AA gun view blocked by shield

[Platapus]

I can't find whether this has been discussed before, so my apologies if this is old news.

I was on my first patrol in a Gar class when I was attacked by one plane. Just for fun I wanted to see if I could shoot it down.

However when I tried to move the AA gun around my view was blocked by the tub like shield surrounding me. This effectively prohibited me from targeting any aircraft other than ones directly astern.

Is this functioning as designed or is it a bug. And if a bug is there a work around?

[Cakewalk]

Definitly something that the dev team overlooked, everyone has this problem. I'm not sure whether it will be fixed in the next patch, but it seems likely that it will be corrected eventually.

[Platapus]

Ok well as long as there is not a work around I guess I aint shootin any aircraft (probably a bad habit to get in to anyway if my SH3 experiences are applicable)

[Cakewalk]

Yeah, and if you really need to shoot down a plane, then just leave one of your crew to man the guns, luckily he's skinny enough that he doesn't "hang over the side" of the tub.:rotfl:

[Grunt]

Bug #23876783022...NOTED!

[DeePsix501]

Why is everyone so quick to call anything they dont like a bug? It is not a bug. The early war subs really did have high fairing around the cigarette deck. Here is the Grudgeon, a Gar class sub. As you can see the fairings are high around the AA gun.

http://www.navsource.org/archives/08/0821111.jpg

It wasn't till ~Mid 1943 till they shaved down the rear fairing and put a railing around the back. Gato class subs along with older Salmon Gar Tambor etc class subs eventualy got the upgraded conning towers. Then it looked like this:

http://www.navsource.org/archives/08/0821112.jpg

Start a career in 1943 and you'll see what i mean. My sub currently has high fairings around the back too and it does hinder AA gun aiming viewing, so I avoid confrontation with enemy aircraft as much as possible. I am playing with realism after all...

[stabiz]

So you are saying the Americans sent submarines out to war that could only fire AA guns straight backwards? Yeah right.

[Ducimus]

I agree its annoying, but i don't agree that bathtub around the AA gun is a bug.

Bug or not, i "fixed" it in my mod pack. Pretty easy to get rid of, just assign the boat the next conning tower earlier then youd normally see it. (next conning tower removes taht bathtub, and on the gato's cuts the shroud around the periscope shears. On the Tambor and gar it only removes the bathtub- thats how i know its not a bug :D )

[Platapus]

The early war subs really did have high fairing around the cigarette deck. Here is the Grudgeon, a Gar class sub. As you can see the fairings are high around the AA gun.

I think I may have not made myself clear. I don't think the high tub shield is the bug, I feel that when you rotate the AA gun to specific positions, the shield behind you is graphically rendering between the gun and the "camera" blocking off the view.

In no way would this happen on a real submarine as the gunners view point would be inside the tub where in the video game the point of view is at the edge of the tub.

I am sorry I did not make that more clear in my post.

[John Channing]

So you are saying the Americans sent submarines out to war that could only fire AA guns straight backwards? Yeah right.

Well, seeing as he was good enough to supply some evidence, perhaps you could supply some to the contrary?

JCC

[DeePsix501]

The early war subs really did have high fairing around the cigarette deck. Here is the Grudgeon, a Gar class sub. As you can see the fairings are high around the AA gun.

I think I may have not made myself clear. I don't think the high tub shield is the bug, I feel that when you rotate the AA gun to specific positions, the shield behind you is graphically rendering between the fun and the "camera" blocking off the view.

In no way would this happen on a real submarine as the gunners view point would be inside the tub where in the video game the point of view is at the edge of the tub.

I am sorry I did not make that more clear in my post.

Oh, so your Camera view is tucked up against the fairings where you cant see at all? Hmm, Maybe fiddle with different resolution sizes and such.

[StandingCow]

Yea, this is an issue of the camera view being behind the tub and blocking your vision, no way would they have ment it to be this way. Its a bug.

[stabiz]

So you are saying the Americans sent submarines out to war that could only fire AA guns straight backwards? Yeah right.
Well, seeing as he was good enough to supply some evidence, perhaps you could supply some to the contrary?

JCC

How about the fact that one can turn the AA gun? No point in that if it only shoots backwards.

[Spaxspore]

Yea, this is an issue of the camera view being behind the tub and blocking your vision, no way would they have ment it to be this way. Its a bug.

Exactly! its like your body (when goin in 360 to aim at planes) goes through a side of the "tub" and your vision is 50% blocked.. extremely annoyin when u r under constent attack by air.

[walsh2509]

ITS NOT A BUG !


I had it on mine up until about Nov 42, I came back from a mission and got a screen, sub being refitted, the "bathtub" round the aft AA gun was being taken away to reduce the subs profile.

its not a bug.

[stabiz]

If its not a bug, how come the crew can fire to all sides, but you cant?

[StandingCow]

ITS NOT A BUG !


I had it on mine up until about Nov 42, I came back from a mission and got a screen, sub being refitted, the "bathtub" round the aft AA gun was being taken away to reduce the subs profile.

its not a bug.
So the sub design may have changed a bit, that doesn't make this not a bug. In NO game should this be the way a limit should be put on a weapon, its sloppy work. They could have easily made the gun lock and not spin after a certain point, and on top of that, if you were actually in the real position of the AA gun, the bathtub would not be an issue.

Its a graphical bug.

[Seadogs]

ITS NOT A BUG !


I had it on mine up until about Nov 42, I came back from a mission and got a screen, sub being refitted, the "bathtub" round the aft AA gun was being taken away to reduce the subs profile.

its not a bug.

Is a bug regarding the camera. Whats bieng said is not the wall infront of the gun cutting out the view, which is fine. But the camera behind you blocking the view in a clipping like fashion. Very common bug in MANY games.

[CybrSlydr]

Just so we're clear on what we're talking about...

I made a video and am uploading it right now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eufdn24eT5w

[modisch]

It's not a bug, per se.

It's bad design.

Yes, the tub is supposed to be there. And yes, updated conning towers provide a cutaway. Those aren't issues.

The issue the that as the camera pans, it pans outside of the tub during certain angles, causing you to have a lovely view of the tub wall and not the gunsights. What should happen is the camera should either be moved in closer to the rotational axis or the tub wall should be made transparent during AA gun use. In real life, if you're using the gun, your body is not going to pass through the metal tub wall. The camera view ingame does. Bad design, not bug. The camera works as designed.... and that's the problem ;)

Pull the camera about 6 inches in to the center of the station and it won't be an issue.

-m

[Spaxspore]

Just so we're clear on what we're talking about...

I made a video and am uploading it right now.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eufdn24eT5w

yep thats it, notice how u pass through the bulkhead... if thats not a bug(graphical) i dont know what is

[Ping Jockey]

If you have a great patrol they remove the tub and put in a rail. So I don't think it's a bug.You get a screen telling you this too.

[DeePsix501]

I wonder if it has to do with the type of AA gun...

I have installed the single 20mm AA gun and I do not clip through the tub. Try that and see if it works.

[stabiz]

That is correct, it only happens with the twin AA gun.

[DirtyHarry3033]

Hmm, this is interesting thread. I've read a LOT of complaints about this, and I wondered what everyone was complaining about. It always worked perfectly for me. (Tambor class, starting Dec 1941, 20mm single AA mount)

Being stupid, I thought people were complaining the tub wall was too high so you couldn't see the horizon as the boat pitched and rocked ;) I never had ANY probs on my 1st 2 patrols shooting down planes no matter what the angle.

Well last night I put into Pearl after my 2nd patrol, refitted, rearmed, recruited a crew for DC, handed out promotions and medals. That's all I did in-game, no upgrades to the boat. I DID exit the game and add on a few mods while in port.

After leaving port, a plane was spotted and I manned the AA gun, and finally saw what everyone else is complaining about. My POV was way further back from the gun than it was before, and when I rotated it, my "body" was swinging outside the tub so my view was blocked :(

Was working perfectly before, now I've got the same prob as everyone else!

Well I thought it might be one of the mods I put on that did it - removed EVERYTHING and reloaded the game - same problem.

So I reloaded a save during my 2nd patrol when things worked right, and guess what? Things were fine, no probs rotating the AA gun.

I then reloaded the auto-save when I entered Pearl, put to sea without doing anything, and again, NO PROBLEMS!

Then I started doing the things I'd done last time:

1) Add DC crew, put to sea - NO PROBS!
2) Add DC crew, give promotions, put to sea - NO PROBS!
3) Add DC crew, give promotions, give medals, put to sea - NO PROBS!

Finally after all that, I saved the game with all the things I'd done, exited and reinstalled the mods I put on before. Reloaded, and still NO PROBS! AA gun is working fine.

Don't ask me, it's over my head. I'm wondering if something is getting randomly "trashed" when leaving port, that might be causing this?

Or maybe it's something in one of the mods I had installed when I was in port that did it? Remember, I uninstalled all the mods before I started doing the crew maintenance work. Then put 'em back on AFTER I was done and back out to sea, and the AA working properly.

Strange, but I'm glad to have my AA back!

DH

[stabiz]

That is very strange indeed! :hmm: You tried with the dual AA gun, and no problems, or the single 20mm?

I for one can confirm it has nothing to do with mods, as I have none at the moment.

[DirtyHarry3033]

That is very strange indeed! :hmm: You tried with the dual AA gun, and no problems, or the single 20mm?

I for one can confirm it has nothing to do with mods, as I have none at the moment.
Yep it is a strange one! I did NOT try with the dual 20mm, I was considering upgrades to deck gun and AA while at Pearl but didn't do it. At 1st I thought, "Well maybe I DID do that dual 20mm upgrade and that's what did it?" So I reloaded a save I made after all in-port work was done but before sailing, and I still had the single. And besides, the graphic for the AA was unchanged, still one barrel. (Except the POV was moved *way* back)

So anyway, all of this happened with the single 20mm only. All thru patrol 1 and 2, it worked fine, at start of patrol 3 it was totally crapped like you and everyone else said. After removing all mods and restarting from the time I entered Pearl after patrol 2, SOMEHOW I got it working again.

Go figure :damn:

DH

[Convoystalker]

This is so annoying I now leave the AA gun in the capable hands of Seaman Roger Acker who starts off with guns rating at 100 .... he is very good.

The problem may be that twin AA gun is using the deck gun seating arrangement hence the operator is outside the shield when turning.

Think about the firing positions. With 20MM AA gun the operator stands maybe 1 foot behind the gun so his body movement arc is very small.

With the deck gun he sits on a pedestal maybe 3-5 feet behind the pivot point of the weapon so his movement arc is far greater ..... large enough to place him outside the conning tower bathtub sides when turning sideways.

Ive never tried a 40MM AA gun but from it's looks it has a seating arrangement sorta like the deck gun with the operator sitting 2-3 feet behind the weapon.
If this were placed at the rear the operator might also have a movement arc outside the bathtub sides.
However the only images of a 40MM I've seen are that it's mounted at the front on an unobstructed platform.

Conclusion :hmm:
Maybe the devs used either the deck gun or 40MM AA pivot point & seating position and therefore larger operators movement arc on the rear twin 20MM.