SUBSIM Radio Room Forums


SUBSIM: The Web's #1 BBS for all submarine and naval simulations since 1997

Go Back   SUBSIM Radio Room Forums > Sonalysts Combat Sims > DW Mod Workshop > DW Mission Designers' Forum
Forget password? Reset here

Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 11-30-2005, 06:06 PM   #31
Mau
Sonar Guy
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 382
Downloads: 3
Uploads: 0
Default

Finally for the range of the AS-14:

5 to 6NM in all the references i have seen

So the 8KM makes sense

That is probably why then we have hard time to have the SU-24 to engage.

But yes, it should have as well AS-9, AS-11, AS-13 and AS-18
Again depending which country that this SU-24 is coming from
Mau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 11-30-2005, 06:53 PM   #32
SeaQueen
Naval Royalty
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 1,185
Downloads: 0
Uploads: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mau
Finally for the range of the AS-14:

5 to 6NM in all the references i have seen

So the 8KM makes sense

That is probably why then we have hard time to have the SU-24 to engage.

But yes, it should have as well AS-9, AS-11, AS-13 and AS-18
Again depending which country that this SU-24 is coming from
Yeah... I checked in Jane's and it was actually a little more conservative, 6-8km. Bummer.

I would prefer to not constrain aircraft loadouts to countries too strongly, because it opens up the possibilities for "what if?" scenarios. Also, transfers of arms and technologies occur all the time, so the information that the decision to allow one country a weapon on its SU-24s and not anothers can quickly become obsolete.
SeaQueen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-08-2006, 09:28 AM   #33
Kazuaki Shimazaki II
Ace of the Deep
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,135
Downloads: 5
Uploads: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaQueen
The thing is, I'm wondering where the heck they got 8-10km anyhow, because really the range of a missile can vary considerably based on launch speed, altitude, etc.
Some, but apparently not so much for a land-attack weapon depending on its profile.

Quote:
AH HA! The SU-24 can carry the AS-11 super-sonic cruise missile which according to FAS has a range of 120km. Too bad it's not modelled. *growl*
Get your butt in the database and fix it. I recommend DWEdit. I've tried it and its pretty easy to use. Just remember to click Apply in the Dialog boxes and then make sure you save - then kiss all your Save files goodbye for you've just rendered them obsolete, and expect problems in multiplayer...

The AS-11 is not a ASM anyway. It is AFAIK a ARM. The ship needs to be forced to turn on its radar, and constantly. It does have a INS, but a ship moves, so if the radar goes off...

On the AS-14, there is also an alternate minority viewpoint in my experience that says that the laser variant of the weapon is only 8-10km, but the EO ones (TV/IR) may have 20-30km, so there may be some base to the 18nm version too. I presume if this is true that the implementation of laser-guidance on the Kh-29/AS-14 is relatively crude (example: bang-bang), thus wasting a lot of energy. This is the modeling used in Su-27 Flanker 2. Try this if you like. Since your main target will be ships or installations, it should be easy on the EO guidance system.

In any case, maritime antishipping work is not exactly the Su-24's primary duty, nor is it the AS-14's. The AS-14 is the Russian version of the Maverick. It is meant for a Su-24 to carry low level to blow up some bridge at close range, not a ship. So for SeaQueen, it is effective - it just wasn't engineered for long-range antiship work and it shows.

Western-sized anti-shipping missiles are somewhat rare in the Russian arsenal anyway. Only in the last years of the Cold War, if that, did they start thinking about that with the Kh-35/SS-N-25.

Before that, a "small" antiship missile might be the P-120/SS-N-9 Siren, which weighs an amazing 3000kg, and those are supposed to be sub missiles anyway. The rest tend to have 1-ton warhead and weigh far too much to carry on anything less than a full Bomber.

So What the Su-24 uses are really a bunch of short and medium range land-attack missiles that are, in DW, pressed into service as antiship weapons.
Kazuaki Shimazaki II is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006, 09:18 PM   #34
SeaQueen
Naval Royalty
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: Washington, DC
Posts: 1,185
Downloads: 0
Uploads: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazuaki Shimazaki II
In any case, maritime antishipping work is not exactly the Su-24's primary duty, nor is it the AS-14's.
Actually, it depends on which country we're talking about. In the scenario I'm putting together, SU-24s ARE that country's front line, universal attack aircraft. Lots of nations buy Russian aircraft and plan to use them in ways radically different from how they were intended, and they're often effective.
SeaQueen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-09-2006, 09:21 PM   #35
Kazuaki Shimazaki II
Ace of the Deep
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,135
Downloads: 5
Uploads: 0
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by SeaQueen
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kazuaki Shimazaki II
In any case, maritime antishipping work is not exactly the Su-24's primary duty, nor is it the AS-14's.
Actually, it depends on which country we're talking about. In the scenario I'm putting together, SU-24s ARE that country's front line, universal attack aircraft.
I'd suggest that the AS-13/18 TV-guided ASMs along with the AS-17 ARM/ASM are the closest that plane has. Maybe you can assume they carry the AS-20/SS-N-25 as well.

Get into the database and set something like that up, and then pack the database package into the Zip. Put a README that says for the game to function properly, you must use the Database provided. See if that works.
Kazuaki Shimazaki II is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 10:36 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2018, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright © 1995- 2018 Subsim