Syria Shoots Down Turkish Fighter

[Skybird]

I wonder if maybe the Turks have provoked a robust Syrian reaction in order to draw NATO into any consequences after a hopefully triggered "incident" and by that triggering an intervention by NATO in Syria.

This zig-zagging close to the Syrian border opens the lane for speculations.

by the BBC:


Turkey has an interest in regime change in Syria now, for the ties with Assad are FUBAR, but with the oppositions (plural) coming to power there are chances that Turkey can play a dominant role in restructuring the region.

German news says the Phantom was warned that it was in Syrian airspace 15 minutes before the shot. The machine immediately reacted and withdrew. Only to return some minutes later.

[Skybird]

Hooray, what did I say: Turkey plans to invoke NATO article 5 over the Syrian shotdown of Turkish jet.

Again NATO troops should risk their lives to install a fundamentalist government in a Muhameddan state, basing on Sharia law.

I stick to it: this goes according to how Turkey has planned it. The flights of the Phnatoms were a provocation to open right this window of opportunity. If the Syrian information on flightplaths over the local map are correct, it is is telltaling a piec eof info, especially the last manouver that led to opening fire.

I just hope that Turkey does not get what it wants at the NATO conference

Syria meanwhile claims that the Phantom was shot down not by SAM, but by AAA, which means it was most likely not attacked in international air space (what AAA shoots 6 miles and more with lethal accuracy?) . And even if it was a SAM, it still could mean that the missile was fired with the Phjantom, in Syrian air space, then it tried to escape with the missile in trial, and got hit aftr having left Syrian air space.

The recovering and examination of the Pjhnatom should not be left to the Turks alone. Erdoghan is a man of split tongue and will produce any lie needed to get what he wants. So watch his fingers closely while he deals the cards.

[Codz]

I'd hardly trust the Syrian government to give trustworthy claims.

[Skybird]

Turkey's statements cannot be trusted any better.

[Reece]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Turkey's statements cannot be trusted any better.

You're not wrong there!!

[joegrundman]

Originally Posted by Codz

I'd hardly trust the Syrian government to give trustworthy claims.

You also cannot trust the US government, or in fact any government, to give trustworthy claims (and you'd be a fool to do so).

All claims serve a purpose, whether true, half-true, or false.

It is the purpose that is interesting, not the claim itself.

[Jimbuna]

Article 5 may be the only way of circumventing Russia and China without bringing them into open conflict.

Then again, Article 5 may still not be enough.

[Catfish]

Well even Turkey admits by now their F4E was shot down in syrian airspace ... methinks a typical turkish provocation, they have done this numerous times.

IF NATO really gets involved in there (i doubt it though, unless they want to provoke, themselves), there may be the faint chance of some unfriendliness with Russia. After the "rocket shield" being installed in Poland (!) to protect the USA against iranian rockets (who is supposed to believe that - the Russians?), i doubt Russia will allow NATO to get involved militarily in Syria (?)

[Skybird]

It seems NATO did not meet Turkey's demand with much warmth, Turkey now steps back and called comments that NATO would considerate the issue on basis of article 5 a "misunderstanding". Maybe NATO has not forgotten Turkish provocations over the Gaza flotilla...

Russia in Syria: I think the Russians are even worse prepared to get into a hot war with NATO then NATO is willing to get into a hot war against the Syrians. But there would be huge political fallout, and reactions in Russia's defence policy and defence budget.

[MH]

Originally Posted by Skybird

Russia in Syria: I think the Russians are even worse prepared to get into a hot war with NATO then NATO is willing to get into a hot war against the Syrians. But there would be huge political fallout, and reactions in Russia's defence policy and defence budget.

Russia wants Syria to be in its sphere of influence....with or without Assad.
The motivations of turkey as a great leader of Sunni world are clear but i cant hardly imagine that NATO will move along with it....they...the Turks must be careful playing the game.
I suspect the issue is becoming real pain in the back for the rest of the western countries.

On humanitarian level it is really sad whats going on is Syria....that's ME and rest of the world in the essence.


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[Skybird]

Doubts over Turkey'S version of the incident mount higher and higher, American sources claim the jet indeed was brought down by triple-A inside Syrian airspace while flying very deep and relatively slow.

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...googlenews_wsj

Before, the Herald Tribune quoted Amerian sources saying that it were extremely unlikely that the jets' mission were not actively directed against Syria.

[Jimbuna]

^ Good link

[Jimbuna]

The bodies have been found...just need to find the plane wreckage to help determine how it was shot down.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-18707069

[Skybird]

It makes the round in the media now that the Turkish general staff, the Turkish secret service and the Turkish government have come to the conclusion that the jet that got shot down indeed was within Syrian air space, and that the propaganda version told by Erdoghan I. can no longer be defended.

[Jimbuna]

Well nothing surrounding the whole sad affair would suprise me...I trust neither side.