Attack on ships at port....what am I doing wrong?

[Crannogman]

Considering how open the 3D harbor models tend to be, there's not really a lot of "inside" the harbor anyhow. Protected anchorages like Tokyo and Pearl are the exceptions. IRL, breakwaters and torpedo nets made harbor attacks much more infeasible.

Incidentally, although most mods put the Penang harbor on the Malay mainland, it was located at George Town on Penang Island. Will have to make note of that

[J0313]

Originally Posted by Bleiente

In my view, it is actually not wise to break with such a large boat in a harbor.
No responsible CO would favor such an action ... because hanging off many lives as well as the boat.
Those who ignore this as a commander, is either stupid or extremely selfish.

Well like I said, Its a game. Your not a CO of anything. So telling somebody they are stupid For playing a GAME the way they want to is WRONG.

[Berserker]

A lot of times the target is stationary but in your scope look for funnel smoke...Then look to the left in the periscope station and check for speed of target...In some harbors you will have torpedo magnets,a nice fat kiturn maru that has been put their just to make you waste torpedoes..The modders have a wicked sense of humor!!

Originally Posted by J0313

Well like I said, Its a game. Your not a CO of anything. So telling somebody they are stupid For playing a GAME the way they want to is WRONG.

Na was not meant that way - so forget it.

[Jimbuna]

Originally Posted by J0313

Well like I said, Its a game. Your not a CO of anything. So telling somebody they are stupid For playing a GAME the way they want to is WRONG.

Originally Posted by Bleiente

Na was not meant that way - so forget it.

[Rockin Robbins]

Raiding harbors in the game is a very different operation than it would be in real life. In real life harbors would be much better protected with sub nets and shallow draft gunboats with depth charges which would be basically impossible to torpedo.

In addition, harbors were carefully guarded with air cover and submarines at the shallow depth of a harbor are very visible from the air even when submerged.

In real life the approaches to the harbors were mined, the channels altered from expected norms and grounding the sub was a high percentage proposition on the way in or out. If grounding happened you had 70 to 80 dead men.

However, stationing yourself outside the harbor was much safer, while all the boats in the harbor had to enter or leave, putting them at your mercy. It just didn't make sense to enter the harbor in real life.

In spite of that, Commander, later Admiral, Eugene Fluckey of the Barb, late in the war when submarine after submarine was returning to base with a full load of torpedoes, entered a Chinese harbor, sank some small vessels, shelled the town and hightailed out of there at more than full throttle, chased by a patrol boat they didn't get a decent shot at. At any point they could have grounded the vessel and 80 men would have become fish food, but he successfully avoided grounding, being shot by the patrol boat, headed off by sampans or attacked by planes. Fluckey received the Congressional Medal of Honor for that.

Should tell you how difficult and dangerous that little foray was. And that is why harbor raiding, as a general rule with only a couple of exceptions, didn't happen in the Pacific.

[Crannogman]

Even then, my reading of that Fluckey raid suggests it was more of an anchorage, and not ships tied up at piers etc. To a great extent the game is limited by flat seabeds that allow a sub to approach fully submerged almost to the shore everywhere. Sandbars, shoals, and other hazards are nonexistent. IRL, a lot of the "navigable" coastal waters are barely deep enough for a surfaced fleet boat - Midway is actually a prime example

[Rockin Robbins]

Fluckey had to navigate more than 20 miles of water too shallow to submerge, uncharted, mined, and attack 20 anchored warships from the surface. Shooting all his torpedoes but four stern ones for possible pursuers he hightailed out of there hitting the all-time speed record for a fleet boat, 23 knots, two DDs chasing him. Fluckey couldn't submerge for over an hour as he charged out of there dodging and colliding with sampans hoping that a mine didn't have his number.

Whatever you want to call it, this, for the first time, penetrated Japan's secret anchorage and killed the assumption that the ships were safe there. Fluckey got credit for one troop carrier sank. Visiting Nam Kwan Harbor in the 1990s he found an eyewitness who credited him with at least three sunk.

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Rockin Robbins

Fluckey had to navigate more than 20 miles of water too shallow to submerge, uncharted, mined, and attack 20 anchored warships from the surface. Shooting all his torpedoes but four stern ones for possible pursuers he hightailed out of there hitting the all-time speed record for a fleet boat, 23 knots, two DDs chasing him. Fluckey couldn't submerge for over an hour as he charged out of there dodging and colliding with sampans hoping that a mine didn't have his number.

Whatever you want to call it, this, for the first time, penetrated Japan's secret anchorage and killed the assumption that the ships were safe there. Fluckey got credit for one troop carrier sank. Visiting Nam Kwan Harbor in the 1990s he found an eyewitness who credited him with at least three sunk.

All true!

[Kapt Z]

Fluckey's adventures with BARB really deserve a great movie!

Not only the crazy harbor raid, but the guy sent a landing party ashore and blew up a train! He also tinkered with launching small rockets from BARBs deck!

Anything to keep your crew from getting bored....

[Rockin Robbins]

Operating late in the war when nobody was sinking anything, Fluckey and Barb sank the highest amount of tonnage of any American sub of the war. When he died, Fluckey was the highest decorated veteran of WWII. He an his crew earned it.

My strategies in Silent Hunter 4 are almost entirely derived from Fluckey's book Thunder Below. He was a maverick who could have been crippled, had he worked for any commanding officer but Admiral Lockwood. In Christie's fleet he would have been made a failure.

[U505995]

Killing ships in port is what you're doing wrong if you ask me. Where is the sport in that?

[AVGWarhawk]

Originally Posted by Sea Demon U-48

Killing ships in port is what you're doing wrong if you ask me. Where is the sport in that?

None really but it is fun to evade any patrol boats and sink a vessel.

[chowderhead62]

Wow this thread turned lively! Well as mentioned, I was on a mission to drop an agent, and was on my way OUT of the area past the harbor when I saw the targets of opportunity and thought "hey it's dark....why not?". And once given the good guidance from this group of 500 yards and set to shallow....low and behold I sank 3 merchants and a destroyer all for good measure. Had to lick a few wounds (my AA gun was destroyed), but all in all a good days work.

And yes....this is a game...it's fun to try things and see what you can or can't get away with. And it gives you an understanding of what those brave men had to do to get the job done. Isn't that really what it's all about?

[AVGWarhawk]

Yep! It is fun to try and gain access to a port. Much more fun when it is left a smoldering mess.