Do we really want to ruin this forum with constant DRM and SH5 trashing?

vonTorpitz · 04-05-10, 12:35 AM

Recently I've heard a tremendous amount of flak both on and off this forum directed against SH5.
Its true, the game was released practically half finished and bug ridden to the extreme. But seriously! There's got to be a bright side to this dismal situation. We actually have a brand new u-boat simulator, exclusively set in The Battle of the Atlantic. The graphics in this game are absolutely amazing both inside and outside the boat, we can now move about the boat (this adds huge freakin possibilities if you use your imagination) and from what I've heard Ubisoft has created the game to very open-ended and moddable. And remember, their previous releases in this genre were also basically unfinished when released but the efforts (superhuman, I might add) of modding community were able to turn them into winners. I personally think the opportunities abound in this game and positivity goes along way folks. So, meine kameraden, keep faith in SH5 and keep faith in the unbelievable skills of the modding community surrounding this game. Because in a years' time this will probably be the best subsim you've ever played.

Danke und Sieg!

vonTorpitz

VonHesse · 04-05-10, 12:58 AM

Umm, no.

I will continue to follow the forums and hope for the best, but untill UBI removes the invasive DRM and fixes the innumerable bugs that have been present since SH3 - inability to dive past 180m without running at flank speed, for instance - I will vote with my wallet.

I refuse to pay for a bug-ridden, half finished, and sloppily scripted mess.

Doing so would only reinforce to UBI that this is an acceptable business practice. I can only vote for myself, but vote I shall, and I refuse to be moved, coerced, or guilted into supporting SH5 based on what it "may become".

I'll buy it if, and when, it meets MY standards as a consumer - not yours.

Zedi · 04-05-10, 02:31 AM

I'm not bothered by drm, bugs but.. by how casual this game it is. I just can't play it anymore, it's mega boring. Go there, sink that, refill. That's the SH5 campaign mode. Nothing hard nor exciting and the only thing that kept me playing was the graphics.

When I heard about the drm and that you actually have to be online to play, I was thrilled. I said.. oke, if all who play this will be online then there must be a strong multiplayer option... yay. Again, a major disappointment, the MP part is a joke, maybe the worst part in SH5.

As most of the people here said, this game may be enjoyable in 6 months or so, after few patches and some hardcore moding. Now, is a fail boat. Boring and casual, filled with bugs, and no MP. It has the potential to become something cool, but that's because the great community and moders, not because the developers.

Sonoboy · 04-05-10, 02:36 AM

I will not be buying this game for quite some time.

I find it very disgusting that ubisoft releases an unfinished game and expects the modders to make it into something great. I have the utmost confidence that the modders will achieve that, but we're not paying the modders for this game, are we? Ubisoft is basically using free labor to finish their product. It's not fair to modders that they have to finish creating the game. It's not fair to the gamers that they pay $50 for a beta-test (and let's not forget those who don't have interest in using mods). That's how I feel about this whole issue.

Second reason is that I don't think my computer will run it very well. Third: I'm enjoying SH3.

vonTorpitz · 04-05-10, 03:46 AM

I totally agree and sympathize with all of your comments. It does seem as though Ubisoft relies on the modding community to finish their SH products. Its bad business. Since the release of SH3 the genre has needed massive modding overhauls in order to be half-assed playable.
I paid the retail price for SH5 and like most who did, I was immediately disappointed. I agree, if Ubisoft is going to release a subsim(?) that is 1/3 finished then they should be charging 1/3 the price. Unfortunately, this is not the case. I hope Ubisoft hasn't torpedoed the entire genre by disillusioning their very unique fanbase.
The fact remains though, I and many others have paid the full price and for me, at least, there is no sense crying over spilled milk. SH5 is, as far as I know, the only current u-boat sim available. If there were any other viable options in the submarine genre to choose from the story would be different. But as it stands, this is what we have to work with for now.
Id still like to think there are enough others out there who also own the game, who think it stands a fighting chance, and who want a change from the older SH releases. Lets move forward and in the spirit of the real u-boat crews, lets have a little faith and create victories out of the most adverse conditions. To hell with Ubisoft.

IanC · 04-05-10, 03:53 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VonHesse

Umm, no.

I will continue to follow the forums and hope for the best, but untill UBI removes the invasive DRM and fixes the innumerable bugs that have been present since SH3 - inability to dive past 180m without running at flank speed, for instance - I will vote with my wallet.

I refuse to pay for a bug-ridden, half finished, and sloppily scripted mess.

Doing so would only reinforce to UBI that this is an acceptable business practice. I can only vote for myself, but vote I shall, and I refuse to be moved, coerced, or guilted into supporting SH5 based on what it "may become".

I'll buy it if, and when, it meets MY standards as a consumer - not yours.

tommyk · 04-05-10, 04:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VonHesse

Umm, no.

I will continue to follow the forums and hope for the best, but untill UBI removes the invasive DRM and fixes the innumerable bugs that have been present since SH3 - inability to dive past 180m without running at flank speed, for instance - I will vote with my wallet.

I refuse to pay for a bug-ridden, half finished, and sloppily scripted mess.

Doing so would only reinforce to UBI that this is an acceptable business practice. I can only vote for myself, but vote I shall, and I refuse to be moved, coerced, or guilted into supporting SH5 based on what it "may become".

I'll buy it if, and when, it meets MY standards as a consumer - not yours.

QFT! thanks.

KL-alfman · 04-05-10, 04:21 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vonTorpitz

SH5 is, as far as I know, the only current u-boat sim available. If there were any other viable options in the submarine genre to choose from the story would be different. But as it stands, this is what we have to work with for now.

your reasons are well respected and I hope SH5 someday will turn out to be what you did expect when you bought it.

but as for different availabilities:
for me there are still some other super-mods to try in SH3 besides GWX (NYGM, LSH, WAC) and I recently bought SH4 which I will also install someday and look forward to the different characteristics of the fleet-boats.
so (for me) there are many other subsims to choose from atm and this makes it easy to stay away from SH5 for the next one or two years (or forever if I will be forced to connect to U-play).

Jimbuna · 04-05-10, 05:13 AM

There is a lot of merit in what you have posted (heaven only knows how often I've read almost identical posts in recent months) so let us not try and reinvent the wheel.

As can clearly be seen, the community is divided over the most recent release of the SH series (and not for the first time).

Ubisoft are the only company currently offering anything in this genre and as such it could probably be argued that support in the way of sales for SH5 are vital if there is to be any more releases in the future.

The other side of the coin is for Ubisoft to consider....they are obviously aware of the strength of feeling and anguish within the subsimming community and as such IMHO it is down to them to show some measure of good faith with said client base.

Probably the best way would be to drop the need for DRM/OSP and release a few patches that fix/correct some of the fundamental problems with the game.

The community are confident they can rely on the modding fraternity to do their bit (as has always been the case) and Ubisoft are well aware of this too.

The question is.....Will Ubisoft play their part and meet us half way?

SteveW1 · 04-05-10, 05:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by VonHesse

Umm, no.

I will continue to follow the forums and hope for the best, but untill UBI removes the invasive DRM and fixes the innumerable bugs that have been present since SH3 - inability to dive past 180m without running at flank speed, for instance - I will vote with my wallet.

I refuse to pay for a bug-ridden, half finished, and sloppily scripted mess.

Doing so would only reinforce to UBI that this is an acceptable business practice. I can only vote for myself, but vote I shall, and I refuse to be moved, coerced, or guilted into supporting SH5 based on what it "may become".

I'll buy it if, and when, it meets MY standards as a consumer - not yours.

I'll second this

TDK1044 · 04-05-10, 05:21 AM

Ubisoft has a history with SHIII and SHIV of releasing unfinished, buggy games that required significant patching in the first year after release. With SH5, they released an unfinished, buggy game that also requires that you play it with a permanent internet connection, using unreliable ubisoft servers.

Early indications are that the target demographic (casual gamers) are not buying this game in large numbers, and neither are many of the franchise core supporters.

Bottom line....cluster f**k! A marketing disaster.

This arrogant Publisher is getting exactly what it deserves.

Bilge_Rat · 04-05-10, 05:37 AM

how original, yet another thread where posters state why they will not buy the game, as if the rest of us care.

thyro · 04-05-10, 06:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vonTorpitz

SH5 is, as far as I know, the only current u-boat sim available. If there were any other viable options in the submarine genre to choose from the story would be different. But as it stands, this is what we have to work with for now.

SH4 has similar graphs and far better stability plus plenty of mods to chose from. In one or two years I'd consider SH5. IF (BIG IF) online DRM idiocracy is dropped.

But till then SH3 still rocks as most complete sub simulator seconded by SH4 as best graphic candy plus 2 different environments (pacific and atlantic) modded.

SH5 well let it rest on the sheves till it gets finished + patched + online DRM free.

Like others I vote with my wallet and these are my terms. Cheers

TDK1044 · 04-05-10, 06:13 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bilge_Rat

how original, yet another thread where posters state why they will not buy the game, as if the rest of us care.

The point is that fewer people are actually buying this game...and some of those people are trying to take it back.

Ubisoft is finally getting what it deserves in my opinion. People are finally voting with their wallets. About time.

Shiplord · 04-05-10, 06:47 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by vonTorpitz

Its true, the game was released practically half finished and bug ridden to the extreme. But seriously! There's got to be a bright side to this dismal situation. We actually have a brand new u-boat simulator, exclusively set in The Battle of the Atlantic.

As Neal said before the release of SH5 in his comment about the half finished state of SH4

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neal Stevens

I promise you, if this happens again with SH5, I will join you with a pitchfork. Even if it kills the franchise (we always have SH3 and GWX). The relationship between Ubisoft (or any game publisher) and Subsim has to be a two-way street of trust and cooperation. I know the Ubisoft marketing group have a job to do, but if the game is half-finished, that I cannot abide.

Why should we forgiven them again and again about this practice of Ubisoft and their devs? Just because they are the only ones who making a submarine simulation?

I said no! At some point there must be an end with the pardon that they always produce the same mistakes in their software, always raise the same half-finished crap on the market.

04-05-10, 12:35 AM	#1
vonTorpitz Seaman Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: an island in the Pacific Posts: 42 Downloads: 23 Uploads: 0	All We Are Saying Is "Give SH5 a Chance" Recently I've heard a tremendous amount of flak both on and off this forum directed against SH5. Its true, the game was released practically half finished and bug ridden to the extreme. But seriously! There's got to be a bright side to this dismal situation. We actually have a brand new u-boat simulator, exclusively set in The Battle of the Atlantic. The graphics in this game are absolutely amazing both inside and outside the boat, we can now move about the boat (this adds huge freakin possibilities if you use your imagination) and from what I've heard Ubisoft has created the game to very open-ended and moddable. And remember, their previous releases in this genre were also basically unfinished when released but the efforts (superhuman, I might add) of modding community were able to turn them into winners. I personally think the opportunities abound in this game and positivity goes along way folks. So, meine kameraden, keep faith in SH5 and keep faith in the unbelievable skills of the modding community surrounding this game. Because in a years' time this will probably be the best subsim you've ever played. Danke und Sieg! vonTorpitz

04-05-10, 05:13 AM	#9
Jimbuna Chief of the Boat Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: 250 metres below the surface Posts: 181,102 Downloads: 63 Uploads: 13	There is a lot of merit in what you have posted (heaven only knows how often I've read almost identical posts in recent months) so let us not try and reinvent the wheel. As can clearly be seen, the community is divided over the most recent release of the SH series (and not for the first time). Ubisoft are the only company currently offering anything in this genre and as such it could probably be argued that support in the way of sales for SH5 are vital if there is to be any more releases in the future. The other side of the coin is for Ubisoft to consider....they are obviously aware of the strength of feeling and anguish within the subsimming community and as such IMHO it is down to them to show some measure of good faith with said client base. Probably the best way would be to drop the need for DRM/OSP and release a few patches that fix/correct some of the fundamental problems with the game. The community are confident they can rely on the modding fraternity to do their bit (as has always been the case) and Ubisoft are well aware of this too. The question is.....Will Ubisoft play their part and meet us half way? __________________ Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something. Oh my God, not again!! GWX3.0 Download Page - Donation/instant access to GWX (Help SubSim)

04-05-10, 05:37 AM	#12
Bilge_Rat Silent Hunter Join Date: Apr 2002 Location: standing watch... Posts: 3,792 Downloads: 344 Uploads: 0	how original, yet another thread where posters state why they will not buy the game, as if the rest of us care. __________________

04-05-10, 12:58 AM	#2
VonHesse Sailor Man Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Dieser verdammte Platz Posts: 239 Downloads: 43 Uploads: 0	Umm, no. I will continue to follow the forums and hope for the best, but untill UBI removes the invasive DRM and fixes the innumerable bugs that have been present since SH3 - inability to dive past 180m without running at flank speed, for instance - I will vote with my wallet. I refuse to pay for a bug-ridden, half finished, and sloppily scripted mess. Doing so would only reinforce to UBI that this is an acceptable business practice. I can only vote for myself, but vote I shall, and I refuse to be moved, coerced, or guilted into supporting SH5 based on what it "may become". I'll buy it if, and when, it meets MY standards as a consumer - not yours.

04-05-10, 02:31 AM	#3
Zedi Sea Lord Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 1,845 Downloads: 184 Uploads: 2	I'm not bothered by drm, bugs but.. by how casual this game it is. I just can't play it anymore, it's mega boring. Go there, sink that, refill. That's the SH5 campaign mode. Nothing hard nor exciting and the only thing that kept me playing was the graphics. When I heard about the drm and that you actually have to be online to play, I was thrilled. I said.. oke, if all who play this will be online then there must be a strong multiplayer option... yay. Again, a major disappointment, the MP part is a joke, maybe the worst part in SH5. As most of the people here said, this game may be enjoyable in 6 months or so, after few patches and some hardcore moding. Now, is a fail boat. Boring and casual, filled with bugs, and no MP. It has the potential to become something cool, but that's because the great community and moders, not because the developers.

04-05-10, 02:36 AM	#4
Sonoboy Planesman Join Date: Aug 2005 Location: United States, CA Posts: 195 Downloads: 8 Uploads: 0	I will not be buying this game for quite some time. I find it very disgusting that ubisoft releases an unfinished game and expects the modders to make it into something great. I have the utmost confidence that the modders will achieve that, but we're not paying the modders for this game, are we? Ubisoft is basically using free labor to finish their product. It's not fair to modders that they have to finish creating the game. It's not fair to the gamers that they pay $50 for a beta-test (and let's not forget those who don't have interest in using mods). That's how I feel about this whole issue. Second reason is that I don't think my computer will run it very well. Third: I'm enjoying SH3.

04-05-10, 03:46 AM	#5
vonTorpitz Seaman Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: an island in the Pacific Posts: 42 Downloads: 23 Uploads: 0	I totally agree and sympathize with all of your comments. It does seem as though Ubisoft relies on the modding community to finish their SH products. Its bad business. Since the release of SH3 the genre has needed massive modding overhauls in order to be half-assed playable. I paid the retail price for SH5 and like most who did, I was immediately disappointed. I agree, if Ubisoft is going to release a subsim(?) that is 1/3 finished then they should be charging 1/3 the price. Unfortunately, this is not the case. I hope Ubisoft hasn't torpedoed the entire genre by disillusioning their very unique fanbase. The fact remains though, I and many others have paid the full price and for me, at least, there is no sense crying over spilled milk. SH5 is, as far as I know, the only current u-boat sim available. If there were any other viable options in the submarine genre to choose from the story would be different. But as it stands, this is what we have to work with for now. Id still like to think there are enough others out there who also own the game, who think it stands a fighting chance, and who want a change from the older SH releases. Lets move forward and in the spirit of the real u-boat crews, lets have a little faith and create victories out of the most adverse conditions. To hell with Ubisoft.

04-05-10, 05:21 AM	#11
TDK1044 Ocean Warrior Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: Georgia, USA Posts: 2,674 Downloads: 25 Uploads: 0	Ubisoft has a history with SHIII and SHIV of releasing unfinished, buggy games that required significant patching in the first year after release. With SH5, they released an unfinished, buggy game that also requires that you play it with a permanent internet connection, using unreliable ubisoft servers. Early indications are that the target demographic (casual gamers) are not buying this game in large numbers, and neither are many of the franchise core supporters. Bottom line....cluster f**k! A marketing disaster. This arrogant Publisher is getting exactly what it deserves.