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Old 05-09-12, 03:35 AM   #46
Bubblehead1980
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George H.W. Bush was a decorated Naval Aviator in World War II, did some pretty heroic things actually.Reagan brought the economy back and implemented a foreign policy that lead to the end of the Soviet Union basically.Please tell me why a union boss with sketchy methods deserves a ship named after him?Really no argument against Reagan or Bush having carriers named after them, but Chavez was scum.No, this is not a right or left thing, it's a whats right or wrong.Now, if Chavez had accomplished something in the military etc I would possibly be okay with it, but he badmouthed his time in service, saying his two years in the US Navy were the "worst of his life".

This is nothing more than a moronic Obama appointee playing politics at the direction of Master Barry.Shame on them, really.Instead of naming a ship after a union thug, how about some of those who have given their lives or limbs in Iraq and Afghanistan.A guy from my my hometown, well just outside my hometown was KIA in Iraq in 2005, actually, he was the 2,000th US service member killed in Iraq, let's name it after him or some of the other lesser known patriots, not a union thug with communist leanings who pretended to advocate non violence.Just another sign of how disgusting this admin is, November can not come fast enough.

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Old 05-09-12, 03:51 AM   #47
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I do not think it will lessen the crew in any way. I am sure they will all be outstanding sailors.

I love me some partisanship sometimes, and have alot of fun with it, but this reeks of idealogical hate.
Lets call our next one the USS Hitler, because he took over alot of countries. Or the USS Bernanke, because he runs our country.I am sure someone sees them as heroes.

Would you cheer if a ship by the name of the USS Obama got sunk? Just wondering. You have an irrational hate towards the other side, as if the other side has nothing to offer, or should be minimized.

EDIT: (St. Reagan gets too much credit for sinking the soviets, but zero blame in our current economical failure, but that is irrelivant ATM. Trickle down lulz!)



They can name it after you for all I care. As long as it works right.

USS Bubblehead... Nice ring! ;P
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Old 05-09-12, 09:41 AM   #48
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Originally Posted by kraznyi_oktjabr View Post
My opinion is that ships (and subs if marine animals and plants are all used) should be named after:
1. geographical locations (states, cities, lakes, rivers etc.)
2. significant battles
3. distinguished military personnel (Medal of Honor recipients, admirals/officers/enlisted with extraordary record etc.)
4. elements & animals
5. after concepts like Her Majesty's Royal Navy does (which I don't think fits to U.S. Navy ships)

After what they should NOT be named:
1. politicians (except if he/she also fits to any category above, having locations/animal's etc. name as first/surname not counting)
I believe this is the best of all possible answers to naming a Naval vessel. It is my believe that naming a ship for political leverage(I did not say the USS Chavez is named for leverage)is poor. This vessel should be named USS Plymouth Rock. I don't believe their will be much upset over this name.
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Old 05-09-12, 10:03 AM   #49
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This vessel should be named USS Plymouth Rock. I don't believe their will be much upset over this name.
But that would be even more disgustingly radical, those seperatists rejected the church and the state and formed a commune where everyone supposedly worked for and was subservient to the common good...bloody radicals from the 1600s eh.
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Old 05-09-12, 10:17 AM   #50
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But that would be even more disgustingly radical, those seperatists rejected the church and the state and formed a commune where everyone supposedly worked for and was subservient to the common good...bloody radicals from the 1600s eh.
And they were illegal immigrants, too!
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Old 05-09-12, 10:20 AM   #51
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Originally Posted by Tribesman View Post
But that would be even more disgustingly radical, those seperatists rejected the church and the state and formed a commune where everyone supposedly worked for and was subservient to the common good...bloody radicals from the 1600s eh.

Good point! Let's just call it USS Rock.
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Old 05-09-12, 10:26 AM   #52
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Good point! Let's just call it USS Rock.
But if you call a ship the Rock the WWF will get on your case over infringement.
no hold on they changed their name as someone confused them with the panda crowd didn't they.
Call the ship the USS panda but not that panda the other one and that will make eveyone happy.....or does panda sound too chinese
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Old 05-09-12, 10:32 AM   #53
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Originally Posted by vienna View Post
really, aside from Chavez, who in the Latino political community has the general public even heard of or know by sight and/or name. I'm clean out of guesses...
Cheech Marin?

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Originally Posted by vienna View Post
As a final note, I want make clear I am not "bashing" Latinos, Hispanics, or whatever the nom du jour might be;
I haven't seen any of your writing as a Latino-bash, rather than giving some insight about the views of the Hispanic-American community.

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There are a great many native born Americans, of Latin ancestry, who feel as I do and have short shrift with all the loudmouthed "activists" who claim to speak for all Latinos anymore than all the loudmouthed Liberal and/or Consrevative "activists" speak for all Americans in general. I do not live as a hypenated entity or political viewpoint: Born American, live American, and will die American...
again a little OT, but this is an interesting topic. It has certainly been before the 24/7 "news" cycle that the media always picks out the loudest as somehow representatives of the community for which they claim to speak for. The media representation gives those people even more opportunity to see themselves as a spokesperson for whoever they claim to speak for. I have often seen this, not only with self-proclaimed community leaders, but also with "liberal activists" (I hate both words) who claim to help/fight for the oppressed, but have no clue of the life reality of the people they want to help. Most people do not want to be in the role of the eternal victim, unable to help themself, waiting for the angel to help them out of their misery....

A little German example, we have this integration/immigration debate going on for decades ... In the last couple of months, one man got invited very often, to talk shows, but also to official political conferences: Serdar Somuncu. A comedian, turkish born, raised in Germany, very well spoken, better German than most politicians. Humor is hard to translate, but I would call him a mixture of David Chappelle, Louis C.K. and Sarah Silverman. He often gets asked about immigration and about the muslim community, he always says: "Why do people ask me this and why the heck do they make the connotation: immigrant=Turk=muslim?" He says he was "dropped somewhere between Ankara and Düsseldorf", so no immigration story here and as an outspoken atheist he finds it rather offensive to be taken as a representative for a religion with which he has less to do than members of our Christian parties.

However in the moments when he joins the media game, fakes to speak for muslims and immigrants, people regard him somehow as an authority for all immigrant questions. He usually starts with saying some trivial things, followed by more and more insane arguments and demands, funny to see how long it sometimes takes till the people notice it - if at all... Nothing seems insane enough if you are a self-proclaimed spokesperson.
The media wants faces to connect: want to speak about Alaska? Ask Mrs Palin, same way Sharpton speaks for every dark-skinned American, or Cheney for every hunter. Much less work than actually speak to a cross-section of the people for whom they claim to speak...

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Chavez was a union thug nothing more.Sure, he is a hero to the mental midgets on the left who buy the class warfare, fine but a US Naval Vessel should not be named after him.
Damn, this just sounds like swallowing textbook-style propaganda and repeating it without even trying to think on your own.
And you wonder that people attack your writing style and bash you? I have refrained to do so yet, I wonder why...
The reason I am not replying on the same level is that there are people from the more conservative side, even on here, whose opinions I can respect, sometimes even agree on (in my seldom cases of mind-gigantism), because they can articulate their views, put them into words and may even put some things into a different perspective.


So fighting for one's own believes, against oppression, standing up for the rights of others, helping to improve their lives is unamerican now?
And this: "[he] rallied a bunch of farmers and despite what the popular narrative is, he was not above using violence"

It sounds that you don't agree with ships that are named after George Washington...
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Old 05-09-12, 10:42 AM   #54
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Originally Posted by soopaman2 View Post
EDIT: (St. Reagan gets too much credit for sinking the soviets, but zero blame in our current economical failure, but that is irrelivant ATM. Trickle down lulz!)
If you're gonna blame Presidents for the health of the economy then Ronnie left the Oval office with the country in a heckuva lot better shape than it was when he got it from the Peanut Farmer.
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Old 05-09-12, 10:49 AM   #55
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Originally Posted by Tribesman View Post
But if you call a ship the Rock the WWF will get on your case over infringement.
no hold on they changed their name as someone confused them with the panda crowd didn't they.
Call the ship the USS panda but not that panda the other one and that will make eveyone happy.....or does panda sound too chinese

PETA will get after us for using Panda.
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Old 05-09-12, 11:44 AM   #56
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How about the USS Debt.
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Old 05-09-12, 12:01 PM   #57
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How about the USS Debt.
This would offend all on Capitol Hill and PA Ave. Sadly, the vessel will probably still have a loan due on it.
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Old 05-09-12, 12:55 PM   #58
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Cheech Marin?
Oddly, he is viewed with ambivilence by the Latino political community. He does have supportive views of general Latino issues, but is not "Mexican enough" for the die-hard political activists. For them, he really has not spoken strongly enough on their key issues of immigation, etc. He is not enough of a raving ideologue to suit their tastes. Remember, Cheech was born in Los Angeles (native born American citizen) and is the son of a Los Angeles Police officer (his mom was a secretary, as I recall). Although I ,myself, am not Mexican, I know how the Mexican community view harshly those Latinos who are not Mexican or are not "Mexican enough". Marin is well-educated (college degree), well-read, is not very fluent in Spanish, is a patron of the arts, and really is not easy to stereotype as a "Mexican". He is also not a far left leaning liberal; he is rather more of a moderate on a great many issues. Aside from trotting him out to fill in the wide gap in the field of well-known/liked Mexicans at public functions, the Latino community seems to generally ignore him. I feel for his position since I have had to deal with far greater discrimination and ill-treatment from the Mexican community than from any other community here in Los Angeles...


Quote:
Originally Posted by Tribesman
But that would be even more disgustingly radical, those seperatists rejected the church and the state and formed a commune where everyone supposedly worked for and was subservient to the common good...bloody radicals from the 1600s eh.
Quote:
And they were illegal immigrants, too!
Reminds me of a bumper sticker I used to see in the late 60s/early 70s:

"The Indians Had Lousy Immiration Laws"...

Quote:
This would offend all on Capitol Hill and PA Ave. Sadly, the vessel will probably still have a loan due on it.
So maybe we should name the ship USS Loan and say we've floated a loan?...
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Old 05-09-12, 03:00 PM   #59
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Originally Posted by mookiemookie View Post
And they were illegal immigrants, too!
I don't think so, this was not a sovereign nation with immigration laws back then.
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Old 05-09-12, 03:07 PM   #60
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Penguin View Post
Cheech Marin?


I haven't seen any of your writing as a Latino-bash, rather than giving some insight about the views of the Hispanic-American community.



again a little OT, but this is an interesting topic. It has certainly been before the 24/7 "news" cycle that the media always picks out the loudest as somehow representatives of the community for which they claim to speak for. The media representation gives those people even more opportunity to see themselves as a spokesperson for whoever they claim to speak for. I have often seen this, not only with self-proclaimed community leaders, but also with "liberal activists" (I hate both words) who claim to help/fight for the oppressed, but have no clue of the life reality of the people they want to help. Most people do not want to be in the role of the eternal victim, unable to help themself, waiting for the angel to help them out of their misery....

A little German example, we have this integration/immigration debate going on for decades ... In the last couple of months, one man got invited very often, to talk shows, but also to official political conferences: Serdar Somuncu. A comedian, turkish born, raised in Germany, very well spoken, better German than most politicians. Humor is hard to translate, but I would call him a mixture of David Chappelle, Louis C.K. and Sarah Silverman. He often gets asked about immigration and about the muslim community, he always says: "Why do people ask me this and why the heck do they make the connotation: immigrant=Turk=muslim?" He says he was "dropped somewhere between Ankara and Düsseldorf", so no immigration story here and as an outspoken atheist he finds it rather offensive to be taken as a representative for a religion with which he has less to do than members of our Christian parties.

However in the moments when he joins the media game, fakes to speak for muslims and immigrants, people regard him somehow as an authority for all immigrant questions. He usually starts with saying some trivial things, followed by more and more insane arguments and demands, funny to see how long it sometimes takes till the people notice it - if at all... Nothing seems insane enough if you are a self-proclaimed spokesperson.
The media wants faces to connect: want to speak about Alaska? Ask Mrs Palin, same way Sharpton speaks for every dark-skinned American, or Cheney for every hunter. Much less work than actually speak to a cross-section of the people for whom they claim to speak...

--------



Damn, this just sounds like swallowing textbook-style propaganda and repeating it without even trying to think on your own.
And you wonder that people attack your writing style and bash you? I have refrained to do so yet, I wonder why...
The reason I am not replying on the same level is that there are people from the more conservative side, even on here, whose opinions I can respect, sometimes even agree on (in my seldom cases of mind-gigantism), because they can articulate their views, put them into words and may even put some things into a different perspective.


So fighting for one's own believes, against oppression, standing up for the rights of others, helping to improve their lives is unamerican now?
And this: "[he] rallied a bunch of farmers and despite what the popular narrative is, he was not above using violence"

It sounds that you don't agree with ships that are named after George Washington...
Oh he was not oppressed and was not standing up for anyone, he was just a corrupt guy who found his way by forming a union, he duped a group of uneducated people, like how most unions gained power.Not being insulting, just stating the obvious, prob a lot easier to fool a farmer than say a banker etc The Democrats have pulled it off or did, a lot of "working" people still think the Democrats are on their side LOL. I would venture to guess it is much easier to dupe a group or farmers than a lot of other groups.

Comparing George Washington to Cesar Chavez is ridiculous.George Washington did something worthwhile that was not about self advancement, he was a patriot, Chavez was a union thug, nothing more.
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