FSAA + Bloom in Sh3?

[XanderF]

Using an ATI card, and I've noticed that when I increase bloom in-game (shift + PgUp), the FSAA turns off. Very frustrating, and I had thought at one time this was identified as a 'game issue'.

However, browsing through the pics thread, I came onthis set of pictures which really got me wondering (http://207.44.214.111/subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=421217&postcount=2713). I suppose it's possible they were resized - they ARE at 'only' 1024x768. But, then, that's the stock resolution (sans mod) so...maybe not?

Difference is that he is using an nVidia card - GeForce 6600GT.

So...could I get some clarification of this? Does FSAA go away on all cards, and these images just look AA'd because they were resized down? Or do nVidia cards keep FSAA with bloom cranked up? (He confirmed in this post (http://207.44.214.111/subsim.com/radioroom/showpost.php?p=421342&postcount=2716) that this wasn't Photoshop doing the bloom effect, but in-game)

Thoughts?

[danlisa]

Or do nVidia cards keep FSAA with bloom cranked up?

:yep: Spot on.

[XanderF]

Or do nVidia cards keep FSAA with bloom cranked up?

:yep: Spot on.

*sigh*

What is it with you GWX guys and 2 or 3 word answers? :nope:

Does that mean YES, FSAA+bloom works? NO, they are also broke, what?

Also - is the UZO issue fixed with them, then? Or do they still disable all water particles in order not to get the stuttering with the UZO/Periscope at surface?

(And to be really, really clear on this point, as a $200 video card purchase hangs on it - could you please take a screenshot, at full res, with shift-PgUp cranked all the way up showing bloom still working? I'm absolutely buying a video card for this title and Sh4 alone, and want to make sure I nail the feature set right. Sh4 obviously also has a 'bloom' issue with ATI cards (http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=108789).)

[danlisa]

My response answered your question.

But to clarify.....

Nvidia - FSAA + Bloom both work together in SH3.
ATI - FSAA + Bloom do NOT work together in SH3.

No I can't take a screenshot with bloom on as I currently use an ATI card.

If you want to use bloom your only choice is to buy an Nvidia card.

[Dowly]

Do you know the story about the longest story in the world?

Once upon a time there lived a chief who liked to listen to stories. And he knew so many stories that sometimes he stopped the storyteller and finished the story himself.

One day the chief sent his servants everywhere to find a good storyteller.

"Our Chief will give many presents to the man who will tell him the longest story in the world and make him laugh," the servants shouted in the streets.

Many people came to the chief and told him very long stories. They tried to make him laugh, but nobody could do that. The chief always said, "That is not the longest story and there is nothing to laugh at."

Once a boy came to the chief and said, "Oh, my Chief, let me try to tell you the longest story in the world and make you laugh."

The chief said, "Well, sit down and begin your story!"

The boy began: "Long, long ago there lived a man, Ubanbau by name. He ate so much that no man could feed him full. The chief of that country heard about Ubanbau and said, "Bring him to me, I shall feed him full." And he ordered his people to bring hundreds of thousands of pots of soup, meat, and fruit. Hundreds of camels carried the pots on their backs. The camels stopped in front of the chief's house. Many people came to see Ubanbau's dinner. Then Ubanbau came. The drummers began to drum, the musicians began to play, and the people sang songs. Ubanbau made a bow to the chief and said to the people, "Now look at me! Look at me! Look at me! With these words Ubanbau began to eat soup. And he ate, and he ate, and he ate, and he ate, and he ate,..."

"Well, what then?" asked the chief. "He ate, and he ate, and what then?"

"Oh, my Chief," answered the boy, "this is only the first pot and there were many thousands of pots! Wait a little.
And he ate, and he ate, and he ate,..."

Evening came. The boy went on with his story; "...and he ate, and he ate, and he ate,..." At last the chief ordered him to stop until the next morning.

In the morning the chief asked the boy to go on with his story. "Now what can you tell us about your Ubanbau?" he asked.

"Oh, my Chief, he not only ate, but drank too, so he drank and then he ate, and he ate, and he ate,..."

The storyteller said louder and louder "And he ate, and he ate, and he ate,..."

The chief looked at the boy and began to laugh. "Well, my boy, your story is the longest in the world! Have a rest now! Stop!"

And the young storyteller stopped his story, got many presents from the chief, climbed up on a camel, and rode away with these words: "And he ate, and he ate, and he ate,..."


Long enough?

Ok, now to the answer. Like Dan said;

Nvidia - FSAA + Bloom both work together in SH3.
ATI - FSAA + Bloom do NOT work together in SH3.

[Foghladh_mhara]

And the young storyteller stopped his story, got many presents from the chief, climbed up on a camel, and rode away with these words: "And he ate, and he ate, and he ate,..."

So how does the story end? :)

[Kpt. Lehmann]

It ends when the servant becomes the master.

The sad thing is that XanderF labeled danlisa as a 'GWX Guy' who supposedly gives 2-3 word answers.
I'm pretty sure that if you combined our collective efforts of the "GWX Guys" in this forum, you'll find the we offer the most tech support to anyone regardless of whether it is GWX related or not.

XanderF, maybe you are having a Monday or Bernard bent the boat again... but you owe danlisa an apology for being rude to him. Asking for a clarification is fine... being a jerk about it cuts into the collective "help-o-meter" that can be found here.

I'm going to assume you were just having a rotten day.

[P_Funk]

I'm pretty sure that if you combined our collective efforts of the "GWX Guys" in this forum, you'll find the we offer the most tech support to anyone regardless of whether it is GWX related or not.

You got that right. I spent 90 minutes last week on the phone with Rogers about my cell phone cause they boned it up. You guys say more in one post than they do.:damn:

:up:

[Brag]

And the young storyteller stopped his story, got many presents from the chief, climbed up on a camel, and rode away with these words: "And he ate, and he ate, and he ate,..."


Long enough?

.

And he ate, and he ate, and he ate. Dowly, when will you finish the story? :huh:

[XanderF]

I'm going to assume you were just having a rotten day.

Actually, I was trying to be sarcastic (re: the "sigh" and emoticon), as the last 2 times I asked a question, some GWX fellow came in with a 2 or 3 word answer that could be interpreted ambiguously (cue the Vorlon answering "Yes" to a 4-choice question). Check how long I've been a member here, I'm well aware that the GWX team provides a lot of support. Unfortunately, the internet continues to be a poor place to transmit sarcasm very well.

Anyway, does anyone have the ability to do a full res screenshot, and specifically with the Shift-PgUp cranked all the way up? Would be very helpful. I mean, it's not that ATI doesn't have bloom at ALL - it does, you just can't adjust it up from the rather anemic stock values without FSAA breaking. I'd like to see if you could take it up quite a bit over stock with nVidia cards.

Oh, and as a related question to that - when you do crank this up (shift-PgUp), how well does it "stick"? With my ATI card, I can have it all the way up, but when I exit the game and load it up again, it's back to stock. Is there a config file tweak that can set that higher than the default on startup?

I do appreciate the help. It's a tough decision I'm considering, as I definitely like my HDR+FSAA in 'Oblivion', but really spend more time in Sh3, Sh4, and 1946 than that game. Which, depending on how this investigation goes, all appear to favor nVidia hardware quite a bit.

[Dowly]

(cue the Vorlon answering "Yes" to a 4-choice question)

Kosh rokzors j00 boxorz!!! :rock::rock:

[XanderF]

So, to recap, questions:


UZO 'spray' bug. Fixed in nVidia cards, or is it still 'fixed' by completely disabling the effect?
How to get the Shift-PgUp 'bloom' increase to start out at an increased level? Config file somewhere?
Screenshot, pls, not resized, showing Shift-PgUp bloom cranked all the way up and 4xAA still working for nVidia?


Thanks in advance!

[The Munster]

Dunno :doh:

Oops sorry, I'm being sarcastic :rotfl:

[Lzs von swe]

The UZO spray bug is fixed in later drivers.
I do not think you can get your bloom effect to stick via any cfg files, sorry.
I really don´t think the AA stays on when you shift-PgUp even on nVidia cards:hmm:
Just got back from a hard patrol and must get some sleep, will get you a screeny later if no one else have done so, ok:yep:

[Lzs von swe]

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u101/vonswe/ecfc5124.jpg
GF 7950, 4xAA, GWX 1.03. No bloom.

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u101/vonswe/065ba4ca.jpg
Full bloom. No edit, no resize, saved at 100%. Big...

[The Renegade]

Damn that bloom is really nice. Does it work with AA at all? Or is it just ATI cards that fail to deliver, yet again? Then again, there's issues for both ATI and nVidia cards, but even now with SH4, it seems that ATI cards have problems with advanced lighting and AA together, which is something the X1000 series is supposed to have as an "exclusive, way cool" feature. Kinda confuddles me that nVidia cards can display a picture with better lighting then...

[XanderF]

No, look at the edge of the hull where it meets the water. Same thing is happening to ATI cards - AA is definitely disabled when you crank the bloom up. Odd thing, too, about that bloom. Notice how white it makes the sky? When the water 'washes' over the periscope and you get the rippling effect, bloom is ALSO disabled. So the sky drops back to it's previous grey or blue through the watery film. As soon as the last of it is off the periscope, *snap*, the sky is back to glowing white again. With heavy weather, it's really bizarre. Bright white, bright white, bright white, *whoosh*, grey, grey, grey, bright white, bright white, etc. The sky flipping back and forth between full bloom and not is odd looking.

A shame, too, as the 'bloom' effect INSIDE the boat is interesting. Gives it a rather hazy look.

(BTW, Lzs von swe, you may want to make sure you have 'transparency AA' and 'alpha blended' AA turned on, those railings look PAINFUL even with AA on!)

I'll try to post a similar set of pics tonight from an ATI card so comparison could be made.

[Lzs von swe]

(BTW, Lzs von swe, you may want to make sure you have 'transparency AA' and 'alpha blended' AA turned on, those railings look PAINFUL even with AA on!)
The transparency AA is turned off as a test but the alpha blended AA is still not available in the Vista 32bit drivers 100.65.

[XanderF]

(BTW, Lzs von swe, you may want to make sure you have 'transparency AA' and 'alpha blended' AA turned on, those railings look PAINFUL even with AA on!)
The transparency AA is turned off as a test but the alpha blended AA is still not available in the Vista 32bit drivers 100.65.

Ah, didn't realize you were using Vista.

Hmm...I hope that doesn't make a difference. There have certainly be claims that Windows XP with GeForce 7-series (or earlier) cards can do FSAA with Bloom cranked, but I've never seen a screenshot to prove it.

[Farszu]

Well i'm using GF 6600 GT and i can't get the FSAA and BLOOM work together. When i turn bloom on it looks like FSAA just turn off. :dead:

[XanderF]

Well i'm using GF 6600 GT and i can't get the FSAA and BLOOM work together. When i turn bloom on it looks like FSAA just turn off. :dead:

Windows XP?

[Farszu]

Yes. Newest graphic drivers.

[Kpt. Kellar]

Hi all, new to the forums. I was going to ask this in its own thread, but it's being talked about here. How can you enable FSAA and Bloom in SH3? Do you need the GWX mod? I just recently purchased SH3 and noticed there's not much in the way of video options. I'd like to kick up the resolution to 1280x1024 if that's possible as well. I have a GeForce 7950GT.

Great game, I'm running it stock right now, but will dive into the GWX mod and others in the future.

[XanderF]

Basic bloom is enabled by default, nothing to do about that. The 'enhanced' bloom is activating by hitting Shift-PgUp many times in game (it's a scale, hitting Shift-PgUp increases it and Shift-PgDn decreases it). It does not work with FSAA at all (it disables it).

As to FSAA in the basic game - just set it in your driver's control panel, done.

As to changing the resolution in the game - see this article (http://www.communitymanuals.com/shiii/index.php?title=Display_Resolution). It's not "easy", but it's really not very hard and DEFINITELY worth doing.

[Kpt. Kellar]

Basic bloom is enabled by default, nothing to do about that. The 'enhanced' bloom is activating by hitting Shift-PgUp many times in game (it's a scale, hitting Shift-PgUp increases it and Shift-PgDn decreases it). It does not work with FSAA at all (it disables it).

As to FSAA in the basic game - just set it in your driver's control panel, done.

As to changing the resolution in the game - see this article (http://www.communitymanuals.com/shiii/index.php?title=Display_Resolution). It's not "easy", but it's really not very hard and DEFINITELY worth doing.

Thanks for the info. :)

[Mush Martin]

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u101/vonswe/ecfc5124.jpg
GF 7950, 4xAA, GWX 1.03. No bloom.

http://i166.photobucket.com/albums/u101/vonswe/065ba4ca.jpg
Full bloom. No edit, no resize, saved at 100%. Big...

Whats peculiar about these two pics is
that two years ago I got an artificial lens implant
in one eye and this is before and after
what the real world looks like to me
I honestly prefer it without the bloom.

[XanderF]

Okay, similar shots - 1280x1024, Radeon X1950 Pro, catalyst 7.3. First with 6xAA+'Adaptive', second with the same settings but bloom cranked up (which obviously disables it):

http://xanderf.go.dyndns.org/images/games/sh3_ati_fsaa.jpg

...vs...

http://xanderf.go.dyndns.org/images/games/sh3_ati_bloom.jpg

...personally, I think the "bloom" shot would look the better of the two, if FSAA was working.

The lighting is just SO much more 'interesting'.