increasing battery life

[Bilge_Rat]

I had noticed that with all ahead 1/3 or even silent running, the batteries were running down very quickly.

However, if you manually set the speed to one knot, you can stretch the battery for a very long time, up to the point where the CO2 level becomes an issue.

(p.s. I'm not using CCIP's battery mod.)

[AVGWarhawk]

Yes sir! Flank speeds got about an hour out of the batteries. Submerged 1-2 kts got you just about a day. Sure, you got about 80nm over the course of the day but it was not speed they were looking for....they were looking to survive!

[Seadogs]

Try 12-24 nm in 12 hours going 1-2 knots. :know:

[-Pv-]

Yup, all us SH3 veterans learned 2 knots will get you easily from sunrise to sunset with reasonable recharge time.
-Pv-

[Banquet]

I think a Gato class could stay submerged for 48 hours at 2 knots.. Bilge Rat, did you time how long you could stay underwater at 1 knot?

[NEON DEON]

I think a Gato class could stay submerged for 48 hours at 2 knots.. Bilge Rat, did you time how long you could stay underwater at 1 knot?

Those are the stats for a Gato/Balao. 95 NM at 2 knots. My question is could the oxygen hold out that long?

[Banquet]

I think a Gato class could stay submerged for 48 hours at 2 knots.. Bilge Rat, did you time how long you could stay underwater at 1 knot?
Those are the stats for a Gato/Balao. 95 NM at 2 knots. My question is could the oxygen hold out that long?

Good question. It's hard to imagine enough oxygen in a cramped sub to last the crew for 48 hours!

[Bilge_Rat]

I think a Gato class could stay submerged for 48 hours at 2 knots.. Bilge Rat, did you time how long you could stay underwater at 1 knot?



no, but 48 hours looks about right.

[NEON DEON]

I think a Gato class could stay submerged for 48 hours at 2 knots.. Bilge Rat, did you time how long you could stay underwater at 1 knot?



no, but 48 hours looks about right.

I just ran a test on SH IV with a Gato in V. 1.1.

At 2 Knots and 24 hours, the battery level and carbo build up are both close to 50.

So it would appear that SH IV models it after the actual specs.

[AVGWarhawk]

I think a Gato class could stay submerged for 48 hours at 2 knots.. Bilge Rat, did you time how long you could stay underwater at 1 knot?
Those are the stats for a Gato/Balao. 95 NM at 2 knots. My question is could the oxygen hold out that long?

Good question. It's hard to imagine enough oxygen in a cramped sub to last the crew for 48 hours!

Air scubbers I believe!

[nattydread]

I read Gatos onlt got about 30mins at flank speed.

[NEON DEON]

I read Gatos onlt got about 30mins at flank speed.

I believe you can say that for just about every WW II submarine.

[Banquet]

I read Gatos onlt got about 30mins at flank speed.

I read that too.. I'm surprised to hear NEON DEON got 24 hours out of a Gato with 50% battery without the battery mod.. I seem to remember testing it and not getting that long but I can't find the notes I made.

[NEON DEON]

I read Gatos onlt got about 30mins at flank speed.

I read that too.. I'm surprised to hear NEON DEON got 24 hours out of a Gato with 50% battery without the battery mod.. I seem to remember testing it and not getting that long but I can't find the notes I made.

I have 1.1 installed and I went back and tested the Gato five times.

Every time at 2 knots the battery and Oxygen levels were just about 50 and the Gato had traveled 48 NM in 24 hours.

In my version of SH IV, they appear to have it right.

[AVGWarhawk]

I agree with Neon, the battery situation seems to be good as is.

[-Pv-]

I see very simular results to SH3. Battery technology was very similar. The results are expected and satisfactory to me. In over three years of playing, I've not worn out the battery yet.
-Pv-

[Banquet]

Ok, I just uninstalled the battery mod to test this.

As far as I know (from sources on the internet, book and SH1 manual), here is some info on the Gato battery..

Time : 48 hours submerged @ 2 kts
Range : 100nm @ 3kts
Range : 95nm @ 5 kts
4-6 hours to recharge the battery.


Now here's what I got in testing;

Time:
2kts
Submerged 8.05. 24 hours later had 39% battery remaining (11% short)

Range:
3kts
Submerged at 05.11 - surfaced 14.44 with 10% battery.. travelled 32.7nm (67nm short)

Range:
5kts
Submerged at 15.59 - surfaced 19.33 with 10% battery.. travelled 16.5nm (79nm short)

Battery re-charge from 10% to 100% - 1 hour 10 mins.



So - on my system the battery is under capacity every time if the (few) sources I have found are to believed.. At slow speeds it's marginal.. at higher speeds it's a massive amount.

Also the battery re-charges far too quickly.

Does it matter? Yes or no depending on your viewpoint.. but imo the batteries are not modelled accurately - which is why I'm now re-installing the extended battery mod! :)

[CCIP]

Yes, at 2kt the range is completely right.

The problem, I believe, is that 2kt is not the actual submerged cruise speed, but it would rather be the 3.5-4 kt that we get with actual 1/3 running in SHIV.

Since the default max ranges are set at a 2kt speed rather than 4kt, there are serious penalties to range when travelling at that speed. The main way in which I modded it was to allow for a 4kt, rather than a 2kt, base submerged cruising speed.

[anthrax]

Well, according to the US Navy's

SUBMARINE TORPEDO FIRE CONTROL MANUAL, Date May 1950

The fleet type submarine. Which I guess it gato,balao, or trench class has the following performance.

310. FLEET TYPE SUBMARINE:

(a) The Fleet Type Submarine will make the following speeds submerged for the length of time indicated, if it starts with a full battery charge:
Knots Time
3.0 48 hours
6.0 3 hours
8.0 1 hour
9.0 1/2 hour


(b) Thus it can readily be seen that a major consideration when making an approach is conservation of the battery capacity.



....

[quote]
320. THE GUPPY II TYPE SUBMARINE:

(a) The Guppy II Type of submarine has characteristics different from the Fleet Type. The primary difference is submerged speed. The Guppy II will make the following speeds for the time indicated with a full battery, charge:
Knots Hours
4.3 48
5.3 36
6.3 20
8.2 10
9.4 6
9.9 5
11.8 3
15.7 1
17.8 30 minutes
[/qoute]

[SteamWake]

I would imagane as well the "good" skippers would make judicious use of currents.

Doing 2 knots in the gulfstream could net you almost 10 knots going with the current.

[7Enigma]

Good question. It's hard to imagine enough oxygen in a cramped sub to last the crew for 48 hours!

Wasn't the O2 that was the problem. It was the CO2 buildup if I remember correctly.

[SteamWake]

Good question. It's hard to imagine enough oxygen in a cramped sub to last the crew for 48 hours!

Wasn't the O2 that was the problem. It was the CO2 buildup if I remember correctly.

You inhale O2 exhale CO2... get the picture ?

[Faamecanic]

I would imagane as well the "good" skippers would make judicious use of currents.

Doing 2 knots in the gulfstream could net you almost 10 knots going with the current.

Or - 8 kts (going backward) if running against said current....

With the aircover as it is (and dead eye dicks with dive bombing) we NEED to be able to stay submerged at least 12 hours... My routine, where there is aircover, is to dive at first light and surface when the red lights come on.

[Faamecanic]

Good question. It's hard to imagine enough oxygen in a cramped sub to last the crew for 48 hours!

Wasn't the O2 that was the problem. It was the CO2 buildup if I remember correctly.

You inhale O2 exhale CO2... get the picture ?

Actually you would have a finite supply of O2 (whatever the sub would hold). But scrubbers (if they had them back in WWII) would remove the Carbon molecule from the O2, hence resupply some of the O2. Without scrubbers then the CO2 merely displaces the O2 as it is used up.

[SteamWake]

Good question. It's hard to imagine enough oxygen in a cramped sub to last the crew for 48 hours!

Wasn't the O2 that was the problem. It was the CO2 buildup if I remember correctly.

You inhale O2 exhale CO2... get the picture ?

Actually you would have a finite supply of O2 (whatever the sub would hold). But scrubbers (if they had them back in WWII) would remove the Carbon molecule from the O2, hence resupply some of the O2. Without scrubbers then the CO2 merely displaces the O2 as it is used up.

Key word being "some" still you breath o2 Co2 is poisionus.

[NEON DEON]

Yes, at 2kt the range is completely right.

The problem, I believe, is that 2kt is not the actual submerged cruise speed, but it would rather be the 3.5-4 kt that we get with actual 1/3 running in SHIV.

Since the default max ranges are set at a 2kt speed rather than 4kt, there are serious penalties to range when travelling at that speed. The main way in which I modded it was to allow for a 4kt, rather than a 2kt, base submerged cruising speed.

The specs on the boat are 96 NM at 2 knots. That is 48 hours.

Double the speed and you will not make it to 48 hours.

[Triad773]

Hi there- I was curious about this subject after navigating around Oahu submerged, and was surprised at the battery life on a P-class ship. I did a search and found this thread, but I think I'd like to know a little more on the subject.

In the course of a typical day, what might be the standard speed for submerged day-long duties? 1/3rd or 2/3rds? I am thinking Ahead Standard must be for surface use under normal circumstances. I am also thinking that one can't really go as fast submerged just anticipating that they will be able to come up to recharge at dusk when they need to; that energy management must seem to dictate such prudence as to have SPARE juice if you need it, and not 'just enough.'

I would like to start out right by learning energy management as correctly as possible. I was interested as to what a sim like SH4 could teach me about historical delimmas of real Captains, and not the game aspect so much.

Any help or thoughts aprecciated-

Thanks

Triad

[-Pv-]

I did careful testing of un-modded battery duration and charging times as well as Co2 in default game. The results are here:
http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=119595&highlight=battery

I see no reason to use any battery modification because the default game is easily within reasonable historical values.
-Pv-

[Triad773]

Hey PV thanks much for the link. My having no familiarity with what's the baseline for such as battery performance on a sub, it looks like a great resource.

Having just started I am having the settings as real as I can stand them and go from there. That and I am really into the historical factors of how they shaped what really happened.

Cheers

Triad

[-Pv-]

I don't think WWII sub had Co2 "scrubbers" in the modern sense. They just sprinkled thin layers of Lithium Hydroxide out of canisters onto shallow pans and plates and distributed them around.
-Pv-

[Sailor Steve]

Key word being "some" still you breath o2 Co2 is poisionus.
CO is poisonous. CO2 is what we exhale. I don't think it's poison - I think we just can't breath it.

Not that there's much difference in the long run.

[-Pv-]

Co2 toxicity (not that it matters in the game)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carbon_dioxide#Toxicity
-Pv-