View Full Version : help rookie skipper under attack!
help please, im in grid cg 41 off the coast of spain in september of 41 and ive been under attack in my IXB for over 8 hours by 2 destroyer escorts i think they have broken off from there convoy and been after me ever since ive been at 190 meters and none of there charges have been close to my depth but mostly right over top of me, i have been in silent running and changing course every little while but i just cant seem to shake them, and my stealth meter has been red just about the whole time, the attack started at 12:30 and it is now 18:30 can anyone help, i read the best evasive manuver thread but im not attacking a convoy just trying to get survive
if you got full HI%
go down to 250-260
better down there
and just because you're in silent running that doesnt mean they cant find you since silent running only stops all noisy activities
but you will still be able to get detected on sonar unless you go deep (doesnt work in late war)
emtmedic005
02-15-07, 03:14 PM
The key to life is to live yeah so surviving is a huge factor in evasion. Um i just had patrol like urs, except i was north of Ireland. But anyways, i went below there Depth Charge line and i was riged or silent running but i shut off my engines, i was cruising at about 180m and about 45 minutes later the ship went away. be very quiet and hopefully you dont have any flooding or damage cause if your in silent running then your crew wouldnt repair anything.
im at full strenth acccept for the watch tower which is orange and the flack gun that is yellow
aight
dive your boat down there
go to around 210-260
Biggles
02-15-07, 03:18 PM
don't forget that silent running is just taking the speed down to 3 kts. lower it to 1 kts. that used to help ME in -41.....but now when it's May -43 for me.....:damn:
don't forget that silent running is just taking the speed down to 3 kts. lower it to 1 kts. that used to help ME in -41.....but now when it's May -43 for me.....:damn:
how do you lower it to 1 kt?
ah never mind got crushed at 210, should try that earlier next time
there should be a little icon on the side of the speed gauge that allows you to switch to knots and not just the ahead slow and flank stuff:up:
Corsair
02-15-07, 03:28 PM
One important thing for detection is the engines revs. Ideally you don't want more than 100 rpms (gauges in the command room and conning tower) so you switch your engine control dial to speed display and slow down until you get the desired revs. 1 knot is fine. Depending on what game you play at that speed your sub will either maintain depth (stock game) slowly rise (GWX) or slowly sink (NYGM).
emtmedic005
02-15-07, 03:37 PM
Ive read some accounts from U-Boat captains that at first they make noise, like speed up at Full, make repairs then once they r deep they go silent, shutting off all engines and making the crew shut up. This throws off the DDs above, thinking hmm the sub must have sunk.
Keelbuster
02-15-07, 03:46 PM
Silence isn't so important when they have active sonar. Silence is your friend on your approach. When you are escaping, the key is to get distance from your attacker. Do this with flank bursts when he does a DC run. Go fast for longer than it feels comfortable, then drop down to 3kts, and make sure your enemeies are ~180 to you. Then, when you feel like you've opened up a bit of distance (to make the active sonar a little less effective) and you're profile is slim, go silent. And pray. Repeat as necessary, and add a BOLD to the beginning if you can. If you just sit there at 1kts, you'll never get away from them as they can continually get you with active. The trick of going down to 260 is a bit of an exploit - it gets you under the active cone, but it relies on having a really low (perhaps artificiallys so) crush depth. I don't operate under 150, and I rarely even have to go that deep.
Kb
Corsair
02-15-07, 03:58 PM
Silence isn't so important when they have active sonar. Silence is your friend on your approach. When you are escaping, the key is to get distance from your attacker. Do this with flank bursts when he does a DC run. Go fast for longer than it feels comfortable, then drop down to 3kts, and make sure your enemeies are ~180 to you. Then, when you feel like you've opened up a bit of distance (to make the active sonar a little less effective) and you're profile is slim, go silent. And pray. Repeat as necessary, and add a BOLD to the beginning if you can. If you just sit there at 1kts, you'll never get away from them as they can continually get you with active. The trick of going down to 260 is a bit of an exploit - it gets you under the active cone, but it relies on having a really low (perhaps artificiallys so) crush depth. I don't operate under 150, and I rarely even have to go that deep.
Kb
This might work in stock game or if there is only one DD over your head. If using NYGM or GWX and more than one DD, then one will sit there and listen while the other(s) do the attack run and will hear your flank speed burst. (Have been trapped often doing that)
Anyway they don't use active sonar for no reason, and if you're pinged it means you did something wrong... I do also quite often...:D
The only really good tactic is to get away without being detected at all, which is relatively easy during the "happy times", but forces you as the war goes on to shoot from further away and really think twice before making an attack, which I find is better than allowing to shoot at anything that moves in any conditions.;)
PS : going around at high speed will also empty your batteries faster and I find I want to stay under as long as possible until they either run out of DCs or call it quit and get back to their convoy - also why I usually take a general direction 180° from convoy heading.
CaptainAsh
02-15-07, 04:00 PM
Don t forget you re in a game ;) DD will not think you re sunk until you re actually sunk ;)
If I got it right, you stay at a low speed all the process. The thing is, at close range the DD is not gonna listen for you but it s gonna ping for you. As soon as the pings are close of each other, it means the DD is closing on you and have a really good idea of where you are and usualy is ready to **** on your head. No point of staying slow at this point. So pass at flank speed and change course by 40° to 60°, less it s of no use, more and you gonna lost too much speed.
The thing is, as DD is passing over your head to nuke you, he s gonna lost both his ping and his hearing abilities. If it doesn t drop depth charge, keep your speed for no more than 10 sec, then back to real slow and change your heading one more time. If he drop depth charges, keep flank and the new course, if you re deeper than 60 meters it should be enough to avoid them. As soon as the depth charges' explosions stop, go back to real slow and change your course one more time.
The deeper you are, the harder it s gonna be for the DD to reaquire you with ping.
The more DD you got ahead, the less efficient is the technic because you re always gonna have one far enough to be on hydrophone mode and even with depth charges exploding all around, it has a good shot to trace you when you re moving at flank... trouble is, if you don t use your flank speed, the depth charges are coming right on your head :)
Corsair
02-15-07, 04:03 PM
Not if you're deep enough...;) As I said they only ping if they know you're there, and if they know you're there, you did something wrong...
PS : I have seen very often DDs break up attack and return to their convoys, or Flowers run out of DCs
Keelbuster
02-15-07, 04:11 PM
Silence isn't so important when they have active sonar. Silence is your friend on your approach. When you are escaping, the key is to get distance from your attacker. Do this with flank bursts when he does a DC run. Go fast for longer than it feels comfortable, then drop down to 3kts, and make sure your enemeies are ~180 to you. Then, when you feel like you've opened up a bit of distance (to make the active sonar a little less effective) and you're profile is slim, go silent. And pray. Repeat as necessary, and add a BOLD to the beginning if you can. If you just sit there at 1kts, you'll never get away from them as they can continually get you with active. The trick of going down to 260 is a bit of an exploit - it gets you under the active cone, but it relies on having a really low (perhaps artificiallys so) crush depth. I don't operate under 150, and I rarely even have to go that deep.
Kb
This might work in stock game or if there is only one DD over your head. If using NYGM or GWX and more than one DD, then one will sit there and listen while the other(s) do the attack run and will hear your flank speed burst. (Have been trapped often doing that)
Anyway they don't use active sonar for no reason, and if you're pinged it means you did something wrong... I do also quite often...:D
The only really good tactic is to get away without being detected at all, which is relatively easy during the "happy times", but forces you as the war goes on to shoot from further away and really think twice before making an attack, which I find is better than allowing to shoot at anything that moves in any conditions.;)
Well, i played NYGM for a few careers. I'm good, but I get detected sometimes. It's a reality of the business. Once I was detected in calm water by 3 black swans in the late war. They quickly began to ping triangulate me. What i'm saying is that in those circumstances, it does you no good to sit there at 1kts. You'll just get a DC up yer hatch. You have to move. And if you're going to move, move quickly. It's desperate. Yea - one's probalby listening, but two are actively pinging you. So you bail. You run like hell. In all the confusion, with one destroyer blazing away with depth charges, the one listening might not hear you for like 10 seconds. Those seconds allow you to reduce your profile and get a few hundred metres away. Sometimes, like 1 in 5 times, those few hundred meters will allow you to slip away silently - the next circle the DD makes with active sonar _might_ just miss you because of your distance and your slim profile. That's how i get away. It works. BOLD helps too.
I won't bet my boat on the 'sit deep and hope they don't find me' strategy.
Kb
Corsair
02-15-07, 04:15 PM
And anyway what is great in this game is that there is no "set piece" tactic, it's all depending of the tactical situation, the environment, the weather, the type of sub, the type of DD, the experience of their crew, the time of day/night, the year we're on, etc...
I think all the guys playing for some time now have been sunk enough times to know that what worked in one situation did not work on some other.
So we all developped our own tactics with experience, and although there are some general tips, it's part of the pleasure to try different things to find out by yourself.
My favourite tactic is definitely to plan my attacks so I have a very reasonable chance to get away undetected, even if it means sinking only 1 or 2 ships in a convoy instead of 4 or 5 (or even let it go). If we look at our careers, most of us will find that greed was the main reason why we got sunk.
I hate going back from a IXB or IXC to a IIa in Kiel in Sept 39 again...:D
Corsair
02-15-07, 04:26 PM
Well, i played NYGM for a few careers. I'm good, but I get detected sometimes. It's a reality of the business. Once I was detected in calm water by 3 black swans in the late war. They quickly began to ping triangulate me. What i'm saying is that in those circumstances, it does you no good to sit there at 1kts. You'll just get a DC up yer hatch. You have to move. And if you're going to move, move quickly. It's desperate. Yea - one's probalby listening, but two are actively pinging you. So you bail. You run like hell. In all the confusion, with one destroyer blazing away with depth charges, the one listening might not hear you for like 10 seconds. Those seconds allow you to reduce your profile and get a few hundred metres away. Sometimes, like 1 in 5 times, those few hundred meters will allow you to slip away silently - the next circle the DD makes with active sonar _might_ just miss you because of your distance and your slim profile. That's how i get away. It works. BOLD helps too.
I won't bet my boat on the 'sit deep and hope they don't find me' strategy.
Kb
Hey, you're the Kapt'n on your boat, that's why you get the big Reichmarks... It's your call.;)
Sorry don't know about late war, I play DiD and am probably not good enough because even if I am cautious, I never got that far yet ( but I am working on it).:D
Having 3 Black Swans on your back is surely not a good experience. Would think once you get there it's pretty hard to survive whatever the tactic.
This is why I do most of my homework on trying to understand why I have been detected so I try not to do the same mistake twice (I said I try...:D). I believe a lot more in the preventive part of the tactics, even if it means let a nice juicy convoy get away because it's daylight / calm weather / shallow waters.
PS : Anyway however fast you move submerged, they will always move faster than you... Also the deeper you are, the more time it takes for the cans to come to you and you can get away by increasing speed a bit without going to flank. I found flank speed was always giving a big "hey I'm here" signal and I try not to use it when submerged. I also tend to have always my rudder 10° to one side or the other as it changes aspect without taking on speed.
Keelbuster
02-15-07, 05:09 PM
I also tend to have always my rudder 10° to one side or the other as it changes aspect without taking on speed.
Ah - good to know.
Sailor Steve
02-15-07, 05:23 PM
don't forget that silent running is just taking the speed down to 3 kts. lower it to 1 kts. that used to help ME in -41.....but now when it's May -43 for me.....:damn:
how do you lower it to 1 kt?
Beside each of the three guages at the bottom right is a little button. Clicking it changes the Compass to a Rudder Guage, the Depth Guage back and forth from shallow (25 meters) to full, and the Engine Telegraph to a 'Knotmeter', which lets you select an exact speed.
aight
dive your boat down there
go to around 210-260
nice tactics captain custard lol, just kidding
hey
it aint my problem ur boat got crushed:rotfl:
Corsair
02-17-07, 02:16 PM
To illustrate my previous posts, I had yesterday a close encounter with a Black Swan escorting a merchant in the Med March 42. Beautiful night, calm weather. I had underestimated the speed (was announced by radio as medium and I calculated my intercept a bit too short) So I was a bit far away and thought I could get away by increasing my speed at periscope depth to 1/3 to close up... False move...
Anyway she picked me up. Soon as I saw the searchlight on, I went to dive at slow speed silent running directly towards her so as to stay a short time in her sonar cone. Was pinged for a few seconds of course but as we travelled opposite directions the first DCs went boom behind me. Made my usual 10° rudder turns left and right. By the time she found me again I was around 120m. She always came at me some 30/40 degrees from one side (there the importance of being at the hydrophone station) so just by turning inside her course as soon as I heard the engines revving up for the run (and the bearing staying fixed), the DCs always were aside of me without having to increase speed more than to 1/3. After 45 mns she lost me and as I was moving on opposite heading to the merchant, she had to go back to her escort duties. I still believe silent escape works. Just stick your ears behind the hydrophone and don't panic. Of course I admit it's a little more tricky when they are 2 or 3 and when they have nothing else to do but chasing you around...:D
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