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Genghis Khan
04-25-07, 05:32 AM
Hello everybody there,

Just posting my impressions on the very first really successfull attack on a Large Convoy Group,I commenced yesterday.

When I started playing Silent Hunter III,I was a bit afraid and tried to avoid pursuing and attacking those heavily guarded convoys,satisfying with numerous attacks on lonely ships and small convoys.

I was very sad yesterday,when I returned to Kiel ashamed,with only two not significant kills.8900 tonns tonnage during over the month of duty.:cry:

During that unsuccessfull patrol,I was actually trying to intercept two large convoy groups.But,I must admit,I was really too much carefull,trying to shorten distances and get on intercept courses in underwater position.Originally,this is my personal observation,when you do try pursuing a convoy underwater,your actual speed is 8 knots,convoy's speed itself if around 7 knots,and you must extremely precisely calculate your actual courses to shorten a distance just a bit.Very,very difficult.Moreover,if you do turn your engines on full power,it's very likely,that
destroyers will detect you and start approaching towards.Then,you turn on "Full Silent",speed drops to 3 knots and convoy starts moving away.I've seen that some convoys are guarded very smartly,I mean one destroyer far ahead,two destroyers far right and left - so all submarine approach routes are covered (That's the thing I actually appreciate - it does add lots of realism.Yesterday,I was looking through a book about PQ-17 tragedy,written by retiree British Navy Admiral,so he painted a detailed scheme of PQ-17 convoy guarding positions - I must say they are very similar to those convoy guarding schemes we have in Silent Hunter III).

So,both large convoys in AL,AM areas during my first patrol have escaped.

I started a second patrol with "Zero - Null" grid.I decided that I will patrol the same AL,AM and north areas of Scapa Flow.My route from Kiel was along west Norwegian coasts and North-East of Scapa Flow I received a message of a large target group moving on overcrossing course.

Navigator calculated an intercept route and after some maneuvering on time compression a lied exactly on intercept course,at distance of approximately 7 kilometers.I spotted no destroyers,thus surfaced.Turned "Full Forward" and on 14 knots (it was stormy started approaching the avanguarde of the convoy).

To left of my position,there was an armed escort trawler,which actually started intercepting me.But this time luck was on Kriegsmarine side.:)Trawler's position and my U-49's high surface speed of 14 knots made perfect conditions for inaccurate trawlers fire.So,without paying any attention I continued rushing towards the avaguarde of convoy.

Turned on UZO.I was so happy as it was my Christmas present - Auxhilliary Cruiser and two T3 tankers almost at the same positions very,very near each other - distance about 2500 m - green markings.I fired all four torpedoes and gave immediate order to dive at 100 m -integrity was already 69 percents due to continious trawler's fire.

OK,depth is about 100m,"Full Silent" mode.Turned on external view - convoy is moving in the same direction.Silence.And....explosion,next explosion,once more explosion,more explosions - huge smoke clouds covered the targeted convoys avanguarde.:o Reports - "Torpedo Hit",the same reports again and again.

On "Full Silent" mode I surfaced again - just in the middle on convoy,reloaded torpedo launchers in "Safe in Silent Mode" and repetead an attack on other smaller ships.Torpedoes missed this time.:cry:Than trowler started approaching again and I decided to dive again and in "Full Silent Mode" leave the attack area.I successfully did that.

On my way back to Kiel,I sunk a small tanker of the small convoy with one remaining bow torpedo,finishing the attack with successfull hit of stern torpedo launcher.It was lucky for this convoy,that the sea was stormy that night.


The Result of Patrol 2 was:

Auxhilliary Cruiser - 13850 tonns
Two T3 Tankers
Small Tanker

Over 40 000 tonns in total.I was really happy,I was extremely happy yesterday.:D

I must admit,that I was playing on "Easy" realism,but as my skills increase I will rise gradually the realism levels.I plan to try GWX Add-on also.

Thanks for attention guys.It would be nice to read your comments and advices.

Good Hunting to all Kriegsmarine Captains :D :up:

Brag
04-25-07, 05:48 AM
Congratulations, Kaleun Genghis Khan! Good tonnage! But be more careful in the future. Position yourself in front of convoy and let it come to you. Attacking on the surface is a very risky business as you have seen. :rock:
you may want to read the Convoy Attack article on my website.
Again congratulations and good hunting :up:

Genghis Khan
04-25-07, 05:58 AM
Thanks for advices,Brag.:)This is just my primary goal - to master underwater torpedo attacks.That shows a real level of professionalism of a submarine captain.

I want to become a "Real Tonnage Ace" - like Gunter Prien and other aces of the deep.

xlbob
04-25-07, 05:59 AM
Keep up the good work :D
Congratulation on the successful attack, herr Kaleun. :up:
If I may suggest, resist the temptation to reload immediately after attacking a convoy. I had unpleasant experiences when I did that :D

rb4door
04-25-07, 06:03 AM
yes, I am a big fan too of positioning infront for an intercept, then crawling low & slow so the convoy arrives "overhead". I've had good successes regularly bypassing the lead escort by doing this. I make sure I stay well to the opposite side of the lead escort as I come in.

I might be a bit of a pyro, I love picking off tankers first hehe. Good tonnage and always a good chance of a fire show.
Nice work Khan - nothing like putting a big dent in a convoy! :arrgh!:

Genghis Khan
04-25-07, 06:03 AM
Xlbob,I am not actually fancy reloading closely to destroyers.If I do that,I do it when the warship contact is long,either constant or moving away.:)

Genghis Khan
04-25-07, 06:11 AM
In fact,I think that if the sea is calm,you can set a team with a deck gun,in principle,so they would keep destroyer under fire in reasonable distance.But,first,I actually never encounter a convoy when the weather is calm,and second,I am afraid that destroyer's fire will kill my men at the deck gun.:)

rb4door
04-25-07, 06:14 AM
yes you dont ever want to be surfaced at any time you are in visual range of a destroyer, your piddly slow 80mm wont have a chance against him.

P_Funk
04-25-07, 06:20 AM
yes you dont ever want to be surfaced at any time you are in visual range of a destroyer, your piddly slow 80mm wont have a chance against him.
Though you are faster than Armed Trawlers and Flower Corvettes. If you wanted to you could easily out run them.

Genghis Khan
04-25-07, 06:26 AM
P_Funk,

That was in my case.Trawler could not come near enough,to fire really accurately.

rb4door
04-25-07, 06:35 AM
yes you dont ever want to be surfaced at any time you are in visual range of a destroyer, your piddly slow 80mm wont have a chance against him. Though you are faster than Armed Trawlers and Flower Corvettes. If you wanted to you could easily out run them.
what is the max speed of a flower corvette?
i've never even contemplated being anywhere near one on the surface

P_Funk
04-25-07, 06:41 AM
yes you dont ever want to be surfaced at any time you are in visual range of a destroyer, your piddly slow 80mm wont have a chance against him. Though you are faster than Armed Trawlers and Flower Corvettes. If you wanted to you could easily out run them.
what is the max speed of a flower corvette?
i've never even contemplated being anywhere near one on the surface
Check your recog manual.:p

Though off the top of my head I think its something like 13 knots. They weren't really very well suited to their task... their task being the most numerous escort in the war. They had a wide body that tossed and turned in the North Atlantic storms and her main gun at first was useless even when it hit.

Not a nimble beast. You could easily out run one on the surface. And at night with your tail presented to him he won't be able to do anything.

rb4door
04-25-07, 06:45 AM
hmmm, perhaps my arrogance level for in game battles just went up notch :D

P_Funk
04-25-07, 07:37 AM
hmmm, perhaps my arrogance level for in game battles just went up notch :D
Just make sure that he doens't have a Hunt III friend. :yep:

danurve
04-25-07, 08:50 AM
hmmm, perhaps my arrogance level for in game battles just went up notch :D
Just make sure that he doens't have a Hunt III friend. :yep:

I think many of us have made that mistake before, one of those where the heck .. :arrgh!:

Hate to waiste a fish on such a small target.

P_Funk
04-25-07, 08:56 AM
Hate to waiste a fish on such a small target.
Unless it frees you up for sinking everything in the area.:arrgh!:

deamyont
04-25-07, 12:09 PM
I had one extremely good patrol (my first with my new carrer) yesterday. 1940, going out from St. Naz, patroling BF15 in my VIIB. 65% realistic GWX.

Got a radio report, large convoy, just a few hours away, ill get there by sunset, comming my way. It was only escoreted by two Flowers... I sneaked in, placed myself between two collumns and fired on a tanker, a large merchant and a large cargo. Cargo exploded and sunk, merchant dead in the water...

As the unrealistic guy I am, I chansed: surface, full speed ahead, and man the deck gun, and the flak gun! One Flower is in front of the convoy, one is way behind, probobly 6-8 km at least. Im inside it. Leading flower makes a U-turn and starts firing at me. Some pretty close but no hits. I, on the other hand, hits it with 10 shells and it explode... just one left, then its me alone, and all those unescorted merchants...

So I take a u-turn, and run for the other flower. When its about 4500 m away I see it and fire away. The flower fired back, gets pretty close and hits the conning tower once, killing my AA gunner, but other than that "Yellow" damage, nothing I cant repair. After 15 or so hits, the flower is sinking, and the rest is history:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v424/Deamyont/convoy.jpg

109.000 tonnes sunk. All torpedoes and all shells expanded. Only the 5 smallest ships are still afloat by mignight...

Brag
04-25-07, 12:37 PM
Deamyont: Nice bone-yard you left behind. :up:

Kaleu. Jochen Mohr
04-25-07, 08:13 PM
Hello everybody there,

Just posting my impressions on the very first really successfull attack on a Large Convoy Group,I commenced yesterday.

When I started playing Silent Hunter III,I was a bit afraid and tried to avoid pursuing and attacking those heavily guarded convoys,satisfying with numerous attacks on lonely ships and small convoys.

I was very sad yesterday,when I returned to Kiel ashamed,with only two not significant kills.8900 tonns tonnage during over the month of duty.:cry:

During that unsuccessfull patrol,I was actually trying to intercept two large convoy groups.But,I must admit,I was really too much carefull,trying to shorten distances and get on intercept courses in underwater position.Originally,this is my personal observation,when you do try pursuing a convoy underwater,your actual speed is 8 knots,convoy's speed itself if around 7 knots,and you must extremely precisely calculate your actual courses to shorten a distance just a bit.Very,very difficult.Moreover,if you do turn your engines on full power,it's very likely,that
destroyers will detect you and start approaching towards.Then,you turn on "Full Silent",speed drops to 3 knots and convoy starts moving away.I've seen that some convoys are guarded very smartly,I mean one destroyer far ahead,two destroyers far right and left - so all submarine approach routes are covered (That's the thing I actually appreciate - it does add lots of realism.Yesterday,I was looking through a book about PQ-17 tragedy,written by retiree British Navy Admiral,so he painted a detailed scheme of PQ-17 convoy guarding positions - I must say they are very similar to those convoy guarding schemes we have in Silent Hunter III).

So,both large convoys in AL,AM areas during my first patrol have escaped.

I started a second patrol with "Zero - Null" grid.I decided that I will patrol the same AL,AM and north areas of Scapa Flow.My route from Kiel was along west Norwegian coasts and North-East of Scapa Flow I received a message of a large target group moving on overcrossing course.

Navigator calculated an intercept route and after some maneuvering on time compression a lied exactly on intercept course,at distance of approximately 7 kilometers.I spotted no destroyers,thus surfaced.Turned "Full Forward" and on 14 knots (it was stormy started approaching the avanguarde of the convoy).

To left of my position,there was an armed escort trawler,which actually started intercepting me.But this time luck was on Kriegsmarine side.:)Trawler's position and my U-49's high surface speed of 14 knots made perfect conditions for inaccurate trawlers fire.So,without paying any attention I continued rushing towards the avaguarde of convoy.

Turned on UZO.I was so happy as it was my Christmas present - Auxhilliary Cruiser and two T3 tankers almost at the same positions very,very near each other - distance about 2500 m - green markings.I fired all four torpedoes and gave immediate order to dive at 100 m -integrity was already 69 percents due to continious trawler's fire.

OK,depth is about 100m,"Full Silent" mode.Turned on external view - convoy is moving in the same direction.Silence.And....explosion,next explosion,once more explosion,more explosions - huge smoke clouds covered the targeted convoys avanguarde.:o Reports - "Torpedo Hit",the same reports again and again.

On "Full Silent" mode I surfaced again - just in the middle on convoy,reloaded torpedo launchers in "Safe in Silent Mode" and repetead an attack on other smaller ships.Torpedoes missed this time.:cry:Than trowler started approaching again and I decided to dive again and in "Full Silent Mode" leave the attack area.I successfully did that.

On my way back to Kiel,I sunk a small tanker of the small convoy with one remaining bow torpedo,finishing the attack with successfull hit of stern torpedo launcher.It was lucky for this convoy,that the sea was stormy that night.


The Result of Patrol 2 was:

Auxhilliary Cruiser - 13850 tonns
Two T3 Tankers
Small Tanker

Over 40 000 tonns in total.I was really happy,I was extremely happy yesterday.:D

I must admit,that I was playing on "Easy" realism,but as my skills increase I will rise gradually the realism levels.I plan to try GWX Add-on also.

Thanks for attention guys.It would be nice to read your comments and advices.

Good Hunting to all Kriegsmarine Captains :D :up:

:o PLZ GIVE ME THE CO-ORDINATES. i never saw a convoy on my career :cry:

deamyont
04-26-07, 06:13 AM
Just park in BF15/13 and you cant possibly miss them all :up:

rb4door
04-26-07, 06:27 AM
I had one extremely good patrol (my first with my new carrer) yesterday. 1940, going out from St. Naz, patroling BF15 in my VIIB. 65% realistic GWX.

Got a radio report, large convoy, just a few hours away, ill get there by sunset, comming my way. It was only escoreted by two Flowers... I sneaked in, placed myself between two collumns and fired on a tanker, a large merchant and a large cargo. Cargo exploded and sunk, merchant dead in the water...

As the unrealistic guy I am, I chansed: surface, full speed ahead, and man the deck gun, and the flak gun! One Flower is in front of the convoy, one is way behind, probobly 6-8 km at least. Im inside it. Leading flower makes a U-turn and starts firing at me. Some pretty close but no hits. I, on the other hand, hits it with 10 shells and it explode... just one left, then its me alone, and all those unescorted merchants...

So I take a u-turn, and run for the other flower. When its about 4500 m away I see it and fire away. The flower fired back, gets pretty close and hits the conning tower once, killing my AA gunner, but other than that "Yellow" damage, nothing I cant repair. After 15 or so hits, the flower is sinking, and the rest is history:


109.000 tonnes sunk. All torpedoes and all shells expanded. Only the 5 smallest ships are still afloat by mignight...


awesome work there deamyont - you have given me inspiration for my next patrol. Leaving as soon as I get home from work tomorrow night! :arrgh!:

Maraz
04-26-07, 06:33 AM
What about surface attacks at night (in pre-radar era)?

They could do that in real life, but it looks like that is very difficult in GWX...

I'm going to change the "Happy Times" stock mission to take place at night, and try that...

Anyway that cruising on the surface at safe distance (>12 km) to arrive along the convoy's expected path, and then waiting fot it at periscope depth, should be the safest tactic. Tried that with my first convoy (in daylight) and it worked!

Maraz

Kaleu. Jochen Mohr
04-26-07, 09:58 AM
Just park in BF15/13 and you cant possibly miss them all :up:
thanks man :rock:
may god be with you and give you more sucsessfull convoy engagements.:up:

danurve
04-26-07, 11:44 AM
Hate to waiste a fish on such a small target.
Unless it frees you up for sinking everything in the area.:arrgh!:

Good point even.