The Perfect Nuke Sub Sim? - Page 2

Frame57 · 09-15-08, 11:55 AM

Hippo, you make some good points. When Sonalysts made the earlier games, this was the dilemma: to make a sim/game that most everyone could play and enjoy. To have a full blown "sim" is boring for people. In fact i have a friend who has a 'Train simulator' and i find it boring, but he loves it because trains are his passion.

As great as these games are they ust do not offer the ability to really engage submarine combat tactics. How do you, when sonar cannot tell you if a torpedo is inbound or not? A tactic that would be fun especially dealing with very quiet subs, like a Kilo for example. Lets say Sonar picks up a faint contact. You as CO with OP orders know that no friendlies should be in the area. I would set the torp for what is called a "swimout" which means you flood the tube and do not fire the torpedo with high pressure air driving a ram which pushes the torpedo out and is noisy. So the fish swims out set at a lower speed. You now change course and listen to see if this suspect contact makes a run for it if the torpedo has aquired anything. the more I analyze this game the less i see it as a simulator.

goldorak · 09-15-08, 12:08 PM

Frame57, a good skipper doesn't fall for this stupid tactic.
Not unless he's very near to you and in that case he's not a good skipper at all in the first place.
Frame57 and AirHippo I don't know if you critisize DW because of your single player experience but believe me when I say that multiplayer is a totally new way of playing.
Forget singleplayer, DW is at its finest in multiplayer-multistation, hopefully with coordinated surface-air-sub units.
There are some mods out there that give you the ability to choose a lot of playable subs/surface units and air units. There is a SCU for DW, you just have to search very very hard for it.

Frame57 · 09-15-08, 01:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goldorak

Frame57, a good skipper doesn't fall for this stupid tactic.
Not unless he's very near to you and in that case he's not a good skipper at all in the first place.
Frame57 and AirHippo I don't know if you critisize DW because of your single player experience but believe me when I say that multiplayer is a totally new way of playing.
Forget singleplayer, DW is at its finest in multiplayer-multistation, hopefully with coordinated surface-air-sub units.
There are some mods out there that give you the ability to choose a lot of playable subs/surface units and air units. There is a SCU for DW, you just have to search very very hard for it.

I do not think it has been used but it is a combat tactic taught in Submarine School. "Stupid", not really, I think the use of UUV's replace the concept of this idea.

goldorak · 09-15-08, 01:37 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frame57

]I do not think it has been used but it is a combat tactic taught in Submarine School. "Stupid", not really, I think the use of UUV's replace the concept of this idea.

I meant a stupid tactic insofar as the other skipper doesn't fall for it.
And good skippers have a very very good situational awareness. So they are never surprised, or at least the surprise factor is mitigated.
In the game, only a newbie would accelerate to maximum speed the moment he hears a torpedo in the water message. The first you do is determine if the fish is actually coming your way. If it is and you're quite distant (always have a good tma on your possibile enemies) you just accelerate the minimium amount necessary to get out of the aquisition cone.

Frame57 · 09-15-08, 02:39 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by goldorak

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frame57

]I do not think it has been used but it is a combat tactic taught in Submarine School. "Stupid", not really, I think the use of UUV's replace the concept of this idea.

I meant a stupid tactic insofar as the other skipper doesn't fall for it.
And good skippers have a very very good situational awareness. So they are never surprised, or at least the surprise factor is mitigated.
In the game, only a newbie would accelerate to maximum speed the moment he hears a torpedo in the water message. The first you do is determine if the fish is actually coming your way. If it is and you're quite distant (always have a good tma on your possibile enemies) you just accelerate the minimium amount necessary to get out of the aquisition cone.

Agreed! Out running a torpedo is like outrunning the cops with a chopper in the air

AirHippo · 09-17-08, 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Frame57

Agreed! Out running a torpedo is like outrunning the cops with a chopper in the air

Only Kyle Reese can outrun a torpedo? Nifty. Have to get him in a hamster wheel some time

</BadTerminatorJoke>

Goldorak, I'm presently avoiding multiplayer quite avidly. This is mostly because I don't fancy the work of having to simultaneously be a helmsman, engineer, sonar operator, ESM operator, radioman, TMA operator (ugh) and so forth, less still when I'm also having to do all this under the pressure of being imminently turned from a submarine into a shipwreck. Furthermore, having to enter the field, populated by now solely by people who've been doing this for many many months and know every trick in the book (or at least the first half), doesn't appeal very much.

Combine the two and I've an excellent reason for sticking with SP, where the frustrations (like the computer being a git) are balanced by the fact I can let the auto-crew do the work until I choose otherwise. All the satisfaction, without the spending six months being relentlessly killed to death by everyone else. By the way, the thought of an SCU for DW interests me; care to enlighten me as to where I can find it, or is this knowledge preserved for the Chosen Few?

09-15-08, 11:55 AM	#16
Frame57 Sea Lord Join Date: May 2008 Location: 1300 feet on the crapper Posts: 1,860 Downloads: 2 Uploads: 0	Hippo, you make some good points. When Sonalysts made the earlier games, this was the dilemma: to make a sim/game that most everyone could play and enjoy. To have a full blown "sim" is boring for people. In fact i have a friend who has a 'Train simulator' and i find it boring, but he loves it because trains are his passion. As great as these games are they ust do not offer the ability to really engage submarine combat tactics. How do you, when sonar cannot tell you if a torpedo is inbound or not? A tactic that would be fun especially dealing with very quiet subs, like a Kilo for example. Lets say Sonar picks up a faint contact. You as CO with OP orders know that no friendlies should be in the area. I would set the torp for what is called a "swimout" which means you flood the tube and do not fire the torpedo with high pressure air driving a ram which pushes the torpedo out and is noisy. So the fish swims out set at a lower speed. You now change course and listen to see if this suspect contact makes a run for it if the torpedo has aquired anything. the more I analyze this game the less i see it as a simulator.

09-15-08, 12:08 PM	#17
goldorak Admiral Join Date: Apr 2005 Posts: 2,320 Downloads: 0 Uploads: 0	Frame57, a good skipper doesn't fall for this stupid tactic. Not unless he's very near to you and in that case he's not a good skipper at all in the first place. Frame57 and AirHippo I don't know if you critisize DW because of your single player experience but believe me when I say that multiplayer is a totally new way of playing. Forget singleplayer, DW is at its finest in multiplayer-multistation, hopefully with coordinated surface-air-sub units. There are some mods out there that give you the ability to choose a lot of playable subs/surface units and air units. There is a SCU for DW, you just have to search very very hard for it.