Damage Control thread

[WilhelmSchulz.]

THE DAMMAGE CONTROL SECTION DOSE NOT WORK! I had a depth charge go off in my face and it dammaged my tubes. I had a DC party try to fix them. THEY DID NOTHING!!!! :damn:

UBI! WHERE NOT BETA TESTERS!!!!!!!! :damn:

[9th_cow]

i must admit given extensive testing i think its certainly not working the way it should.
simple repairs are often beyond your crew, and even after repairing things you seem to die far to often.
it does seem to work to a degree however at the moment im feeling a big loss of imersion, and and even bigger loss of fun :)
hopefully they will fix it.

[XanderF]

To be fair, this MIGHT be 'as designed'. These guys don't have "Star Trek"-style replicators around, what they CAN repair is certainly very limited.

[9th_cow]

thats possible, but im talking about things like your crew fixing a bulkhead, and a half second later the bulkhead collapses and the whole sub is destroyed.
its missleading :) either it can be fixed or it cant, now if it says it can be fixed and shows progress, then when i get it repaired i expect it to work again not blow up.

i remember having systems outright destroyed in SHIII and it was very obvious they were broken.
in this its really not. maybe thats where the problem lies ?

[walsh2509]

The damage I have had the DC fix , though it may not have been as bad as the type you had, but it is annoying that there is no repair time showing. And I just had a thought, the if the damage is that bad and the sub is going to go under, they might have put in an Abandon ship button. Then an after cut scene of us in your live rafts, I take it we have them on board?:D

[WFGood]

Perhaps it seems a little misleading, but could it be even more realistic. Damage repair at sea, especially for hull breaches or damaged bulkheads cannot return it to its initial state. Leaks can be stopped and wood shoring added, but in a submarine they lack the machine shops and such to make detailed repairs. (I am not saying this is the case, but it does seem more realistic in that sense.)

[stabiz]

I have yet to survive damage, actually. And the interface is clearly much better in SH3.

[Onkel Neal]

THE DAMMAGE CONTROL SECTION DOSE NOT WORK! I had a depth charge go off in my face and it dammaged my tubes. I had a DC party try to fix them. THEY DID NOTHING!!!! :damn:

UBI! WHERE NOT BETA TESTERS!!!!!!!! :damn:

Maybe thoose toobs were dammaged beyonnd repare...? Did tehy work after you had a reffit?

[WilhelmSchulz.]

Confremed!

I had some dammaged deck gear(Deck gun and flack guns) and the bar didint move! They where only lightly dammaged. The crew did nothing. :damn:

[stabiz]

:rotfl:

But we should go easy here, maybe Wilhelm has writing/reading difficulties. (I dont know the wording in English, so hope I dont offend anyone)

[Cakewalk]

My crew, oddly enough, also never seems to repair a damaged deck gun... although it still works fine when I use it myself.

[fidget]

2 things you need to do. First, staff up the damage control team at the crew management screen. I just yank the guys off the torpedo crews. Second, hit the 'Damage Control Team' enable button under the 'Sub Management' Section. It may not be realistic, but these guys were able to fix pressure hull damage with critical flooding along with a bunch of other stuff in a day. Oh, and remember to put the torpedo crews back on at the torpedos when they get the job done (or whevever you pulled them from).

[WilhelmSchulz.]

2 things you need to do. First, staff up the damage control team at the crew management screen. I just yank the guys off the torpedo crews. Second, hit the 'Damage Control Team' enable button under the 'Sub Management' Section. It may not be realistic, but these guys were able to fix pressure hull damage with critical flooding along with a bunch of other stuff in a day. Oh, and remember to put the torpedo crews back on at the torpedos when they get the job done (or whevever you pulled them from).
I did that but they didint do anything. :-?

[TheSatyr]

For those who are dieing after repairing a bulkhead,it could be like in SH3,where damage affected your maximum depth.

It could be that you were too deep for the repaired bulkhead to hold up to the pressure. Next time,try going up to periscope depth and see if the ship still sinks or not.

[McBeck]

Confremed!

I had some dammaged deck gear(Deck gun and flack guns) and the bar didint move! They where only lightly dammaged. The crew did nothing. :damn: Yup...Iv seen that too.
Tried to put repair crew in...they did nothing.
The bar said that it took 40 sec. to repair...that didnt change..

Oh....and the deckgun and Flak worked anyway?!

[HKLE]

I have yet to survive damage, actually. And the interface is clearly much better in SH3.

I fully agree. I still am not used to the "table" like appearance of crew management. I miss SH3 style on this dearly. In SH3, you saw immediately, where the damage was, what to do and how much time to end.

I had a message "boat damaged" during an air raid and never saw the damage itself. I put some guys into maintenance crew, ordered them to repair whatever damage there was - no action proposed in the appropriate window.

Deck gun, Flak symbols where blue ?? (Is this the damage ? Or was that the symbol's colour before too ?)

[JScones]

THE DAMMAGE CONTROL SECTION DOSE NOT WORK! I had a depth charge go off in my face and it dammaged my tubes. I had a DC party try to fix them. THEY DID NOTHING!!!! :damn:

UBI! WHERE NOT BETA TESTERS!!!!!!!! :damn:

Maybe thoose toobs were dammaged beyonnd repare...? Did tehy work after you had a reffit?
ROFL. :rotfl: :rotfl: :rotfl:

[shmall]

I have yet to survive damage, actually. And the interface is clearly much better in SH3.


I agree about the interface, however I have survived floodings a few times :)
Crew have managed to pump out both forward and aft torp rooms from complete flooding,....I love this sim :)


Simon

[partyboy]

My feeling is it's a combination of undocumented functions and bugs. Damage control is certainly fiddly, but sometimes things just refuse to be repaired for unexplainable reasons, or are repaired and keep breaking for no reason.

[Ducimus]

After a tinsy bit of experimentation, im almost inclined to think that things are DESTROYED all to easily. I noticed that when an item is damaged, theres a vertical red bar. Some bars are 50%, others are 0%. My thought is everything on the boat is too fragile.


I noticed that alot of stuff that would normally be in the zones.cfg is seems to be acutally in the various files located at sh4\Data\UPCData\UPCUnitsData\

From what ive looked at, my hope that if one was to increase the hitpoints, that maybe these problems would go away. Just a thought.

[Driftwood]

I posted my damage control trouble in another thread. I'm having the same thing happen. Manual says (pg 80) that the crew will begin repairs of any damage in their area. The damage control team you put together should increase the speed with which damage is repaired. But those damage indicator bars (in red) never move. :cry:

[Liszt_]

I have yet to survive damage, actually. And the interface is clearly much better in SH3.

I agree about the interface, however I have survived floodings a few times :)
Crew have managed to pump out both forward and aft torp rooms from complete flooding,....I love this sim :)


Simon

To get a compartment that has flooding under control - the main pump needs to be functioning correct? I had flooding under control in the forward torp. Looked about knee hight. I decided to go to periscope to continue repairs and I sank like a rock.

WTF?

[DJSatane]

Entire crew management system seems either broken of nullified, back in SH3 when i right clicked on compartment it would auto assign people there, so far I tried various things in SH4 and no avail. Further, damage control doesnt work at all as far as I can tell. I have to confirm on this. It seems to me damage control screen actually has less information than SH3 had...

Btw, I love when a crewmember is asleep and you move him out of that compartment, any crewmember you replace him with will automatically sleep too...lol I guess its a SLEEP DISEASE.

[Ducimus]

After a bit of testing (IE crashed dived in shallow waters, sat on the bottom with high compression, diving to crush depth and staying there tell things broke, or just plain ole beaching the boat to incur damage), ive concluded that Damage control DOES work.

But you have to do a couple things first.

1.) Assign a damage control crew
2.) cilck the button to send them to work.

Until those two things are done, nothing will happen.

Three observations:

a.) The red vertical bar next to a component seems to reflect the level of damage. The lower the red bar is, the less damaged the item is. When the verticle red bar is nearly to the bottom, its almost done being repaired.

b.) Repairs seem to take a long time to complete as compared to say, Stock SH3. It seems the devs took a more realsitic approach to repair times

c.) catastrpohic damage seems to be just that, catastrophic. If you get a massive bomb hit from a plane, or stay at crush depth too long, doesn't seem to matter what you do, your sunk. I make this observation based on upping the hitpoints of various compartments and equipment. Even with a tougher sub, doesnt matter.




ON that note, ive created this test modlet if anyone wants to give it a whirl. All it does is.
a.) doubles thie hitpoints on various equipment (IE, 100 hps changed to 200 hitpoints)
b.) increases hitpoints on various comparments. For example i noticed some compartments were listed as having 200 hitpoints where in SH3/GWX they would have 400 htpoints.

So what you have here, is basically in theory, a tougher submarine, and less equipment being destroyed (destroyed means it cannot be repaired):
http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/Sub_equipment_test.7z

[Onkel Neal]

Well done :up:

So, it dose works after all...

[Ducimus]

Oh yeah, on another note

If your main pump gets destroyed and you've taken on enough water to alter your boyancy to negative, your hosed. No pump, no water removal.

Im also theorizing that if you have major damage to a bulkhead (im guessing this means you have a big hole with water coming in), combined with a wrecked main pump, kiss it bye bye.

[CCIP]

Great, why don't I see the modlet on the mods forum? It's a great idea. I remember increasing hitpoints for RUb in the same way based on gouldjg's research for SHIII, and it did work out quite well overall back in the day.

I also think that the damage and repair system works, works quite well, and actually works better than in SHIII when you get down to it. So far I've been able to manage repairs far more efficiently.

One thing that does tick me off is that repairs are NOT stopped by silent running as in SHIII. They should be.

[AVGWarhawk]

Thanks Ducimus. I have experience just what you stated to do. I should know. I get blown to bottom every patrol and spend most of my time repairing my sub/uboat;). Yes, repair times are more realistic now.:yep:

[FIREWALL]

2 things you need to do. First, staff up the damage control team at the crew management screen. I just yank the guys off the torpedo crews. Second, hit the 'Damage Control Team' enable button under the 'Sub Management' Section. It may not be realistic, but these guys were able to fix pressure hull damage with critical flooding along with a bunch of other stuff in a day. Oh, and remember to put the torpedo crews back on at the torpedos when they get the job done (or whevever you pulled them from).

And while your doing all that you'll be heading for the bottom and end of
game.:)

[Ducimus]

Great, why don't I see the modlet on the mods forum?


I guess i undevalued it. I just sort of threw it together in about 15-20 mins, and ran some damage control tests with it. I didn't want to make a big deal out of it i guess. I'll post it in the mod forums if you think it should be.

edit:
ok i posted it. Happy now? :88) :lol:

[fidget]

Quote:
Originally Posted by fidget
2 things you need to do. First, staff up the damage control team at the crew management screen. I just yank the guys off the torpedo crews. Second, hit the 'Damage Control Team' enable button under the 'Sub Management' Section. It may not be realistic, but these guys were able to fix pressure hull damage with critical flooding along with a bunch of other stuff in a day. Oh, and remember to put the torpedo crews back on at the torpedos when they get the job done (or whevever you pulled them from).


And while your doing all that you'll be heading for the bottom and end of
game.:)
Well, at least you'll be busy so maybe it will take your mind off of your imminent demise :)

[stabiz]

Thanks, Ducimus!

[Driftwood]

If DC is working can someone please explain to me what I'm doing wrong? I've got a DC party of nothing but torpedo men working on fixing my damaged aft tubes, over a period of days (using time compression). The damage bar (and it's numerical value) never improves. I am, of course, assuming that an item is repairable if it's red bar isn't maxed out.

On another note, is there a better game reference than the printed manual? It really doesn't explain the mechanics (no pun intended) about how DC works.

[phloon]

Here's the thing I think some people are missing. They way the manual is worded, and from what I've seen in my own experience, you don't need to have dedicated damage control people. If there is damage in the forward torpedo room, for instance, the people in that room will automatically start repairs. Having dedicated damage control personnel is supposed to help speed up repairs which are already taking place.

That being said, if you find that damage never repairs it may be due to the component in question being destroyed completely.

Also, there seems to be some weird bug or misunderstood feature which causes damaged equipment to break again after being repaired. This is most commonly seen with the crew death problem and may or may not be related (though I'd love to get to the bottom of that issue).

[Onkel Neal]

Hmmm.. Good point.

BTW, has anyone experiened this? When being depth charged at 200 feet, I saw the game had a few crewmen assigned to the deckgun and AA guns. I assumed that meant they were in the sub, but assigned to the guns if we surfaced. After a few close ash cans, they died! A glitch? Note to self: when under DC attack, move the gunners to the damage control slots….

[Ducimus]

one thing i suspect is that enviormental factors now effect the health of the crew.

For example, laying on the bottom with high TC on (usually a good way to get some damage), i noticed the engines took damage, and a bit later, some crewman in the engine rooms lost a few points of health. When conditions in the compartment improved, so did their health.

Another note going through some of the associated files, there's some exposurefactor variable of some sort.

[stabiz]

Got bombed ten minutes ago, and lost my observation periscope (completely red bar), and damaged conning tower, radar, AA, etc. So I start fixing after shooting down the bugger. Everything gets fixed except the deck gun, which still works, by the way. Suddenly my attack periscope is destroyed too, with nothing in the vicinity. Then my radar goes red again, and suddenly people start dying like flies.

This bug is a killer.

[Driftwood]

To my way of thinking, a piece of equipment is not destroyed unless it's red bar is maxed out. Therefore it stands to reason that if the "damage bar" is not full, then some progress should be seen regarding it's repair over the passage of time. I agree with phloon that the manual's wording regarding DC flat out states that your people will begin repairs with or without the DC party. This is sounding more and more like a bug to me. :hmm:

P.S. I'm still loving the sim. It will take some time for Ubi to get all this stuff sorted out.

[shmall]

c.) catastrpohic damage seems to be just that, catastrophic. If you get a massive bomb hit from a plane, or stay at crush depth too long, doesn't seem to matter what you do, your sunk. I make this observation based on upping the hitpoints of various compartments and equipment. Even with a tougher sub, doesnt matter.




Yeah my crew just spent hours fixing the sub so that all the red markers where gone, good I thought, at last I can dive, dropped slowly to periscope depth but it just kept going, no matter how many times I did an emergency blow, dropped all the way to 1182 feet before crushing? lol.....


Simon

[-Pv-]

When you take serious damage there is a factor that's not shown- Structural Damage.

In SH3 there was a percentage display of the hull that resulted from taking too much damage. Even though the crew was able to repair internal damage, they could not repair external damage. If you take a hit or hits that cause you to lose bulkheads and flooding, you also have external structural damage.

The way this was modeled in SH3, if you got bulkhead damage, although you could stop the leak and shore up the crack with a timber, the hull remained weakened. Once surfaced you cannot submerge again. You must make a run for it to the nearest port for repair.

"Here's the thing I think some people are missing. They way the manual is worded, and from what I've seen in my own experience, you don't need to have dedicated damage control people."

I think this is a misinterpretation of a fine point. Although the crew on station WILL begin MINOR repairs to save their skin, they are GREATLY assisted by the dedicated repair crew. The more skill they have, the faster the repair. I keep them assigned in all high risk situations and when I'm dedicated to combat, I issue the Battle Stations command which places ALL the crew on station for arming, repairs, and sensing. I'm careful not to keep them that way unnecessarily.

It would not be realistic if you could repair and recover from ALL damage. After all, over 40 of our WWII boats were lost in the Pacific despite being manned by the best crews the Navy could produce. Getting sunk once in a while will teach you good attack and evasion technique and how to measure your risk against gain. There are LOTS of targets. "Know when to hold them, know when to show them, know when to walk away, know when to run."
-Pv-

[Dustyboats]

Oh boy....Did it take a lot of working out!!! Eventually with a crew loaded into Damage Control Team; selecting priorities from the damage panels; activating the team from icon;all was repaired.....however I found it quite amusing that the after ends were not pumped out until repair to bulkhead was done.....this may sound logical to you...but in practice the pumps, buckets and wardroom half pint cut glass beer mugs were the first things to start bailing out with at one time in my life! The other observed thing was the ENORMOUS amount of time it took.......Dusty

[nvdrifter]

Yes people. The days of the SH3 instant 2 minute repair times are long gone (thankfully). Now repairs take much, much longer. This is more realistic and fun in my opinion. If anyone doesn't want longer, more realistic repair times, all you have to do is uncheck it in the gameplay options. Please don't encourage the dev team to nerf the longer repair times in the next patch by starting threads like this. Please don't do that. :roll:

[Skweetis]

Aye aye! No NERFS, just fixes for the broken stuff....

The only thing that terrifies me about the popularity of SH4 right now, is that the more Simulator/Hardcore SubSiimmers are now heavily out numbered by the more casual crowd....

NERF stuff if you have to to open it to more casual players, but give me the option to unNERF it, cause Im looking for Pucker Factor 9.5.

P's & Q's Ubi!

:D

[Lawndart]

This is the best thread I have read in teh long time. I'm not worried about "nurfs" if they do we can mod it back for the hardcore minority.

BUT, the REAL problem with damage control is it's unituitive. This thread has systematicly created a logical explination, even accepting some bugs in the process. But its so increadably unintuative and lacking in feedback. Realisum is one thing, putting it into the context of a game is something else.

I would LOVE for SH3 damage interface with the realistic repair times. Even if the % was completely unrealistic, I prefered not to discover my boat was 10% before I tried to go to perescope depth. Trial and error to that saverity isn't fun... especially with a fragel load/save system.

At the very least just document it so we better understand that repairning a sub while submerged is like putting a cast on a broken arm from inside the body...

[DiveMonkey]

Here's my scenario, Presser Hull breached, forward torpedo room flooding! I'm sinking like a rock...200ft...250ft...300ft.

I'm in a 60% nose down dive strait for the bottom!

Emergency revers!...Blow ballast!

My descent begin to slow, I man all repair teams with the best from all categories, and my most experience bridge officers.

350ft......400ft.........425...........400ft :up:

I've stopped the dive and even gained on it a little...I've bout some time.

My repair crews are working over time to save their arses.
I could blow a second or even third time to reach the surface but ANY FORWARD speed will send me plummeting to the bottom all over again!

Three hrs later with all enemy long gone I surface my boat :up:

ars first! :yep:

it may be a bug, but what I've seen so far is any sinking in deep water sends you nose first at about 60deg.
Full revers and blow ballast can buy some time, and even save your boat :)

[Dustyboats]

Having been in a real life situation of flooding when dived it was actually good to see that the INSTANT RECOVERY in SH3 was done away with in SH4. However the point still stands "Pumps were in action FIRST as was a lot of internal trimming of the boat using O tanks and blowing main vents a touch" (Oh and buckets were used to say nothing of anything that would soak up sea water after the event!) As a game however my point was to express the longer (and quite rightly so) time it took in SH4 as apposed to the game in SH3/GWX1.02........So there!!!! Do not please modify these events.

[nikimcbee]

My feeling is it's a combination of undocumented functions and bugs. Damage control is certainly fiddly, but sometimes things just refuse to be repaired for unexplainable reasons, or are repaired and keep breaking for no reason.

I think the damage control is pretty bad. This needs to get fixed somehow! I finally got damaged, had flooding, repaired the pump, stopped flooding. Then I dove to periscope depth, but instead, my sub sank like a rock to >600 feet, then I died (I'm in a S-class:rotfl: :rotfl: ). No, I did not have the time compression on.:dead: I sank so fast it wasn't funny (maybe 10 seconds)

[partyboy]

one thing i suspect is that enviormental factors now effect the health of the crew.

For example, laying on the bottom with high TC on (usually a good way to get some damage), i noticed the engines took damage, and a bit later, some crewman in the engine rooms lost a few points of health. When conditions in the compartment improved, so did their health.

Another note going through some of the associated files, there's some exposurefactor variable of some sort.
Maybe this is the functionality that is causing the enevitable deaths for crews on damaged decks?

(For those that don't know, there seems to be a bug where if your deck is damaged, any crew on it or placed there will start to lose health until they die. And in my experience, the deck can never fully be repaired. Sometimes it goes 'grey' but then out of nowhere it becomes damaged again and eats your crew.)

[ccruner13]

and why do some of my crew members stay at the same health level after ending my patrol?

[McBeck]

Can anybody make a step by step guide to this?

[nattydread]

I had my first damage in game, I had my radio reciever damaged and my main pump damaged. The were both fixed in about 1 hour.

[shad43]

Besides the crew injury bug I think the DC works ok, but it's in dire need of a
structural indicator on the DC panel, I too have experienced the "got damaged
repaired damage dove to peri depth and died thing" and I think its because the hull is no longer at 100 percent, if there were some sort of visual indicator to tell you its
not safe to dive it would be great.

[phloon]

and why do some of my crew members stay at the same health level after ending my patrol?

Well, if I had to guess, I'd say it's because they're dead.

[ccruner13]

and why do some of my crew members stay at the same health level after ending my patrol?

Well, if I had to guess, I'd say it's because they're dead.

lol yea i took a couple dead guys back out on patrol once but these ones werent hehe

[stabiz]

A couple? I had at least 15 dead guys on my last patrol. (When I left Pearl) :rotfl:Every once in a while my sub stopped, so I had to wake up the living, to throw the dead out of the command room.

[John Channing]

Every once in a while my sub stopped, so I had to wake up the living, to throw the dead out of the command room.

Sounds a lot like where I work!

JCC

[Redwine]

Yes people. The days of the SH3 instant 2 minute repair times are long gone (thankfully).
Correct and agree...

Now repairs take much, much longer. This is more realistic and fun in my opinion.
Agree...

Please don't encourage the dev team to nerf the longer repair times in the next patch by starting threads like this. Please don't do that. :roll:
Agree...


The problem is the time to flood is much smaller than time to repair... it is easy to solve.

i was looking this with a friend who has the same problem, when we take damage wich cause flooding, sub sinks as a rock, with no posibility to do anything to repair it.

What i done...

1]
At first i made the same changes in depth chrages made for SH3, a lethal radius of 40 seems to be unrealistic...

This not solve the problem but reduce the probability to take lethal damage.

2]
To check as near the depth charges explodes, i had increased the underwater visibility, i increase it up to 50m, so i have good visibility at the initial external camera position, so i can check as far from the hull they explode and as much damage they produced...

3]
Then i increased the Hit Points and Armor for all rooms.

But this not solve the problem, you have a reduce probability of to take lethal damage, but when you take flood.... you sinks as a rock.

Note SH3 has very higher values than SH4, and this tweaked file.

4]
Looking the damage and crew control screen/atation into the sim, if you put the mouse over the name of the room, a pop up shows you Time to repair, and Time to Flood.

Time to flood was always small, it was near 2 minutes, and time to repair was always high, when a lethal damage was taked, the time to repair was 40 minuts, 50 minutes, even 59 minutes....

If the time to flood is 2 minutes, and the time to repair is 59 minutas, you always will die...

So i take the files and decide to increase the time to flood.

It was 120... 120 waht, minutes, seconds, hours ?

Well it looks to be 120 seconds... according with the 2 minutes showed in the pop up little screen.

Then i decide to rise up them to a same value as the long repair times... i increase the flooding time up to one hour, 3600 seconds.

Then the repair times and the flooding time are in concordance.

I thnik so, the 120 value is itended so, when you have a hul perforation, you are done, and you can do nothing...

5]
The test...

I saw to my friend, now it is posible your sub become undestructible, because the time to flood will be well covered by the time to repair.

We played some missions, now with the tweaked depth charges, they produce lethal damage when they explodes near the sub, not as before, when they was able to kill the sub exploding at 30 meters. Default depth charges have a lthal radius random between 4.5m and 40m, 40 is terrible unrealistic, in SH2 and SH3 we discovered historical information about the mos extensive used depth charge, the 420lb has a lethal radius on a hull of 3/4 inch and 1 inch of about 4m..... for TNT, and this value rise up up to 7m into AMTOLor MINOL at later war times.

This was the lethal radius for the 90 % of the depth charges used by the allies in the atlantic along all the war.

If I am not wrong, Japanese depth charges was not so powerful like the used by allies, but disregard it, just take same values.


6]
Continue the test....

Now the posibility to take a lethal damage was reduced...

Using the increased underwater visibility, we can note the new depth charges value can produce severe damage exploding in example at 6 meters over the deck...

This means the hul can be damaged and perforated when the depth charge explodes at about 8 meters over a hull of a Balao class.

It is too much power for the depth Charge... i think so. But the game randomises the lethal radius and power between 2 values, a lower and a higher value.

Not always you will have the higher lethal radius with the higher explosion power.

First examination, passed... it seems to be too powerful yet, but may be a furter power reduction can make the game so easy.


7]
Then we take attemption to the flooding...

Looking into the smage control...

Now repair times and flood times are more equilibrated... they are similar... so if you put a good repair team into the flooded room, you can control it.

If you have there, wonded, or dead people... you can not control de flood, and ship sinks.

You need to continuously give attempotion to the repair team, and the crew into the flooded room, so the repair time not rise up over the flood time.

If the attack continues.... you can have wonded or dead people, into the repair team, or into the room with flood, the the eficience droops down and the flood wins...

You must to replace continueously the tired, wonded or dead creww to maintain the room eficience... you must to asign a team to repair, and you must to hit, all crew to battlestations...

If you do it, you can control many floods...

In one mission my friend plays, we was able to control 5 floods....

You think the sub is invincible... ? Not...

Sub start to have lot of malfunctions... after the flood number 4, it have lot of problems to manatin a selected depth.

After the flood number 5, it sinks....., we asign a shalower depth, the sub start to rise up its pitch.....

Finally it finished with a 60 degrees of pitch up, and sinks very slowly, we put fank speed to mintain depth.....

The sub stay in 60 degrees pitch up for about one hour or soome like that, most of the time with flank speed..... finally we run out of battery.... the sub was at 189 meters depth....

When batteries gone, was imposible to stops the slow rate of sink, it take many minutes more to rech the crush depth...

Avery slow way to be killed.... almost two of my friends become so happy with this new way to sink.

Of course these settings need more test....

If some you want to test these tweaks files...

Here you have....


Reduced Depth Charges Lethal Radius:

http://files.filefront.com/Depth_Charge_Mod_Stage_1zip/;7239110;/fileinfo.html

http://rapidshare.com/files/23169672/Depth_Charge_Mod_Stage_1__SH_IV_.zip.html


Increased Underwater Visibility :

http://files.filefront.com/Improved_Underwater_Visib1zip/;7239031;/fileinfo.html

http://rapidshare.com/files/23236501/Improved_Underwater_Visibility_Stage_1.zip.html


Tweaked Sub Hit Points, Armor and Flooding Times :

http://files.filefront.com/Tweaked_Zones_Stage_2zip/;7239211;/fileinfo.html

http://rapidshare.com/files/23884493/Tweaked_Zones_Stage_2.zip.html


If you dont like as it works, yu can tweak it your self, just ask me, send me a private message or ask here.... it is the same as in SH3.

Use the Time Traveller MiniTweaker for Depth Charges...

Hexeditor for Underwater visibility.

And Notepad for Hit Points, Armor and Flooding times......

Sorry my bad english please....

:up:

[WilhelmSchulz.]

After a bit of testing (IE crashed dived in shallow waters, sat on the bottom with high compression, diving to crush depth and staying there tell things broke, or just plain ole beaching the boat to incur damage), ive concluded that Damage control DOES work.

But you have to do a couple things first.

1.) Assign a damage control crew
2.) cilck the button to send them to work.

Until those two things are done, nothing will happen.

Three observations:

a.) The red vertical bar next to a component seems to reflect the level of damage. The lower the red bar is, the less damaged the item is. When the verticle red bar is nearly to the bottom, its almost done being repaired.

b.) Repairs seem to take a long time to complete as compared to say, Stock SH3. It seems the devs took a more realsitic approach to repair times

c.) catastrpohic damage seems to be just that, catastrophic. If you get a massive bomb hit from a plane, or stay at crush depth too long, doesn't seem to matter what you do, your sunk. I make this observation based on upping the hitpoints of various compartments and equipment. Even with a tougher sub, doesnt matter.




ON that note, ive created this test modlet if anyone wants to give it a whirl. All it does is.
a.) doubles thie hitpoints on various equipment (IE, 100 hps changed to 200 hitpoints)
b.) increases hitpoints on various comparments. For example i noticed some compartments were listed as having 200 hitpoints where in SH3/GWX they would have 400 htpoints.

So what you have here, is basically in theory, a tougher submarine, and less equipment being destroyed (destroyed means it cannot be repaired):
http://www.ducimus.net/sh4/Sub_equipment_test.7z

I did all that and they still didint do nothing.

[Hans Schultz]

i wish there was a crew specialty for repair like SH3

[Ducimus]

@WilhelmSchulz.
If your expecting damge to be repaired quckly it wont be, as already cited, repair times are much longer now.


@Redwine
I thought about increasing the flood times on the sub model but didnt quite see the need until i read your post here. I have a question though, wasn't there a way to decrease the amount of time it takes to pump out flooding while leaving long repair times intact?

[Redwine]

@Redwine
I thought about increasing the flood times on the sub model but didnt quite see the need until i read your post here. I have a question though, wasn't there a way to decrease the amount of time it takes to pump out flooding while leaving long repair times intact?

Good question, relly i dont know ... may be, but i dont know where it is, i take the easy way, or may be the pump flow is a steady value, and you must to play with the flooding times.. :up:

Today i play a mission... i was catched by de "jap" boys... they give me a hard lesson, many crew wonded, flood in "4" compartements... repair times between 30 and 50 minutes... finally i survive, but in one compartement, all crew was wonded, i was enforced to replace them and some wonded into the reapir team too, to be able to control the flooding in this compartement.

Bulkhead seems to be the hard item to repair, what is this ? The hull or the pressure firewalls ?

[ccruner13]

http://i117.photobucket.com/albums/o49/borschwanger/SH4Img27-3-2007_4.jpg
somehow my damage control team is damaged?? btw this happend before i modded too

[Ducimus]

@redwine.
Theres two pumps in the zone.cfg Ones is XXIpump the other i think is mainpump just search for "pump". Compare the values in SH4 with values from SH3 or SH3/GWX. Try using SH3 pump values if their different and see what happens.

Also check/compare the UC files (the new ones) its possible the game uses those values over the ones in the zone.cfg

[U-Bones]

@Redwine
I thought about increasing the flood times on the sub model but didnt quite see the need until i read your post here. I have a question though, wasn't there a way to decrease the amount of time it takes to pump out flooding while leaving long repair times intact?
Good question, relly i dont know ... may be, but i dont know where it is, i take the easy way, or may be the pump flow is a steady value, and you must to play with the flooding times.. :up:

Today i play a mission... i was catched by de "jap" boys... they give me a hard lesson, many crew wonded, flood in "4" compartements... repair times between 30 and 50 minutes... finally i survive, but in one compartement, all crew was wonded, i was enforced to replace them and some wonded into the reapir team too, to be able to control the flooding in this compartement.

Bulkhead seems to be the hard item to repair, what is this ? The hull or the pressure firewalls ?

Redwine I appreciate this, I was going to muck about with flooding a bit and now I don't have to yet. I was already running a slightly tweaked Ducimus FTT and will be adding 3600 flooding to the compartments.

Pump flow is steady, and if modifiable, is outside of zones.cfg. So yes, playing with flooding times is all we have until someone finds mainpump.gpm or similar ;)

Bulkhead is partition between compartments, interior wall in a manner of speaking.

[walsh2509]

http://i149.photobucket.com/albums/s48/mefw/SH4/SH4Img27-3-2007_22-3.jpg

[-Pv-]

"...I think the damage control is pretty bad. This needs to get fixed somehow! I finally got damaged, had flooding, repaired the pump, stopped flooding. Then I dove to periscope depth, but instead, my sub sank like a rock to >600 feet, then I died (I'm in a S-class:rotfl: :rotfl: ). No, I did not have the time compression on.:dead: I sank so fast it wasn't funny (maybe 10 seconds)..."

Frankly what's missing is the hull damage percentage we had in SH3. Because you don't SEE any effects of damage and everything APPEARS repaired, you think you can dive.

If we had that piece of feedback returned to SH4 you would see it's NOT safe to descend again. This is no different from SH3. In that sim you also could not dive after bulkhead damage. This is unchanged and not a bug but an historicaly true feature. When SH3 came out, the devs advised everyone when you get this kind of damage DO NOT SUBMERGE again. This is unchanged in SH4. You have HULL damage that cannot be repaired and it breaks up when you submit the sub to hull pressure again. You have repeired internal damage (what the crew has access to while submerged) but you still have EXTERNAL damage that requires a shipyard to repair.
-Pv-

[Redwine]

@redwine.
Theres two pumps in the zone.cfg Ones is XXIpump the other i think is mainpump just search for "pump". Compare the values in SH4 with values from SH3 or SH3/GWX. Try using SH3 pump values if their different and see what happens.

Also check/compare the UC files (the new ones) its possible the game uses those values over the ones in the zone.cfg
Thanks for info... i didnt note the new .upc files. :up:

Redwine I appreciate this, I was going to muck about with flooding a bit and now I don't have to yet. I was already running a slightly tweaked Ducimus FTT and will be adding 3600 flooding to the compartments.
3600 gives you more equilibrate values between repair and flooding times.

Pump flow is steady, and if modifiable, is outside of zones.cfg. So yes, playing with flooding times is all we have until someone finds mainpump.gpm or similar ;)
.gpm ? where are those files ?

There are new files to tweak in this game !

Bulkhead is partition between compartments, interior wall in a manner of speaking.
Understand, the pressure firewalls... many thanks. :up:


somehow my damage control team is damaged?? btw this happend before i modded too
Interesting... and there is no body wonded. That produce a degradstion into the repair team effciency...


@ Walsh2509.... thanks ! :up:

[Ducimus]

@ redwine
Don't worry the files are in clear text.

[Redwine]

Frankly what's missing is the hull damage percentage we had in SH3. Because you don't SEE any effects of damage and everything APPEARS repaired, you think you can dive.

If we had that piece of feedback returned to SH4 you would see it's NOT safe to descend again. This is no different from SH3. In that sim you also could not dive after bulkhead damage. This is unchanged and not a bug but an historicaly true feature. When SH3 came out, the devs advised everyone when you get this kind of damage DO NOT SUBMERGE again. This is unchanged in SH4. You have HULL damage that cannot be repaired and it breaks up when you submit the sub to hull pressure again. You have repeired internal damage (what the crew has access to while submerged) but you still have EXTERNAL damage that requires a shipyard to repair.
-Pv-

Yes... that is true... the hull not in conditions to dive must to appears with a red bar... so you can know you cant dive.

[Redwine]

@ redwine
Don't worry the files are in clear text.

Thanks... :up:

[waste gate]

I wanted to drop you a line WilhelmSchulz and tell you how much I appreciate you clearing my view of the sub. It's like the lightbulb going on. I really enjoy the view. Thank you!!

[H00K]

I'm new here, so don't hurt me :doh:

Anyway, I have noticed I have a tendency to stay in Silent Running and lo and behold, noone will repair damage when you are in running silent...Don't know why I didn't figure that out sooner, but once I got off Silent Running, damage got repaired pretty quickly, even without a dedicated damage control team..

-H00K

[castorp345]

welcome aboard, H00K
:)

[Seal]

I was hit by an aircraft round in the AA gun, barely damaging it. I send a repair team which sucessfully repaired the thing. However, no matter how many times I repair the AA gun, when I try to submerge I get the warning again 'the AA is getting damage', the sub enters in a uncontrolled dive, engines stop, water enters and the sub goes directly to the seafloor:damn:

[-Pv-]

"... Bulkhead seems to be the hard item to repair, what is this ? The hull or the pressure firewalls ?..."

Bulkheads are the walls between compartments. They are like the studs in the walls of your house. They provide the structual strength of the sub. When they are damaged, the support for the skin of the ship is not as strong. It's like the wind blowing against your house when the wood inside your walls is cracked.
-Pv-

[-Pv-]

"...Don't know why I didn't figure that out sooner, but once I got off Silent Running, damage got repaired pretty quickly, even without a dedicated damage control team..."

Yup. Silent running isn't silent when you have crews banging away on stuff. Was the same way in SH3. You have to turn off SR or even with a repairable sub and assigned and enabled crew, no repair. Of course you have to way this against the enemy hearing your efforts and renewing the attack.
-Pv-

[9th_cow]

i finally realised why i always died in situations where i thought i should not.
time to flooding will show as 22 minutes, and time to repair as 28.
swapping in fit crew for the injured in that compartment has no effect.
turning the damage controll team on and off. increasing or decreasing theyre numbers has no effect either.
even if you only sink to something like 50 feet and repair all the damage, you die after 22 minutes anyway.

basically im guessing its meant to be catastrophic damage. and anything you do after receiving it is pointless.

however in one other occaision i must have received light damage to the hull and the crew were actually able to stop the flooding. my sub behaved fine after this down to depths of 200 feet.

it seems that in the first instance. nothing what so ever has any effect on flooding.
in the end i turned the damage controll team off. came off battle stations.
flooding in 22 time to repair still 28.

so not being able to surface i sit on the sea for 22 minutes, and die.
i can only assume some damage is meant to be so devastating that you cannot repair it.

those are some powerfull AA machine guns on the backs of those cargo ships...

[ccruner13]

heh yea and ive unloaded my entire stock of aa ammo on a freighter without one explosion..out of torps and deckgun what else but try to detonate something..random crap explodes all the time

[StandingCow]

Both my prop shafts were badly damaged... they would repair slowly... then go back to the original dmg.. I couldnt turn the sub either.. I thought that was odd.

[bruschi sauro]

I think the damage control not work very well.... i'm waiting a patch... a big patch:cry: thi simulation is ..... I have not words:down:

[Redwine]

"... Bulkhead seems to be the hard item to repair, what is this ? The hull or the pressure firewalls ?..."

Bulkheads are the walls between compartments. They are like the studs in the walls of your house. They provide the structual strength of the sub. When they are damaged, the support for the skin of the ship is not as strong. It's like the wind blowing against your house when the wood inside your walls is cracked.
-Pv-

Thanks... :up:, the problem was the traslation.

[Redwine]

i finally realised why i always died in situations where i thought i should not.

time to flooding will show as 22 minutes, and time to repair as 28.
swapping in fit crew for the injured in that compartment has no effect.
turning the damage controll team on and off. increasing or decreasing theyre numbers has no effect either.

even if you only sink to something like 50 feet and repair all the damage, you die after 22 minutes anyway.

basically im guessing its meant to be catastrophic damage. and anything you do after receiving it is pointless.

it seems that in the first instance. nothing what so ever has any effect on flooding.
in the end i turned the damage controll team off. came off battle stations.
flooding in 22 time to repair still 28.

so not being able to surface i sit on the sea for 22 minutes, and die.
i can only assume some damage is meant to be so devastating that you cannot repair it.
Correct... i sopupose those was slow but lethal damages.

I think so the team intoduce a more "long way" to die than in SH3.

The main problem is, the lethal damages occurs near to always you was hited.

The problem is you receive a lethal damage by depth charges exploding so far, unrealistically far, and the damage is near to always lethal.

I think so it reduces a little bit the game interest, the lethal radius of the depth charges is too big, and damages near to always finish into an uncontrolable flooding.

Then i mede the cnages i described into the page 3 of this topic... if you want to fix this behaviour, just use the files i put there in the page 3 of this topic.

You will have lot of damage, but not all floodings will be lethal, most of floodings become controlable now.

:up:

[tater]

I was showing a friend SH4 last night, and tried the quick mission to get Yamato in port. I ran in on the surface at flank, shooting up stuff, lol. A DD started shooting at me, I fought him with the deck gun. I sank a fleet DD, and I got hit at least as many times as he hit me. The DC screen was covered with red. If anything I think the player sub is too hard to kill considerig the amount of abuse on the surface I can take, that or the DDs are way way too fragile. Likely it's a combination of both. I actually repaired everything after fighting my way in on the surface and sinking 2 DDs. The 2d I put a fish in as it tried to run me down from dead astern. It slowed to a stop a couple hundred yards from ramming me, lol.

Regarding DC damage, how is it with fully realistic IJN DCs in place? With the real sink rate (very very slow) and weak charge? I bet with the DCs fixed to realistic values much of that damage just wouldn't happen since they'd almost need to contatct the hull to make the kind of damage seen normally in vanilla SH4.

tater

[Redwine]

I was showing a friend SH4 last night, and tried the quick mission to get Yamato in port. I ran in on the surface at flank, shooting up stuff, lol. A DD started shooting at me, I fought him with the deck gun. I sank a fleet DD, and I got hit at least as many times as he hit me. The DC screen was covered with red. If anything I think the player sub is too hard to kill considerig the amount of abuse on the surface I can take, that or the DDs are way way too fragile. Likely it's a combination of both. I actually repaired everything after fighting my way in on the surface and sinking 2 DDs. The 2d I put a fish in as it tried to run me down from dead astern. It slowed to a stop a couple hundred yards from ramming me, lol.

Regarding DC damage, how is it with fully realistic IJN DCs in place? With the real sink rate (very very slow) and weak charge? I bet with the DCs fixed to realistic values much of that damage just wouldn't happen since they'd almost need to contatct the hull to make the kind of damage seen normally in vanilla SH4.

tater

Interesting, sure we need more experience, may be the sub is to hard under ships shells, but under the original default depth charges is too fragile... almost the depth charge are too powerful in radius.

May be you was hited by a low power shell ? I was reached one time by a single shell and when dive, my sub was losed...

[U-Bones]

Tank like behavior in Surface engagements are a balance hangover from the SH3 engine. Try simply surfacing near 2 or 3 DD's and clicking your stopwatch in both SH3 and SH4 and you will see what I mean. The amount of abuse they take, while still maintaining a claim to be called a sub, is incredible. IRL, a hit or two and they would just be another leaky boat at best.

In SH3 I dealt with it by simply playing submerged, it remains to be seen how things shake out in SH4.

[ccruner13]

so my radar kept getting broke more and more causing a ton of people to get dead. well i didnt have my dmaage control team online anymore because it was my makeshift sick bay. so now my radar got destroyed. I DONT HAVE A RADAR SYSTEM ON MY BOAT

[D'biter]

a DD rammed me and blew up, he did almost nothing to me


WTF?!?!?!?!?!?

[AVGWarhawk]

a DD rammed me and blew up, he did almost nothing to me


WTF?!?!?!?!?!?

This would happen in SH3. Seems to be a carry over. Someone in the wonderful modding department will mod out that issue be sure.

[letterboy1]

Also, there seems to be some weird bug or misunderstood feature which causes damaged equipment to break again after being repaired. This is most commonly seen with the crew death problem and may or may not be related (though I'd love to get to the bottom of that issue).

That just occured to me, too. I kept posting here about repairs made during a refit magically got damaged again. If the items were destroyed, then the bug is not that the condition went back to "Damaged," the bug is that it showed as repaired in the first place! :D I guess it only makes sense that refit facilities like Midway aren't necessarily outfitted with new periscopes and artillery. :D I guess some damage requires putting in to port.

[tater]

In the Yamato mission (the quick mission one), I was hammered by multiple DDs. Literalyl every single item was red, the only variability was how red. There is just no way I should have sank him before he sank me on the surface. I could see if he wasn't hitting me, but he was.

You are probably right regarding the IJN DCs though since we know they are something like 2X more powerful than they were in RL.

[minsc_tdp]

I've added many damage and repair related bugs into BZ:

http://sh4bugs.com/buglist.cgi?quicksearch=repair

If one of the scripts/mods here fixes any of these, please note that on the bugs and also set the status to something other than NEW

[-Pv-]

I have some observations based on testing the persistant AA Gun damage behavoir.

Over the course of several hours I purposely encountered attacks from zeros.
Invariably I took on minor damage and the flack gun was hit every time (planes attacked with machine guns only as near as I could tell.) I shot a buch of them down before the AA gun went out.

What is necessary to repair ANY gun:
1) Must be on surface.
2) Repair time in the gun rollover text must elapse WITH GUN CREW ASSIGNED AND ACTIVATED. The active gun crew repairs the gun.
3) In the case of the AA gun, it can be kept in operation only about 15 minutes after which it automatically gets damaged again. This is regardless of sea conditions, sub motion, repair crew online, or enemy activity. I suspect this is simply a timer that gets activated in the game to limit the period a compromised gun can function.
4) If a crew member is assigned to the gun (even submerged and the crew is inactive) when the gun goes out, the crew member will get 5% deducted from his health. No crew hit if no assigned crew. Perhaps it hurts the crew when it malfunctions.
5) The AA gun can be re-repaired (as long as points 1-3 above are valid) an endless number of times in 15 minute increments.
6) The total time the assigned crew member is immune from damage by the AA gun malfunction is the repair time plus the operational time(repair+15 min.)

On General damage:
As long as you have damage animation in the 3D internal compartments (sparying water and steam) your diving ability is restricted (not sure by how much.) The persistant animation in the 3D areas is an indication you have persistant, unrepaired damage and the integrity of your boat is compromised.
In some cases I have been able to dive down to 70ft for reasonable periods.

-Pv-

[Krupp]

Hmm. I thought we got ridden the instant-repair feature in sh4. Jap gunboat scored a lucky hit in my Tambor-class boat, right behind the tower. Sonar, bulkhead and quite a lot of equipment were damaged and about dozen crew wounded ( only 1 or 2 points tho).

I cathered the damage control team and ZAP, like less then 10 seconds and everything was fixed, including bulkhead and the pressure hull.

That was a somewhat lame act. Reading posts here and there give me an impression that repairs should take a long time?

[-Pv-]

"...
That was somewhat lame act. Reading posts here and there give an impression that repairs should take a long time?..."

Do you have Realistic Repair Time unchecked?
-Pv-

[Krupp]

-Pv-, realistic repair time is checked. I wonder what's the not-so-realistic repair times are? From matrix?

[tater]

From my observations (realistic repair times checked), damage to the sub seems to be simultaneously too easy to repair and impossible to repair, lol. Too easy as in the example above of mine. I was getting stuff fixed in 1:1 time during a single running engagement with multiple DDs. After I sank a couple, I was fixed up in no time. OTOH, even though totally repaired, any dive at all would force me to blow tanks before I plowed into the bottom in free-fall.

I'm fine with some damage permanently compromising and forcing a careful RTB on the surface, I'd just like to know about it--like having someone in the crew make a report to me: "skipper, the pressure hull damage has been patched, but it won't hold up to a dive at this point, we'll need a drydock for that."

tater

[-Pv-]

I agree a message about unrepairable damage would be helpful.
-Pv-

[Elias999]

I had the exact same issue with my forward tubes. Of course I thought "maybe I just can't fix them because the damage is external", so I pulled into port and refit. They got repaired during the refit but minutes later I received a message "forward tubes damaged sir". Ok fine I was still in range of port so I refit again. This time I made it about 500 nm before they took damage again. Very sad that even simple things like this didn't get fixed before release. I think it just goes to show that large developers push games out so they can start earning cash. But of course we already knew that.

[U-Bones]

I looked at a save file for a S18 that would do tail down at periscope - but was showing no damage.

The savefile shows Damage at 0.54... (to the sub itself - confirmed no compartment or equipment damage). So basically I have a green board but a hull that is at 46%.

It is kinda silly that it exhibits itself as a flooded stern with no leaks.

A weak hull should operate perfectly normal, until you take it too deep.

[-Pv-]

I'm conceding the damage/repair by crew/refit is inconsistantly and confusingly applied.
-Pv-

[Boogie]

I don't have any gripes about the DC system my biggest bugbear is that the actual damage model itself seems FUBAR for example i dived to periscope depth sunk a merchie dived and waited for the escorts to disapear on returning to periscope depth with no damage i haten to add i raised periscope to have a quick nose around my rising periscope was hit by one of the life boats from the merchant i had sunk apart from the over zealous sound effects which made me think i had rammed a battle ship at flank speed my crew went ape screaming that we had flooding then critical flooding and i then promptly found myself crash diving to crush depths at unstoppable speed. WTF...........:damn:

[BooBooLovesAll]

I love silent running at 200 + feet... out of the blue comes in a destroyer, launches his DC with nice accuracy...

I get hit badly, flooding starts... and my dmage control crew stand around with their wrenches up the dairy aire wondering what to do....

Where we all proceed to drop like a rock to davy jones locker... with the final scene being the brass saying that it would be a good idea for me to resign.:88)

I must have had good lungs to get from the depths of the pacific.. and THEN to swim all the way back to Pearl!

I should be in the olympics!:rock:

[AVGWarhawk]

I love silent running at 200 + feet... out of the blue comes in a destroyer, launches his DC with nice accuracy...

I get hit badly, flooding starts... and my dmage control crew stand around with their wrenches up the dairy aire wondering what to do....

Where we all proceed to drop like a rock to davy jones locker... with the final scene being the brass saying that it would be a good idea for me to resign.:88)

I must have had good lungs to get from the depths of the pacific.. and THEN to swim all the way back to Pearl!

I should be in the olympics!:rock:

Were you set up to repair? No silent running? No repairs in silent running. Crews at battle stations? After all, you are in a battle all be it you are on the receiving end and it is pretty much a one way battle. Take your tub to 250 feet:yep: to avoid the DC. Also, direct hit by DC....good luck anyway...your going to need it.

[BooBooLovesAll]

Were you set up to repair? No silent running? No repairs in silent running. Crews at battle stations? After all, you are in a battle all be it you are on the receiving end and it is pretty much a one way battle. Take your tub to 250 feet:yep: to avoid the DC. Also, direct hit by DC....good luck anyway...your going to need it.

Crews were at BB, nuff crew in the "damage control section", no SS.

[AVGWarhawk]

Were you set up to repair? No silent running? No repairs in silent running. Crews at battle stations? After all, you are in a battle all be it you are on the receiving end and it is pretty much a one way battle. Take your tub to 250 feet:yep: to avoid the DC. Also, direct hit by DC....good luck anyway...your going to need it.

Crews were at BB, nuff crew in the "damage control section", no SS.


Read your first post....it says you love silent running. Sure you were not silent running? This is why I asked.:hmm:

[Charlie901]

I'm getting the distinct feeling that the DC in this game is another one of the areas that wasn't properly finished before UBI ordered this title out the door?

Hmmmmm:hmm:

[-Pv-]

It may also be that due to the poor manual, it's not fully understood as are many other things.
-Pv-

[BooBooLovesAll]

Were you set up to repair? No silent running? No repairs in silent running. Crews at battle stations? After all, you are in a battle all be it you are on the receiving end and it is pretty much a one way battle. Take your tub to 250 feet:yep: to avoid the DC. Also, direct hit by DC....good luck anyway...your going to need it.
Crews were at BB, nuff crew in the "damage control section", no SS.

Read your first post....it says you love silent running. Sure you were not silent running? This is why I asked.:hmm:

Well.. once I got hit, I turned off the SS>

I was just saying that having SS on seemed to attract the Destroyer...:hmm::p

[AVGWarhawk]

Were you set up to repair? No silent running? No repairs in silent running. Crews at battle stations? After all, you are in a battle all be it you are on the receiving end and it is pretty much a one way battle. Take your tub to 250 feet:yep: to avoid the DC. Also, direct hit by DC....good luck anyway...your going to need it.
Crews were at BB, nuff crew in the "damage control section", no SS.

Read your first post....it says you love silent running. Sure you were not silent running? This is why I asked.:hmm:
Well.. once I got hit, I turned off the SS>

I was just saying that having SS on seemed to attract the Destroyer...:hmm::p

If unsure, hit SS again and then turn off. Sometimes you get stuck in SS and do not know it. Sometimes the DD get a good fix on you through pinging. Sometimes they get a fix without it which can be two things, magic or the AI are not as dumb as we think.

Anyway, I submerge to 250 feet to 300 feet to avoid the patrol killing DC. When damaged, my crew has repaired the sub. Much longer repair times than SH3 every had with getting modded.

[Spruence M]

Secenrio:

Was Bombed about 12 hours ago, took damage to decoy launcher, no pressure hull damage, no flooding. When I dove to aviod a 2nd bombing, I barely noticed in time to save my boat from crushing, but after making sure that I had effectivly escaped, I made it to shallow water and gave a dive order, my boat sank from stern to bow, and not the other way around... Furthermore, I had no control over depth, either sink streight down from stern, or stay surfaced for Betty to crap on me.

What was wrong here?http://members.cox.net/groundbreaker/dum0.JPG

[Spruence M]

Sorry, I could'nt find out how to post this at the end of the preceding post.

I am having trouble with the Destroyer's AI in Silent Hunter IV. Never had the problem in III, actually, I had installed the MOD to make the AI more intelligent. This time however, I have been playing since day after release, but due to surgery and other playing time restrictions, I have only fit in about 10 patrols, I have not been depth charged more than once in my career. I've been sunk many times by Aircraft, but barely even shot at by Tojo's Tin Cans...

To test this I attacked a convoy on the surface. The first convoy had 6 merchants and 3 escorts. I sank the 3 escorts using my .40 cal deck gun! Then procedeed to destroy the merchants with the rest of the ammo.

I sustained 1 hit from 1 escort. Damged several systems, deisel engines, pressure hull, but was able to repair relativly quickly. That never should have happend. If this would have been a real day, SS-23 would have been at the bottom, permenently.

Only things that I have turned off in the realism are:

Free Floating Camera
Manual Targeting
No Map Contact Update
(It is hard to play laying on my back after surgery)

Is this an issure that is experinced by anyone else?

By The Way: I've been downloading Mods here since SH2. Thank you for your time and effort in creating the forums and MODS, they have breathed life into the Sub games' replaybility.

Matthias Spruence

[Snacko]

[quote=nvdrifter]

Increased Underwater Visibility :

http://files.filefront.com/Improved_Underwater_Visib1zip/;7239031;/fileinfo.html

http://rapidshare.com/files/23236501/Improved_Underwater_Visibility_Stage_1.zip.html
Can you make these work with the Jonesoft Generic Mod Enabler software?

[-Pv-]

Possible flak gun repair solution (patch1.1):

I've seen it reported here and elsewhere that once the flak gun is damaged, after docking at patrol end, starting a new patrol the flak is still damaged. I have not experienced this but I have experienced the gun not staying repaired on patrol.
I noticed it's also tied to weather. In moderate sea I could repair the flak with the AA gun crew member, remove the crew and the flak would damage again in about 15 minutes (I pull the crew to prevent re-injury.) Later when I tried the same technique in flat calm (wind 1 knot and zero knot) the flak would stay repaired for up to an hour. Also, if I chose to use the gun manually with no crew, although it took awhile for the gun to become "ready" I could engage aircraft myself without risking the crew.

I experimented a bit to see what would happen after a refit at Midway. I had an idea to pull into Midway, repair the flak with the crew member, pull the crew out and instantly click the refit. This resulted in the flak still becoming damaged when continuing on to Pearl.

At Pearl I tried the same thing, repaired the flak with the crew then clicked dock. Again, although I cannot claim to have experienced a continued broken flak on starting a new patrol (as I have seen at least one other person report) I've now sailed 5 days without a broken flak. This leads me to conclude:
1) flaks get repaired on a patrol end dock
2) or, convincing the code the flak was repaired before the dock helps
3) or, only patrol end dock repairs flak and not a refit.

In addition, I'll repeat observation above. Weather seems to affect flak re-damage time (maybe speed too?) and regardless of damage, the user-commander can take control of the flak and if you wait long enough, it becomes enabled for manual targeting (crew or no crew.)

We'll see what happens on patch 1.2

-Pv-