Type IX/D2 - Page 2

Morpheus · 03-24-09, 11:36 AM

what a crappy discussion ...

LukeFF · 03-24-09, 03:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morpheus

what a crappy discussion ...

And you didn't exactly add anything to the conversation, now did you?

Morpheus · 03-24-09, 03:39 PM

it comes to a fragile point when ppl start talking about nacional socialism propaganda.

which is absolutely not true about the movie das boot. but if you didnt get it it would be worth another try watching it. also movies about war aren't ment to be funny or entertaining, other than you to show what a misery it was for all that had to go through it.

kr morph

Rockin Robbins · 03-24-09, 04:48 PM

Morpheus you are making no sense whatever. There are no ideas in your post at all. Try making a point and defending it. I wouldn't be surprised if there was an idea in there somewhere...

It is just impossible to find it in what you wrote.

Explanation: it is a pronoun referring to nothing. What is it? What is a fragile point? Who was talking about "nacional socialism proganda?" What isn't true about the movie Das Boot? If one didn't get what? There's that undefined "it" again. Who maintained Das Boot was meant to be funny or entertaining? What could a phrase like "other than you to show what a misery it was for all that had to go through it" possibly mean? Another undefined "it." There's no there there.

Agree or disagree with me, I posited a definite point, explained and illustrated it with idiocies from the movie. Your post not only did not respond, it was irrelevant to the English language itself. Put one foot in front of the other and walk!

Morpheus · 03-24-09, 06:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

... The main character is some everyman whose function is to whimper in the corner, suffering nobly but incapable of any constructive function on the boat. Give me a break! On a real U-Boat he would have been properly tossed overboard without a life jacket. There weren't enough men on a U-Boat to have a designated corner whimperer. Send him back to his mommy!

When the sub is under attack there is no evasion at all! They just sit down there and hope the enemy misses. Stupid! U-Boats were not helpless victims of war, they actually fought it!

When I watched the movie in ignorance when it first came out I was awed. As I learned more and more about how submarines and U-Boats were run, I looked at Das Boot for what it is: a poor melodrama, whose purpose is propoganda. A lousy anti-war film with great props. An insult to the real U-Boat crews who fought with courage and ability.

i am sure you can understand my text if you want to, there are some typos ... normal condition on internet forums. i would like to see you type some german text anyway.

when i re-read your posting from earlier today, i would say that you have a problem with making a point.

i marked out the interessting lines in bold. first, this man was not a everyman whimp, he was what we call a "kriegsberichterstatter", in english, a war correspondent. second, this story is no fiction, it really happend. The man's name you called a everyman whimp was Lothar-Günther Buchheim, and he joint U96 in 1941 as a war correspondent. i read his book, which the movie was made after. Propaganda? For what? Hitler? You must be jokin. It points out so much as a antipropagande for Hitler. Poor Melodrama? What do you think the saving of private ryan or any reasonable movie is? everything else i would call a propagande for making war, no?

As i said earlier, this is coming to a "sensitive" point.

//EDIT: i excanged the word fragile with sensitive, that should help

Morpheus · 03-24-09, 06:15 PM

finally, to add some comment to the actual thema.

i think it is senseless to compare german vs. us subarines here, since we will never get a chance to find out. i like both, played sid meyers silent service on the c64 wayback in the 80ies and enjoyed the gato and balao class submarines very much. i like german subs the same, just for what they are. this game doesn't represent "the real" submarines at all, but gives our imagination some great help in having an idea of how it could of been.

so, if you want to have a measure on your dick with eachother you will have to find another kind of measurement than this one. just because it is ridiculous ...

Rockin Robbins · 03-24-09, 07:53 PM

I stand by my statements and leave it to others to judge whether I have made my points well. I am satisfied that aside from misspelling propaganda, I did a pretty good job.

By the way, the book is excellent. It is the movie that is pitiful. And it is pitiful from a dramatic point of view, not photographic. It is the men who are unbelievable, not the machines. Many U-Boat veterans have made my exact point that the movie denigrates the men it is supposed to lionize. They don't consider themselves to be heroes anyway. While I respect them, I agree completely with their self-image. A hero must fight for a just cause. Theirs was evil to an extreme seldom seen in human enterprise.

Why do you find it necessary to make anatomical references (I'm surprised the illustrious auto-censor let that one fly

. Two points for sneaking that one through.) or bring up the U-Boat vs. fleet boat angle, which was not even treated in my opinion of Das Boot? Misdirection is a tool of someone who has conceded the discussion and needs to change the subject. I'll let your conduct speak for itself.

Morpheus · 03-24-09, 08:13 PM

Did you have your coffee this morning, Admiral?

martes86 · 03-25-09, 05:38 AM

This is fun...

Morpheus, do you realise that your "sort-of-points" are making us serious u-boot fans look like a bunch of stupid blind-faith kriegsmarine worshippers?

Shut up if you're not able to make a valid point. Thanks.

Now, a serious point here.

Yeah, I know what's Das Boot about, and still, I can't help loving it. It's terribly unrealistic speaking from an operations protocol point of view, and there's probably too much of a screaming act when under attack, etc.
Still, it's a movie (made for Hollywood, mind I add), it's about U-Boote, and regardless of poor depiction, it's damn cool. Das Boot was made to try to realisticly reflect some points of U-Boot warfare and its people, but not all of them... and while we might base our statements about U-Boote in this movie for a large part, it's for a great desire of making the environment in which we "play" the "game" a spectacular and fun show, which we can enjoy with a mixture of realism and spectacular fun show. Das Boot is seen like a bible for "U-Booting", but even though we base our acts on it, it's an accesory, and of course, those of us with a responsible and rational approach, try to make it a complement of even more realistic materials.

Now, for realistic protocols, you might want to watch "Morgenrot", a WW1 based german film made in the late 20's.

I'll post more if something comes up to mind.

Morpheus · 03-25-09, 07:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martes86

This is fun...

Morpheus, do you realise that your "sort-of-points" are making us serious u-boot fans look like a bunch of stupid blind-faith kriegsmarine worshippers?

Shut up if you're not able to make a valid point. Thanks.

give me a invalid point i made

sorry when i ruined your roleplay jacko

martes86 · 03-25-09, 07:54 AM

Invalid points? Well, for starters...

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morpheus

so, if you want to have a measure on your dick with eachother you will have to find another kind of measurement than this one. just because it is ridiculous ...

This is not like a very constructive comment, so you can take it back in, we don't want to see it. :rotfl:

Now,

Quote:

Originally Posted by Morpheus

i marked out the interessting lines in bold. first, this man was not a everyman whimp, he was what we call a "kriegsberichterstatter", in english, a war correspondent. second, this story is no fiction, it really happend. The man's name you called a everyman whimp was Lothar-Günther Buchheim, and he joint U96 in 1941 as a war correspondent. i read his book, which the movie was made after. Propaganda? For what? Hitler? You must be jokin. It points out so much as a antipropagande for Hitler. Poor Melodrama? What do you think the saving of private ryan or any reasonable movie is? everything else i would call a propagande for making war, no?

RR didn't actually say that the man was a everyman whimp, but that he looked like that. He knows that he's supposed to be a correspondent, but, my guess is that he doesn't think he's very well portrayed... he might be right.

Second, the story IS FICTION. Das Boot is a fictional version of one of the patrols of U96, and so, all characters in the book have fictional names. Buchheim published another book, which name I can't remember right now, but that was the one based on real facts, and included real photos made on patrol. Das Boot is a fiction novel. Of course, having been a correspondent a board the U96, he gathered that experience to make the book look convincing, but it was fiction nevertheless, and the U-Boot veterans didn't like that fiction as they thought it didn't represent the reality of U-Boot men, so they wrote the book entitled "We U-Boot men say: no, it was not like that". I guess you didn't know that.

Of course, I wouldn't go as far as calling it poor melodrama, as I love the movie, but still, RR has a point, which you seemingly don't... at least, even if I don't agree with him, I try to make a solid point of my opinions, instead of talking about dicks' sizes.

And don't worry, nothing ruined here... in fact I'm having fun reading some of the ignorant posts being made by some people that call themselves u-boot fans.

Morpheus · 03-25-09, 11:32 AM

who is the ignorant one here. you interpret the writen of someone else as it fits for you and distract with moving away from the thema ... must bee some weird stuff you're comsuming.

as it seems you both didnt get the line i made with answering within two sepperate posts. one was a direct answer to RR, and the other a answer to this thread. maby you go back and look what it was about on the start anyway. but i can image that lines start to blur when consuming heavy stuff.

my intend is in no way to talk bad about u-boat fans, but it seems to me that you are cought in some kind of fog. talking about invalid points, i think it was a very good point, and i think you enjoyed reading it, which would explain your smiley towards that one.

we can continue with this hairsplitting typing anyways until the moon drops down ... thats why i called this a crappy thread in the beginning.

martes86 · 03-25-09, 11:44 AM

I'll admit, the "lower member" thing was a little drift... anyways, seemed funny to mock the comment, and so I did, thus, the smiley present in my post...

But the rest of the post is perfectly valid and in line with your previous post.

Morpheus · 03-25-09, 12:22 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by martes86

But the rest of the post is perfectly valid and in line with your previous post.

you mean this?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

The main character is some everyman whose function is to whimper in the corner, suffering nobly but incapable of any constructive function on the boat.

and

Quote:

Originally Posted by martes86

RR didn't actually say that the man was a everyman whimp, but that he looked like that. He knows that he's supposed to be a correspondent, but, my guess is that he doesn't think he's very well portrayed... he might be right.

your abilities are amazing, you should go to nasa testlabs ...

martes86 · 03-25-09, 12:47 PM

Now it is me who doesn't know what stuff are you smoking. I thought RR and me were answering you for the post he made about Das Boot and your later replies.

Oh, BTW, I also think he's a little wrong when saying that the movie is propaganda. But I reafirm myself on the rest of the stuff I wrote.

03-24-09, 04:48 PM	#19
Rockin Robbins Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: DeLand, FL Posts: 8,899 Downloads: 135 Uploads: 52	Morpheus you are making no sense whatever. There are no ideas in your post at all. Try making a point and defending it. I wouldn't be surprised if there was an idea in there somewhere... It is just impossible to find it in what you wrote. Explanation: it is a pronoun referring to nothing. What is it? What is a fragile point? Who was talking about "nacional socialism proganda?" What isn't true about the movie Das Boot? If one didn't get what? There's that undefined "it" again. Who maintained Das Boot was meant to be funny or entertaining? What could a phrase like "other than you to show what a misery it was for all that had to go through it" possibly mean? Another undefined "it." There's no there there. Agree or disagree with me, I posited a definite point, explained and illustrated it with idiocies from the movie. Your post not only did not respond, it was irrelevant to the English language itself. Put one foot in front of the other and walk! __________________ Sub Skipper's Bag of Tricks, Slightly Subnuclear Mk 14 & Cutie, Slightly Subnuclear Deck Gun, EZPlot 2.0, TMOPlot, TMOKeys, SH4CMS

03-24-09, 07:53 PM	#22
Rockin Robbins Navy Seal Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: DeLand, FL Posts: 8,899 Downloads: 135 Uploads: 52	I stand by my statements and leave it to others to judge whether I have made my points well. I am satisfied that aside from misspelling propaganda, I did a pretty good job. By the way, the book is excellent. It is the movie that is pitiful. And it is pitiful from a dramatic point of view, not photographic. It is the men who are unbelievable, not the machines. Many U-Boat veterans have made my exact point that the movie denigrates the men it is supposed to lionize. They don't consider themselves to be heroes anyway. While I respect them, I agree completely with their self-image. A hero must fight for a just cause. Theirs was evil to an extreme seldom seen in human enterprise. Why do you find it necessary to make anatomical references (I'm surprised the illustrious auto-censor let that one fly. Two points for sneaking that one through.) or bring up the U-Boat vs. fleet boat angle, which was not even treated in my opinion of Das Boot? Misdirection is a tool of someone who has conceded the discussion and needs to change the subject. I'll let your conduct speak for itself. __________________ Sub Skipper's Bag of Tricks, Slightly Subnuclear Mk 14 & Cutie, Slightly Subnuclear Deck Gun, EZPlot 2.0, TMOPlot, TMOKeys, SH4CMS Last edited by Rockin Robbins; 03-24-09 at 08:03 PM.

03-24-09, 11:36 AM	#16
Morpheus Ensign Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 234 Downloads: 17 Uploads: 0	what a crappy discussion ...

03-24-09, 03:39 PM	#18
Morpheus Ensign Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 234 Downloads: 17 Uploads: 0	it comes to a fragile point when ppl start talking about nacional socialism propaganda. which is absolutely not true about the movie das boot. but if you didnt get it it would be worth another try watching it. also movies about war aren't ment to be funny or entertaining, other than you to show what a misery it was for all that had to go through it. kr morph

03-24-09, 06:15 PM	#21
Morpheus Ensign Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 234 Downloads: 17 Uploads: 0	finally, to add some comment to the actual thema. i think it is senseless to compare german vs. us subarines here, since we will never get a chance to find out. i like both, played sid meyers silent service on the c64 wayback in the 80ies and enjoyed the gato and balao class submarines very much. i like german subs the same, just for what they are. this game doesn't represent "the real" submarines at all, but gives our imagination some great help in having an idea of how it could of been. so, if you want to have a measure on your dick with eachother you will have to find another kind of measurement than this one. just because it is ridiculous ...

03-24-09, 08:13 PM	#23
Morpheus Ensign Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 234 Downloads: 17 Uploads: 0	Did you have your coffee this morning, Admiral?

03-25-09, 05:38 AM	#24
martes86 Grey Wolf Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: The Colourful Seville - Spain Posts: 971 Downloads: 18 Uploads: 0	This is fun... Morpheus, do you realise that your "sort-of-points" are making us serious u-boot fans look like a bunch of stupid blind-faith kriegsmarine worshippers? Shut up if you're not able to make a valid point. Thanks. Now, a serious point here. Yeah, I know what's Das Boot about, and still, I can't help loving it. It's terribly unrealistic speaking from an operations protocol point of view, and there's probably too much of a screaming act when under attack, etc. Still, it's a movie (made for Hollywood, mind I add), it's about U-Boote, and regardless of poor depiction, it's damn cool. Das Boot was made to try to realisticly reflect some points of U-Boot warfare and its people, but not all of them... and while we might base our statements about U-Boote in this movie for a large part, it's for a great desire of making the environment in which we "play" the "game" a spectacular and fun show, which we can enjoy with a mixture of realism and spectacular fun show. Das Boot is seen like a bible for "U-Booting", but even though we base our acts on it, it's an accesory, and of course, those of us with a responsible and rational approach, try to make it a complement of even more realistic materials. Now, for realistic protocols, you might want to watch "Morgenrot", a WW1 based german film made in the late 20's. I'll post more if something comes up to mind.

03-25-09, 11:32 AM	#27
Morpheus Ensign Join Date: Mar 2009 Posts: 234 Downloads: 17 Uploads: 0	who is the ignorant one here. you interpret the writen of someone else as it fits for you and distract with moving away from the thema ... must bee some weird stuff you're comsuming. as it seems you both didnt get the line i made with answering within two sepperate posts. one was a direct answer to RR, and the other a answer to this thread. maby you go back and look what it was about on the start anyway. but i can image that lines start to blur when consuming heavy stuff. my intend is in no way to talk bad about u-boat fans, but it seems to me that you are cought in some kind of fog. talking about invalid points, i think it was a very good point, and i think you enjoyed reading it, which would explain your smiley towards that one. we can continue with this hairsplitting typing anyways until the moon drops down ... thats why i called this a crappy thread in the beginning.

03-25-09, 11:44 AM	#28
martes86 Grey Wolf Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: The Colourful Seville - Spain Posts: 971 Downloads: 18 Uploads: 0	I'll admit, the "lower member" thing was a little drift... anyways, seemed funny to mock the comment, and so I did, thus, the smiley present in my post... But the rest of the post is perfectly valid and in line with your previous post.

03-25-09, 12:47 PM	#30
martes86 Grey Wolf Join Date: Jun 2004 Location: The Colourful Seville - Spain Posts: 971 Downloads: 18 Uploads: 0	Now it is me who doesn't know what stuff are you smoking. I thought RR and me were answering you for the post he made about Das Boot and your later replies. Oh, BTW, I also think he's a little wrong when saying that the movie is propaganda. But I reafirm myself on the rest of the stuff I wrote.