1st encounter with an enemy sub

[Warmonger]

I had it today when returning to St Nazaire after a pretty good patrol.

Time: Mid December '42
Location: about 400km out of St Nazaire
Sub: VIIC vs S-Class

I had only 2 TIV left in my aft tube, winds at 12 m/s so gun was out of question (at least for me...).

Here some pics:

First torpedo fired at 1600m:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/Warmonger2/firing1.jpg


1st torpedo homing in on the screws (although the sub was only making 8 knots...)
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/Warmonger2/torp1_in-1.jpg


1st torpedo hits the screws but does not immobilize the sub...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/Warmonger2/torp1_hit.jpg


So I set up for a second attack and see that the sub is listing already to the stern:
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/Warmonger2/sub_listing.jpg


2nd and last torpedo fired and inbound...
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/1003/Warmonger2/torp2_in.jpg


Waiting for the impact..........AND

CLONK! :o

A dud!
As I watched the sub with disgust through my periscope it opened fire with its deckgun and took 5% from my hull!

So I dove deep and crawled away...

[ReallyDedPoet]

Nice. I am in Saint Nazaire presently, hopefully I will come across something like this.

[bigboywooly]

Aint that the way
Last torp and its a dud
And the weathers too rough for the DG

Always bugs me that how everything else can fire the guns even in a 15m storm and we cant

[Albrecht Von Hesse]

Aint that the way
Last torp and its a dud
And the weathers too rough for the DG

Always bugs me that how everything else can fire the guns even in a 15m storm and we cant

Well, everything else has their gun platforms quite a bit higher above the water than we do. :p

I think it's less that our deck gun is too inaccurate in heavy seas and is more a matter of watching your gun crew go (involuntarily, kicking and screaming) swimming before they get a single round off.

[Warmonger]

But a sub equally big and seaworthy to mine being able to man and fire the DG while I'm not is not fair..:arrgh!:

[Albrecht Von Hesse]

But a sub equally big and seaworthy to mine being able to man and fire the DG while I'm not is not fair..:arrgh!:

Errrr . . . dats true. Then again, the poor thang can't actually fire torpedoes and is stuck on the surface, so perhaps it's a draw. ;) :p

[Warmonger]

But a sub equally big and seaworthy to mine being able to man and fire the DG while I'm not is not fair..:arrgh!:
Errrr . . . dats true. Then again, the poor thang can't actually fire torpedoes and is stuck on the surface, so perhaps it's a draw. ;) :p


Uhm well, seen like that you could be true...:hmm::D

[danurve]

Interesting event. I wonder what would have happened if you rammed the sub at periscope depth?

WWBHD?

[raymond6751]

Any idea if this was an American or British sub?

My research has indicated that British subs were sent off to the Med early in the war to avoid being attacked when mistaken for u-boats.

An S boat would only have range to St. Nazaire if it were British. The West Coast of US is just out of range.

A bit of fiction, eh?

[bigboywooly]

You may need some more research then :rotfl:

P514 21.6.42 Mistaken for U-boat and rammed by minesweeper HMCS Georgian in Western Atlantic.

Unique 24.10.42 Sunk in Atlantic, on passage from UK to Gibraltar.

Unbeaten 11.11.42 Sunk in Bay of Biscay, Atlantic, in error by Wellington of No 172 Sqdn RAF Coastal Command, 110nm SSW of Ushant.

http://web.ukonline.co.uk/chalcraft/sm/ww2sm2.html

While its true most did go to the med and the Indian Ocean as well as the Pacific there were subs that stayed in home waters and the North sea
Plus new boats out of the UK in 42\43 had their first patrols out of the UK before moving bases
Not possibly all S class but its the only one we have so eh

[Mooncatt]

can enemy subs fire fish at you????? i thought i read somewhere that they can only fire their deck gun.

[Jimbuna]

Deck guns only...but in all weather conditions :o

[Mooncatt]

:o wot???? not fair.

[Boris]

One torpedo should rip a sub apart! I think this needs some changing.

[danlisa]

One torpedo should rip a sub apart! I think this needs some changing.

Will this still be true IF the AI Torp is perfected?

I know that realistically 1 torp can destroy a sub but it would be a game killer.

:hmm: Second thoughts, bring on more realism. I can just imagine seeing a torp being dropped from a plane through my bino's. Probably the last thing I see.:dead:

[melnibonian]

One torpedo should rip a sub apart! I think this needs some changing.
I think it depends where the sub is hit. One torpedo can damage a sub (to the point it cannot submerge for example) but if it hits it in the bow I cannot see how it can sink it every time. I would suggest to treat subs like any other ship with critical areas. If the torpedo hits there caboom. If not give them a probability or something to survive one torpedo hit. Obviously that's just a suggestion.

[Mooncatt]

lol yeah would be a bit of a show stopper being killed with just one fish, but hell yeah 1 torp would annihilate a sub no probs

[Warmonger]

The hole even one torpedo would rip into a sub's hull would normally be enough to sink it, no matter if it's a small or a big sub.

[Jimbuna]

One torpedo should rip a sub apart! I think this needs some changing.
I think it depends where the sub is hit. One torpedo can damage a sub (to the point it cannot submerge for example) but if it hits it in the bow I cannot see how it can sink it every time. I would suggest to treat subs like any other ship with critical areas. If the torpedo hits there caboom. If not give them a probability or something to survive one torpedo hit. Obviously that's just a suggestion.

There could be the slight consideration of bow torpedos :hmm:

[Albrecht Von Hesse]

One torpedo should rip a sub apart! I think this needs some changing.

While I agree that I think the subs should be more vulnerable to torpedo hits, it's not necessarily true that a single hit would automatically fatally damage a sub. The FIDO ASW aucoustical homing torpedo did not destroy every U-boat it hit; quite a few were simply damaged . . . although I really don't think calling the damage they did do was just 'simple'. ;)

[Respenus]

Excellent encounter! Wish I ever saw something like this (but it is true I haven't played SH3 since my first GWX Beta game (making it also the only one)). :-?

[andy_311]

I never saw a enemy sub until I got down to the Far East and I saw so many of them I got sick of them.

[bigboywooly]

Just had 2 patrols by Gib from Lorient
Got whacked in the first by an escort and had to dock at Thalia - no bow tubes and only 1 stern left
Loads of fish left though :damn:
Anyway on leaving Thalia came across another convoy close to Gib heading west
Hit the convoy and took out 2 of the escorts and 3 mercs
Took some hits from another Black Swan inc destroyed forward batteries
Managed to lose the BS and caught up with the convoy on the surface
As I overtook I took out that damn Black Swan then had a surface duel with a Corvette
:rotfl:
So methinks - convoy unescorted
Closed decks awash on flank of convoy and boom
We are taking damage
Eh ?

http://img343.imageshack.us/img343/3255/screenhunter168ct8.jpg

Didnt notice this sucker

4 hits from the 105mm and he was gone too

Pity its 1941 and the bigger mercs have guns
Ended up sinking 12 from the convoy before all out of shells and fish ( sunk 2 mercs with DG before I found the convoy )

[Kapitan Edvard]

Interesting event. I wonder what would have happened if you rammed the sub at periscope depth?

WWBHD?

On a side note, what is the effect on the submarine if it rams a small vessal such as a tug or a trawler head on? I would imagine it cause some damage to the hull, but is it much?


EDIT: Oh, and bigboywooly, how did you get those screenshots? I'm having a bit of difficulty

[bigboywooly]

I use a program called Screenhunter 4.1 pro
Hit the print screen button and it saves them in a format and folder of my choice

Had it so long to be honest I cant remember how to do it normally in game :oops:
But there is a way

[Corrupt_File]

Interesting event. I wonder what would have happened if you rammed the sub at periscope depth?

WWBHD?
On a side note, what is the effect on the submarine if it rams a small vessal such as a tug or a trawler head on? I would imagine it cause some damage to the hull, but is it much?


EDIT: Oh, and bigboywooly, how did you get those screenshots? I'm having a bit of difficulty

Virtually Nil, I've taken down many MV's and sloops alike with just my tube. No credit tho, but fun.

[Jimbuna]

I use a program called Screenhunter 4.1 pro
Hit the print screen button and it saves them in a format and folder of my choice

Had it so long to be honest I cant remember how to do it normally in game :oops:
But there is a way

Ctrl + F11 and the screenshot is saved in your SH3 folder :up:

[fabel]

Cool, those enemy submarines, I never saw one, until now:sunny:

[Torpex752]

Shame it isnt possible to alter how much and what tyope of ammo the AI subs have. You could mod the files giving them torps and only 4. Might look silly seeing a torp fly out of a deck gun... LOL but it would only be silly for a second! :P

Frank :cool:

[bigboywooly]

Shame it isnt possible to alter how much and what tyope of ammo the AI subs have. You could mod the files giving them torps and only 4. Might look silly seeing a torp fly out of a deck gun... LOL but it would only be silly for a second! :P

Frank :cool:

Well Serg uses a similar workaround but with the gun in the sub so you dont see the moment it fires
Am still hoping the AI torpedo will be perfected
Anvart and Serg have had some success with AI fish from an aircraft so hopefully will be working for subs before long
Ref is also on the case
Between those 3 guys is a wealth of talent so fingers crossed eh

[TheSatyr]

Keep in mind that all subs were trimmed to dive as quickly as possible,meaning that they had very little positive bouyancy. One Torp hit anywhere would destroy whatever positive bouyancy the sub had. A few US subs were hit by circular running torps,(at least 2 boats). Neither survived the hit.

And I can't remember reading about any sub surviving a torp hit.

[Torpex752]

Keep in mind that all subs were trimmed to dive as quickly as possible,meaning that they had very little positive bouyancy. One Torp hit anywhere would destroy whatever positive bouyancy the sub had. A few US subs were hit by circular running torps,(at least 2 boats). Neither survived the hit.

And I can't remember reading about any sub surviving a torp hit.

Not being argumentative, but I'm not sure where the thought process came from that has permeated the bouyancy knowledge here. basic submarine doctrine from now to the turtle is to always find your neutral bouyancy. Thats the norm even US boats in WWII trimmed for neutral in a surfaced and submerged condition. Its the only safe thing to do. The thermal and salinity layers that exist in the oceans do not have a regular location. So if you were triming light (like the current SHIII GWX model) and went into water that would induce a positive bouyancy, or were crash diving and hit that layer, it could/would slow your decent downwards to the point you could not go unless you injested seawater to make your boat heavier. Remember, a "layer" can be temperature AND salinity which the more salinity the lighter your boat will behave. The flip side could be trimming heavy and diving into a layer that will make your boat act heavy. (I assure you that when I've conducted my trim dives, I've sailed right into a layer and needed speed to keep from sinking to the bottom, and floating to the top, sometimes as much as 20k lbs of seawater was needed to be injested or pumped) In doing this you could find yourself going straight to the bottom because the combination of negative layer and negative bouyancy would be more then the engines could pull out. I honestly dont know if the Germans conducted trim dives daily like US boats were required to if they spent alot of time on the surface, but I am sure that when they dove to do a sound check, they checked their trim as well.
Just for an FYI, all this trim adjustment is conducted with trim tanks, not ballast tanks. If you'd like an explanation between the two, just ask.

Frank :cool:

[JU_88]

um.. just about every sub in WW2 sunk by a torpedo -broke in half. ;) Think about it.