Russian Federation vs Soviet Union.

[DanCanovas]

Hi Folks,

I would be interested in hearing from people including those with experience with regard to comparisons between the Russian Federation as it is today and the Soviet Union. Im particularly interested in, the experiences of ordinary people, money, food, personal things, transportation.

In my experience of talking to people at university and since, the general feeling is that during the days of the USSR "we didnt have much but we had pride. now we have neither".

Feedback would be much appreciated.

Dan

[CCIP]

Hi Folks,

I would be interested in hearing from people including those with experience with regard to comparisons between the Russian Federation as it is today and the Soviet Union. Im particularly interested in, the experiences of ordinary people, money, food, personal things, transportation.


Give me a few days!

I was back in Russia the previous summer; and then the fact that I had the experience of growing up in late 80s-early 90s Russia... so naturally I'll have plenty to say on the subject, assuming you're interested.


Here is an excerpt from my journal. I can post more later if you're interested.


The next photos came the next day, after I arrived to my grandparents apartment.

Soviet Russian living conditions

Actually, that was my first and only culture shock when I arrived there. The apartments are amazingly tiny. The pictures can't really convey it. I had the reverse shock when I returned to Canada some two months later. It just hits you.

Which is all the stranger since, while growing up in Russia, I spent nearly every weekend in that exact apartment.

Certainly it isn’t true of all living conditions, but as Russia lacks a true middle class – all but a small elite live in cramped quarters to say the least. The buildings are also in horrible condition, though it doesn’t seem like their mere 35-year age is all that much. But they are honestly incredibly stupidly-constructed pre-fab concrete block card houses. Sometimes there's odd noises coming from the building; the rumble from traffic seems unreasonable and the 9-storey block sometimes shakes. By the time I left two months later, two doors located in the same area stopped closing at all (I suspect because the building slightly deformed while I was there). Disturbing to say the least, but that’s normal real estate for most Russians.

Oh, I’m only beginning to scare you up. Before I go any further, allow me to disclaim that – as my pictures show – I love that city and don’t think Russia is hell at all, but there are many facts of life there that have to be adjusted to.

Some pictures from a typical Soviet Russian kitchen:

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y122/Otohiko/Russia/PICT0463.jpg
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y122/Otohiko/Russia/PICT0464.jpg
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y122/Otohiko/Russia/PICT0465.jpg
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y122/Otohiko/Russia/PICT0466.jpg




View out the window:
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y122/Otohiko/Russia/PICT0469.jpg
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y122/Otohiko/Russia/PICT0473.jpg

It might look OK, but actually, that area is rather... ghetto. It hadn’t been so obvious to me when I was younger. On this trip I sincerely disliked it, thought it was unsafe and always snuck off to another part of town (where I mostly grew up and went to school) to see my friends.

A big part of it was that there was a disturbing number of groups of young shady-looking men talking loudly and consuming alcoholic beverages (people drink on the streets. All the time. It's amazing, but you can't walk 10 meters without seeing someone with a beer bottle.)

My main fear walking on the streets in that part of town, though, was stepping on a [medical] needle. These were also encountered with disturbing frequency – not used for medical purposes, if you know what I mean.

Later in that area, I was also treated to the pleasure of standing for 5 minutes waiting for someone to open the door for me - while a few meters away, two somewhat intoxicated men were arguing loudly and threatening each other with bricks. :-?

And if that’s not enough – about 10 years ago, the same apartment block was partially evacuated after some explosive stored by terrorists in the basement blew up, ruining a two-floor section, about 50 feet wide. It was repaired and the building still stands. Only one person was injured in that incident – an old lady who was sleeping in a first-floor apartment and was reportedly blown out of it with her bed.

I wrote a story about that in an English class in Canada – saying “man, I wish I was there when it blew so I could see that old lady flying through the air!” My teacher was bepuzzled and dismissed it as some nonsensical fantasy, perhaps for fear that one of her students might think of something so obviously wrong, I think. At the time I didn’t think of it as anything incredibly wild.

That’s shady areas for you.

[Gizzmoe]

Here is an excerpt from my journal. I can post more later if you're interested.

Yes, please do! :yep:

[XabbaRus]

Which city is that?

[CCIP]

Which city is that?

That's the northern parts of St. Petersburg, the fabled "Grazhdanka". (my least favorite part of the city, I think)

[SUBMAN1]

I'd like to hear more as well.

-S

[DanCanovas]

wow thats just the sort of stuff i meant. very interesting!

[Tchocky]

Thats nicer than my flat!

*browses apartment listings*

[TteFAboB]

Nice pics.

That refrigerator doesn't seem to have a "brand". Do you know what "it" is? Where was it produced or something? The oven has a brand but I can't read it. Let me try with my cartoony eyes: :o . Nope, still can't read it.

[CCIP]

If it had a brand, it peeled off. It's an old Soviet-made one.

I have a couple of rants, but I'll have to save them for tomorrow, or else I'll never finish my work.

(Then again, isn't today the bunking-off-work day?)

[nikimcbee]

Wow! I don't recognize the place w/o snow. I need to scan my pix and post them. I was there in 94.

[CptSimFreak]

I guess I could join in. Just for contrast, here are pictures from center of St.Petersburg.

http://pages.sbcglobal.net/simfreak/pics/DSC02580.jpg

http://pages.sbcglobal.net/simfreak/pics/DSC02584.jpg


http://pages.sbcglobal.net/simfreak/pics/DSC02804.jpg

http://pages.sbcglobal.net/simfreak/pics/DSC02803.jpg

http://xf8.xanga.com/c3ed044737031105101946/w74294651.jpg

http://xcf.xanga.com/0c7d3a7bc4233105101957/w74294658.jpg

http://xff.xanga.com/d94d034137c31105101962/w74294663.jpg
http://x66.xanga.com/066d224537c33105101969/w74294670.jpg
(inside subway station...it's illegal to take pics, but I did it anyways :D)

[CCIP]

(inside subway station...it's illegal to take pics, but I did it anyways :D)
Beat me to it! :rotfl:I have those 'illegal' pics as well. Was nearly arrested for them at one point...

And yes, you didn't give me a chance to contrast yet. For all the negatives... that city is still my favorite place in the world. I'd return there if I had a reasonable chance to do so.

[CptSimFreak]

Now if we move somewhere where communism designed houses without influence of the Europe, picture changes drastically. This is from a 'new' and 'modern' section on outskirts of center. To me it seems same person with no taste or budget designed ~10 different types of houses that spread out through Russia like a virus. All of them are horrible. Fortunately, house that are currently build look half proper.

http://x06.xanga.com/5d5830f2c2428105104045/w74296315.jpg
Street right after rain. Majority of people live in those houses.

http://x4a.xanga.com/c9680af2c2549105104013/w74296287.jpg

Here's a different perspective. I took a picture of what I was taking a picture earlier.

http://xdb.xanga.com/9378346365638105104038/w74296311.jpg

My grandfather has a garage and a car. To western standards, both are horrible. But if one doesn't know better, they are quite happy with that they have.

http://x20.xanga.com/ccb834f162548105104015/w74296289.jpg

Another pic of garage.
http://x00.xanga.com/2638076365639105104033/w74296306.jpg

An open bonnet. The car is easy to maintain and can be worked on by anyone with any tools; yes, really. My grandfather usually takes entire car apart during winter.

http://x39.xanga.com/69ad047a17d31105104049/w74296319.jpg

During Soviet times, just about everyone got a piece of land. and so 'datchyas' (summer houses) were born. People using own strength build house away from city. They would live there during summer vacation, enjoy clean air and grow different things there such as potatoes, carrots, pickles, apples, etc. Kids would spend time during summer vacation growing up there.

http://x31.xanga.com/e2b805fb65759105104005/w74296282.jpg

and for the final picture for today; here's a stair case. Yes, it smells just like it looks.

[nikimcbee]

I wish I could go back with a digital camera:roll: I have very fond memories of Moscow, Suzdal', Vladimir, and St. Petersburg. I saw a Kilo parked in the Neva! I really wanted to see the naval museum,but everything was closed to get ready for the goodwill games.

[Chaotic42]

I've always thought that Russia was a neat country. I'd like to visit there someday. I've got a lot of resepect for the Russian people. Somehow I think the story would be different in the middle east if the terrorists had flown a plane into a building in Moscow.

History seems to teach us a lesson: Don't mess with Russia!

I'd like to visit Siberia along with St. Petersburg. Lenin Square in Yakutsk is looking kind of run-down though:

http://www.yakutsk-city.ru/images/content/gallery/img43.jpg

[Polak]

Typical, communist kitchens in Russia are bigger than communist kitchens in Poland...
Communism was a really bad time for us. It's funny that the architecture is almost identical all over the whole eastern bloc.

[DanCanovas]

good discussion so far folks. keep it up! im intrigued.

[tycho102]

Wow! Thank you for the pictures, CCIP and CptSimFreak. I haven't gotten around to scanning my negatives (gotta clean the oil off the platen glass).

I'd love to get the full-res originals from either of you. Those are wondefully sharp and detailed.

[DanCanovas]

I agree, an incredible insight

[XabbaRus]

Wow I lived in Petersburg for 6 months but my ex girlfriend has all my photos :(

I'll post some of my pics of Moscow from my time there if I can find any.

Hey I married a Russian and would love to go back for good if I could though.

Siberia is cool, literally, very flat. I'd recommend going in winter and spring, summer has too many mossies about. Watching cars drive over a frozen river is fun.

CCIP I'll try and remember where my flat in St Petes was and then you can tell me if I was lucky not to get into trouble or not. When I first got there I stayed in the ob. with the other students in my group. That was on the broken metro line. I wonder if they have fixed that yet?

[CptSimFreak]

Let me post some more.

http://xed.xanga.com/8ba8346102ca8105241807/w74402311.jpg

Here’s the famous little ship named ‘Avrora’ parked on Neva in St Petersburg.


http://xb6.xanga.com/1b8d003314331105241819/w74402321.jpg
And here are some pictures from Kronshtat (http://maps.google.com/?ie=UTF8&z=14&ll=59.986838,29.768143&spn=0.021423,0.080338&om=1), an island with naval school.



http://x83.xanga.com/abbd1a34d7d31105241818/w74402320.jpg


http://x04.xanga.com/cea8066302ca9105241811/w74402315.jpg
http://xaa.xanga.com/b2fd013254331105241817/w74402319.jpg

http://xa3.xanga.com/a1dd033334131105241809/w74402313.jpg

What sub is that ;)



Final picture for today: Typical sight; a completely rusted and ignored ship. It does make a good photogenic scenery.
http://xcc.xanga.com/39b835f6592a8105241815/w74402317.jpg


(I can send full pics, send my private with email address)

[ASWnut101]

That sub would be a 877 (or other version) Kilo Class SSK.:know:

[Chaotic42]

More excellent pictures. You guys are going to force me to take two weeks to visit there, aren't you? :rotfl:

For those who live or have lived in Russia, what do you think is the biggest problem now? What's the largest issue for the average Russian person?

[nikimcbee]

http://img104.imageshack.us/img104/2121/scan0001pg7.jpg
Moscow 1994, White House. This was taken 6 months after Yeltsin attacked The White House. more to come...

[DanCanovas]

wow fascinating. :yep:

[Kapitan]

My stepfather lives in the rich side of st petersburg so the only view that ive ever realy had is the people with money and he has some money:

To give you what he gets a month a break down:

Pension from Stena bulk $351.18 per month
Pension from the former soviet navy paid by the russian government $32.00 per month
Payment for any service he provides in the naval academy $12 per day
Payment for going to sea $53 per day.

Total with no days at sea and 5 days teaching included (which is average)

total is about $443 per month for a 62 year old
Out goings is around $390 to $410 per month.

That makes him fairly well off some of his friends get allowencies of just $38 per week to live on.

ive been there only a few times most of my trips take me into murmansk where he lives in what i can only discribe as incredibly poor conditions, its a big leap from rich to poor, the block of flats are half disused and blocked up the childrens play ground is well hasnt been maintained since the 80's most likely, but the buildings would what id discribe as the following:

A realy realy bad council estate thats due for demolition (for the UK people)

Theres very few people with money in murmansk and if you show you have money you probly end up getting mugged or robbed (hence the dress down), its pretty wild out in murmask cut off an isolated and St Petes for me is a 50 min plane ride.

In the city of murmansk tempratures get down to around -18*c (thankyou tall buildings) (thats as cold as your deep freeze) in the open country side the tempratures have been known to drp to -32*c and further east in omnicom the record is -89*c (thats in siberia)

He lives about 55km from the acctual arctic circle and its winter 9 months a year in summer the best you can realy hope for is around 5*c or 6*c.
Being so high up the nights are far longer and in summer the days are longer if i can remeber right its light for 24 hours a day for a whole week at one point in the calender (have to re check that)

My stepdad lives on the 5th floor of a block of flats near the docks, there is 1 bus but thats fine because nearly everything is within walking distance (yes including the pub)

It is fun theres a great sence of comunity and most of the old old locals do not like forigners (americans AND BRITISH (YES EVEN ME))

My stepdad isnt hard core old soviet style but you can tell he does have alot of it in him born when stalin still reigned ! so he has been through the entire cold war and listed to the soviet proaganda and is in more of a position to wiegh up the situation than most other people because he was a soviet person who was working on british registerd ships so he got both sides of nearly every story.

I enjoy it i was due to go out there a few weeks before the london meet up with you dan and lesrae but he went to sea so i had absolutly no where to go so i didnt go (dont fancy my chances alone).

Anyways thats about it.

[CCIP]

For those who live or have lived in Russia, what do you think is the biggest problem now? What's the largest issue for the average Russian person?

I still haven't had the chance to do my rant yet, but it's definitely socioeconomics. That is, the vast majority of the population is poor; many are unemployed; naturally, problems with housing, living conditions, crime and so on stem from that. This is why I think it's a misconception in the West to view the 'un-democratization' under Putin as the overriding issue in Russia. It's fairly low on the agenda compared to trying to edge out a stable living. This is why, for example, since the mid-90s the support for real liberal-democratic politicians has plummeted to single-digit percents of the vote.

Consider Kapitan's pension figures. My grandmother, who worked as a teacher all her life, gets 3500 roubles (~$140) a month, with price levels for household goods and food being virtually identical to those in the US.

[nikimcbee]

More Moscow pix.
This is not me!
http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/2702/lenin1lr9.png


The wall behind the White House.
http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/1473/wallkd1.jpg

Avrora with guard.
http://img161.imageshack.us/img161/9320/avroragc3.jpg

Kolomenskoye -15 degrees when I was there that day.
http://img182.imageshack.us/img182/6069/kolomenskoyeit1.jpg

[DanCanovas]

great stuff

[Kapitan]

Exactly CCIP that $140 doesnt go far either, what my stepdad gets in pensions he is lucky if he hadnt have gone to work for stena bulk then he probly be on about the same or maybe less.

[CCIP]

Before more pictures, a quick rant that I promised.

Just to explain to the people what, in my view, is the real story of the "abortion of Russia's middle class".

Perestroika. Gorbachev's wonderful reforms suddenly turn up massive economic problems and there is a huge deficit of goods. Naturally, with nothing on the shelves to buy, most people save their money. Thanks to the reforms, though, some enterprising individuals set up cooperatives, but these are rather few.

Then the devaluation of currency starts. Naturally, people try to get their money out and buy something - except for the most part, there's nothing to buy. Some are lucky; my father managed to buy a wad of grey cloth worth a few hundred dollars and later converted it to colored metals (money was worthless) - not much but I think it really made a difference for a rainy day. And the rainy day came.

Sberbank (the central and only bank in the USSR) closes all withdrawals. Soon, the currency crashes. People's entire savings are wiped out. It should be noted that with the way the Soviet system worked, people had little in the way of assets as most of everything was state-owned.

Not all the people however. Naturally, the ones that didn't lose were those who did not rely on Sberbank - and who they are might be easy to guess. For one, it's the wise entrepreneurs who, in the brief couple of years between being allowed to organize cooperatives and the crash, managed to build up small businesses and gain some assets. Then, of course, it's the black market run by the mafia who, understandably, would not have relied on the state bank. Thirdly, it's of course the party elite, for obvious reasons.

Privatization - for which some consider its mastermind, Anatoly Chubais, an economic genius, and for which I'd love to see him drawn and quartered. Up until now, this was a typical economic crash story, but Privatization is where it got uniquely ugly.

With the USSR gone and the Soviet system collapsed, naturally there was now a need to switch to a new system which encouraged private enterprise - and thus hand off the economy to the people. There was a problem of course: the people just lost all their money.

But in any case, in a stroke of genius, the government sells Russia's massive industrial power for remarkably low prices. International investors are not in the scene, of course, seeing the massive instability within the country. Of course, however low the prices, most people can't afford anything. They are broke.

Now, the government decides to play fair. They issue vouchers for a proportional share of state property to every soul in the country. There are two things that one can do with their voucher: invest it into one of the many investment companies that suddenly spring up out of nowhere; or, more cynically - sell it to one of the myriads of guys standing at subway entrances offering the equivalent of $10 for your voucher.

Most who went with the latter option were the better for it. My family, who were persuaded to invest, were luckier than most - we got a few dollars' worth of dividents before the company mysteriously disappeared. Most other people who invested never saw a rouble.

Meanwhile the sale of state assets is proceeding full-force. And those buying it are the ones with money. The former party officials are of course there by default. The mafia, coming out of the black market to the 'white market', are best adapted to negotiation. They benefit massively. The entrepreneurs are in a disadvantaged position for the most part - assuming they hadn't already been forced out by the envigorated mafia's racketeering. When trying to buy these major state assets, many are simply told "this is not for you". Only the most persistent and the most willing to bribe secure their spot.

Out of these three groups comes a great new Russian elite, called "Novye Russkie" meaning "New Russians". The most advanced of them are the famed Oligarchs - but the rest aren't too badly off. Consider the fact that at the present moment, just 12 people own 50% of Russia's GNP. It's fair to assume that the next 1% of the population owns another 40-something percent. The New Russians are that very group - former party officials and their families (the Chernomyrdin [ex-premier] and Yeltsin [ex-president] families are among the top names); children of the black market and shady trade (Berezovsky, Abramovich come to mind) and the mafia;
lucky entrepreneurs (Khodorkovsky) who were willing to go the way. With the mafia and the former party (a mafia of sorts in themselves) being the most numerous of the New Russians, it's easy to imagine their cultural values and ethics.

I've no sympathy for the New Russians whatsoever.

Meanwhile, what's all the more absurd is that following all that upheaval, what one would associate with 'cultural elite' or 'core middle class' are suddenly at the bottom of the well. Teachers, doctors, scientists, and other public workers were, at least during the 90's, some of the least paid professions (at one point the teachers at my school were earning around $15 a MONTH - not an exaggaration).

The stabilization of the economy in the past few years has smoothed things over somewhat and most people can survive - just barely. Not all is great, of course. For all the supposed positives, the current government seems to be bent on starving out the numerous pensioners. This may be unsurprising: pensioners overwhelmingly favour the remaining Communist Party that consists of the party members that didn't, in their view, "sell out" and go over to the new government. The parliament, without much debate, has passed a few bills in the past couple of years which would strike any reasonable person as death warrants for pensioners. Little noise has been raised over it. Likewise, Putin prides himself in incentives for families with children that he recently introduced. These are also a total joke, unless one believes that a lump sum of about $400 is enough to convince a family to have a child.

Remember that the cost of living in most Russian cities today is about the same as in most US cities for example.

The Russian middle class is dead, having never been born. Russia is not a democracy. Russia today is essentially a feudal state run by the few New Russians that have, with the have-nots being just that - have-nots.

[waste gate]

Way back in January of 1984 when I spent a few days in St. Petersburg, I stayed at a hotel which gave me a great view of the Aurora. Unfortunately I was ill most of the time in St. Petersburg. I can't remember the name of the hotel. I do remember showing the house doctor a Tylenol (the old capsule type) and the look on her face. She was amazed. She then asked for a magazine. I had to tell her that every western magazine I had was taken from me when I entered the country. She seemed disappointed.


http://xed.xanga.com/8ba8346102ca8105241807/w74402311.jpg

[flintlock]

http://x66.xanga.com/066d224537c33105101969/w74294670.jpg
(inside subway station...it's illegal to take pics, but I did it anyways :D)

If you look carefully, you can see a KGB agent watching you. ;)

[DanCanovas]

thats pretty incredible! i thought it was a museum! not the tube

[nikimcbee]

(inside subway station...it's illegal to take pics, but I did it anyways :D)

If you look carefully, you can see a KGB agent watching you. ;)

Yeah, they don't like that. A girl in our class was taking pix there, and she had a little talk to from a cop.

just for the nostalgia: http://www.metro.ru/

I lived by the Vykhino http://www.metro.ru/stations/tagansko-krasnopresnenskaya/vyhino/

[DanCanovas]

if you took a photo of the underground here in London the lens would break!

[CptSimFreak]

So lets see what outside of a city looks like. This is what people grow in datchyas.

http://xb9.xanga.com/23cd062110631106056515/w75031492.jpg
http://x17.xanga.com/3c6d335568130106056564/w75031528.jpg

http://x9e.xanga.com/632d0a2111031106056556/w75031521.jpg

http://x1e.xanga.com/0fd80b76d8639106056531/w75031502.jpg

http://x22.xanga.com/192d0b5b12631106056593/w75031550.jpg

Other than picture of apples, other pictures I don't know how to titles. I just don't know those names in English.

http://x0b.xanga.com/02683b74d8068106056613/w75031562.jpg

http://x35.xanga.com/c6ed005a13131106056624/w75031570.jpg

[DanCanovas]

very pretty, a part of Russia most of us forget exists

[CptSimFreak]

Before I continue, lets make some tea; old style way. :yep:
http://xcc.xanga.com/590d005517431106057228/w75032005.jpg

http://x77.xanga.com/2d9d035577431106057237/w75032014.jpg
http://x39.xanga.com/c4dd3055d1530106057409/w75032147.jpg
Look at this old thing!

[CptSimFreak]

And now some water action.

http://x0b.xanga.com/89f8327a40349106057420/w75032156.jpg
In the morning

http://x33.xanga.com/895d0b2734231106057428/w75032161.jpg
Day
http://x65.xanga.com/4cb8347a40748106057245/w75032021.jpg
Evening.

[nikimcbee]

Those are beautiful dacha photos. Where were they taken? My "ex" 's had a dacha in Peredelkino, her grandma worked for Pasternak. I'll scan my 2 photos of there. When we were out walking there, that was the place I asked her to marry me. So I love dachas! Fond memories!:cry:

[DanCanovas]

stunning!

[Chaotic42]

Looks delicious! I'll be over in a minute for dinner...

I looked up apartments in St. Petersburg. A small one bedroom apartment was 800 Euros/month. I guess that's not bad for a large city, but you'd have to be making 30,000 Euros/year to live at a level that most Americans would call comfortable. Me, anyway.

[DanCanovas]

i dont think 800 Euros a month is particularly cheap for a 1 bedroom flat. certainly a lot more than I expected for Russia

[tycho102]

Wow. There's some fairly hardcore perspectives in this thread.

@CCIP: I agree with you on Putin and "democracy". I know you can't just heave a load of voting into a place and expect everything to be perfect. Look at China -- there was a time when I thought Tiennamen was horrible, but now that I'm older and looking at California, I don't blame the Communists for doing it (rolling in the tanks). Russia has significant issues with crime, aged population, infrastructure, border security. If there is to be a "middle class" in Russia, it's going to be the young generation that grows up to fill it. But my God, it's been what, 15 years since that failed coup against Gorby?

Post-war Japan, which is about how I view current Russia, was still having a rough time in 1955. Hell, it wasn't until the mid 70's until their economy broke even from the war reparations. All the oldies died in the war from physical hardship, which is some that....pragmatically.....Russia does not have the benefit of. What is it, like 20% of their population is over 60? It's about 15% for America (our mexican population brings that down).

Anyway, nice pictures.

[Dan D]

Great pics and stories, and i am hoping for more to come.
What I was always wondering about, is the guys here who are living in the UK and having Russian roots. Ethnic Russians living in the US or Canada do not surprise me, because those are the classic immigration countries. We also have a bunch of Russian speaking folks here in Germany, who are Ethnic Germans and thus can apply for a German passport anytime, like e.g. so-called Wolga-Germans who once moved to Russia at times of Catharine the Great. How comes that people with Russian roots move to the UK?
Is it familiy ties or is is because the UK is probably also a classic immigration country within Europe or whatever reason it is?
IF you don't mind, I would like to hear more about family backgrounds.

Part of my family were French Hugenots who settled in Prussia; so much for my family background.

[CCIP]

What I was always wondering about, is the guys here who are living in the UK and having Russian roots. Ethnic Russians living in the US or Canada do not surprise me, because those are the classic immigration countries. We also have a bunch of Russian speaking folks here in Germany, who are Ethnic Germans and thus can apply for a German passport anytime, like e.g. so-called Wolga-Germans who once moved to Russia at times of Catharine the Great. How comes that people with Russian roots move to the UK?
Is it familiy ties or is is because the UK is probably also a classic immigration country within Europe or whatever reason it is?
IF you don't mind, I would like to hear more about family backgrounds.

I'm not entirely sure, but Russians aren't really that selective as far as immigration, as long as it's West (except perhaps Israel). If you mean new immigrants - for a period in the 90's, it was really wherever you could go. I have friends' relatives in the UK - a Russian girl who married a Brit.
Then there are people with old Russian roots, most likely descendants of Russian nobility who escaped into Europe during the revolution.

Backgrounds - interesting you bring this up. I find it ironic how hard it is to figure out just what is an ethnic Russian (my general conclusion is that there's no such thing).

My own background is about 1/4 Novgorod Russian, a small proportion of 'other' (western) Russian and Ukranian, 1/4 German/Danish/Swedish (nobility), 1/4 Karel (essentially Finnish), and then about 8% of everything else including Tartar, Jewish, Turkish, Gypsy and other backgrounds.

I'm rather proud of my mix to be honest, which illustrates just how ironic many ethnic conflicts and xenophobias are.

[CptSimFreak]

nikimcbee, first pic is near St Petersburg. About 60km. Second is around 200km.


http://xf6.xanga.com/69cd505531d32106056668/w75031598.jpg
Peter The Great made this man-made river so that ships could travel when there was storm on lake Ladoga.

http://x3e.xanga.com/ae4d225572d33106056686/w75031606.jpg
This is more modern. Made with same reasoning as picture before.

http://x11.xanga.com/ee9d305572430106057047/w75031874.jpg
Usually one can find many fresh products in near store. Goat's milk is quite good.

http://x5c.xanga.com/d6ad365562730106057057/w75031883.jpg

Reminder of WW2....
(Here near a village Lipki on 12 Jan 43 during breakthrough of blockade of Leningrad, commander rota 533 CP 128CD of Volhovsk front, comsomole senior Lt Yakov Ivanovich Bogdan closed with own body enemy's hardened position)
http://xd2.xanga.com/ffdd005b14431106056642/w75031581.jpg

This one is of un-named soldier. Someone placed helmet with hole on grave.
http://xb9.xanga.com/cacd012729231106057213/w75031996.jpg
Here's a foxhole. Dill a little and you can find many things.
http://x5a.xanga.com/9aa83b7540278106057443/w75032170.jpg
This maybe a command center. Or hiding spot for mortar team, or etc.

http://x59.xanga.com/fc7d3b5505530106057167/w75031965.jpg
Around this swamplands, my mother's brother found a tank.

http://x37.xanga.com/94983075d9c38106057131/w75031943.jpg

http://xde.xanga.com/aadd0b2126631106057095/w75031912.jpg

Some cranberries.
http://x2d.xanga.com/64e83271d9d09106057080/w75031900.jpg
and a mushroom. Many people go during end of summer to gather mushrooms in local forests. It was one of my favorite things to do. Before family would wake up, I would check my mushroom spots so that they could eat mushrooms for breakfast (I couldnt stand eating them). The other one was gathering WW2 relics. During my last trip to this area, without even looking for anything, I found 3 rusted Mauser shells. When I was little, I found mortar rounds, grenades, rifle, bullets and such around my datchya.

(My background: I have no idea. I think I have some Fin in me, Ukrainian, some aristocrat and Russian....whatever that is.) (I think being Russian is a state of mind, not genetics)

[DanCanovas]

real good pics! thanks

[CCIP]

Great nature pics!

I have a few of my own, but I'm still catching up.

Meanwhile, I just found a few pics from back in the USSR that might be relevant -

My dad in the Soviet Army during the 1970s (Kola Peninsula; he was a radio operator):

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y122/Otohiko/dadarmy2.jpg
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y122/Otohiko/dadarmy1.jpg
http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y122/Otohiko/dadarmy3.jpg

Some scary Cold War enemies there, eh? ;)

One funny thing about my dad: he got a perfect duty for himself when he became a radio operator. What did he mostly do during his shifts you ask?
He listened to BBC and other western radio, enjoying the 'banned' rock music from the west and news in English. Never even got caught!:p After ending his military service, he became a musician and played in 'underground' rock bands of the late Soviet era.

[Abraham]

Thanks all participants for interesting thread with great pics!
The personal comments with some of the pics makes them even more special.
:up:

[CptSimFreak]

Lets continue with St Petersburg tour; churches.

http://x83.xanga.com/a7cd336018231107321366/w76029127.jpg

Unfortunately this church was closed that day so I couldn't take pictures from inside. Instead, there's a mother of all fences.
http://xf0.xanga.com/2118362230118107321381/w76029141.jpg

http://x2b.xanga.com/3c7d306030531107321418/w76029166.jpg
This one we can see not only in-and-out, but on top as well. :D
http://xb0.xanga.com/ed9d047233631107321426/w76029173.jpg

From the top.

http://x20.xanga.com/f4ad226030730107321439/w76029185.jpg

and inside.

http://x3f.xanga.com/31c83720300b8107321450/w76029194.jpg

Sorry from crappy angle, church is not crooked; My hands are.

http://x16.xanga.com/087d317332730107321395/w76029153.jpg

Here's an inside of a different church. Look! there is a bread line! :rotfl:

http://x9c.xanga.com/4138012130029107321410/w76029163.jpg

[CCIP]

http://x20.xanga.com/f4ad226030730107321439/w76029185.jpg

Interesting fact:
Some of the mosaics you see here were created by my great-great-grandfather, a remarkable artist in his own right.

Ironically, he had taught in the Royal Academy in Tsarskoye Selo (now Pushkin) and had several of his works bought by the Tsar's family themselves for massive amounts of money - money virtually all of which he later donated to the Bolshevik party, of which he was a dedicated and fairly high-ranking member.

[CptSimFreak]

And following CCCP lead, here some of my personal photos.

http://x08.xanga.com/5f0a3b5a7063257581069/w38593114.jpg
This is my great-grandfather (right). He served in calvary. After WW2, he was a comander of tank(s) in Berlin. (no pics of that)

http://x79.xanga.com/77da375a7913257581045/w38593099.jpg

And here's grandfather. A captan of a ship. He did Land-Lease route.
http://x2f.xanga.com/fc680b2bc6669107328000/w76034169.jpg
Here's an image some might fine interesting. That's one frozen ship.

http://x55.xanga.com/da283425c6668107328004/w76034173.jpg

My father. He was playing on the ship behind him.

[CptSimFreak]

Interesting fact:
Some of the mosaics you see here were created by my great-great-grandfather, a remarkable artist in his own right.

Ironically, he had taught in the Royal Academy in Tsarskoye Selo (now Pushkin) and had several of his works bought by the Tsar's family themselves for massive amounts of money - money virtually all of which he later donated to the Bolshevik party, of which he was a dedicated and fairly high-ranking member.
I remember reading about it....I'm not sure if it was about your family. Was he lead designer?

[XabbaRus]

Those are lovely pictures, especially the ones of the dacha land. It reminds me of my wife's parent's place near Moscow.

Seeing those pictures makes me want to go back. Funny thing is, although my life in the UK is probably safer and more stable those pictures stir up many emotions in me. Is it strange that although I am not Russian I consider in many ways Russia to be my home, or at least a second home, warts and all.

Just trying to figure out what I could do to get back and earn similar money to what I am doing right now.

[CptSimFreak]

Bump... :cool:

[CptSimFreak]

I'm use this thead to post pictures from Russia...

Here are some pictures I took of this Fort. It was a stronghold that managed to hold off Germans and provide cover for "Road of Live" during Leningrad siege.(Hence the beat up look of it)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shlisselburg

Google Maps (http://maps.google.com/maps?hl=en&q=Fort+Krepki+Oreschik&ie=UTF8&ll=59.954022,31.037579&spn=0.020929,0.080338&t=h&z=14&om=1)

http://xb0.xanga.com/be3d952356632128586318/w93457303.jpg


The only way to get to Fort, other than to swim, is to take a 10 minute ride on a boat.

http://x4f.xanga.com/73cd822366332128586345/w93457327.jpg
High on the roof restoration is in progress: fresh paint.

http://xea.xanga.com/181d655a10533128586370/w93457350.jpg

Highly secured entrance to the Fort.

http://x07.xanga.com/75ad822510032128586416/w93457391.jpg
Direction sign for the lost travelers :D
http://x39.xanga.com/f04d862511435128586474/w93457443.jpg

Couple 45s mm(?) displayed for public. They were used to hold off fluffy Germans.


http://xce.xanga.com/822d872377235128586446/w93457417.jpg
Inside that structure, a memorial stands
http://x31.xanga.com/cfcd912411d32128586503/w93457465.jpg

http://x96.xanga.com/731d9b2349532128586531/w93457489.jpg

http://xa7.xanga.com/d55d862613735128586574/w93457522.jpg

http://x84.xanga.com/a46c1722c1534128594348/w93463986.jpg

This is an old style holding cell that used to hold family members of Tsar.

[CptSimFreak]

http://x97.xanga.com/8dbc052314137128586875/w93457779.jpg

During Tsar times and after, this Fort was used as prison. Here's a uniform of pre-1900 guards.
http://x1e.xanga.com/9e8d832513035128586581/w93457526.jpg
http://x1e.xanga.com/f43d6527c4533128594322/w93463962.jpg
This is a new-style prison structure. It was used to hold death sentenced people who fought vs tsar regime.

http://x8a.xanga.com/188c0a2b18437128586895/w93457794.jpg

Ruins; no one may enter


http://xa9.xanga.com/2cec152315734128586909/w93457805.jpg

Second floor of the outer wall.


http://xf5.xanga.com/316c022335334128586927/w93457819.jpg

Wall is over two meters deep. (That's me)


http://x02.xanga.com/b3dd9126c4432128594333/w93463972.jpg

http://x9b.xanga.com/2b8d912bc4132128594366/w93464002.jpg

Translation: In memory of peace between Novgorod and Sweden. Year 1323

http://xc7.xanga.com/a9fc052143c37128596986/w93466095.jpg

[fatty]

Just saw your photos over at SimHQ... very interesting! :up:

[Chock]

Some interesting comments on this thread. I'm certainly no expert on the matter, as I've only ever been to Russia once, and that was in 1979 when they were not exactly flavour of the month with a lot of the world. Lots of nations were planning to (and did) boycott the Moscow Olympics the following year, in protest at what the Russians were doing fighting in Afghanistan, now of course it's perfectly fine to go doing that it seems.

Which just goes to show what a lot of b*llocks the Cold War was I suppose, and the East and West were not so different as might be supposed when you get to the top of the tree.

Moscow was very interesting when I went there, of course in that time (being westerners) we were shepherded around a bit, but it was nevertheless fun and there are some really fantastic things in Moscow, even some of the underground railway stations in Moscow were better than a lot of public buildings I've seen in other countries! Ladas might be crap, but when the Russkies really want to build something nice, they sure as hell can. Nevertheless, it was apparent that we were to a large extent only seeing what they wanted us to see.

Oddly enough, when I went to the Czech Republic a few years ago on a press trip, on the surface the people appeared to support their 'Velvet Revolution' as they call it, which made them independent. But many people that I spoke to, when you got them started, told you a very different story. I lost count of the amount of people working in bars and hotels who were actually teachers (and similar professions), but who couldn't find a job and were scraping a living as a consequence.

The instances of drug dealing were evidently escalating and the telling hand of 'the west' was starting to appear in the form of McDonalds and KFC on Wencelas Square. You could see that basically one regime was giving way to another, and both of them had their ugly side. Of course Prague is very pretty, in fact probably the prettiest place I've ever been, but the ride out to Prague from Ruzyne is probably more educational than looking at Prague itself in many ways. Being a former Soviet Bloc country, outside the picture-postcard town, the buildings are depressingly awful Soviet-style monstrosities.

So what you are left with if you view Prague and it's surrounding country as a microcosm of the switch from former Soviet Bloc to Capitalist hotspot, is between one regime and the other as far as I could tell, you could either have state controlled ugliness, or the ugliness that comes from personal greed.

Kind of sad really.

:D Chock

[CptSimFreak]

Here are some blithe, and not so, pictures of St Petersburg.

http://x75.xanga.com/389d647162431144829022/w107230281.jpg

http://x69.xanga.com/3aec107340733144829138/w107230384.jpg

http://x5c.xanga.com/a97c107561033144828981/w107230246.jpg

http://x42.xanga.com/660d927662731144829044/w107230302.jpg

http://xe6.xanga.com/410d8b6a39733144829077/w107230333.jpg


http://xe3.xanga.com/cf3d856ac0333144829184/w107230426.jpg


http://xdf.xanga.com/f1fd937564031144829221/w107230456.jpg

http://x02.xanga.com/e47c027352432144829258/w107230485.jpg

more to come.

[antikristuseke]

While i dont live in Russia, I live in a country boardering it. What little i can remember before the collapse of the soviet union wasnt like the first poster said "we didnt have much but at least we had pride". Arround here we had hatred for our ocupiers.
Before i go any further ill give some insight into my family history which might explain my position. When the soviet ocupation came, my grandmothers and thousands of others were deported to siberia to die. She survived and made it back to Estonia where she met my grandfather who had fought the soviets during WW2 with the 20.Waffen-Grenadier-Division der SS (estnische Nr.1) as a voulenteer to try to keep the soviets out. After the war for Estonia was lost he defected and managed to get back into the general population here and avoid repressions. My father had to serve in the Soviet armed forces, as did most of my relatives, he was a steersman in the navy. During his forced service he was severely injured in some sort of incident though he has never really told me much about it.
Anyway as for life during the soviet union compared to life now in an independant country, the two cant really be compared. What we had during the long soviet ocupation was survival, not life. Everything was in short supply, even the most basic food items. Everyone had to conform or had dealings with the secret police, hell even listening to foreign radio stations was illegal and several people were shot for doing so. The public transportation was not too bad actualy, it worked and was relatively on time and this is about the only good thing i can think of to say about that period. Everything was government controled, there were no elections there was just voting for candidates or a candidate that the party put there. The only people who miss that era are either completely brainwashed, dilusional or were unable to make it when the doomed from the start system that kept them sustained collapsed and now blame everyone else for their own failings.

[Happy Times]

While i dont live in Russia, I live in a country boardering it. What little i can remember before the collapse of the soviet union wasnt like the first poster said "we didnt have much but at least we had pride". Arround here we had hatred for our ocupiers.
Before i go any further ill give some insight into my family history which might explain my position. When the soviet ocupation came, my grandmothers and thousands of others were deported to siberia to die. She survived and made it back to Estonia where she met my grandfather who had fought the soviets during WW2 with the 20.Waffen-Grenadier-Division der SS (estnische Nr.1) as a voulenteer to try to keep the soviets out. After the war for Estonia was lost he defected and managed to get back into the general population here and avoid repressions. My father had to serve in the Soviet armed forces, as did most of my relatives, he was a steersman in the navy. During his forced service he was severely injured in some sort of incident though he has never really told me much about it.
Anyway as for life during the soviet union compared to life now in an independant country, the two cant really be compared. What we had during the long soviet ocupation was survival, not life. Everything was in short supply, even the most basic food items. Everyone had to conform or had dealings with the secret police, hell even listening to foreign radio stations was illegal and several people were shot for doing so. The public transportation was not too bad actualy, it worked and was relatively on time and this is about the only good thing i can think of to say about that period. Everything was government controled, there were no elections there was just voting for candidates or a candidate that the party put there. The only people who miss that era are either completely brainwashed, dilusional or were unable to make it when the doomed from the start system that kept them sustained collapsed and now blame everyone else for their own failings.

I have heard the same story many times from other Estonians.

[Snipy901]

I just want to say thank you to all of you for sharing your pictures and stories with us. :smug:

[kiwi_2005]

http://i15.photobucket.com/albums/a390/Kiwi_Frank/lada.jpg

They still exist:hmm:

[Dmitry Markov]

http://www.pinklink.ru/uploads/posts/1170422006_lizwcjok.jpg Yes, Lada still exists :damn: Inscription on the picture "Devil drives Lada" "see daily on the streets of a city" . Below the photos are the names: Hachik Akhverdian, Arslan Zaboev, Ashot Paparyan, Semen Palych, Vasya from Naro-Fominsk (town in Moscow region). In Moscow old models of Lada ( 2106, 2104, 2107, 2105 and so on) mostly used by comers from Caucasus for individual taxi "service". There are zounds of them on the streets and what they do is undescribable. In their hunt for money they drive despite all the road rules. The same do the drivers of Gazel's (these are the light commercial vans which have a lot of modifications from light truck to small commertial bus (or "marshrutka") ). For the Gazels the trouble is that it provides a feeling of allmightyness for the driver because of it's maneuverability, but one can not see anything around himself on the road while being on the driver's place in this car. http://www.autovek.ru/images/upload/1273/ru/gazel.jpg But it is rather cheap and very suitable for small business so there are a lot of them... :huh: On sunday I will post my pictures of today's Moscow and Russian countryside. ;) Best Regards

[Tchocky]

A couple of years ago I was in Finland, and we ended up driving across a frozen lake in a Lada 4x4. I was pleasantly surprised, a great car.

Now, your average four door Lada....run away!

[antikristuseke]

Ladas actualy have one redeaming feature, if you can drive a lada, you can drive anything.

[Dmitry Markov]

Tchocky, maybe you mension Niva (VAZ 2121) - That's the true masterpiece of a country car. It's cheap and it can go anywhere at all no matter is there any road or it isn't :up:

http://agtustud.ru/forum/modules/photogallery/show_img.php?file=4_8_1164291283&n=Niva_v_Paris.jpg


More modern version: Chevrolet Niva still the cheapest 4x4 but not quite as good money/quality ratio as it's predeсessor hashttp://www.cars.ru/files/news/1253/_n_1253_img1.jpg

Best Regards

[Kapitan]

Ladas actualy have one redeaming feature, if you can drive a lada, you can drive anything.

Sadly so true i find driving a 26 tonne or even the bigger 32 tonne dustcarts easier to drive than a lada niva, the one i was driving had no power steering 4 gears and it loved to kick the clutch pedel back into your foot.

[antikristuseke]

The only vehiacle iv found hardter to drive than a lada is the forklift we ahve at work, 3.5 tons and no power steering.

[CptSimFreak]

They were a car of the year....40 years ago :)


I got to drive this thing around ....quite exciting, especially when breaks started to fail.

http://xdb.xanga.com/9378346365638105104038/w74296311.jpg

[CptSimFreak]

I mean look at this munificent little paragon! It doesn't even have a rpm gauge so driver have to feel the car throuth the body.
http://xe4.xanga.com/0dcd645b53031145037209/w107410222.jpg

[Kapitan]

Im am so glad that driver is religious he must pray each and every 30 seconds in that thing, coming up to traffic lights "oh lord please stop my car" a motorway"oh lord let me pass 45mph"

and the padestrians "oh lord allow me to speed up"

[CptSimFreak]

Im am so glad that driver is religious he must pray each and every 30 seconds in that thing, coming up to traffic lights "oh lord please stop my car" a motorway"oh lord let me pass 45mph"

and the padestrians "oh lord allow me to speed up"
It is a wonderful car that gives quite a lot of respect due to its attributes; Every car moves away and lets driver through; Pedestrians run away from it, cops do not bug you. :rock:

[Kapitan]

Yes i know ive driven three and the only reason cops leave you alone is because the thing is built like a tank and will more than likely destroy the cop car before you ever have a flipping chance of stopping the lada.

Where my friends base is down in shoeburyness he had two lada nivas, one he canibalised for parts the other ran, well we decided to let the 33 tonne modified alvis saracen a 3x3 APC run over the thing.

DID it heck after four attempts we still hadnt snapped the axles time to move in on the big boy our recovery truck finnished it off simply by ramming it into a wall a few times.

If you want to drive a safe car drive lada. garenteed to start in the snow easy to nick although no one will in england. and an engine that will outlast you!

[Kapitan]

Advertisement for lada

0-60 in 3 calender months
0-100 never unless pushed off a cliff

[antikristuseke]

Ah the fun iv had with a few of those, be very careful in bends and such, it has a tendency to come up on two wheels and if you roll over you are quite ****ed since the seatbelts are useless. good times, good times.

Edit: The ladas engine will indeed outlast you, but when the body starts to rust it will go quickly. Driving a car you can feel bend under you in turns is not fun, well it is fun but it isnt safe. Allso dont run into a wall at 30 km/h since arround that speed the hood will rise up and head straight for your head. But at least you will never need more than two tools to fix any problem in a moskovich or lada, an axe and a sledgehammer. With those you can do everything you could ever need to to maintain the car, we have changed the transmition with my uncle using those two.

[Happy Times]

Tchocky, maybe you mension Niva (VAZ 2121) - That's the true masterpiece of a country car. It's cheap and it can go anywhere at all no matter is there any road or it isn't :up:

[/IMG]show_img.php?file=4_8_1164291283&n=Niva_v_Paris.jpg[/IMG]


More modern version: Chevrolet Niva still the cheapest 4x4 but not quite as good money/quality ratio as it's predeсessor hashttp://www.cars.ru/files/news/1253/_n_1253_img1.jpg

Best Regards

Niva is great fun to drive.:D Another even more is the UAZ-469 that we had in the army, we used to race with them in the forest.:rock:

http://tietokannat.mil.fi/kalustoesittely/media/1110199725_UAZ.jpg

[joea]

I recall ads we had in Canada (yup they sold Ladas) "How do you like your Lada? I like mine just fine." Hehe. Well I always thought not every Russian car would be crud, after all I always liked the T-34 and Il-2 and while far from fancy machinery they worked well and were durable.

[Dmitry Markov]

Here are some photos from small town Sebezh (Себеж) in Pskov Region (North-western parts of Russia). I've lived there for two years in 80-s during my father's military service. These photos weren't taken by me - I wish they were but they are from an official site of the town and nereby Nature Park :

http://www.seb-park.org.ru/mfa/Images/nab%20(6).jpg

http://www.seb-park.org.ru/mfa/Images/gor%20(7).jpg

http://www.seb-park.org.ru/mfa/Images/gor%20(4).jpg

http://www.seb-park.org.ru/mfa/Images/gor%20(5).jpg

http://www.sebezh.ru/img/alin/alin16.jpg

More to come

[Dmitry Markov]

This are couple of my photos of the Pskov's Kremlin - I've taken them in autumn 2005:

http://photofile.ru/photo/dmmarkov/3038450/63035293.jpg

http://photofile.ru/photo/dmmarkov/3038450/63035295.jpg


More to come

[Dmitry Markov]

Nice gallery with pictures of my native city: http://www.pbase.com/galina_stepanova/moskva

Especially this one:

http://www.pbase.com/galina_stepanova/image/46658234

:)

[XabbaRus]

Ah Pskov,, beuatiful town and a church on every corner so it seemed.

I'll have to dig out a photo I took of a church, the Sky behind is black with cloud but the sun was reflecting nicely off the white church. almost holy like.

[Dmitry Markov]

I'm longing to see it, XabbaRus! :)

[Dmitry Markov]

Some of my favorite corners of Moscow:





Riverside in Kolomenskoye Park near the center parts of the city:

http://mosday.ru/photos/54_154.jpg
http://mosday.ru/photos/54_155.jpg
http://mosday.ru/photos/54_19.jpg

Hamovniki district:

http://mosday.ru/photos/57_813.jpg


http://mosday.ru/photos/54_29.jpg

Northern Port:

http://mosday.ru/photos/14_79.jpg
http://mosday.ru/photos/45_94.jpg

More to come

[Dmitry Markov]

This thing is situated in Moscow also :yep: :

http://mosday.ru/photos/57_564.jpg

[antikristuseke]

Excuse my ignorance, but what boat is that?

[Kapitan]

Russian tango class SSK but im looking at the picture 3/4 of the way to sleep.

[Dmitry Markov]

Yes, she is Tango class indeed (project 641B "Som" (641Б "Сом") ). Her number is Б-396. Now she is a museum and situated near the North Port on Himkinskoye storage pond (nothern parts of Moscow).

Best Regards

[XabbaRus]

I went to that last year, and I was told the next day they were closing it to start work on the museum. Is it still open?

[Dmitry Markov]

It opened in July this year. Luzhkov ( mayor of Moscow ) is planning to make it a part of a bigger Navy museum including SKR "Druzhny" project 1135 (Krivak I) it's already in Moscow too but still under reconstruction:

http://www.riverfleet.ru/photo/2/skd/032.jpg

There would also be a chapel in honor of Fedor Ushakov

Best Regards!

[Dmitry Markov]

And now they also have brought this one near the Б-396 and it also would be a part of a museum:

http://www.wikimapia.org/p/00/00/14/31/30_big.jpg

It is "Orlyonok" ekranoplan :up:

Best Regards

[nikimcbee]

cool bump:|\\

[CptSimFreak]

cool bump:|\\
here you go.

http://xbb.xanga.com/76dc3211d4732151676667/w113114773.jpg


http://x90.xanga.com/279c17e377133151676661/w113114767.jpg

http://xd9.xanga.com/92fc161b77130151676670/w113114776.jpg

http://x15.xanga.com/9bdc061477033151676675/w113114780.jpg

[nikimcbee]

Some of my favorite corners of Moscow:





Riverside in Kolomenskoye Park near the center parts of the city:

http://mosday.ru/photos/54_154.jpg
http://mosday.ru/photos/54_155.jpg
http://mosday.ru/photos/54_19.jpg

Hamovniki district:

http://mosday.ru/photos/57_813.jpg


http://mosday.ru/photos/54_29.jpg

Northern Port:

http://mosday.ru/photos/14_79.jpg
http://mosday.ru/photos/45_94.jpg

More to come

I love Kolomenskoye!:up: I didn't recognize it without the snow. I think I scanned my picture from there. I've been inside the wood building there:up:

Has anybody been to the Naval Museum in St Petersburg? I'd love to see pictures...It was closed then I was there:damn:

[CptSimFreak]

Has anybody been to the Naval Museum in St Petersburg? I'd love to see pictures...It was closed then I was there:damn:

Look at post above yours. Three of four pics are from there.