints when the same event happens to you when we meant to raid the house next-door. (Sack him). Many police chiefs have forgotten that they are in a position to protect and serve (this is the intent of a police force, but thanks to the PRC ruling on LEO cpacity this is all but destroyed). The police chief is NOT to use his position to grand-stand arrests to convince the legislature that his dept. deserves more money because of an impressive arrest and prosecution record. If you are in a position of authority I expect you not to abuse it.

And borrowing the words of a friend:

"Unfortunately, there are a lot of bullies in law enforcement. It just depends on the attitude of the guys at the top. If they insist on "professional" behavior then that's what they get. If they tolerate groin kickers, then that's what they get.

Sounds like Annapolis needs a new Mayor and Chief. "


In wrapping up my rant I should point out that I'm NOT a cop-hater, I'm a hater of incompetent bureaucracy and people who are inept, careless, and dangerous to the public in their command. I know there are good people in LE who still want to do the right thing, but are caught in the middle or suppressed by the system or are forcibly "retired" from LE.

http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k84/yahoshua/Smilies/2cents.gif

[Heibges]

The lack of apology is much ado about nothing and the headline is very misleading.





To quote from the first article:"In this day and age, people have to apologize, but as soon as you apologize, you put yourself in a defensive position legally," Officer Hal Dalton, city police spokesman, said after a media conference.No one's trying to be intentionally sinister here, unless you count the attorneys who helped create such an atmosphere. :yep:

Lawyer jokes always welcomed! :p

Lets count the ways this op. went wrong:

http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k84/yahoshua/Smilies/RantONRantOFF.gif

-Wrong address: The intended address was across the street (which they raided right after they realized their mistake, the obvious result being that it was empty), so they DID have the right address printed on the warrant but apparently somebody is incapable of reading the proper address.

-Method of arrest: I'm not surprised (sadly) at the ineptitude and incompetence displayed by the leadership in this situation, as it doesn't take alot of manpower to verify intelligence information before making a raid (stakeout anyone?), nor does it take much effort to arrest the individuals (as per the warrant) by arresting them once they arrive at their home or place of work. What was used here was a battering ram and stun grenades on the basis of a drug warrant with faulty or outdated intelligence.

The chief should be sacked and the commander in charge of this debacle should be sacked, mistakes like this get people killed and there are more than enough incidents of this kind of event floating around the internet. Such events like this lead to mistakes like the woman in Atlanta who killed 3 LEOS using a no-knock warrant (and lied to the judge get that warrant) in order to make a drug bust with planted evidence and faulty intelligence.

Our LEOs' are NOT paramiltary forces, and they should not be playing "Commando Cop" on the job. They can play weekend warrior on their own time, out of uniform, and not using any official capacity as a LEO whatsoever.

-Unwarranted abuse of the occupants: The occupants did not resist and were unarmed. The woman was 4 months pregnant and being roughly handled by the LEOs', and her husband got a boot in his nuts. (As for whether the occupants are legal residents or not remains an open question for now). Why the husband deserved a boot in the nuts if he didn't resist smacks of a bully in uniform, hence "Commando Cop".

-No knock warrants for drug charges are an especially dangerous abuse of the no-knock warrant. Surrounding a residence and knocking on the door is more than enough to arrest a person suspected of dealing in drugs and they'll shoot whether there is a no-knock warrant or a knock-warrant issued or not. If someone were to burst into my home and begin assaulting me, I'm already going to be responding with lethal force (it's not as if crooks won't yell "police" to throw you off guard) before I realize my mistake and realize that these men invading my home aren't a bunch of brawling thugs coming after me with the intent to kill me and my family.

-Refusal to apologise: Refusing to apologise for a mistake you've already made is more than damning to your reputation, it completely shatters it. For example, if I accidently bump someone elses vehicle and put a dent in it, I'm going to apologise and pay for the damages I caused (this is how one avoids lawsuits). If I were to cause that same damage and refuse to take responsibility or apologise for it, I'm going to be dragged into court and lose more than I needed to because I felt I was above the law.

Comments such as "What's the big problem we raided the wrong place, we didn't kill anyone...." don't go over well in court and should not be taken as an excuse to make the same mistake again. Thank you Mr. Spokesman, I don't expect to hear any complaints when the same event happens to you when we meant to raid the house next-door. (Sack him). Many police chiefs have forgotten that they are in a position to protect and serve (this is the intent of a police force, but thanks to the PRC ruling on LEO cpacity this is all but destroyed). The police chief is NOT to use his position to grand-stand arrests to convince the legislature that his dept. deserves more money because of an impressive arrest and prosecution record. If you are in a position of authority I expect you not to abuse it.

And borrowing the words of a friend:

"Unfortunately, there are a lot of bullies in law enforcement. It just depends on the attitude of the guys at the top. If they insist on "professional" behavior then that's what they get. If they tolerate groin kickers, then that's what they get.

Sounds like Annapolis needs a new Mayor and Chief. "


In wrapping up my rant I should point out that I'm NOT a cop-hater, I'm a hater of incompetent bureaucracy and people who are inept, careless, and dangerous to the public in their command. I know there are good people in LE who still want to do the right thing, but are caught in the middle or suppressed by the system or are forcibly "retired" from LE.http://i86.photobucket.com/albums/k84/yahoshua/Smilies/2cents.gif

Unfortunately, LE is a rather low profession in America due to its low pay compared to White Collar professions. Even Law and Medical Schools have felt the pinch, as highly qualified college students find it easier/cheaper to become stock brokers.

[Yahoshua]

Unfortunately, LE is a rather low profession in America due to its low pay compared to White Collar professions. Even Law and Medical Schools have felt the pinch, as highly qualified college students find it easier/cheaper to become stock brokers.

I agree, LEOs' and teachers aren't being paid what they're worth, and our lawsuit culture has driven the medical profession, for all intents and purposes, overseas.