No foreign vessels!!

[merc4ulfate]

Why is it that in U-boat side and Operation Monsun there are merchant vessels from a great many countries including Spain, France, Switzerland and Norway but on the Allied side of the game you get one ... Japanese???

I have used many mods including RSRD, TMO and Traveller but I have never seen any merchant vessel in the Pacific save the Japanese. If you play the U-boat side it is much more realistic with vessels being from a great many countries.

Did the stock game simply not produce merchants from other countries so the mods that follow were not able to create them as well?

[SilentPrey]

With TMO and RSRDC I have run across American merchants. I can't recall ever seeing any belonging to anyone else but I really don't expect to see any ships but Japan's where I hang out. The only thing that saved the Americans was a particularly bright moon. That patrol was down near Guadalcanal if I remember correctly.

Have you patrolled the same places in a fleet boat that you do in a U-boat?

[Admiral Halsey]

I've seen American merchants in the Java Sea plenty of times before Japan takes over the area while using TMO+RSRDC.

[Sniper297]

I'm still chugging along with semi vanilla (I made my own mods) 1.4, haven't gotten around to 1.5 yet so no gots Das Boot. I have seen and avoided attacking Dutch, Australian, New Zealand, and US ships in Asiatic careers. However, never saw Spain, France, Switzerland and Norway flags in the Pacific. Spain and Switzerland were pro-Nazi neutrals, France and Norway were both occupied, and does Switzerland even have a Navy or merchant marine? Last I checked it was landlocked with no sea ports.

Ship models are all the same except for the Liberty cargo, pretty much Japanese "small old engine aft" or "large old split freighter" or whatever with a different flag. Playing with manual targeting OR no map contacts there's a quick way to check IFF, but playing with manual targeting AND no map contacts you gotta double check the flag before firing. With improved environments heavier fog that gets downright hairy, the flag is a gray blur until I'm too close for the fish to arm.

[bandit484]

I think what he is asking is where are the other nationality based ships other than Japanesse or American , certanly there were Brittish ships in the area as well as Australian. Although i have to admit i've seen a lot of Dutch flagged ships in the Pacific.

[Sniper297]

Dutch is no surprise, the Dutch had colonies all over the Pacific, and continued to operate after Holland was occupied by the Nazis. Java, Borneo, New Zealand, and Australia (original name "New Holland") were all Dutch colonies at some point in history.

[merc4ulfate]

In all my years of playing SH4 I have never seen any national flag other than American or Japanese playing the allied side in the Pacific. I have used many mods including TMO, RSRD and Traveller.

The Pacific theatre had other merchants ships than simply the United States and the Empire of Japan so I think it is odd that there were never modeled by the game creators nor modders.

[Sniper297]

Don't recall if I ever saw any with the Pearl Harbor career start, but with an Asiatic career they're all over the place at the start of the war. Especially in places they don't belong, sneak into Manila harbor after March 42 and meet a Dutch or New Zealand merchie coming out. Even after the fall of Java when everyone has retreated to Australia you still gotta check flags on all unescorted merchies anywhere near Borneo or the Philippines, I've even seen Indian and Australian merchants chugging blissfully through Luzon Straits in 43. Dunno if them idiots are lost or just hadn't heard the war started.

[HertogJan]

Only once I saw a German T3 tanker running TMO and RSRDC, it was on my very first patrol in the area but it was a long wait. She was NNW of Okinawa heading SW if I recall correct.

I know FORTS has a few Axis vessels sailing the Japanese main coast, some of them even shoot back


Edit:

What Sniper says.. there is a lot of Aussi and Dutch shipping beginning 1942 before the Java invasion... I've seen them sail after Feb 28 in that region... makes me wonder what those sailors are thinking tho.
Same goes for US vessels, still going to Manila after it has been taken

[aanker]

I thought I remembered crossing paths with an Australian small freighter with his lower deck always awash in heavier seas quite a few times, also a French small freighter while enroute to Midway from Empire waters in the Stock campaign... not 100% sure. I've been using a different campaign.

The French freighter..... even if it was Vichy French, it was so small and the crew probably weren't political - I didn't want to sink it... lol. It could have been after Aug 44, then of course it would have been French. What were the French doing there?

Probably bait from the AI, if I sunk it then Allied aircraft would attack me for 48 hours or whatever time period that penalty is active.

Happy Hunting!

the campaign files tells the game which ships to generate and what nationality they are supposed to be.

that's what needs to be completely rewritten but that would take months for someone to do it right, that's why no one did it yet.

so far whats been done has only concentrated on getting historical battles to work right and be in the right places at the right times with the right kind of ships as well a try to make more realistic convoys and shipping routes but im sure having many nationalities of ships you run into was not a priority problem to be fixed at that time.

its not just telling the game to be putting the ships in but they need a starting and ending point as well as course and speed for each ship and then it must make sense for where it is and where its going not to mention the dates because some will change sides so convoy make ups can be a nightmare if a ship in the convoy becomes the enemy between point "a" and point "b" and the ships start attacking each other.

[Admiral Halsey]

Originally Posted by Webster

the campaign files tells the game which ships to generate and what nationality they are supposed to be.

that's what needs to be completely rewritten but that would take months for someone to do it right, that's why no one did it yet.

so far whats been done has only concentrated on getting historical battles to work right and be in the right places at the right times with the right kind of ships as well a try to make more realistic convoys and shipping routes but im sure having many nationalities of ships you run into was not a priority problem to be fixed at that time.

its not just telling the game to be putting the ships in but they need a starting and ending point as well as course and speed for each ship and then it must make sense for where it is and where its going not to mention the dates because some will change sides so convoy make ups can be a nightmare if a ship in the convoy becomes the enemy between point "a" and point "b" and the ships start attacking each other.

Honestly if you wanted to fix the problem just add the Allied convoy routes to Australia.

Originally Posted by Admiral Halsey

Honestly if you wanted to fix the problem just add the Allied convoy routes to Australia.

yes that would add convoys to those routes but AFAIK the makeup of the ships in those convoys would still be the same as everywhere else in the game unless you wrote new files for them.

now as long as you have the free time and the desire and will to commit to doing it, there is nothing really hard about doing all this and then testing to make sure nothing "strange" is mixed in

[aanker]

Originally Posted by Admiral Halsey

Honestly if you wanted to fix the problem just add the Allied convoy routes to Australia.

Yep - that's about what I did plus a few more historical routes for the Axis, although it is nothing I'd want to release publicly. I'm also using the Guerrilla Spyron campaign on top, it has some scripted shipping and Task Forces too as a part of the missions. So, I'm not running RSRD.

Quite a few people like RSRD. All shipping in it is carefully scripted, it must have been a huge project.

The Guerrilla Spyron campaign was another huge project. It is well researched and all its missions are missions that were actually conducted by US submarines during WW II in the Pacific. I like it.

Happy Hunting!

[merc4ulfate]

"convoy make ups can be a nightmare if a ship in the convoy becomes the enemy between point "a" and point "b" and the ships start attacking each other."

I bet that would be fun to watch