Looks like 1.3 might be on the way!

[Hitman]

In the german UBI forum, UBI_Marc posted this yesterday:

Hallo Leute,
Momentan ist es rund um Silent Hunter 4 ein wenig ruhig und wir möchten uns dafür entschuldigen. Das Entwicklerteam hat sich zum ersten Mal seit Beginn der Arbeiten an SH4 einen längeren und verdienten Urlaub gegönnt.

Wir versuchen euch so schnell wie möglich neue Informationen zum Thema Patch und Updates zukommen zu lassen. Ich hoffe dass ich schon in der kommenden Woche Neues berichten kann.



Approximate translation (From german to english, and done by me spaniard:p so please don't blame me if something is not exact)

"Right now it is a bit quiet re SH4, and we want to apologize for that. The Dev Team hads taken for the first time a well earned long holiday since starting the SH4 development.

We will try so quick as possible to provide new information about patches and updates . I hope to be able to to inform about it already in the next week."

[FinnN]

Funny how news always comes from Germany first. You'd expect some delay due to time zones (I assume the English forums are moderated from US) but not the several days it usually is. Good news in any case!

Have fun
Finn

[Skubber]

I sure hope this is a true sign of a forthcoming patch.

The game shows so much promise, but I have to admit I am not playing it right now.

[AVGWarhawk]

Well, hopefully rested and ready to attack the final bugs the developers will be. :up: I have faith they will come through. I only need a few bugs fixed and all will be well in my world.

[DJSatane]

Hopefully they can fix chronometer speed esitimation as described in manual. I am still waiting for that.

[codeseven]

[/quote]We will try so quick as possible to provide new information about patches and updates . I hope to be able to to inform about it already in the next week."[/quote]

Was that patchES and updateS? As in more than one!:D

[bruschi sauro]

IS THE TRUTH? :-? mah.......maybe?

[cunnutazzo]

IS THE TRUTH? :-? mah.......maybe?

aspetta e spera...!! :lol:

[t0maz]

I hope they fix radar at all :ping:

[bruschi sauro]

IS THE TRUTH? :-? mah.......maybe?

aspetta e spera...!! :lol:
guarda che non mi aspetto molto da Ubi,:nope: per ora mi diverto molto con SH3
con GWX 1.03.:up:

[Iron Budokan]

Very welcome news.

[mookiemookie]

Hope they take their time and do it correctly! :yep:

[kakemann]

Good news indeed! There is a considerable list of issues that would be great if they fixed!

Some smaller than others of course, but I think there are some more important issues. :p

[SteamWake]

All he said is that he promised to bring us "news" regarding any further updates.

What that "news" is he probably doesent even know.

It does need at least one more patch that address the "known" issues.

Lets hope the news is positive. :up:

[DragonRR1]

All he said is that he promised to bring us "news" regarding any further updates.

What that "news" is he probably doesent even know.

It does need at least one more patch that address the "known" issues.

Lets hope the news is positive. :up:

Agreed .. the OP is not actual confirmation of a patch.

[AVGWarhawk]

The Dev Team hads taken for the first time a well earned long holiday since starting the SH4 development.

Still a team and not broken up as written here. If the boys were back from vacation and assigned to something else, they then therefore would not be a team anymore. Can they really say a game is complete when the two items that define the submarine like the TDC and chronometer are broken? Now that would be a travesty at best. At the very least, these need to be fixed. Looks to me and reads like a patch is coming.

[Bilge_Rat]

That is good news, although I would have been surprised if they had stopped at 1.2.

[TDK1044]

I don't see a confirmation of a new patch into the OPs original translation. I read into it that the Devs have taken a very well earned vacation, and we all hope that Ubisoft assigns them to at least one more SH4 patch before going on to other projects, but it sure would be nice to read a statement from Ubisoft announcing that work is about to begin on patch 1.3.

[GSpector]

So far, I don't have too many complaints about SH4, so the only thing I would really like to see in the next patch is the addition of the

U.S. NAVY

I never liked the generic Navy with U.S. Flags

[t0maz]

(...)
Can they really say a game is complete when the two items that define the submarine like the TDC and chronometer are broken? Now that would be a travesty at best. At the very least, these need to be fixed. Looks to me and reads like a patch is coming.

Whats problem still with TDC?
Remeber about the radar ;)

[FIREWALL]

Thx for info Hitman :up:

Me inglesh ont su hot ithir :D undet's ull ey kno :doh:

Just kiddin. And thx for new whiz wheel. :up:

[codeseven]

If UBI is so 'gracious' as to allow one more patch, it better be a duezy! What I mean is, the bug list has over 79 broken or missing features, one more patch aint gonna cover them all. With the realistic prospect that 1.03 maybe the 'last' patch (if we even get it), then that list of 79 bugs should be arranged by priority. Things like TDC, Chronometer and Radar gotta take precedence over more 'minor' problems. A last patch is only going to be so big and contain just so many fixes, might as well get the ones fixed that will make the game tollerable enough to hand over to the Mods to finish off.

[mookiemookie]

might as well get the ones fixed that will make the game tollerable enough to hand over to the Mods to finish off.
I find the game to be "tollerable" already. Heck, you may even be surprised to find that I even think it's *gasp!* fun

I'm sure they're aware of the major issues. The obviously read this forum. It'll get there.

[AVGWarhawk]

I find the game tolerable for sure. I really only need one fix....the TDC needs to be dead on. I can live without the chronometer. I'm doing it already and with some success.

Other than that, I really love the game and enjoy it quite a bit.

[mookiemookie]

I find the game tolerable for sure. I really only need one fix....the TDC needs to be dead on. I can live without the chronometer. I'm doing it already and with some success.

Other than that, I really love the game and enjoy it quite a bit.

Seconded. Without a spot on TDC, they might as well send you out with shoddy magnetic pistols on your torpedoes. :up:

I'd say radar and convoy AI are the other "must fix" bugs.

[AVGWarhawk]

I find the game tolerable for sure. I really only need one fix....the TDC needs to be dead on. I can live without the chronometer. I'm doing it already and with some success.

Other than that, I really love the game and enjoy it quite a bit.
Seconded. Without a spot on TDC, they might as well send you out with shoddy magnetic pistols on your torpedoes. :up:

I'd say radar and convoy AI are the other "must fix" bugs.

Yes, you are right mookie....the radar needs fixing. OK, two things and I'm good.

[Lord Axel]

IS THE TRUTH? :-? mah.......maybe?
maybe.... but i hope.... the game is fun (with mods of course),
and if they fix all(?) bugs.... maybe maybe maybe....
;););)

[Jace11]

Convoys stopping when attacked, escort AI and radar are my 3 big gripes.

Also, even though they are on holiday, they are still around the forums...

check this post

http://www.simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2205994&page=1#Post2205994

Nice little tip about the mouse wheel. I had no idea it worked, but it does....

[codeseven]

If UBI is so 'gracious' as to allow one more patch, it better be a duezy! What I mean is, the bug list has over 79 broken or missing features, one more patch aint gonna cover them all. With the realistic prospect that 1.03 maybe the 'last' patch (if we even get it), then that list of 79 bugs should be arranged by priority. Things like TDC, Chronometer and Radar gotta take precedence over more 'minor' problems. A last patch is only going to be so big and contain just so many fixes, might as well get the ones fixed that will make the game tollerable enough to hand over to the Mods to finish off.

Ok, ok, maybe tolerable was a bit harsh. The game is 'playable' I'm just thinking in terms of how finished or complete do we want the game to be after the last patch and official support for the game is terminated. Major bugs that involve manipulation of the game code to fix are absolute 'must be fixed' by the Devs items. Those are the bugs that have to be bumped up in priority. The Mods can handle the rest:up:

[GSpector]

I'll just be happy when I start seeing U.S. Navy items like uniforms with Ranks and Ribbons.

[ReallyDedPoet]

Nice:up:

RDP

[GakunGak]

IS THE TRUTH? :-? mah.......maybe?

aspetta e spera...!! :lol:
guarda che non mi aspetto molto da Ubi,:nope: per ora mi diverto molto con SH3
con GWX 1.03.:up:
Convengo 100%, come SH3 GWX è lontano più superrior di SH4, ed adesso con l'imminente moderno, siamo tutta la serie... :|\\

[USS_shipmaster]

Good news, thanks G-d. We need solution for gameplay bugs or promised but unimplemented features ASAP(100 times mentioned chronometer etc) and we can wait for it ,but It will be just a good tradition from UBI to keep us informed. Leaving big community of Subsim fans in incertaincy is not a good practice at all. I think all we need is respect do our dedication of submarine theme. Dedicated Devs did the best job they could in their schedule and I hope UBI let them finish their job... Best regards to all moders,moderators and subsim fans - we rule! (together! :-))
Best regards VK,
SH kapitan since 1996.

[RICH12ACE]

dont forget the capains cabin! :up: :D and the walk along the outside/top of the sub fix .

[AirborneTD]

Two complaints that I've read about here are no problem for me. I use the main chronometer in the game to calculate speed of targets--off of radar contacts and visually. Radar is the other one. I use the Flavored to Taste mod--Radar works.

I've been playing the game steadily since it came out--even with its early (major) faults. The patch would be nice but its not stopping me from enjoying this sim (thanks to the mod makers).

[Beery]

We will try so quick as possible to provide new information about patches and updates . I hope to be able to to inform about it already in the next week."

Was that patchES and updateS? As in more than one!:D

He said "We will try so quick as possible to provide new information on the subject of patches and updates"

Let's not get too hopeful. It could mean that there are more to come. It could also mean that the new info is that there won't be any more.

[Beery]

I find the game tolerable for sure. I really only need one fix....the TDC needs to be dead on. I can live without the chronometer. I'm doing it already and with some success...

I'm doing it too, but the thing is it shouldn't be broken. There's a button there that's supposed to take a speed reading using the chronometer (by the way, can't we just call it a watch?) and the button doesn't work.

Game buttons should work.

[Beery]

Nice little tip about the mouse wheel. I had no idea it worked, but it does....

I had no idea the mouse wheel was for that. I must have missed that in the manual (LOL).

[Bilge_Rat]

Convoys stopping when attacked, escort AI and radar are my 3 big gripes.

Also, even though they are on holiday, they are still around the forums...

check this post

http://www.simhq.com/forum/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2205994&page=1#Post2205994

Nice little tip about the mouse wheel. I had no idea it worked, but it does....

If you check out Elanaiba's posts on SIMHQ, you can see he is playing Armed Assault during his holidays, a true gamer at heart...:up:

However, I would be happier if he was playing SH4 and thinking of ways to improve it.:rotfl:

[RocketDog]

we all hope that Ubisoft assigns them to at least one more SH4 patch before going on to other projects, but it sure would be nice to read a statement from Ubisoft announcing that work is about to begin on patch 1.3.

Does it work like that? I half suspect that Ubisoft commission a delivered game and, say, up to XYZ man hours of post-release work on patches, all as part of the original deal. Whether the devs deliver it as one great big patch or a series of minor ones is probably left to the devs. I am not sure that Ubisoft would go scrounging around for more mnoney after the game has been delivered - it would be a hostage to fortune in that it would encourage devs to deliver a half-working product and then be rewarded for it by being funded again to sort it out. That sort of thing used to happen in the defence industry in the UK quite a lot...

RD.

[TDK1044]

Hi Rocket Dog,

I guess my real worry is that because the Production Development for SH4 was under budgeted by about 4 months, and because patches are usually part of the Development Budget, it wouldn't surprise me if they cut the patch budget in half giving us two instead of the 4 that SH3 had.

This is all pure speculation, but I'd be very surprised if there was a patch beyond 1.3, and I'm not totally convinced that we'll even get 1.3. I hope I'm wrong.

[bruschi sauro]

The patch 1.03 on the way.? I don't belive.:nope: .The game is big flop!:damn:
THE GAME IS OVER....:dead:

[codeseven]

I agree TDK, if we get another patch, we'd better plan on it being the last one. Thats why even if we get a hint that there will be a 1.3, 'we' better make it a good one by having a 'priority' list of critical (game code changing) bug fixes available, ready to go and submittable to the Devs. At least that way we could be sure of what the final patches content will be and what the state of the game should be when support stops.

[TDK1044]

I agree TDK, if we get another patch, we'd better plan on it being the last one. Thats why even if we get a hint that there will be a 1.3, 'we' better make it a good one by having a 'priority' list of critical (game code changing) bug fixes available, ready to go and submittable to the Devs. At least that way we could be sure of what the final patches content will be and what the state of the game should be when support stops.

I agree 100 percent. We should have a top ten list of critical bugs to fix ready for the Devs. I think DragonRR1 is also thinking down these lines.

[AVGWarhawk]

Agreed also. If they said what do I want fixed because this is the last patch....Radar so it works no matter where the sub is heading and the TDC should be dead on. Other than that, I'm good to go.

PS: If you want to fix more please do:D

[tycho102]

I agree 100 percent. We should have a top ten list of critical bugs to fix ready for the Devs. I think DragonRR1 is also thinking down these lines.
I have two:

1. The radar detection issues, including 90-to-270 heading. The radar needs to be fixed.

2. The message-log bug where it gets too full and slows down the system. When I've been refiting my boat (at midway) for the past 6 months across 5 or 6 different patrol objectives, I get slowdown even if my contact is limited to 350km. If you're going to shut me down after 10 patrols, fine, but by Zeus I'm going to get my money's worth out of every single patrol. If that means coming back after 6 months with 250,000 tons, so be it.

[NefariousKoel]

I would be surprised if there were only one more patch.

I'd guess 2 more, just like SH3.

[Payoff]

Please reverse the Interior Sounds & Diving Motion so they are correct.

[codeseven]

I would be surprised if there were only one more patch.

I'd guess 2 more, just like SH3.

Two more would be awesome, but I think we should treat the next patch as if were the last, unless told otherwise by the Devs (and not UBI!).

[mookiemookie]

I agree 100 percent. We should have a top ten list of critical bugs to fix ready for the Devs. I think DragonRR1 is also thinking down these lines.
I have two:

1. The radar detection issues, including 90-to-270 heading. The radar needs to be fixed.

2. The message-log bug where it gets too full and slows down the system. When I've been refiting my boat (at midway) for the past 6 months across 5 or 6 different patrol objectives, I get slowdown even if my contact is limited to 350km. If you're going to shut me down after 10 patrols, fine, but by Zeus I'm going to get my money's worth out of every single patrol. If that means coming back after 6 months with 250,000 tons, so be it.

Two I'd add to that list are

Convoy and Escort AI - Ships stopping when attacked, DD's who stop and seem very uninterested in finding you.

A working chronometer for calculating ship speed when using manual targeting.

[Beery]

...DD's who stop and seem very uninterested in finding you..

I believe that's a feature. It's either destroyers stopping to use hydrophones or it's a green crew. I think we need some sort of confirmation of this being a bug, because if the devs take out the destroyer's ability to stop and listen that would be a step backwards in terms of AI. In SH3 the destroyers were deadly when one stopped and told the others where your sub was..

My personal big three bugs to fix (in order of importance) are as follows:

1. Chronometer. This simply has to work in order to plot a solution using the in-game tools.

2. Radar. The idea that radar stops working if your sub turns south is beyond ridiculous.

3. Burst pipes water sounds should be fixed. When I get a leak the water sprays soundlessly - another ridiculous bug, and if you miss the visuals the lack of water spray sounds can kill you.

[Soundman]

I'm happy to hear this news. My biggest gripe is definitely the chrono. There are of course more, but I gotta say I'm still enjoying the sim immensely and continue to play it despite it's many flaws. I must add this, and I'm willing to bet many here will agree, and I hope Ubi reads this....IF THERE ARE NO FURTHER PATCHES FIXING SOME OF THE BROKEN ITEMS, THAT THE "POORLY" WRITTEN MANUAL FEATURE, THIS WILL BE THE LAST UBI GAME I OWN! As i said, I do continue to play it, and it has the potential to be outstanding, but I feel that if some of the more important issues are not fixed, Ubi has broken a contract with what they have promised to deliver, even in their own advertisements.

[GakunGak]

There should be at least one from UBI registered here, as there were from SCS....
Probably they're just behind cover and takin' notes....
Whatever the case, 1.3 should be a total bug fixer, and instead of using images in the installer, they could use that space for something to be fixed...
I guess no-one will mind even a 200MB patch, just it needs to be done.
And I think UBI is shadowing the patch work so we could not scream for its release....:hmm:

[Nightmare]

There should be at least one from UBI registered here, as there were from SCS....
Probably they're just behind cover and takin' notes....
Whatever the case, 1.3 should be a total bug fixer, and instead of using images in the installer, they could use that space for something to be fixed...
I guess no-one will mind even a 200MB patch, just it needs to be done.
And I think UBI is shadowing the patch work so we could not scream for its release....:hmm:
There is at least one member of the development team, a programmer if I remember correctly, that is registered here and posts in the forums. I wouldn't be surprised at all if half of the team read these forums frequently.

[GakunGak]

There should be at least one from UBI registered here, as there were from SCS....
Probably they're just behind cover and takin' notes....
Whatever the case, 1.3 should be a total bug fixer, and instead of using images in the installer, they could use that space for something to be fixed...
I guess no-one will mind even a 200MB patch, just it needs to be done.
And I think UBI is shadowing the patch work so we could not scream for its release....:hmm:
There is at least one member of the development team, a programmer if I remember correctly, that is registered here and posts in the forums. I wouldn't be surprised at all if half of the team read these forums frequently.
Then I guess his PM inbox will be flooded...:arrgh!:

[USS_shipmaster]

I totally agree with sir Beery. I have the same gameplay bugs priority list:
1) watch / chrometer has to work as it mentioned in the manual
2) radar has to work from 0 to 360, not only from 270 - 90
3) TDK stadimeter bug and correct data of JN for it

For people who have stability bugs I dare to give an advice :
custom made pc is better working machine than PC with good brand names like Dells, HP. I never experienced CTD with 1 exeption A -button bug made my PC CTD. Same opinion have a lot of guys from UBI sh forum. My system works perfectly:
ASUS p5ld2 3.4 GHz Intel Core Duo 2 G-Ram(2x1G DDR2 PC 4200) and 256 Nvidia EN7300GT (not even 7800)
I believe we can wait month or 2 but we need to know that 1.3 will fix problems mentioned above ( and not only)
VK

[AVGWarhawk]

custom made pc is better working machine than PC with good brand names like Dells, HP.

I own a Emachine. Game is very stable for me. Hours of non-stop play and no CTD. All I have done was added an ATI card and a stick of RAM. Good to go:up:

[NefariousKoel]

My biggest gripe right now is Imperial measurements still aren't fully implemented.

Oh, and radar.

Other than that there's a lot of minor stuff I'd like tweaked but I'm not pushing for all of them.

[USS_shipmaster]

AVGwarhawk "I own a Emachine. Game is very stable for me. "

no rules without exceptions :-). Not all brand names are garbige ( at least some models). but custom made pc if you have the same amout of money ( about $1000) will work better ( my experience). And my statement is just an opinion.

[mookiemookie]

I think we need some sort of confirmation of this being a bug, because if the devs take out the destroyer's ability to stop and listen that would be a step backwards in terms of AI. In SH3 the destroyers were deadly when one stopped and told the others where your sub was..

This is true. When I first saw it happen, I remembered back to the good ol' SH3 days and was like "Oh ****, here it comes..." thinking that one was telling the others where I was, but it didn't work out that way. The other escorts sailed off, and that one was just still sitting there stopped all by his lonesome.

[AVGWarhawk]

AVGwarhawk "I own a Emachine. Game is very stable for me. "

no rules without exceptions :-). Not all brand names are garbige ( at least some models). but custom made pc if you have the same amout of money ( about $1000) will work better ( my experience). And my statement is just an opinion.

All I have owned was Emachines. They laughed many years ago at them. I love them and have no issues. My kids use my old 550 P3 Emachine for games. Custom PC's made just for gaming like most guys do should be rock solid.:yep: I wish I had to the cash to build one myself:oops:

[USS_shipmaster]

modified reply :I totally agree with sir Beery. I have the same gameplay bugs priority list:
1) watch / chrometer has to work as it mentioned in the manual
(its feature simulates watch officer job) and ( thanks to Decimus for FTT 2.4 mode whetre it is implemented) ID target button. I can do it but last days I have deficit of free time and my brain is "overloaded".
2) radar has to work from 0 to 360, not only from 270 - 90
3) TDK stadimeter bug and correct data of JN for it-> (including metric- imperial measurements issues)
best regards VK

[USS_shipmaster]

AVGWARHAWK "Custom PC's made just for gaming like most guys do should be rock solid.:yep: I wish I had to the cash to build one myself:oops:"
I build this system knowing that sh4 is coming. I will not buy a new PC during next 4-5 years. I m not a typical crazy gamer. My previous system was bought in 2002 and last upgrade was in 2005 for Sh3
I just bought 'UFO - ET' its a good staff for 'old' folks like me - turn based tactical strategy ( guys liked to play ufo enemy unknown) Graphic is not so perfect but it is good remake of old game. Another good game (while waiting for next patch of sh4 ) is Medieval2 total war. I have only 3 games on my pc. I do not count sh3 GWX
PS actually sh4 costs me $1050. I think I have a right to demand that game be fully patched with all working features.

[NefariousKoel]

AVGwarhawk "I own a Emachine. Game is very stable for me. "

no rules without exceptions :-). Not all brand names are garbige ( at least some models). but custom made pc if you have the same amout of money ( about $1000) will work better ( my experience). And my statement is just an opinion.

I agree there. When you buy the parts separately, you generally know what quality they are, but to each his own.

[Hartmann]

i don´t see a confirmation about a future patch but could be vey interesting fix the most importat bugs.

Yes, build your own system is a good practice,:yep:

[codeseven]

I agree TDK, if we get another patch, we'd better plan on it being the last one. Thats why even if we get a hint that there will be a 1.3, 'we' better make it a good one by having a 'priority' list of critical (game code changing) bug fixes available, ready to go and submittable to the Devs. At least that way we could be sure of what the final patches content will be and what the state of the game should be when support stops.

I agree 100 percent. We should have a top ten list of critical bugs to fix ready for the Devs. I think DragonRR1 is also thinking down these lines.

I'll have to take a look at DragonRR1's thread first to see if its being planned but, when the time comes shouldn't there be a post stickied, easily found by the Devs, reading something like 'Patch 1.03 Priority Bug Fix Requests'?

[TDK1044]

Yes. That's the plan. :D

[wstaub]

Well My PC Is an Emachines case totally revamped on the inside... New MoBo..New Processor and New Video Card and added RAM, also added new HD and DVD Burner. System was bought orignally in 2002.. Does this still Count as an Emachines?? LOL!:rotfl:

[donut]

I'm happy to hear this news. My biggest gripe is definitely the chrono. There are of course more, but I gotta say I'm still enjoying the Sim immensely and continue to play it despite it's many flaws. I must add this, and I'm willing to bet many here will agree, and I hope UBI. reads this....IF THERE ARE NO FURTHER PATCHES FIXING SOME OF THE BROKEN ITEMS, THAT THE "POORLY" WRITTEN MANUAL FEATURE, THIS WILL BE THE LAST UBI. GAME I OWN! As I said, I do continue to play it, and it has the potential to be outstanding, but I feel that if some of the more important issues are not fixed, UBI. has broken a contract with what they have promised to deliver, even in their own advertisements.
Let UBI. not neglect the RADAR, "SO" necessary late war. SD,& SJ, Many THXS.

[akdavis]

I'm sorry, but torpedos also absolutely must be fixed. As it stands, both contact and magnetic torpedos will detonate below or before reaching the hull.

[DragonRR1]

I agree TDK, if we get another patch, we'd better plan on it being the last one. Thats why even if we get a hint that there will be a 1.3, 'we' better make it a good one by having a 'priority' list of critical (game code changing) bug fixes available, ready to go and submittable to the Devs. At least that way we could be sure of what the final patches content will be and what the state of the game should be when support stops.
I agree 100 percent. We should have a top ten list of critical bugs to fix ready for the Devs. I think DragonRR1 is also thinking down these lines.
I couldn't agree more. IMO the chance of UBI allowing the devs to fix 80+ issues is near zero. We should act like any patch post 1.2 will be the last.

Since I started the bug list I maintain (latest here) http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=529992&postcount=466 I've submitted each version to UBI. A senior dev has recently acknowledged it as the official community list. Unfortunately I've had no feedback as to what, if anything, will be fixed.

Based on the assumption that the list is to large and almost certainly won't be fixed in one patch we need to get the list ordered and IMO the top priorities are issues which cannot be modded or worked around. For example:

1. Issue 8) the chronometer cannot be fixed at all by modders and even though I'm not currently hardcore enough to use it I would still put it in a "top ten".

2. Issue 23) The Convoy/Task Force/Destroyer AI can be improved by mods but not fixed ref: Kakemann. Surfacing in the middle of a task force without being fired upon is an immersion breaker for me (it doesn't always happen tho.). So I would put AI in the top ten.

3. Issue 36) Torpedo detonation problems - hardcoded? I don't know of any workaround for the problem.

4. Issue 73) Some ships are unable to fire - hardcoded or can this be modded?

I haven't tried them but I believe there are workarounds or fixes for the 90-270 issue and the torpedo tracking issue so I wouldn't put those in the top ten unless the general consensus is that the issue(s) are unfixable by modders.

Issues such as transparent crew (31) and Widescreen problems (27) would not be in my "top ten" list because they are not exactly game breaking.

In conclusion we need as much feedback from users and modders as possible and gradually work the list into a set of priorities. I tend to agree with codeseven - stickying a 1.3 priority thread, but I would also remove the sticky on patch 1.2 discussion since that thread is pretty much dead and confuses the issue.

Dragon

[joea]

I'm sorry, but torpedos also absolutely must be fixed. As it stands, both contact and magnetic torpedos will detonate below or before reaching the hull.

Didn't they do that in RL during the war before they were really fixed?

[CaptainCox]

Sure did!
http://www.geocities.com/Pentagon/1592/ustorp2.htm

Long thread about this stuff in the SH4 Mod forum.
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=113031&highlight=torpedo

[akdavis]

I'm sorry, but torpedos also absolutely must be fixed. As it stands, both contact and magnetic torpedos will detonate below or before reaching the hull.

Didn't they do that in RL during the war before they were really fixed?

Read that again. Both contact and magnetic torpedos detonate without coming into contact with the hull. You can set a torpedo to contact and set it to run beneath the target's hull and it will still detonate as it moves under the near side of the hull, even though it is running on a course about 5 feet below the hull. Since both contact and magnetic behave the same way, there is really no way to tell to what degree the magnetic detonator is failing, although I will note I have never seen a magnetic torpedo detonate more than 5 feet or so below the hull. In real life, the magnetic exploder was not reliable, but it did not invariably fail.

Also, the magnetic exploder was never "fixed" and ended up being disabled for the balance of the war.

[Beery]

2. Issue 23) The Convoy/Task Force/Destroyer AI can be improved by mods but not fixed ref: Kakemann. Surfacing in the middle of a task force without being fired upon is an immersion breaker for me (it doesn't always happen tho.). So I would put AI in the top ten.

3. Issue 36) Torpedo detonation problems - hardcoded? I don't know of any workaround for the problem.

The thing is, I'm still not convinced that either of these are bugs. They look like features to me. Torpedoes definitely had major problems during the war, and not just magnetic issues either. Torpedoes ran too low so NEITHER the magnetic exploder nor the impact exploder would work.

Then there's the AI - people seem to be complaining about things that we asked to be added as features in SH3 - surfacing in the middle of a convoy was a tactic because often the ships around you wouldn't notice the extra ship and DDs couldn't see you from where they were outside the convoy. We SHOULD be able to surface in a convoy and remain unseen - even during daylight. The fact that we couldn't do so in SH3 was a flaw. The fact that we can in SH4 is not a flaw - it's a feature.

[DirtyHarry3033]

Then there's the AI - people seem to be complaining about things that we asked to be added as features in SH3 - surfacing in the middle of a convoy was a tactic because often the ships around you wouldn't notice the extra ship and DDs couldn't see you from where they were outside the convoy. We SHOULD be able to surface in a convoy and remain unseen - even during daylight. The fact that we couldn't do so in SH3 was a flaw. The fact that we can in SH4 is not a flaw - it's a feature.
How about surfacing outside the convoy, between the DD's and a crippled freighter? I did that this afternoon, time was about 23:00. Weather clear, winds 4m/sec, stars but no moon.

Freighter was at relative bearing of 182 w/fires on the stern, range 600yds, two DD's (at dead stop btw) bearing 355, range 400 yds.

Just for a laugh, I surfaced. Sat there on the surface several minutes in plain sight of both DD's and neither did anything except blink morse at each other. I was between them and a burning freighter, clearly silhouetted and close enough for them to "reach out and touch". Surely they should have seen me?

Should have sailed past 'em to see if they'd notice, but instead put a round of HE into the freighter's waterline and immediately checked the DD's - that woke 'em up, they both went to 12kts steaming across my bow. Crash-dived to 245 feet and they spent the next hour looking for me and dropping DC's not even close!

Now they've moved off with the rest of the convoy and soon I'll surface and finish off the freighter :arrgh!:

Not all are like that, some are so good it's scary (if not fatal ;) ) But most in my experience seem 99% brain-dead.

[Beery]

Freighter was at relative bearing of 182 w/fires on the stern, range 600yds, two DD's (at dead stop btw) bearing 355, range 400 yds.

Just for a laugh, I surfaced. Sat there on the surface several minutes in plain sight of both DD's and neither did anything except blink morse at each other. I was between them and a burning freighter, clearly silhouetted and close enough for them to "reach out and touch". Surely they should have seen me?

Clearly silhouetted, or camouflaged by the glare? It's dark - subs are very difficult to see in the dark - there are reports of them surfacing in a convoy 200 yards from the nearest ship and no one notices. A sub is really small and a freighter is really big, and some of the game's destroyers have awful watch crews - this is a feature, not a bug.

Should have sailed past 'em to see if they'd notice, but instead put a round of HE into the freighter's waterline and immediately checked the DD's - that woke 'em up, they both went to 12kts steaming across my bow. Crash-dived to 245 feet and they spent the next hour looking for me and dropping DC's not even close!

Brain-dead escorts were the rule in WW2 and they should be in a simulation too. Far from finding escorts too easy I'm finding them jolly deadly. They kill my sub with astonishing (and unrealistic) regularity. Basically, if we're getting killed more than once in every fifty patrols the destroyers are too deadly. Poor AI in 90% of the escorts is almost certainly a feature, not a bug.

It would be awful if we lost the ability to surface in a convoy simply because players think that AI should always be challenging. AI in a sim needs to reflect human abilities, and missing a sub at night even when you'd think it should be visible is all too human.

[Jonin]

I hope they keep going and don't abandon the game like they did SH3. If they do this for SH4, I don't think I'll buy the next one. The game has alot of potential... I hope they do it justice.

[AVGWarhawk]

Brain-dead escorts were the rule in WW2 and they should be in a simulation too. Far from finding escorts too easy I'm finding them jolly deadly. They kill my sub with astonishing (and unrealistic) regularity. Basically, if we're getting killed more than once in every fifty patrols the destroyers are too deadly. Poor AI in 90% of the escorts is almost certainly a feature, not a bug.


I see the standard game AI as a feature also. Some are just sleepy and do not care, others rip you a new one. You never know what your going to get. So, last convoy I sunk em all. Gee, I do the same here on this new convoy, oh oh, three DD are on me like flies on manure:o . Sunk....:damn:

I just want my TDC dead on and my radar working 360 degrees! Not asking for much am I?;)

[tater]

There are a couple AI problems I have. One, thet AI should have a "zig zag" mode. Not the constant helming they do once you'd hit one, but real zig-zags. We need a new waypoint property that has a spot for degrees off base course (0 would be no zig-zag), a +- field to add to that, and a time interval in minutes.

So you set waypoint 3 to zig-zag 30 degrees off base, +-5, 15 minutes. The convoy will change off base course 25-35 degrees (30+-5) every 15 minutes until it gets to waypoint 4.

The second AI factor that needs looking at is TF/convoy reaction to contacts. The escorts stopping to listen makes sense, but the whole group stopping to present ideal targets while one ship sinks is absurd. The AI at the very least needs to pick from a few options once they are under attack:

1. Stop/go slowly like they do right now.

2. Scatter at high speed for XXX minutes, rally at (proceed to) next waypoint.

3. Leave along base course (with zig-zags or constant helming) at best speed for XXX minutes.

The escorts should act in addition to the above choices so that some escorts might stay to prosecute the sub while others leave.

[DragonRR1]

@Beery.

issue 23)

I can certainly see your point BUT if this is a feature then there is still the problem that certain ships simply cannot fire issue 73) and for example..


I surfaced near the middle of a task force near to the Yamoto after sending the last six of my torps at her and two other battleships. There were at least two other battleships, 2 carriers, destroyers and merchants, I guess there must have been over 15 ships altogether. I followed them and shot (deck gun) at the Yamoto without any return fire at all. Only one ship, a carrier, had a quick go. I noted that the guns on many ships turned from time to time but nothing other than that. The enitire task force jinked giving me the impression that the AI knew I was there. I used all of my deck gun ammo on various ships sinking a couple but not the Yamoto. After the ammo ran out I just wandered around the group and eventually sailed off all on the surface.

(I posted the above some time ago here: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=112904)

In essense.. Yes I accept that the ability to surface in the middle of a convoy or a task force shouldn't automatically mean that you are destoyed immediately.However it looks to me like if this is a feature it is currently broken.

In addition Kakemann, who has provided a destroyer AI mod, suggests that although he can provide a workaround it is limited and the real issue is hardcoded.

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=113232

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=517755#post517755 (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?p=517755#post517755)

EDIT: I should point out that the task force issue was mid day in moderate but not dead calm seas.

Dragon

[codeseven]

[/quote] I couldn't agree more. IMO the chance of UBI allowing the devs to fix 80+ issues is near zero. We should act like any patch post 1.2 will be the last.

Based (http://Based) on the assumption that the list is to large and almost certainly won't be fixed in one patch we need to get the list ordered and IMO the TOP PRIORITIES ARE ISSUES WHICH CANNOT BE MODDED OR WORKED AROUND. For example:

1. Issue 8) the chronometer cannot be fixed at all by modders I would put it in a "top ten".

2. Issue 23) can be improved by mods but not fixed So I would put AI in the top ten.

3. Issue 36) hardcoded? I don't know of any workaround for the problem.

4. Issue 73) hardcoded or can this be modded?

In conclusion we need as much feedback from users and modders as possible and gradually work the list into a set of priorities. I would also remove the sticky on patch 1.2 discussion since that thread is pretty much dead and confuses the issue. Dragon[/quote]

Absolutly! And thanks Dragon for taking this on. Your right, that list of 80! problems is absolutly overwhelming and though letigitimate and complete, is too much to realistically expect to get fixed in a final patch (ya, I know, who says theres only going to be one more patch? I still think were better off treating 1.3 as the last and final patch, anymore after that as bonuses!).

A 'Priority List' is mandatory in my opinion and relieves the Devs the task of figuring out which of the 80 problems we 'most' want fixed before support ends. Again, as you pointed out, if it cannot be modded or worked around it has to be on the Priority List.

[Harry Buttle]

Absolutly! And thanks Dragon for taking this on. Your right, that list of 80! problems is absolutly overwhelming and though letigitimate and complete, is too much to realistically expect to get fixed in a final patch (ya, I know, who says theres only going to be one more patch? I still think were better off treating 1.3 as the last and final patch, anymore after that as bonuses!).

A 'Priority List' is mandatory in my opinion and relieves the Devs the task of figuring out which of the 80 problems we 'most' want fixed before support ends. Again, as you pointed out, if it cannot be modded or worked around it has to be on the Priority List.

Fine, and once they have decided what percentage of those glaring errors will be fixed will they also be deciding what percentage of their wages they will return to Ubisoft? who would no doubt then decide which percentage of the money we paid for the product will be returned to us?

I see no reason why we should be prepared to accept a product that is only 50% fixed, it comes down to integrity - they shoved it out the door early to get the cash (a dubious ethical position at best), now they need to spend some of that cash to fix it.

Why would I even consider SH V if SH IV is left by Ubi as a dud?

[AVGWarhawk]

Absolutly! And thanks Dragon for taking this on. Your right, that list of 80! problems is absolutly overwhelming and though letigitimate and complete, is too much to realistically expect to get fixed in a final patch (ya, I know, who says theres only going to be one more patch? I still think were better off treating 1.3 as the last and final patch, anymore after that as bonuses!).

A 'Priority List' is mandatory in my opinion and relieves the Devs the task of figuring out which of the 80 problems we 'most' want fixed before support ends. Again, as you pointed out, if it cannot be modded or worked around it has to be on the Priority List.

Fine, and once they have decided what percentage of those glaring errors will be fixed will they also be deciding what percentage of their wages they will return to Ubisoft? who would no doubt then decide which percentage of the money we paid for the product will be returned to us?

I see no reason why we should be prepared to accept a product that is only 50% fixed, it comes down to integrity - they shoved it out the door early to get the cash (a dubious ethical position at best), now they need to spend some of that cash to fix it.

Why would I even consider SH V if SH IV is left by Ubi as a dud?

I find two glaring issue with this game:

1. TDC needs to be dead on.
2. Radar losing contacts when heading in certain directions.

These are the tools of the trade.

No one is preparing to take a product that is 50% fixed. IMHO the game is 90% to complete. What list in question that you responded to concerns the most important fixes we would like to see on the next patch.

[MemoryLeaK]

50% vs 90%. Opinions don't matter. Facts and reality are what count. I have read most of the posts since this game came out. The company did something very unethical and I can't beleive there are so manyh forum members defending them. If this game was beta tested and they still released it then they knowingly commited fraud. The repair list is as long as my arm. If you bought a radio that advertised as being AM/FM capable, and it only had AM capabilities and the company deliberately lied to you would you thank them? Would you be grateful that they at least made a radio available to you? I wouldn't have that attitude. I'd feel that they deliberatley cheated me. I know I don't have posts on this forum so that makes me subhuman but I've been around for years. I love submarine sims and most war games. That is why I take this personally. I usually post at MATRIXGAMES.COM, same moniker. UBI should be taken to task for their cavalier and dishonest attitude they have exhibited with their dubious business practices.
Thanks

[SteamWake]

If this game was beta tested and they still released it then they knowingly commited fraud.

Please god no not again... :shifty:

[Ducimus]

If this game was beta tested and they still released it then they knowingly commited fraud.

Please god no not again... :shifty:

No ****ing ****, here we go again :roll:

[GakunGak]

If this game was beta tested and they still released it then they knowingly commited fraud.

Please god no not again... :shifty:

No ****ing ****, here we go again :roll:
This is like one to many....:rotfl:

[mookiemookie]

In other BREAKING and NEW news, water is still wet and the sky is still blue.

Go ahead and start your lawsuit or whatever. I will find it entertaining to see you laughed out of every lawyer's office and court in the land. :lol:

[GakunGak]

Maybe we will be the one laughed at when he gets his part on CNN...:hmm:

[-Pv-]

"If this game was beta tested and they still released it"

There is no where you can go to have a cival discussion without the moaners.
Sell the game on ebay, cut your losses and stop playing it. ANYTHING. I don't want to hear any more.

If the radio company fixed the FM dial then I wouldn't be so upset.

I'm glad I don't visit MATRIX and have to suffer this twice.
-Pv-

[GakunGak]

"If this game was beta tested and they still released it"

There is no where you can go to have a cival discussion without the moaners.
Sell the game on ebay, cut your losses and stop playing it. ANYTHING. I don't want to hear any more.

If the radio company fixed the FM dial then I wouldn't be so upset.

I'm glad I don't visit MATRIX and have to suffer this twice.
-Pv-
Where do I sign?:arrgh!:

[Ducimus]

This thread is now offically roadkill.

[TDK1044]

The original point of the post has been thoroughly discussed and debated. This is now degenerating into the kind of nonsense that we see in other forums. Closing thread.