To Attack & Get Away With it For Noobs

[Brag]

The GWX Convoy Attack :lurk:

I believe that the continuous success in attacking convoys depends greatly on mental attitude and planning. For the first time attacker, finding oneself in the middle of a convoy, with all those targets and escorts is mind-boggling. Dealing with all the problems under great danger to oneself doesn't help matters. Only by being mentally organized, you will consistently succeed in attacking a convoy and getting away with it.

To make it easier to understand the operation, it is best to break it down into stages: Interception
Peparation
Analysis
Penetration
Positioning
Attack
Evasion.

Interception. You want to position yourself ahead of the convoy. Draw a line depicting the projected course of the convoy and pick a spot where you want to be when the convoy arrives. Keep in mind that convoys do change course (this will be discussed later). The important factors in choosing the ambush point is depth of water and time of the day.

Preparation. Ideally, you want a depth of over 200 meters and the cover of darkness. I like to arrive at my ambush point about 2-3 hours before the convoy's ETA. At this point, I want: Batteries charged to 100%, compressed air 100%, oxygen 100%. All torpedo tubes loaded, crew rested. I double check the depth under the keel at this time and submerge, advancing into the direction of the convoy at 3 knots.

Analysis. When the hydrophone operator (HO) announces the first contact, I check that the convoy is still on the reported (or estimated) course. I adjust my own heading to position to one side of the convoy. The various groupings of contacts will show the columns of ships. At this time is when I tell myself: This is a reconnaissance. I don't need to sink a single ship for my operation to succeed. All I want to know is the composition of the convoy, the number of escorts. I will attack only if conditions are favorable.

I deploy a strong crew to damage control and have idle crew in each compartment, ready to repair damage. Don't bother with torpedo reloads until you are clear of the convoy and out of hearing of the escorts.

Positioning. Most likely, your first visual contact will be an escort zig-zaging in front of the convoy. If in daylight: Down scope, silent running, reduce speed to two knots, mark the escort's position on the chart and keep tracking it by hydrophone and periodically marking the chart. Take a heading that will keep you away from this escort. Once you are past this escort, you are inside the convoy. I try to turn 90 degrees to the convoy's course.

Attack. If at night, I can raise the periscope and begin searching for hi-value targets: Large merchants, tankers, troop ships. In the daytime, I keep the scope down until ready to attack. Once I've raised the scope, it's a quick sweep and I shoot at whatever is available.

At night I can wait for the targets to come to me. I select a good target some distance away and shoot two torpedoes, then pick one closer and send two fish down it's way. Hopefully the explosions will be close to simultaneous (this seems to confuse escorts).

Now we come to the nastiest part of the convoy attack. The escorts know where you are and will come for you.

Evasion. As I fire my last torpedo, I order flank speed, 5 degrees of port or starboard rudder, and a depth of 150 meters and lower my scope. As I pass twenty meters, I order 2 knots. I can still descend quite rapidly as the speed bleeds down. I have anything between two or three minutes before the escorts are overhead.

The escorts in GWX are GOOD, 9 times out of 10, they will come overhead and drop depth charges exactly on top of you. As the escort is almost overhead, I go to ahead flank. Once the speed reaches six knots I order 2 knots. The burst of speed, hopefully will get me out of the lethal range of the DC's. The escort has a problem now he has to find me again, I'm deeper and in a different position and being quiet, not helping him at all.

Try to give the escort as narrow a profile as possible, but don't make sharp turns. Go as deep as you dare. NOTE: people been reporting crushes at less than 200 meters (probably due to previous damage).

If two or more escorts are after you, it will be more difficult to get away.

Once I see, the DC drops become less accurate, I stop going to flank speed. If the escorts lose you for 30 minutes game time, they will go away.

Now you know the composition of the convoy. Your next attack will probably be more profitable. My goal is 15,000 tons per attack. Once it is safe to do, surface, calculate a new intercept point, reload torpedoes and race for another go at the convoy

Convoy course. When calculating intercept, check and see where is the convoy course aiming at, is it a logical destination? If not. You know it will change course. Position yourself to where you think it will turn. Or shadow it from a distance, submerging to get it's location by hydrophone.

I hope this will help you do the nasty on the Allies and a long GWXy life. :D

Happy hunting, Kaleun.

:lost:

[Morts]

nice read:up:

[Camaero]

you say you ideally want a depth of 200 meters during the prep. You never did say when you come to p depth however. When the convoy is on top? Before it gets to you?

Thanks for the post. I will await your answer and try your tactics out the next time I play. :up:

[Corsair]

Well written...:up:

I would just differ on 2 points :

Attack : if it's daylight and nice weather, I would just shadow the convoy from safe distance and plan a night intercept. Had bad experiences with daylight attacks...

Evasion : I found that I get away more often undetected by diving at slow speed (1/3 then slow) from start as I found out that even short bursts at flank speed when diving away would get me spotted.

[mookiemookie]

you say you ideally want a depth of 200 meters during the prep. You never did say when you come to p depth however. When the convoy is on top? Before it gets to you?

Thanks for the post. I will await your answer and try your tactics out the next time I play. :up:

I think he means that you want a depth of at least 200 meters below you, so you have plenty of room to make your escape.

[Brag]

you say you ideally want a depth of 200 meters during the prep. You never did say when you come to p depth however. When the convoy is on top? Before it gets to you?

Thanks for the post. I will await your answer and try your tactics out the next time I play. :up:

I want 200 meters (not always possible) of water under me to escape.
I make the approach at pero depth (harder to detect when near the surface). In daytime, the moment I see the lead escort and have him identified on the hydro plot, the scope comes down and stay down until attack. At night, I will make periodic scope observations, searching for escorts and targets.

I'm at the end of 1940 in my GWX career. When radar starts spotting scopes will have to be more careful at night.

Thanks for your kinds words--keep me posted on your experiences. :arrgh!:

:/\\x:

[Brag]

Thanks, Morts!

:88)

[Brag]

Well written...:up:

I would just differ on 2 points :

Attack : if it's daylight and nice weather, I would just shadow the convoy from safe distance and plan a night intercept. Had bad experiences with daylight attacks...

Evasion : I found that I get away more often undetected by diving at slow speed (1/3 then slow) from start as I found out that even short bursts at flank speed when diving away would get me spotted.

Corsair, your tactic should work. I only use flank when I know the enemy has my position, to get depth quickly. Or when in his baffles when he can't hear me. Thanks for the comments as they add depth (no pun intended) to this discussion.

:|\\

[Morts]

Thanks, Morts!

:88)

Np:up:

even though i dont attack convoys much, it was nice reading so that im ready for when i meet a convoy

[Brag]

Thanks, Morts!

:88)

Np:up:

even though i dont attack convoys much, it was nice reading so that im ready for when i meet a convoy

Good luck and lots of tons on you next one.
:yep:

[Corsair]

Not saying I hold the truth... It's just that I am very careful with using flank speed when submerged because it seems to me from various experiences (usually bad ones) that it kind of sends a signal around "hey, I'm here !"
If it's a lone escort and you are sure to be in his baffles, it should work, but if there are several escorts... You can hear a ship prop 15 / 20 kms away in good conditions, there is no reason why the hydrophone operators on the other side should be deaf...:D
In some conditions (night and light fog for instance), if you had to shoot from long distance for positioning reasons, I think it is even safer to get away surfaced at slow speed (because of the wake) than to submerge at all...
PS : and if the escort are only Flowers, even if they start turning your way, you can also outrun them as you are faster surfaced at flank speed.

[Morts]

next one?, im mid patrol :)

im just exploring right now, and ofcourse looking for enemy/neutral ships:arrgh!:
but im not much of a convoy attacker

[AVGWarhawk]

AHHHH preparation.... yeah right... I sail in on the surface no matter the time of day!!!! FULL SPEED!!! Send the fish off with full bird salute:up: Spin around 180 for the sterns tubes, give them the full moon with my watch crew.:o Dive for the bottom! Silent running..what does that mean, you have your socks on? J/K Brag!!!! Thanks for the read and please join me on my second patrol:rotfl::rotfl:

[Morts]

AVGwarhawk, im sorry but i have to declare you INSANE:rotfl: :rotfl:

[Brag]

Not saying I hold the truth... It's just that I am very careful with using flank speed when submerged because it seems to me from various experiences (usually bad ones) that it kind of sends a signal around "hey, I'm here !"
If it's a lone escort and you are sure to be in his baffles, it should work, but if there are several escorts... You can hear a ship prop 15 / 20 kms away in good conditions, there is no reason why the hydrophone operators on the other side should be deaf...:D
In some conditions (night and light fog for instance), if you had to shoot from long distance for positioning reasons, I think it is even safer to get away surfaced at slow speed (because of the wake) than to submerge at all...
PS : and if the escort are only Flowers, even if they start turning your way, you can also outrun them as you are faster surfaced at flank speed.

Can't argue with your logic, especially since no tactical situation is ever exactly the same. And being quiet is a quality a Kaleun should pursue. :up:

[Brag]

AHHHH preparation.... yeah right... I sail in on the surface no matter the time of day!!!! FULL SPEED!!! Send the fish off with full bird salute:up: Spin around 180 for the sterns tubes, give them the full moon with my watch crew.:o Dive for the bottom! Silent running..what does that mean, you have your socks on? J/K Brag!!!! Thanks for the read and please join me on my second patrol:rotfl::rotfl:

Yah, Warhawk! Your second patrol is the guarantee of doom. I'll send Bernard as my stand in :rotfl: :rotfl:

BTW, I've made it to Dec. '40 and now sailing in a IXB sumbie without optional extras. This sled left me renown broke :roll:

[AVGWarhawk]

I see your goal is 15000 tons per attack. I'm happy if I get 2 merchant but I guess it all depends if you can bag the fats one!!! Currently I'm in 40' with my IXB PATROL NUMBER 5:rock:. Thanks to posts like this I can make patrol number 6 and more:up::up: The offer is still up for patrol number two in my next new boat and port of call!!!!

[Brag]

I see your goal is 15000 tons per attack. I'm happy if I get 2 merchant but I guess it all depends if you can bag the fats one!!! Currently I'm in 40' with my IXB PATROL NUMBER 5:rock:. Thanks to posts like this I can make patrol number 6 and more:up::up: The offer is still up for patrol number two in my next new boat and port of call!!!!

A goal is just that. I seldom achieve it on my first greeting a convoy. But once I get its layout, I have a better idea what to aim for on the encore performance. "Hullo, you big fat buggers. I's gotz you in my sights." On my last patrol, got two big freighters with 4 torps, which exploded within 10 seconds. The escorts never bothered me -- That got me the IXB sumbie.

:-j

[She-Wolf]

useful advice here. Can we save a whole thread to desktop do you know anyone?

[mookiemookie]

useful advice here. Can we save a whole thread to desktop do you know anyone?

At the top of the page, there's an option for "thread tools" that you can click. Click there, and you should see a link to "show printable version." That's what you want. :know:

[Mooncatt]

well that has really helped me as i was attacking convoys from the side :oops: so thanx for this its really easy to understand and doesnt baffle us all with the techincal side of things:up:

[danlisa]

Nice post Brag:up:

But did anyone mention that in the GWX manual there is a section on Surviving an ASW Attack. It's very good, try that too.

[Mooncatt]

well yea i understand that too. only problem i have is that once the convoy is right on you and you make a 90 degree turn wont all the ships be too close to even lauch a fish without it just bouncing of the side??

[danlisa]

True, but you should be targetting the column of merchants farthest away from you. That way you're luring the escorts away from you.

So, if you're approaching from the right hand side of the convoy target a ship on the far left and watch all the escorts start searching over there.;)

[Woof1701]

Hi Brag,

Very nice read. Thanks a lot.
Now the only thing I need is a guide "To make a surface attack at night and get away for seasoned AOD players" :)

[She-Wolf]

useful advice here. Can we save a whole thread to desktop do you know anyone?
At the top of the page, there's an option for "thread tools" that you can click. Click there, and you should see a link to "show printable version." That's what you want. :know:

thank you Mookie, I have downloaded this and three others now I know about that:up:

[Brag]

Hi Brag,

Very nice read. Thanks a lot.
Now the only thing I need is a guide "To make a surface attack at night and get away for seasoned AOD players" :)

In the game, I believe, a surface attack is suicide. The captain of the British destroyer who captured Priem wrote: when he inspected Priem's binoculars that he understood how the Germans were able to see much better because of the night vision quality of the Zeiss glasses. In comparison, the Brits were blind. This is not the case in SHIII or GWX. They will see you.:huh:

[Brag]

well yea i understand that too. only problem i have is that once the convoy is right on you and you make a 90 degree turn wont all the ships be too close to even lauch a fish without it just bouncing of the side??

Moon,
Not only that, but you have to watch out for collision with the larger freighters, so be ready to lower your scope reall fast. I position my scope at 90 or 270 degrees the face the oncoming ships as the scope comes up.

Danlisa explains well where to aim.

Let me know how you do on your next convoy attack. ;)

[Brag]

Nice post Brag:up:

But did anyone mention that in the GWX manual there is a section on Surviving an ASW Attack. It's very good, try that too.

Thanks for the kind words. I should have mentioned that my tactics are greatly influenced by the GWX manual. After reading it, I did two test patrols and 4 convoy attacks in 1942 conditions. Got zapped whenever I deviated from the concepts of caution stated on this post.
:/\\x:

[ref]

This could also be usefull, I've been doing a lot of tests with DCs latelly trying to emulate the disturbance they produce when they explode, and using a lot the free cam (cheating the most I could) to survive multiple passes I found some interesting stuff:
- best way to dive fast is order crash dive and before reaching the crash dive depth order a lower depth, the planes remain at a higher angle than a normal dive.

- If you're about 90/100 meters doing 2 knots and a DD makes a DC run once it's passing over your sub, hit flank speed and order a 90º course with the dd, you clear the DCs for 10/15 meters, enough to avoid damage and gain depth, once you hear the first DC explode 2 knots again, you anounce your presence to the DD using their hydrophones, but the one making the attack couldn't hit you, two or three attack runs and you're near 180/200 meters then set a speed of 1 knot and try to sneak away. Once they get the hedgehogs it's another matter, as they fall much faster and you can't wait to hear the splashes, you've to order flank before the DD passes over you.

Ref

[Brag]

This could also be usefull, I've been doing a lot of tests with DCs latelly trying to emulate the disturbance they produce when they explode, and using a lot the free cam (cheating the most I could) to survive multiple passes I found some interesting stuff:
- best way to dive fast is order crash dive and before reaching the crash dive depth order a lower depth, the planes remain at a higher angle than a normal dive.

- If you're about 90/100 meters doing 2 knots and a DD makes a DC run once it's passing over your sub, hit flank speed and order a 90º course with the dd, you clear the DCs for 10/15 meters, enough to avoid damage and gain depth, once you hear the first DC explode 2 knots again, you anounce your presence to the DD using their hydrophones, but the one making the attack couldn't hit you, two or three attack runs and you're near 180/200 meters then set a speed of 1 knot and try to sneak away. Once they get the hedgehogs it's another matter, as they fall much faster and you can't wait to hear the splashes, you've to order flank before the DD passes over you.

Ref

Hola amigo!
Your experiences are pretty close to what I have seen. The only difference in our tactics is that I don't use full rudder as 1.) It slows my escape. 2.) It creates a noise knuckle. I use 5-10 degrees rudder, zig-zagging. This subtle change in heading seems to throw off the escorts and they tend to drop their DCs in a slightly wrong position (every little bit helps) :roll:.

How are the chiquitas this summer? :lol:

:help:

[ref]

How are the chiquitas this summer? :lol:

:help:

Too busy with RL work to go to the beach :nope:
Anyway today weather is a bit cold and overcast and I have a good view from my office to one of the most comercial streets, a lot of tourists walking and shopping, a lot of babes :cool:

Ref