GWX 1.04 Developmental Sneak Peak Part 5

Kpt. Lehmann · 08-30-07, 05:51 AM

Well, its been awhile since I've posted one of these and honestly, I've been dreading this one.

I'm going to talk (a little) about some things that will NOT be in GWX version 1.04... or that you may not like... and give everybody a head start on complaining about it.:p

Longer repair times:
The LRT mod that many are familiar with, will not be included in GWX. Not only does it break the crew qualifcation system and play havoc with sensor employment in SH3/GWX, but it also puts at risk our tried and tested player U-boat damage model. Though the currently available LRT mod(s) might possibly be adapted to work with GWX, there are a great many hidden side effects that I think people just don't understand in relation to its interaction with GWX files. Repair times in GWX are already slightly lengthened over stock... and this is in line with research that indicates long/lengthy repairs couldn't really be done at sea. (as in the movie Das Boot)
What I find is that there is basically three kinds of damage that was sustained by U-boats in combat.
1) Catastrophic damage- U-boat lost.
2) Major damage- U-boat must return to base to repair, unable to continue mission.
3) Minor damage usually requiring little sustained action by the crew, mission continues.
The LRT mods modify elements of the player damage model that are very risky to mess with... ie: "water weight." I don't think that any of you would like to spend ages trying to pump out the water at periscope depth... only to crush at periscope depth. Further example: 32 hours to repair batteries...
I realize that for some this mod is a "must have" for "immersion" and their personal enjoyment... and more power to them. However, we will not risk such an important change to the final release of GWX.
Finally, the individual who designed the LRT mods is the only real expert on adjusting it... and he has left the community. At any rate, even if he returned today... the time and work involved to build and test an agreeable version would be prohibitive.

The "Stay Alert Crew" mods:
We also exhaustively tested the "Stay Alert" crew mods that are intended to increase player visual and hydrophone sensor accuity... and have declined their inclusion. Though again, some view this as a "must have" element and strong opinions abound regarding its use... they also break intended effects, and negate factors limiting sensor effectiveness designed into GWX.
The Stay Alert crew mods increase the speed of sensor sweeps (namely visual sensors and hydrophones) in an effort to overcome detection lag times among units in SH3... that are more pronounced with each increment of time compression. Some of you recall the discussions concerning the lack of aircraft attacks in SH3 while in transit at high TC... well, the same is also true of surface unit detection by both enemy and player AI... due to computational lag.
While the aims of the Stay Alert crew mods are admirable, (to prevent situations where the enemy may spot you before you spot them) in so doing they also completely reintroduce the old vampire night vision bug allowing player crew to pretty much instantly spot vessels at the absolute edge of visual range on the darkest of nights. Furthermore, it is also absolutely feasible and appropriate that the enemy may spot you before you spot them. This element must remain, IMHO. It is a risk that U-boat crews faced, and one that GWX users will continue to face.
This decision was only made following their inclusion in files we made available to our testers. Now before any of you think that I'm having a slap at the gentleman who designed the Stay Alert mods... I am not. GW/GWX owes its existence and success to him in a large way. I haven't a single bad thing to say about him.

Loading times:
Loading times will be a bit longer with 1.04. This is unavoidable. Do not confuse this with specifications required to run the game once it IS loaded. Any time we add something new... that didn't previously exist... it potentially increases load times. Though faster systems do shorten the load times a bit... the system that you play GWX on today... will run GWX version 1.04. Just keep your patience. We are all stuck with it as it is precipitated by limitations of the SH3 engine/program design. GWX version 1.04 will not demagnetize your refridgerator magnets or make your hamsters pregnant.

Radar Warning Receiver ranges in relation to SH3/GWX:
Another thing that became readily apparent in testing, is the complete and total reliability of RWR sensors at maximum total range. We have been unable to influence their reliability at outer ranges to make them "fuzzy" and give them any sort of range variance... Though the maximum possible ranges are historically accurate in the currently available evolution of GWX... we are pulling them back a few clicks to make more sense in relation to the environment that can be effectively represented in SH3.
The original ranges in stock SH3, though erroneous, were PROPORTIONATE in relation to historically possible ranges. We have chosen a middle ground. (Don't panic... you should still be able to crash dive in time to avoid trouble if you are vigilant.) In so doing, we've cut down on a bit of the constant radar warnings you may receive that have no real bearing on your current situation. (Do you really want to pick up that bomber formation heading to St. Nazaire 30km away 90 degrees to starboard and have it dump you out of TC each time one of the aircraft is detected?)

Contacts: (Aaronblood this is for you.

Sorry you had to wait so long.)
In keeping with our "some... but not all" situational awareness availability of information given to the player... contacts are now LOSING their tails. This may not seem like much at first, but that tail gives you the exact heading of the contact, making intercepts a great deal simpler than should be. Making a successful intercept should not be a certainty. This coupled with the pre-existing random waypoint changes of convoys/merchant shipping (and now ASW forces and task forces) makes a successful intercept contain the same frustration in part that the real U-boat forces faced. We cannot simulate the nearly real-time decryption and dissemination of Enigma communications that were VERY often used by the Allies to re-route shipping well away from U-boat hunting areas... so this will serve the purpose. <Yes i hear many of you groaning... now stoppit!>
Once you DO attain visual range though... you can then click on the different contacts and zoom in on the map to reveal the outline and disposition of individual contact headings... as the watch crew could relate to the U-boat commander on his request.

Contact presentation with GWX 1.04:
Zoomed out- (Convoy contacts present similarly to the FIRST screenshot, though the example shown is for visual range individual contacts.)

Zoomed in-

Well, that's about it for now. Our next public update will be our final (and biggest/most powerful update

) ... and it will likely be followed by a fair amount of silence by the dev team as we beat it into submission as a release. Please DO NOT try to read a projected release date based on this. We've learned our lesson concerning such projections by running into unpredictable snags that often take many days to overcome. It will be ready when it is ready!

Oh... and you thought I wasn't going to give you any eye-candy...

http://rapidshare.com/files/52168964/wonderwhat.7z.html

and here: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...postcount=3629

mr chris · 08-30-07, 06:03 AM

Sounds good to me.

Nice *** ship. Very impressed with how it sinks.

Jimbuna · 08-30-07, 06:05 AM

Xmas could well come early this year

Mush Martin · 08-30-07, 06:21 AM

Thanks for the update Kpt if I have any complaints Ill just mod them
out. Sounds good though.

MM

Kpt. Lehmann · 08-30-07, 06:25 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mush Martin

T... if I have any complaints Ill just mod them
out.

I have no doubt that people will do exactly that.

Mush Martin · 08-30-07, 06:28 AM

Honestly Im looking forward to a fresh round of serious none arcadish
play. these days it seems Im mostly testing stuff when I play
(I still reserve one day a month for real play though)

Career games bring elements that missions dont.
each evolving situation and the adaptive approach.
its been a while for a serious career and its long time
I got back to the garden as it were.
M

Woof1701 · 08-30-07, 06:38 AM

Ok I start complaining: When reading the title I thought I'm gonna see something new, and now I only see what's NOT in the game. No new screenshot *sniff* ;-)

Venatore · 08-30-07, 06:41 AM

Now that took my breath away

danlisa · 08-30-07, 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woof1701

Ok I start complaining: When reading the title I thought I'm gonna see something new, and now I only see what's NOT in the game. No new screenshot *sniff* ;-)

LOL, you obviously have not d/l'd or viewed the links at the bottom of the first post.

madmike81 · 08-30-07, 06:50 AM

Holy Smokes! Looks very nice. Very nice indeed.

Woof1701 · 08-30-07, 06:55 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by danlisa

Quote:

Originally Posted by Woof1701

Ok I start complaining: When reading the title I thought I'm gonna see something new, and now I only see what's NOT in the game. No new screenshot *sniff* ;-)

LOL, you obviously have not d/l'd or viewed the links at the bottom of the first post.

Ok. Now I really feel stupid. Thanks ...

Mush Martin · 08-30-07, 06:56 AM

Well I got the d/l and although Im a touch familiar with the subject.
I didnt actually get to see the clip. there is something wrong
with my current version of Media player.

it will give sound but wont show the video portion either of
this clip or of my own video from mr fleck.

wierd surely im missing something.

danlisa · 08-30-07, 07:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mush Martin

Well I got the d/l and although Im a touch familiar with the subject.
I didnt actually get to see the clip. there is something wrong
with my current version of Media player.

it will give sound but wont show the video portion either of
this clip or of my own video from mr fleck.

wierd surely im missing something.

It's a direct Fraps grab, use VLC media player.

http://www.videolan.org/vlc/

I have yet to find a video codec that VLC can't play.

mkubani · 08-30-07, 07:01 AM

Hi guys, is anybody out there willing/able to reupload the file from Kaptain to a different host please? Rapidshare isn't friendly with my online provider.

mkubani · 08-30-07, 07:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by danlisa

I have yet to find a video codec that VLC can't play.

I did once or twice, but VLC is still the best/easiest to use out there that I know of.

08-30-07, 05:51 AM	#1
Kpt. Lehmann GWX Project Director Join Date: Jul 2005 Location: The Republic of Texas Posts: 6,993 Downloads: 124 Uploads: 0	GWX 1.04 Developmental Sneak Peak Part 5 Well, its been awhile since I've posted one of these and honestly, I've been dreading this one. I'm going to talk (a little) about some things that will NOT be in GWX version 1.04... or that you may not like... and give everybody a head start on complaining about it.:p Longer repair times: The LRT mod that many are familiar with, will not be included in GWX. Not only does it break the crew qualifcation system and play havoc with sensor employment in SH3/GWX, but it also puts at risk our tried and tested player U-boat damage model. Though the currently available LRT mod(s) might possibly be adapted to work with GWX, there are a great many hidden side effects that I think people just don't understand in relation to its interaction with GWX files. Repair times in GWX are already slightly lengthened over stock... and this is in line with research that indicates long/lengthy repairs couldn't really be done at sea. (as in the movie Das Boot) What I find is that there is basically three kinds of damage that was sustained by U-boats in combat. 1) Catastrophic damage- U-boat lost. 2) Major damage- U-boat must return to base to repair, unable to continue mission. 3) Minor damage usually requiring little sustained action by the crew, mission continues. The LRT mods modify elements of the player damage model that are very risky to mess with... ie: "water weight." I don't think that any of you would like to spend ages trying to pump out the water at periscope depth... only to crush at periscope depth. Further example: 32 hours to repair batteries... I realize that for some this mod is a "must have" for "immersion" and their personal enjoyment... and more power to them. However, we will not risk such an important change to the final release of GWX. Finally, the individual who designed the LRT mods is the only real expert on adjusting it... and he has left the community. At any rate, even if he returned today... the time and work involved to build and test an agreeable version would be prohibitive. The "Stay Alert Crew" mods: We also exhaustively tested the "Stay Alert" crew mods that are intended to increase player visual and hydrophone sensor accuity... and have declined their inclusion. Though again, some view this as a "must have" element and strong opinions abound regarding its use... they also break intended effects, and negate factors limiting sensor effectiveness designed into GWX. The Stay Alert crew mods increase the speed of sensor sweeps (namely visual sensors and hydrophones) in an effort to overcome detection lag times among units in SH3... that are more pronounced with each increment of time compression. Some of you recall the discussions concerning the lack of aircraft attacks in SH3 while in transit at high TC... well, the same is also true of surface unit detection by both enemy and player AI... due to computational lag. While the aims of the Stay Alert crew mods are admirable, (to prevent situations where the enemy may spot you before you spot them) in so doing they also completely reintroduce the old vampire night vision bug allowing player crew to pretty much instantly spot vessels at the absolute edge of visual range on the darkest of nights. Furthermore, it is also absolutely feasible and appropriate that the enemy may spot you before you spot them. This element must remain, IMHO. It is a risk that U-boat crews faced, and one that GWX users will continue to face. This decision was only made following their inclusion in files we made available to our testers. Now before any of you think that I'm having a slap at the gentleman who designed the Stay Alert mods... I am not. GW/GWX owes its existence and success to him in a large way. I haven't a single bad thing to say about him. Loading times: Loading times will be a bit longer with 1.04. This is unavoidable. Do not confuse this with specifications required to run the game once it IS loaded. Any time we add something new... that didn't previously exist... it potentially increases load times. Though faster systems do shorten the load times a bit... the system that you play GWX on today... will run GWX version 1.04. Just keep your patience. We are all stuck with it as it is precipitated by limitations of the SH3 engine/program design. GWX version 1.04 will not demagnetize your refridgerator magnets or make your hamsters pregnant. Radar Warning Receiver ranges in relation to SH3/GWX: Another thing that became readily apparent in testing, is the complete and total reliability of RWR sensors at maximum total range. We have been unable to influence their reliability at outer ranges to make them "fuzzy" and give them any sort of range variance... Though the maximum possible ranges are historically accurate in the currently available evolution of GWX... we are pulling them back a few clicks to make more sense in relation to the environment that can be effectively represented in SH3. The original ranges in stock SH3, though erroneous, were PROPORTIONATE in relation to historically possible ranges. We have chosen a middle ground. (Don't panic... you should still be able to crash dive in time to avoid trouble if you are vigilant.) In so doing, we've cut down on a bit of the constant radar warnings you may receive that have no real bearing on your current situation. (Do you really want to pick up that bomber formation heading to St. Nazaire 30km away 90 degrees to starboard and have it dump you out of TC each time one of the aircraft is detected?) Contacts: (Aaronblood this is for you. Sorry you had to wait so long.) In keeping with our "some... but not all" situational awareness availability of information given to the player... contacts are now LOSING their tails. This may not seem like much at first, but that tail gives you the exact heading of the contact, making intercepts a great deal simpler than should be. Making a successful intercept should not be a certainty. This coupled with the pre-existing random waypoint changes of convoys/merchant shipping (and now ASW forces and task forces) makes a successful intercept contain the same frustration in part that the real U-boat forces faced. We cannot simulate the nearly real-time decryption and dissemination of Enigma communications that were VERY often used by the Allies to re-route shipping well away from U-boat hunting areas... so this will serve the purpose. <Yes i hear many of you groaning... now stoppit!> Once you DO attain visual range though... you can then click on the different contacts and zoom in on the map to reveal the outline and disposition of individual contact headings... as the watch crew could relate to the U-boat commander on his request. Contact presentation with GWX 1.04: Zoomed out- (Convoy contacts present similarly to the FIRST screenshot, though the example shown is for visual range individual contacts.) Zoomed in- Well, that's about it for now. Our next public update will be our final (and biggest/most powerful update ) ... and it will likely be followed by a fair amount of silence by the dev team as we beat it into submission as a release. Please DO NOT try to read a projected release date based on this. We've learned our lesson concerning such projections by running into unpredictable snags that often take many days to overcome. It will be ready when it is ready! Oh... and you thought I wasn't going to give you any eye-candy... http://rapidshare.com/files/52168964/wonderwhat.7z.html and here: http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/show...postcount=3629 __________________ www.thegreywolves.com All you need is good men. - Heinrich Lehmann-Willenbrock Last edited by Kpt. Lehmann; 08-30-07 at 06:29 AM.

08-30-07, 06:05 AM	#3
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 190,500 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	Xmas could well come early this year __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!!

08-30-07, 06:21 AM	#4
Mush Martin Eternal Patrol Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 4,398 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	Thanks for the update Kpt if I have any complaints Ill just mod them out. Sounds good though. MM __________________ RIP Mush Tutorial

08-30-07, 06:28 AM	#6
Mush Martin Eternal Patrol Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 4,398 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	Honestly Im looking forward to a fresh round of serious none arcadish play. these days it seems Im mostly testing stuff when I play (I still reserve one day a month for real play though) Career games bring elements that missions dont. each evolving situation and the adaptive approach. its been a while for a serious career and its long time I got back to the garden as it were. M __________________ RIP Mush Tutorial

08-30-07, 06:50 AM	#10
madmike81 Sparky Join Date: Oct 2005 Location: Johnson City TN Posts: 155 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Holy Smokes! Looks very nice. Very nice indeed. __________________ "We're on the side of the demons, Chief. We're evil men in the gardens of paradise, sent by the forces of death to spread devastation and destruction wherever we go."

08-30-07, 06:03 AM	#2
mr chris Silent Hunter Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Herefordshire, England Posts: 3,562 Downloads: 216 Uploads: 0	Sounds good to me. Nice *** ship. Very impressed with how it sinks.

08-30-07, 06:38 AM	#7
Woof1701 Commodore Join Date: Jan 2002 Location: Munich, Germany, Home of U-96 Posts: 633 Downloads: 9 Uploads: 0	Ok I start complaining: When reading the title I thought I'm gonna see something new, and now I only see what's NOT in the game. No new screenshot sniff ;-)

08-30-07, 06:41 AM	#8
Venatore Admiral Join Date: Apr 2005 Location: Australia:- Sydney Posts: 2,049 Downloads: 68 Uploads: 0	Now that took my breath away

08-30-07, 06:56 AM	#12
Mush Martin Eternal Patrol Join Date: Dec 2006 Posts: 4,398 Downloads: 4 Uploads: 0	Well I got the d/l and although Im a touch familiar with the subject. I didnt actually get to see the clip. there is something wrong with my current version of Media player. it will give sound but wont show the video portion either of this clip or of my own video from mr fleck. wierd surely im missing something. __________________ RIP Mush Tutorial

08-30-07, 07:01 AM	#14
mkubani Lieutenant Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 256 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Hi guys, is anybody out there willing/able to reupload the file from Kaptain to a different host please? Rapidshare isn't friendly with my online provider.