Das Boot (the original uncut version DVD)

[von Zelda]

If you play SH3, you must see this movie on DVD. This was my holiday gift to myself. I ordered it from Amazon for approximately $36.

[AVGWarhawk]

I already got the wife working on that for me:up::D

[melnibonian]

Oh yes. This is the best Sub movie ever. I think there should be a question in the installation of SH about it. It should be something like 'Have you seen Das Boot?' If you reply no then the installation should stop and tells you 'Fine go buy a copy of the movie, see it and then come back and continue with the installation of SH'!!!
:rotfl: :rotfl:

[Albrecht Von Hesse]

Oh yes. This is the best Sub movie ever. I think there should be a question in the installation of SH about it. It should be something like 'Have you seen Das Boot?' If you reply no then the installation should stop and tells you 'Fine go buy a copy of the movie, see it and then come back and continue with the installation of SH'!!!
:rotfl: :rotfl:

Hide the install key somewhere in the movie. :o

[melnibonian]

Hide the install key somewhere in the movie. :o

That's a Brilliant idea :yep: :yep: :yep:

[CptGrayWolf]

Personaly I find the uncut version much too long, and some scenes I can understand why they were cut (the mistaken bird for an airplane bit was horrible)!
But it was nice to see Francoise...:)

[VIICDriver]

Have not personally seen it but am going to have to buy it. It is subtitled correct?

Chuck

[Captain Nemo]

Have not personally seen it but am going to have to buy it. It is subtitled correct?

Chuck

If you buy the DVD you can play it with German language and english subtitles or you can play it dubbed over in english. It's your choice.

Nemo

[kylania]

Have not personally seen it but am going to have to buy it. It is subtitled correct?

Chuck
If you buy the DVD you can play it with German language and english subtitles or you can play it dubbed over in english. It's your choice.

Nemo

There really isn't a choice. :D You must watch it in German with English subtiles if so desired or else you're going on bilge duty!

They did get the actual actors to do the English voice overs though, so that helps a little, but it's still not as good as the German language.

The subtitles in the 5 hour version are slightly different than in the 3 hour version, not as good I feel, and the sound is supposedly not as good either (but I couldn't tell on a DTS/THX system) but the extra footage makes up for any shortcommings.

[Respenus]

It hurts me down real deep because I have only see the Directors Cut!

BTW, I don't think there's a Kaleun here that hasn't seen Das Boot (If they haven't, go lunch yourself from a torpedo tube till you reach the coast of some country and buy Das Boot there! :arrgh!:)

[Gogs]

My copy is still in the plastic wrapping. Its been a toss up of play the game or watch the DVD since I got it. I'm a very long way from being bored of the game yet and the other half "doesn't like war films". I will get around to it soon but which would you rather do for 5 hours?

[CptGrayWolf]

My copy is still in the plastic wrapping. Its been a toss up of play the game or watch the DVD since I got it. I'm a very long way from being bored of the game yet and the other half "doesn't like war films". I will get around to it soon but which would you rather do for 5 hours?

Umm...you can't play the game one day and watch the movie the next day?
And btw, tell your other half this war film is actualy an anti-war film.

[Respenus]

My copy is still in the plastic wrapping. Its been a toss up of play the game or watch the DVD since I got it. I'm a very long way from being bored of the game yet and the other half "doesn't like war films". I will get around to it soon but which would you rather do for 5 hours?
Umm...you can't play the game one day and watch the movie the next day?
And btw, tell your other half this war film is actualy an anti-war film.

:yep:

Most probably true. The Nazi propagandy most surerly wouldn't play it around!

[Goat]

Keep an eye on your TV guide. It has been on several times, full width, and in German, no breaks for commercials ! That's where I got MY VCR tape of it...

[Respenus]

Keep an eye on your TV guide. It has been on several times, full width, and in German, no breaks for commercials ! That's where I got MY VCR tape of it...

And I only get 4 national programs! But not for long! :p

[VIICDriver]

Ordrered it on netflix. Should be here maybe Tuesday or so.

Chuck

[Sailor Steve]

I bought the DVD when it was released two years ago. Except for the four months I've been unable to use my computer or TV I've watched at least once every month since I got it. It's that good. When I have other things to do I watch it one hour at a time.

The subtitles aren't as good as in the Director's Cut, nor is the sound. Personally I liked the 'false alarm' scene, and while it was indeed nice to actually see Francoise, she didn't appear in the book so it's odd. I don't think it's too long. One time I watched it in English with the English subtitles. It's amazing how much they changed for the 'nicer' English version. Best of all is Werner's narration, which doesn't appear in any other version. I actually found the shorter Director's Cut to be more boring than the long version.

It is definitely worth the money, and the time it takes to watch.

[CptGrayWolf]

I bought the DVD when it was released two years ago. Except for the four months I've been unable to use my computer or TV I've watched at least once every month since I got it. It's that good. When I have other things to do I watch it one hour at a time.

The subtitles aren't as good as in the Director's Cut, nor is the sound. Personally I liked the 'false alarm' scene, and while it was indeed nice to actually see Francoise, she didn't appear in the book so it's odd. I don't think it's too long. One time I watched it in English with the English subtitles. It's amazing how much they changed for the 'nicer' English version. Best of all is Werner's narration, which doesn't appear in any other version. I actually found the shorter Director's Cut to be more boring than the long version.

It is definitely worth the money, and the time it takes to watch.

Hmm...I might give it another go and watch it again.

[Jimbuna]

If you play SH3, you must see this movie on DVD. This was my holiday gift to myself. I ordered it from Amazon for approximately $36.

Oh..right...what's this film about ? Is it any good ?:D (joke) :up:

[Tachyon]

German with subtitles is a must, the crew saying "Captain" instead of Herr Kaleun seems a little out of place to me :)

Oh, and does anyone know where to get the soundtrack for the movie? In particular , the theme music?

[tycho102]

German with subtitles is a must, the crew saying "Captain" instead of Herr Kaleun seems a little out of place to me

I agree. It's the same thing with any other foreign language film: I cannot stand the english track.

I have the "superbit" version. As far as I know, it's the director's cut with a little higher bitrate on the video.

[Hybris]

When I play the movie in Germen with English subs and play SH3 I usually sink 3 to 5 times as much shipping then otherwise. Strange isn't?:hmm:

[Shape76]

The first time I watched "Das Boot" I was still in my pree-teen years and I already loved it like crazy back then.

Many years later the first DVD came out, labelled as Director's Cut. Anxious and thrilled as I was I totally oversaw that it was just a bit longer than the cinematic version back from the 80's but to me there is only one true version - the long 5-6 hour version. Grrrreeeeaaat disappointment !

Then someday about 3 years ago I couldn't believe my eyes when I saw the original long version available as DVD which I bought practically instantly. Never saw the Directors Cut after that again.

[frau kaleun]

I bought the DVD when it was released two years ago. Except for the four months I've been unable to use my computer or TV I've watched at least once every month since I got it. It's that good. When I have other things to do I watch it one hour at a time.


I'm glad to see I'm not the only one, lol.

After years of having it on my mental list of "movies I need to see before I die" I finally got it from Netflix over the summer. I had the thing for nearly a month and watched all or at least part of it almost every day, once I got started. I couldn't bear to send it back until I'd gotten my own copy from Amazon. Now I've got the uncut version as well and I watch either one or the other - all the way through, or whatever there's time for - on a pretty regular basis. I can't remember the last time I was so "taken" with a movie, and I'm still not the least bit bored with it.

There are a lot of things I prefer about the uncut version, altho' I have to say the intercutting of the "Francoise" scenes at the beginning that break up the scenes in the bar annoy me to no end. I much preferred learning about her and Ullman in the short scene in the DC where Werner asks to see her picture and Ullman reveals the full extent of his situation.

[frau kaleun]

German with subtitles is a must, the crew saying "Captain" instead of Herr Kaleun seems a little out of place to me :)

Oh, and does anyone know where to get the soundtrack for the movie? In particular , the theme music?

I got mine here:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000006UOJ/ref=oss_T15_product

Amazon.de has it available as an mp3 download. Don't know about other non-US Amazon sites. The North American release of the CD is out of print IIRC - the import from a third party seller was the only thing I could find there.

[flakmonkey]

Best sub movie by far, although 4:42 is a tad long to watch in a single sitting, i picked it up for 99p from woolworths before they went bust, bargin!

[Zilch]

It's available on Netflix via instant stream. I watched on my Xbox 360. More than once.

[comet61]

German with subtitles is a must, the crew saying "Captain" instead of Herr Kaleun seems a little out of place to me

I agree 100%. Don't use the English track. Subtitles only. The translation and dubbing in English is way below par and it takes something away from the scenes. Yes...it is long. But you must remember that this film was never intended for theaters. It was originally a 6 part mini-series...hence the uncut length. I found that the scenes cut from the released version to be somewhat refreshing and granted a few of them were on the dull side. The director did not make this as a war movie but about people under unusual stressful circumstances in a U-Boat. The cat-and-mouse scenes are intense and the Jurgen Prochnow character (kaptain) said it best in one scene.."now it gets psychological"....which it is and the movie follows the characters during these intense scenes. The captain of the original U-96 was on the set as a "technical advisor"....watch the extras on the DVD.

I like this movie a lot. One of the best war-time movies ever made.

[nikimcbee]

I bought the DVD when it was released two years ago. Except for the four months I've been unable to use my computer or TV I've watched at least once every month since I got it. It's that good. When I have other things to do I watch it one hour at a time.

The subtitles aren't as good as in the Director's Cut, nor is the sound. Personally I liked the 'false alarm' scene, and while it was indeed nice to actually see Francoise, she didn't appear in the book so it's odd. I don't think it's too long. One time I watched it in English with the English subtitles. It's amazing how much they changed for the 'nicer' English version. Best of all is Werner's narration, which doesn't appear in any other version. I actually found the shorter Director's Cut to be more boring than the long version.

It is definitely worth the money, and the time it takes to watch.

That was one thing I noticed too, the bad language has been really toned down from the original release. Some of the jokes have also changed somewhat.

[flag4]

i beleive Lothar-Günter Buchheim did not like it so much, criticism being aimed at over dramatisation, unreal dialogue. i think he thought it was a hollywood-style actioner more than a real life film about a U-Boat. here is the link from Wiki...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Das_Boot

i thought the book was fantastic and its ashame that his other works are not available in translation.

flakmonkey: that is true shopping !!

[Jimbuna]

Best sub movie by far, although 4:42 is a tad long to watch in a single sitting, i picked it up for 99p from woolworths before they went bust, bargin!

Way to go http://www.psionguild.org/forums/images/smilies/wolfsmilies/thumbsup.gif

[JScones]

Oh..right...what's this film about ? Is it any good ?:D (joke) :up:
Just watch SH5.


:D

[Rapt0r56]

Agreed, i still watch and love the uncut Tv mini series, also when i known the whole Movie and every Scene in it. :shucks:

[Sailor Steve]

WOW! Was this really resurrected after three years? I'm not complaining, just surprised.

I actually wish the long version was divided into the original miniseries episodes. It would be easier to watch, and I've always been curious to know where the episode breaks are.

[Panser]

The miniseries is one of my strongest memories of growing up. As I recall it was a regular fixture on BBC2 at about 6pm in the late 80's / early 90's. I guess I really didn't stand much chance of not being a silent hunter fan... I've no idea how many times I must have seen Das Boot over the years!

As for the best version, I suppose this all comes down to personal preference, though I will be controversial and say that I prefer the full, uncut version. The subtitles differ in some ways to those of the Director's Cut (I own both), but with my scant knowledge of German I feel the full version has the more accurate subtitles. Neither are perfect, but I think the DC version tends to gloss over some of the more crass lines to make them less rude, something which seems rather petty given the sort of men the film is about (Frenssen's farts and the infamous violin string spring to mind). It also has a tendency to be rather apologetic, particularly by "explaining" apparently controversial scenes with subtitles that just aren't spoken or even suggested in any way, a prime example being the scene with the survivors fleeing the burning ship.

To draw my conclusions to a close, I feel the DC version has been cut to be more palatable and easily understood by British and American audiences or those who don't quite understand the realities of war and the lifestyle these men had to endure. I also reckon the uncut version matches the pace of the book much better, as it really draws out the frustration and impatience of certain scenes. For a first time viewer, I would probably advise the Director's Cut. For anyone familiar with the film, do yourself a favour and check out the uncut version!

As an aside, my copy of the DC has an amusing error in it:
In the scene where Thomsen has collapsed on the toilet floor in the brothel, even with German audio on he gets up and declares (in English) "I AM NOT IN THE CONDITION TO ****!" before continuing in German :haha:

[Sailor Steve]

It's the same in the Uncut version. Another funny is just before the captain's "Now, men...all clear?" The Chief turns to Werner and says "Here it comes. The Speech." and after he says "Some speech, huh?"

That scene isn't in the Uncut version or the Director's Cut, but it is in the very shortest theatrical version. I find that strange and funny all at the same time.

[frau kaleun]

As an aside, my copy of the DC has an amusing error in it:
In the scene where Thomsen has collapsed on the toilet floor in the brothel, even with German audio on he gets up and declares (in English) "I AM NOT IN THE CONDITION TO ****!" before continuing in German :haha:

Don't know if I'm misunderstanding you, but I'm not sure the English dialogue is an error - I think it was either written in the script for him to say it in English, or else the actor just decided to do it that way and they left it as is because Petersen liked it. (On the DC commentary they do allude to the fact that the actor's drunkenness in the scene was not all acting, lol, so who knows?) Either way there are other instances in "Das Boot" where Der Alte also speaks English, especially (it seems to me) to emphasize a point to someone.

I could be wrong but I think English language was an educational requirement for Kriegsmarine officers at the time? So I don't find it particularly unusual that Thomsen uses English in that scene.

I do find it funny that I get English subtitles for a line very clearly and effectively spoken in English, lol. Although on one version - can't remember which - they actually don't appear, IIRC, until after he's already completed the line and is tossing off the sarcastic "Sieg Heil" to end the scene.

There are things I like about each version over the other - the DC certainly is handy when I want to sit down and watch the storyline to completion in one go but don't have enough time for the uncut version. Also there are some scenes in the uncut version I could do just as well without - my biggest dislike (and it's still a small one) is the introduction of Ullman's French girlfriend as a flesh-and-blood person instead of just another far-off loved one to be worried about and longed for. She's the only one "left behind" at home or back in port by any of the men that we actually see and hear in person - everyone else is just a face in a picture or the subject of a conversation among the officers and men of the Kriegsmarine, and to me the absence of "face time" for the viewer with those faraway loved ones does something to increase the poignancy of the situation. It seems to emphasize even more the isolation of the officers and crew from things most of us take for granted and their distance from the comforts of home and life on land.

Also I'd really prefer the nightclub scene to play out without being interrupted by scenes of Ullman and Francoise, even if they have to be in there somewhere. I find it really jarring to be yanked from one to the other and back again - maybe it was done for some kind of effect but it just doesn't work for me.

On the other hand, there are SO MANY great extra scenes in the extended version that to complain about a few at the very beginning seems like the worst kind of nitpicking, even from a certified veteran nitpicker like myself. :D

I especially love all the extra interaction we see between Der Alte and different members of the crew, especially when he's shown in more parts of the boat than just the control room, o-messe, and his own quarters. Makes him seem much more involved than might be obvious from what gets shown in just the DC. Of course in a boat that small it would be hard NOT be involved in darn near everything that goes on, lol, but it's nice to see it. The little conversation with Johann back in the engine room about good seamen and careful seamen and how "they" want heroes no matter what the cost is, to me, priceless.

But oh how I wish they'd been able to work in the scene from the book that Petersen said he wanted to include but didn't or couldn't - Der Alte in the galley cooking up potato pancakes for the entire crew. Now that would have been awesome.

[frau kaleun]

It's the same in the Uncut version. Another funny is just before the captain's "Now, men...all clear?" The Chief turns to Werner and says "Here it comes. The Speech." and after he says "Some speech, huh?"

That scene isn't in the Uncut version or the Director's Cut, but it is in the very shortest theatrical version. I find that strange and funny all at the same time.

I wonder why it didn't make the longer versions? Someone referred to it in another forum I was at a while back and I had no idea what they were talking about - kept looking for it in both of the versions I have and was mystified. Thought I must be missing some background dialogue that just wasn't subtitled. I've never seen the original, shorter theatrical release so now my confusion is, er, less confusing.

[Panser]

frau kaleun and Sailor Steve, I 've just checked on my copy (yes, I'm really that anal) and you're right, he speaks English in that scene on both versions. I guess that was just a case of misremembering on my part, but I always figured it to be an error in the audio tracks. I never realised that was intentional. :oops:

[Terragon]

Bought mine as part of the Wolfgang Peterson collection. Directors Cut, still pretty good. Mom's side of the family is German, so I know a little bit, but not nearly enough to keep up with three hours worth of it. Used English subtitles, quite a powerful movie. The best sub movie I probably have ever seen. U571 was such a let down, don't you agree?

[DaveU186]

Not even sure which version I have. Blinding film though.

"Sink them all" :arrgh!::cool:

[frau kaleun]

Not even sure which version I have. Blinding film though.

"Sink them all" :arrgh!::cool:

if you have it on dvd, i think it's got to be either the director's cut theatrical re-release or the miniseries extended version. iirc the original shorter theatrical version never came out on dvd. i could be wrong though.

i think the director's cut clocks in at around 3 1/2 hours, one disc that you have to turn over midway through. extended cut is closer to 5 hours on two disks. (at least the region 1 versions i have.)

[frau kaleun]

frau kaleun and Sailor Steve, I 've just checked on my copy (yes, I'm really that anal) and you're right, he speaks English in that scene on both versions. I guess that was just a case of misremembering on my part, but I always figured it to be an error in the audio tracks. I never realised that was intentional. :oops:

i think i had to go back at first and make sure he really said it in english too, because i've had a couple of dvds of foreign films (okay they were old hong kong chop socky flicks but still) where the one and only audio track contained both original language and dubbed english dialogue, first one and then the other, all the way through. didn't think a 'das boot' dvd would be as haphazardly put together as that, but you never know.

whether or not it was intentional on anybody's part, other than the fine actor playing Thomsen, is another question i don't know the answer to. everything i've heard about his performance including petersen's own comments suggests that he was at least a couple sheets to the wind when they filmed those scenes. what was in the script and what he improvised - well, i'd love to know. he doesn't get much screen time but he sure makes the most of it!

[frau kaleun]

Bought mine as part of the Wolfgang Peterson collection. Directors Cut, still pretty good. Mom's side of the family is German, so I know a little bit, but not nearly enough to keep up with three hours worth of it. Used English subtitles, quite a powerful movie. The best sub movie I probably have ever seen. U571 was such a let down, don't you agree?

i haven't seen it, and nothing i've heard about it so far has made me want to.

i do really like 'hunt for red october' and i saw 'crimson tide' (if that's even the right title - gene hackman, denzel washington, that one) when it was in the theaters. and saw the old one with... er... clark gable and william holden? is that 'run silent, run deep'? with an ex-boyfriend years ago.

obviously, i'm not a submovie connoisseur by any means, lol. but i do love a really well-made film and 'das boot' certainly qualifies in every respect IMO. didn't realize it would jumpstart so many new and interesting things for me to get into, but i'm certainly having a good time with all of it.

i messed around with learning a little german years ago and have started trying to pick some up again - just my luck a german family now living here in the states just joined up at my dojo so i have the little girl in my kid's class and the dad's been coming to our adult classes as well. gives me chance to use (and not forget) what little german i have, although i must say the opportunities to yell 'anblasen' are, sadly, few and far between in that context. :O:

[frau kaleun]

*sigh*

well now i think i will have to go and watch Das Boot again, or at least as much of it as i can fit in between now and bedtime.

what a tragedy, i don't know how i'll survive it. :D

[Terragon]

i haven't seen it, and nothing i've heard about it so far has made me want to.

i do really like 'hunt for red october' and i saw 'crimson tide' (if that's even the right title - gene hackman, denzel washington, that one) when it was in the theaters. and saw the old one with... er... clark gable and william holden? is that 'run silent, run deep'? with an ex-boyfriend years ago.

obviously, i'm not a submovie connoisseur by any means, lol. but i do love a really well-made film and 'das boot' certainly qualifies in every respect IMO. didn't realize it would jumpstart so many new and interesting things for me to get into, but i'm certainly having a good time with all of it.

i messed around with learning a little german years ago and have started trying to pick some up again - just my luck a german family now living here in the states just joined up at my dojo so i have the little girl in my kid's class and the dad's been coming to our adult classes as well. gives me chance to use (and not forget) what little german i have, although i must say the opportunities to yell 'anblasen' are, sadly, few and far between in that context. :O:


It's OK. Not accurate, or even believable, but some parts were pretty good. I liked the depth charging sequence, and it showing the conditions of American subs. Harvey Keitel plays a good Chief. Hunt for Red October was good, but no where near as good as the book. (How many movies are?) Crimson Tide was okay too.

Heard of 'Run Silent'... LOL. Never watched it.

You have a dojo? What do you teach?

I train as a MMA (Mixed Martial Artist) with a background in Filipino Martial Arts, Tae Kwon Do, Kickboxing, and folk-style/greco-roman Wrestling.

[frau kaleun]

Sorry, should've clarified - it's "my" dojo in the sense of being the one where I train, lol. Several of us help out sensei by running group classes and sometime help with private instruction of newer students if we're needed for that.

I run a kid's class once a week and usually part or all of the regular group class afterwards on the same evening, and the rest of the time it's just a matter of whether or not he needs somebody to help out and I'm there and outrank everybody else in the room, lol.

But I should say it's also "my" dojo in the sense that it's one of the few places on earth other than my home where I still feel completely at home.

It's a Tracy's Karate dojo, but in reality what we learn/teach is more rightly called kenpo karate or kenpo jujitsu.

I've thought about looking into TKD as a secondary style, if I ever have the time and money. Mostly because it seems to involve a lot of kicking and I really, really like to kick things. :D


folk-style/greco-roman Wrestling


I'm sure it's nothing like what I'm imagining, which is two people wrestling while some dude with a goatee strums an acoustic guitar in the background and sings "If I Had A Hammer."

:hmmm:

Actually I can see where a hammer might come in handy in a wrestling match. Whatever works, as we like to say. :03:

[Steel_Tomb]

Whats with all the thread necromancy going on lol... a 2006 thread! Thats one hell of a bump!

I got my copy of Das Boot through a very kind gent (he knows who he is lol)... I was pretty much blown away by it. Ranks up there as one of the best war films of all time. The characters are built up to such a level with you the viewer that you can't help but feel completely gutted when it finishes, all that they've been through together and bam over in a flash.

[Jimbuna]

if you have it on dvd, i think it's got to be either the director's cut theatrical re-release or the miniseries extended version. iirc the original shorter theatrical version never came out on dvd. i could be wrong though.

i think the director's cut clocks in at around 3 1/2 hours, one disc that you have to turn over midway through. extended cut is closer to 5 hours on two disks. (at least the region 1 versions i have.)

i think i had to go back at first and make sure he really said it in english too, because i've had a couple of dvds of foreign films (okay they were old hong kong chop socky flicks but still) where the one and only audio track contained both original language and dubbed english dialogue, first one and then the other, all the way through. didn't think a 'das boot' dvd would be as haphazardly put together as that, but you never know.

whether or not it was intentional on anybody's part, other than the fine actor playing Thomsen, is another question i don't know the answer to. everything i've heard about his performance including petersen's own comments suggests that he was at least a couple sheets to the wind when they filmed those scenes. what was in the script and what he improvised - well, i'd love to know. he doesn't get much screen time but he sure makes the most of it!

i haven't seen it, and nothing i've heard about it so far has made me want to.

i do really like 'hunt for red october' and i saw 'crimson tide' (if that's even the right title - gene hackman, denzel washington, that one) when it was in the theaters. and saw the old one with... er... clark gable and william holden? is that 'run silent, run deep'? with an ex-boyfriend years ago.

obviously, i'm not a submovie connoisseur by any means, lol. but i do love a really well-made film and 'das boot' certainly qualifies in every respect IMO. didn't realize it would jumpstart so many new and interesting things for me to get into, but i'm certainly having a good time with all of it.

i messed around with learning a little german years ago and have started trying to pick some up again - just my luck a german family now living here in the states just joined up at my dojo so i have the little girl in my kid's class and the dad's been coming to our adult classes as well. gives me chance to use (and not forget) what little german i have, although i must say the opportunities to yell 'anblasen' are, sadly, few and far between in that context. :O:

*sigh*

well now i think i will have to go and watch Das Boot again, or at least as much of it as i can fit in between now and bedtime.

what a tragedy, i don't know how i'll survive it. :D

WOW!!.....Connect 4 :o:DL

[frau kaleun]

Whats with all the thread necromancy going on lol... a 2006 thread! Thats one hell of a bump!

I got my copy of Das Boot through a very kind gent (he knows who he is lol)... I was pretty much blown away by it. Ranks up there as one of the best war films of all time. The characters are built up to such a level with you the viewer that you can't help but feel completely gutted when it finishes, all that they've been through together and bam over in a flash.

one of the most gutwrenching endings to a movie i've ever seen. what an emotional rollercoaster.

and one of the advantages of the longer versions is that you get to know the characters so much better, see them in a wider variety of situations... makes it even more powerful.

"blown away" is a good way to describe it. saw it the first time courtesy of netflix and couldn't bear to send the disk back until i'd gotten my own copy to keep.

[Platapus]

It hurts me down real deep because I have only see the Directors Cut!

BTW, I don't think there's a Kaleun here that hasn't seen Das Boot (If they haven't, go lunch yourself from a torpedo tube till you reach the coast of some country and buy Das Boot there! :arrgh!:)

Why would I want to watch a move about a shoe???





(Ducking)





:D

[danasan]

Hi again,

Quote

"As an aside, my copy of the DC has an amusing error in it:
In the scene where Thomsen has collapsed on the toilet floor in the brothel, even with German audio on he gets up and declares (in English) "I AM NOT IN THE CONDITION TO ****!" before continuing in German"

/Quote

I think, I am not that wrong, if I said that Thomsen made it in English, because he was still (mentally) in his speech about Churchill. And therefor, as a kind of "greeting" to Churchill, he made his "I AM NOT IN THE CONDITION TO ****!" statement. That means, it would be NOT an error.

Nice to meet you again!

danasan

[Jimbuna]

That is no error, I have noticed it in a few copies belonging to people I know, my own included.

[frau kaleun]

Why would I want to watch a move about a shoe???

Do we have a smiley for hitting somebody upside the head with a flashlight?

No?

Okay, just asking.

:D

[Jimbuna]

A frying pan is much more effective http://imgcash4.imageshack.us/img126/2543/iconfrypanei7.gif

[urfisch]

seen this movie several times since 1985, when watching the tv-version as a child. this was a magic moment...when my parents left me home and letting me watch tv. and there was this great and unforgetable movie "Das Boot". Afterwards i got the book "Iron coffins" from Herbert A. Werner and my uboat frenzy started.

I guess it is not available in english, but i recently bought my copy of a book called "The search for the crew of U-96" (Die Suche nach der Crew von U-96, which is a "catalog" with 300 sites from the german film-museum. There was a fair in this museum, called "Das Boot revisited" with all kind of photos, relics, requisites, etc. shown from the film.

:yeah:

[Terragon]

Just finished watching the Wolfgang Peterson collection, watched Das Boot and Air Force One back to back.

Saw a cool tribute to Das Boot in Air Force One. General Radek is played by Jurgen, who is the Captian of the U-Boat is Das Boot. When General Radek is released from a Russian prison (watch the movie), four men in Russian uniform come to meet him. The two with their covers off are crewmembers from Das Boot. The only reason I realized it is because I watched it back to back. Shortly after that, Jurgen gets machine-gunned again.

Bad luck dying as a German AND a Russian officer. Perhaps he should try American. :D

[Terragon]

I run a kid's class once a week and usually part or all of the regular group class afterwards on the same evening, and the rest of the time it's just a matter of whether or not he needs somebody to help out and I'm there and outrank everybody else in the room, lol.

But I should say it's also "my" dojo in the sense that it's one of the few places on earth other than my home where I still feel completely at home.

It's a Tracy's Karate dojo, but in reality what we learn/teach is more rightly called kenpo karate or kenpo jujitsu.

I've thought about looking into TKD as a secondary style, if I ever have the time and money. Mostly because it seems to involve a lot of kicking and I really, really like to kick things. :D

I'm sure it's nothing like what I'm imagining, which is two people wrestling while some dude with a goatee strums an acoustic guitar in the background and sings "If I Had A Hammer."



I always thought TKD was a very good defensive style of fighting. I'm 6'4" tall, I like any style of fighting that involves the use of legs. Karate and Jujitsu are very good, I believe Kyoto Machita (an UFC MMA Champion) is an all-Karate fighter. His grandfather or father is a Karate Grandmaster. ..And that's all he needs.

As for folk-style, that's the standard style of wrestling in High School, you can also compete in Greco-Roman (Use of the upper body only), or Freestyle, which is too confusing for me.

Ah, the joyous memories of running on a track in sweats in a garbage bag in Florida at seventeen. All youth should experience it. :DL

[frau kaleun]

A frying pan is much more effective http://imgcash4.imageshack.us/img126/2543/iconfrypanei7.gif


True, I just thought hitting someone with a flashlight a la Frenssen would be staying more on-topic. :O:

[frau kaleun]

Bad luck dying as a German AND a Russian officer. Perhaps he should try American. :D

Judging by the list I found online a while back, he seems to have bad luck in a LOT of his movies:

http://www.jpwsfc.org/fates.htm

Some of the more interesting ones include shot by arrows, shot in the neck with harpoon, ripped apart by robot, and survives but goes out with Patsy Kensit. :O:

I guess it's because he's been cast as a villain so often. Shame, really. Although he typically does a fine job with it.

[Terragon]

Would you consider him a villain in Das Boot? Just curious.

[frau kaleun]

I always thought TKD was a very good defensive style of fighting. I'm 6'4" tall, I like any style of fighting that involves the use of legs.

I'm only 5'6" but kicking just seems to feel natural to me. Plus it seems to be my first instinctive reaction to a threat, maybe because it (usually) provides a good strike while still outside the reach of someone else's fist.

Karate and Jujitsu are very good, I believe Kyoto Machita (an UFC MMA Champion) is an all-Karate fighter. His grandfather or father is a Karate Grandmaster. ..And that's all he needs.

Yep, I've seen him a couple times on the UFC stuff they show on Spike. They always mention the fact that he's more of a "pure" karate stylist, I guess because that's become such an anomaly in those competitions.

Our style incorporates something of just about everything I can think of, but since it is primarily a stand-up style we don't emphasize grappling or groundfighting although we do get into that a little bit depending on what sensei wants to teach us (probably like in every dojo, lol). I remember my "baptism of fire" before reaching brown belt was spending a long Saturday morning getting put on the mat over and over again and having to fight my way out from someone bigger and much more skilled. A good experience in terms of learning how much you can endure if you're in that situation - I remember I wasn't allowed to tap out unless I was in a submission hold or a choke, and boy I sure wanted to after a while. Just had to work through it and keep going. But ideally with our style, if anybody ends up on the ground it should be your attacker after you put him there.

Doesn't always work that way in reality though and taking up something emphasizing grappling would be another preferred option for me if/when that's ever possible... if only because it's something I'm still not entirely comfortable with and I'd like to get past that eventually.

[frau kaleun]

Would you consider him a villain in Das Boot? Just curious.

Oh, absolutely not!

But he does tend to get cast as a villain (or just a fairly minor neutral character) in a lot of the Hollywood movies he's made since then. In German productions, from what I've seen, not so much. Probably to be expected given the way the film industry works.

I think it's really a shame that his performance in "Das Boot" didn't translate into the same kinds of roles in high-quality productions over here. He's certainly been very successful in terms of the quantity of work he's done, and he's always watchable IMO no matter the part, but with a few exceptions I don't think Hollywood really knows what to do with most actors who aren't American or British.

[Panser]

Would you consider him a villain in Das Boot? Just curious.

No, I would not. The captain as a character is portrayed as being loyal to his ship and his crew, prepared to look out for their welfare and their safety. He clearly feels personally responsible for the men (particularly his sorrow at thinking he might have failed them), very much playing the role of the patriarch.

Besides his care (and concern) for his own men, he also has a healthy respect for his enemy. He obviously believes in doing "the right thing", and his anger at the crew of the convoy ship not being rescued by their own side is a major part of the film. Related to this, he also has to make a hard decision - one which the crew may not have liked but is obviously the only realistic answer - such is the lot of the Captain of a ship. His rank keeps him rather distant, meaning that he is unable to truly share confidences or concerns. Finally he is clearly portrayed as being rather hostile to the more blatant propoganda and political indoctrination - expressed both in his dislike of the news broadcasts and of his extremely ideological first officer.

Neither is he particularly heroic, he's basically just a man carrying out his duty for his country, constantly enduring extreme danger and terrible living conditions like so many millions did on on all sides of WW2.

[frau kaleun]

^ what he said :yep:

[Terragon]

No, I would not. The captain as a character is portrayed as being loyal to his ship and his crew, prepared to look out for their welfare and their safety. He clearly feels personally responsible for the men (particularly his sorrow at thinking he might have failed them), very much playing the role of the patriarch.

Besides his care (and concern) for his own men, he also has a healthy respect for his enemy. He obviously believes in doing "the right thing", and his anger at the crew of the convoy ship not being rescued by their own side is a major part of the film. Related to this, he also has to make a hard decision - one which the crew may not have liked but is obviously the only realistic answer - such is the lot of the Captain of a ship. His rank keeps him rather distant, meaning that he is unable to truly share confidences or concerns. Finally he is clearly portrayed as being rather hostile to the more blatant propoganda and political indoctrination - expressed both in his dislike of the news broadcasts and of his extremely ideological first officer.

Neither is he particularly heroic, he's basically just a man carrying out his duty for his country, constantly enduring extreme danger and terrible living conditions like so many millions did on on all sides of WW2.

I thought this too. It's just that the general public has a healthy hatred to anything linked to Nazi Germany, and that snowballs to hating soldiers and sailors just trying to do the job.

Just wondering.

[Panser]

^ what he said :yep:

Hey, stop copying me :O:

I should imagine just about everyone here feels the same way, though. Besides an interest in the genre, I think respect and perhaps a little admiration for the U-boat crews is necessary to play and enjoy the game. No doubt Das Boot is partly the reason so many of us considered it as interesting in the first place. I shouldn't think for one second anyone asinine enough to play the game purely to "be the bad guy" would have the patience to get through the learning curve!

[frau kaleun]

Agreed, Panser.

What I find so interesting is that the film and miniseries seem to have been so well received generally in the UK, since it was Britain that bore the brunt of the BoA for so long.

But then I've also seen shows where Japanese and US veterans of the Pearl Harbor bombing get together to commemorate all who died in it, and the consequences of it - peacefully and lovingly greeting each other as former enemies and now friends if only because each side knows best what it was like to live through and survive the conflict. It's a shared experience that creates a bond... not to mention a burning desire to see that their descendants never have to go through it as they once did.

That's how peace happens, I guess.

[Sailor Steve]

Also I'd really prefer the nightclub scene to play out without being interrupted by scenes of Ullman and Francoise, even if they have to be in there somewhere. I find it really jarring to be yanked from one to the other and back again - maybe it was done for some kind of effect but it just doesn't work for me.
I kind of agree, but in my case it's mostly that she wasn't a 'real' character in the book. I did like the scene - also not in the book - with Der Alte and 'Werner' discussing the girl in the window as they leave the docks.

But oh how I wish they'd been able to work in the scene from the book that Petersen said he wanted to include but didn't or couldn't - Der Alte in the galley cooking up potato pancakes for the entire crew. Now that would have been awesome.
Another scene from the book that wasn't in the movie was the Spanish freighter at the end. I can see why they left that one out, and replaced it with the sinking British tanker, but it still might have been interesting.

[Randomizer]

Hi again,

Quote

"As an aside, my copy of the DC has an amusing error in it:
In the scene where Thomsen has collapsed on the toilet floor in the brothel, even with German audio on he gets up and declares (in English) "I AM NOT IN THE CONDITION TO ****!" before continuing in German"

/Quote

I think, I am not that wrong, if I said that Thomsen made it in English, because he was still (mentally) in his speech about Churchill. And therefor, as a kind of "greeting" to Churchill, he made his "I AM NOT IN THE CONDITION TO ****!" statement. That means, it would be NOT an error.

Nice to meet you again!

danasan
No error. In the book he lapses into English for that phrase.

[frau kaleun]

In the interest of correctness I should've said that it was Prochnow, not Peterson, who mentioned in the commentary that he wished they had included the potato pancake scene in the movie.

It's probably my favorite thing from the book that didn't make the movie. IIRC in the book the men all line up to pass through the galley and der Alte stuffs a rolled up pancake in each guy's mouth as he goes by. Hilarious.

I don't mind the scene of the girl waving from the window as the boat puts out to sea, really, because it doesn't interrupt the flow of the action. The cuts to her and Ullman the night before really take something away from the Bar Royale scene IMO and, even if you left in the waving from the window, they could easily be left out.

Don't really need to see anything of her from the night before to clarify who she is because everything about that and her situation is taken care of when Ullman talks about her to Werner later on. Now that I think about it, it might have been more interesting just to see her waving from the window and then not know anything more until Ullman tells Werner about her.

The Spanish boat was the one the 1WO screwed up the ID on and they almost attacked, correct? I don't know, maybe they didn't want to add anything else that was too "negative" about his character. He kind of started out as the most unpopular guy on the boat and it's only as the movie progresses that he becomes less unlikeable if only because he's finally starting to understand the difference between his shiny ideology and the grubby reality of their situation. Making him look like a doofus again might've worked against that from the audience's perspective.

[Randomizer]

Buchhiem's treatment of the fictional 1WO is pretty stereotypical and given that he himself was a paid part of the Party propaganda apperatus (and so by definition considered politically orthodox and acceptable to the regime) one gets the feeling that perhaps "he doth protests too much", to paraphrase Bill the Bard.

The nameless Number 1 always struck me as being an reasonably effective executive officer and any personal quiffs were professionally irrelevant. He managed two hits on three targets during the convoy attack and so it would appear he knew how to use a UZO effectively.

He kind of started out as the most unpopular guy on the boat and it's only as the movie progresses that he becomes less unlikeable if only because he's finally starting to understand the difference between his shiny ideology and the grubby reality of their situation. Making him look like a doofus again might've worked against that from the audience's perspective.
This is less apperant in the book but after all the times reading the novel and watching the movie I had never quite put Number 1 into that context. Nice catch.

[frau kaleun]

Thanks. I think it's one of the more effective things about the movie but I didn't even notice it until I'd watched it a couple of times. Just on the basis of personal hygiene and dress, you can see him slowly "falling apart" as the story goes on, when nearer the beginning he's even reading lectures to Ullman about the importance of an officer's attention to such things. He still tries harder than anybody else on board, but by the time they're on the Weser he looks almost shabby compared to the merchant ship's officers. It's a nice visual metaphor for the loss of his naivete and idealistic notions about what it really means to fight the war that his Nazi idols started. The reality is you can't do the dirty work without ruining your manicure, only the guys giving the orders from behind a desk somewhere far away have that luxury.

One biggie that's not in the book, IIRC, but very effective in the movie is Kriechbaum getting wounded at Gibraltar. If you pay attention with a mind to following it, you realize that his condition mirrors the situation of the boat overall. When things are looking their worst, Hinrich is saying it doesn't look good for Kriechbaum, who is still pretty out of it and muttering "mama mama" as he's attended to. When they think they actually have a shot at getting off the bottom again and are making the necessary repairs, you see him regain consciousness and he appears to be lucid enough to pay attention to what's really going on around him. At least he's not obviously dying at that point. And of course when they're back in port he's awake and doing well enough to thank Hinrich for taking care of him and doesn't appear to be in any immediate danger.

That would be the extended cut, though. In the theatrical releases it's not obvious because some of that's left out. But it's very nicely done in the longer version.

And then the air raid comes but I choose to believe that the ambulance he was put in got away clean. A small consolation, but there it is.

[Sailor Steve]

The Spanish boat was the one the 1WO screwed up the ID on and they almost attacked, correct?
I was thinking more of the Captain's reaction when someone wondered what would have happened if they had torpedoed the neutral ship. The Captain's reply is something along the lines of "Then it would be to our benefit if no one told the tale", leaving then others to wonder if he was joking or actually thinking of killing the survivors. Very deep dilemma to be put on film.

As to the 1WO, the long version of the film gets me to thinking that he's not a party member because he's a hardline Nazi at heart, but rather because he's a confused young man who wants to be liked - to be part of 'the gang'. He's stuffy and a little pompous, sure, but he tries hard to be liked and respected, and fails miserably at both.

I also noted that whatever his failings, when the depth charges are falling all around he's usually seen to be calmly doing his job. He may not be the most likable character, but he's a very capable officer.

That's one of the reasons I like the 'Uncut' version. It does even more than the book to flesh out these characters and make them seem like real people. No one is all good or all bad.

[frau kaleun]

As to the 1WO, the long version of the film gets me to thinking that he's not a party member because he's a hardline Nazi at heart, but rather because he's a confused young man who wants to be liked - to be part of 'the gang'. He's stuffy and a little pompous, sure, but he tries hard to be liked and respected, and fails miserably at both.

I also noted that whatever his failings, when the depth charges are falling all around he's usually seen to be calmly doing his job. He may not be the most likable character, but he's a very capable officer.


Oh, I agree that that his unpopularity with the crew and other officers, however much there is of it, is personal and not professional, at least in the movie there's no indication that he's not thoroughly competent as an 1WO.

Also there's the fact that (at least in the movie) he's not from Germany, he's from Mexico. It doesn't indicate how long he'd been there, if he was raised there from childhood on or not, but at the very least he was living and working there full-time for a while. Like many people living or born and raised abroad who self-identified as German he came back to serve what was (or what he considered to be) his homeland in time of war. Striving to be as "German" as possible (which he naively equates with strict adherence to Nazi ideology) would certainly be one way to try and compensate for being a returning "outlander" or whatever the appropriate term is.

(Reminds me that Wolfgang Luth was also an ethnic German who was actually born and raised outside of Germany, I believe in one of the Baltic states. And the record does seem to indicate that he also spoke and behaved like a "true believer" in the Nazi regime and its policies, insofar as he understood and was aware of them.)

[Sailor Steve]

Since we're on the subject of navies and Nazis, I will take a diversion to mention The Sea Chase. It's certainly not a great movie, or even a particularly good one, but it is interesting. It's about a German merchant captain in Australia when the war breaks out, and he feels it's his duty to get his crew home to Germany so they can decide for themselves what they want to do. He was originally in the Kriegsmarine commanding a cruiser, but was ousted because of his outspoken opinions against the party. His best friend is a captain in the RAN, but he looks the other way when The Captain sneaks out of the harbor in the dead of night.

The Captain takes the crew of an island radio station hostage so he can "liberate" supplies, but while they are preparing to leave the evil Nazi First Mate sneaks back and murders them all, which makes the Australian best friend set out to bring them all to justice.

As I said, not a great movie, but there is one notable twist: the German captain is played by...John Wayne!

[Randomizer]

The evil Nazi XO is a recurring theme in Naval theatre, particularly in wartime propaganda films and later during the post-war period when rearming West Germany became important for NATO.

See additional examples from 49th Parallel - Leslie Howard and Raymond Massey and of course the classic submarine movie The Enemy Below with Robert Mitchum and Kurt Jurgans.

Das Boot the movie treats Number 1 with far more depth and sympathy than does The Boat the book and I suspect that was to avoid comparison with the stereotypes found in The Sea Chase and the above flics.

It would be interesting to see if the original German text differs significantly from the English translation in this regard.

Edit
Forgot that Under Ten Flags, the highly fictionalized movie about Raider Atlantis also had an Evil Nazi Officer on board but I cannot recall if he was XO or just a junior officer.