Why in SH4 etc. (walk or view other areas of the Subs)

[Downunderjock]

It's a pity SH4. (And the German add on)
Didn't do like SH5 that you could walk or even just view other areas of the Subs. (like some others games with Ships)

Was UBI Soft etc restricted via the US Govt even now 70 or more years, now.
That you couldn't say see things like the Engine or Torepedo rooms or the sleeping quarters or the Galley. (LOL let alone the Head, Ha!)
Cos it would've been nice to see. True?
Anyway, I hope you all, won't mind this thought.

See Ya.

Take care all. Jock.

[ETR3(SS)]

The ability to walk around the boat in SH5 was pretty much demanded by the fanboys. You also didn't have this feature in SH3, 2, or 1.

Post war, a decent amount of the fleet boats were turned into museums throughout the country so there's nothing classified about the inside in that regard. There was a lot of debate around the development of SH5 about what walking around the boat added to the game. One side wanted to do absolutely everything themselves, and so what we see is that in game. The other side of the argument (the more logical and realistic one) was "I'm the Captain, I don't do everything, I give the orders and others do it." Which is pretty much what we had in previous installments.

[propbeanie]

Partial interiors have been modded, as well as the CAM file, that allow some walk-arounds. A fellow some years ago was attempting a full fleetboat interior, but ran out of time and tried to hand it off to someone. No one took him up on the offer. Even still, it would just be decoration and a resource hog in SH4.

I'm in the same boat as ETR3(SS), and I'm the captain (well, different boat, same fleet though). I issue orders to my crew as I see fit for the safe yet efficient operation of my boat - following orders myself... tic - besides, my feet hurt - not forgetting that I get stuck on the ladders in SH5 - and I don't like walking anyway... It would be cool to see the tubes being reloaded though...

[Nicolas]

I really like walking the sub in 5, adds to the immersion, i should be able though to order things yelling etc anyway.

[Downunderjock]

Originally Posted by ETR3(SS)

The ability to walk around the boat in SH5 was pretty much demanded by the fanboys. You also didn't have this feature in SH3, 2, or 1.

Post war, a decent amount of the fleet boats were turned into museums throughout the country so there's nothing classified about the inside in that regard. There was a lot of debate around the development of SH5 about what walking around the boat added to the game. One side wanted to do absolutely everything themselves, and so what we see is that in game. The other side of the argument (the more logical and realistic one) was "I'm the Captain, I don't do everything, I give the orders and others do it." Which is pretty much what we had in previous installments.

Hi.

Do you all realize. (I know you do)

That you play both Capt and crew?

I don't know about the original SH (1?) or 2. But in 3 - 4 - and 5.

You can be the Capt or crew with the **Binnes or the UZO.
Also with the AA gun.** (Yer, I know it wouldn't be the Captain, but maybe in certain circumstances?)
**And the Deck Gun esp in SH5.
Yet, in both you maybe become a crewmen?
Maybe, UBI thought about it as you play as both Capt and crew.
Which I think is a good thing.
So as I saw on steam in a comment for UBoot, someone wrote, similar.

Anyway, pardon for this extra thought, whoops.

Take care all.

[KaleunMarco]

Originally Posted by Downunderjock

Hi.

Do you all realize. (I know you do)

That you play both Capt and crew?

I don't know about the original SH (1?) or 2. But in 3 - 4 - and 5.

You can be the Capt or crew with the **Binnes or the UZO.
Also with the AA gun.** (Yer, I know it wouldn't be the Captain, but maybe in certain circumstances?)
**And the Deck Gun esp in SH5.
Yet, in both you maybe become a crewmen?
Maybe, UBI thought about it as you play as both Capt and crew.
Which I think is a good thing.
So as I saw on steam in a comment for UBoot, someone wrote, similar.

Anyway, pardon for this extra thought, whoops.

Take care all.

look, matey, if you want to see the interior and exterior of a WWII submarine, use your next holiday and come to the US and visit one in person.
i have been to several on the attached list. always a joy....
https://www.submarinemuseums.org/

[ETR3(SS)]

A month late in my response because I kinda forgot about this thread.

So SH5 (stock) has only 1 type of submarine the player can use with it's fully detailed interior. That's the Type VII, of which there is a surviving example in Germany that the devs could study in person (not sure if they did) during development. Consider the immense amount of detail that would have to be drawn in 3d to provide this level of immersion. Now there is a surviving Type II in Finland, one Type IX in Great Britain, one Type IX in the US, and a Type XXI in Germany. But those aren't in game due to the extra amount of time involved in modeling them.

Now let's go to SH4. Starting with the oldest and going forward: S Boats, P or Porpoise Class, Salmon/Sargo Class, Tambor/Gar Class, Gato Class, and Balao Class. Of those classes the only surviving examples are Gato and Balao class boats. Of those two, very few are still in their original wartime configuation. Add on the logistics difficulty for a European game developer to travel to the US for an extended amount of time, and frankly I'm glad they did as well as they did with the interiors we have.

SH3 had the same design layout as 4, or rather 4 follows the layout of 3. Of note as well, 3, 4, and 5 all run off of the same game engine. In fact when 4 came out, many of the files from 3 were still included but unused! I have a theory that I'd like to test someday about just how far down I can strip 4 and it still works as released.

SH2 gave us our first 3d experience in the series. The interior remained 2d interfaces but the exterior was 3d modeled.

SH1 was written for MS-DOS/WIN95. It was all 2d. Personally I loved the awards system from this and wished it could've been brought back with 4. You were awarded the real medals and could receive multiple awards of the same decoration. This was in stark contrast to 4 with it's fictional (US) awards and the generic baffling US aircraft used in game (Lancaster Bomber for the USN and USAAF).

As for playing Captain and crew, for a game, a balance must be struck. That balance was struck in 3 and 4 with it being optional to partake in other stations. Another thing to note, as I said earlier 3, 4, and 5 are off the same engine. That means 4 inherited the bugs left over from 3, 5 in turn was built off of 4. During development, most of us from Team "I'm the Captain" wanted those bugs resolved. We lost as far as I know. Trying to keep it informative here, but I know my bias is showing through. There's been a lot emotion surrounding the series since Ubi took over development. I bought 4 on release and shelved it after a short time of playing and didn't play again until much later. I also protested the paid patch that was the Uboat Missions before finally giving into that as well.

[Rockin Robbins]

It all comes down to the tradeoff between gameplay and bling. You have a finite amount of resources (much less than we have today back in 2007). Ubi stretched the capabilities of contemporary computers with what they did. What you want, a completely detailed out interior in 3D, which you could walk through, to no improvement in gameplay, would have killed SH4, rendering it nothing but a television show.

SH5 paid terrible penalties for their walkthrough capabilities, leaving you with only one submarine and half a war.

Even today, making mods, we still have to contend with the old gameplay vs bling conundrum of old, although we can be unbelievably lavish without harm. In FOTRSU, we've more than doubled the number of ships in the game, replaced the entire sound system, retextured just about everything, for instance, we're in the middle of retexturing propellers from a 128x128 texture to a 1024x1024 texture. Ducimus would shoot us. We've just increased the resources to render each propeller, completely irrelevant in gameplay, by 64 times!

Because our modern computers have unimaginable resources and memory to those 10 years ago we can get away with such frivolities, and they work well. But we still couldn't have a 3D walkthrough submarine interior for five different kinds of fleet boats and be able to keep the game enhancements we've added to the game. Our mod is 4.7 GB! I remember when we were trying to keep it under 4. When a mod is bigger than the game it modifies, then you are stretching the envelope of playability. A perfect mod that only 10% of the community can play is a failure in my mind. Ducimus would shoot us as it is.

[KaleunMarco]

Originally Posted by ETR3(SS)

The ability to walk around the boat in SH5 was pretty much demanded by the fanboys. You also didn't have this feature in SH3, 2, or 1.

Post war, a decent amount of the fleet boats were turned into museums throughout the country so there's nothing classified about the inside in that regard. There was a lot of debate around the development of SH5 about what walking around the boat added to the game. One side wanted to do absolutely everything themselves, and so what we see is that in game. The other side of the argument (the more logical and realistic one) was "I'm the Captain, I don't do everything, I give the orders and others do it." Which is pretty much what we had in previous installments.

amen, brother.