UCLA student tasered

[Tchocky]

Article here - http://dailybruin.com/news/articles.asp?id=38958

Video here - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5g7zlJx9u2E

Seems excessive to me, nice to see the politics of fear still work....

[Yahoshua]

I cant say much other than the guy was being a dick for a few minutes, and exactly what ocurred before the vid I dunno (other than the article). But it's obvious they tasered him without reasonable cause several times. The comment from the LEO at about 6:39 in the vid just makes me feel all warm inside, dunno why exactly he said that when the student confronting him (not the one being arrested) for information wasn't acting particularly violent.

[HunterICX]

I saw that one yesterday,

I must say, well the moron should brought his Pas/Card with him. the security is there not for nothing. the Taser seems not to work. so 3 strong guys can pick him up and take him outside. that would saved some time.

Edit: also , my question is...the Security guard tells him that he can not enter without his Card. so why didnt he leave when told him so...really...he was just asking for problems.

HunterICX

[Konovalov]

Come on, it's not like they used lethal force. ;) Seriously this sort of thing would be unheard of back in Australia. Then again school or university shootings aren't too common down under.

[joea]

Look on the bright side: he could have been shot 12 times, or beaten to a pulp with batons. :dead: Hey these cops showed proof of humanitarianism. :roll: :down:

[Polak]

Stupid liberal student, serves him right if you ask me. The rest of the students should also get stuned. The policemen where doing their job and gave him a direct and simple order, which he refused to comply with. I believe that the police should be able to use more force than they are allowed to today, at least in Poland and Sweden, I can not speak for the USA.

[HunterICX]

@polak,

I can tell you about spain, I had a Junky who was anoying. I told him to leave.
it was just my luck that an police officer came around the corner and saw him and he yelled ''Dammit, Are you here know!!!'' the police officer pulled the junky out of my shop after telling him to leave and the junky replied ''No!, Ehh..I like the music that he is playing on his radio''. the police had enough of him and beaten the **** out of him on the street...I wish I had a camara back then, that was just stunning to see, especially the part when I see the junky running down the street followed by the police officer that was a lot faster. I never seen that before when I lived in Holland. the police officer came back to me and said ''well you wont get bothered by him again'' I replied ''thats just what I thought'' funny guy

when the junky got his ass kicked I really had a grin on my face , well I'll bet I wont see him again:lol:

[Konovalov]

@polak,

I can tell you about spain, I had a Junky who was anoying. I told him to leave.
it was just my luck that an police officer came around the corner and saw him and he yelled ''Dammit, Are you here know!!!'' the police officer pulled the junky out of my shop after telling him to leave and the junky replied ''No!, Ehh..I like the music that he is playing on his radio''. the police had enough of him and beaten the **** out of him on the street...I wish I had a camara back then, that was just stunning to see, especially the part when I see the junky running down the street followed by the police officer that was a lot faster. I never seen that before when I lived in Holland. the police officer came back to me and said ''well you wont get bothered by him again'' I replied ''thats just what I thought'' funny guy

when the junky got his ass kicked I really had a grin on my face , well I'll bet I wont see him again:lol:

For a minute there I thought you were describing the SA brown shirt thugs from mid 1930's Nazi Germany.

[Polak]

@polak,

I can tell you about spain, I had a Junky who was anoying. I told him to leave.
it was just my luck that an police officer came around the corner and saw him and he yelled ''Dammit, Are you here know!!!'' the police officer pulled the junky out of my shop after telling him to leave and the junky replied ''No!, Ehh..I like the music that he is playing on his radio''. the police had enough of him and beaten the **** out of him on the street...I wish I had a camara back then, that was just stunning to see, especially the part when I see the junky running down the street followed by the police officer that was a lot faster. I never seen that before when I lived in Holland. the police officer came back to me and said ''well you wont get bothered by him again'' I replied ''thats just what I thought'' funny guy

when the junky got his ass kicked I really had a grin on my face , well I'll bet I wont see him again:lol:
That sounds as something the police should be allowed to do, at least with junkies. But since we all live in democracies, that will never be allowed. My boss at work told me that they had problems with junkies where he lived, they where stealing car radios and other things. When he called the police, they said that it wouldn't do much good if they arested the junkies, because they would not learn anything that way + they would be out in a couple of days. They told him to handle the problem himself, and that he should beat up the junkies with a couple of neighbours. Something like this is really stupid, the police should have handled the whole thing the way they advised him to do.

In the apartment block where I live we had a problem with junkies a couple of years ago, they where breaking in to the laundry room and stealing clothes. Here no one bothered calling the police. They changed doors on the building and beat the junkies up, solved the problem.

[Bort]

The repeated tasing of this guy seems unnecessary. Was he being a major pain, yes, but they could have just as easily forced the guy to the ground, cuffed him, and carried him out. There were certainly enough cops there to accomplish that minor feat without zapping the guy over and over again. This incident disturbs me because I am considering becoming a police officer (if some other job options don't pan out) and if that means my job is to repeatably electrify some idiot when I could just as easily (and less painfully) physically subdue him, I'm not sure that is an occupation I would like to pursue. Use of force is all about proportion and necessity and neither of those criteria were fulfilled in this incident from what I could see.:nope:

[Konovalov]

* Bort']Use of force is all about proportion and necessity and neither of those criteria were fulfilled in this incident from what I could see.:nope:

Well said. :yep:

[Onkel Neal]

* Bort']This incident disturbs me because I am considering becoming a police officer (if some other job options don't pan out) and if that means my job is to repeatably electrify some idiot when I could just as easily (and less painfully) physically subdue him, I'm not sure that is an occupation I would like to pursue. Use of force is all about proportion and necessity and neither of those criteria were fulfilled in this incident from what I could see.:nope:

You better think twice about being a cop, then. They routinely have to deal with the scum of society. Why do you think they get such violent attitudes? After a few years of arguing with junkies, punks, and drunks, you get pretty fed up. Wait till you "easily (and less painfully) physically subdue" some wiseass and he gets an elbow loose and knocks some of your teeth out.:huh: You're not getting paid to be nice. People should show some respect to the law and its enforcers. Or they could get tasered :D

[VON_CAPO]

Clear demonstration of legal torture, at many parts of the civilizated world these abusers would be lynched by the people at once. :nope::nope::nope:

Edit: I hope this incident have a wide effect to get anyone involved into a court of justice. :yep:

[Bort]

You better think twice about being a cop, then. They routinely have to deal with the scum of society. Why do you think they get such violent attitudes? After a few years of arguing with junkies, punks, and drunks, you get pretty fed up. Wait till you "easily (and less painfully) physically subdue" some wiseass and he gets an elbow loose and knocks some of your teeth out.:huh: You're not getting paid to be nice. People should show some respect to the law and its enforcers. Or they could get tasered :D
I understand that there are situations that require use of force like tasers, but I think that this was not one of those situations. Look, this was a bunch of College Cops forcing someone to leave because he didn't have a school ID card, not Chicago Police fighting it out with a coked up maniac. No, the cops aren't being paid to be nice, but they are being paid to be fair and this wasn't fair. The only time I have personally watched a belligerent person being arrested was in London, outside an underground station, and the drunk as a skunk college age kid was quickly efficiently and fairly forced to the ground by a Metropolitan Police officer (without anything more high tech than a billy club) and that was that. A little bit of wrestling and a fair amount of swearing on the part of both combatants but the end result was a good fair arrest. I would be more than willing to do the same in order to ensure the safety and fairness of the arrest as a police officer. This incident at UCLA was ludicrously unnecessary.

[sonar732]

Clear demonstration of legal torture, at many parts of the civilizated world these abusers would be lynched by the people at once. :nope::nope::nope:
Whatever VON_CAPO. This kid was told multiple times to stand up while he was hancuffed. He was warned multiple times that he would be tased if he didn't follow the order. As for your comment...

at many parts of the civilizated world these abusers would be lynched by the people at once.
In certain European countries, he would've been beaten to a pulp and then taken to the station. I remember hearing stories of our service men and women serving in Germany with stories about how not to mess with their police and follow orders or you'd be black and blue with bruises.

This kid was obviously giving a show for the mob that formed..yelling about the Patriot Act...come on :nope:. The Patriot Act had nothing to do with him being a citizen who failed to observe authority.

EDIT: Validating an attack by mob action isn't going to solve anything either. I'm sure that there will be a typical lawsuit filled by liberal organizations and his family...I hope his parents have the "authority" to tell him he should've listened to the sworn officers.

[VON_CAPO]

being a citizen who failed to observe authority.
I understand that american people are well trained to obey "authority" (no offense intended); but any authority vanish as smoke when the deputies cross the line between the right and the wrong.

Also, I think you see this under the optic of the military, and this is a academical ambit, where freedom and respect rules.

This kind of abuse is non sense into a university.

[sonar732]

being a citizen who failed to observe authority. I understand that american people are well trained to obey "authority" (no offense intended); but any authority vanish as smoke when the deputies cross the line between the right and the wrong.

Also, I think you see this under the optic of the military, and this is a academical ambit, where freedom and respect rules.

This kind of abuse is non sense into a university.
You blew your own comment about "respect" out of the water as your "client" didn't respect the order to get up. Are you a lawyer for the ACLU? :rotfl:

EDIT: I remember signing forms when I went to college regarding the "respect" of the University Security Officers and that I had to listen to them when given an order.

[VON_CAPO]

You blew your own comment about "respect" out of the water as your "client" didn't respect the order to get up. Are you a lawyer for the ACLU? :rotfl::rotfl: You are demonstrating that you have no idea about the academic community and how it thinks.

About respect: do not confuse "respect to the rules" with "respect to the ambit"
Because of a simple misconduct, the victim was electrocuted and bullied many times.

If I know my peers, it will be a huge cluster of witnesses in court in a near future.
And without any doubt, those bumpkins will have what they deserve. :yep::yep::yep:

[sonar732]

:rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl::rotfl:

[August]

being a citizen who failed to observe authority. I understand that american people are well trained to obey "authority" (no offense intended); but any authority vanish as smoke when the deputies cross the line between the right and the wrong.

Also, I think you see this under the optic of the military, and this is a academical ambit, where freedom and respect rules.

This kind of abuse is non sense into a university.

Actually I've found Europeans to be far more "trained to obey authority" than any similar group of Americans.

[VON_CAPO]

Validating an attack by mob action isn't going to solve anything either. I'm sure that there will be a typical lawsuit filled by liberal organizations and his family...I hope his parents have the "authority" to tell him he should've listened to the sworn officers. If everything runs good, those sworn officers will be users of "Food Stamp" coupons, for a long long time. :lol::lol::lol:

[sonar732]

Validating an attack by mob action isn't going to solve anything either. I'm sure that there will be a typical lawsuit filled by liberal organizations and his family...I hope his parents have the "authority" to tell him he should've listened to the sworn officers. If everything runs good, those sworn officers will be users of "Food Stamp" coupons, for a long long time. :lol::lol::lol:

So now you are putting down the officers in that they will be using Food Stamps after going to court? The court will more than likely see this video, see the student in hand cuffs and disobeying orders as the officers are attempting to pick him up and move him. You are truely a liberal minded individual in that the thinking is "It wasn't my fault...it's someone elses and going to the far left of your "religion" conversation that people are responsible for their own actions.

[StdDev]

If everything runs good, those sworn officers will be users of "Food Stamp" coupons, for a long long time. :lol::lol::lol:

That depends on if the officers were "cadets" or full on "campus police"..
The "Full on Campus Police" are actual police officers just like LAPD or whatever city you want to name.. they will probably get an incident report in their file.. perhaps some "counceling" after which they will be free to go charge up their taserz...
If the officers involved (the tazing officers) were cadets.. I'm pretty sure that their contract will not be renewed.

Universities are businesses.. if they piss off the student population their enrollment suffers (not really likely at UCLA but the admin must keep up appearances). The fact is.. the whole situation could have been avoided if the student had just used a bit more sense and not been so antagonistic towards the police.
Dont get me wrong.. I definately think the repeated tazing was excessive, ... but so was the students attitude.

[TteFAboB]

EDIT: To prevent further misunderstanding I will abide by VON_CAPO's rule book and add that this post has: (no offense intended)

(...)this is a academical ambit, where freedom and respect rules.

Hypocrite.

In your other thread you've shown your contempt for freedom and respect for religion. You are for the freedom that suits you, for the respect that suits you. Those who do not agree or think like you get neither.

Go speak for freedom and respect in Teheran univesity, go speak against respect for authority in China where torture and abuse is rampant, or are you too much of a coward? You know how to pick your fights and they're always the easy ones, without further consequences and certainly without any pain, you can talk against the USA and Americans all day long and nothing happens because nobody cares, even though you've been enjoyning the benefits of America for how long now? Also, you talk about attacking the guards as part of a mob and going to court in a cluster of peers, obviously you can only feel comfortable and safe to act in a large group. I guess then that if you were this lone student without a group you'd just kneel on the floor and beg "I'm not worthy! I'm not worthy! I'll do whatever you say sir!". Good to know you are free to form and participate in these groups in the USA, isn't it? Unlike what happened many times all across Europe, from Portugal to Russia, where groups were denied the freedom to gather.

[VON_CAPO]

Universities are businesses.. if they piss off the student population their enrollment suffers (not really likely at UCLA but the admin must keep up appearances). I agree, and after the public video, we can bet that the administration is running into a nightmare.

The fact is.. the whole situation could have been avoided if the student had just used a bit more sense and not been so antagonistic towards the police.
Dont get me wrong.. I definately think the repeated tazing was excessive, ... but so was the students attitude. I can imagine the situation, the law enforcer tell the guy to leave or whatever.

The guy refused and surely tried to explain their reasons.
The law enforcer put a finger on the guy and this was the point where everything went out of control.

Many people are trained to obey without questions, without to think, and consider reasonable that commands from enforcers must be complied.
To refuse is an option, a personal determination, it is valid when you believe that you are right, and it is still more valid, when your opponent want to subdue you by force.

EDIT: If understand well the video the abusers wanted the guy up, but he did not resist, he just did not collaborate. :hmm::hmm::hmm:

Let's understand the following about the situation: "Police forces are the instrument of the State to keep the monopoly of violence".
Into this frame many enforcers abuse their position.

[VON_CAPO]

(...)this is a academical ambit, where freedom and respect rules.
Hypocrite...................... You are running out of limits.
No personal attacks please. :cool:

BTW: the video was posted by american people, not by me. And the violence happened in UCLA, not in Teheran or China.

[jumpy]

One of these days the fuzz will tazer some poor shmuck with a pacemaker, for yet another minor offence. See how 'non lethal' they are then.
I take the view that:
1) a tazer is a substitute for a firearm in a situation where the 'offender' is armed but not with a gun etc and the desire is not to intentionally kill the person.
2) it is used to subdue an assailant posing a physical threat to an officer or individual.

It is not used because the officers can't be bothered to get on with the job and take the short route. It is what they get paid to do after all. It is not a tool to further subdue an individual being arrested; in other words used as a cattle prod. Are people now cattle to he herded by tazer wielding faculty/state sponsored goons?

Given my experience of some who call themselves 'police officers' in the UK, I wouldn't trust them with a sharp pencil, let alone something like a tazer or firearm. In most instances the moral and intellectual integrity required to do the job is almost always a good deal short of the mark, if it's even evident at all.

Still at least getting abused at university by private security and public servants will prepare that guy for the rigours of post graduate life :roll:
Based on the article the response seems to be grossly over the top, bordering on assault. Best get your 'papers' handy in future peeps, else you'll be off to the gulag without your feet touching the ground. Or at the very least get some rubber pants to avoid potential emarrasment when your universal joint lets go under the influence of 50000 volts. :lol:
And some people wonder why ID cards are frowned upon in the UK. I take a very dim view of events like these.

Police forces are the instrument of the State to keep the monopoly of violence
So very true - do as I say, not as I do - can be found at the core of most governments. Shame really.

[sonar732]

(...)this is a academical ambit, where freedom and respect rules.
Hypocrite...................... You are running out of limits.
No personal attacks please. :cool:

BTW: the video was posted by american people, not by me. And the violence happened in UCLA, not in Teheran or China.

Incite a riot and then hide behind the results...I see this thread being locked again because of your beliefs.

[jumpy]

http://img222.imageshack.us/img222/7581/flwrhandbagyx3.jpg (http://img222.imageshack.us/my.php?image=flwrhandbagyx3.jpg)

:rotfl:

Neal, do we have a Forum Tazer? maybe we can zapp these two after they've finnished circling the bag :-j

[HunterICX]

Konalov:
For a minute there I thought you were describing the SA brown shirt thugs from mid 1930's Nazi Germany.

Mmm...dont forget the spanish police are different
you have the Local ones ''Policia Local''
and the ''Guardia Civil'' also known as Dictator Franco private army
the guardia Civil on the other hand are not the ones you should mess with. If you messing around and they stop in front of you...you better pray.

for a nice example the Madrid Bank robber , wich took hostiges
he demanded a motorcycle to escape which he got (Bad choise I would choose a Tank)
the reason why is shown here:

http://rob.com/matt/misc_videos/Car_vids/spainbank.wmv
:up:

[Konovalov]

for a nice example the Madrid Bank robber , wich took hostiges
he demanded a motorcycle to escape which he got (Bad choise I would choose a Tank)
the reason why is shown here:

http://rob.com/matt/misc_videos/Car_vids/spainbank.wmv
:up:

I see why you suggested the tank. :yep: That guy must have been a promising candidate for moron of the year.

[VON_CAPO]

Incite a riot and then hide behind the results... Out of reality again.

This is Subsim, an internet board (an electronic board in the cyberspace), general topics category, and we are commenting a post.
It is impossible to me to imagine how the Subsim's members can create a riot. :o:o:o:o:o
Do you have any clue how this can be possible? :cool:

I see this thread being locked again because of your beliefs.That thread was locked not because of my beliefs, but yours.
Ask to the Big Chief about that. :yep::yep::yep:

[sonar732]

...at many parts of the civilizated world these abusers would be lynched by the people at once. :nope::nope::nope:


This isn't inciting a riot?

[August]

...at many parts of the civilizated world these abusers would be lynched by the people at once. :nope::nope::nope:

This isn't inciting a riot?
I think it is and besides that it is inaccurate. In many parts of the civilized world the kid would have got a darn good beating if not a bullet between the eyes.

[Onkel Neal]

(...)this is a academical ambit, where freedom and respect rules.
Hypocrite...................... You are running out of limits.
No personal attacks please. :cool:

BTW: the video was posted by american people, not by me. And the violence happened in UCLA, not in Teheran or China.

Incite a riot and then hide behind the results...I see this thread being locked again because of your beliefs.

No, I don't think that will happen, let's just be sure we all stick to a friendly discussion and even if we do not agree, let's not get too heated or personal ;)

[sonar732]

That thread was locked not because of my beliefs, but yours.
Ask to the Big Chief about that. :yep::yep::yep:

It wasn't about your beliefs per sey...it was how you brought them to the forum. I hate to let you in...but I wasn't notified at any point about being unprofessional regarding my post. Draggin in the "Big Chief" wasn't the smartest idea.

[Konovalov]

Guys, Neal has said not to get too heated or personal. The best way of avoiding such is by staying on the topic at hand in this thread. If you have a problem with past history between you then take it off the forums or via PM's but not here. Please? :)

[TteFAboB]

EDIT: To prevent further misunderstanding I will abide by VON_CAPO's rule book and add that this post has: (no offense intended)

(...)this is a academical ambit, where freedom and respect rules.
Hypocrite...................... You are running out of limits.
No personal attacks please. :cool:

BTW: the video was posted by american people, not by me. And the violence happened in UCLA, not in Teheran or China.

You have said the mob should've lynched the guards, are you willing to repeat that in their face? In front of them? If you would then ignore my coward allegation and I apologize for it.

I am not being personal here but merely acknowledging the fact that you are a hypocrite to speak of respect and freedom when you have no respect for nor tolerate freedom of religion. It is your freedom only and your respect only, it is personal and egocentric and not universal and for all.

These are not attacks, they're facts unless proven wrong. If you believe me to be wrong you can instantly prove it by expressing respect for religion and speaking for freedom of religion. Do this and my post crumbles down making water. Do not do this and you prove you do not believe in universal freedom, only in freedom for some people and respect for some things.

This has everything to do with the topic of persecution in university Konovalov, persecution of religious students.

[TteFAboB]

EDIT: To prevent further misunderstanding I will abide by VON_CAPO's rule book and add that this post has: (no offense intended)

Had to interrupt that post, so forgive the "double post" of sorts.

Carrying on,

VON_CAPO, further back you've made the following statement:
I understand that american people are well trained to obey "authority" (no offense intended);...

All you people worried about personal attacks, look here now. VON_CAPO believes he can make this statement without intending offense, however, when I present ideas contrary to his own he hides behind the "no offenses please"?

Is this it VON_CAPO? You can make statements about entire groups of people without offending them, however, I cannot make a statement about your hypocrisy without it being a personal attack? This only proves the hypocrisy even further, there is one rule for you and one for everybody else.

And finally about the Chinese or Teheranian point, that's a counter-argument to precisely the statement I quoted here. If you were in China or Teheran and if you would not rebel against the authority because there would be painful consequences, then you can't speak anything of the American people if under harsher circumstances you'd just bow and obey, though you're willing to rise against authority in the USA where the Rule of Law guarantees your personal safety to do so. And if it is possible to rise against authority in the USA, that means the American people are not submissive to authority, otherwise their system would not grant you the freedom to take these guards to court had you been personally involved if you wanted to.

[SUBMAN1]

* Bort']This incident disturbs me because I am considering becoming a police officer (if some other job options don't pan out) and if that means my job is to repeatably electrify some idiot when I could just as easily (and less painfully) physically subdue him, I'm not sure that is an occupation I would like to pursue. Use of force is all about proportion and necessity and neither of those criteria were fulfilled in this incident from what I could see.:nope:
You better think twice about being a cop, then. They routinely have to deal with the scum of society. Why do you think they get such violent attitudes? After a few years of arguing with junkies, punks, and drunks, you get pretty fed up. Wait till you "easily (and less painfully) physically subdue" some wiseass and he gets an elbow loose and knocks some of your teeth out.:huh: You're not getting paid to be nice. People should show some respect to the law and its enforcers. Or they could get tasered :D
:up:

The taser doesn't work well I see unless you shoot it. They should have shot him with it so he gets the point that ID is 'mandatory' or 'leave'.

-S

[VON_CAPO]

Bad news, the guy is Iranian-American :-?
This is going to appear in Al Jazeera network. :-?:-?:-?

---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3GstYOIc0I&mode=related&search=

[VON_CAPO]

A student making a few comments about this repulsive incident.
Very disturbing.

---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gL6bWMWkp6Y&mode=related&search=

[sonar732]

A student making a few comments about this repulsive incident.
Very disturbing.

---> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gL6bWMWkp6Y&mode=related&search=

He talks much about nothing.

[sonar732]

From the local NBC news affiliat.

http://www.nbc4.tv/news/10325914/detail.html

[sonar732]

And as I predicted...

UCLA Student files lawsuit (http://ktla.trb.com/news/ktla-uclataser,0,4201981.story?coll=ktla-news-1)

Just look at all the organizations that took part.

[tycho102]

You better think twice about being a cop, then. They routinely have to deal with the scum of society. Why do you think they get such violent attitudes?

After a few years of arguing with junkies, punks, and drunks, you get pretty fed up. Wait till you "easily (and less painfully) physically subdue" some wiseass and he gets an elbow loose and knocks some of your teeth out.:huh:

You're not getting paid to be nice. People should show some respect to the law and its enforcers. Or they could get tasered :D
Pretty much spot on, mate. Cops are so poorly paid that the ones one who will take the job are the ones who enjoy the power (just like a politician). Plus the rules of engagement put the police in far more danger than the perp, and our society has virutally no personal responsibility requirements, the job is horrible. I have imagined myself as a police officer, and I just absolutely could not justify that job to myself. Not with our current judicial system.

I generally refer to it as the Rodney King collorary. If you're high on PCP and cocaine, doing 100mph down the freeway, refuse to lie down when you have finally been pulled over, and take a swing at an officer...blame racial prejudice.



But I mean, come on. This is a California university -- the epitome of personal responsibility. There can be absolutely no doubt this attack was racially motivated, and the entire police force should be fired.

[sonar732]

To make it even better, some of the Youtube captions state he's mentally ill now.

[VON_CAPO]

From the local NBC news affiliat.

http://www.nbc4.tv/news/10325914/detail.html From this link:
"" Officers were escorting Tabatabainejad out of the computer lab when the trouble started, according to the Daily Bruin. One of the officers placed a hand on one of his arms, to which the student objected.As a second officer approached, he repeatedly yelled "get off of me," the newspaper reported. ""

As I said too, those bumpkins put a finger on him.
A logical reaction, any person with a high self-esteem would refuse or resist to be touched by those.
But, anyway, the bumpkins are trained to handle scum, and they logically handle anybody like scum.
Wrong training for to work at the university.

It is natural for them to be insolent (to touch without consent), because their are wrapped in "authority".

[Takeda Shingen]

As the moderator responsible for locking the thread in question, I will gladly verify what Von Capo has said: The 'Dark Ages' thread was locked due to irresponsible behavior on both sides of the issue. I had posted several warnings, and was ignored. Its locking was in no way a referendum on Von's ideas or opinions. Such characterization is both inaccurate and insulting to both Von Capo and myself.

Carry on.

[StdDev]

When did this become a "racial profiling" issue?

Von_Capo.. you remarked that "Americans are trained to obey the laws" or something to that effect.. I dont believe that this is at issue in this incident.. many Americans are brought up with the "challenge Authority" mind set.. civil disobedience etc..
What most Americans ARE capable of (learn early in life) is : pick your battles!
When a guy the size of a diesel truck asks you to do something.. for christs sake dont mouth off to him.. particularly if the guy is wearing a police uniform!
Yes.. the police acted "unprofessionally", but guess who got the sh*ty end of the stick on this deal.
The police were certainly within their rights (actually it was their duty) to ask the student to leave. The police may or may not have had reason to attempt escorting the student out of the library by the arm.
Now imagine how this might have transpired if the student ,instead of screaming and making a huge issue of this, had said to the officer "i'm sorry.. I left my I.D. in my car.. let me go get it and come back".. or something along these lines... anything that was NOT disrespectfull. I can guarantee that NONE of this would have happened!

As far as I can see it, the student is AT LEAST as responsible for the incident as the police are.

[sonar732]

From the local NBC news affiliat.

http://www.nbc4.tv/news/10325914/detail.html From this link:
"" Officers were escorting Tabatabainejad out of the computer lab when the trouble started, according to the Daily Bruin. One of the officers placed a hand on one of his arms, to which the student objected.As a second officer approached, he repeatedly yelled "get off of me," the newspaper reported. ""

As I said too, those bumpkings put a finger on him.
A logical reaction, any person with a high self-esteem would refuse or resist to be touched by those.
But, anyway, the bumpkins are trained to handle scum, and they logically handle anybody like scum.
Wrong training for to work at the university.

It is natural for them to be insolent (to touch without consent), because their are wrapped in "authority".
So, by this you are advocating resisting arrest?

EDIT: Combine your statement with this..Clear demonstration of legal torture, at many parts of the civilizated world these abusers would be lynched by the people at once.

Makes me worried if you ever get caught breaking the law as you'll encourage those around you to lynch your arresting officers and claim they don't have the right to arrest or escort you out of the building if you refuse to leave...

Looks around for the backlash. :roll:

[August]

So the officer touched him. Big deal. That does not justify resisting an officer in the performance of his duty.

[sonar732]

That thread was locked not because of my beliefs, but yours.
Ask to the Big Chief about that. :yep::yep::yep:

You are incorrect in this assertation. He clearly stated that all parties are responsible.

So, with that in mind, I take out my incorrect quote.

[Onkel Neal]

This could have all been easily avoided, and should have been.

Campus security: "Sir, do you have your college ID?"
Guy: "No, not with me."
Campus security: "We'll have to ask you to leave."
Guy: "Ok, I understand, have a good evening, officer."

Total no-brainer.

[Onkel Neal]

Konalov:
For a minute there I thought you were describing the SA brown shirt thugs from mid 1930's Nazi Germany.

Mmm...dont forget the spanish police are different
you have the Local ones ''Policia Local''
and the ''Guardia Civil'' also known as Dictator Franco private army
the guardia Civil on the other hand are not the ones you should mess with. If you messing around and they stop in front of you...you better pray.

for a nice example the Madrid Bank robber , wich took hostiges
he demanded a motorcycle to escape which he got (Bad choise I would choose a Tank)
the reason why is shown here:

http://rob.com/matt/misc_videos/Car_vids/spainbank.wmv
:up:

haha, I just got to see that. That was great!

[Iceman]

The problem with things...videos like this...we usually never see the whole thing from start to finish ..we only see it from the parts where things have heated up to the point where the intrest of others is captured and the cameras start rolling....with that said...

I think it is a good training video to show to other police officers to teach them how to and not to deal with situations...in this situation..if tazing the individual twice did not get him to comply and he was not "Violent"...then hog tieing and dragging his azz out quick as possible would have been the smart thing to do...if violence was ensuing to the point of civilians being endanged then clubs or weapons are what "We" as citizens grant our officers the ability to use.

I don't want some dude freaking out in a library or public place causing such a scene or trying to incite others as it appeared late in the vid to riot against the police.If my kids were in that school and the dude was doing that I "Expect" the police to handle the situation...if it is my son doing that...then I have taught him that, that is what you can expect to get....

Don't break the law....period.

Whole thing would have been different if the guy would have been discoverd to have a pipe bomb strapped to his chest...cops would have been heros...or maybe not...maybe they would have set it off with all that tazing..lol doh!

[sonar732]

Iceman...he was already handcuffed and went limp. Then, when the people started noticing him screaming at the officers before he was tazed...the show started. :nope:

[VON_CAPO]

Von_Capo.. you remarked that "Americans are trained to obey the laws" or something to that effect.. I dont believe that this is at issue in this incident.. many Americans are brought up with the "challenge Authority" mind set.. civil disobedience etc..What most Americans ARE capable of (learn early in life) is : pick your battles!
It is a personal commentary based in my (in situ) observations of different populations.

Also it was addressed to some american members of this forum and how they make reference at their laws and enforcers.
It looks like they do not realize that enforcers are just theirs neighbors wrapped with power to make comply rules, and not the "untouchables". They are so clean or dirty as anyone.

Enforcers are necessary to maintain order in society, but as wild dogs, the leash must be keep it short and tight on them.
Otherwise we get undesirable events.

When a guy the size of a diesel truck asks you to do something.. for christs sake dont mouth off to him.. particularly if the guy is wearing a police uniform! Here I have two answers:
1- Under american jurisdiction (the case of this thread): Yes, I agree, it is better to keep the voice low and calmed because of electrocutions, pepper spray and beatings; and of course privation of your liberties to roam freely for a a time (there is exceptions, but deputies usually choose violence).
To complain is dangerous.
2- Others jurisdictions: It depends where and who.
It can be from a police trying to calm you down and to talk (because the law does not authorize him to use force if there is not an imminent and physical threat), to a bullet in the brain.

I am wondering: ""Are the enforcers policing by consent or policing by compliance???""
I mean, does people comply because they recognize the authority; or because of fear to brutal methods authorizated by law?? :hmm::hmm::hmm:


About electroshocks:

From the link: ---> http://web.amnesty.org/pages/ttt4-article_13-eng

"Trading in the tools used to torture"

""" The school bus journey on 3 October 2002 started as normal for Chiquita Hammond, a 15-year-old schoolgirl in Miramar, Florida.
However, during the journey the driver stopped the bus and flagged down three police officers with a complaint that the students were being unruly.
Chiquita Hammond stepped off the bus.
According to the police, the teenager became verbally abusive.
When she started walking away, one of the officers grabbed the girl by the wrist and attempted to handcuff her.
Chiquita Hammond allegedly responded by knocking his glasses off.
She was then wrestled to the ground while the police officer tried to handcuff her.
Another officer sprayed her in the face with pepper spray, which the police said did not appear to have an effect.
At this point a third officer pulled out his M-26 Taser gun and fired it at Chiquita’s back, delivering a 50,000-volt shock.

The use of such a painful "less than lethal" weapon in this case constitutes excessive and disproportionate use of force."""

Police electrical baton with spikes, exhibited at the China Police 2002 exhibition in Beijing, June 2002.
Less sophisticated than Tasers, but the same purpose.
http://img339.imageshack.us/img339/3742/chnbatondz8.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

[VON_CAPO]

This could have all been easily avoided, and should have been.

Campus security: "Sir, do you have your college ID?"
Guy: "No, not with me."
Campus security: "We'll have to ask you to leave."
Guy: "Ok, I understand, have a good evening, officer."

Total no-brainer. :yep::yep::yep::yep::yep:

[August]

I am wondering: ""Are the enforcers policing by consent or policing by compliance???""
I mean, does people comply because they recognize the authority; or because of fear to brutal methods authorizated by law?? :hmm::hmm::hmm:

Both. Looking for one single answer is kinda stupid. Some people comply because they recognize and respect authority, others because they fear the threat of retaliation for non-compliance.

[VON_CAPO]

[quote=VON_CAPO]
Both. Looking for one single answer is kinda stupid. Some people comply because they recognize and respect authority, others because they fear the threat of retaliation for non-compliance.I am surprised for your smart deduction. :|\\

By the way, My wondering postulated to choose between two answers and you called it "kinda stupid", such expression does not help at all.
Also, it would be wise to take a look at post #35.

Hostility is unwelcome everywhere.
Can you restrain your keyboard please? Thank you. :cool:

[The Avon Lady]

If I had a nickel for every disorderly student/police excessive for incident.......... :roll:

I can't believe this has stretched to 4 pages.

[August]

Both. Looking for one single answer is kinda stupid. Some people comply because they recognize and respect authority, others because they fear the threat of retaliation for non-compliance.I am surprised for your smart deduction. :|\\

By the way, My wondering postulated to choose between two answers and you called it "kinda stupid", such expression does not help at all.
Also, it would be wise to take a look at post #35.

Hostility is unwelcome everywhere.
Can you restrain your keyboard please? Thank you. :cool: Quit with the passive agressive nonsense and quit telling people what you think is permissible or not. If I think something is stupid i'll say so. Note that I didn't say YOU were stupid but if you feel its applicable then feel free to run with it.

[Gizzmoe]

Guys, calm down, please!

[August]

Guys, calm down, please!

I am quite calm Gizzmoe. I'm just tired of him tossing his verbal bombs left and right and then complaining at the merest hint of one being tossed back at him.

[sonar732]

I posted the same thing basically about him validating a riot against sworn officers...won't go any farther with how it went. :roll:

[The Avon Lady]

New Zealand really is upside-down (http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20061117/od_afp/nzealandcrimepolice_061117202448)! :doh:

[sonar732]

New Zealand realy is upside-down (http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20061117/od_afp/nzealandcrimepolice_061117202448)! :doh:

I see him going thru a rigorous training period since he couldn't hit the guy after 5 attempts.

[Sub Sailor]

Well by golly this topic has been rode hard and put a way wet, I guess I missed it-did four pages come to a conclusion over this truly "Society Changing Event"?
I would tell about my recent hunt, but that would start a cruelty to animals debate, I am sure that would take up pages and pages so to save time- I am a hunter, fisherman, I cut down trees for fire wood which causes pollution, which both my wife and add to driving Trucks, Suvs, ATVs, and I don't recycle. So Go For it. In spite of all those faults I have a great life.

Everyone have a really great day, I will,

Ron Banks MMCM(SS), USN(Ret)

[VON_CAPO]

From: ---> http://www.unobserver.com/printen.php?id=2574

THE TASER: A POLICE DEVICE FOR TORTURE AND DEATH:

By Christopher Bollyn

""" There are reportedly nearly 200 citizens of the United States and Canada who have been killed by the electro-shock police weapon known as the TASER, according to the Auckland, New Zealand-based organization Campaign Against the TASER.
From Woonsocket, Rhode Island, to Wisconsin, Colorado, Arizona and California, there are numerous current news reports about the death of a local individual caused by excessive force used by the police involving the TASER weapon."""

""" In 1997, Robin Cook, then Foreign Secretary of the United Kingdom, said the British government considered all such electro-shock weapons, including the TASER stun gun, commonly used by police in the United States, to be equipment "designed primarily for torture."
Cook said the British government would press for a global ban. """

""" Amnesty International (AI), the leading anti-torture watchdog organization, has long called on "U.S. state, federal and local authorities to suspend all transfers and use of TASERS and other electro-shock weapons pending a rigorous, independent inquiry into their use and effects."

AI considers the use of TASERS to constitute "cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment – and torture."

AI has reported that TASER devices are frequently used to torture and interrogate people such as political prisoners and that TASERS are used by police in the U.S. "particularly for torture to 'gain compliance.'"

Law enforcement agencies in the United States, however, have not heeded AI's call to suspend use of TASERS.

Today, some 7,000 law enforcement agencies, out of a total of 18,000, use TASERS as part of their arsenal.

AI recently reiterated its concerns about the use of the TASER stun gun on individuals who have already been handcuffed or placed in mechanical restraints.

"The use of the TASER in conjunction with restraints has been a common factor in many of the deaths," AI reported on 28 March 2006:

"AI considers that inflicting excruciating pain on a suspect who is restrained, and not able to pose a serious threat to their own life or that of police officers or members of the public, constitutes an excessive use of force, sometimes amounting to torture or other cruel, inhuman or degrading treatment."

A 2004 study by The Denver Post found that in one county, one third of the 112 people shot with a TASER had been handcuffed at the time. ''
Deaths by TASER through 2004. Currently some 200 Americans and Canadians have been killed by the "non-lethal" TASER.

http://img72.imageshack.us/img72/8056/taserdeaths1201im6.gif (http://imageshack.us)

[VON_CAPO]

Another Taser video showing torture with full details.
Warning!!! very shocking. :nope::nope::nope::nope::nope:

---> http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/content/news/video/taser_video3a.html

[August]

You have to wonder how many people would have died if they were shot with a bullet instead of being tased.

[VON_CAPO]

You have to wonder how many people would have died if they were shot with a bullet instead of being tased. That is the same idea that the manufacturer use to promote this vile tool.

I think that would be easier to understand the mistake of justify torture (or let's call it compliance if you like) against fellows citizens, if we read about the worldwide experience of humans beings tortured with electricity.

[sonar732]

Another Taser video showing torture with full details.
Warning!!! very shocking. :nope::nope::nope::nope::nope:

---> http://www.palmbeachpost.com/news/content/news/video/taser_video3a.html

This was posted a long time ago. The training officer even has commentary in this link you provided.

Victoria Goodwin was shot with a stun gun in Boynton Beach on Aug. 6, 2004 for going 52-mph in a 35-mph zone. Goodwin had just dropped her daughter off at daycare and was heading to her mother's house. She breezed past a yellow Mustang driven by an undercover traffic cop, Rich McNevin, who pulled her over. Things would get worse quickly, and within five minutes, the young mother would be squirming on the ground like somehow having a seizure, whimpering, "Oh, my God, oh, my God." Goodwin was apparently one of those violent suspects that police officers are allowed to use a stun gun to subdue. She was, after all, driving with a suspended license and she did not get our of her Isuzu Rodeo fast enough when McNevin ordered her get out of her car—nor did she get off her cell phone when told to. Another officer with McNevin tried to grab the cell phone out of her hand. At that point, McNevin said in his report, Goodwin tried to slap the other officer and he shot her with his stun gun.

I wonder if she would've encouraged a lynching?

[sonar732]

Current deaths of police officers in line of duty.

Officer Down (http://www.odmp.org/year.php)

Of those here is the breakdown.

Aircraft-2
Assault-2
Automobile accident-34
Bomb-1
Duty related illness-2
Gunfire-43
Gunfire (Accidental)-2
Heart Attack-8
Motorcycle accident-6
Stabbed-1
Struck by vehicle-9
Vehicular assault-14
Vehicle pursuit-3

So...show all the stats you want and complain about police brutality, but what will you tell the families of the cops here that if he used a stun gun could've saved his life. I understand that not all of these would've been stopped by the use of tazer, but probably a good number of them.

[August]

You have to wonder how many people would have died if they were shot with a bullet instead of being tased. That is the same idea that the manufacturer use to promote this vile tool.

I think that would be easier to understand the mistake of justify torture (or let's call it compliance if you like) against fellows citizens, if we read about the worldwide experience of humans beings tortured with electricity.

So you're recommending they just be beaten and/or shot like they would have in the old days instead of using non-semi-mostly non-lethal weapons?

[TteFAboB]

Wait up a minute VON_CAPO, did you just said: (...)if we read about the worldwide experience of humans beings tortured with electricity.

When I mentioned China and Teheran, which makes even more sense now that we know the guy here is an Iranian-American, didn't you said that those locations didn't mattered because we were talking about the USA here?

Now you want to look at worldwide experience? Now the rest of the world is important?

My my, are we contradictory?

Here's the quote: BTW: the video was posted by american people, not by me. And the violence happened in UCLA, not in Teheran or China.

But you show no problem talking about China here: Police electrical baton with spikes, exhibited at the China Police 2002 exhibition in Beijing, June 2002.
Less sophisticated than Tasers, but the same purpose.

If you want to compare police equipment and abuses between countries you must also accept to compare psychology and freedom.

[tycho102]

So you're recommending they just be beaten and/or shot like they would have in the old days instead of using non-semi-mostly non-lethal weapons?
If we reduced the size of the federal government, reduced the authority of the federal government*, made states more responsible for balancing their own budget without federal support, and increased the pay of police officers.

Yes. People shouldn't need a beanbag or a taser to motivate them to follow the instructions of a police officer.

We need to increase the confidence that people have in the police force by making the police force something respectable. Enforcing personal responsiblity in our judicial system would make it possible to have a respectable police force, along with the other "reforms" I have mentioned.



(* Blanco should be held accountable for not requesting the national guard. I am absolutely horrified that the president now has the authority to move in troops without the specific request of the state governor. That was the wrong way to address the issue. Don't vote in a governor that has to check the f*cking polls before taking action.)

[jumpy]

Current deaths of police officers in line of duty.

Officer Down (http://www.odmp.org/year.php)

Of those here is the breakdown.

Aircraft-2
Assault-2
Automobile accident-34
Bomb-1
Duty related illness-2
Gunfire-43
Gunfire (Accidental)-2
Heart Attack-8
Motorcycle accident-6
Stabbed-1
Struck by vehicle-9
Vehicular assault-14
Vehicle pursuit-3

I understand that not all of these would've been stopped by the use of tazer, but probably a good number of them.

Gunfire-43
Stabbed-1

44 out of 83 possibles for stunner use there.

Sounds a bit harsh, but you takes the money, don't moan when crimms shoot guns at you. Same with military peeps, if you didn't want Iraqi insurgents shooting at you, don't sign up.
Sure the cops have a hard job, but they all know what they're letting themselves in for, indeed many of them enjoy the excitement/challenge of the job (from the horses mouth that one).
Using a stunner on someone who already has the cuffs on is just cruel and unnecessary imo. Any anyone who does so doesn't deserve to be a policeman.

Like Tycho says, some folk need a bit more respect taught to them when growing up and the institutions like the police need more confidence and integrity visible to joe public.
I was always brought up to respect the law etc, but some of my polite dealings with the enforcers of those laws over the years have been less than cordial in their response to my obvious respect for their position. Result- I have no faith or trust in the ability of the police to do their job and not abuse me in the process. More than ever in recent years has this become apparent to me as an inevitable consequence of lowering the standards bar across the board.
Sign of the times or what?

[VON_CAPO]

UCLA policy okays use of tasers against passive demonstrators: (http://americablog.blogspot.com/2006/11/ucla-policy-okays-use-of-tasers.html)

http://img139.imageshack.us/img139/5528/uclataserpolicydd2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

UCLA has a written policy (http://dailybruin.com/documents/2006/11/17/taserpolicy.pdf) authorizing the use of a 50,000 volt taser against students who are offering passive resistance.
That means, sitting down and not moving as a form of protest can get you tasered repeatedly.
It also means the cops who repeatedly tasered a student who refused to show them an ID may have actually been following official campus policy.
It is UCLA campus policy to taser students who offer passive resistance.
This is sickening. :nope::nope::nope:

Any similarity with fascism would be pure coincidence. ;)

[The Avon Lady]

Any similarity with fascism would be pure coincidence.
Funny. Sounds like plain boring law enforcement to me.

Oh.

Fascists often wear uniforms. So do police. See the connection!

:roll:

[VON_CAPO]

Any similarity with fascism would be pure coincidence. Funny. Sounds like plain boring law enforcement to me.
Should I understand that you have got experience in this kind of issues? :hmm::hmm::hmm:

[sonar732]

Any similarity with fascism would be pure coincidence. Funny. Sounds like plain boring law enforcement to me.
Should I understand that you have got experience in this kind of issues? :hmm::hmm::hmm:

Probably about the same amount as you VON_CAPO.

[VON_CAPO]

I am astounded, you people justify or downplay torture against american civil population. :o:o:o

If humans rights cares so little to you, do not think it would better if a psychiatrist administrate the electroshocks??? :hmm:

It would be safer for the victims, and complainers would be handled in a better efficient way. (you know, soviet style is called). :|\\

[sonar732]

I am astounded, you people justify or downplay torture against american civil population. :o:o:o

If humans rights cares so little to you, do not think it would better if a psychiatrist administrate the electroshocks??? :hmm:



No, I have a problem with people crying wolf about their civil rights when they don't respect the rules. Before attending UCLA, he signed a form that he would follow the policies of the university. He refused to follow the policy, and then went on about the Patriot Act, which had nothing to do with him refusing to leave after not showing his id. Multiple witnesses have stated that the roving id checks were going on for 5-10 minutes before getting to him and he complains that he was singled out due to his race.

[VON_CAPO]

No, I have a problem with people crying wolf about their civil rights when they don't respect the rules. Well, it is not about civil rights only, but something higher called "human rights".

Also, an authoritarian view of society & rules would lead us to retreat to the medieval age.
If you do not know, the medieval age is called "dark age" in the history books. :|\\

[sonar732]

No, I have a problem with people crying wolf about their civil rights when they don't respect the rules. Well, it is not about civil rights only, but something higher called "human rights".

Also, an authoritarian view of society & rules would lead us to retreat to the medieval age.
If you do not know, the medieval age is called "dark age" in the history books. :|\\

EDIT: Did you see the other people complaining about being asked for id?

Like the right to incite a lynching?

...lynched by the people at once.

[Fish]

It' snot only the police been rude against the student, here against a woman protester.

http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=2292911

[VON_CAPO]

EDIT: Did you see the other people complaining about being asked for id? I have the impression that you do not have the point.

What is the central subject here?
a) Rules and to ask for ID.
b) Torture and human rights violations.

The answer is pretty obvious. Do not you think?

Like the right to incite a lynching?

...lynched by the people at once. Well, here it is something that your are dragging through many posts and threads.
It is "text comprehension failure".
Let's analyze the sentence:
Clear demonstration of legal torture, at many parts of the civilizated world these abusers would be lynched by the people at once. -- Clear demonstration of legal torture ---> An opinion or fact, it depends of the legal frame.
-- at many parts of the civilizated world ---> Here I was making a composition of place.
It denotes different places than USA, but also similar (civilizated world).
-- these abusers ---> The subject of the sentence.
-- would be lynched by the people at once ---> Here is where you have troubles.
"Would be" denotes a potential circumstance and a consideration.

But you are affirmating over and over again that I am "inciting a lynching".
Why is this??? :hmm::hmm::hmm:
The only logical deduction is that you are not able to distinguish "would" from "should".
The original phrase is "would be lynched by the people at once".
But you understand "should be lynched by the people at once".

My dear friend, that is one of basic reasons I usually overlook your posts. :|\\

EDIT:
Also I would like to remind you the post #32:
Incite a riot and then hide behind the results... Out of reality again.

This is Subsim, an internet board (an electronic board in the cyberspace), general topics category, and we are commenting a post.
It is impossible to me to imagine how the Subsim's members can create a riot. :o:o:o:o:o
Do you have any clue how this can be possible? :cool:

[sonar732]

EDIT: Did you see the other people complaining about being asked for id? I have the impression that you do not have the point.

What is the central subject here?
a) Rules and to ask for ID.
b) Torture and human rights violations.

The answer is pretty obvious. Do not you think?

Like the right to incite a lynching?

[quote=VON_CAPO]...lynched by the people at once. Well, here it is something that your are dragging through many posts and threads.
It is "text comprehension failure".
Let's analyze the sentence:
My dear friend, that is one of basic reasons I usually overlook your posts. :|\\
As evident...you don't overlook them just as I could say the same. The whole issue was started by a person who refused to leave when he didn't follow the rules. You are the one who misses the issue beyond your own tunnel vision.

EDIT: Not only did he refuse to leave after told the first time, he went limp on the floor like my 11 year old son because he was corrected in a public place and wanted to get his way. Unfortunately, the person he was with felt embarrased and gave him what he wanted. This guy gave his hissy fit and is getting all the attention he wanted and more.

[VON_CAPO]

It' snot only the police been rude against the student, here against a woman protester.

http://abcnews.go.com/Video/playerIndex?id=2292911 Sadly it looks like many psychos are into the ranks. :nope::nope::nope:

[sonar732]

The difference between Fish's post and the police officer who tazed the student is that the officer in this incident is willing to speak with the Islamic community regarding the incident instead of making fun about it.

[VON_CAPO]

The difference between Fish's post and the police officer who tazed the student is that the officer in this incident is willing to speak with the Islamic community regarding the incident instead of making fun about it. A psycho's characteristic is that enjoys the other people's suffering.

[Konovalov]

The difference between Fish's post and the police officer who tazed the student is that the officer in this incident is willing to speak with the Islamic community regarding the incident instead of making fun about it.

Exactly. :yep:

Is this thread still going? :doh:

[AVGWarhawk]

I have read most of the post here and watched the video. It is plain and simple. Youth today have not respect for authority AT ALL!!!! He simply should have submitted and he would have been on his way. But no, the I will take you to court attitude and take every penny you have always prevails these days and all he was think was retiring early on the tax money from the UCLA campus. I'm sure the lawyers were outside his house the next day to start and formulate their case for millions of dollars in "pain and suffering ". Look at it for what it is ...a punk not cooperating at ALL. So ok, no pistol whipping or batons....use the taser to subdue and get his dead butt out of the building so the paying students who want to do something with their lives can keep studing without idiot boy making trouble. Now we did not see what happened prior to the tasing therefore we can only guess whatever he was up to was not good as three officers responded. Furthermore, perhaps he was on some whacked out drug and really not feeling anything at all. LSD is known to make people feel like Superman and do incredible things. Whatever the case, he got what he deserved. The police force are not here to be abused by every Tom, Dick or Harry when they feel like it.:nope:

[SleightOfHand]

UCLA policy okays use of tasers against passive demonstrators: (http://americablog.blogspot.com/2006/11/ucla-policy-okays-use-of-tasers.html)
<snip>


Not that I want to get too deeply involved in this argument, but I can't help but notice that the quoted post is not misleading so much as blatantly wrong. Let's do the reading comprehension thing.

At the top of the list, we have 'Officers utilizing any pain compliance technique should consider the totality of the circumstance, including but not limited to:'. The case Capo's talking about, (g), reads 'If time permits (e.g. passive demonstrators) other reasonable alternatives. So the whole sentence is, for (g): Officers utilizing any pain compliance technique should consider the totality of the circumstance, including but not limited to (if time permits) other reasonable alternatives.'

So, actually UCLA isn't advocating taser use against passive demonstrators so much as saying that in the case of passive demonstrators, pain compliance techniques should not be used.

I would insert a remark about not misrepresenting facts, but the only one who seems to be doing that regularly is Von Capo, and other people have done the remarks already.