[REL] Trigger Maru Overhauled

[Rockin Robbins]

Ducimus believed that gameplay is king. Eye candy takes a seat in the trunk. Whenever he tested enviironmental modifications he affected gameplay in a bad way. He ended up with a crippled version of one of the environmental mods (Pacific Environments I think) that left gameplay unaffected.

If you change environment you will change gameplay in a bad way. He's a smart guy and he put way more hours into figuring this out than you or I ever have. Mostly eye candy sucks up computer resouirces that would be better used to optimize the gameplay.

The premier eye candy mod for SH4 is Fall of the Rising Sun. It's stunningly beautiful and the gameplay is full of ideosyncracies. But I heartily recommend it because is is so beautiful. And it's a lesson of what price you pay for eyecandy and environmental prettiness.

[silverdragon41]

Does this mod do anything to how the ships are taken out? As in will it allow for sinking of the vessels without having to resort to taking out all of their hp?

[TorpX]

I think you have a misunderstanding of SH4. Even the stock game has defined zones within each ship, and these zones have various parameters related to flooding, fire, explosion, critical hits, etc., etc.

So, it is not a pure, simple hit point model.

[silverdragon41]

Originally Posted by TorpX

I think you have a misunderstanding of SH4. Even the stock game has defined zones within each ship, and these zones have various parameters related to flooding, fire, explosion, critical hits, etc., etc.

So, it is not a pure, simple hit point model.

I see. It was more of the fact most ships explode everytime. Its annoying and rather a ship to just sink with less explosions. I can understand explosions as the cold sea water hits the hot boilers.

[Galaga Galaxian]

As a long time GWX fan, I recently made the transition to SH4 when the sub-bug bit again, and yeah, I was a bit curious about the ship sinking in TMO as wel.

From my (limited) understanding, TMO doesn't change ship sinking mechanics much from stock, it concentrates on other areas. This was a bit disappointing, but after comparing TMO and RFB, I decided I still preferred what TMO had to offer in other categories so I gave it a go (alongside RSRDC).

After one war patrol sinking a few ships I was, indeed, somewhat disapointed with how quickly the ships sunk. So I dug around and found this thread. http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=193610 Which has a supplemental longer sinking mod for TMO, seemingly largely achieved by reducing how much HP damage the torpedoes cause.

Well, after installing it I'm in the middle of a new war patrol (same career) and I've sunk three 5000 ton ships, including a Kuma CL, and they've all sunk in about the same time. Maybe I'm using overkill though, as I've hit each ship with two torpedoes (more than I know it probably needs, but I'm leery of early-war Mk14s causing me grief, and indeed, that Kuma would've eaten 3 torps, but one detonated early). To be honest, I haven't noticed too much of a change, though I guess the first freighter took a bit extra time to sink, and (I think) was listing before going down, not much though (a minute at most). The Kuma and the second Maru sink almost immediately, but in the second Maru's case, that might be because it suffered multiple violent explosions, must've been carrying something volatile.

Honestly, despite the small sample size, I'm kinda wondering if I'm just using overkill (2 torps on a 5000ton target) or if its just the way TMO is, even after that mod. If its the latter, then I guess I'll just keep at it, since TMO is quite nice otherwise. I'll also admit I never played stock SH4, so maybe ships sink even faster in stock. I really do miss the ship sinking style of GWX3 though.

Either way, Silverdragon, you could try out that mod I linked and see if it improves things for you. It is too bad the guy who made it never uploaded that new/tweaked version he mentioned he would. Life probably just got in the way.

[edit] You know, I think the thing that bugs me the most with the way they sink is not the speed at which they sink, but that they always seem to do so nose or stern first, they never just list, roll over, and go down on their side before starting to tip one way or another.

[fitzcarraldo]

Try LST for TMO with Webster Torpedo Training mission. The ships took a long time to sink and also capsized with LST. I use also a modified torpedo mod.

Regards.

Fitzcarraldo

[Galaga Galaxian]

May I ask what torpedo mod would that might be?

Also, is the Longer Sink Time mod something that would require a new career? I figured applying it between patrols would be enough.

Maybe I installed the LST mod wrong? This is my JSGME

[Galaga Galaxian]

Well, don't I feel stupid. No wonder LST doesn't seem to be working, there was another LST folder insider the LST folder, which has the proper Data folder in it.



I guess I'll enable it next patrol.

[Aktungbby]

Galaga Galaxian! after a six year silent run!

[TorpX]

Originally Posted by silverdragon41

I see. It was more of the fact most ships explode everytime. Its annoying and rather a ship to just sink with less explosions.

I can't really say much about TMO, as I play RFB + RSRDC.

In RFB merchants will sink slowly. Bigger warships are same as stock, because those were never changed.

I would point out that there are random factors involved; just because a certain ship blows up immediately one time, does not mean it will happen the next time.

[silverdragon41]

Originally Posted by TorpX

I can't really say much about TMO, as I play RFB + RSRDC.

In RFB merchants will sink slowly. Bigger warships are same as stock, because those were never changed.

I would point out that there are random factors involved; just because a certain ship blows up immediately one time, does not mean it will happen the next time.

I have tried rfb before. It was fun and having the destroyers hut you down like rabid dogs was fun. I did like the thing of the ships actually sink then explode.

[silverdragon41]

Originally Posted by Galaga Galaxian

As a long time GWX fan, I recently made the transition to SH4 when the sub-bug bit again, and yeah, I was a bit curious about the ship sinking in TMO as wel.

From my (limited) understanding, TMO doesn't change ship sinking mechanics much from stock, it concentrates on other areas. This was a bit disappointing, but after comparing TMO and RFB, I decided I still preferred what TMO had to offer in other categories so I gave it a go (alongside RSRDC).

After one war patrol sinking a few ships I was, indeed, somewhat disapointed with how quickly the ships sunk. So I dug around and found this thread. http://www.subsim.com/radioroom/showthread.php?t=193610 Which has a supplemental longer sinking mod for TMO, seemingly largely achieved by reducing how much HP damage the torpedoes cause.

Well, after installing it I'm in the middle of a new war patrol (same career) and I've sunk three 5000 ton ships, including a Kuma CL, and they've all sunk in about the same time. Maybe I'm using overkill though, as I've hit each ship with two torpedoes (more than I know it probably needs, but I'm leery of early-war Mk14s causing me grief, and indeed, that Kuma would've eaten 3 torps, but one detonated early). To be honest, I haven't noticed too much of a change, though I guess the first freighter took a bit extra time to sink, and (I think) was listing before going down, not much though (a minute at most). The Kuma and the second Maru sink almost immediately, but in the second Maru's case, that might be because it suffered multiple violent explosions, must've been carrying something volatile.

Honestly, despite the small sample size, I'm kinda wondering if I'm just using overkill (2 torps on a 5000ton target) or if its just the way TMO is, even after that mod. If its the latter, then I guess I'll just keep at it, since TMO is quite nice otherwise. I'll also admit I never played stock SH4, so maybe ships sink even faster in stock. I really do miss the ship sinking style of GWX3 though.

Either way, Silverdragon, you could try out that mod I linked and see if it improves things for you. It is too bad the guy who made it never uploaded that new/tweaked version he mentioned he would. Life probably just got in the way.

[edit] You know, I think the thing that bugs me the most with the way they sink is not the speed at which they sink, but that they always seem to do so nose or stern first, they never just list, roll over, and go down on their side before starting to tip one way or another.

Gave that mod a quick try and do like how the tanker that I shot two torpedoes at sank without the normal fireworks going off. There was a few explosions but i put that to the cold sea water hitting the hot boilers. As for the sinking nose first or stern I do not seem to have that problem either as a fuso bb I shot at capsized before going down thou a bit bow first but it capsized all the way over first.

[granite00]

Originally Posted by Galaga Galaxian

Honestly, despite the small sample size, I'm kinda wondering if I'm just using overkill (2 torps on a 5000ton target) or if its just the way TMO is, even after that mod.

With early war duds, do you really want to take the risk that one torpedo will get the job done?

[RoflCopter4]

Just want to ask to be sure: this mod is not compatible with the Subsim Narwhal mod, correct? It would be awesome if it were, but I don't want to break anything by trying to use it in this mod if it is not actually compatible.

[aanker]

Ducimus made adjustments to the Donation NARWHAL so it would be compatible with TMO 2.1.... and 2.5.

At the time he didn't post it publicly because the NARWHAL was a donation only mod and he didn't want to have a 'back door' way to get the donation NARWHAL.

It should be in the downloads section

His Readme:
Hello
TMO 2.5 Support for donation Narwhal
Install with JSGME.
TriggerMaru_Overhaul_2-5
New Narwhal K v 1.8.5
New Narwhal TMO2.5_Support

http://www.subsim.com/radioroom//sho...d.php?t=195185
See post #11

Happy Hunting!